Nuggets: Jamal Murray’s contract through 2025 is insane

[FkLA]

White is inconsistent breaking.down defenders and is primarily a pick - and - roll ballhandler, too. He also is passive on offense, is erratic from three - point range, maybe prone to minor injuries (plantar fasciitis is a concern especially when he's had it on both feet, I believe) and can't be the focal point on a NBA offense.

See, we can all play this stupid game.

Jamal Murray at this is point is better player than White and only a blind, idiot homer would argue otherwise.

Again, plenty of PG's have been "hidden" on defense since it is considered (by some) to be the least impactful defensive position. That doesn't change the fact that Murray has improved every year in the NBA, has been a starter/contributor way longer than White and is clearly better than White to this point.

But I'm not making the stupid ass claims that White is some unstoppable force on offense like you are about Murray, am I?

Murray is better at being a scorer than White (for now). That's it. Just like Kevin Martin was a better scorer than young Nephew. Just like Bargnani was a better scorer than Draymond. That's a completely different argument than who is a better basketball player though. It's White and it's not even close. Again, only a casual idiot that puts all the emphasis on scoring (no matter how inefficient or empty those points may be) would argue otherwise.

and shoots a dagger in the face of "blocked his shot everytime" White.

Nobody said every time idiot. But the fact remains that White blocked him or forced him to bail on shots midair (bc he was going to get stuffed) several times throughout the series. Not to mention the steals/forced TOs, some of them in crucial moments. A far cry from getting "lit up" throughout the 7 game series.

Murray will still get his point totals at times, because the fact of the matter is that great offense can beat great defense and he's a volume shooter. His 4th Qtr explosion in Game 2 is a great example. He was shooting like 20% through the first 7 quarters of the series but kept chucking and eventually caught fire. Some of those shots were just tough ass, well defended shots that happened to go in. None of that changes the fact, that in general, he struggles to get his shot off against White though.

[J_Paco]

Literally everything you said had nothing to do with my post. A shorter Mighty Mouse was a better player. Fact. Him being 6’4 doesn’t make him better than Mighty Mouse. They play a similar style of b-ball. Damon played off ball too. Or did you not know he played with Sabonis, who was also the best passing big man in the league.

You make this guy sound like an all star. He isn’t. He never will be. Dude also shot 2-6 against us. 8-23 and 7-18. So he didn’t dominate every game like you say he did. He shot 43% from the field in the regular season but yes you’re right, he can get his shot off against everybody

Never said the kid was a star, but he's better than White at this point. Also, Stoudamire started out in Toronto as the #1 option on a bad squad.

Anyway, my main point was that they don't play similarly at all not that Murray is or isn't better. He's bigger, stronger, has more range and can score in the post or off - ball. Damon was an iso - heavy scorer that used his advanced handles and speed to score.

[J_Paco]

But I'm not making the stupid ass claims that White is some unstoppable force on offense like you are about Murray, am I?

Murray is better at being a scorer than White (for now). That's it. Just like Kevin Martin was a better scorer than young Nephew. Just like Bargnani was a better scorer than Draymond. That's a completely different argument than who is a better basketball player though. It's White and it's not even close. Again, only a casual idiot that puts all the emphasis on scoring (no matter how inefficient or empty those points may be) would argue otherwise.



Nobody said every time idiot. But the fact remains that White blocked him or forced him to bail on shots midair (bc he was going to get stuffed) several times throughout the series. Not to mention the steals/forced TOs, some of them in crucial moments. A far cry from getting "lit up" throughout the 7 game series.

Murray will still get his point totals at times, because the fact of the matter is that great offense can beat great defense and he's a volume shooter. His 4th Qtr explosion in Game 2 is a great example. He was shooting like 20% through the first 7 quarters of the series but kept chucking and eventually caught fire. Some of those shots were just tough ass, well defended shots that happened to go in. None of that changes the fact, that in general, he struggles to get his shot off against White though.

Dude, White is a great defender and a solid playmaker but his defense isn't (so far) good enough to supercede Murray's offense. Both are still developing, but Murray is the second best player on a le contender. White is a role player (3rd or 4th best) that needs to prove himself on the offensive end.

Why do you continue to bring up some made up comparison of Kevin Martin and Kawhi Leonard? No one has or is comparing the two & neither of the guys were speaking are at that level, yet.

