Just because you are willing to panic and overpay, does not mean the FO will. Nor should they.
Its not over paying. Manu is on the decline now. So is Camby, who is not young, but Camby gives the spurs a fighting chance against the lakers big frontline.
you will not be winning les relying on Manu to be a consistent star if you are weak on the frontline.
I disagree. Camby was available if you dangled the right trade in front of the Clippers.
I haven't read the whole thread (I guess is a big part of it is about people wanting to trade their usual scapegoat) but something to consider is the evolution of the financial state of the NBA.
This summer, projections were bad for the league with a $63M luxury tax threshold. Last December, projections were significantly better with a $66M luxury tax threshold. Spurs should be less reluctant to trade their expirings (Bonner, Mason, Finley, Mahinmi...) for players with longer contracts because Spurs will pay less luxury tax in 2010-2011.
Parker's not untouchable, but I'm only moving him if it lands Chris Paul or Deron Williams. Tony will be back strong next season. Everyone else but TD is not only on the block, but expendable.
But you don't know if an injured (back then) Ginobili was the right trade. For all we know, they could have been asking for Tony. Or wanted the Spurs to also absorb a terrible contract like Kaman's. If it was such a slamdunk trade for the Clips, well, we still have the assets to do it, and I don't see them making Marcus available.
I look at the Clips and I see they already have the very talented, injury prone guard in BDiddy. They have a promising guy in Gordon. Now they have Kaman with a bad contract which I assume it's gonna be the first guy they want to get rid of when Griffin plays next season. Camby has a great contract. I don't see why they would want to move him at all.
Tony and Manu being s s of their former selves is the reason this team is mediocre. Blaming Popovich is asinine.
Who cares? Whoever wants to play stays, those gutless ones can go for all I care.
agreed timmy is on his last legs, manu is old and tony is hurting add in were starting a rookie and now a 2nd year player and u might be able to c this coming
I agree and this is something I touched on during the last Kori show. Pop is certainly making some questionable moves, but they are all predicated on his best players (outside of Tim) not playing to their level.
Not only are they not playing to their level, they are well below it. That is not coaching, but it does put the coach in an incredibly tough spot. Sure, Pop could be making some moves to help out, but right now he does not really have the tools at his disposal to make a meaningful impact no matter what he does imo.
If guys are able to elevate their play, I think you will see a difference in the coaching and effectiveness of this team.
What's asinine is putting Ginobili to guard Landry in the paint...
I'm not going to deny that Manu and Tony have not played at their full potential, but tonight they both had a good game and we still gave up a gazillion points.
At some point the Coach HAS to get some degree of responsability.
The obsession with small ball and playing lineups that give the team no chance to be successful defensively is coaching and it's also hypocritical considering Pop's penchant for stressing defense. We know this team is lacking a true number two big on the front line and in certain match-ups, I understand going small, but in every game, regardless of match-up? That's just insanity. You can talk about his deficiencies in every other facet of the game if you want, but how can Pop complain about the defense, yet rarely ever play (with the exception of garbage time) Ratliff? He's proven to still be an effective rim protector and shot blocker in short stretches.
Do Parker and Ginobili need to play better? Absolutely. But the overall depth and talent on this roster should offset that, at least against average teams, at home, in the regular season. It's easy to pick apart what's wrong with this team, but why aren't they, like every other good-very good team in the league, simply getting away with out-talenting teams? Look at the Lakers. They have six credible players: 1 is done, 1 is having a sub-par season, 2 are inconsistent and of the 2 stalwarts, one's play is suffering due to injury and the other has missed many games due to injury. Yet through it all, they're managing to win. Unimpressive fashion, no doubt, but winning all the same.
Our starting 5 outside Duncan are just not performing on any consistent basis, which is probably most of the reason why the bench has been performing so well. There is no trade that can remedy this. We seriously need Manu/Tony/Jefferson to find some semblance of game-to-game consistency or we have no chance. A big man, whether serviceable or excellent, isn't going to help when you have your top two play makers hobbling on one leg.
Our success is now a roll of the dice from this point out. It is highly unlikely that any team takes on Dices or Jefferson's contracts and highly unlikely that we get talent in return for manu or tony. We are in a lose-lose situation. Best that we can do is make the best trade we can with our expirings and pray everyone finds their games.
Pop certainly does not get a free pass and he shares the blame. But if TP, Manu and to a somewhat lesser degree Dice cannot play at a championship level, none of this will matter.
There is no clear cut favorite this year. Every team has players not playing up to their standards. The least Pop could do is make the right decisions and not handicap this teams defense by electing going small in crucial moments of big games. Pop is too stubborn to realize this though unfortunately.
IMO there are clear cut favorites. Even if Pop made the perfect coaching decisions and the Spurs all played to their potential, they would not be the favorites to win assuming everyone is relatively healthy.
They would certainly have a much, much better chance, but I would still not rate them higher than a few other teams.
I'll watch the rest of the regular season and playoffs (if there is any) and I'm grateful for the front office's attempt to take one last stab.
I'd almost like to see the rotation altered with Bogans and Dice out and Ian and Hairston in. Just see what they got.
I agree, but you also have to wonder what the message is, and if some players are listening at all. Coach says after the game that we sucked last game giving up 60 points. You would have to assume he spoke to the players about this. Ok, first half tonight: 55 points. Well, better but FAR from good. Talk about it some more, second half: gave up 60 points again...
