View Poll Results: Who is the better system QB?

Voters
5. You may not vote on this poll
  • Joe Montana

    3 60.00%
  • Tom Brady

    2 40.00%
Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 53
  1. #1
    Montana or Brady?

  2. #2
    Believe. i'm_still_beta's Avatar
    My Team
    New England Patriots
    Post Count
    886
    Montana. Brady is not system qb. Nice troll attempt btw.

  3. #3
    Enemy of the System Millennial_Messiah's Avatar
    My Team
    Dallas Cowboys
    Post Count
    24,579
    Montana. Brady is not system qb. Nice troll attempt btw.
    Brady would be flacco without Belichick.

  4. #4
    Damns (Given): 0 Blake's Avatar
    My Team
    Baltimore Ravens
    Post Count
    76,231
    How many offensive coordinators has each one gone thru? That pretty much would answer the question as to who is less of a system qb imo

  5. #5
    Veteran
    My Team
    San Francisco 49ers
    Post Count
    14,539
    Brady would be flacco without Belichick.
    Can't prove that.

  6. #6
    #TrustinVlade Divac Doesnt Flop's Avatar
    My Team
    Buffalo Bills
    Post Count
    83
    Belichick was medicore coach with Browns, 37-45. Brady's OCs have not had much success as HCs. He's only had 2 really high caliber targets - Gronk, Moss. His running game and O-lines have rarely been anything special. I hate the Pats but some of his haters are absurd.

  7. #7
    Believe. i'm_still_beta's Avatar
    My Team
    New England Patriots
    Post Count
    886
    Brady would be flacco without Belichick.
    Maybe he would've been out of the league after couple of seasons. As well as Belichick could've been just a great dc if he did't get lucky with Brady.

  8. #8
    Enemy of the System Millennial_Messiah's Avatar
    My Team
    Dallas Cowboys
    Post Count
    24,579
    Maybe he would've been out of the league after couple of seasons. As well as Belichick could've been just a great dc if he did't get lucky with Brady.
    Bledsoe was declining by then, but even so, they likely would have won the championships in '01, '03 and possibly '04 with Bledsoe starting as well if the initial injury didn't happen. That defense and secondary was an absolute monster, Belichick with that #1 defense was just ridiculous.

  9. #9
    #TrustinVlade Divac Doesnt Flop's Avatar
    My Team
    Buffalo Bills
    Post Count
    83
    Pats D wasn't that great in 01-02. Only really good in 03-04 in those early years. NE has only been outside the top 10 in pts once since Brady's been QB, usually in top 5, while their points production was below avg in 99-00.

  10. #10
    Believe. i'm_still_beta's Avatar
    My Team
    New England Patriots
    Post Count
    886
    Bledsoe was declining by then, but even so, they likely would have won the championships in '01, '03 and possibly '04 with Bledsoe starting as well if the initial injury didn't happen. That defense and secondary was an absolute monster, Belichick with that #1 defense was just ridiculous.
    With Bledsoe:
    2000:5-11
    2001:0-2
    Now insert Brady and ... you know the rest. Brady turned around Belichick head coaching career.
    Sometimes I just don't know what to say. I watch games and see Brady playing outstanding football, helping his team win games, sometimes stealing games. In short, I see elite qb. Agree to disagree.

  11. #11
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
    My Team
    New England Patriots
    Post Count
    22,310
    Belichick was medicore coach with Browns, 37-45. Brady's OCs have not had much success as HCs. He's only had 2 really high caliber targets - Gronk, Moss. His running game and O-lines have rarely been anything special. I hate the Pats but some of his haters are absurd.
    Belichick has a career record below .500 without Brady , the narrative that he made Brady makes no sense.

    All of the NFL's historically successful QBs played in a "system". There's a reason Peyton Manning won a few superbowls with elite defenses carrying him but the "let him call his own plays" system fell on its face in the playoffs.

    You win superbowls by executing your coaching staff's system to perfection as the QB, you don't win superbowls by calling your own plays and playing outside of any system.

  12. #12
    Enemy of the System Millennial_Messiah's Avatar
    My Team
    Dallas Cowboys
    Post Count
    24,579
    Yeah the idea that being a “system QB” is a bad thing is just stupid. Brady (6 rings), Montana (4 rings), Bradshaw (4 rings), Aikman (3 rings), Old Elway (2 rings), were all called system QB’s.

    Meanwhile Peyton (1.5 rings), Favre (1 ring), Rodgers (1 ring), Marino (0 rings), Young Elway (0 rings) are all “they are the system” QB’s, and most of them sucked under pressure too.
    Don't be a dip . Every ring counts, regardless of if you have Von Miller on your team or not. Brady had Seymour, Ty Law, Wilfork... it happens.


    Also, if Peyton loses part of the credit for his ring because he was replaced by Osweiler for a few weeks that year, then Brady loses part of one of his for being replaced by Jimmy G and ...wait for it... Jacoby Brissett () for 4 games. Also he only started 14 games in 2001. Can't have double standards, chump.

