Nah. They need to acquire such an upgrade.
Yeah, Manu is making $14 Million to cater to guys on rookie and min deals. But he's looking bad as those guys. That's a problem with him, not the rest of the roster. The Spurs needed to spend their cap carefully last summer, but they sort of pissed it away.
Once Dedmon was signed with the RE, what Manu makes doesn't matter, and you know that. The Spurs did what they thought they needed to do, right or wrong.
Those decisions have nothing to do with the fact that two teams came to our arena and dropped almost 40 points in the 1st quarter, and we played soft defense.
We can spin this about the offseason all night long, but it's still dodging the fact that our problem in these games have been defense, not offense.
They allowed 73 points in the 1st half
I hate Aldridge, but he's a great #2 scoring option and #3 best player on a le team, tbh..
Offensively, this team has the same problem it's had for the past few years, which is the lack of a big-time playmaker at the PG position..Parker is finished and Ginobili shouldn't be playing more than 15 MPG(closer to 10 when he's struggling, like tonight)..when you're hoping for 8th-10th caliber players like Simmons and Anderson to be your solution, you're in trouble, tbh..
soft and lazy defense, tbh... i get trying to sleepwalk through the Jazz, a nobody, but you'd think they'll be awake against the Clips, tbhThey allowed 73 points in the 1st half
I hate Aldridge, but he's a great #2 scoring option and #3 best player on a le team, tbh..
Offensively, this team has the same problem it's had for the past few years, which is the lack of a big-time playmaker at the PG position..Parker is finished and Ginobili shouldn't be playing more than 15 MPG(closer to 10 when he's struggling, like tonight)..when you're hoping for 8th-10th caliber players like Simmons and Anderson to be your solution, you're in trouble, tbh..
LA's offense has been the least of our problems tonight.
He is in theory but he goes missing in far too many games. He only plays well in little spurts and then goes back to being a ghost.They allowed 73 points in the 1st half
I hate Aldridge, but he's a great #2 scoring option and #3 best player on a le team, tbh..
Offensively, this team has the same problem it's had for the past few years, which is the lack of a big-time playmaker at the PG position..Parker is finished and Ginobili shouldn't be playing more than 15 MPG(closer to 10 when he's struggling, like tonight)..when you're hoping for 8th-10th caliber players like Simmons and Anderson to be your solution, you're in trouble, tbh..
The defense has been awful tonight, but I don't think their defense will be THIS bad. The lack of a second option is something that's been happening a lot.
I had a bad feeling about this game, since last night... that's why I started the tank thread... we're an old team in a lot of key positions, tbh... not just Tony and Manu, but also Pau and Lee is getting up there too.
The defense has been abysmal this year, that's the real issue.
Also LMA has easily outplayed Kawhi tonight while matched up with Blake and Kawhi getting shut down by Jamal Crawford.
Going to be interesting to see what the roster looks like in a couple years. We've sort of retooled, but with all the old pieces the rebuild has yet to come. Kawhi could spend a year or two of his prime on a young rebuilding team.
Let's just get this out of the way, no. That's not the way it works. It was all set up before the moratorium ended. Manu took the hold exactly as I said he did, and that's not looking like a good deal right now. Matching Philly's offer is not looking like a good deal, because Manu is playing worse than guys making a tenth or less of what he's making. It's horrible.
Nah, the problem's been offense. Green will fix almost every defensive issue because a) He's worlds better than Anderson/Simmons, b) He can cover for Parker/Mills by switching over go PGs and getting out on the break c) He can give Kawhi breaks rather than forcing Leonard to work on both ends. There are still problems, but the Spurs will be a top defense once he returns. The problem in this game isn't the D; it's that the Spurs are playing Kawhiso, and when those shots aren't falling (and the refs aren't blowing the whistle), the whole team breaks down. The Clippers get run-outs and can control the past. Morale falls apart. Getting that third scoring would make the team better on both ends.We can spin this about the offseason all night long, but it's still dodging the fact that our problem in these games have been defense, not offense.
This team lacks a first option against a Doc Rivers led team
Kawhi was atrocious tonight, by far his worst game of the season..while nobody looked great on offense, it was the defense was clearly the issue..I missed the first half, but it appears that they haven't shown any resistance against the Clippers offense, so far..
It's too early to say it's a problem, though, as the defense had been really solid until tonight(granted their opponents have been relatively weak)..
