Greater Argentinian Athlete: Manu or Messi

[JWest596]

Manu.......never heard of whatisname.

[Genjuro]

Futbol players don´t run the whole field and its less exhausting than BB, those 2 babies you showed me are really fat but that doesnt make mine skinnier.

Football players run two-to-three times the distance covered by NBA players: http://www.runnersworld.com/fun/dist...various-sports

There are never back-to-back games in football, because of how exhausting it is. In basketball you can see back-to-back-to-back games being played.

It would be nice for you to show me any evidence to support your statement, or at least a clue pointing that way.

Even if Argentina wins which would be awesome Maradona already did it, the difference is Argentina is a futbol country and we always have great futbol teams, what Manu did as leo_d said is he won against Team Usa twice with a NT full of nobodies (how many of these dudes had a good NBA career?) while our futbol team is full of dudes playing in elite euro teams.

Well, more guys from Argentina had a good NBA career than those from Puerto Rico or Lithuania that beat the USA in those very same Olympic Games. Indeed Italy demolished them in preparation with "superstars" Basile and Galanda as the go-to players, with no (past, present or future) NBA guy in that squad.

It was a bigger challenge, there is no futbol national team stacked as that USA BB team.

It was such a challenge that Yugoslavia and Spain beat the USA as well in 2002, and Puerto Rico and Lithuania in 2004.

What Argentina did was historic, but let's not pretend those were strong US Teams, because they weren't.

same with Duracne that skinny lives by the refs what a heliflopter queen I hate him and his fat mom he is a good shooter and thats it...Manu is the better player when the Durant played like Manu ´05?

I can handle my own, thanks; you don't need to help me.

Regarding Manu vs Messi athletism, Futbol players run, basketball players run and jump, Messi is not a good jumper he is like 5´7 and has barely made goals using his head.

If it's only about athleticism, taking skills away, I admit I wouldn't know. Messi is definitely not the best athlete in his country. How good is Argentina in athletics? Perhaps you can find a better athlete than Ginobili in some random sport. I'm not sure that's what the thread's creator had in mind when he asked, though.

Those fatty you showed to me were centers, thats like futbol goalkeepers

Yeah... right. I'm giving you that basketball is more exhausting than playing goalkeeper.

[Genjuro]

they dont run the whole court dumbass, a striker(like messi incase you didnt know) can sit on his ass when the ball is on the other side of the court. While bball players run the whole court every moment.

And that's why football players run two-to-three times more distance than basketball players per game: http://www.runnersworld.com/fun/dist...various-sports

[ddjeffries]

And by greater you mean what? Better at their sport? More popular?

[Mikeanaro]

Football players run two-to-three times the distance covered by NBA players: http://www.runnersworld.com/fun/dist...various-sports

There are never back-to-back games in football, because of how exhausting it is. In basketball you can see back-to-back-to-back games being played.

It would be nice for you to show me any evidence to support your statement, or at least a clue pointing that way.



Well, more guys from Argentina had a good NBA career than those from Puerto Rico or Lithuania that beat the USA in those very same Olympic Games. Indeed Italy demolished them in preparation with "superstars" Basile and Galanda as the go-to players, with no (past, present or future) NBA guy in that squad.



It was such a challenge that Yugoslavia and Spain beat the USA as well in 2002, and Puerto Rico and Lithuania in 2004.

What Argentina did was historic, but let's not pretend those were strong US Teams, because they weren't.



I can handle my own, thanks; you don't need to help me.



If it's only about athleticism, taking skills away, I admit I wouldn't know. Messi is definitely not the best athlete in his country. How good is Argentina in athletics? Perhaps you can find a better athlete than Ginobili in some random sport. I'm not sure that's what the thread's creator had in mind when he asked, though.



Yeah... right. I'm giving you that basketball is more exhausting than playing goalkeeper.

Nonsense, thats like saying you are better athlete because you play futbol than some dude doing nonstop pushups for 90 minutes, distance doesnt mean squat.
Weak argument, our argentinian guys are far away from those in Team Usa, and way below than any argentinian national squad, you cant reverse that.
It doesnt matter if is strong or not they did it, who else? always trying to find around Manu, MESSI SCORELESS IN 2010 WITH A STACKED TEAM!
You can´t handle your own since you think a manufactured star is better than a player that won everywhere lol comparing Manu to that ethiopian, shame on you.
Got to go cant keep writing right now.

[DWizz007]

I agree. Messi is on Barcelona a club team with large deep pockets to spend on superstars. The Argentinian national team is no push over either. He has some of the worlds best play makers at every position surrounding him at all times on the pitch. Ginobili on the other hand is limited on his NBA team and National team. Both teams which have won it all against "greater" compe ion. Ex: Miami Heat and Team USA.

[DWizz007]

Manu and is not even close.