  13. #13
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
    My Team
    New England Patriots
    Post Count
    22,310
    Don't be a dip . Every ring counts, regardless of if you have Von Miller on your team or not. Brady had Seymour, Ty Law, Wilfork... it happens.


    Also, if Peyton loses part of the credit for his ring because he was replaced by Osweiler for a few weeks that year, then Brady loses part of one of his for being replaced by Jimmy G and ...wait for it... Jacoby Brissett () for 4 games. Also he only started 14 games in 2001. Can't have double standards, chump.
    Bull , you don't get to pull the every ring counts card when you're using the term "system QB" under the premise that Brady's rings don't count. If every ring counts as much as the next, Brady has 3x as many as Manning, that's it and that's all.

    Not to mention how intellectually dishonest you're being by saying Brady was "replaced" in 2016 when you know that wasn't the case. Also, in 2001, New England lost the two games he didn't start. Winning a superbowl as the starter for all 16 games is easier than taking over after an 0-2 start and winning a superbowl. He was the starter for all of their wins. Doesn't that make sense to you, or is your brain so dumb that you can't even get that?

    This is of course as opposed to 2015 Manning who was able to take a break for half the season while Osweiler went 5-2 and come back fresh for the playoffs to a defense that only needed 20 points a game to win (less any points it was able to score on its own)

  14. #14
    #TrustinVlade Divac Doesnt Flop's Avatar
    My Team
    Buffalo Bills
    Post Count
    83
    Granted, Seahawks did simply hand the Pats a gimme le on a silver platter with their dumb playcalling at the goal-line. Nonetheless, Brady has done far more with less than basically any other QB ever, and it's not even close.

  15. #15
    Enemy of the System Millennial_Messiah's Avatar
    My Team
    Dallas Cowboys
    Post Count
    24,579
    Bull , you don't get to pull the every ring counts card when you're using the term "system QB" under the premise that Brady's rings don't count. If every ring counts as much as the next, Brady has 3x as many as Manning, that's it and that's all.

    Not to mention how intellectually dishonest you're being by saying Brady was "replaced" in 2016 when you know that wasn't the case. Also, in 2001, New England lost the two games he didn't start. Winning a superbowl as the starter for all 16 games is easier than taking over after an 0-2 start and winning a superbowl. He was the starter for all of their wins. Doesn't that make sense to you, or is your brain so dumb that you can't even get that?

    This is of course as opposed to 2015 Manning who was able to take a break for half the season while Osweiler went 5-2 and come back fresh for the playoffs to a defense that only needed 20 points a game to win (less any points it was able to score on its own)
    Correct, but the last 2 paragraphs are hogwash.

    Injury and suspension both qualify, they are both unfortunate whether they are the fault of the player or not, but they all count. Nobody gave the Cowboys a pass in 2017, just saying.

    Brady 6
    Manning 2
    Aaron Rodgers 1

    that is all.

  16. #16
    Enemy of the System Millennial_Messiah's Avatar
    My Team
    Dallas Cowboys
    Post Count
    24,579
    Granted, Seahawks did simply hand the Pats a gimme le on a silver platter with their dumb playcalling at the goal-line.
    At least that was in a pressure situation, though it was objectively the wrong and poor analytics call, at least it's better than...

    ...calling deep drop-back pass plays from well inside comfortable field goal range, when trying to protect and solidify an 8 point lead with the ball and 3-4 minutes left on the clock.

    A field goal at any point on that drive and the game is over barring, not only the TD the other way but also some miracle (<5% chance) on an obvious onside kick attempt.

  17. #17
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
    My Team
    New England Patriots
    Post Count
    22,310
    Correct, but the last 2 paragraphs are hogwash.

    Injury and suspension both qualify, they are both unfortunate whether they are the fault of the player or not, but they all count. Nobody gave the Cowboys a pass in 2017, just saying.

    Brady 6
    Manning 2
    Aaron Rodgers 1

    that is all.
    Manning wasn't injured, he was benched on favor of Lossweiler because he was playing so tily. That's not the same thing as your backup playing because you're suspended.

    You can't seriously be this re ed.

  18. #18
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
    My Team
    New England Patriots
    Post Count
    22,310
    Granted, Seahawks did simply hand the Pats a gimme le on a silver platter with their dumb playcalling at the goal-line. Nonetheless, Brady has done far more with less than basically any other QB ever, and it's not even close.
    2014 was a gift while 2007 was the opposite when Asante Samuel lets a game winning interception slip through has hands and Rodney Harrison lets a scrub catch a pass with his helmet. 2011 was also a Welker drop away from another superbowl. It all evens out over time. Brady could just as easily have 9+ (2006, 2007, 2011, 2017, etc.) as he could only have <3 superbowls. He has 6.

