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  1. #676
    生麦生米生ハメ baseline bum's Avatar
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    No exit for Jimmy now

    Last edited by baseline bum; 08-16-2022 at 10:19 AM.

  2. #677
    Veteran DeadlyDynasty's Avatar
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    Thatís a top 5 best series finale ever. Definitely better than Breaking Badís finale.

    Choosing between BB vs BCS is like choosing between Godfather and Godfather II. Thereís no wrong answer. It might be recency bias but I think BCS is the superior show.
    Gotta go with BCS because thereís no Skylar White

  3. #678
    More Chug, Less Glug Monostradamus's Avatar
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    Gotta go with BCS because there’s no Skylar White
    I do love that Kim proves the “hAtInG sKyLaR iS sExIsT” discourse was stupid, and Vince Gilligan corrected that mistake with Kim. Despite being in a similar position, she acts like the polar opposite of Skylar and everybody loved her for it.

  4. #679
    A neverending cycle Trainwreck2100's Avatar
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    Of all the characters returning from BB I didn't expect to see Marie My only real issue was the idea that Hamlin's wife would have been able to take kim for everything when bankruptcy is a thing and as lawyers they would all know that. I liked BB more but that's just a personal opinion

  5. #680
    Because I choose to. Neo.'s Avatar
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    as much a skylar got on my nerves, tbh if skylar wasnt so naggy and obnoxious, walter may not have been so unsatisfied with his life to turn to making meth. right from the get-go, it made clear how controlling she was in the very first scene by forcing him to eat veggie bacon, nagging him over taking his pills and leaving his second job (which was a huge sacrifice on his part to even do) on time all in the span of about 1 minute. then instead of welcoming him to his surprise party, she quietly pesters him more. so i personally felt it added to his choice to break bad.

    regardless, kim >>> skylar

  6. #681
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    as much a skylar got on my nerves, tbh if skylar wasnt so naggy and obnoxious, walter may not have been so unsatisfied with his life to turn to making meth. right from the get-go, it made clear how controlling she was in the very first scene by forcing him to eat veggie bacon, nagging him over taking his pills and leaving his second job (which was a huge sacrifice on his part to even do) on time all in the span of about 1 minute. then instead of welcoming him to his surprise party, she quietly pesters him more. so i personally felt it added to his choice to break bad.

    regardless, kim >>> skylar
    kim and skylar arent comparable. you guys are acting like they were going for the same thing and just executed better with kim. they are radically different characters. kim always enjoined the cons even from the first one as viktor and whatever her dutch name was. and look at the howard one... she was the one pushing things forward. she enjoyed that side of jimmy

    skylar never enjoyed walt's side business, was never really a part of it. only got involved to launder basically to protect him from going to prison, not out of her love of the drug business

  7. #682
    Because I choose to. Neo.'s Avatar
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    kim and skylar arent comparable. you guys are acting like they were going for the same thing and just executed better with kim. they are radically different characters. kim always enjoined the cons even from the first one as viktor and whatever her dutch name was. and look at the howard one... she was the one pushing things forward. she enjoyed that side of jimmy

    skylar never enjoyed walt's side business, was never really a part of it. only got involved to launder basically to protect him from going to prison, not out of her love of the drug business
    i never said anything like that. in fact, my post was to defend how skylar was done in the show. i felt her being the way she was, is a hugely important part of the storyline, and anna gunn played her role incredibly well.

    i just personally liked kim's character better, she was very likable, while skylar was not (as was clearly the intent by the writers of each of their characters)

  8. #683
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    i never said anything like that. in fact, my post was to defend how skylar was done in the show. i felt her being the way she was, is a hugely important part of the storyline, and anna gunn played her role incredibly well.

    i just personally liked kim's character better, she was very likable, while skylar was not (as was clearly the intent by the writers of each of their characters)
    i was responding more to mono i guess, with his comment about how the writers learned from skylar and improved with kim

    characters being likeable =/= the characters being compelling

    king joffrey, janice soprano were both extremely unlikeable characters who were also good characters in their respective shows. i think skylar was ok, but not an amazing character. i think people just got really mad at "i ed ted" tbh

    the only "bad" character i can remember in breaking bad was probably marie. just boring. the whole kleptomania thing had nothing to do with the show. none of her side stories mattered.

