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  1. #51
    5. timvp's Avatar
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    Also, I don't care what the question is, Patty Mills is not the freaking answer. EVERYTHING that is wrong with Forbes in the SL is wrong with Mills. Have you been watching the way they have been going at Patty the minute he comes into the game? That was a no-name starter that ran through Forbes. There are no-name bench players running through Patty. Replacing Forbes with Patty solves the Forbes problem, but only by replacing it with the Mills problem.
    Pretty fair. Although I contend that Mills can defend point guards better than Forbes can.

    It's not a solution and not exactly optimal but it could be a Pop friendly maneuver that has a chance of actually happening -- and it'd make the Spurs better, IMO.

    They traded kawhi for Derozan and he’s the highest paid player
    Sunk cost fallacy.

  2. #52
    Klaw apalisoc_9's Avatar
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    Can't wait for OP's next groundbreaking article: "Pop should play Dejounte and Derrick Together"

    Queue my one positive quote about Forbes amidst my sea of calling Forbes a trash player for the last 2.5 years
    Its ing stupid. This dude comes back after a two year hiatus, regurigates an opinion that's popularized by who the sniffers calls eddgeloards but because it's him it all of a sudden a holy book.

    I mean these people have only recently realized Derozan is not a good fit and Kobyz has been saying that since 1832 and that is dumb as ..

    But he comes back..says the something and it all of a sudden..Derozan is a complete scrub

    yeah your're right. Its almost like most of these people dont watch games and rely soley on spurstalk articles.

  3. #53
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    Not sure why we are hoping to save the season. It’s time to retool and build around our young guys. As far as Forbes, if you put Walker in the starting lineup and give him enough leash to make mistakes, we would be considerably better on both ends. Will it happen, probably not but if we keep losing even Pop won’t stay the course. So go Mavs!

  4. #54
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    if forbes isnt starting,

    then u chuck him with the 2nd unit with wombat and belli?
    They shouldn't be playing either. They are a source of this teams defensive woes.

    Forbes/Mills/Belinelli are targeted by opponents on every possession. Their minutes need to reduced or they need to be dropped from rotation.

  5. #55
    5. timvp's Avatar
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    Its ing stupid. This dude comes back after a two year hiatus, regurigates an opinion that's popularized by who the sniffers calls eddgeloards but because it's him it all of a sudden a holy book.

    I mean these people have only recently realized Derozan is not a good fit and Kobyz has been saying that since 1832 and that is dumb as ..

    But he comes back..says the something and it all of a sudden..Derozan is a complete scrub

    yeah your're right. Its almost like most of these people dont watch games and rely soley on spurstalk articles.
    Trying too hard. You're not a real edgelord. Sorry.

  6. #56
    Veteran KobesAchilles's Avatar
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    Trying too hard. You're not a real edgelord. Sorry.
    Idk. ing ones aunt sounds edgy to me

  7. #57
    R.C. Deez Nuts. Mugen's Avatar
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    Its ing stupid. This dude comes back after a two year hiatus, regurigates an opinion that's popularized by who the sniffers calls eddgeloards but because it's him it all of a sudden a holy book.

    I mean these people have only recently realized Derozan is not a good fit and Kobyz has been saying that since 1832 and that is dumb as ..

    But he comes back..says the something and it all of a sudden..Derozan is a complete scrub

    yeah your're right. Its almost like most of these people dont watch games and rely soley on spurstalk articles.
    To be clear, I enjoy SniffVP's articles and having to rewatch and analyze Spurs games with this squad and writing articles on it is a task I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy.

    The "edgelords" have been right more times than they've been wrong during these last 5 years and it's hard to admit that your favorite HOF coach is well past his prime so I get it.

    The only issue I have is when the Sniffers say edgelords would be complaining about a lottery team with the young guys getting a lot of playing time which is re ed since a lot of people having been calling for a tank

    Tim's my guy and is probably the best Spurs analyst out there tbh. At least he's still answering for the old man's bull when other Sniffin' losers are nowhere to be found nowadays

  8. #58
    Klaw apalisoc_9's Avatar
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    To be clear, I enjoy SniffVP's articles and having to rewatch and analyze Spurs games with this squad and writing articles on it is a task I wouldn't wish on my worst enemy.

    The "edgelords" have been right more times than they've been wrong during these last 5 years and it's hard to admit that your favorite HOF coach is well past his prime so I get it.

    The only issue I have is when the Sniffers say edgelords would be complaining about a lottery team with the young guys getting a lot of playing time which is re ed since a lot of people having been calling for a tank

    Tim's my guy and is probably the best Spurs analyst out there tbh. At least he's still answering for the old man's bull when other Sniffin' losers are nowhere to be found nowadays
    I doubt this site survives without PATFO suckers.

  9. #59
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    Forbes is a reasonably paid bench guy (making only about half the lower MLE) being asked to play starter minutes in a line up with DeRozan, who doesn't spread the floor and doesn't play D... that's the big issue. A guy like Fournier can be hidden in a line up that winds up being pretty good defensively, but the Spurs just have too many undersized non-defenders piled up. The Spurs went from a Kawhi/Green Wing Stop duo to a Forbes/DeRozan Hole in the Middle scenario. But at least Forbes isn't paid 28 mil/year.

