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  1. #1
    Bruce Almighty Bruno's Avatar
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    Born: Feb 10, 1985
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    Prior to NBA / Country: Louisiana Tech / USA

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  2. #2
    Bruce Almighty Bruno's Avatar
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    If Spurs have around $10M in cap space after resigning Manu, Millsap would be my primary FA target. I like more players like Al Jefferson or Josh Smith but I doubt they would sign for that amount. Gasol would be above all these players but he might not be amnestied or another team might claim him for more money.

  3. #3
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    I'd have Millsap before Jefferson, and it's close with Gasol(In a World where we keep Splitter, he'd be just Without Splitter, It's Gasol.) He's an efficient scorer, good enough rebounder and can shoot and pass well enough to play in a Spurs system. Gives an additional option against the Big SF's/Quick PF's.

    Given his excellent Adjusted +/- numbers, I'd expect the Rockets to throw a bunch of money at him though(If they miss on Dwight)

  4. #4
    Veteran Richie's Avatar
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    If Spurs have around $10M in cap space after resigning Manu, Millsap would be my primary FA target. I like more players like Al Jefferson or Josh Smith but I doubt they would sign for that amount. Gasol would be above all these players but he might not be amnestied or another team might claim him for more money.
    Exactly my feelings. My only worry is that we won't be able to scrape together $10m. He also might get offered more by another team, but he might value the Spurs championship ambitions.

    If we can get a player like Millsap, who knows where the Spurs might go in future. A team of Parker/Green/Kawhi/Millsap/Splitter is playoff quality, albeit probably not a contender.

  5. #5
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    If Spurs have around $10M in cap space after resigning Manu, Millsap would be my primary FA target. I like more players like Al Jefferson or Josh Smith but I doubt they would sign for that amount. Gasol would be above all these players but he might not be amnestied or another team might claim him for more money.
    Could Spurs sign Millsap after resigning Manu and Splitter?

  6. #6
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    Hey Bruno, question.

    If Spurs elect to resign Manu and Splitter before any other moves, is there a chance Spurs could include Diaw (if he accepts his option to stay) in a sign and trade so they can offer more money to their desired FA target?

  7. #7
    Bruce Almighty Bruno's Avatar
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    Could Spurs sign Millsap after resigning Manu and Splitter?
    It will depends on how much money Ginobili and Millsap will cost and the level of the cap. Splitter isn't really part of the equation since you can sign him last for whatever amount you want.

    To make it simple, with a cap of $62M, Spurs will have $16.3M to split between Ginobili and Millsap. If Ginobili is fine with $6M per years, Spurs could offer Millsap a contract starting at $10.3M.

  8. #8
    Bruce Almighty Bruno's Avatar
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    Hey Bruno, question.

    If Spurs elect to resign Manu and Splitter before any other moves, is there a chance Spurs could include Diaw (if he accepts his option to stay) in a sign and trade so they can offer more money to their desired FA target?
    The logical order to sign players for Spurs this summer would be Manu first, cap space free agent second and Splitter third.

    Diaw could be of course included in a sign and trade but the other team would have to accept taking him. What could help Spurs is that the team minimum salary will now 90% of the cap. A team like Utah, with only $26M of salaries committed in 2013-2014 will have no financial interest to have a payroll below about $55M. Diaw might be basically free for them.

    Another option with Diaw would be to waive him and sue the stretch provision. His $4.7M salary will be spread in 3 years ($1.57M per year). If you count the additional roster hold of $0.49M, waiving him with the stretch provision would create an additional $2.64M of cap space. The drawback of that move would be that you lower both your 2014-2015 and 2015-2016 capspace by $1.57M.

  9. #9
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
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    Bruno are you counting 500k that I'm not seeing?

    I got 62M (cap) - 39.2M (salary charge) - 7.5M (Splitter) + 490k (roster charge) - 6M (Ginobili) + 490k (r.c.) + 490k (r.c.) = 10.8M

    Did I forget someone?

