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  1. #276
    Believe. GAustex's Avatar
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    Serena be a brickhouse
    Strong gal he is.

  2. #277
    6X ST MVP Spurtacular's Avatar
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    other than your neural connections?
    Deflect all you want.

  3. #278
    6X ST MVP Spurtacular's Avatar
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  4. #279
    Believe. i'm_still_beta's Avatar
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    Nadal is going for the Slam №21. Does it make him the GOAT?

  5. #280
    6X ST MVP Spurtacular's Avatar
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    Nadal is going for the Slam №21. Does it make him the GOAT?
    13 are on clay (French Open), which is the surface that deviates the most from the norm IMO. So, I can't give him that.

    RN definitely the best clay player of all-time.

  6. #281
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    Novak will pass them both. They are clutching their pearls thinking it was one or the other for all time

  7. #282
    6X ST MVP Spurtacular's Avatar
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    Novak will pass them both. They are clutching their pearls thinking it was one or the other for all time
    Not a lock. He's not going to be on the right side of 35 for much longer. If Fed or Nadal stretch their lead from two to three or four, it could be an uphill battle for him.

  8. #283
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    13 are on clay (French Open), which is the surface that deviates the most from the norm IMO. So, I can't give him that.

    RN definitely the best clay player of all-time.
    That's one of the most re ed takes I've read and it reeks of racism and prejudice, tbh. What's the norm for you? Hard courts? How does clay deviate from hard courts any more than grass? Furthermore, did you know that hard courts weren't always the norm? There was a time where the grand slams were played twice on grass and twice on clay. Imagine if Nadal played on that era, he would have twice as many grand slams.

    As a Federer fan and a Nadal hater, I can't believe people are making me argue in favour of the Spaniard, but you leave me no choice with ignorant comments like these, tbh.

  9. #284
    Manu Mania lefty20's Avatar
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    That's one of the most re ed takes I've read and it reeks of racism and prejudice, tbh. What's the norm for you? Hard courts? How does clay deviate from hard courts any more than grass? Furthermore, did you know that hard courts weren't always the norm? There was a time where the grand slams were played twice on grass and twice on clay. Imagine if Nadal played on that era, he would have twice as many grand slams.

    As a Federer fan and a Nadal hater, I can't believe people are making me argue in favour of the Spaniard, but you leave me no choice with ignorant comments like these, tbh.
    Let's be honest here, Clay ain't real tennis. It's basically a track meet. So yeah, no question about it. Rafa is the GOAT track & field player in Men's Tennis, by a lot.


    But srsly, it's safe to say the Fed is done winning slams and Rafa has one more FO in him b4 he's done. This means that Novak has a couple years of farming les allowing him to build a safe lead before finally hanging it up. I just don't see how he stays below ~23 les.

  10. #285
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    Let's be honest here, Clay ain't real tennis. It's basically a track meet. So yeah, no question about it. Rafa is the GOAT track & field player in Men's Tennis, by a lot.


    But srsly, it's safe to say the Fed is done winning slams and Rafa has one more FO in him b4 he's done. This means that Novak has a couple years of farming les allowing him to build a safe lead before finally hanging it up. I just don't see how he stays below ~23 les.
    To win in clay you need to be skilled, be solid with all your shots, and actually think the game and come up with a game plan. You can't win by just serving and trying to mindlessly overpower your oponent, tbh.

  11. #286
    Manu Mania lefty20's Avatar
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    To win in clay you need to be skilled, be solid with all your shots, and actually think the game and come up with a game plan. You can't win by just serving and trying to mindlessly overpower your oponent, tbh.
    You can win on clay by overpowering your opponents with a non-stop barrage of heavy top spin forehands backed by elite defense. That's literally how Nadal does it.

  12. #287
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    You can win on clay by overpowering your opponents with a non-stop barrage of heavy top spin forehands backed by elite defense. That's literally how Nadal does it.
    You are oversimplying the out of that but, for the sake of argument, let's say you are right. You still need to be able to hit every shot at an above average level to pull it off. You can win a grass tournament with just a serve and a few lucky bounces.

