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  1. #1
    Millennial Messiah UNT Eagles 2016's Avatar
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    IMO, he's screwed the pooch on his own legacy.

    As if the 3-6 thing isn't bad enough (he'll always be known as Mr. Second Place, both to MJ in GOAT standings and to his opponents in the Finals, and in the West in his time with the Lakers) he's really ruined his own legacy and what people will think of him, remember him for. At best case, people will think of him as a mercenary, and at worst people think of him as a chronic traitor and turncoat.

    Look, I get it. Cleveland is a crappy place, both for sports and for life in general. Their football team is the NFL's punching bag, the drug and crime rate is off the charts. If LeBron didn't want to be there, he shouldn't have re-signed when his rookie contract was up. Should have forced his way out after the 2006 loss to Detroit and signed either in New York or Miami, two bigger markets starving for GOATs at the time (and even now). Instead he waited until 2010 to "take [his] talents to Souf Beach" which was too late, even though he was still pre-prime at the time. He had already cemented himself in Cleveland for far too long, taken the Cavs too far and then just ditched them... not a good look at all on his part, but we all know that.

    Even then, if he had committed to spending the rest of his career in Miami post-2010, we all would have had a more favorable view of him. If he was there to lead the Heat(les) to a championship, or more, after Chris Bosh's heart defect ended his career, and Wade's injuries slowed him down? Nobody would really think of him as a mercenary, just a guy who got out of a situation he didn't like at a young age and followed through with his Great Decision. He would have been by far the greatest player in Heat history, the GOAT or second best, and perhaps they could have replaced Bosh quickly with another star (nobody really wants to move to the craphole that is Cleveland, but we all know everyone wants a part of Miami).

    Instead, he took his talents back to Cleveland in 2014, a huge mistake, and though he did win a championship in 1 out of 4 trips to the Finals, it was far overshadowed by the three gruesome, mostly one-sided defeats handed by the deadly embrace of the Warriors – a superteam of ring-wraith mercenaries built on the very foundation he created in his Decision 2010, when he joined All-Stars Bosh and Wade in Miami.

    Now he's completely sold out by moving to the Lakers where he'll just be one of the many, nothing special really, but akin to Wilt Chamberlain who joined the Lakers near the end of his career. He's not going to forever live in Laker lore the way guys like Jerry West, Kareem, Worthy, even early Shaq – not to mention arguably superior GOATs in Magic and Kobe who weren't pathetic mercenaries.

    BOTTOM LINE: LeBron James will be remembered in NBA history for his greatness in basketball throughout the 2000s and 2010s, but also for his failures, both on the court and in his unprecedented, frankly bizarre decision-making.
    Last edited by UNT Eagles 2016; 07-12-2018 at 12:11 AM.
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  2. #2
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    If he would have gone anywhere else it would have been OK. And this is not some "I hate the Lakers" rant. It's just that he chose the one and only fan base known for hating him throughout his entire career. It's just an awkward situation all around.

    No matter what happens, there will never be any kind of affection going either way on this relationship, and if he doesn't win at least one, he will get killed forever by Lakers fans. Just an all around very dumb decision by the King.

    If he wanted to settle in LA so much, he should have just gone to the Clippers, tbh. Who knows? maybe he would already have Kawhi by his side by now there.
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  3. #3
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    If he would have gone anywhere else it would have been OK. And this is not some "I hate the Lakers" rant. It's just that he chose the one and only fan base known for hating him throughout his entire career. It's just an awkward situation all around.

    No matter what happens, there will never be any kind of affection going either way on this relationship, and if he doesn't win at least one, he will get killed forever by Lakers fans. Just an all around very dumb decision by the King.


    If he wanted to settle in LA so much, he should have just gone to the Clippers, tbh. Who knows? maybe he would already have Kawhi by his side by now there.
    That's how I pretty much feel. I'll just add to it which is winning even 1 title with the Lakers will not be good enough to win that fan base over. They will always hate him to them Kobe is god and they view Lebron as a guy whose trying to replace Kobe. Everytime Lebron doesn't win they will bring up Kobe and say well Kobe would have never let us down blah blah blah. Kobe will also add in some shots when the Lakers don't win by saying "I love Lebron but he just doesn't have that killer mentality to win here in LA."

    I just don't get why he decided to settle in LA granted LA is a great city but this guy is married(safe to say he probably cheats but still pretty stupid to be in LA if your married). LA is not a city you can fully enjoy if you are not single. It wouldn't surprise me if Lebron gets divorced in a few years. Also it's not a place to raise a family. I guess Hollywood appealed to him and that's why he decided to be in LA since had a movie production company.

  4. #4
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    That's how I pretty much feel. I'll just add to it which is winning even 1 title with the Lakers will not be good enough to win that fan base over. They will always hate him to them Kobe is god and they view Lebron as a guy whose trying to replace Kobe. Everytime Lebron doesn't win they will bring up Kobe and say well Kobe would have never let us down blah blah blah. Kobe will also add in some shots when the Lakers don't win by saying "I love Lebron but he just doesn't have that killer mentality to win here in LA."

    I just don't get why he decided to settle in LA granted LA is a great city but this guy is married(safe to say he probably cheats but still pretty stupid to be in LA if your married). LA is not a city you can fully enjoy if you are not single. It wouldn't surprise me if Lebron gets divorced in a few years. Also it's not a place to raise a family. I guess Hollywood appealed to him and that's why he decided to be in LA since had a movie production company.
    Oh, Kobe's passive agressive comments will be there for sure.

    "Playing in LA is not like playing anywhere else. Only the strong ones make it here. You want it? You gotta go and take it. Nobody will give it to you. You need a special personality to succeed here".

  5. #5
    Satanic Point Guard Stabula's Avatar
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    Sad as it is, it's all very true and well said.

  6. #6
    LONG LIVE THE CHIEF lefty's Avatar
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    No I don't think so.


    But KD did

  7. #7
    Veteran Arcadian's Avatar
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    Going to Cleveland in '14 was a good move. Wade and Bosh were declining by that time, the Heat had just been demolished in the Finals by the largest margin in history, and he had two younger stars waiting to team up back in Cleveland. The victory in '16 was so glorious that it probably makes up for the 3 losses to GS by itself. Everyone knows he was up against a superteam, and that he had teammates like JR Smith who forget the score, and they have sympathy for him.

    BUT with all that said, his poor Finals record is a strike against him, and rightfully so.

  8. #8
    Veteran LkrFan's Avatar
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    TLDNR that shiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit!!!
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  9. #9
    Veteran Killakobe81's Avatar
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    If he would have gone anywhere else it would have been OK. And this is not some "I hate the Lakers" rant. It's just that he chose the one and only fan base known for hating him throughout his entire career. It's just an awkward situation all around.

    No matter what happens, there will never be any kind of affection going either way on this relationship, and if he doesn't win at least one, he will get killed forever by Lakers fans. Just an all around very dumb decision by the King.

    If he wanted to settle in LA so much, he should have just gone to the Clippers, tbh. Who knows? maybe he would already have Kawhi by his side by now there.
    THE one and only fan base that hated him?
    You think the Celts and Bulls fan loved LeBron? I Get you may live outside the US but I follow the Celts since they are one true rival Celts fans hated LeBron as did Pistons fans too.
    And though I feel Kobe fan firsts are the ones that hate LeBron more than true Laker fans... The #1 bashes of LeBron legacy even more than Kobe worshipers is the Jordanites in the media who won't even say its possible for James to surpass Jordan.
    Not excusing the dumbasses in our fanbase that defaced LeBron's new mural but pretty sure Celts spewed more venom at LeBron especially circa 2008-2011.

    As for the rest.. I agree he should have stayed I with cavs he would have rang eventually he is that great.
    But he did not.
    Every move since leaving the cavs led to rings by year two... Hopefully history repeats itself...
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  10. #10
    Board Man Comes Home Clipper Nation's Avatar
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    Joining the Lakers was dumb, but no. The star who's actually made a mockery out of their career is Durbeta.
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  11. #11
    Veteran BG_Spurs_Fan's Avatar
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    The Warriors broke him. I bet he lowkey hopes some other team beats them before they have to play the Warriors next season.

  12. #12
    I want my parcel DD's Avatar
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    The last time I was a Lebron James fan was the 2008 ECSF vs Boston. Not gonna lie, I've rooted against him every game since, so flipping the script will definitely be awkward for me tbh. If he wins just one in his 3-4 years I'll be happy.

    As far as hate, I never hate players or teams because of success. I respect Brady, Bron, Big Rape, the Spurs, Patriots, etc...even though i can't stand watching any of them succeed. I do hate players/teams that are hyped but never win jackshit. The Michael Vicks and Chris Pauls of the world...big show, absolutely no results. Same with the Dallas Cowboys since 2005. Just empty bragging
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  13. #13
    I want my parcel DD's Avatar
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    Now that I think of it...there's 2 hyped athletes through the years that I've respected despite lack of success: Dan Marino and Allen Iverson.