  10. #10
    Bruce Almighty Bruno's Avatar
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    I don't know exactly what you're doing but I'm using these numbers:

    Tony Parker: $12,500,000
    Tim Duncan: $10,361,446
    Boris Diaw: $4,702,500
    Danny Green: $3,762,500
    Nando De Colo: $1,463,000
    Kawhi Leonard: $1,887,840
    Patrick Mills: $1,133,950
    Cory Joseph: $1,120,920
    Aron Baynes: $788,872
    Splitter cap hold: $7,493,600
    Ginobili starting salary of his new contract: $6,000,000
    Roster cap hold: $490,180

    Total: $51,704,808

    So, with a $62M cap space, it's $10.3M of space. $8.3M with a $60M.

    And it's assuming Spurs amnesty Bonner and stash or trade their first round pick.

  11. #11
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    The logical order to sign players for Spurs this summer would be Manu first, cap space free agent second and Splitter third.

    Diaw could be of course included in a sign and trade but the other team would have to accept taking him. What could help Spurs is that the team minimum salary will now 90% of the cap. A team like Utah, with only $26M of salaries committed in 2013-2014 will have no financial interest to have a payroll below about $55M. Diaw might be basically free for them.

    Another option with Diaw would be to waive him and sue the stretch provision. His $4.7M salary will be spread in 3 years ($1.57M per year). If you count the additional roster hold of $0.49M, waiving him with the stretch provision would create an additional $2.64M of cap space. The drawback of that move would be that you lower both your 2014-2015 and 2015-2016 capspace by $1.57M.
    Business is business, whether he's TP's best friend or not. I think and hope Spurs best interests would be to part ways with him one way or another after this year.

  12. #12
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    I don't know exactly what you're doing but I'm using these numbers:

    Tony Parker: $12,500,000
    Tim Duncan: $10,361,446
    Boris Diaw: $4,702,500
    Danny Green: $3,762,500
    Nando De Colo: $1,463,000
    Kawhi Leonard: $1,887,840
    Patrick Mills: $1,133,950
    Cory Joseph: $1,120,920
    Aron Baynes: $788,872
    Splitter cap hold: $7,493,600
    Ginobili starting salary of his new contract: $6,000,000
    Roster cap hold: $490,180

    Total: $51,704,808

    So, with a $62M cap space, it's $10.3M of space. $8.3M with a $60M.

    And it's assuming Spurs amnesty Bonner and stash or trade their first round pick.
    Hypothetically, 8.3M (cap at 60M) + Diaw's 4.7 mil in sign and trade = 13 million in cap space for free agents this off-season (so Josh Smith could be a realistic target).

  13. #13
    Bruce Almighty Bruno's Avatar
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    Business is business, whether he's TP's best friend or not. I think and hope Spurs best interests would be to part ways with him one way or another after this year.
    I'm not saying the opposite but including Diaw in a sign and trade isn't that easy. The big issue is that the other team has to be fine with taking him and his salary.

    It takes two (or more) to make a trade.

  14. #14
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    I'm not saying the opposite but including Diaw in a sign and trade isn't that easy. The big issue is that the other team has to be fine with taking him and his salary.

    It takes two (or more) to make a trade.
    Fully aware of that. But since it's only a 1 year expiring contract, it will be a lot easier for a team to accept than it normally is in sign and trades because of the length of the contract.

  15. #15
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    Business is business, whether he's TP's best friend or not. I think and hope Spurs best interests would be to part ways with him one way or another after this year.
    Yeah because there's a lot of third bigs better than him on contenders...

    He's the best passing PF in the nba and great for the money.

    Green is the one who needs to be traded.

  16. #16
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    Yeah because there's a lot of third bigs better than him on contenders...

    He's the best passing PF in the nba and great for the money.

    Green is the one who needs to be traded.
    Disagree. He's not the best passing PF in the NBA. I do think he makes the most unwarranted passes out of any PF in the league though. Most of the time when he does pass the ball, it's the wrong play because sometimes he just passes just to pass because he's so damn passive (which leads to rushed shots for his teammates due to potential shot clock violations). Most pass happy player in the league, tbh. Sometimes being too passive at passing negates true passing ability, tbh. That's just on offense. On defense, Diaw is the worst out of any big on the Spurs by far and it's not close.

