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  1. #1151
    SeaGOAT midnightpulp's Avatar
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    Just play a modern game man. Stop this charade
    What charade? I play plenty of modern games, but I approach modern AAA games like I'm watching a movie, something to play as passive relaxation (just finished Uncharted 3 and the Order not too long ago. Two decent movie games). I have a classic games collection that I need to work through, and when I'm in the mood for a real single player challenge, the classics it is.

  2. #1152
    SeaGOAT midnightpulp's Avatar
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    Go beat Japan's Super Mario Bros 2. They took Super Mario Bros and turned up the difficulty to a ridiculous level with lots of leaps of faith and jumps you miss by one pixel if you're at all off.
    Classic platformers are my worst genre, but I'll give it a shot one of these days.

  3. #1153
    Klaw apalisoc_9's Avatar
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    What charade? I play plenty of modern games, but I approach modern AAA games like I'm watching a movie, something to play as passive relaxation (just finished Uncharted 3 and the Order not too long ago. Two decent movie games). I have a classic games collection that I need to work through, and when I'm in the mood for a real single player challenge, the classics it is.
    The order is not a good game man..C'mon bro.

    You should play Bloodborne. You sound like a bloodbrone guy.

  4. #1154
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
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    No man, I can't do that! Playing an 100 hr game and then watching the anime attached to it is too much for me. That would burn me out.
    Speaking of the anime, I think I was a little hasty writing off the Persona 4 Golden Animation. Apparently that was written under the assumption the audience already knows the base story of Persona 4 so the P4G animation focuses mostly on the new character Marie. So that makes some sense why they would skip over a lot of the main story of Persona 4, such as Kanji's bathhouse and Rise's strip club.

  5. #1155
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
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    The order is not a good game man..C'mon bro.

    You should play Bloodborne. You sound like a bloodbrone guy.
    I gotta second that. It's such a great game and challenging but not in a cheap way. Plus once you get comfortable with the base game and start feeling like you're good the DLC will kick the out of you for a while, since its bosses don't have the kind of exploitable flaws you can find for the bosses in the base game.

  6. #1156
    what uganda do about it? Joseph Kony's Avatar
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    >>modern games
    >uncharted 3
    >the order


    lolwut

  7. #1157
    SeaGOAT midnightpulp's Avatar
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    >>modern games
    >uncharted 3
    >the order


    lolwut
    The Order came out a couple of years ago. And Uncharted hasn't evolved from the first installment to the most recent, so UC3 isn't fundamentally different from 4.

  8. #1158
    what uganda do about it? Joseph Kony's Avatar
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    exactly you said "plenty of modern games" and cited a game from 3 years ago and a game from the previous gen of consoles...

  9. #1159
    Klaw apalisoc_9's Avatar
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    Lol Midngithpulp has no idea games today are way more complex gameplay wise. Lol he thinks every game is like uncharted.

  10. #1160
    SeaGOAT midnightpulp's Avatar
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    Lol Midngithpulp has no idea games today are way more complex gameplay wise. Lol he thinks every game is like uncharted.


    Thinking I don't play modern games. I don't play trash like the Battle Royale genre (PUBG, Fortnite), but if it's a modern AAA franchise, I probably played it. Now make your claim, instead of handwave with an unbacked opinion, like you do in the soccer/baseball arguments. How are games "more complex gameplay wise?"

    Let's examine this.

    Modern "tactical shooters," like CoD, the Battlefield series, and Rainbow Six Siege vs. this:



    And one hit, you're dead. None of this ty regenerating health bull . The Ghost Recon series kept some remnants of the original R6's planning stages, but streamlined it immensely to make it more user and casual friendly.

    Modern RPGs. Lol. Level up fests. Nothing more. There was a time where you actually had to draw your own maps and intimately know the RnG system in order to get anywhere. I've never really been a player of that genre before Diablo, but like Wizardry, Ultima, and the SSI gold box games have a much steeper learning curve than the Witcher 3 or any JRPG grindfest to come out over the last two decades.

    Modern "action" games. Mostly dominated by the sandbox genre, which is built more around exploration and "player freedom," than anything else. There was a time when you needed to learn a relatively complex (for an action game genre, at least) combat system to succeed at the game. Ninja Gaiden Black, Godhand, the early DMCs, Otogi, Gun Valkyrie. You can't sleepwalk through these games even on Easy, like you can in GTA, Saints Row, and the newer Tomb Raiders. The other 3rd person action game variants (stealth, survival horror) have also been dumbed down, like the Splinter Cell and Metal Gear series. And when Resident Evil 6 came out, it was nick-named Gears of Evil. And lol God of War. I enjoy the series, but you can beat the game spamming the same attack. It's basically another movie game.