Why don't you just let White continue to improve and stop arguing that he's better than he actually is. Next you'll say he's better than Kemba Walker and should be starting on team USA, lolol.

[FkLA]

Dude, White is a great defender and a solid playmaker but his defense isn't (so far) good enough to supercede Murray's offense. Both are still developing, but Murray is the second best player on a le contender. White is a role player (3rd or 4th best) that needs to prove himself on the offensive end.

His defense isn't good enough to supercede Murray's offense? Says who? If you look at let's say RPM, White's is higher because his advantage in DRPM is bigger than Murray's advantage in ORPM. It's more like whatever advantage Murray has in scoring isn't enough to overcome the advantage White has in pretty much every other aspect of basketball. Once White averages 15+ PPG during the season, which he already did during the playoffs btw, this comparison will be laughable.

Also stop calling him the second best player on DEN like it's supposed to bolster your argument or something. If he is the second best player on a le contender (both of which are arguable), then he's a Jason Terry to Dirk type of second best player. Not a Curry, or a Manu, or a Kobe type of second best player.

Why do you continue to bring up some made up comparison of Kevin Martin and Kawhi Leonard? No one has or is comparing the two & neither of the guys were speaking are at that level, yet.

Because it's the same principle. I also brought up Bargnani and Draymond. Being a better scorer doesn't automatically make someone a better player.

Why don't you just let White continue to improve and stop arguing that he's better than he actually is. Next you'll say he's better than Kemba Walker and should be starting on team USA, lolol.

I'm not making any claims about White that aren't true. You're the one making stupid ass comments, actually.

-Murray lit the Spurs up for 7 games
-Murray is a borderline all-star
-Murray is way better than White
-Murray can get his shot off against almost anyone

[J_Paco]

His defense isn't good enough to supercede Murray's offense? Says who? If you look at let's say RPM, White's is higher because his advantage in DRPM is bigger than Murray's advantage in ORPM. It's more like whatever advantage Murray has in scoring isn't enough to overcome the advantage White has in pretty much every other aspect of basketball. Once White averages 15+ PPG during the season, which he already did during the playoffs btw, this comparison will be laughable.

Also stop calling him the second best player on DEN like it's supposed to bolster your argument or something. If he is the second best player on a le contender (both of which are arguable), then he's a Jason Terry to Dirk type of second best player. Not a Curry, or a Manu, or a Kobe type of second best player.



Because it's the same principle. I also brought up Bargnani and Draymond. Being a better scorer doesn't automatically make someone a better player.



I'm not making any claims about White that aren't true. You're the one making stupid ass comments, actually.

-Murray lit the Spurs up for 7 games
-Murray is a borderline all-star
-Murray is way better than White
-Murray can get his shot off against almost anyone

You really in your feelings about White, huh?

Back to the main point you made, White isn't a Super Max (or Max) contract player and only an idiot like you would suggest that.

Although, he's the superior defender his tentative play on offense holds him back (a 7 game playoff sample size doesn't mean ) from being better than Murray (to this point).

If he can be a better Malcolm Brogdon that would be huge for the Spurs.

And I love White and his game, but I won't start pumping him too soon. Especially, over an everyday starter (not based on cir stance/injury) that has improved every year of his career.

And again, none of those silly comparisons have anything to do with this current discussion. Except you attempting to change the subject to other players for some reason.

[FkLA]

You really in your feelings about White, huh?

Back to the main point you made, White isn't a Super Max (or Max) contract player and only an idiot like you would suggest that.

Although, he's the superior defender his tentative play on offense holds him back (a 7 game playoff sample size doesn't mean ) from being better than Murray (to this point).

You said "White's advantage on defense doesn't supercede Murray's advantage on offense". I bring up RPM (you can also look at BPM) which proves otherwise, and your response is that I'm in my feelings about White? True sign of someone that has no counter argument.

The supermax post was a joke. Do you know how it works? He's not even eligible for it. Not my fault you're an idiot that took it seriously.

If he can be a better Malcolm Brogdon that would be huge for the Spurs.

He will be a better Brogdon. And for the record, I'd take Brogdon over Murray too. Then when you consider their contracts (4/$85 vs 5/$170) it's a no brainer. Gary Harris > Murray too, imo.

And I love White and his game, but I won't start pumping him too soon. Especially, over an everyday starter (not based on cir stance/injury) that has improved every year of his career.