    As for Green, you can't find a more valuable role player for the price (not including players on rookie deals). For 3.5 M, he's well worth the money.
    Last edited by MaNu4Tres; 04-04-2013 at 03:34 PM.

  17. #17
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    Disagree. He's not the best passing PF in the NBA. I do think he makes the most unwarranted passes out of any PF in the league though. Most of the time when he does pass the ball it's the wrong play because sometimes he just passes just to pass because he's so damn passive. Most pass happy player in the league, tbh. Sometimes being too passive negates true passing ability, tbh. That's just on offense.

    On defense, Diaw is the worst out of any big on the Spurs by far and it's not close.

    As for Green, you can't find a more valuable role player for the price (not including players on rookie deals). For 3 million he's well worth the money.
    He owned Millsap himself and held his own vs Griffin last year, and last time I checked but that was a while ago he had a better assist to TOs ratio than Manu. The offense already looks like since he got moved to the bench and with Manu's decline, the last thing we need imo is getting rid of more playmakers in favors of specialists.

    Green is good for the money, which is why he's a nice trade bait, but we saw him last year in the WCF and we see him going 5/30 every now and then, basically he's almost garanteed to go cold a full series and we have other 40% 3 points shooters who can pass the ball and make layups like De Colo (who is even cheaper).
    Last edited by Pop; 04-04-2013 at 03:53 PM.

  18. #18
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    On defense, Diaw is the worst out of any big on the Spurs by far and it's not close.
    The only big that torched Boris is Ibaka and he also epicly torched Tiago earlier this year. Basically it was all about Pop's defensive scheme. He's the worst rebounder tho.

  19. #19
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
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    I don't know exactly what you're doing but I'm using these numbers:

    Tony Parker: $12,500,000
    Tim Duncan: $10,361,446
    Boris Diaw: $4,702,500
    Danny Green: $3,762,500
    Nando De Colo: $1,463,000
    Kawhi Leonard: $1,887,840
    Patrick Mills: $1,133,950
    Cory Joseph: $1,120,920
    Aron Baynes: $788,872
    Splitter cap hold: $7,493,600
    Ginobili starting salary of his new contract: $6,000,000
    Roster cap hold: $490,180

    Total: $51,704,808

    So, with a $62M cap space, it's $10.3M of space. $8.3M with a $60M.

    And it's assuming Spurs amnesty Bonner and stash or trade their first round pick.
    Yes, but the Spurs can use that roster charge as part of Milsap's deal. So I thought they can give him $10.8 (or $8.8) in your scenario. Just like you're taking away the roster charges when including a deal for Ginobili and Splitter's hold.

  20. #20
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
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    He owned Millsap himself and held his own vs Griffin last year, and last time I checked but that was a while ago he had a better assist to TOs ratio than Manu. The offense already looks like since he got moved to the bench and with Manu's decline, the last thing we need imo is getting rid of more playmakers in favors of specialists.

    Green is good for the money, which is why he's a nice trade bait, but we saw him last year in the WCF and we see him going 5/30 every no and then, basically he's almost garanteed to go cold a full series and we have other 40% 3 points shooters who can pass the ball and make layups like De Colo (who is even cheaper).
    I don't know if you saw Green's playoff stats when I posted them in another thread. He didn't actually play that poorly (quan atively) in the first four games of the OKC series. He still had a much better plus-minus that other players who "stepped up" or "were hot" like Jack. He shot poorly, but he still went for 9 points, 5 rebs, 3 ast, 1 stl and 1 blk per 36. Those numbers weren't nearly as good as those in the Clippers series, but everyone on the team has had a four-game streak that poor at some point recently. It seems to me that Pop panicked when he took Green out of the rotation, which ruined his confidence for the eight total minutes he played in the final two games. It was much more likely that Green would have started streaking the right way than it was that anyone else was going to step up into Green's role.