  14. #14
    LONG LIVE THE CHIEF lefty's Avatar
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    Going to Cleveland in '14 was a good move. Wade and Bosh were declining by that time, the Heat had just been demolished in the Finals by the largest margin in history, and he had two younger stars waiting to team up back in Cleveland. The victory in '16 was so glorious that it probably makes up for the 3 losses to GS by itself. Everyone knows he was up against a superteam, and that he had teammates like JR Smith who forget the score, and they have sympathy for him.

    BUT with all that said, his poor Finals record is a strike against him, and rightfully so.
    No it shouldn't.

    He lost to much better teams.

    And before you bring up Dallas, that team jad just swept the 2 time defending champs and beat a talented OKC team that year

  15. #15
    I want my parcel DD's Avatar
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    No it shouldn't.

    He lost to much better teams.

    And before you bring up Dallas, that team jad just swept the 2 time defending champs and beat a talented OKC team that year
    Dude LeBron was absolute garbage in that Dallas series. He was deathly afraid of the big moment in 4 or 5 straight close games

  16. #16
    LONG LIVE THE CHIEF lefty's Avatar
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    Dude LeBron was absolute garbage in that Dallas series. He was deathly afraid of the big moment in 4 or 5 straight close games
    So what?

    All NBA greats have some stain on their resumes

  17. #17
    I want my parcel DD's Avatar
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    So what?

    All NBA greats have some stain on their resumes
    I'm not arguing that...I'm arguing your point that Dallas was some insurmountable obstacle he ran into. If he did even 1% of what he was capable of in any of those close games they win that series. It was a historical chokejob not by the Heat, but him alone. When Jason Kidd is bodying you at the end of games then that's a problem. Reminded me of Dirk inexplicably struggling against Posey in 2006.

  18. #18
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    THE one and only fan base that hated him?
    You think the Celts and Bulls fan loved LeBron? I Get you may live outside the US but I follow the Celts since they are one true rival Celts fans hated LeBron as did Pistons fans too.
    And though I feel Kobe fan firsts are the ones that hate LeBron more than true Laker fans... The #1 bashes of LeBron legacy even more than Kobe worshipers is the Jordanites in the media who won't even say its possible for James to surpass Jordan.
    Not excusing the dumbasses in our fanbase that defaced LeBron's new mural but pretty sure Celts spewed more venom at LeBron especially circa 2008-2011.

    As for the rest.. I agree he should have stayed I with cavs he would have rang eventually he is that great.
    But he did not.
    Every move since leaving the cavs led to rings by year two... Hopefully history repeats itself...
    I said "the one and only fan base known for hating him throughout his entire career."

    Laker/Kobe fans hated Lebron pretty much from the get go and remained hating him even after Kobe retired.

    Celtics and Bulls fans hated him when they had a rivalry going, but prior and after that they didn't hated him. Same with Pistons for a moment, with GS now. The only fanbase that trully hated Lebron no matter what was the Lakers; and that's without even having face each other in the playoffs.

  19. #19
    Veteran baseline bum's Avatar
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    Going to Cleveland in '14 was a good move. Wade and Bosh were declining by that time, the Heat had just been demolished in the Finals by the largest margin in history, and he had two younger stars waiting to team up back in Cleveland. The victory in '16 was so glorious that it probably makes up for the 3 losses to GS by itself. Everyone knows he was up against a superteam, and that he had teammates like JR Smith who forget the score, and they have sympathy for him.

    BUT with all that said, his poor Finals record is a strike against him, and rightfully so.
    I still think Micky Arison signed LeBron's ticket out of Miami when he amnestied Mike Miller. LeBron sounded pissed about that and after it happened he said he would never take a paycut again. I would be too, LeBron took a paycut in 2010 to open up capspace to go after Miller, who ended up crucial to their 2013 title and his absence was huge in the 2014 Finals when Chalmers got in that slump.

  20. #20
    Veteran LkrFan's Avatar
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    Joining the Lakers was dumb, but no. The star who's actually made a mockery out of their career is Durbeta.
    ^That's just Lakers and Dubs are both better than the Clipps talking

  21. #21
    I'll tumble for ya Chris Fall's Avatar
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    No. What he’s done throughout his career up to now cannot be undone. If he went to Russia or Cuba to play professionally to end his playing career, it wouldn’t change anything. This certainly doesn’t. The fact he chose to close things out in LA with a historic but beaten down franchise won’t stain anything he’s done beforehand. He’s not ring chasing. He didn’t make a spectacle of his free agency. He didn’t superteam with Golden State or Houston. He went to the place that offered him and his family what he felt was the best mix of everything, including business interests, family wants, and post playing opportunities.

    Honestly, him going to the Lakers is partly to blame on teams like the Knicks, Nets, and Clippers. I truly believe if those teams made the appropriate payroll and salary maneuvers, the Lakers wouldn’t have been a slam dunk choice. This off season, his only real choices were the Lakers and Sixers. Cleveland was out for sure. LeBron didn’t really have many options. But I think his wife would have considered New York as a legitimate option after LA, except for the Phil Jackson variable. But we saw LeBron go back to Cleveland despite Gilbert’s comic sans letter. And the Clippers offer the same as the Lakers in terms of outside basketball factors. A couple of those teams should have done more to at least give LeBron options to prevent him from being a Laker.

  22. #22
    Veteran Killakobe81's Avatar
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    No. What he’s done throughout his career up to now cannot be undone. If he went to Russia or Cuba to play professionally to end his playing career, it wouldn’t change anything. This certainly doesn’t. The fact he chose to close things out in LA with a historic but beaten down franchise won’t stain anything he’s done beforehand. He’s not ring chasing. He didn’t make a spectacle of his free agency. He didn’t superteam with Golden State or Houston. He went to the place that offered him and his family what he felt was the best mix of everything, including business interests, family wants, and post playing opportunities.

    Honestly, him going to the Lakers is partly to blame on teams like the Knicks, Nets, and Clippers. I truly believe if those teams made the appropriate payroll and salary maneuvers, the Lakers wouldn’t have been a slam dunk choice. This off season, his only real choices were the Lakers and Sixers. Cleveland was out for sure. LeBron didn’t really have many options. But I think his wife would have considered New York as a legitimate option after LA, except for the Phil Jackson variable. But we saw LeBron go back to Cleveland despite Gilbert’s comic sans letter. And the Clippers offer the same as the Lakers in terms of outside basketball factors. A couple of those teams should have done more to at least give LeBron options to prevent him from being a Laker.
    Great post as usual but being a Clipper in LA even off court is different. Being a Clip is like being an Angel instead of a Dodger, Ram instead of a Raider or Duck instead of a King. USC basketball or Ucla football. All those teams even the Clips have had Some level of success... And their stars like CP3, Blake, Eric Dickerson etc all do well off the court. Dickerson was better than Allen when he played here but because Marcus was a Raider it meant more. Heck Bo Jackson's brief tenure as Raider was bigger than Dickerson and Eric broke records. But being the star of LA's secondary teams is nothing like being a star of the premier teams. I don't like baseball as much as Hoops but I would absolutely choose being a Dodger in LA over the Clips.
    That is the thing Clips not only battle with Lakers but they not even a favorite over our main baseball team. I do think they have more fans than Angels or Ducks and maybe even the King's due to Hoops being more popular overall. But they are not even bigger than USC football or Ucla basket ball traditionally in the pecking order of the city. I'm not hating that's facts. I thank God for the Clips since half of the Lakers games I attended before I left were Clippers home games vs the Lakers at both Sports Arena and Staples cuz they were so much cheaper.
    As for the rest agree Bron if he dropped dead already certified top 5 dead or alive.

  23. #23
    Chopper Ed Helicopter Jones's Avatar
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    In NBA lore he won’t surpass Michael, and perhaps not even guys like Russell the further back in history his career becomes. Wilt was probably the most dominant basketball player ever, but he isn’t remembered that way because he couldn’t deliver the ‘chips and bounced around the league. I think it’s a good take OP.

  24. #24
    Veteran Thebesteva's Avatar
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    Oh how we’ve come full circle since LeDecision in 2010
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  25. #25
    "The ball don't lie." dbestpro's Avatar
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    There is an interesting piece on ESPN about the legacy of Chamberlain vs Russell. Most look at these two guys fairly evenly, but when you look at the two statistically,Wilt almost doubles Russell. The big difference? Russell played on one team, while Wilt played on many. Because of this James and Durant will always be in the shadow of even Kobe. Future generations will see that he played with one team and that gets extra points when it comes to the legacy perception.
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