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  1. #51
    bandwagoner fans suck ducks's Avatar
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    So what is a mild fine
    100 200 5000?
    _____________________________
    There are roughly 312 million people in the United States. There are Roughly 357 million guns. There are Approximately 32,000 deaths per year from firearms. 60% are Suicides. That is 19,220 3% are Accidental. That is 960. 4% are justified. That is 1,200 33% are Homicides. That is 10,560. 80% of those Homicides are Gang related. That is 8,488. That leaves 1,713 in a society of 312 million people. That gives you a 0.010256410256% chance of death by gun. A 0.008564% chance if you don't hang out in the hood not planning a crime and not planning on committing suicide. The United States Does Not have a Gun problem.

  2. #52
    Veteran DMC's Avatar
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    They have only been doing this vastly expanded policy for a month or so.

    This is going to be a humanitarian disaster, and the longer it continues, the greater the chance that some child will die in one of these centers, and the greater the chance that will be due to negligence of some sort on the part of overwhelmed caregivers.

    I am deeply ashamed of my country for this. It is evil. Period.



    http://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/poli...213026379.html
    How many are you going to house with you?

  3. #53
    bandwagoner fans suck ducks's Avatar
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    It is a bit sad to see that you are so blinded by hate, you can't even call evil when you see it. I feel sorry for you. The world would be better if you could tell right from wrong.
    It is wrong for them to come here and claim asylum when 80 percent do not qualify costing money
    Court time judges housing and food

  4. #54
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    It is a bit sad to see that you are so blinded by hate, you can't even call evil when you see it. I feel sorry for you. The world would be better if you could tell right from wrong.

    You're not a fan of accountability, at all and that doesn't equate to being of higher moral fiber.

    Endangered children being forced to illegally cross the border should be taken away from their stupid parents.
    Done and done. The parents risk their children's well being by breaking the law (and all the associated risk) and you think the offenders shouldn't have to face the loss part of the risk equation.

  5. #55
    Prince of Whales RandomGuy's Avatar
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    Is dragging children away from their parents and keeping them in cages to punish their parents evil?
    What repercussions for breaking the law aren't "evil"?
    A mild fine, for a mild crime would be "not evil", especially a fine that is a punishment leveled on the person who actually committed the crime.

    Now, your turn.

    Is dragging children away from their parents and keeping them in cages to punish their parents evil?
    So they separate the kids from their locked up parents to punish them? What are they supposed to do? Throw the kids in the clink with them?
    Not really too inclined to keep answering your questions, if the courtesy is not returned. I thought my question was pretty straightforward. Even so, yes, that is the stated intent, to punish parents for breaking the law. Yes, keep the family together. That is the moral thing go do. Even if you don't care what is moral, it simply costs us less than paying caregivers to step in for the parents.

    Let's add a bit of information in that separating children from parents and keeping them separate is known to cause lasting psychological harm to children, especially young ones.

    So:

    Is it evil to drag a blind, crying six year old boy from his mother, in order to punish them both for the crime of crossing a border?
    _____________________________
    ďTo announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.Ē -- The kind of Republican that would kicked out of the party today.

    "You know what uranium is, right? Itís this thing called nuclear weapons. And other things. Like lots of things are done with uranium. Including some bad things." -President Trump

    Putin has built up their military again and again and again. Their military is much stronger. Heís doing nuclear, weíre not doing anything. Our nuclear is old and tired and his nuclear is tippy-top from what I hear. Better be careful, folks, okay? You better be careful.Ē -President Trump



    http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...16#post9293816

  6. #56
    bandwagoner fans suck ducks's Avatar
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    Kids die all the time in the USA

    Kids die all the time
    The people coming here they say is because they are scared they feel they will die there

    USA does not have to take care of the world!
    I feel bad for those countries but if we keep it up we could easily be a third world country

  7. #57
    Dončić Dynasty monosylab1k's Avatar
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    Iím not saying I donít feel for these kids, their situation sucks. But if this deters illegal immigration, then at least thereís something good coming out of it. Too many people go missing and/or die trying to illegally cross the border. any parent who would willingly risk their childís life by taking that path.

    Iím all for legal immigration, Iím all for allowing refugees, Iím all for relaxing current immigration laws to let more people in. I think people who are already here illegally should be given a path to legal status without risk of deportation, if they go through the proper channels. But there absolutely should be a zero tolerance policy towards illegal immigration from now on, which protects the migrants more than anything.
    _____________________________




  8. #58
    Prince of Whales RandomGuy's Avatar
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    How many are you going to house with you?
    More failed moral reasoning from someone not quite smart enough to understand the failure. I can explain it to you, again, but I can't understand it for you.

  9. #59
    bandwagoner fans suck ducks's Avatar
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    Taking children from their native country and forcing them to come to the USA is not psychologically challenging ?

  10. #60
    Veteran DMC's Avatar
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    More failed moral reasoning from someone not quite smart enough to understand the failure. I can explain it to you, again, but I can't understand it for you.
    the poor kids
    muh beer money

    Your explanations seem to come with copious amounts of hyperbole accompanied by misleading imagery. If you have a real point you'd not need to be so dishonest about it.

  11. #61
    bandwagoner fans suck ducks's Avatar
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    Kids die trying to cross the boarder illegally all the time
    They lie it is only a few miles not that hot

  12. #62
    Prince of Whales RandomGuy's Avatar
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    You're not a fan of accountability, at all and that doesn't equate to being of higher moral fiber. .
    I do think accountability is a good thing. It is the only thing that makes human societies work. Good morals comes from doing the right thing when no one is looking, IMO. Not sure what you are getting at here, other than deflect from my main point.

