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  1. #51
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    The Medicare Trump wants to cut funding for?
    As opposed to the whole thing going UNDER as Medicare for All? Older people have contributed their whole working life to Medicare (and the program is still gonna run into trouble soon) - do you think they want to pay for Medicare for All which will endanger their won Medicare?

  2. #52
    Believe. Pavlov's Avatar
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    As opposed to the whole thing going UNDER as Medicare for All? Older people have contributed their whole working life to Medicare (and the program is still gonna run into trouble soon) - do you think they want to pay for Medicare for All which will endanger their won Medicare?
    As long as theirs stays the same they probably won't care -- and it probably will stay the same.

    lol your scare tactics

  3. #53
    WICKED PISSAH!!!! Will Hunting's Avatar
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    They actually got around to changing the process? good work Democrats though, but it's baby steps, because they should eliminate the superdelegates anyway, it's anti-cons utional.
    Agreed completely but I’m optimistic that the way it’s done now will basically make it so the superdelegates will need to go with the voters. If candidate X is winning among all of the voters but loses the final delegate count because the superdelegates close the gap for candidate Y on nomination night it’d be such a blatant act of voter disenfranchisement that someone would probably challenge it in court.

    Even in 2008 the superdelegates started flipping from Clinton to Obama once it was clear the voters were favoring Obama.

  4. #54
    俺はマンコが大好きだ baseline bum's Avatar
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    Shocker, the conservatives in this thread think liberals should embrace the most centrist candidate in the primary who aligns closest with their views.
    They tell us for years how horrible Clinton was and then want another Clinton who would beat Trump easily.

  5. #55
    俺はマンコが大好きだ baseline bum's Avatar
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    Please vote Bernie for the nomination. Most older Dems will hold their noses, and vote Trump to protect their Medicare (and not Medicare for All) and not pay for free college tuition/forgiveness of student loans.
    Holy you're re ed WC. Die in a fire pls.

  6. #56
    WICKED PISSAH!!!! Will Hunting's Avatar
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    As opposed to the whole thing going UNDER as Medicare for All? Older people have contributed their whole working life to Medicare (and the program is still gonna run into trouble soon) - do you think they want to pay for Medicare for All which will endanger their won Medicare?
    The people who believe your hourse about how MEDICARE FOR ALL = MEDICAIRE FOR NONE!!! are voting Republican regardless of who the candidate is on the Democrat side.

    The song and dance about how old people have been contributing their entire life is also just more sanctimonious drivel from baby boomers and the “silent” generation. Baby boomers have known that Medicaire has been underfunded for decades because of outdated actuarial projections that assume an average life expectancy in the 60s, but they wanted no part of changing it or making it sustainable until millennials and gen Xers would be the ones shouldering the tax burden for it.

  7. #57
    WICKED PISSAH!!!! Will Hunting's Avatar
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    They tell us for years how horrible Clinton was and then want another Clinton who would beat Trump easily.
    I don’t buy it that Biden beats Trump easily. He’s a better candidate than Clinton because he comes off as more folksy and genuine but he’s also very much a career politician who’s never stood for anything. The fact he’s a Delaware politician also makes him repulsive. I don’t see how he inspires the voter turnout among millennials or blacks that’s required to beat Trump. He has too many sound bites about how young people are lazy and his track record on civil rights has its holes. He’s also been a big supporter of neoliberalism and free trade which makes him vulnerable against Trump.

    I think he beats Trump in 2016 but beating Trump as an in bent after going through what’s going to be a brutal primary is tall task for him.

  8. #58
    俺はマンコが大好きだ baseline bum's Avatar
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    I don’t buy it that Biden beats Trump easily.
    Should have put in blue for sarcasm since all I hear from the right is any Democrat milquetoast not on the left would easily beat him. Just like the last Democrat milquetoast centrist did.

  9. #59
    WICKED PISSAH!!!! Will Hunting's Avatar
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    Should have put in blue for sarcasm since all I hear from the right is any Democrat milquetoast not on the left would easily beat him. Just like the last Democrat milquetoast centrist did.
    Ah ok.