  9. #684
    More Chug, Less Glug Monostradamus's Avatar
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    only got involved to launder basically to protect him from going to prison, not out of her love of the drug business
    I am completely baffled that you came to this conclusion. Skylar very obviously wanted in on the drug business, she changes her mind when Walt made it clear that she couldn’t control him in that arena.

  10. #685
    More Chug, Less Glug Monostradamus's Avatar
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    On top of that Skylar reacts by acting irrationally and with a nauseating amount of self-pity, accepts zero responsibility for her actions, and faces virtually no consequences for what she did.

    To pretend like there is no way to compare Kim and Skylar is just stupid as well. There’s very obvious points of comparison between the two.

  11. #686
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    I am completely baffled that you came to this conclusion. Skylar very obviously wanted in on the drug business, she changes her mind when Walt made it clear that she couldnít control him in that arena.
    what?

    From my memory skylar wanted no part of any of it. Left walt, etc. only got invested when they needed to use the money for hanks medical bills

  12. #687
    More Chug, Less Glug Monostradamus's Avatar
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    what?

    From my memory skylar wanted no part of any of it. Left walt, etc. only got invested when they needed to use the money for hanks medical bills
    That got her in the door, but she was 100% enthusiastic about it at that point until she overstepped her bounds and Walt put her in her place, itís completely disingenuous to act like she was just begrudgingly forced into it the entire time.

  13. #688
    I cannot grok its fullnes leemajors's Avatar
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    That got her in the door, but she was 100% enthusiastic about it at that point until she overstepped her bounds and Walt put her in her place, it’s completely disingenuous to act like she was just begrudgingly forced into it the entire time.
    Yeah she was all about it for a bit, enjoyed the challenge thoroughly. Made him buy the car wash, loved tormenting the owner to sell it while being the wettest blanket of all time. I do not like the character at all, but Anna Gunn did a great job.

  14. #689
    More Chug, Less Glug Monostradamus's Avatar
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    And Kim is definitely a course correction as there isnít a single likable female character in BB until what, Andrea? Gilligan clearly saw the criticism.

  15. #690
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    That got her in the door, but she was 100% enthusiastic about it at that point until she overstepped her bounds and Walt put her in her place, it’s completely disingenuous to act like she was just begrudgingly forced into it the entire time.
    Yeah she was all about it for a bit, enjoyed the challenge thoroughly. Made him buy the car wash, loved tormenting the owner to sell it while being the wettest blanket of all time. I do not like the character at all, but Anna Gunn did a great job.
    guess i gotta rewatch the show. i do remember skylar insisting on the car wash but i dont recall that being her going against walt, but rather saul. saul wanted laser tag. skylar said the car wash makes more sense because it would be more believable, and iirc walt agreed. they only differed as far as how to negotiate with bogdon. maybe im misremembering... but i dont recall skylar wanting to be the queenpin or anything

  16. #691
    A neverending cycle Trainwreck2100's Avatar
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    guess i gotta rewatch the show. i do remember skylar insisting on the car wash but i dont recall that being her going against walt, but rather saul. saul wanted laser tag. skylar said the car wash makes more sense because it would be more believable, and iirc walt agreed. they only differed as far as how to negotiate with bogdon. maybe im misremembering... but i dont recall skylar wanting to be the queenpin or anything
    her thinking she was a boss nearly got her family killed when dealing with lydia. They'd be dead if not for Todd of all people

  17. #692
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    her thinking she was a boss nearly got her family killed when dealing with lydia. They'd be dead if not for Todd of all people
    how was that her thinking she was boss?

    either i legit dont remember some of these plot points or i feel like there's a lot of revisionist history going on here

    wasnt her only interaction with lydia at the car wash when she told her to stay away? at a time where Walt was out of the business and had turned over the cooking operation to todd? in what was is that her thinking she's boss... of a nonexistent drug operation

  18. #693
    A neverending cycle Trainwreck2100's Avatar
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    how was that her thinking she was boss?

    either i legit dont remember some of these plot points or i feel like there's a lot of revisionist history going on here

    wasnt her only interaction with lydia at the car wash when she told her to stay away? at a time where Walt was out of the business and had turned over the cooking operation to todd? in what was is that her thinking she's boss... of a nonexistent drug operation
    Not the boss, a boss, she had a fundamental misunderstanding of who she was dealing with. It was that one interaction that led Lydia to believe she was a threat.

