Jax wants out..

[HarlemHeat37]

If Spurs want to do a trade for SJax (I don't think it's the case), their best interest is to send as much salary as possible to lower their luxury tax hit.

Mason + Finley + Bonner for SJax would be the best trade possible for Spurs. If Spurs want to add some vet depth after that, there is a certain spa owner available...

Best case scenario for me..

[greensborohill]

Nellie and Pop's relationship >>>>>> Nellie and Cuban's relationship. I think the last thing he wants to do is help that out.

I guess you didn't hear when I just said that Nellie is already in talks with the Mavs.

In any case, we shall see.

[greensborohill]

When have the warriors said they want cap relief? They can still put together a decent team. Nelly is not going to give Jackson away.

Go to my link. DB.com broke the story b4 the national media did. They want Bucks contract. Is it that inconcievable? You guys got RJ for nothing.

[JonNOKC]

I think you have to at least contact GS and make the offer - Mason,Finley,Bonner (+ draft pick if necessary) - while SJAX may have some down side he not Ron Artest - he knows what would be expected from him in SA and he didn't take SA out of list of teams he would want to play for which makes me think he is ready to accept whatever role Pop has for him and his game is better than 2003 - his assit to TO ratio for each of the last 4 years has been better than Manu's and is perfectly acceptable for a player who has the ball alot Here are reasons to do trade -

1.In Spurs system he would probably have ball less thus less TOS - also last year with injuries he played alot of point forward and had career high 6.5 assist per game (TOs was career high, but bottom line he has been a 2 to 1 ratio guy for the last 4-5 years)

2. This trade makes you longer, more athletic, more versatile on the wing, while freeing up salary and roster space for this year if you trade all three expiring contracts

3.Also note that GS has plenty uf redundancy at 2-3 spots and that Randolph, Morrow, and Azabuike are in last year of deals and Curry's rookie contract will be up before SJAX comes off books so GS has motivation for moving SJAX (although they would rather move Magggette, but that is much tougher to do)
---------------------------------------------------------------
The only reasons to not pull the trigger:

1. The main reason would be the $$ committment and if Manu has good year and stays healthy could you resign him - only Holt can really answer how long the Spurs are willing to pay luxury tax.

2. Not as big of risk as I think some people make it out to be would be SJAX at ude, chemistry, and off court behavior.

[angelbelow]

I think we need to add draft picks or player rights, probably Tiagos.

[Obstructed_View]

Jack missed his chance. Spurs don't need him.

[Mel_13]

I think you have to at least contact GS and make the offer - Mason,Finley,Bonner (+ draft pick if necessary) - while SJAX may have some down side he not Ron Artest - he knows what would be expected from him in SA and he didn't take SA out of list of teams he would want to play for which makes me think he is ready to accept whatever role Pop has for him and his game is better than 2003 - his assit to TO ratio for each of the last 4 years has been better than Manu's and is perfectly acceptable for a player who has the ball alot Here are reasons to do trade -

1.In Spurs system he would probably have ball less thus less TOS - also last year with injuries he played alot of point forward and had career high 6.5 assist per game (TOs was career high, but bottom line he has been a 2 to 1 ratio guy for the last 4-5 years)

2. This trade makes you longer, more athletic, more versatile on the wing, while freeing up salary and roster space for this year if you trade all three expiring contracts

3.Also note that GS has plenty uf redundancy at 2-3 spots and that Randolph, Morrow, and Azabuike are in last year of deals and Curry's rookie contract will be up before SJAX comes off books so GS has motivation for moving SJAX (although they would rather move Magggette, but that is much tougher to do)
---------------------------------------------------------------
The only reasons to not pull the trigger:

1. The main reason would be the $$ committment and if Manu has good year and stays healthy could you resign him - only Holt can really answer how long the Spurs are willing to pay luxury tax.

2. Not as big of risk as I think some people make it out to be would be SJAX at ude, chemistry, and off court behavior.

-Manu's assist to TO ratio has been better than Jackson's every year that Ginobili has been in the NBA.