    To be fair, I hear it from the left just as much. Bill Maher went from being someone who begged Warren to run against Hillary in 2016 to more or less crying about Bernie supporters being unreasonable on his show every week because the Dems need to focus on “winning the center”.

    God knows MSNBC crams it down its viewers’ throat too, Joe Scarborough’s shtick these days is having Claire McCaskill on his show so she can provide viewers with her “expertise” on how she won the center in Missouri by not being a “crazy Democrat” when the actual reality is that she only won in 2006 because of a historically unpopular Republican President and again in 2012 only because her opponent made one of the most re ed comments about a rape/pregnancy in the history of abortion debates.

  10. #60
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    If Bernie loses again and his supporters pout and stay home again, Trump wins easily.

    Bernie supporters need to stop pouting.

  11. #61
    俺はマンコが大好きだ baseline bum's Avatar
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    God knows MSNBC crams it down its viewers’ throat too, Joe Scarborough’s shtick these days is having Claire McCaskill on his show so she can provide viewers with her “expertise” on how she won the center in Missouri by not being a “crazy Democrat” when the actual reality is that she only won in 2006 because of a historically unpopular Republican President and again in 2012 only because her opponent made one of the most re ed comments about a rape/pregnancy in the history of abortion debates.
    Wow, network sounds like a dumpster fire. As for Maher, I stopped paying attention to him once he said crystal meth was just uppers and lots of successful people use speed.

  12. #62
    Believe. Pavlov's Avatar
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    The voting population on the whole went a little to the left. You got moderate Democrats elected in Round Rock and far left Democrats elected in the Bronx. It's not rocket science.

  13. #63
    WICKED PISSAH!!!! Will Hunting's Avatar
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    If Bernie loses again and his supporters pout and stay home again, Trump wins easily.

    Bernie supporters need to stop pouting.
    Ignoring how blown out of proportion the “Sanders supporters stayed home and ruined it for Hillary!” narrative is, the at ude that Sanders supporters owe their vote to whoever wins regardless of that candidates’ views or track record is what’s wrong with the Democratic Party. If someone beats Bernie and that person wants votes from Bernie supporters, he should give them a reason to show up and vote other than “I’m the Democrat and the other guy is a Republican”.

    The mainstream Democrats who value beating Trump over everything else need to recognize that a lot progressives no longer see the point of aiding a two party system where both parties support things like private healthcare, increased fossil fuel usage and deregulating Wall Street.

    Even if it means the Republicans are able to cause another Great Depression in the short term because Biden doesn’t have enough support within his base to win, I still see more value in voting for Trump as a way to cripple the establishment Dems than I do electing another centrist hack like Biden who wouldn’t bring about any meaningful change.

  14. #64
    Believe. Pavlov's Avatar
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    Ignoring how blown out of proportion the “Sanders supporters stayed home and ruined it for Hillary!” narrative is, the at ude that Sanders supporters owe their vote to whoever wins regardless of that candidates’ views or track record is what’s wrong with the Democratic Party. If someone beats Bernie and that person wants votes from Bernie supporters, he should give them a reason to show up and vote other than “I’m the Democrat and the other guy is a Republican”.

    The mainstream Democrats who value beating Trump over everything else need to recognize that a lot progressives no longer see the point of aiding a two party system where both parties support things like private healthcare, increased fossil fuel usage and deregulating Wall Street.

    Even if it means the Republicans are able to cause another Great Depression in the short term because Biden doesn’t have enough support within his base to win, I still see more value in voting for Trump as a way to cripple the establishment Dems than I do electing another centrist hack like Biden who wouldn’t bring about any meaningful change.
    Right, if Bernie progressives don't get their way immediately they'd rather have Trump again.

    That's what I said.

    They can pout if that's what they want. It's a free country.

  15. #65
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    Ignoring how blown out of proportion the “Sanders supporters stayed home and ruined it for Hillary!” narrative is, the at ude that Sanders supporters owe their vote to whoever wins regardless of that candidates’ views or track record is what’s wrong with the Democratic Party. If someone beats Bernie and that person wants votes from Bernie supporters, he should give them a reason to show up and vote other than “I’m the Democrat and the other guy is a Republican”.