I don't think Manu and Tony played that much different that we could have made a big impact on defense...
I agree with that, but you have seen it in flashes where this team can defend much better than they are currently. They might not have the tools to be a top 3 defensive team, but with more consistent play the could be better.
It is really hard to pin point certain things, but one thing that is for sure is that the Spurs need someone to help on the interior.
Well I don't agree with you. A simple move like Bonner+ Finley+ Mahimni for Haywood would help our interior defense and put us in the pool of teams that would have a realistic chance at a le. IF Pop managed the playing time and subs utions the right way. IMO
Unfortunately it wouldn't really matter if you really think about it realistically. I say that because Pop would only play Haywood an insignificant 15-22 minutes, because Matty and small ball need their playing time. After all spreading the floor with small ball is what won us 4 les right?
I just don't understand Pop. He preaches to the media and obviously to the players that they are playing " poor" defense. He claimed in the Express News that they are going back to their old ways " defense first". Yet he puts the team at a very vulnerable spot with Manu and RJ playing the 4 in crucial times in games regardless of the matchups. And there's Tim's man as usual setting screens, taking away our only interior defender to the perimeter, leaving the paint as wide open as Jenna Haze.
Another thing I don't understand about Pop.
Several times this year Blair would recieve 2 fouls in the first quarter or 3 fouls late in the 2nd quarter and would only see the floor maybe 5 minutes the rest of the game. Many of you would say " Blair only played 7 minutes because he got in foul trouble". My question is this. Why is Pop even worried about his fouls if he uses McDyess Bonner and Blair like a CYO rotation. All playing around 20 minutes barring injury or severe foul trouble. I never understood why Blair hardly ever sees the floor for the rest of the game if he gets in foul trouble early.
The fact of the matter is, finding a good bigman and/or swingman isn't going to solve all their problems. Pop likes to say they've lost more corporate knowledge than they realized, I contend it's more like their Championship soul; the intangibles, mystique, intelligence, discipline and overall know-how has been greatly diminished or completely lost. You don't just win with having great, healthy stars at the top of your lineup, but with grit, courage, resolve and highly-intelligent basketball players that make up a supporting cast; Bowen, Horry, Kerr, Barry and on, where are those guys on this roster?
The point isn't to point fingers or for me to say I told you so, but to acknowledge the facts as they are: The San Antonio Spurs are a gatekeeper without the personnel to shed the label. If they really want to change that fact, than they're going to have to act boldly (sans Duncan, there are no sacred cows).
And having said that, there's really not much you can do at this point..
I've discussed the AI-Dalembert with a couple of friends (probably their best option, if in the unlikely event the Sixers bit on RJ, expirings, Splitter and a possible pick(s)) but it's a very tenuous prospect, given the flux of the roster and the short time to find cohesion; maybe you're looking to next year, though.. And short of a CP3 for TP9 trade (something that could change the makeup and edge of the team and conceivably work short and long-term because of his ability to orchestrate an offense and lead) there's just not a lot that can realistically be done (I'm perfectly aware that CP3 for TP9 isn't realistic, by the way).
Honestly, even though I never liked RJ as a fit or thought he brought the type of game that could thrive or help to fill the gaps, I didn't see this coming; no way to this extent. There's nothing about the player he's shown in the Spurs uniform that says you can win with him at the highest level.
He's made a name for his self over the years and is plenty capable of producing a highlight, but little-to-nothing he's been bringing to the table has been what you'd need to win a Championship; the guy's lost the directions to the free-throw line and makes Bonner look like Moses Malone on the boards (the term, 'floor game', is a completely foreign concept to the guy). I just can't see how a team could really win a Championship with him being a big-minute complimentary player; nothing he does is complimentary. In fact, everything has to be tailored to him for him to be successful (some people's success just isn't worth the effort in the context of team).
Like I said before, there's no perfect or ideal fix out there; never mind the fact that I'm only talking from a basketball standpoint (the financial climate isn't all that conducive to taking on high-priced personnel).
I guess we'll get to see if there was anything to all the 'all-in' talk, though..
you guys know that trading this season is going to make us worse right?...
http://www.rofljock.com/2009/12/spur...o-save-season/
/shameless plug
LOL @ that last trade proposal. hah thats funny.you guys know that trading this season is going to make us worse right?...
http://www.rofljock.com/2009/12/spur...o-save-season/
/shameless plug
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMa...radeId=yl43g7m
yea dat one
was havin' some fun with trade machine a while back
I don't really see why people keep saying that "trading for a big won't solve our problems"..of course it won't solve ALL the problems with Tony/Manu/Pop/Jefferson/McDyess, but at least it will help shore up the defense and at least give us a chance to win games..
People keep talking about how all these guys are struggling offensively, but the defense is by far the WORST of the Duncan era..that's just as concerning to me..obviously we need Tony/Manu/RJ/Pop to step up, but at least having a good defense will give us a real chance to actually win some of these games while those guys are trying to find their games..
Anybody that has been watching can tell that we need another 7-footer BADLY..the Spurs have reached fiend status..also, obviously we have to hope Pop actually plays him, as Manu4Tres mentioned..
Speaking of Pop, anybody else excited for Finley to make his return next week?..he should fill that PF spot nicely..
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