This defense is the kind of I was concerned about when TD retired... also, for as much Manu gets (and rightly so a lot of times), he's still one of our best perimeter defenders, especially with Danny being MIA and Tony getting 30+ mpg.
LMA/Pau is going to struggle defensively against certain matchups, and Pop is going to have to go to Dedmon more sometimes.
I mean, we're probably not going to survive bad shooting nights from Kawhi anyways, that's how we're built. But we're 7 games into the new season, 5-2, we can get better.
Oh, it's still early for sure. With GS looking mortal, i feel the Spurs have a good a chance as any team to go on a special run come playoffs. We really haven't seen this team at full strength with Danny back in the SL(and Anderson benched? One can pray)
On Deadman, I really wonder how open Pau is to coming off the bench as long as it's only in certain match ups. Maybe he can compromise with Pop.
There's nothing to get out of the way. It was the Spurs that decided to give Dedmon the RE, instead of giving it to Manu. Once that happened, they couldn't sign Manu with the RE, which is something you yourself peddled all offseason. After THAT happened, they could only sign Manu with cap. And the Spurs didn't match Philly's offer. Manu actually was offered more than what the Spurs paid. Now, you can say Manu is not a $14m player, that's fine. I can agree with that. It's immaterial though, he had to be signed with capspace, period. Again, the Spurs were in full control throughout this entire process, they knew exactly who they wanted to sign, keep, sacrifice, etc.
That's how this team's offense is built, at least the starters: Kawhi-ISO, Kawhi-Postup, LMA-Postup... we just can't give up 70 points at the half and pretend to win many games, tbh...
We started 8-0 with Pau and LMA hitting 3s... and I guess they thought we had it in the bag...
Everything on D was terrible: transition, we were switching on everything, bad 3 point covers, people looked lost. A lot like vs Utah a week ago, tbh...
You're trying to put it back in the way, but no. They didn't give Dedmon anything until after they committed to keeping Manu. Dedmon was signed with a cap exception, and keeping Manu required space for his hold. That space should've gone to someone else, it seems.
There's no period there. Manu shouldn't have been re-sign at all, not just re-signed for that much. The team needed to figure out something besides him. I didn't even want him back for the min. The team needed to upgrade their back court, but instead they kept Parker and reupped Manu.Now, you can say Manu is not a $14m player, that's fine. I can agree with that. It's immaterial though, he had to be signed with capspace, period.
Yes, and they were wrong. That the Spurs keep trotting out Manu is just as wrong as them repeatedly signing Bonner. They just can't afford to continue ignoring that their back court sucks outside of Green and Mills and that both of those guys needed to be at least knocked down a peg.Again, the Spurs were in full control throughout this entire process, they knew exactly who they wanted to sign, keep, sacrifice, etc.
Yes, and so it's entirely too depended on two scorers, one of which is naturally inconsistent and the other is inconsistent against LAC. They need a third scorer to balance that out. And the D wouldn't be so bad if the offense wasn't. That one affects the other is almost universal to sports. It's like in the NFL when the offense keeps turning the ball over inside their 20. You can't blame the defense for giving up a bunch of points if they're constantly put in poor position by their offense.That's how this team's offense is built, at least the starters: Kawhi-ISO, Kawhi-Postup, LMA-Postup... we just can't give up 70 points at the half and pretend to win many games, tbh...
You don't know that, or what was promised to who. Neither do I for that matter.
Well, that's a different story altogether. But you *were* ing about the $14m he's making. Fact remains that once the *Spurs* decided Manu was going to get paid with cap space, how *much* he was going to get paid was immaterial. That was my argument when I replied to your post.
Now, you can opine the Spurs screwed up, that's your opinion, respectable, tbh.
I'm not even worried here. We're going to have bad shooting nights and lose games here or there. There was more that just bad perimeter D in this game though.
That said, there's gotta be acceptance that this is how the Spurs decided to make a run for a championship this season: we're primarily an ISO team, and we're going to need a much better effort defensively if we want to reach the promised land. But it's still early.
Tonight they lacked a first option.
They could have had their cake & ate it too. Doc gave Austin/Crawford 40 mill contract then signed Felton/Bass/Speight for the in' vet minimum.
PATFO should have rolled out the red carpet for Felton knowing that Porker was done but they couldn't even get Bass to sign who is now rotting on the Cripples bench.
Yes, we do know. This is a case where the order of contracts mattered. The Spurs and Dedmon agreed to a deal with that structure, but had they not known they were going to use Manu's hold, it wasn't going to specifically be the RE. It wasn't reported as such, if you recall.