  13. #288
    6X ST MVP Spurtacular's Avatar
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    That's one of the most re ed takes I've read and it reeks of racism and prejudice, tbh. What's the norm for you? Hard courts? How does clay deviate from hard courts any more than grass? Furthermore, did you know that hard courts weren't always the norm? There was a time where the grand slams were played twice on grass and twice on clay. Imagine if Nadal played on that era, he would have twice as many grand slams.

    As a Federer fan and a Nadal hater, I can't believe people are making me argue in favour of the Spaniard, but you leave me no choice with ignorant comments like these, tbh.
    You just go right there like a triggered . Okay, I'll call you out, then; what did I say exactly that reeks so much of racism?

  14. #289
    Manu Mania lefty20's Avatar
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    You are oversimplying the out of that but, for the sake of argument, let's say you are right. You still need to be able to hit every shot at an above average level to pull it off. You can win a grass tournament with just a serve and a few lucky bounces.
    Djoker is either equal to or better than Rafa in pretty much every other category. But that forehand is in a league of it's own and is absolutely the #1 reason behind Rafa's dominance on Clay.

  15. #290
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    You just go right there like a triggered . Okay, I'll call you out, then; what did I say exactly that reeks so much of racism?
    Clay is known to be the surface of the "latinos". Knowing your posting history, I'm pretty sure your dislike for the surface has something to do with that, because there's no other reason to believe clay "deviates from the norm" more than any other surface. Heck, the tennis that we know today started with grass and clay. The first grand slams were played on those surfaces. So, if anything, these modern hard courts are the ones that deviate the most from what originally percieved as "the norm".
    Last edited by DAF86; 03-17-2021 at 01:56 AM.

  16. #291
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    Djoker is either equal to or better than Rafa in pretty much every other category. But that forehand is in a league of it's own and is absolutely the #1 reason behind Rafa's dominance on Clay.
    Yeah well, that forehand it is what is because of it's unique technique, tbh.

    Also, what does bringing Djokovic to the equation accomplish for your cause? It sure as doesn't adress my argument that one trick ponys usually do better on faster courts than on clay, tbh.

  17. #292
    6X ST MVP Spurtacular's Avatar
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    Clay is known to be the surface of the "latinos".
    This is news to me. But even if it were, I'm supposed to base my opinions on Latino attachment to clay? That's pretty stupid when you think about it.

    Knowing your posting history
    You mean your triggered history apparently.

    Knowing your posting history, I'm pretty sure your dislike for the surface has something to do with that, because there's no other reason to believe clay "deviates from the norm" more than any other surface.
    It does deviate from the norm. Lefty said it on the very next post. Is he racist too? Or is this designation just for the people on your enemies list?

    Knowing your posting history, I'm pretty sure your dislike for the surface has something to do with that, because there's no other reason to believe clay "deviates from the norm" more than any other surface.
    Are you this ignorant to not know how much more different clay is than the other surfaces?

  18. #293
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    This is news to me. But even if it were, I'm supposed to base my opinions on Latino attachment to clay? That's pretty stupid when you think about it.



    You mean your triggered history apparently.



    It does deviate from the norm. Lefty said it on the very next post. Is he racist too? Or is this designation just for the people on your enemies list?
    Don't flatter yourself son, I don't consider yourself an enemy, tbh. And yeah, if you want, I can call lefty's second brand an ignorant too, for saying that ignorant .

    You forgot the last part of my post. How can clay "deviate from the norm" when it was one of the surfaces where grand slam tennis started? Way before modern hard courts were invented.
    Last edited by DAF86; 03-17-2021 at 02:09 AM.

  19. #294
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    Are you this ignorant to not know how much more different clay is than the other surfaces?
    I know exactly how much more different clay is to grass and hard courts. I also know exactly how much more different grass is to clay and hard courts. And how much more different hard courts are to clay and grass. Each surface has its own unique characteristics and they are very different from each other. You are the ignorant one if you think grass is somehow more similar to hard courts than clay courts are. Specially these new hard courts.