-Jackson's assist to TO ratio has been 1.47 for the last 4 years.

-roster spaces will indeed be opened by a three for one trade. How much money, if any, is saved will depend on what is done to fill those spots. If both are filled by players making the vet min, savings in salary plus lux tax for this year will be be less than 500K.

[siraulo23]

GSW would take expiring contracts (according to hoopshype), so the trade is possible if the spurs want it

[Mel_13]

In terms of roster spots opening I think it would be solid to use them on McClinton and Gist, ship them to Austin and save money. But realy quick, Mason+Bonner+Finley is about 1.8 million more than Jack's 7.6. Isn't that just a tad too much?

It works. GS can take back 125% of Jackson's salary + 100K. So they can take back a little bit more than 9.6M.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Not if cap relief is what is wanted, which is what it seems that they do want. Jax for Buckner, Wiliams, & Barea nets the Barea and gets the an instant 3 million dollar savings in Buckner. That's a done deal IMO.

Kidd
Jax
Marion
Dirk
Damp

Terry & Josh

The only place you are hearing about GS wanting cap relief is from DallasBasketball.com, which is a ridiculously homer Mavs site.

[DPG21920]

Yes. Bonner + Finley + Williams works.

[ChumpDumper]

I think we need to add draft picks or player rights, probably Tiagos.

Splitter? Pass.

[DPG21920]

I think offering Splitter plus Mason and Bonner would be about the best offer GS would get. I do not know if I like it. I think a deal could happen, but I am not sure at all how the Spurs front office views Jacksons long term salary.

[DPG21920]

I know this is just hypothetical, but if the Spurs did this trade, and only had to give up one or the other between Mason and Finley, I think I would do this:

Starters
TP
Mason or Finley
RJ
Tim
Dice

Bench
Hill
Gino
SJ
Blair/Haislip
Ian/Bonner/Theo

Or whomever is playing better of the bigs.

[DPG21920]

I'd say thats the worst part. But the Spurs have always done a great job of moving those long contracts. Like Rasho and Butler. Still Jackson is younger than Manu, and he would be pretty effective for the rest of Tim's contract.

I guess, but the Spurs are running out of assets to package (Scola, Tiago...)

[DPG21920]

I would be upset as well, but it is a really tough situation. I do not think the Spurs will be duped by either Tiago or the marketplace. They will know his intentions and what other teams can offer and make a strong assessment on what to do with him.

But unless you are almost positive that he won't come over, you do not trade him. Unless it is a no brainer, which SJ is not imo. Then you have to worry about why other teams would want him.

[xtremesteven33]

Splitter/Mason/Finley for Jax......no question....

[JonNOKC]

-Manu's assist to TO ratio has been better than Jackson's every year that Ginobili has been in the NBA.

-Jackson's assist to TO ratio has been 1.47 for the last 4 years.

-roster spaces will indeed be opened by a three for one trade. How much money, if any, is saved will depend on what is done to fill those spots. If both are filled by players making the vet min, savings in salary plus lux tax for this year will be be less than 500K.

Sorry did look at wrong info on A to TO ratio - however the numbers are similair and SJAX has had one year with better ratio and two years with better assist per game average - if you compare SJAX TO numbers to other 2nd tier 20PPG scorers he is better than most better than Maggette, Peirce, Caron Butler, Antwaon Jamison, Ben Gordon, and Richard Jefferson just to name a few. Also true that not much money will be saved but whatever is saved would be doubled due to LT and main benefit is more young guys can fill out spots and stay with team while maybe bringing back a Bowen or other vet. This trade is simple to me - if Holt is willing to stay in LT for nex 4 years you pull the trigger if not then you hold fast.

Assist to TO ratio

Manu 2006 2007 2008 2009
Asst 3.6 3.5 4.5 3.6
TO 1.86 2.09 2.7 2.0
Ratio 1.93 1.67 1.66 1.8

SJAX 2006 2007 2008 2009
Asst 3.1 4.6 4.1 6.5
TO 2.19 2.68 2.7 3.8
Ratio 1.41 1.72 1.51 1.71

*stats from NBA.com

[Agloco]

Captain Jack next to LeBron would be .......... scary.

