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No. If we were treating them like POW's that'd be one thing, but we're not.
No problem. I try to keep informed about this stuff. I think it's important.
No. If we were treating them like POW's that'd be one thing, but we're not.
That would be much much cheaper than the way we do it now. I've heard the Chinese charge the families of the executed for the cost of the bullets expended.
Maybe we could just bill em back for the whole process. That way, they wouldn't cost the US taxpayer anything.
are you suggesting military justice isn't quite up to the task?
Perhaps the federal justice system is a little more capable of sorting out the factual issues. The frequency of adverse review outcomes for cases relating to irregular detainees would seem to suggest this may be the case somewhat more than just occasionally.
Last edited by Winehole23; 02-18-2010 at 04:20 PM.
You keep giving me these slogans and ideas and pretty soon we will have President Elbama in 2012.
No charge.
elbamba apparently chose to disregard this completely, even with the amplification supplied by ElNono.How is that a fair shake?
Just come right out and say it, elbamba. What do you have to lose at this point?
We're not gonna give em a fair shake. We're not even going to pretend to. We're gonna railroad em.
That's what America is all about!
http://www.fbi.gov/publications/terror/terror99.pdf
Page four.Terrorists are arrested and convicted under existing criminal statutes. All suspected terrorists placed under arrest are provided access to legal counsel and normal judicial procedure, including Fifth Amendment guarantees.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Militar...ns_Act_of_2006Cheney all over himself saying the underpants bomber should have been handled differently when he was actually handled in the same manner the shoe bomber was by the Bush administration.
"Clearest thinker"
You are as full of as Cheney.
Already discussed. Thanks for not reading.
If he was an unlawful combatant, there was no need to try him at that time.
It's a great day for Cheney, who was released from the hospital.
Doctors say he'll be up, shooting lawyers in the face in no time.
Let's hope for number 6!
When criminals run free...
Bush: Damn Right I Ordered Torture.
ProspectGeorge W. Bush's new memoir, and the surrounding publicity campaign, could have been designed by Barack Obama's team as a reminder of just how awful his predecessor was. First we heard about Bush's grotesquely narcissistic belief that the worst moment of his presidency was not the preventable deaths of 3,000 people in New York City or the partially avoidable death and destruction visited on New Orleans, but the fact that a hip-hop artist said something mean about him after his inept handling of the latter. Today, we find out that he did, in fact, support the arbitrary and illegal torture of suspected terrorists.
Essentially, the Republican line on arbitrary torture ordered by the executive branch has evolved from "of course we don't torture, it's wrong" to "we don't torture, but what if we did?" to "of course we tortured people!" The obfuscation is officially over. I wish I believed that twould provoke the outrage it merits, but I'm inclined to think that the pessimistic take is correct. his Because, of course, there's not enough to be depressed about this week...
Karma chameleon....
the US record on human rights, in war and at home, is far from perfect.
most of the detained are just foot soldiers. and though I agree with almost all winehole23 has posted, I have to raise the stakes and say that this isnt the only time the US military has abused human rights. The US military does not have the great reputation outside the US that it does inside. On top of that there is a huge prison system, some privatized, iirc the US has the most incarcerated citizens per capita, and still there is a crime problem (go drug war). This has been a big problem and huge cost for the US, and a poor example for other countries,
As far as the military angle, I think the US has basically two options to do this "right"- either detain the correct people (ie, go to saudi arabia, not iraq) and deal swift justice, or become more professional and have the moral authority to claim justice. Scenes like Abu Grhaib are medieval, they dont inspire respect for the power of justice, on the contrary they show the soldiers are there to people up (again, it would help a lot to go after the right people, AND take into account collateral damage).
of those options, the first one is "cheaper", but the second one is ethically superior, and in terms of cost, it is labor intensive but considerably more effective if done correctly. This is a big divider politically, because basically here is where you say "i believe in doing the right thing no matter the cost" or "you can't make an omelette without breaking some skulls". IMO the omelette hasnt come out good enough to justify breaking those skulls, but I will grant that sometimes they just need to be broken. That decision though should be made by principle, not personal expediency.
The article is wrong on both counts.
Kanye West wasn't his "worst" moment, he called it the most disgusting [personally] because he was being accused of being a racist.
And, there are many people, scholars -- cons utional ones, at that -- that still assert the coercive techniques the administration employed never technically nor legally amounted to torture.
Litigate it if you don't like it.
I tend to agree, especially when studies show the remarkably high percentage of false confessions which "coercive interrogations" produce. In light of those facts, torture becomes even more deplorable and irrational as it is done despite the availability of better methods for eliciting information from suspects -- more as political theater than the preventative dirty work it is marketed as.
Are we really such cowards as to be ethically fine with torturing people whose guilt is far from certain for the miniscule possibility of intercepting actionable intel when there are demonstrably better solutions which don't undermine our political covenants, national reputation, or cons utional ideals? Or is it even an issue of cowardice as much as, as you say, "personal expediency?"
Not racist, just apathetic.
The US military and civilian courts have prosecuted waterboarding as a crime of torture several times in the past.And, there are many people, scholars -- cons utional ones, at that -- that still assert the coercive techniques the administration employed never technically nor legally amounted to torture.
Litigate it if you don't like it.
That's good enough for me.
Also, that didn't work at all.
waterboarding "torture"? Pffffft
bunch of ing pussies.
It's not like they were jerking their fingernails out with pliers and hooking up electrodes to their nuts...
Have you ever been waterboarded by people trying to extract information from you?
Tell us what it was like.
So CC and other right-wing nuts support our enemies waterboarding our badass non-pussy soldiers several times/day and night for months?
Last time I checked, our enemies were sawing our guys heads off while they were still alive and posting the video.
so whatever the terrorist do, justifies whatever America does?
OBL laughing his ass off at how he's dragged America, Shining Light of Civilization, into the gutter.
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