This is actually what I said initially:Well, that's a different story altogether. But you *were* ing about the $14m he's making. Fact remains that once the *Spurs* decided Manu was going to get paid with cap space, how *much* he was going to get paid was immaterial. That was my argument when I replied to your post.
So no, I was complaining about Manu's cap hold before I started talking about his salary. The concerning thing is that he's not playing like he's worth his cap hold. In fact, he's not playing like he's better than guys making so much less than his $14 Million. If he were playing like a $7-Million player, that would be fine. But he's playing like a min-contract guy instead.
Yes, in so far as this is always just opinion. However, yeah, it's hard to justify Manu is anything but a negative so far. He's third on in the rotation in USG% despite being in the bottom half in almost every advanced stat. And that's on a 5-2 team.Now, you can opine the Spurs screwed up, that's your opinion, respectable, tbh.
Obviously, but that was the main problem. The Spurs aren't going to be perfect swapping out Anderson/Simmons for Green. But they'll be more than good enough.I'm not even worried here. We're going to have bad shooting nights and lose games here or there. There was more that just bad perimeter D in this game though.
This is true, and they need another scorer to fix these issues. Because when you're an ISO team, you aren't going to make shots for others consistently. So your bucket-getters have to perform. Only way to deal with having off bucket-getters is to have more.That said, there's gotta be acceptance that this is how the Spurs decided to make a run for a championship this season: we're primarily an ISO team, and we're going to need a much better effort defensively if we want to reach the promised land. But it's still early
Nope. They needed to actually spend the $20 Million or so they had on the best guards they could get. They shouldn't have thought Murray and Simmons were going to make up for running out a decrepit duo for $30 Million.They could have had their cake & ate it too. Doc gave Austin/Crawford 40 mill contract then signed Felton/Bass/Speight for the in' vet minimum.
PATFO should have rolled out the red carpet for Felton knowing that Porker was done but they couldn't even get Bass to sign who is now rotting on the Cripples bench.
It was a given Manu was going to get his back-pay but even then they could have still signed Felton by doubling his pay & allowed him to stay in Texas while not paying state taxes. Danny is also Felton's buddy so I'm pretty sure they could have signed him & offered him a bigger role than the Cripples.
He played WestBrick better than Porker/Patty did in the postseason so it was obvious he would be an upgrade.
IIRC, the only info we had about Dedmon was that the Spurs signed him with the RE, period. I'm fairly sure that's how we knew that Manu wasn't getting resigned with the RE... as you were advocating in the offseason. Then again, you were way more active than me during the offseason chatter, so I'm probably wrong on this and I'll gladly take your word for it.
And I didn't say a peep about how much he made until you actually brought it up, here...
Yeah, Manu is making $14 Million to cater to guys on rookie and min deals. But he's looking bad as those guys. That's a problem with him, not the rest of the roster. The Spurs needed to spend their cap carefully last summer, but they sort of pissed it away.
This is where I responded about the $14m. We both know that once the Spurs decided they were signing him up with cap space, how much he was signed for didn't really matter. We're way past the cap hold argument at that point.
But I understand better what you were trying to say now, so that's fine. You think he shouldn't have been brought back, that's a fair opinion, regardless if I agree or not with it.
I think he was above average or better in 3 out of the 6 games he played. He was between bad and really bad in the other 3 though. I mean, he's averaging 21 mpg, but I think that has to do with the lack of Danny and now TP, than anything else. For example, I don't think he plays tonight if Danny is available. Realistically, for a 39 year old, I though he's played with more passion than a lot of younger guys, even if not everything has always worked for the better.
What's a bit more disconcerting to me is that nobody else seems to be picking up the slack on a consistent basis. Patty and Simms have had their peaks here or there, but not consistently enough. I thought this season was going to be more of Manu going for those 15mpg Harlem is talking about, while naturally Simms, Kyle or Patty making him expendable, but I haven't seen it yet, and that's kinda scary. Makes you wonder if the Spurs are going to reach for Kevin Martin all over again.
That's why I'm a bit averse of moving Pau out of the starting lineup. It's a conundrum, but the dropoff on offense, as this team is built right now, from Pau to Dedmon is pretty darned big.
The worst part is that we both know Tony and Manu are not going anywhere, and neither Kyle or Simms are going to fetch you much with their contracts. So we're going to have to make it work this way.
We'll see what happens once Danny comes back.
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