    Platformers? The main element that added difficulty and pressured the player in that genre was knowing that if you up a difficult jump/sequence of jumps too many times, it's game over and you have to start all over. There's absolutely nothing challenging about modern platformers because you get infinite continues and respawn at a close checkpoint.

    RTSes? The Koreans still play StarCraft 2 for a reason. Most of the modern RTSes, especially by Relic, took the whole micromanagement element out of the genre and basically turned the genre into a isometric squad based combat genre (Dawn of War, Company of Heroes).

    The racing genre has certainly got more complex, so really no arguments there.
    Last edited by midnightpulp; 04-10-2018 at 01:44 AM.

  11. #1161
    Klaw apalisoc_9's Avatar
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    Not this again...

    Bloodbrone and Monster hunter alone on all older games gameplay wise.

    Look man its ok if you are out of touch but you very clearly dont play new games anymore.

  12. #1162
    Klaw apalisoc_9's Avatar
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    Show me an older game that is more complex than GTA V?

  13. #1163
    SeaGOAT midnightpulp's Avatar
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    Show me an older game that is more complex than GTA V?
    What's complex about a sandbox game? What mechanics do you have to learn in GTA V or the series as a whole to succeed at the game? Any sophisticated combo system in GTA? No. Are there moves that require multiple button and joystick inputs performed in sequence to execute? No. Do "bosses" in that game have unintuitive patterns of attack that take a few tries (or dozens) to figure out so that you can exploit? No. Even the driving is ty. You can literally drive like an idiot, crashing into everything, and still evade 5 star police chases. Regarding the driving, do you have to master cornering, drifting, braking, racing lines to drive well? No. Does the gameplay force you out of a mechanic "comfort zone," and challenge you to use a variety of mechanics you might not be comfortable using (ala Ninja Gaiden Black) to beat a boss/section? No.

    You're likely confusing game design complexity with technical/graphical complexity.

  14. #1164
    Klaw apalisoc_9's Avatar
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    What's complex about a sandbox game? What mechanics do you have to learn in GTA V or the series as a whole to succeed at the game? Any sophisticated combo system in GTA? No. Are there moves that require multiple button and joystick inputs performed in sequence to execute? No. Do "bosses" in that game have unintuitive patterns of attack that take a few tries (or dozens) to figure out so that you can exploit? No. Even the driving is ty. You can literally drive like an idiot, crashing into everything, and still evade 5 star police chases. Regarding the driving, do you have to master cornering, drifting, braking, racing lines to drive well? No. Does the gameplay force you out of a mechanic "comfort zone," and challenge you to use a variety of mechanics you might not be comfortable using (ala Ninja Gaiden Black) to beat a boss/section? No.

    You're likely confusing game design complexity with technical/graphical complexity.
    I think you fail to realize that modern gaming is not limited to triple A games or Sanbox games. There's amazing games out there like Resogun and Rocket league for dudes that enjoy classical gaming.

    Modern gaming is legit because developers can develop fuxk all...Resogun is probably better than any 90s game in terms of gameplay complexity or difficulty.

  15. #1165
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
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    Just finished FarCry 5, tbh... was ok

  16. #1166
    SeaGOAT midnightpulp's Avatar
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    I think you fail to realize that modern gaming is not limited to triple A games or Sanbox games. There's amazing games out there like Resogun and Rocket league for dudes that enjoy classical gaming.

    Modern gaming is legit because developers can develop fuxk all...Resogun is probably better than any 90s game in terms of gameplay complexity or difficulty.
    I haven't played Resogun (I know the game well though, and it doesn't look like any more complex of a shooter than Ikaruga, Radiant Silvergun, etc. Resogun uses a pretty basic scoring multiplier mechanic. Nothing like Ikaruga's color absorbing mechanic, or Silvergun's chaining mechanic. You probably haven't played many Shmups if you think Resogun is highly complex. They modelled it after Defender, to be an easy to learn, difficult to master type of arcade game. A lot of the Jap shooters are basically logic puzzles in shooter form), but I've played a lot of the indie heavy hitters: Hotline Miami Series, Axiom Verge, Outland, the Shank series, Bastion, the Trine series, Magicka, Mark of the Ninja, games that try to blend modern gaming with old school sensibility, and while they're fun and good, the lack the one thing all the classic games had: punishment. After your lives run out, it's not back to the beginning of the game or the level, but to a close checkpoint. And games like Trine and Bastion are basically impossible to lose at.