[Agloco]

They just don't have the pieces to pull it off if you were to ask me.

Agreed, which is the only reason I didn't drop a brick in my pants when I read this...

[Flux451]

SJAX FOR LEAVING US IN THE FIRST PLACE!!!!

i AM BETTING ON OUR CURRENT ROSTER.

[HarlemHeat37]

I wouldn't give up Splitter in this deal..Golden State has no leverage..we don't need Jackson, he would just be a luxury(on the court, ignoring the contracts)..they don't win in this deal if they're looking for something big, Jackson isn't good enough to bring that type of return..

They should be looking to unload the bad contract they gave him, so I honestly believe they'll take any good offer..if the FO is offering Bonner + Mason + Williams, I'd be shocked if they didn't take it..our FO has more concerns about doing this trade than their front office, since this obviously isn't a talent issue..

I'm using logic though..Golden State's front office doesn't use logic, as we've seen with most of their moves, so I guess you never know..

If the FO is really going all-out to the extreme in Duncan's last years, this could actually happen though..if Golden State is just looking for straight expirings and wouldn't ask for Mason, then I think I would have to take Jackson's salary back without question, because that would give us the best team in the NBA(health permitting of course)..

For the record..I usually dislike player's that play like Jackson plays, and he isn't exactly known as a man with great character..the key here is that he's won a le with our team, with the same core, and he has a good relationship with the main people involved..that's what makes this deal somewhat possible IMO..

[bigbendbruisebrother]

It's funny how everyone is ga ga over Stephen Jackson now. True, Jax hit some big, big shots against Dallas in the WCF, 03. Aside from that isolated (albeit great) performance however, I cringed whenever he had the ball. His turnovers don't seem statistically to have been that big of a deal, but they seemed to come at the worst possible times. If we get him back, so be it, but I can't see Pop et al blowing their wads (and their trade bait) right now--especially given Pop's statements to effect that as long as he was around, Stephen wouldn't be.

[DPG21920]

It would certainly create a roster crunch though position wise. Manu, Steven Jackson and Richard Jefferson; who would be playing in crunch time? Steven Jackson would be Manu insurance, but if Manu stays healthy, then there would be some serious questions that need to be answered.

I don't see the Spurs playing super small ball with TP, Manu, RJ, SJ and Tim in crunch time.

[Mel_13]

Sorry did look at wrong info on A to TO ratio - however the numbers are similair and SJAX has had one year with better ratio and two years with better assist per game average - if you compare SJAX TO numbers to other 2nd tier 20PPG scorers he is better than most better than Maggette, Peirce, Caron Butler, Antwaon Jamison, Ben Gordon, and Richard Jefferson just to name a few. Also true that not much money will be saved but whatever is saved would be doubled due to LT and main benefit is more young guys can fill out spots and stay with team while maybe bringing back a Bowen or other vet. This trade is simple to me - if Holt is willing to stay in LT for nex 4 years you pull the trigger if not then you hold fast.

Assist to TO ratio

Manu 2006 2007 2008 2009
Asst 3.6 3.5 4.5 3.6
TO 1.86 2.09 2.7 2.0
Ratio 1.93 1.67 1.66 1.8

SJAX 2006 2007 2008 2009
Asst 3.1 4.6 4.1 6.5
TO 2.19 2.68 2.7 3.8
Ratio 1.41 1.72 1.51 1.71

*stats from NBA.com

I agree with your conclusion, with the caveat that obtaining Jackson does not preclude signing Manu to an extension if justified by his health and level of play.

For the sake of accuracy, though, your numbers are still off. The first two sets of numbers you have for Jackson are from the Indiana and GS portions of the 2006-2007 season, not two separate seasons. When you use his totals for each season, you will see that Manu has had a better ratio in every season in which both players have been in the NBA.