  21. #21
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    I don't know if you saw Green's playoff stats when I posted them in another thread. He didn't actually play that poorly (quan atively) in the first four games of the OKC series. He still had a much better plus-minus that other players who "stepped up" or "were hot" like Jack. He shot poorly, but he still went for 9 points, 5 rebs, 3 ast, 1 stl and 1 blk per 36. Those numbers weren't nearly as good as those in the Clippers series, but everyone on the team has had a four-game streak that poor at some point recently. It seems to me that Pop panicked when he took Green out of the rotation, which ruined his confidence for the eight total minutes he played in the final two games. It was much more likely that Green would have started streaking the right way than it was that anyone else was going to step up into Green's role.
    I don't really disagree with you on that tbh, he was not unbelievably bad and maybe sticking with him would have been better indeed. But I feel like we could use more playmaking with the offense being so poor this year. I made that point a while ago when we were still looking great about the lack of secondary playmakers when TP gets traped and now I can't help but come back to it because of what I see on the offensive end. I believe Green is one of the best 3 point shooters in the league and I feel like he really has been playing better defense lately but I'm not sure about the starting five as a unit.

  22. #22
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    And maybe the offseason will come down to Boris vs Danny, since Tiago Boris is not a very good combination, if they go for a PF then Boris' role become a real question mark unless he slides down to SF, the new PF would take his place in the 3 bigs rotation.


    And if they decides to pay a guard because of Manu's decline and move Green instead, they are more likely to only get fourth big through draft/FA or even stick with Baynes.

  23. #23
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
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    I don't really disagree with you on that tbh, he was not unbelievably bad and maybe sticking with him would have been better indeed. But I feel like we could use more playmaking with the offense being so poor this year. I made that point a while ago when we were still looking great about the lack of secondary playmakers when TP gets traped and now I can't help but come back to it because of what I see on the offensive end. I believe Green is one of the best 3 point shooters in the league and I feel like he really has been playing better defense lately but I'm not sure about the starting five as a unit.
    I can agree with you on that part. I feel the same way, only with Splitter instead of Green. As I said in the Neal thread, I hope this off-season leads to a change in the way the Spurs' brass thinks about the rotation. I think Splitter going to the bench and bringing in a versatile power-forward would be a better move. You worry about the lack of play-makers outside of Parker, but I think that can be fixed by bringing in a post player. That way, the offense is less dependent on Parker's penetration, which should prevent teams from keying on him as much. If Duncan is pretty much going to be a spot-up shooter now then Splitter's limitations are more obvious.

    If Al Jefferson had quicker feet, he'd be ideal, but really I think that any big that can be successful in iso situations could really help the team. I don't feel the same way about getting a high-usage guard to pair with Parker. I'd rather Pop put the ball in Kawhi's hands more and use him as a ball-handler than remove Green. Green's spacing allows for everyone else to have the room they need to work. If Leonard improves as much as we all think he can, he's going to need Green's spacing as much as anyone, as the defense tends to leave him open enough to drive because they're skewed to the other side.

  24. #24
    Veteran Richie's Avatar
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    Bruno you reminded me of the stretch provision, if we waive Bonner (and his $1m guaranteed), can we use it on him? That would make his cap hit this year an almost negligible $333k and save us having to amnesty him.

  25. #25
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    Disagree. He's not the best passing PF in the NBA. I do think he makes the most unwarranted passes out of any PF in the league though. Most of the time when he does pass the ball, it's the wrong play because sometimes he just passes just to pass because he's so damn passive (which leads to rushed shots for his teammates due to potential shot clock violations). Most pass happy player in the league, tbh. Sometimes being too passive at passing negates true passing ability, tbh. That's just on offense. On defense, Diaw is the worst out of any big on the Spurs by far and it's not close.

    As for Green, you can't find a more valuable role player for the price (not including players on rookie deals). For 3.5 M, he's well worth the money.
    I agree with you about his passivity but c'mon, Diaw is a better defender than Blair, at least as good as Bonner and it's too soon to judge Baynes.

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