NBA: 1986 Celts vs 2014 Spurs

[Killakobe81]

My fault, I meant to say Kobe wasn't 1b until 2003. He was the clear robin until then. If you can even call him robin. He's the Hawkeyes or black widow up till around 2002. Became robin for the year, then more of an equal billing in 2003 when shaq declined and the lakers went nowhere.

And no, shaq didn't get swept by the Jazz because he didn't have a #2, it's because he had rambis or whoever it was as a patch instead of kfc, and 98 shaq is no where as dominant as 2001 shaq. It's like you saying 85 Kareem was as dominant as 80 Kareem, it's just not the case.

I'm fine with with Kobe being the number 2, he earned it since around 1999/2000, but no way in was he the 1b until at least 2003. Shaq ran that team. Nobody called Pippen a 1b, he was the clear #2. Same with mchale, and Kobe had that role during the three peat.

And you are disappointed with me? Look at the quote I originally responded to, the entire thing was Kobe propaganda, trying to sneak Kobe into the conversation and draw equivalence of him with the most dominant version of shaq. If I said Parker was the clear 1b to Duncan in 2003, it would be a clear propaganda move to boost up Parker and would be an insult to Duncan as well.

Sure the best teams needed a #2. Pippen was that on the 92 bulls, and Kobe was that on the 01 lakers. Neither of them were 1bs.

To nitpick, magic was 1b in 85 still. Kareem was the 1a.

You sa y it was 2003 i say it was the 2001 playoffs vs sacto especually the two road games and Kobe proved tflhat vs yiur Spurs as well. Again this not all about him its about the more dominant team Shaq was doininant in 97 98, 99 yet we were still lising when it mattered. Horry was in his prime always clutch but we could not win. Of hourse PJ deserves praise for 2000 because ge did motivate shaq ti get in shape but the biggest key was Kobe improving enough for us to trade for Rice's shooting. The 2000 team needed that because Fisher was not ready to provide that yet as a starter.

And nitpick is what you do best.

In 1985 Magic waa the driving force not Kareem even if was still out leading scoree And although Worthy was our #3 it was he and Magic that drove us because both choked in 84. Magic was tragic and henderson stole the ball ftom worthy. They drove us in 1985 even if Kareem was the clear #2 and Finals mvp. I know it was team the first team i followed for a whole season all 82 plus ...

[ambchang]

How old are you?
Did you actually see those teams play? And if you did... your Kobe hate makes more sense .to me now. if you watched those teams play even as kid of course Kobe's ball dominant ways would rub you the wrong way ...although not sure why Mj's ways dont do the same ...but whatever.

I think I'm about the same age as you but there are tapes, and those Knicks and Blazers team were a thing of beauty. People are googoogaaing over the Spurs and Warriors offense now but it was done back the. Sure the defense wasn't as complex back the. Nor the players movement as aesthetically pleasing, but the offenses were similar. We went away from that because the rules favoured one on one offense for a long time.

I don't hate Kobe, I dislike him because he's horribly overrated. He's ball dominant without being dominant, he coasted on defense for long stretches of his career despite him having the capability to do so, and o my do enough to get his brand going rather than help his team win. You'd say 5 rings but look at it closely and he was carried to three back in the three peat, and get way more credit than he deserved in the repeat. He clearly puts his own legacy and ego above the team, and lucked out in the other years. You can say Jordan was the same earlier in his career, but he adapted and trusted his teammate to two three peats, and was absolutely dominant in those years. I never really liked Jordan and didn't think he's as clear cut as the GOAT as people make him out to be, but you have to appreciate his true dominance. I never really liked shaq either, but he was dominant.

Btw, I liked Kobe during the threepeat, he was good. He played his role and out in great defense, it's when he ran shaq and Phil out of town to chase his own scoring numbers the mj complain about management that I started to dislike him. He's disingenuous and selfish.

[ambchang]

ESPN had them ranked 7th alltime a few years back behind the 1987 squad and the 86 Celts and the 72 win Bulls but when you say wasnt that great that seems dismissive to me. I think they are better than the 1983 Sixers tbh ...

Don't get me wrong. The 85 lakers team were probably one of the better teams ever, but we are talking about the best of the best. You don't talk about Barkley when you talk about the GOAT.

That said, I'd put the 83 sixers above the 85 lakers. Malone was just way too much that year.

[Killakobe81]

I think I'm about the same age as you but there are tapes, and those Knicks and Blazers team were a thing of beauty. People are googoogaaing over the Spurs and Warriors offense now but it was done back the. Sure the defense wasn't as complex back the. Nor the players movement as aesthetically pleasing, but the offenses were similar. We went away from that because the rules favoured one on one offense for a long time.

I don't hate Kobe, I dislike him because he's horribly overrated. He's ball dominant without being dominant, he coasted on defense for long stretches of his career despite him having the capability to do so, and o my do enough to get his brand going rather than help his team win. You'd say 5 rings but look at it closely and he was carried to three back in the three peat, and get way more credit than he deserved in the repeat. He clearly puts his own legacy and ego above the team, and lucked out in the other years. You can say Jordan was the same earlier in his career, but he adapted and trusted his teammate to two three peats, and was absolutely dominant in those years. I never really liked Jordan and didn't think he's as clear cut as the GOAT as people make him out to be, but you have to appreciate his true dominance. I never really liked shaq either, but he was dominant.

Btw, I liked Kobe during the threepeat, he was good. He played his role and out in great defense, it's when he ran shaq and Phil out of town to chase his own scoring numbers the mj complain about management that I started to dislike him. He's disingenuous and selfish.

Both mj and kobe were selfish Shaq too that is whyvthey all needed Phil and Tex tbh

[Killakobe81]

Don't get me wrong. The 85 lakers team were probably one of the better teams ever, but we are talking about the best of the best. You don't talk about Barkley when you talk about the GOAT.

That said, I'd put the 83 sixers above the 85 lakers. Malone was just way too much that year.

Moses was a beast but im still taking the 85 lakers because of the #2, #3, #4 on the 85 ate all better by comparison. Moses was the better #1.

[baseline bum]

Only pussies & assholes blame injuries & the officiating.

Neal never raped

[ambchang]

You sa y it was 2003 i say it was the 2001 playoffs vs sacto especually the two road games and Kobe proved tflhat vs yiur Spurs as well. Again this not all about him its about the more dominant team Shaq was doininant in 97 98, 99 yet we were still lising when it mattered. Horry was in his prime always clutch but we could not win. Of hourse PJ deserves praise for 2000 because ge did motivate shaq ti get in shape but the biggest key was Kobe improving enough for us to trade for Rice's shooting. The 2000 team needed that because Fisher was not ready to provide that yet as a starter.

And nitpick is what you do best.

In 1985 Magic waa the driving force not Kareem even if was still out leading scoree And although Worthy was our #3 it was he and Magic that drove us because both choked in 84. Magic was tragic and henderson stole the ball ftom worthy. They drove us in 1985 even if Kareem was the clear #2 and Finals mvp. I know it was team the first team i followed for a whole season all 82 plus ...

Face it. Phil made more difference than anything. Kobe got way better in 2002 due to rule changes ( see other perimeter players like pierce, carter, tmac, iverson, Allen) but was still #2.

We can nitpick on 85, but Kareem was the man. Magic was still 1b

[Killakobe81]

I think I'm about the same age as you but there are tapes, and those Knicks and Blazers team were a thing of beauty. People are googoogaaing over the Spurs and Warriors offense now but it was done back the. Sure the defense wasn't as complex back the. Nor the players movement as aesthetically pleasing, but the offenses were similar. We went away from that because the rules favoured one on one offense for a long time.

I don't hate Kobe, I dislike him because he's horribly overrated. He's ball dominant without being dominant, he coasted on defense for long stretches of his career despite him having the capability to do so, and o my do enough to get his brand going rather than help his team win. You'd say 5 rings but look at it closely and he was carried to three back in the three peat, and get way more credit than he deserved in the repeat. He clearly puts his own legacy and ego above the team, and lucked out in the other years. You can say Jordan was the same earlier in his career, but he adapted and trusted his teammate to two three peats, and was absolutely dominant in those years. I never really liked Jordan and didn't think he's as clear cut as the GOAT as people make him out to be, but you have to appreciate his true dominance. I never really liked shaq either, but he was dominant.

Btw, I liked Kobe during the threepeat, he was good. He played his role and out in great defense, it's when he ran shaq and Phil out of town to chase his own scoring numbers the mj complain about management that I started to dislike him. He's disingenuous and selfish.

Of course there are tapes ...that great Blazers,team btw was down 2-0 to one man wrecking crew in the Finals ...but even if yiu saw those finals pretty sure you didbt see much of the regular season run and the best of the best you cant truly judge without the whole body of work ...which is why for me the 2001 lakers fall short of the 80s teams even the 83 sixers because they only turned it on truly the last 30 games plus the playoffs our most dominant player was coadting and the team mostly followed suit.
But if you asked who would win or who was more dominant come playoffs it was 2001 over 83 sixers. I also take 85 lakers because like the spurs in 2014 that squad was on a mission and not many teams could of brat them not even Moses squad

[ambchang]

Both mj and kobe were selfish Shaq too that is whyvthey all needed Phil and Tex tbh

Jordan and shaq adjusted. Kobe didn't.

[ambchang]

Moses was a beast but im still taking the 85 lakers because of the #2, #3, #4 on the 85 ate all better by comparison. Moses was the better #1.

Dr j cheeks and Andrew toney were the bomb. Bobby Jones was still great as well. Those sixers were extremely talented.

[ambchang]

Of course there are tapes ...that great Blazers,team btw was down 2-0 to one man wrecking crew in the Finals ...but even if yiu saw those finals pretty sure you didbt see much of the regular season run and the best of the best you cant truly judge without the whole body of work ...which is why for me the 2001 lakers fall short of the 80s teams even the 83 sixers because they only turned it on truly the last 30 games plus the playoffs our most dominant player was coadting and the team mostly followed suit.
But if you asked who would win or who was more dominant come playoffs it was 2001 over 83 sixers. I also take 85 lakers because like the spurs in 2014 that squad was on a mission and not many teams could of brat them not even Moses squad

Moses will neutralize shaq. Just my opinion. He dominated a semi prime Kareem, he can play prime shaq to a stand still. Moses was strong enough to guard shaq.

The Blazers were down 0-2 because that sixers team was very talented, but they adjusted and then dominated. That's what great teams do, they have enough talent and versatility that if you close one door, they open another.

As for 85 lakers, sure they were on a mission, but that doesn't out them as one of the greatest teams ever. I won't out the 14 Spurs as one of the greatest teams ever. In fact, I thought the 05 Spurs were the best of the Spurs championship teams. But that's just me.

[da_suns_fan]

Well the 1987 Celtics made it back to the NBA finals.

How did the 2015 Spurs do?

[Thread]

Well the 1987 Celtics made it back to the NBA finals.

How did the 2015 Spurs do?

...face ass down at Staples.

[baseline bum]

...face ass down at Staples.

They were selling your

[baseline bum]

Well the 1987 Celtics made it back to the NBA finals.

How did the 2015 Spurs do?

Same as the 83 Sixers who are also regarded among the top teams in NBA history.

[Killakobe81]

Moses will neutralize shaq. Just my opinion. He dominated a semi prime Kareem, he can play prime shaq to a stand still. Moses was strong enough to guard shaq.

The Blazers were down 0-2 because that sixers team was very talented, but they adjusted and then dominated. That's what great teams do, they have enough talent and versatility that if you close one door, they open another.

As for 85 lakers, sure they were on a mission, but that doesn't out them as one of the greatest teams ever. I won't out the 14 Spurs as one of the greatest teams ever. In fact, I thought the 05 Spurs were the best of the Spurs championship teams. But that's just me.

The Blazers didnt play the sixers, they played the Nets.
Moses was strong but not as strong as Shaq and would be giving up a few inches as well as quickness. Moses had a sturdy bade and great center of gravitt but he wouldnt be able to stop a prime Shaq ...in my JohhntyCochran voice ....nicca please.

The rest i dont cate to argue because your biased and there is no point.

[baseline bum]

The Blazers didnt play the sixers, they played the Nets.

He's talking about the 77 team

[baseline bum]

And yeah, the 77 Blazers were ing incredible to watch. Damn Walton would have been the best bigman ever if not for his feet.

[ambchang]

The Blazers didnt play the sixers, they played the Nets.
Moses was strong but not as strong as Shaq and would be giving up a few inches as well as quickness. Moses had a sturdy bade and great center of gravitt but he wouldnt be able to stop a prime Shaq ...in my JohhntyCochran voice ....nicca please.

The rest i dont cate to argue because your biased and there is no point.

I was talking about the 77 Blazers who played the 6ers in the finals. Or are we talking about the same stuff?

Shaq was guarded by Malik rose some times. As long as you are comparatively strong and quick enough, you stand a chance against shaq. Moses can move shaq out of his comfort area and due to his range, it doesn't matter if shaq shoots over you. I'm not saying Moses will stop shaq, I'm saying Moses will neutralize shaq.

[Molotov]

Bulls Rodman played Shaq well, when he played for Orlando, IMO TBH.

[Killakobe81]

I was talking about the 77 Blazers who played the 6ers in the finals. Or are we talking about the same stuff?

Shaq was guarded by Malik rose some times. As long as you are comparatively strong and quick enough, you stand a chance against shaq. Moses can move shaq out of his comfort area and due to his range, it doesn't matter if shaq shoots over you. I'm not saying Moses will stop shaq, I'm saying Moses will neutralize shaq.

My bad i was the one confused

[Kawhitstorm]

The Blazers didnt play the sixers, they played the Nets.
Moses was strong but not as strong as Shaq and would be giving up a few inches as well as quickness. Moses had a sturdy bade and great center of gravitt but he wouldnt be able to stop a prime Shaq ...in my JohhntyCochran voice ....nicca please.

PRIME Shaq shot 44% while mainly being guarded by washed up Admiral/Malik Rose/Mark Bryant in '02.

FOH w/ that PRIME Moses wouldn't have a chance against Shaq BS when Malik Rose used to piss him off by using his low center of gravity which resulted in him drawing charges. Moses would have been able to hold his ground & still challenge his shots unlike 6'6" Rose who need weakside help.

[Spurtacular]

PRIME Shaq shot 44% while mainly being guarded by washed up Admiral/Malik Rose/Mark Bryant in '02.

[spurraider21]

The 86 Celtics had the most devastating break I have ever seen thanks to Bird's touch passes. Bird and Walton on the same team was so ing unfair to the rest of the league.

bird

If belinelli played in the 80's he would be bird

/re s

[Spurtacular]

bird

If belinelli played in the 80's he would be bird

/re s

This has to be the stupidest thing you've ever said, chump.