    Not really a sign of someone who knows they are standing on firm rhetorical ground.

  13. #63
    Prince of Whales RandomGuy's Avatar
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    the poor kids
    muh beer money
    More failed moral reasoning from someone not quite smart enough to understand the failure. I can explain it to you, again, but I can't understand it for you.

  14. #64
    Veteran DMC's Avatar
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    More failed moral reasoning from someone not quite smart enough to understand the failure. I can explain it to you, again, but I can't understand it for you.
    Your explanations seem to come with copious amounts of hyperbole accompanied by misleading imagery. If you have a real point you'd not need to be so dishonest about it.

  15. #65
    bandwagoner fans suck ducks's Avatar
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    If I find a kid injured I call for help but i do not take them home and feed them
    It is called kidnapping

  16. #66
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    If I find a kid injured I call for help but i do not take them home and feed them
    It is called kidnapping
    so much better to leave them in a cage

  17. #67
    Veteran DMC's Avatar
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    I do think accountability is a good thing. It is the only thing that makes human societies work. Good morals comes from doing the right thing when no one is looking, IMO. Not sure what you are getting at here, other than deflect from my main point.

    Not really a sign of someone who knows they are standing on firm rhetorical ground.
    Good morals comes from doing instead of saying. People who are concerned based on moral principles should have the wherewithal to act on it. If you don't, if you see yourself as some arbiter of morality without agency to act, then you're part of the problem. The civilized world has enough idle opinions.

  18. #68
    bandwagoner fans suck ducks's Avatar
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    What about the kids their dad has when patrolling the country and the illegal shot the agent.
    What about those kids psychology ?

  19. #69
    Prince of Whales RandomGuy's Avatar
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    the poor kids
    muh beer money

    Your explanations seem to come with copious amounts of hyperbole accompanied by misleading imagery. If you have a real point you'd not need to be so dishonest about it.
    When you don't have any decent arguments, this is what you do. Fall back on personal attacks, as if that means your position is somehow not inferior.

    I accept your white flag.

  20. #70
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    Orange Shit.

  21. #71
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    Not really too inclined to keep answering your questions, if the courtesy is not returned. I thought my question was pretty straightforward. Even so, yes, that is the stated intent, to punish parents for breaking the law. Yes, keep the family together. That is the moral thing go do. Even if you don't care what is moral, it simply costs us less than paying caregivers to step in for the parents.

    Let's add a bit of information in that separating children from parents and keeping them separate is known to cause lasting psychological harm to children, especially young ones.

    So:

    Is it evil to drag a blind, crying six year old boy from his mother, in order to punish them both for the crime of crossing a border?

    See, here's the thing. Morality is, at least the non-obvious, decency issues, subjective. You're stating that your "take" on the issue is the definitive judgement on it and you're not any authority to say.

    I don't think it "evil". It would only be evil if it was permanent and reunion with the family isn't being halted although the reunion location isn't where you would like it to be, which would be the reason they were separated in the first place.

    I think it sucks, but it's the result of what happens when you do something wrong/illegal. It's cause and effect and it's the parents' fault the kids are taken away since they choose to put their kids in jeopardy.

    You deny any self-accountability on these offenders and then find the end result to be "evil". You can feel how you wish, but the way you describe the penalty is just that- your description. But you personally judging it that way doesn't make it evil and doesn't make anyone less humane for agreeing with the end result and doesn't make you a person of higher moral fiber just because you see something that way.

  22. #72
    bandwagoner fans suck ducks's Avatar
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    RandomGuy is it immoral not to put your money where your mouth is?
    why not give them money to help them.
    again the usa can not help everyone. Kids suffer all the time from parents choices even the legal parents here in the states.

  23. #73
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    If only the US stopped giving trillion dollar tax cuts to the super rich. How much welfare do THEY need?

  24. #74
    bandwagoner fans suck ducks's Avatar
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    If only the US stopped giving trillion dollar tax cuts to the super rich. How much welfare do THEY need?
    so you think the rich should pay for the illegals children and parents so they do not have to work and be with them

    if you can not afford kids do not have sex and not get kids!
    if where you live in the third world that be a kid would be bad DO NOT PRODUCE KIDS
    IF your spouce is bad and you think your kids would suffer DO NOT PRODUCE KIDS

  25. #75
    Prince of Whales RandomGuy's Avatar
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    See, here's the thing. Morality is, at least the non-obvious, decency issues, subjective. You're stating that your "take" on the issue is the definitive judgement on it and you're not any authority to say.

    I don't think it "evil". It would only be evil if it was permanent and reunion with the family isn't being halted although the reunion location isn't where you would like it to be, which would be the reason they were separated in the first place.

    I think it sucks, but it's the result of what happens when you do something wrong/illegal. It's cause and effect and it's the parents' fault the kids are taken away since they choose to put their kids in jeopardy.

    You deny any self-accountability on these offenders and then find the end result to be "evil". You can feel how you wish, but the way you describe the penalty is just that- your description. But you personally judging it that way doesn't make it evil and doesn't make anyone less humane for agreeing with the end result and doesn't make you a person of higher moral fiber just because you see something that way.
    That was a good, thoughtful response. Thank you. I have a lot to get done today, and need to get back to it. This deserves a response, and I will bookmark it and try to get back to it in the next few days.

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