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  1. #26
    Board Man Comes Home Clipper Nation's Avatar
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    The Seahawks found a new WR to bail Struggle out, tbh.


  2. #27
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    Wilson is a top 3 QB in the league. I don't know why so many people hate to ackowledge this fact.

  3. #28
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    first there were people on this forum saying sidney rice was basically larry fitzgerald. then it became all golden tate. then it became all doug baldwin. now its all lockett

    maybe there's a common denominator, like that 7x pro bowl qb they have. 8 yards per attempt, only 5 INT's in over 500 attempts, to go with 31 passing TDs

    most of ST has already let this shtick go... there are still a couple of you left

  4. #29
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    first there were people on this forum saying sidney rice was basically larry fitzgerald. then it became all golden tate. then it became all doug baldwin. now its all lockett

    maybe there's a common denominator, like that 7x pro bowl qb they have. 8 yards per attempt, only 5 INT's in over 500 attempts, to go with 31 passing TDs

    most of ST has already let this shtick go... there are still a couple of you left
    Soon to be Metcalf, if not already. Good WR's are made by good QB's, tbh.

  5. #30
    Soon to be Metcalf, if not already. Good WR's are made by good QB's, tbh.
    There have been plenty of WRs that make QBs look good, too, though.

    Really, everything in the NFL is related, it isn't like other sports. There's very little major success in the NFL from individual brilliance, which is why it's funny when people try to rank NFL players using individual stats.

    It's also 70/30 in favor of coaching as the reason for success IMO(head coach and coordinators, system) compared to something like the NBA which is 10/90.

  6. #31
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    There have been plenty of WRs that make QBs look good, too, though.

    Really, everything in the NFL is related, it isn't like other sports. There's very little major success in the NFL from individual brilliance, which is why it's funny when people try to rank NFL players using individual stats.

    It's also 70/30 in favor of coaching as the reason for success IMO(head coach and coordinators, system) compared to something like the NBA which is 10/90.
    For example?

    The way I look at things, good accurate QB's can boost the catches and yds of average/below average WR's in a much more significant way than the other way around. You can build the perfect WR on a lab but that guy still won't be able to turn a ty QB into a decent one. Sure, he will be able to provide QB's with bigger windows, but if the QB is an inaccurate ty one, there isn't much to do, imho.

    "Skill" position players (other than QB's) are by far the most overrated ones. They are, imho, the less important players of all the players in an NFL roster.
    Last edited by DAF86; 01-07-2020 at 02:06 PM.

  7. #32
    Believe. i'm_still_beta's Avatar
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    There have been plenty of WRs that make QBs look good, too, though.

    Really, everything in the NFL is related, it isn't like other sports. There's very little major success in the NFL from individual brilliance, which is why it's funny when people try to rank NFL players using individual stats.

    It's also 70/30 in favor of coaching as the reason for success IMO(head coach and coordinators, system) compared to something like the NBA which is 10/90.
    The saddest part is that players are ranked by number of rings won in NBA or NFL.

  8. #33
    Veteran SpursforSix's Avatar
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    For example?

    The way I look at things, good accurate QB's can boost the catches and yds of average/below average WR's in a much more significant way than the other way around. You can build the perfect WR on a lab but that guy still won't be able to turn a ty QB into a decent one. Sure, he will be able to provide QB's with bigger windows, but if the QB is an inaccurate ty one, there isn't much to do, imho.

    "Skill" position players (other than QB's) are by far the most overrated ones. They are, imho, the less important players of all the players on an NFL roster.
    I agree with this for the most part. A ty QB is ty in part because he's inaccurate. A great WR might be able to make a ty QB look a little better. But probably not enough for someone to say he's a good QB.

    That being said, I do think the right system with multiple good receiving options can make a difference.

  9. #34
    Veteran SpursforSix's Avatar
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    The saddest part is that players are ranked by number of rings won in NBA or NFL.
    That's not true for the NFL for the most part. Maybe somewhat for a QB but not really for any other skill positions.

  10. #35
    Believe. i'm_still_beta's Avatar
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    For example?

    The way I look at things, good accurate QB's can boost the catches and yds of average/below average WR's in a much more significant way than the other way around. You can build the perfect WR on a lab but that guy still won't be able to turn a ty QB into a decent one. Sure, he will be able to provide QB's with bigger windows, but if the QB is an inaccurate ty one, there isn't much to do, imho.

    "Skill" position players (other than QB's) are by far the most overrated ones. They are, imho, the less important players of all the players on an NFL roster.
    Look at Green Bay for example. Why Rodgers stats and level of play declined after 2014? Because of receivers. They are some of slowest in the league, they can't get open. Rodgers stays in the pocket for too long, gets sacked or forced to throw the ball away. Brady in 2013 same story.

  11. #36
    Believe. i'm_still_beta's Avatar
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    That's not true for the NFL for the most part. Maybe somewhat for a QB but not really for any other skill positions.
    Yes, I should of put it more precisely. QBs only.

  12. #37
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    Look at Green Bay for example. Why Rodgers stats and level of play declined after 2014? Because of receivers. They are some of slowest in the league, they can't get open. Rodgers stays in the pocket for too long, gets sacked or forced to throw the ball away. Brady in 2013 same story.
    Rodgers and Brady were still putting up great numbers and were regarded as elite QB's. I'm not saying receivers don't make a difference, they just don't make a significant one. Meanwhile, for a WR, the difference between having a good QB and a ty one is all-pro vs irrelevance.

