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so incredibly sub-par.
only non-spur championship run that I enjoyed
And the Cs defense falls apart if you switch out KG for a prime Dirk. I'm also pretty sure that, outside of mavfans & ST, KG is already remembered at a higher height than Dirk tbh.
^40% is 40%, JET had his moments too.
He shouldn't even be in this conversation. I understand Barkley. But his laziness (admittedly partied during the '93 Finals) and mediocre Game 6 performance in the '93 Finals (shot 7-18 for 21 points in a game they lost by 1) keeps him out of GOAT PF conversation. Too many Barkley and Malone apologists use the, "But they had to face Jordan
This is why the nba forum sucks
Dirk shot like 39% for the entire '11 Finals ...He shouldn't even be in this conversation. I understand Barkley. But his laziness (admittedly partied during the '93 Finals) and mediocre Game 6 performance in the '93 Finals (shot 7-18 for 21 points in a game they lost by 1) keeps him out of GOAT PF conversation. Too many Barkley and Malone apologists use the, "But they had to face Jordan
Played with the flu and garnered so much defensive attention that other guys were able to knock down open shots
they tried to make him beat them with his passing like golden state did. Well guess what, he learned a thing or two since then and he did just that.
He shot .416. Averaged 26 points and 9.7 boards a game as well. He was also a ridiculous .978 from the line, going 45/46 over the series. Even though his raw FG% was rather low, he was overall efficient. He also played some damn good defense on Bosh. He also scored 9 straight points to close the 4th quarter in game 2, in which the Mavs came back from 15 down with 6 minutes left.
And Barkley averaged 27.3 ppg, 13.0 rpg, 5.5 apg, 1.2 spg on 47.6% from the field. That didn't stop you from punishing him for one poor game. If instead of choking LeBron averages 41/8.5/6.3 like MJ did in '93, Dirk would be ringless as well. Dirk didn't simply win because he's more of a winner or a better player than Barkley.
All four are great.
If a college player was billed as the next Chris Webber you would say "okay..good offensive big man who can also pass".
If a college player was billed as the next Malone, Barkley, Dirk or KG you would say "yeah right".
All the greats garner attention and get role players open shots, that's nothing new. Not all shoot 41% despite all the attention. Most also make an impact on the defensive end. That's why Dirk slides down to the #4 or #5 spot in the PF GOAT list.
Look at the individual box scores for the series. Barkley was below his standards in many key games in the series (Game 1: 9-25, Game 3, 9-20, outplayed by both KJ and Dan Marjerle. Game 5, saved by Richard Dumas. And in Game 6, he was 7-18, as mentioned). It's also worth mentioning that '93 was a different era. Early 90's basketball was still in the vein of 80's basketball, with regards to pace and defense. I don't think Jordan averages those numbers on that efficiency in 2011. Wade was also pretty damn good in the 2011 Finals (one of the best Finals performances in losing effort that I can remember) and the Mavs still won it.
Let's also not forget Dirk's series against OKC. 32ppg on .557 shooting. The often cited Terry shot only 37%.
Then in '95, Barkley's team blows a 2-0 lead to the Rockets in the WCSF. Barkley was below his averages for the series and scored only 18 points on 7-16 shooting in Game 7 of the series, a game which the Suns lost by 1. (In the previous home closeout game [game 5], Barkley shot 8-22 for 17 points. A game that went to OT).
If Barkley steps up in either of those games, he likely has a ring. No one to blame but himself. Kevin Johnson tried to drag him to the Finals, but Barkley wasn't along for the ride.
I also forgot the Barkley's Suns blew a 2-0 lead the previous year, as well
And again, Barkley's stats for the series were below standard and he was terrible in the two home games where the Suns could've put a stranglehold on the series.
^All is well that ends well. My O & 47 has held up, Barkley remained ringless, Curry didn't provide his favor here, you didn't get your repeat, The Bag stays in Texas, Pau ended up ass over teacup|||The Relent took place + Paul & How couldn't cut the mus .
And your Cavs are about to scratch.
"You look beautiful, Cub. Just like a baby. All pink and powdered up."
- Eddie Felson
It's my Cleveland, but, it ain't my Cavs.
If Patrick Ewing, Jason Kidd, Rip Hamilton and Lebron all average 41/8.5/6.3 like MJ did in '93, Timmy would be ringless as well.
Great line of reasoning
This is one of the dumbest things I've ever heard said on this board, which is saying something. I know he's widely despised and that most people are unable to separate that, but there is no credible basis for saying he shouldn't be in the conversation with Garnett, Barkley and Nowitzki.He shouldn't even be in this conversation. I understand Barkley. But his laziness (admittedly partied during the '93 Finals) and mediocre Game 6 performance in the '93 Finals (shot 7-18 for 21 points in a game they lost by 1) keeps him out of GOAT PF conversation. Too many Barkley and Malone apologists use the, "But they had to face Jordan
Not KG. Maybe Dirk, but he couldn't defend either one of them. KG could defend Malone, but Barkley would have punished him physically.
KG has always reminded me of David Robinson in terms of otherworldly production (in terms of advanced stats) and consistent crap for supporting casts. Neither was good enough to pull a scrub team past the conference finals.
It's all opinion anyway, but I have it as KG, Dirk, Malone, Barkley.
You're making the claim. Prove it, with relevant stats, data, and analysis.
I'll start out by saying (which has been illustrated by statistics) that Karl Malone has the biggest dropoff from regular season to post season play among star players.
I cant stand him but you are right, he was on a mission that year.
Agreed on Heat and Lakers being tough compe ion. But OKC, harden, WB and durant were 22 years old playing in their first WCF, only player with deep playoff experience were perkins and mohammed, scott brooks hadn't even coached 20 playoff games when that series started. Is it really reasonable to consider that a big win?? The blazers were a decent team, but were they better than last years blazers? Remember Roy was already a s of himself, that team was basically aldridge plus role players, nothing to write home about IMO.
IMO 2011 was 2007 in reverse- in 07 the mavs were 1st seed and favorites but lost in the first round, opening the door for the spurs to get good matchups en route to the le. 2011 spurs lost as 1st seed and opened up the mavs to good matchups, just as the mavs would have been favored in 07 the spurs would have been favored in 11, much tougher matchups than the spurs - jazz wcf of 2007 / mavs - okc wcf of 2011.
Only similarities are that one team won and the other team lost in the 1st round as the 1st seed.
Mavs would have destroyed Spurs in 2007.
Mavs also would have destroyed Spurs in 2011.
Mavs faced tougher compe ion in 2011.
Manu and the Spurs owned the Mavs in the 2010/2011 season, as they also owned them in the playoffs the prior postseason.
lol "Would have destroyed"
ing dumb homer got.
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