Grades: Spurs @ Heat - Nov. 7, 2018

[SpursDynasty85]

That was at the beginning. By the time the deal was done, it was pretty common knowledge it was going to get done. At that point, the Raptors could not bring DeRozan back. You saw how badly he spiraled down after the trade, even with PATFO and Gay supporting him. Imagine how much worse that would have been with Ujuri having to pull the "I voted for it, but I was glad that it didn't pass" card? It would have been like the failed Chris Paul trade.

I think I know what you mean but still think you are grasping at straws here. Also it sounds like you are suggesting Spurs reneg on whatever deal might have been negotiated to gain an upper hand on the Raptors. Nobody knows exactly the inner working or details besides the parties but this sounds unlikely. If it is true, I believe very few teams would try to do anything Bush league like that, especially the Spurs.

Rumors were heavy in a way leading up to the deal but nothing that couldn't have worked it's way back. Like Derozanwas saying he was caught off gaurd until a few hours before it went official. It's just a trade both sides wanted to make. Raptors negotiated well and really Spurs were the ones who needed to make it happen. Nobody wanted a Jimmy Butler situation. Spurs and Lawhi would've been much worse.

[Chinook]

I think I know what you mean but still think you are grasping at straws here. Also it sounds like you are suggesting Spurs reneg on whatever deal might have been negotiated to gain an upper hand on the Raptors. Nobody knows exactly the inner working or details besides the parties but this sounds unlikely. If it is true, I believe very few teams would try to do anything Bush league like that, especially the Spurs.

We're not talking about a couple of hours here. There rumored trade came out days before anything happened -- days before Toronto popped up as the leading team (which was days before they completed the trade). This was in the works for a long time. There was a huge gap of time where it was apparent the Raptors were looking to trade DeRozan but before anything was finalized. That's how the rumor about Kawhi/Green/First for DeRozan/Poeltl became the reality of Kawhi/Green/cash for DeRozan/Poeltl/First. The teams were still negotiating. The Spurs had every right to pull out during that stage had Toronto drawn a line at adding more than that sweetener package. However, had talks failed, it still would have been apparent, if not immediately then eventually, how willing Ujuri was to move DeRozan, which would have been enough to damage chemistry.

You don't seem to remember how close Toronto was to blowing it up in the off-season. DeRozan, Ibaka and Lowry were on the block. Ujuri was not going to stand pat. He didn't have leverage.

[bklynspursfan]

The Raptors did have to make a deal. Once they decided to kill the king, they had to make sure he was dead. The Spurs didn't have to make a deal, especially not then. Maybe with all the locker-room , they didn't have the stomach to hold onto Kawhi any longer. I can't judged them too harshly if that was the case. But I'm also not going to remove all other lines of thinking. It's not like Kawhi was going to become more of a cancer if the Spurs told him the deal with Toronto fell through. He didn't want to go there anyway.

They could've stuck it out and ran it back, and with Lebron gone, who would blame them? They could've just said the rumors were BS, I'm sure it happens.

The Spurs theoretically didn't have to, Kawhi was under contract. It was being reported he didn't want to step foot in that locker room again. The team just went through a year of questions and drama, I don't blame them for wanting to rid the source. Other offers had slowed and teams weren't offering a lot for him. We see it now with Butler, it won't be easy to move a guy like that maybe until the deadline. I don't blame them for wanting to get rid of him and his uncle as quickly as possible

[Kurgan]

I noticed that, too. The team reaction wasn't what you'd expect when one of the "family" is hurting. A bad sign.

Danny Green was "family". A great locker room guy that did a lot for the community too. Poeltl's the overhyped Euro stiff that replaced him. Derozan replacing Kawhi is not much of an issue since most of the team probably disliked Kawhi's family drama. Green, on the other hand, didn't ask to be traded. Everybody genuinely liked him. If Poeltl played more like Splitter and less like Joffrey Lauvergne, the locker room might actually like him. He's been a massive bust thus far and his confidence is shattered. You can see the defeated look in his eyes, the other players probably notice it too. Won't be long before he whines about going back to Europe like all the other mentally weak Euro busts.

[JeffDuncan]

Poeltl played in all 82 regular season games last year, with avg minutes over 18. That Raptor team won 59 games. Clearly they found a use for him, but I don't know what it was.

[Kurgan]

Poeltl played in all 82 regular season games last year, with avg minutes over 18. That Raptor team won 59 games. Clearly they found a use for him, but I don't know what it was.

Spurs were swindled, plain and simple. Instead of taking back a badly needed wing player, they receive a soft Euro piece of . What the are we stashing Milutinov in Europe for if we're never gonna bring him over?