  20. #295
    6X ST MVP Spurtacular's Avatar
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    Don't flatter yourself son, I don't consider yourself an enemy, tbh. And yeah, if you want, I can call lefty's second brand an ignorant too, for saying that ignorant .

    You forgot the last part of my post. How can clay "deviate from the norm" when it was one of the surfaces where grand slam tennis started? Way before modern hard courts were invented.
    I didn't mean the norm in terms of usage or history but rather for effect on play. Grass is neutral. Concrete increases the speed of the ball and the height on the bounces but is otherwise not so much varied. Though it can certainly be argued that it is artificial for the purist who think grass is true surface for tennis; and I could absolutely give credence to that. But nonetheless, I consider the effect at least somewhat muted. Clay on the other hand is a total game changer. The players traction and subsequently his playing style is greatly altered. Or do you think it's just a coincidence that Nadal has 2/3 of his grand slams on a surface that is only at 1/4 of grand slams?

  21. #296
    6X ST MVP Spurtacular's Avatar
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    I know exactly how much more different clay is to grass and hard courts. I also know exactly how much more different grass is to clay and hard courts. And how much more different hard courts are to clay and grass. Each surface has its own unique characteristics and they are very different from each other. You are the ignorant one if you think grass is somehow more similar to hard courts than clay courts are. Specially these new hard courts.
    Concrete courts do add advantages for players with faster serves especially. But it's not an all encompassing game changer like clay apparently is. Many players are night/day clay vs. other surfaces.

  22. #297
    Manu Mania lefty20's Avatar
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    Yeah well, that forehand it is what is because of it's unique technique, tbh.

    Also, what does bringing Djokovic to the equation accomplish for your cause? It sure as doesn't adress my argument that one trick ponys usually do better on faster courts than on clay, tbh.
    My point is that one trick pony can also dominate Clay if that trick is good enough, say like Rafa's forehand.

  23. #298
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    I didn't mean the norm in terms of usage or history but rather for effect on play. Grass is neutral. Concrete increases the speed of the ball and the height on the bounces but is otherwise not so much varied. Though it can certainly be argued that it is artificial for the purist who think grass is true surface for tennis; and I could absolutely give credence to that. But nonetheless, I consider the effect at least somewhat muted. Clay on the other hand is a total game changer. The players traction and subsequently his playing style is greatly altered. Or do you think it's just a coincidence that Nadal has 2/3 of his grand slams on a surface that is only at 1/4 of grand slams?
    Concrete is faster than grass? What?

    And no, clay isn't any more different to hard courts than grass. If anything, the most different surface is precisely grass. The ball bounces lower than in clay and hard courts. You have to move differently than in clay and HC because you will slip if not. On the later stages, the grass burns out and the court becomes a mixture of sand and grass, giving you plenty of weird bounces. If anything, grass is the "oddball surface".

  24. #299
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    My point is that one trick pony can also dominate Clay if that trick is good enough, say like Rafa's forehand.
    Are you implying Rafa is a one-trick ponny?

    Give any player Rafa's forehand with a weak backhand and he wouldn't win one RG, let alone 13 (or how many are that Rafa has).

  25. #300
    Manu Mania lefty20's Avatar
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    Are you implying Rafa is a one-trick ponny?

    Give any player Rafa's forehand with a weak backhand and he wouldn't win one RG, let alone 13 (or how many are that Rafa has).
    Were you implying that Fed is a one trick pony for dominating grass? Cuz, it kinda seemed that way. My apologies if not.


    Idk how one can ignore the fact that 65% of Rafa's Slam success is all on same damn court. There's no getting around that. If he really was as good of an all around player as Djoker and Fed he wouldn't be getting out classed so badly on grass, hard courts and indoor courts. For this reason he will always stay below Fed and eventually Djoker in the eyes of the most fans. There's just no getting around that.

    He's welcome to try and change that narrative by winning something other than RG but I don't see that happening, tbh.

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