  19. #694
    生麦生米生ハメ baseline bum's Avatar
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    Not the boss, a boss, she had a fundamental misunderstanding of who she was dealing with. It was that one interaction that led Lydia to believe she was a threat.
    IDK Lydia seemed like she just wanted to off anyone who had seen her.

  20. #695
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    Not the boss, a boss, she had a fundamental misunderstanding of who she was dealing with. It was that one interaction that led Lydia to believe she was a threat.
    walt told her she was a business associate of his, nothing more. from skyler's perspective, this was the one brief window of the show where they possibly could have gone on to live a life of normalcy. walt was out of the business. wanting to purge out all meth elements from their lives was rational. and tbh, it worked. lydia didnt come groveling back to walt after that. went haywire because of hank finding out and jesse finding out about the ricin.

    lydia wanted to kill everyone who could possibly connect back to her, including the list of people that walt arranged to kill in prison. she wasnt out to kill skyler out of vengeance for that interaction ... she probably would have tried to have Walt killed too if he wasnt MIA by then

  21. #696
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    both walt and jimmy are in their own ways, antiheroes. they are bad people but the audience is behind them and cheering for them. walt is magnitudes worse

    people dont like skyler because she was pitted as an adversary to our protagonist, whereas kim was an enabler/partner/accomplice of jimmy. skyler was called naggy or whiny because she didnt like her husband having a secret double life, being a serial liar, and being in the meth business. i dno. i dont think skyler's character was great (though the acting performance was usually quite good), but i do feel like a lot of the vitriol is pretty unwarranted

    skyler was often hypocritical whereas kim was more straightforward, i can grant that. i think skyler is more comparable to chuck than kim

  22. #697
    I cannot grok its fullnes leemajors's Avatar
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    both walt and jimmy are in their own ways, antiheroes. they are bad people but the audience is behind them and cheering for them. walt is magnitudes worse

    people dont like skyler because she was pitted as an adversary to our protagonist, whereas kim was an enabler/partner/accomplice of jimmy. skyler was called naggy or whiny because she didnt like her husband having a secret double life, being a serial liar, and being in the meth business. i dno. i dont think skyler's character was great (though the acting performance was usually quite good), but i do feel like a lot of the vitriol is pretty unwarranted

    skyler was often hypocritical whereas kim was more straightforward, i can grant that. i think skyler is more comparable to chuck than kim

  23. #698
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    And Kim is definitely a course correction as there isnít a single likable female character in BB until what, Andrea? Gilligan clearly saw the criticism.
    i mean these shows dont have that many women in the main cast. its basically just skyler and marie in breaking bad. who else is there as a main character? lydia who comes in near the end of the show? jane was good in her short time. deeply flawed, but a fun character in the show.

    and how many in BCS? its basically just Kim and like... Francesca

    i think marie was a legitimately bad character, and i already went into that above. we hate skyler because she was an adversary of our protagonist, and we like kim because she was the partner/confidant of our protagonist

    imo

  24. #699
    Because I choose to. Neo.'s Avatar
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    we hate skyler because she was an adversary of our protagonist, and we like kim because she was the partner/confidant of our protagonist

    imo
    being an adversary doesnt automatically make someone unlikable. most everyone loved gus despite him being an adversary of walt.

  25. #700
    Winner in a losers circle 140's Avatar
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    I honestly never cared for Walt as a character/protagonist and will go as far as to say that I watched BB not because but despite of him - and even I thought Skyler was an insufferable tbh

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