    I'd get the argument if it were an Eli Manning type thing where he had 2 superbowl seasons that required every stroke of luck to break in his direction and hasn't ever sniffed a superbowl outside of that, but Brady's legitimately had 11 seasons that either resulted in a superbowl or were a few plays away from one (2001, 2003, 2004, 2006, 2007, 2011, 2014, 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018).
    Last edited by Will Hunting; 07-14-2019 at 09:27 AM.

  19. #19
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
    My Team
    New England Patriots
    Post Count
    22,310
    With Bledsoe:
    2000:5-11
    2001:0-2
    Now insert Brady and ... you know the rest. Brady turned around Belichick head coaching career.
    Sometimes I just don't know what to say. I watch games and see Brady playing outstanding football, helping his team win games, sometimes stealing games. In short, I see elite qb. Agree to disagree.
    Yeah I wouldn't agree with it but I'd at least understand the system QB argument if he put up mediocre stats like other "system QBs" such as Montana (or Manning when he threw 3 touchdowns and 7 interceptions during his first "superbowl run" ), but he's top 4 all time in career passing yards, passing touchdowns, passer rating, and he's done it only throwing interceptions on 1.8% of his pass attempts. Of all the other QBs who are near the top in purely quan ative stats like career passing TDs, the next best in terms of interception % is Drew Brees at 2.4%. There's no reasonable argument that Brady's career statistic, both quan ative and qualitative, aren't among the best.

    The "system" works because of how patient Brady is in taking what's given to him and executing it. You couldn't run the 8 minute, 15 play drive that they opened up with against the Chiefs with Aaron Rodgers, Favre or Peyton Manning. Rodgers or Favre would have fallen behind on downs at some point by chucking an unnecessary 40 yard heroball pass instead of taking the 5-7 yard checkdown that was wide open, and Manning would have ed it up by audibling out of the running plays that were gashing KC and going one dimensional. If the goal is winning games then comparing which QBs are best at playing heroball is a stupid way to look at it.

  20. #20
    Enemy of the System Millennial_Messiah's Avatar
    My Team
    Dallas Cowboys
    Post Count
    24,579
    2014 was a gift while 2007 was the opposite when Asante Samuel lets a game winning interception slip through has hands and Rodney Harrison lets a scrub catch a pass with his helmet. 2011 was also a Welker drop away from another superbowl. It all evens out over time. Brady could just as easily have 9+ (2006, 2007, 2011, 2017, etc.) as he could only have <3 superbowls. He has 6.

    I'd get the argument if it were an Eli Manning type thing where he had 2 superbowl seasons that required every stroke of luck to break in his direction and hasn't ever sniffed a superbowl outside of that, but Brady's legitimately had 11 seasons that either resulted in a superbowl or were a few plays away from one (2001, 2003, 2004, 2006, 2007, 2011, 2014, 2015, 2016, 2017, 2018).
    Granted, that Samuel play is always a bit overrated; it sailed a few feet over his head; he didn't "drop" it or let it go directly through his hands. The Tyree play is ridiculous, though.

  21. #21
    Enemy of the System Millennial_Messiah's Avatar
    My Team
    Dallas Cowboys
    Post Count
    24,579
    Manning wasn't injured, he was benched on favor of Lossweiler because he was playing so tily. That's not the same thing as your backup playing because you're suspended.

    You can't seriously be this re ed.
    Manning WAS injured, actually.

    But he still rang. A ring is a ring is a ring is a ring.

    Just be happy with 6>2.

  22. #22
    6X ST MVP
    My Team
    Minnesota Vikings
    Post Count
    81,091
    Brady is Matt Cassel Plus.

  23. #23
    6X ST MVP
    My Team
    Minnesota Vikings
    Post Count
    81,091
    With Bledsoe:
    2000:5-11
    2001:0-2
    Now insert Brady and ... you know the rest. Brady turned around Belichick head coaching career.
    Sometimes I just don't know what to say. I watch games and see Brady playing outstanding football, helping his team win games, sometimes stealing games. In short, I see elite qb. Agree to disagree.
    Pats were gonna make the playoffs with Bledsoe that season; they were a team that had figured it out. That was painfully obvious. That's why there was debate about who should be QB when Bledsoe returned from injury. You make it sound like Brady was an unquestioned savior. , some were even saying keep Bledsoe and trade flash in the pan Brady.

  24. #24
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
    My Team
    New England Patriots
    Post Count
    22,310
    Manning WAS injured, actually.
    https://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2015/11...brock-osweiler

    Denver Broncos quarterback Peyton Manning was benched and replaced with Brock Osweiler during the third quarter of Sunday's game against the Kansas City Chiefs. Manning did not appear to be injured.


    What was his injury exactly?

  25. #25
    Enemy of the System Millennial_Messiah's Avatar
    My Team
    Dallas Cowboys
    Post Count
    24,579
    Shoulder/arm IIRC.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •