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^not sure what happened with format of my post... not a big deal... not like I'm having the most interesting debate ever anyway
[QUOTE=Chinook;8504647]You need to stop lying about this. That's all it can be described as at this point. I've said in almost every response to you in this thread that it's not statistically significant yet. I really have. At this point, you're not even reading what I've said. However, just because it's statistically significant doesn't mean it doesn't have informative value. Martin has been bad so far. We can all admit that, even if the stats wouldn't pass with a 99-percent confidence interval. That doesn't mean he won't end up being better.[/QUOTE]
wtf dude... you wrote: "The point is that Martin's sample size is actually getting large enough to be significant."
it is enough or not ? make up your mind... I've better things to do than lying on a sport message board.
[QUOTE=Chinook;8504647]That's a bigger role than he is currently slated to get. When the team is healthy, Martin is getting very few non garbage-time minutes. This is why mpg is a horrible way to measure a role, especially for the Spurs, since they rest guys so often and have a lot of blowouts.[/QUOTE]
oh boy... fine it is a bigger role
[QUOTE=Chinook;8504647]It's not any more important. We don't affect the outcome, so we're just talking. If we were mods trying to talk about who to ban, then that's a more important conversation.[/QUOTE]
of course it 1,000,000 times less important. God belief or lack of is a big part of people's lifes.... nobody gives a about PT or role of KA and or KMart except for two old farts like us who like arguing for the sake of it.
[[QUOTE=Chinook;8504647]That is just your opinion and is something I haven't really attacked. I don't think Pop promised him anything, but whatever. It's when you try to extend that opinion into a constructive and rebuttal that I take issue. A constructive needs support. You can't just turtle back into "it's just my opinion." We can totally agree to disagree on what we think Martin's role will be, and I think we already have. But as long as you make assertions, they're open for discussion.[/QUOTE]
Yes it is and I can perfectly take the turtle back into it is just my opinion. I've explained this opinion 100 times in other threads (You don't hire a vet like Martin playing 30 mpg with big usage to play the rookie role, dude is not that old to be in retirement plan), you also explained why you disagree, that's perfectly fine bro. your arguments did not convince me, I did not convince you. point taken and move on.
[QUOTE=Chinook;8504647]Martin's been hurting the offense nearly as much by not going to the corner and getting run off the line. He's not getting the whistle either, so he'd just throwing up mess after every shot. Anderson is at least a plus on defense. [/QUOTE]
I agree with the bold part and I laugh at the notion of KA being a plus on defense. let's say KA is slightly less bad.
[QUOTE=Chinook;8504647]I think Anderson will get the first crack at it. If he fails, it'll go to Martin or Miller. I don't think him having an average game for his standards would be considered a failure, though. But yes, I hope Martin gets his together too.[/QUOTE]
fair enough
[QUOTE=Chinook;8504647]He's gotten more chances than most 10-day guys do on two tries. Is it definitive, no. But it's good enough to know he's currently playing poorly.[/QUOTE]
yep and this is still 100 times less than KA
Yeah I'm sorry but I don't hate KA I've said 100 times I wish him the best, he is young can develop blablabla....there is a difference between hating and saying dude has limited potential and suck. Ask O_V I'm saying the same since he has been drafted. For now I do hope we will be healthy enough to not need him at all. I do like your "when he is on his offense is really good"... issue is it is not often the case. I did not check his defensive stats but if this is true it is a proof that a lot of advanced metrics are ed up... oh and before you overreact, yes this is an opinion
^not sure what happened with format of my post... not a big deal... not like I'm having the most interesting debate ever anyway
Many of us thought that was a mistake. Chinook was the most vocal about it. I didn't like it either bc I had liked Butler and he had helped us win a few games we were understaffed in, but I didn't even know Martin's game, so I stayed mostly quiet about it. Seeing Martin's production, indeed there were games this season that if we switched roles and played Martin instead of Butler, we don't win.
I can't point to a single one of Martin's games as a Spur that I can say, yes Martin helped us win that game. Not a one. All of Butler, Kyle and even Simmons had a game like that. Hey even Boban had a few early season games he surprised (an early season Minny game at home that Tony/lma/Kawhi played and shot poorly. One of those games the bench rescued the starters, Boban had almost 20 points and caught lobs from Diaw/manu all night). Point is at some point all these guys showed up and made the difference in a game. This thread is actually following up in the header of a terrific game by Kyle when he showed up and helped us get another win. I can't say that from Martin in any game. Rather it seems we win despite him not doing much of anything to help in the effort. I can't envision a guy like that helping us win in the playoffs, I just can't. And as you point out he's almost out of time.