[r0drig0lac]

Spurs were swindled, plain and simple. Instead of taking back a badly needed wing player, they receive a soft Euro piece of . What the are we stashing Milutinov in Europe for if we're never gonna bring him over?

I would like to see Dangubic, he has size and plays in a position we need, if he is not as soft as Bertans seems to have stayed (he really did not give that impression when he arrived in SA), should have a chance here

[Beartrucci]

Like I said in game thread, we're watching reality set in. We got off to hot start because of adrenaline from DD, but it was never going to last. We're not a playoff team. I'd honestly rather try and get one of those 3 Duke players anyway

Thanks for the write up timvp. Great stuff as always.

[JPB]

Like I said in game thread, we're watching reality set in. We got off to hot start because of adrenaline from DD, but it was never going to last. We're not a playoff team. I'd honestly rather try and get one of those 3 Duke players anyway

Thanks for the write up timvp. Great stuff as always.

DeWow hot start has to be put in perspective with LMA relative slump. Aldridge should get his touch back, opening things for DD and shooters. With Gay back in the mix and Fathead jr. getting in rythm, there might be room for improvement.

This team isn't finished and has yet to find its iden y.

But those past two games were definitely brutal.

[BlackAndWhite]

My question is, is Forbes better than Gary Neal? Spurs won 61 games in 2011 with a similar type of line up.

[Beartrucci]

DeWow hot start has to be put in perspective with LMA relative slump. Aldridge should get his touch back, opening things for DD and shooters. With Gay back in the mix and Fathead jr. getting in rythm, there might be room for improvement.

This team isn't finished and has yet to find its iden y.

But those past two games were definitely brutal.

Yea maybe I'm being too negative here. I forget how pedestrian Lma has started out. If he can return to form it changes a lot. I won't say they're finished, but I don't think they're a playoff team right now. If injury luck starts working in our favor who knows...incredibly tough start for us there.

[ECOV]

ing need to calm down Jesus Christ it's only been a f****** month of the season. calm the down down down. Losing is a part of life get over it .

[J_Paco]

And your 2 best players looking worn down 10 games in. Allen Iverson would be rolling over in his grave. Dude played 40 MPG basically his entire (Sixers) career and never really got hurt. And he was slashing and cutting, running and jumping and taking it to the hole in a much more physical NBA. Today you're not allowed to play any physical defense and these guys are just getting non contact fluke injuries

I'm not sure what your statement about Allen Iverson has to do with Aldridge's poor play, DeMar's minutes or the injury bug that has hit the team?

A.I. was practically out the league around LaMarcus' age and DeMar is playing heavy minutes (a rarity for a recent Spur) as the only (good) penetrator, ball handler and playmaker. Hopefully, with Derrick back and more comfortable offensively it lighten his burden.

Also, Iverson played through a lot of nagging injuries that piled up overtime and contributed to his rapid decline.

The team needs to hope Poetl can find his confidence soon because he looks nothing like he did in Toronto. It has been a while since a player has looked this poor in their first season in town.

How has he gone from running the floor well, scoring effectively/efficiently inside and being stout on defense to the complete an hesis one year later? And isn't like he had an elite playmaker off Toronto's bench spoon feeding him baskets....

The team also needs to stop bull ting and look for some actual perimeter help. Forcing DeRozan, Cunningham and Bertans to man the SF position while Gay is out is a recipe for disaster. They can always audition someone with the extra two - way contract and dump them (or Pondexter) if/when Huestis is finally healthy.

[JeffDuncan]

My question is, is Forbes better than Gary Neal?

Gary Neal was better.

Spurs won 61 games in 2011 with a similar type of line up.

Similar....hm. Well, I guess similar. They were all male sapiens.

[J_Paco]

ing need to calm down Jesus Christ it's only been a f****** month of the season. calm the down down down. Losing is a part of life get over it .

I totally agree, but being irrational, negative and trolling have become a staple here (unfortunately). I think LaMarcus' recent poor offensive performances and the lack of another quality SF (or even a fringe one) are legitimate concerns.

He can't play this poorly on offense on a regular basis and expect the team to win games.

I hate crapping on or speaking ill of R.C. or the front office, but they've done the team a huge disservice by not finding at least a serviceable backup SF or prospect. There are at least 4 or 5 undrafted/two-way guys they could've plucked but instead they settled on Quincy Pondexter and Dante Cunningham.

[Beartrucci]

ing need to calm down Jesus Christ it's only been a f****** month of the season. calm the down down down. Losing is a part of life get over it .