How so?

[Genjuro]

I agree. Messi is on Barcelona a club team with large deep pockets to spend on superstars. The Argentinian national team is no push over either. He has some of the worlds best play makers at every position surrounding him at all times on the pitch. Ginobili on the other hand is limited on his NBA team and National team. Both teams which have won it all against "greater" compe ion. Ex: Miami Heat and Team USA.

Yep, a 54-wins team from the Leastern Conference and the guys falling by 17 points to an Italian squad whose players have never spent one single second on a NBA game, that's the "greater" compe ion you're talking about?

[Genjuro]

Nonsense, thats like saying you are better athlete because you play futbol than some dude doing nonstop pushups for 90 minutes, distance doesnt mean squat.
Weak argument, our argentinian guys are far away from those in Team Usa, and way below than any argentinian national squad, you cant reverse that.
It doesnt matter if is strong or not they did it, who else? always trying to find around Manu, MESSI SCORELESS IN 2010 WITH A STACKED TEAM!
You can´t handle your own since you think a manufactured star is better than a player that won everywhere lol comparing Manu to that ethiopian, shame on you.
Got to go cant keep writing right now.

Exacty what I thought: no evidence, no clue, no reasoning to support your statements. Football is more exhausting, which doesn't mean football players are better athletes than basketball ones. Actually it's hard to compare because the required athleticism is different in those sports.

That USA Team was very talented, but as a team they were crap, which is the reason why they lost so many games.

I'm not trying to find about Manu. He's currently my favourite player from any sport, the Spurs is currently my favourite team from any sport and the 2002-2004 Argentina basketball NT is my all-time favourite NT from any sport. Let's say idolizing is not my thing. The real Manu is a good and exciting enough player to enjoy and root for.

The fact that Messi went scoreless in 5 games during the summer of 2010 while playing mid-fielder is not so dramatic to write the whole sentence in capitals.

[leo_d]

You can only use that card with Maradona. Manu wasn't even his team's top player when he won his NBA rings. How can you enter a "greatest" discussion if you're not even the top player in your own team?

Well, beeing the MVP of the team, to me, is another requirement to be the greatest, along with prolongued success over the years and winning the most important le in the sport.

I could tell you that Manu could have been easily considered the top player in the 2005 playoff run, but for a not american player, the hardest thing you can do is to beat team USA and win the olympics (is different for american players, because the hardest thing that they can do is to win a nba championship, they never will have to go trough an All Star Team to win a golden medal), and Manu was the mvp in 2004, dropping 27 points against Tim Duncan, Allen Iverson, Lebron James, Richard Jefferson, Stephon Marbury, Shawn Marion, Amare Stoudemire, Carmelo Anthony, Carlos Boozer, Lamar Odom, Emeka Okafor y Dwyane Wade (no matter what you say, that is a of team, and any team in the world would have change any of his players for one of them).

Messi pass two of the requirements, buy hey, if you do not agree, please tell me what is your criteria to consider someone the greatest.

[DAF86]

Your point must be that since soccer is more popular around the world, then so it must be that Messi would be considered the greater athlete around the world?
I disagree with that premise, if that is indeed your premise.
One fact does not make another.

How on Earth the best player of the most popular sport wouldn't be considered the greater athlete?

[Genjuro]

Well, beeing the MVP of the team, to me, is another requirement to be the greatest, along with prolongued success over the years and winning the most important le in the sport.

I could tell you that Manu could have been easily considered the top player in the 2005 playoff run, but for a not american player, the hardest thing you can do is to beat team USA and win the olympics (is different for american players, because the hardest thing that they can do is to win a nba championship, they never will have to go trough an All Star Team to win a golden medal), and Manu was the mvp in 2004, dropping 27 points against Tim Duncan, Allen Iverson, Lebron James, Richard Jefferson, Stephon Marbury, Shawn Marion, Amare Stoudemire, Carmelo Anthony, Carlos Boozer, Lamar Odom, Emeka Okafor y Dwyane Wade (no matter what you say, that is a of team, and any team in the world would have change any of his players for one of them).

Messi pass two of the requirements, buy hey, if you do not agree, please tell me what is your criteria to consider someone the greatest.

Manu was amazing in 2005, but Tim Duncan was the real centerpiece of that team. Everything is built from him. That's why Tim Duncan is now widely considered a top-10 all-time player and some people still question whether Ginobili should be HoF (not me, by the way).

You keep bringing the Olympic heroics, but as exciting as that was, a compe ion that isn't even played by many of the greatest players (because they just don't care enough) can't be weighted so much when discussing truly all-time greatness. Plus, it suffers the same downside as football WC, meaning a tournament only every four years and just a handful of games long.