I said he had 4 horrible games and yes played worst than KA, where did I ignore that ? I just say it's sample size and this picture can change... or not, I complement saying Anderson picture won't change after 1,400 mn we know what we have.
If I'm wrong I will say I was wrong you were right... something I don't think you are capable of
ok bro I have the burden of proof...
So I guess it is the same than atheists saying to believers, you have the burden of proof god exists, with no proof I can sit here and relax and be happy with my opinion god does not exist, light a cigar waiting the waitress suck my
I wasn't around for that. So I do not understand your reference. Inside joke for you though.
You could simply say "Nazr>Rasho" and a 5 paragraph rant would ensue. It was hilarious.
now that's the best... are you really asking "is Tony inspiring this hate toward young teammates ?"
George Hill had the same age or so and produces 10 times more than KA.. this is a fact darling.
Pop played tons of minutes of RJ, centerpiece and tell me they are not scrubs ? DeJuan Blair played more minutes in his second year than KA in his first two years
This is the issue
Me: My opinion is
Chinook: Mine is better
Me: why
Chinook: evidence
Me: what evidence
Chinook: none but you have burden of the proof
Me: wtf...
omg that post of sagirl is just golden
George Hill had the same age or so and produces 10 times more than KA.. this is a fact darling.
Pop played tons of minutes of RJ, centerpiece and tell me they are not scrubs ? DeJuan Blair played more minutes in his second year than KA in his first two years
I told y'all since day 1 that SA girl is a troll and a man.
omg that post of sagirl is just golden
you are a hater
I can't find a YouTube video of Fathead's performance last night
2pts (1/3fg), 3reb, 4ast
It's not enough to project how good he's going to be. It is enough to say that he's sucked so far. He's not going to get ahead of Anderson by playing like he's been playing.
It doesn't affect the outcome either way.of course it 1,000,000 times less important. God belief or lack of is a big part of people's lifes.... nobody gives a about PT or role of KA and or KMart except for two old farts like us who like arguing for the sake of it.
You want to agree to disagree, that's fine. But that's actually where it stops. It's not about trying to change your mind. It is about continuing a discussion so long as you keep rebutting. I don't care if you want to rib me when Martin plays well. But then you shouldn't get all upset when the stats you quoted come back to bite you later.Yes it is and I can perfectly take the turtle back into it is just my opinion. I've explained this opinion 100 times in other threads (You don't hire a vet like Martin playing 30 mpg with big usage to play the rookie role, dude is not that old to be in retirement plan), you also explained why you disagree, that's perfectly fine bro. your arguments did not convince me, I did not convince you. point taken and move on.
You can laugh all you want, but Kyle's defensive metrics are outstanding. He has weaknesses, just like Green does, for example. But the aggregate package has been great.I agree with the bold part and I laugh at the notion of KA being a plus on defense. let's say KA is slightly less bad.
He's very similar to Green in that regard with the big difference being that Green helps the offense just by standing there whereas Kyle doesn't have that gravity.I do like your "when he is on his offense is really good"... issue is it is not often the case.
There really isn't a metric that says Kyle isn't a good defender. You can eye-test if you want, but I think he's third on the team as far as perimeter defense goes.I did not check his defensive stats but if this is true it is a proof that a lot of advanced metrics are ed up
I share that opinion on advanced stats, as I've said before. However, when they all suggest Anderson is a top-five Spurs defender, it's hard to reject.oh and before you overreact, yes this is an opinion
I mean, you can't simultaneously say Anderson is who he is while saying he has potential. Players improve game to game, not season to season. Kyle isn't going to become a knock-down three-point shooting next game, but he damned sure can become aggressive offensively or internalize a gameplan well enough not to foul a three-point shooter.
I've actually been eating crow for a while when it comes to lambasting Apa's predictions on Leonard's scoring. And I've taken my share of lumps for my fandom of Green this season. But so far, you've been dead wrong on Martin, and he's struggled in the ways I said he would. I hope I'm wrong if he has to play in the post-season. But right now, I'm pretty confident he'll be a bench-warmer.If I'm wrong I will say I was wrong you were right... something I don't think you are capable of
That is how the burden of proof works. Again, not getting into it here as it's irrelevant, but it's critical for many metaphysical arguments for both sides to try to shift the burden of proof. It's very powerful.So I guess it is the same than atheists saying to believers, you have the burden of proof god exists, with no proof I can sit here and relax and be happy with my opinion god does not exist, light a cigar waiting the waitress suck my
Oh yeah, I'm no doubt the only one that loled.I wasn't around for that. So I do not understand your reference. Inside joke for you though.
I have nothing against the fact you call me out on Martin as I called you out on him before and no I'm not upset at all
Martin is quite smart playing off the ball, he thrieves on situation where he can get open, he is a border line career .40 3pts shooter, he is 7/18 with the Spurs. I fully expect him to increase FGAs from 3 pts and keep or improve his efficiency. Mart takes around 2,5 3PTA per game he is at 1,6 with Spurs and at 4 per 36 which is in line with Twolves but he already shot 5/6 per 36 in previous years, that's where he should be.
Blair's metrics were all also great at one point, it does not change the fact he has been badly exposed on defense numerous times
Except KA progression is slow lik his 3 pts release
I don't do shift the burden of proof BS, I state straight up what I think, explain why, read other opinions, react... I don't play mind games with poster to get them confused
G.Hill came into the league after 4 seasons in college. Kyle had only 2. He's earlier in his development than G. was. Kyle came to a team that was fully rostered and was looking to repeat last season. He wasn't going to unseat anyone.
George Hill had the same age or so and produces 10 times more than KA.. this is a fact darling.
Pop played tons of minutes of RJ, centerpiece and tell me they are not scrubs ? DeJuan Blair played more minutes in his second year than KA in his first two years
His best games were when Kawhi got injured in December. It was obvious he had to work on his game, but his best games in his rookie season were in a stretch that we needed him. You could see even with that little experience and playing time he was a better player than other guys in the roster like Daye and Ayers. The rest of his playing time except that stretch was pure garbage time around guys who are very marginal in the league like Bonner or guys who flat out were not legit NBA players and are now out of the league like Williams, Daye, Ayers.
Hate is indeed using the minutes of that patchwork/scattered playing time in his rookie season to think that is all he is. Along the way he dominated and won tournaments in all the lower leagues Spurs sent him to showing he was ready to play in a more difficult league and has earned every bit the role and time he gets now in a very deep and talented team.
I can't address G.Hill otherwise bc I was not around for his seasons. Blair was the true definition of the bad tweener but from my understanding what really did him in was the knees/weight issues. A guy that short relied on explosiveness to do what he did, once that is gone he's just not the same player.
And yes I do question you bc you do have your agendas and your clackes and your groups of players you like to hate on in a pure subjective manner, then turn around and say I am not hating.... Guess what? You are hating when most of your negative projections discard all the positives in a short period of a young career, including the reality he's currently playing better than Kmart.
G.Hill came into the league after 4 seasons in college. Kyle had only 2. He's earlier in his development than G. was. Kyle came to a team that was fully rostered and was looking to repeat last season. He wasn't going to unseat anyone.
His best games were when Kawhi got injured in December. It was obvious he had to work on his game, but his best games in his rookie season were in a stretch that we needed him. You could see even with that little experience and playing time he was a better player than other guys in the roster like Daye and Ayers. The rest of his playing time except that stretch was pure garbage time around guys who are very marginal in the league like Bonner or guys who flat out were not legit NBA players and are now out of the league like Williams, Daye, Ayers.
Hate is indeed using the minutes of that patchwork/scattered playing time in his rookie season to think that is all he is. Along the way he dominated and won tournaments in all the lower leagues Spurs sent him to showing he was ready to play in a more difficult league and has earned every bit the role and time he gets now in a very deep and talented team.
I can't address G.Hill otherwise bc I was not around for his seasons. Blair was the true definition of the bad tweener but from my understanding what really did him in was the knees/weight issues. A guy that short relied on explosiveness to do what he did, once that is gone he's just not the same player.
And yes I do question you bc you do have your agendas and your clackes and your groups of players you like to hate on in a pure subjective manner, then turn around and say I am not hating.... Guess what? You are hating when most of your negative projections discard all the positives in a short period of a young career, including the reality he's currently playing better than Kmart.
You don't like G. Hill comparaison... fine. Let's have a look at DeJuan... 2 years of college, 1 year younger than KA and he produced in two years twice as much as KA... you are getting short of excuses. BTW you are right about Dejuan limitation playing with no acl, KA has his limitations some difficult to correct (lack of lateral quickness) others you can work on (slow 3 pts release), thing is even working with the best shooting coach of the league, his form and release did not change much tbh...
for the rest I won't even bother... learn to read... I say KA is playing better than KMart between you and me that's not saying much. For knowing despite of that why I think KMart can be more useful than KA you just need to read what has been posted earlier
finally SAGirl, if it makes you feel better thinking I hate your boy, fine... it's ok tbh I don't mind...
oh and
I feel dirty
Don't feed the troll brah. Too easy to pick them apart tbh...
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