"everyday starter"
"2nd best player on a le contender"

I like how you keep trying to use dumb descriptors, that are completely dependent on cir stances, to make him seem better than he is.

You know if Murray had another promising PG on his team, that DEN was really high on, and had been drafted a year before him he wouldn't be the clear cut starter either. Mudiay has become a journeyman so he doesn't fit the bill. If he had DeRozan and LMA on his team he wouldn't be the 2nd best player. If he was on last year's Spurs squad in place of White the Spurs wouldn't have even been a playoff team much less a " le contender".

And again, none of those silly comparisons have anything to do with this current discussion. Except you attempting to change the subject to other players for some reason.

Actually, I've already explained to you like 3 times why those comparisons are being brought up. You're just choosing to ignore it just like you did my RPM and BPM comment.

[J_Paco]

You said "White's advantage on defense doesn't supercede Murray's advantage on offense". I bring up RPM (you can also look at BPM) which proves otherwise, and your response is that I'm in my feelings about White? True sign of someone that has no counter argument.

The supermax post was a joke. Do you know how it works? He's not even eligible for it. Not my fault you're an idiot that took it seriously.



He will be a better Brogdon. And for the record, I'd take Brogdon over Murray too. Then when you consider their contracts (4/$85 vs 5/$170) it's a no brainer. Gary Harris > Murray too, imo.



"everyday starter"
"2nd best player on a le contender"

I like how you keep trying to use dumb descriptors, that are completely dependent on cir stances, to make him seem better than he is.

You know if Murray had another promising PG on his team, that DEN was really high on, and had been drafted a year before him he wouldn't be the clear cut starter either. Mudiay has become a journeyman so he doesn't fit the bill. If he had DeRozan and LMA on his team he wouldn't be the 2nd best player. If he was on last year's Spurs squad in place of White the Spurs wouldn't have even been a playoff team much less a " le contender".



Actually, I've already explained to you like 3 times why those comparisons are being brought up. You're just choosing to ignore it just like you did my RPM and BPM comment.

Man, I'm over this stupid argument. White and Murray are close in most advanced metric except swapping offense for defense being their respective strengths.

I'll take the guy who is less efficient, but more confident and a better scorer for now.

I love White's game and hope he can become a great combo guard of the bench (6th man) or starting.

You are gonna continue with your pointless comparisons, parroting advanced metrics (which are close other RPM & BPM) and acting as is White is the best or 2nd best player on the Spurs.

[FkLA]

You're en led to your opinion, bro. Noone said otherwise. But I'm also en led to tell you how stupid that opinion is.

White >>> Murray

[FkLA]

There were days when he looked like the "best player on the floor for either team" according to JVG. He's probably just a homer too though.

[JohnnyMax]

Jamal Murray vs Derrick White (text below are links)

Head to Head

Player Comparison

[Down Under]

I'm taking White. He's a superior decision maker, his footwork is better, Murray is the better shooter at this point, but White hasn't had an opportunity to get any offensive rhythm with DD & LMA being such high usage guys.

[FkLA]

I'm taking White. He's a superior decision maker, his footwork is better, Murray is the better shooter at this point, but White hasn't had an opportunity to get any offensive rhythm with DD & LMA being such high usage guys.

You're a smart Aussie.

[J_Paco]

You're en led to your opinion, bro. Noone said otherwise. But I'm also en led to tell you how stupid that opinion is.

White >>> Murray

Dude, your thoughts are just opinion too.

I'll update this thread during the preseason top 100 lists and see where they both land (since Jeff Van Gundy's opinion is so valid).

[J_Paco]

Jamal Murray vs Derrick White (text below are links)

Head to Head

Player Comparison

Murray bested him in the regular season, playoffs, played more minutes and scored more. Their advanced metrics are close (except inverted for defense and offense), yet White is superior?

Just proves what damn fools some fans can be, man.

Side - note: I hope that one or two of White, Murray or Walker IV surpasses the Nuggets' foursome of Murray, Harris, Beasley & Morris. If they can that means the Spurs have better chance over taking them in the conference standings, but guys ain't there yet. That isn't meant as a slight to White or any of the three just giving the Nuggets backcourt respect (that they earned by whipping our ass last season).

[FkLA]

Why don't you update it throughout the season, fool? Maybe then you'll be smart enough to realize White is in the midst of a breakout year.

preseason lists