My criteria to consider someone the greatest is to be the best possible player at whatever he does (of course, you have to weight the importance and compe ion of every sport; basketball and football are popular enough around the world), and let the les call the relatively close cases. Of course truly great players tend to win. Messi himself has won three Champions Leagues, which is the very top club compe ion in the world.

[leo_d]

So Di Stefano is better than Messi, Pele and Maradona, I mean, he was the best possible player at what he does, and as a close case his 5 champions leagues give him the edge. He never won a WC tough, but that´s just a 7 game compe ion that truly greatest athletes don´t take really serious.

[Mel_13]

slomo

How about moving this thread to the soccer forum or the international forum? , the Pistons forum is a quiet place.

[Mikeanaro]

slomo

How about moving this thread to the soccer forum or the international forum? , the Pistons forum is a quiet place.

How about moving you out of this place? this is the offseason there is no much to talk about.

[Mikeanaro]

Exacty what I thought: no evidence, no clue, no reasoning to support your statements. Football is more exhausting, which doesn't mean football players are better athletes than basketball ones. Actually it's hard to compare because the required athleticism is different in those sports.

That USA Team was very talented, but as a team they were crap, which is the reason why they lost so many games.

I'm not trying to find about Manu. He's currently my favourite player from any sport, the Spurs is currently my favourite team from any sport and the 2002-2004 Argentina basketball NT is my all-time favourite NT from any sport. Let's say idolizing is not my thing. The real Manu is a good and exciting enough player to enjoy and root for.

The fact that Messi went scoreless in 5 games during the summer of 2010 while playing mid-fielder is not so dramatic to write the whole sentence in capitals.

Right now even if Lion-el wins all the teams were pure crap, Netherlands winning against Costa Rica by penalties, and Brazil won against Chile doing the same, all other games were 1-0 because of that lame defensive scheme with 8 guys hugging in the goal field, very boring World Cup.

[Genjuro]

So Di Stefano is better than Messi, Pele and Maradona, I mean, he was the best possible player at what he does, and as a close case his 5 champions leagues give him the edge. He never won a WC tough, but that´s just a 7 game compe ion that truly greatest athletes don´t take really serious.

Honestly, that's a pathetic try to put words in my mouth that I've never said. I was talking about Olympic Games in basketball and many players not caring enough to compete.

As for Di Stefano, he's in that all-time top level. He's reportedly comparable to Pele, Maradona and Cruyff, and there's a reason Cruyff and Di Stefano are considered top-5 all-time players despite never winning a WC, but it's Pele and Maradona are the ones put in the all-time top two positions. As I've said, the les call the relatively close cases.

[Gervin44Silas13]

MESSI HASNT WON !!!! MANU HANDS DOWN>>>>BOW TO MANU!!!!!

[leo_d]

R.I.P. Di Stefano

[Cowboys_Wear_Spurs]

they dont run the whole court dumbass, a striker(like messi incase you didnt know) can sit on his ass when the ball is on the other side of the court. While bball players run the whole court every moment.

The most fit guys on the pitch are holding midfielders and wing defenders (if they are the type that go forward like Roberto Carlos). Strikers for 80% of the match play only one side of the field. Midfielders and Wing defenders play both thirds of the pitch.

When coming to accolades, Messi will possibly trump Manu. Both there is no way in is he more athletic than Manu. Manu is in the 99.9% percentile of the populous when it comes to pure athleticism. Messi is probably in the 85%. What Messi has is just excellent ball control and like Zidane, and like him he isn't the most athletic guy on the pitch most days. There are a lot of futbol players even today that are more athletic than Messi.

[doobs]

Manu is easily the better athlete. Messi will end up being the more accomplished and dominant sportsman. And since Argentina is more of a soccer country, Messi has a greater impact in his country and is likely more of an icon. But soccer sucks balls.

[lefty]

[Cowboys_Wear_Spurs]

England was the #1 defense in the world at the time. That is what makes this goal by Maradona so great.

I really don't look at Club stats too much b/c its easy to score goals when your Club is one of the biggest in the world and you have a top 5 player or two in the world starting at each position.

Messi just had his worse season in 6 years last year and that is directly due to Xavi and Iniesta not being the players they were 3-4 years ago. That's why I will consider Maradona and Pele the greatest goal scorers ever is b/c they had the ability to take on 3-4 guys and score goals perpetually. Messi and the likes of Ronaldo does this once in a blue moon, but never against the best defenses in the World.

Messi is a great footballer but his stats are way overrated considering the talent that he had played with at Barca. Basically it would have the same as Lebron (SF), Duncan (PF), Manu (SG), Paul (PG), and Gasol (C) played on the same team since 2005. That team would rival the 70's Nuggets in PPG.

[Brazil]

How on Earth the best player of the most popular sport wouldn't be considered the greater athlete?

I truly believe dude is mentally challenged

[Brazil]

just saw the result of the poll
ST