  13. #38
    5X ST MVP Spurtacular's Avatar
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    first there were people on this forum saying sidney rice was basically larry fitzgerald. then it became all golden tate. then it became all doug baldwin. now its all lockett

    maybe there's a common denominator, like that 7x pro bowl qb they have. 8 yards per attempt, only 5 INT's in over 500 attempts, to go with 31 passing TDs

    most of ST has already let this shtick go... there are still a couple of you left
    He's better than Cousins but not a top five QB. Philly's weak offense saved him some humiliation.

  14. #39
    Board Man Comes Home Clipper Nation's Avatar
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    Wilson is a top 3 QB in the league. I don't know why so many people hate to ackowledge this fact.
    Top 3 is still Mahomes, Rodgers, Brees, tbh, although this will probably be Brees' last season in that tier.

    I'll never understand why people are so impressed with Struggle managing the game on mega-stacked teams every year. He has it so much easier than the QBs he's compared to. For instance, he just led his offense to only 17 points in a road playoff game and they were never in any danger of losing. That's a luxury that actual franchise QBs don't usually have.

  15. #40
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    He's better than Cousins but not a top five QB. Philly's weak offense saved him some humiliation.
    cousins is in the average tier tbh... he's as good as the situation around him. he'll look good on a good team, bad on a bad team. he's not holding you back, but he's also not carrying a bad offense. he's in the same bucket as matt stafford, ryan tannehill, matt ryan, jared goff, derek carr, etc. you can order that group how you want, but they're average.

    wilson is absolutely top 5

  16. #41
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    Top 3 is still Mahomes, Rodgers, Brees, tbh, although this will probably be Brees' last season in that tier.

    I'll never understand why people are so impressed with Struggle managing the game on mega-stacked teams every year. He has it so much easier than the QBs he's compared to. For instance, he just led his offense to only 17 points in a road playoff game and they were never in any danger of losing. That's a luxury that actual franchise QBs don't usually have.
    How's this Seahawks team stacked? The defense is good but nothing more; and the offensive line is laughably bad. Running game is non-existent and if Wilson wasn't Wilson he would get sacked about 5 times per half.

  17. #42
    Board Man Comes Home Clipper Nation's Avatar
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    How's this Seahawks team stacked? The defense is good but nothing more; and the offensive line is laughably bad. Running game is non-existent and if Wilson wasn't Wilson he would get sacked about 5 times per half.
    The defense is stacked, they have Lockett and Metcalf, and they even brought back Beast Mode to carry him like the old days. No offensive line is ever going to look good with Struggle's style of play.

    If Struggle and Wentz switched places, the Seahawks would still be in the playoffs and the Eagles would have a top-5 draft pick with all the injuries they had.

  18. #43
    WICKED PISSAH!!!! Will Hunting's Avatar
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    Top 3 is still Mahomes, Rodgers, Brees, tbh, although this will probably be Brees' last season in that tier.

    I'll never understand why people are so impressed with Struggle managing the game on mega-stacked teams every year. He has it so much easier than the QBs he's compared to. For instance, he just led his offense to only 17 points in a road playoff game and they were never in any danger of losing. That's a luxury that actual franchise QBs don't usually have.
    I think its generous putting Rodgers in the top 3...if you want to talk game manager he was the quintessential game manager this year.

    Quite frankly the level of QB play across the league is the worst I can remember outside of Mahomes. There hasn’t been a young crop of QBs who come close to replacing the elite QB play we saw from Manning/Brady/Brees/Rodgers in their primes.

  19. #44
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
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    How's this Seahawks team stacked? The defense is good but nothing more; and the offensive line is laughably bad. Running game is non-existent and if Wilson wasn't Wilson he would get sacked about 5 times per half.
    Shtick Nation...

  20. #45
    5X ST MVP Spurtacular's Avatar
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    Top 3 is still Mahomes, Rodgers, Brees, tbh, although this will probably be Brees' last season in that tier.
    Mahomes, Rodgers, Jackson, tbh.

  21. #46
    5X ST MVP Spurtacular's Avatar
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    Quite frankly the level of QB play across the league is the worst I can remember outside of Mahomes. There hasn’t been a young crop of QBs who come close to replacing the elite QB play we saw from Manning/Brady/Brees/Rodgers in their primes.
    Makes guys like Watson look like superstars.

  22. #47
    CDs Nuts. resistanze's Avatar
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    @ Rodgers top 3. Based on what?

  23. #48
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    @ Rodgers top 3. Based on what?
    What I was telling HarlemHeat37, there's a lot of people who still rank him up there.

  24. #49
    5X ST MVP Spurtacular's Avatar
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    @ Rodgers top 3. Based on what?
    Dude is at 51-6 on back-to-back 4000 yard seasons with a sub par receiver corpse. What kind of ty Packers fan are you, anyhow?

  25. #50
    5X ST MVP Spurtacular's Avatar
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    Even Seattle was like, we ain't spending a 1st or 2nd rounder on this guy; we'll take our chances.


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