  17. #1167
    SeaGOAT midnightpulp's Avatar
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    It's also worth noting that when I say "modern games," I more referring to the general game design philosophy many modern developers adhere to and not games simply made in today's era (many of the indie games Apa mentioned follow a more old school game design, but those games are exceptions to the rule). Modern game design is heavily story, exploration, and progress driven, basically rewarding a player for time spent with the game rather than rewarding an improvement in skills.

    To get neckbeard-y for a moment, let's think about what a "game" is supposed to be. Traditionally, it's an activity that tests physical and/or mental ability in some fashion, involves a learning curve where the player sees his skill level incrementally increase as he practices and/or studies the game. When you play a shump (from any era), you're usually mediocre to start, after a couple of hours of play (depending on the game's difficulty), you might reach level 3's boss with a life left, but it kicks your ass since you haven't gotten its pattern down. The next play session, you get to this boss with more lives, start to get the pattern and rhythm down, and eke out a victory. Then you get a bit further and further each time you play, just like a person learning basketball might incrementally improves his shooting percentage every day he plays.

    Modern game design doesn't challenge you in this way. The way you beat bosses and levels today is simply though some kind of progress system reward structure (better weapons, armor, attributes, etc) rather than through the learning of the combat system, defensive system, enemy patterns, etc. In short, it's about having the right gear and not the right skills. To again compare to basketball, it would be like our practicing player getting a +5 shooting ability or a magic basketball simply by shooting a certain number of shots (regardless or whether or not he learns to shoot properly). In modern action games (Tomb Raider, GTA, Gears, Uncharted, Far Cry etc) there's really no pressure to "play well," since you're afforded infinite continues at generous checkpoints. You could always issue a personal challenge to yourself, but the combat systems in modern action games are pretty shallow (duck, cover, shoot, run away and hide to regain health) that it's not even rewarding to put in the effort to do a pistol only Uncharted run or something.

    That said, this doesn't apply to all big games, as I know the Souls, Bloodbornes, etc actually punish you, but it does to most of the games we see on the various "Best of the Year" lists. And no, I don't dislike modern gaming. I play them as much as the "classics," because I don't always feel like getting my ass to handed to me by Japanese shumps and merciless, quarter crunching arcade games.
    Last edited by midnightpulp; 04-10-2018 at 04:27 AM.

  18. #1168
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
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    Platformers? The main element that added difficulty and pressured the player in that genre was knowing that if you up a difficult jump/sequence of jumps too many times, it's game over and you have to start all over. There's absolutely nothing challenging about modern platformers because you get infinite continues and respawn at a close checkpoint.
    I gotta disagree with this part. Japanese Super Mario Bros 2 on the Famicom Disk System from 1986 is by far the hardest platformer I have ever played, and it has infinite continues. If you don't know the story of Super Mario Bros 2 USA vs Japan, it's pretty interesting.

    Last edited by baseline bum; 04-10-2018 at 06:56 AM.

  19. #1169
    SeaGOAT midnightpulp's Avatar
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    I gotta disagree with this part. Japanese Super Mario Bros 2 on the Famicom Disk System from 1986 is by far the hardest platformer I have ever played, and it has infinite continues. If you don't know the story of Super Mario Bros 2 USA vs Japan, it's pretty interesting.

    Yeah, I know the story. We got Doki-Doki Panic renamed. When you continue in Super Mario 2 Japan, do they start you where you died or at the beginning of the level?

  20. #1170
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
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    Yeah, I know the story. We got Doki-Doki Panic renamed. When you continue in Super Mario 2 Japan, do they start you where you died or at the beginning of the level?
    Beginning.

  21. #1171
    SeaGOAT midnightpulp's Avatar
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    But yeah, this looks infuriating, especially if they start you at the beginning of the world (i.e. die on 5-4, get sent back to 5-1).



    You beat it clean, Bum or with save states?

  22. #1172
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
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    But yeah, this looks infuriating, especially if they start you at the beginning of the world (i.e. die on 5-4, get sent back to 5-1).



    You beat it clean, Bum or with save states?
    I made a save state at the start of each level, as the game is madness without the fireball flower. The first couple of worlds play out like a hard Super Mario Bros but the game starts getting trollish around world 3 if I remember right.

  23. #1173
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
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    ing Yakuza 0


  24. #1174
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
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    Sega just announced a Genesis/Megadrive Classic



    Get in here Chris

    Google translate of it



    Also:


  25. #1175
    what uganda do about it? Joseph Kony's Avatar
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    playing FFXV on PC since steam had a nice sale on it. game is pretty graphically demanding, one of the few games im having trouble running smoothly at highest settings

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