    The mainstream Democrats who value beating Trump over everything else need to recognize that a lot progressives no longer see the point of aiding a two party system where both parties support things like private healthcare, increased fossil fuel usage and deregulating Wall Street.

    Even if it means the Republicans are able to cause another Great Depression in the short term because Biden doesn’t have enough support within his base to win, I still see more value in voting for Trump as a way to cripple the establishment Dems than I do electing another centrist hack like Biden who wouldn’t bring about any meaningful change.
    I like your thought. On a personal level I would much rather lose to Donald Trump than win with another establishment shill like Kamala Harris or Beto. I'm not gonna waste my time and gas to go to a long ass line and vote for a corporate shill that will give us someone worse that Trump down the line, the next Stalin or Hitler.

    Btw I question everything we are told about Hitler and Stalin but you get my point.

  16. #66
    WICKED PISSAH!!!! Will Hunting's Avatar
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    Right, if Bernie progressives don't get their way immediately they'd rather have Trump again.

    That's what I said.

    They can pout if that's what they want. It's a free country.
    You said Bernie supporters need to stop pouting which is what I was mostly commenting on. Now you’re saying they can pout if they want.

    Glad were in agreement but that’s not what you said.

  17. #67
    5X ST MVP Spurtacular's Avatar
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    You said Bernie supporters need to stop pouting which is what I was mostly commenting on. Now you’re saying they can pout if they want.

    Glad were in agreement but that’s not what you said.
    Pscychopav taking both positions.... Par.

  18. #68
    5X ST MVP Spurtacular's Avatar
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    Right, if Bernie progressives don't get their way immediately they'd rather have Trump again.
    So, what's the lesson learned here for hardcore Democrats like you?

  19. #69
    WICKED PISSAH!!!! Will Hunting's Avatar
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    FTR, if it’s an honest primary process where the candidates are all given a level playing field, there isn’t stuff done behind the scenes to prop up the establishment favorites and there aren’t any controls in place to stop a less mainstream candidate like Sanders from winning and the voters were really the ones deciding the race, then I’d probably vote for whoever wins the primary in the general unless it’s Biden.

    Unfortunately, this is already shaping up to be another controlled primary with bull stunts like an “LGBT focused” debate, so I’m not optimistic.

  20. #70
    Believe. Pavlov's Avatar
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    You said Bernie supporters need to stop pouting which is what I was mostly commenting on. Now you’re saying they can pout if they want.

    Glad were in agreement but that’s not what you said.
    They should stop pouting.

    But pout away.

    It won't make anything better now or later.

  21. #71
    WICKED PISSAH!!!! Will Hunting's Avatar
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    They should stop pouting.

    But pout away.

    It won't make anything better now or later.
    So why should they stop pouting?

  22. #72
    Believe. Pavlov's Avatar
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    So why should they stop pouting?
    Because historically the closest things to revolutionary change we've had in this country wouldn't have happened without establishment politicians.

  23. #73
    Still Hates Small Ball Spurminator's Avatar
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    I still see more value in voting for Trump as a way to cripple the establishment Dems than I do electing another centrist hack like Biden who wouldn’t bring about any meaningful change.
    Why would this cripple establishment Dems?

  24. #74
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    "Biden’s huge task is to hide his phoniness."

    LOL!

    Could not have said it better.

  25. #75
    WICKED PISSAH!!!! Will Hunting's Avatar
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    Why would this cripple establishment Dems?
    Same reason Hillary losing to Trump loosened the establishment’s grip on the party. Trump beating Biden contradicts the entire establishment thesis that candidates like Sanders and Warren are “unelectable” and thus voters should support center-right corporatists like Hillary and Biden because they can win “the center” which is supposedly the key to winning elections (even though after 2016 Republicans managed to control the White House, both houses of Congress, and SCOTUS, not to mention how much more control they have at the local level in most states, all by having far right demagogue at the top of the ticket who couldn’t have given a about winning the center).
    Last edited by Will Hunting; 04-28-2019 at 11:14 AM.

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