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  1. #2451
    LMAO koriwhat's Avatar
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    That's why he needs to pick Tulsi Gabbard as his VP
    i'd still rather see him and all other commie's sick feet under. bernie and tulsi if she signs on with him at any stage of his campaign.

  2. #2452
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    why'd they cut it off right there?

    reminds me of Pelosi: "you have to sign the bill to find out what's inside"
    oh that meme again?

    “In the fall of the year,” Pelosi said, “the outside groups … were saying ‘it’s about abortion,’ which it never was. ‘It’s about ‘death panels,’’ which it never was. ‘It’s about a job-killer,’ which it creates four million [jobs]. ‘It’s about increasing the deficit’; well, the main reason to pass it was to decrease the deficit.” Her contention was that the Senate “didn’t have a bill.” And until the Senate produced an actual piece of legislation that could be matched up and debated against what was passed by the House, no one truly knew what would be voted on.

    “So, that’s why I was saying we have to pass a bill, so we can see, so that we can show you, what it is and what it isn’t,” Pelosi continued. “It is none of these things. It’s not going to be any of these things.”

  3. #2453
    non-essential Chris's Avatar
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    The problem isn't "how much is this going to cost" but since Bernie has no idea, he would never get anything through congress. We can all offer up flighty ideas about how to fix things. The fact that Bernie made a career doing this is amazing.
    Not really when you see your average Bernie supporter confronted on the street. They have no idea what Bernie's policies entail, they just think they are fighting for the common man.

  4. #2454
    non-essential Chris's Avatar
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    why'd they cut it off right there?
    deep state edits, It's a conspiracy against Bernie


    oh that meme again?
    What meme?

  5. #2455
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    Not really when you see your average Bernie supporter confronted on the street. They have no idea what Bernie's policies entail, they just think they are fighting for the common man.
    Bots and irony.


  6. #2456
    LMAO koriwhat's Avatar
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    Bots and irony.

    lol being so dumb you think captchas block bots... you're such a dumb ing tranny.

  7. #2457
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    Not really when you see your average Bernie supporter confronted on the street. They have no idea what Bernie's policies entail, they just think they are fighting for the common man.
    Except these clowns weren't even born when Bernie got started.

  8. #2458
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    the meme i responded to, and provided an explanation to in that very post

  9. #2459
    Pronouns: Your/Dad TheGreatYacht's Avatar
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    Tucker Carlson: Don't Be So Sure Trump Beats Bernie

  10. #2460
    Pronouns: Your/Dad TheGreatYacht's Avatar
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    Lev Parnas' Full Video of Trump Telling Associates To "Get Rid Of" Ambassador Marie Yovanovitch


    I haven't been paying attention to the impeachment crap. It's boring and I don't give a about it. But this video popped up on my YouTube feed. If anyone already posted this video then my apologies. Ignore this comment.
    Trump @ 54:40 "If Bernie would have been VP it would have been tougher...I got 20% of Bernie vote because of trade. He's a big trade guy. You know he basically says we’re getting screwed on trade. And he’s right. Had she [Hillary] picked Bernie Sanders it would have been tougher. He is the only one I didn't want her to pick."



    I ing KNEW IT. I've been saying this the whole time. Bernie 2020

  11. #2461
    Pronouns: Your/Dad TheGreatYacht's Avatar
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    DMC

    The cat is out of the bag. This is why you wanted Biden too eh? I called it.

  12. #2462
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
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    Yeah the Texas state government took 20 ing years to complete the project on IH-35 but the private sector builds a toll road from Georgetown to San Antonio in about 3 years.

    Just because some basic services are provided by the State and federal government using taxpayer money doesn't mean other services should be.

    I understand some aspects when it's a problem of ours but if it's a problem of mine that seems to be something I should be responsible for. FEMA doesn't get involved if my house floods only if everyone's house floods.
    But it is 'our' problem. Insurance companies and/or service providers might want to make it about the individual, but we can't escape the fact that we spend way, way more as a nation on healthcare than any other nation. That's us, combined.

    We already have the cozy arrangement where the private sector not only won't touch the high risk population (elderly) but will directly dump it onto the government.

    In cases like medicines, we are subsidizing other nations by paying exorbitant amounts of R&D and clinical testing. Pharma can't sell those drugs at inflated prices anywhere else, and cannot prevent supplying those nations (unless they want to see generics made with government sanction).

    And, about government involvement/delivery, we already have it doing a lot of that through Medicare, VA, Medicaid. And honestly, plenty of countries have mixed systems where the government does things like price control for medicines, certain services, and there's both public services and enhanced private services to choose from. If you can afford the latter, that's great, but if you can't, at least you have something to fall back to. The US has something similar with Medicaid, but you really need to be poor as to qualify, you have to apply for it, you have to be granted the benefit, etc.

    At some point, service and goods providers will have to take a hit, because this just isn't sustainable in the long term. Medicines that cost $300-$500/month here, you can cross the border up or down, and buy for $40, same damn drug. That gravy train is just going to have to come to an end at some point.

  13. #2463
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
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    By the way I'm still waiting for someone to name one of the Departments of the federal government that's efficient and effective.

    Why do people keep ignoring the difficult questions and only go for the low-hanging fruit?
    I didn't know you asked. The IRS is probably both, considering they end up ensuring much more money comes in than what they cost, the DOD is probably fairly effective, considering the whole superpower thingie. The DOJ is certainly effective, and I don't particularly remember large inefficiencies there.

    Just off the top of my head.

  14. #2464
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
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    Are undo ented immigrants en led to medicare or medicaid?

    With porous borders there's no way to control the user base of a program that has a very finite amount of payers. Taxing the working citizens of the US isn't going to relieve world poverty. It will just make us all poor.
    This would be under the presumption that undo ented immigrants don't pay taxes, which isn't necessarily the case.

  15. #2465
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
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    Did people really believe Obama would do this

    Obama will wait in the shadows until a candidate is picked, then go campaign for/with him/her

  16. #2466
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
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    I can see how Bernie Sanders might win the nomination, but I can’t see how Sanders ends up as much more than a McGovern redux.

    Black people aren’t talking about Bernie Sanders. Or Elizabeth Warren. Or the mayor of South Bend. They’re talking about Joe Biden and Michael Bloomberg.

    I get so ing tired of gentry white liberals and their fake “woke” compassion. They don’t have any intention of considering what minorities think or minorities want. Being the self-appointed vanguards of social justice is just a means to power and an excuse for the creative-class’s neoliberal dispossession of the white working class.

    That’s why so much of the discussion revolves around these dead-end boutique candidates that are non-starters outside the progressive bubbles and faculty lounges.
    It's a field with variety, but pretty damn terrible. The only guy I can think of that's somewhat inspirational is Bernie, even if I'm personally not a fan. It's the only guy from that crowd I would bet some money that will stick to his convictions, even if he can't pass one law as POTUS.

    But he could also end up like a Ron Paul, basically a loser outcast with a rabid following.

  17. #2467
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
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    Not really when you see your average Bernie supporter confronted on the street. They have no idea what Bernie's policies entail, they just think they are fighting for the common man.
    Sounds like your average Trump fan too, tbh

  18. #2468
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    "average Bernie supporter confronted on the street. They have no idea what Bernie's policies entail"

    Chris working from his own confrontations of Bernie supporters on the street.



  19. #2469
    non-essential Chris's Avatar
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    Sounds like your average Trump fan too, tbh
    Sorry George, but most Trump fans know exactly what Trump's policies are because he doesn't beat around the bush or sugar coat his agenda. This is obvious to anyone with a lick of common sense. Maybe try watching a rally sometime, and turning off Rachel Maddow. If you can't, at least put some effort in to your whataboutery.

  20. #2470
    Pronouns: Your/Dad TheGreatYacht's Avatar
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    Sorry George, but most Trump fans know exactly what Trump's policies are because he doesn't beat around the bush or sugar coat his agenda. This is obvious to anyone with a lick of common sense. Maybe try watching a rally sometime, and turning off Rachel Maddow. If you can't, at least put some effort in to your whataboutery.
    Yousef, (man responsible for Steven Crowder's night terrors) Interviewed by Nick Fuentes



  21. #2471
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    But it is 'our' problem. Insurance companies and/or service providers might want to make it about the individual, but we can't escape the fact that we spend way, way more as a nation on healthcare than any other nation. That's us, combined.
    Sure, if you combine the data and look at it as a collective then it appears to be a problem of ours, but so would anything else. National disasters that affect a lot of people have one basic cause, and they are a problem of ours. Health related issues are caused by a large variety of things, some under the direct control of the patient (lifestyle related issues, self harm, etc..) and some not (genetic disorders, accidents, etc..). I don't consider these to be my problems. Sure collectively they put a strain on society, but that strain can be relieved without creating a free HC system. In fact, the single payer system would make it worse imo.
    We already have the cozy arrangement where the private sector not only won't touch the high risk population (elderly) but will directly dump it onto the government.
    You mean onto the taxpayer. You're proposing that all medical costs be dumped onto the taxpayer. How does that make it better?
    In cases like medicines, we are subsidizing other nations by paying exorbitant amounts of R&D and clinical testing. Pharma can't sell those drugs at inflated prices anywhere else, and cannot prevent supplying those nations (unless they want to see generics made with government sanction).
    Same with technology.
    And, about government involvement/delivery, we already have it doing a lot of that through Medicare, VA, Medicaid. And honestly, plenty of countries have mixed systems where the government does things like price control for medicines, certain services, and there's both public services and enhanced private services to choose from. If you can afford the latter, that's great, but if you can't, at least you have something to fall back to. The US has something similar with Medicaid, but you really need to be poor as to qualify, you have to apply for it, you have to be granted the benefit, etc.
    All the stuff you're mentioning would be worse if the taxpayer was forced to pay more. More free for some doesn't work well for the group paying for it. I don't know why people keep pretending it would benefit me as a taxpayer. My HC coverage now is just fine. I don't have long wait times for specialist care, surgical needs, MRIs or CAT scans. My co-pay is manageable. My deductible is manageable. I could imagine if I was someone on dialysis or had cancer treatments where the chemo is a prescription medication that costs exorbitant amounts, I might be on the other side of that but that's not where I am. Right now I would be the loser in the equation. Like others here and elsewhere, my outlook is based mostly on how it would affect me. This is why I say it's not a problem of ours.

    People have a right to move to other countries if the HC system is to their liking more than here in the US. Of course they can use the democratic process to try to change what the US offers, but cherry picking only desirable aspects of other countries without considering what they give up or require to have that system is too convenient to be useful.
    At some point, service and goods providers will have to take a hit, because this just isn't sustainable in the long term. Medicines that cost $300-$500/month here, you can cross the border up or down, and buy for $40, same damn drug. That gravy train is just going to have to come to an end at some point.
    The market will have to adjust when that happens.

    I don't pay 500 for any medication. The most I ever pay is about 20 dollars. This doesn't include my insurance payments. In my case, the ends don't justify the means.

  22. #2472
    Pronouns: Your/Dad TheGreatYacht's Avatar
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    Sorry George, but most Trump fans know exactly what Trump's policies are because he doesn't beat around the bush or sugar coat his agenda. This is obvious to anyone with a lick of common sense. Maybe try watching a rally sometime, and turning off Rachel Maddow. If you can't, at least put some effort in to your whataboutery.
    Steven Crowder gets BTFO'd by college student (Bernie Bro)



  23. #2473
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    This would be under the presumption that undo ented immigrants don't pay taxes, which isn't necessarily the case.
    But you simply don't know because they are undo ented.

  24. #2474
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    You mean onto the taxpayer. You're proposing that all medical costs be dumped onto the taxpayer. How does that make it better?
    current version of medicare is still working despite only covering the most vulnerable/expensive people. the concept of insurance is having a broad enough risk pool. if only sick people had insurance, premiums would be much higher (or the industry would just collapse). by broadening the risk pool for the government plan, it would only make it more financially efficient.

    and yes, it would still require more taxpayer funding, but those taxpayers are largely already paying for health insurance (which pays for other peoples' treatment). you would think of the government care as just one very large insurance company... you still pay premiums (via taxes) and obviously its the sick who are going to reap the benefits while the healthy are paying into the system. thats even the situation you find yourself in now... paying premiums despite admittedly not needing regular benefits.

    the advantage of the "single national insurance company" is the elimination of the profit margin that private insurance companies need to survive, while cutting overhead/administrative costs. the government program would obviously still have such costs, but studies support that theirs would be lowers than we see in the private sector.

  25. #2475
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    current version of medicare is still working despite only covering the most vulnerable/expensive people. the concept of insurance is having a broad enough risk pool. if only sick people had insurance, premiums would be much higher (or the industry would just collapse). by broadening the risk pool for the government plan, it would only make it more financially efficient.

    and yes, it would still require more taxpayer funding, but those taxpayers are largely already paying for health insurance (which pays for other peoples' treatment). you would think of the government care as just one very large insurance company... you still pay premiums (via taxes) and obviously its the sick who are going to reap the benefits while the healthy are paying into the system. thats even the situation you find yourself in now... paying premiums despite admittedly not needing regular benefits.

    the advantage of the "single national insurance company" is the elimination of the profit margin that private insurance companies need to survive, while cutting overhead/administrative costs. the government program would obviously still have such costs, but studies support that theirs would be lowers than we see in the private sector.
    Sorry, lack of compe ion doesn't equate to a favorable outcome for customers. I don't give all about their profit margin. I care about mine. Is there some moral victory to be had here by denying a private business a profit margin and instead spreading out all the costs to the taxpayers? The end result is more money out of my pocket for the same or worse medical care.

    People in their "earning years" who aren't minimum wage earners would likely pay more overall for this program than they pay for HC right now.

    The last thing I want from my government is them having even more control over my personal choices.

    That may be best for the collective. I don't live as a collective nor vote as one.

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