I didn't think we were a playoff team when DD was going crazy and we were winning. Never thought it was sustainable. LMA has to get going.

[paperboy77]

Whiteside is a headcase. Here is the thing about Whiteside; if he gets going, he does really well. He got a couple of early blocks and a few made baskets. All of a sudden, he feels great and Spo went for him. Players like Amare Stoudamire did the same thing. He gets his touches, makes baskets, then all of a sudden he is an elite rebounder and altering shots. Whiteside is that type of player. The idea is, you get him to bite, make dumb fouls, and then his game is in his head.

Pop dropped the ball. He should have seen Whiteside was full of energy after a few blocks and baskets. He should have lit the fire under LMA. The loss was mainly on LMA. Can't blame the role players on this one. DD did okay. He didn't actually hurt the spurs, but LMA 2-12 or some is a massive negative.

I'm pissed because you can't drop games like this with Dragic out. And we just lost to the Magic. FFS, these games are the difference between getting home court advantage or being a 9th seed.

i don’t recall Amare being that at all. That dude was a straight killler. Maybe in the latter years after repeated micro surgery.

[paperboy77]

DeWow hot start has to be put in perspective with LMA relative slump. Aldridge should get his touch back, opening things for DD and shooters. With Gay back in the mix and Fathead jr. getting in rythm, there might be room for improvement.

This team isn't finished and has yet to find its iden y.

But those past two games were definitely brutal.

Been a while since I heard that!

[HarlemHeat37]

I'm not sure what your statement about Allen Iverson has to do with Aldridge's poor play, DeMar's minutes or the injury bug that has hit the team?

A.I. was practically out the league around LaMarcus' age and DeMar is playing heavy minutes (a rarity for a recent Spur) as the only (good) penetrator, ball handler and playmaker. Hopefully, with Derrick back and more comfortable offensively it lighten his burden.

Also, Iverson played through a lot of nagging injuries that piled up overtime and contributed to his rapid decline.

The team needs to hope Poetl can find his confidence soon because he looks nothing like he did in Toronto. It has been a while since a player has looked this poor in their first season in town.

How has he gone from running the floor well, scoring effectively/efficiently inside and being stout on defense to the complete an hesis one year later? And isn't like he had an elite playmaker off Toronto's bench spoon feeding him baskets....

The team also needs to stop bull ting and look for some actual perimeter help. Forcing DeRozan, Cunningham and Bertans to man the SF position while Gay is out is a recipe for disaster. They can always audition someone with the extra two - way contract and dump them (or Pondexter) if/when Huestis is finally healthy.

Not elite, but FVV was very good out of the pick & roll, they had multiple ball-handlers when Wright was in and their bench had the best chemistry of any 2nd unit in the league..

It's an indictment on Pop and the front office that his game mysteriously fell off a cliff in just 6 months..maybe it's not on them that he isn't being used properly, but if they knew the personnel to help him wasn't available on this roster, why acquire him in the first place?

[spurs10]

Thanks for the grades. It's scary how big of hit we have taken with Gay, and now Gasol, out. It's certainly a credit to those two, as I thought we looked like a pretty good team during our four game winning streak.

[ECOV]

I didn't think we were a playoff team when DD was going crazy and we were winning. Never thought it was sustainable. LMA has to get going.

That's fine ..spurs are always thrown under the bus they will always prove teams and people wrong. Spurs are. Of playing there best I say make mistakes now and learn . spurs are fine and a great team .just need to be more aggressive

[TDomination]

Thanks for the grades. It's scary how big of hit we have taken with Gay, and now Gasol, out. It's certainly a credit to those two, as I thought we looked like a pretty good team during our four game winning streak.

with Murray, Walker and White out, its really hard to have 2 more guys out and try to win. Its next to impossible. We just can't have more guys go down.

I'm hoping Gay is just being rested since we practically have a week off, and he's able to get on Saturday. Same goes for Pau.

If both play on Saturday, White needs to come off the bench IMO.

[r0drig0lac]

That's fine ..spurs are always thrown under the bus they will always prove teams and people wrong. Spurs are. Of playing there best I say make mistakes now and learn . spurs are fine and a great team .just need to be more aggressive

no they are not, and about "be more aggressive" some people just do not have it inside them, Spurs aside from the clear lack of athleticism has some of the softer players in the league, so I would not count on that

[Spurs da champs]

Jakob has no range, yet is charmin soft. Why has this guy not put on any muscle? Its unacceptable to be so weak (on top of not being athletic )at that size with such a limited skillset. How was he a lottery pick?

[lefty]

DDR in rare playoff form .......


Kawhi would have destroyed those clowns