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  1. #2501
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    I didn't say his character was ruined though, I said they made his character suck, which it did. You said it would be hard to make a character suck with 8 hours screen time. They absolutely can. Both of their series so far they've had issues actually making half of the le characters work. I'd say wanda was almost bad, character development wise. Visions arc was better of the two, IMO once again with less screen time.
    Ah, difference of opinion. I didn't think they sucked. I think there were missed opportunities in both series. I hope they lean into Wanda's being kind of a bad guy now that she's overpowered. FAWS seems like a victim of the COVID shutdown so I hope and expect the movie will have more focus.

    The Disney+ stuff is pretty new territory and I think they have ignored the occasional but real long form successes of the old Marvel TV division. It's mostly snobbery but that's the business.

  2. #2502
    A neverending cycle Trainwreck2100's Avatar
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    true true

    But Sam Wilson has grown on me tbh, mostly thanks to this show


    Before he was the ultimate wingman, beta token black guy who followed Cap lile a little dog

    At least Rhodey knew when to push back
    Brah that's cause Cap was never wrong there was nothing to push back. I think they ed up by not letting him be the one to save rhodey all the way back in civil war. The fall at this point meant nothing anyway. What was his only other solo hero moment, the fight with crossbones?

  3. #2503
    TheDrewShow is salty lefty's Avatar
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    Brah that's cause Cap was never wrong there was nothing to push back. I think they ed up by not letting him be the one to save rhodey all the way back in civil war. The fall at this point meant nothing anyway. What was his only other solo hero moment, the fight with crossbones?
    Not saying Cap was wrong but from the moment Sam met Cap in CA:TWS he decided he was going to be his puppy
    At that point he didn't know Steve well yet, only by reputation

  4. #2504
    A neverending cycle Trainwreck2100's Avatar
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    Not saying Cap was wrong but from the moment Sam met Cap in CA:TWS he decided he was going to be his puppy
    At that point he didn't know Steve well yet, only by reputation
    In that world captain America was a WW2 vet and saved the world with the avengers so that's a pretty good reputation. Also, remember Cap does go out of his way to break into a heavily guarded base to get Sam his suit back.

  5. #2505
    TheDrewShow is salty lefty's Avatar
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    In that world captain America was a WW2 vet and saved the world with the avengers so that's a pretty good reputation. Also, remember Cap does go out of his way to break into a heavily guarded base to get Sam his suit back.
    Yeah it'S pretty good reputation, no question
    But still, at that point Sam didn't know him well and that's a fact

    Yes Cap and Nat did get him his exofalconwingpackthingy but that's because Sam told Cap he would help him even though he still didn't know him well

    "If Captain America needs my help, I'm cool with being killed by super psychopaths"
    ok that's exactly what he said but that's the idea

    Or "I do what he does, only slower"
    , that's the ultimate beta following wingman talk

    Not to mention how hard he was trying to be Cap's friend right after that jogging session, that was creepy as

  6. #2506
    Damns (Given): 0 Blake's Avatar
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    How did Sam make the new super suit? Did I miss that part?

    And how does he gas up the wings?

  7. #2507
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    How did Sam make the new super suit? Did I miss that part?

    And how does he gas up the wings?
    Deus ex Wakanda.

  8. #2508
    A neverending cycle Trainwreck2100's Avatar
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    Yeah it'S pretty good reputation, no question
    But still, at that point Sam didn't know him well and that's a fact

    Yes Cap and Nat did get him his exofalconwingpackthingy but that's because Sam told Cap he would help him even though he still didn't know him well

    "If Captain America needs my help, I'm cool with being killed by super psychopaths"
    ok that's exactly what he said but that's the idea

    Or "I do what he does, only slower"
    , that's the ultimate beta following wingman talk

    Not to mention how hard he was trying to be Cap's friend right after that jogging session, that was creepy as
    Sam was doing his VA PTSD schtick with Cap after the jogging session because he recognized Cap as a veteran adjusting back to civ life. I'd argue that the whole reason they were both up and running was because neither of them could sleep. And when he met cap at the VA he told him he got out because he didn't think it was worth fighting anymore. Him and Steve join up because they both found an enemy that they had to beat. That was the whole point of the scene at his house.

  9. #2509
    Bosshog in the cut djohn2oo8's Avatar
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    How do you even do Black Panther 2 now

  10. #2510
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    How do you even do Black Panther 2 now
    I would forgive Disney for trying to recast BP or even retconning/resurrecting/rehabilitating Killmonger. Wakanda's too important to abandon. Until Reed and Xavier are introduced, Shuri is pretty much the MCU genius. White Wolf should have a role in whatever happens as well.

  11. #2511
    TheDrewShow is salty lefty's Avatar
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    When Stark is not around, there is Wakanda

  12. #2512
    TheDrewShow is salty lefty's Avatar
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    Sam was doing his VA PTSD schtick with Cap after the jogging session because he recognized Cap as a veteran adjusting back to civ life. I'd argue that the whole reason they were both up and running was because neither of them could sleep. And when he met cap at the VA he told him he got out because he didn't think it was worth fighting anymore. Him and Steve join up because they both found an enemy that they had to beat. That was the whole point of the scene at his house.
    Good point tbh imo

  13. #2513
    Manu Mania lefty20's Avatar
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    I would forgive Disney for trying to recast BP or even retconning/resurrecting/rehabilitating Killmonger. Wakanda's too important to abandon. Until Reed and Xavier are introduced, Shuri is pretty much the MCU genius. White Wolf should have a role in whatever happens as well.
    I would definitely prefer a redemption arc for Killmonger storyline. But it looks like they're gonna move ahead with Shuri taking on the BP mantle.

  14. #2514
    Bosshog in the cut djohn2oo8's Avatar
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    I would definitely prefer a redemption arc for Killmonger storyline. But it looks like they're gonna move ahead with Shuri taking on the BP mantle.
    What if Killmonger and Shuri both take up the mantle? Michael B didn’t confirm or deny he was returning which means he is and sense his role won’t be small

  15. #2515
    TheDrewShow is salty lefty's Avatar
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    didnít Killmonger dieded?

  16. #2516
    Manu Mania lefty20's Avatar
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    didn’t Killmonger dieded?
    It was implied, but never confirmed.

    It'd be pretty easy to retcon his story. The combination of Wakanda medical tech + his herb powers is theoretically enough to explain how he's still alive.

  17. #2517
    A neverending cycle Trainwreck2100's Avatar
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    I would definitely prefer a redemption arc for Killmonger storyline. But it looks like they're gonna move ahead with Shuri taking on the BP mantle.
    wow that's awful, maybe if she didn't get snapped you could sat she had those 5 years to train for battle but the only way to make her a believable threat would be to make her suit be an iron man suit.

  18. #2518
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    didn’t Killmonger dieded?
    Michael B. Jordan didn't.

  19. #2519
    Manu Mania lefty20's Avatar
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    Also, did Marvel just low key confirm that an F4 movie will follow GotG V3?

    Edit: This would mean F4 before Blade... kinda weird since they've announced the movie it's lead actor for a good while now. This might mean that Marvel already has a handshake agreement with their preferred actors for F4.

  20. #2520
    6X ST MVP Spurtacular's Avatar
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    I would forgive Disney for trying to recast BP or even retconning/resurrecting/rehabilitating Killmonger. Wakanda's too important to abandon. Until Reed and Xavier are introduced, Shuri is pretty much the MCU genius. White Wolf should have a role in whatever happens as well.
    Why does Disney need your forgiveness?

  21. #2521
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    Why does Disney need your forgiveness?
    Who said they did, derp?

    Be specific.

  22. #2522
    Veteran cd021's Avatar
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    Also, did Marvel just low key confirm that an F4 movie will follow GotG V3?

    Edit: This would mean F4 before Blade... kinda weird since they've announced the movie it's lead actor for a good while now. This might mean that Marvel already has a handshake agreement with their preferred actors for F4.
    Blade is apparently coming out in October 2022, Fantastic 4 seems likely for July 2023. They are still early in development for that to change so that's probably why they haven't confirmed the dates.

    What if Killmonger and Shuri both take up the mantle? Michael B didn’t confirm or deny he was returning which means he is and sense his role won’t be small
    There has been reports that The Brigerton guy is reportedly going to play Kasper Cole (The second Black Panther). Until then, I see the Dora Milaje, Shuri, and M'Baku sharing the hero role.

    I would definitely prefer a redemption arc for Killmonger storyline. But it looks like they're gonna move ahead with Shuri taking on the BP mantle.
    I would prefer that too but it would be an abrupt about face. They could say that Shuri saved his life and he helped protect Wakanda during the snap. Why wasn't he at the Thanos battle then? I still think Kasper Cole will be the Next BP with Shuri taking the mantle down the road.

  23. #2523
    Veteran cd021's Avatar
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    Just look at falcon, they did nothing to flesh out his hesitancy for taking the mantle, it was an acknowledged issue for like maybe 30 minutes of the show. All of it ended in a "captain america speech" which was way too long. in terms of character development walker, bucky, zemo, and old black guy had better arcs and story telling in far less time.

    Bucky's character development actually was pretty lacking, they did a good good job with Zemo, Sharon, and Bradley in limited time. I thought they did a solid job with Sam, expanding on his "It doesn't feel like its mine" line in Endgame.

    They explain that He left N.O because he wanted to prove himself and prove White people wrong. He joined the military where he began doing solo flights with the wings. He gets out and ends up leading a group to help soldiers recovering from PTSD. He later meets Cap and becomes Falcon in TWS. I think he wanted to pave his own way and make his own name rather than having to live up to Rodgers when he knows that he can't.

    Meeting Bradley suddenly makes him not only reinforces his decision but makes him doubt whether there should even be a captain America. The second meeting, after he regains the shield, makes him second-guess taking up the mantle after he seemed willing too after the -show of Walker.

    The boat story-line was about preserving legacy, he fights for the boat even when its easier to let it go. He realizes that its too easy to let all of the negative history surrounding the shield dissuade him and that he rather fight to restore the legacy even though millions won't accept him. The same reason why he left for the military is the same reason why he became Captain America. As far as story-telling goes, I think that's pretty good.

  24. #2524
    Veteran cd021's Avatar
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    Why would she be finished?

    Just looks like they're including Kamala and Monica.

    Not defending her acting or her character as currently written....
    Yeah, and they may include Blue Marvel too. Kinda makes more sense to call it The Marvels as opposed to Captain Marvel 2. Still kinda surprised that went away from the traditional series names though

    shh just let me troll

    Monica's character is pretty dry imo, but seems I'm in the minority there.
    She is a bit bland, ironically, she was a lot more interesting as Geraldine. They need to do a better job writing Carol and Monica and not making them too over-serious.

  25. #2525
    A neverending cycle Trainwreck2100's Avatar
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    Bucky's character development actually was pretty lacking, they did a good good job with Zemo, Sharon, and Bradley in limited time. I thought they did a solid job with Sam, expanding on his "It doesn't feel like its mine" line in Endgame.

    They explain that He left N.O because he wanted to prove himself and prove White people wrong. He joined the military where he began doing solo flights with the wings. He gets out and ends up leading a group to help soldiers recovering from PTSD. He later meets Cap and becomes Falcon in TWS. I think he wanted to pave his own way and make his own name rather than having to live up to Rodgers when he knows that he can't.

    Meeting Bradley suddenly makes him not only reinforces his decision but makes him doubt whether there should even be a captain America. The second meeting, after he regains the shield, makes him second-guess taking up the mantle after he seemed willing too after the -show of Walker.

    The boat story-line was about preserving legacy, he fights for the boat even when its easier to let it go. He realizes that its too easy to let all of the negative history surrounding the shield dissuade him and that he rather fight to restore the legacy even though millions won't accept him. The same reason why he left for the military is the same reason why he became Captain America. As far as story-telling goes, I think that's pretty good.
    He didn't do solo flights Riley getting shot down is why he dropped out of the military. If they wanted to make a story line about preserving legacy that was the whole point of the shield and who carries it, even though it's a different shield, didn't need a boat for that. The boat was filler and not needed. I don't even think the shield has negative history I don't know what you mean when you say that, even in the comics Bradley recognized it for it's power as a symbol he gets arrested for putting it on. His entire family arc was a waste

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