  10. #60
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    One of the main problems with this team for the last few years is having BOTH Forbes and Mills on the same roster. In my opinion it eliminates roster flexibility. Rotations would be much better if one of them were gone. Also not playing Marco along with that would really help.

  11. #61
    You Are Not Worthy ZeusWillJudge's Avatar
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    Pretty fair. Although I contend that Mills can defend point guards better than Forbes can.

    It's not a solution and not exactly optimal but it could be a Pop friendly maneuver that has a chance of actually happening -- and it'd make the Spurs better, IMO.

    Awww, I hate it when you're all reasonable-like. Okay, so maybe it's a marginal improvement. And, yeah, it's something that Pop might actually consider. That's a big deal, since a lot of these things have zero chance in the real world.

    So a slight improvement is probably all it would have taken to pull out a W in two of these games. The team would be 7-6 instead of 5-8. If the goal is to squeak into the playoffs, I guess that's a plan. I would like it a lot better if I thought it was a part of a larger plan.


    BTW - I was serious about signing Lemon as a third PG, and ditching one of the deadwood players at the end of the bench. He's good enough to handle enough PG minutes to allow Murray and White to play together. It would also be a marginal improvement, but if we're in "every little bit helps" mode, it would be worthwhile.

  12. #62
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    Timvp, who would you start and who would be your second unit of you're head coach of the Spurs? I'm actually curious.

    If the Spurs aren't going to trade Derozan or Aldridge, then Derozan needs to come of the bench along with Forbes IMO.

  13. #63
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    Timvp, who would you start and who would be your second unit of you're head coach of the Spurs? I'm actually curious.

    If the Spurs aren't going to trade Derozan or Aldridge, then Derozan needs to come of the bench along with Forbes IMO.
    This is what a lot of us have been saying for quite some time. Without a three point shot or any defensive awareness, Derozan doesn't have the skills required to start in the modern NBA. He's a Lou Williams tier player that had delusions of grandeur about being a star. If he whines about being relegated to the bench, him. He's gone at the end of the year anyway.

  14. #64
    The Dude minds DPG21920's Avatar
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    Pretty fair. Although I contend that Mills can defend point guards better than Forbes can.

    It's not a solution and not exactly optimal but it could be a Pop friendly maneuver that has a chance of actually happening -- and it'd make the Spurs better, IMO.



    Sunk cost fallacy.
    Sure, I know it’s a sunk cost, but it illustrates the over-arching point. On any team, regardless of trade, you normally expect your “most talented” and often highest paid player to be a leader. They deserve the most blame, unless they don’t like when Timmy was balling but had bad role players.

  15. #65
    Derrick White fanboy FkLA's Avatar
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    Jesus christ what a damning article. Someone send that to Pop.

    It's mostly on Pop for overusing him though. Especially when there's a much better option, that was ready to have a breakout year, on the bench playing 23 mpg. You'd also have to imagine that atleast defensively, Forbes would have a little more success going up against second units. But then he'd be paired with Wombat so the best outcome would probably be if he just gets thrown into a DeRozan trade, tbh.

  16. #66
    The Dude minds DPG21920's Avatar
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    Not to derail the thread - but honest question timvp: How much stock do you put in leadership? I know talent and ability trumps all, but how many issues on this team are caused by lack of leadership and accountability by the best players (LMA and DeRozan)?

  17. #67
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    Jesus christ what a damning article. Someone send that to Pop.

    It's mostly on Pop for overusing him though. Especially when there's a much better option, that was ready to have a breakout year, on the bench playing 23 mpg. You'd also have to imagine that atleast defensively, Forbes would have a little more success going up against second units. But then he'd be paired with Wombat so the best outcome would probably be if he just gets thrown into a DeRozan trade, tbh.
    This isn't a bad idea. He's about to be way overpaid this summer anyway and Spurs always have a knack for finding these one dimensional Roger Mason/Gary Neal clones. That's probably why they drafted Weatherspoon this year, to be Forbes replacement when he inevitably asks for too much of a raise.

  18. #68
    5. timvp's Avatar
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    Timvp, who would you start and who would be your second unit of you're head coach of the Spurs? I'm actually curious.
    Murray, White, DeRozan, Gay and Aldridge. Gay is the hardest call of the bunch but, IMO, if you have two isolation scorers in DeRozan and Aldridge, you might as well have a third in Gay instead of trying to space the court as has been done traditionally.

  19. #69
    You have no idea UZER's Avatar
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    I’ve said before in other threads...

    If you still don’t think Pop has gone senile, consider this - He came to the conclusion that having one short Patty Mills on the team wasn’t enough, so he created another carbon copy and is starting Bryn and playing him major minutes. I mean, you can’t make this stuff up.

  20. #70
    Veteran r0drig0lac's Avatar
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    They shouldn't be playing either. They are a source of this teams defensive woes.

    Forbes/Mills/Belinelli are targeted by opponents on every possession. Their minutes need to reduced or they need to be dropped from rotation.

  21. #71
    5. timvp's Avatar
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    I’ve said before in other threads...

    If you still don’t think Pop has gone senile, consider this - He came to the conclusion that having one short Patty Mills on the team wasn’t enough, so he created another carbon copy and is starting Bryn and playing him major minutes. I mean, you can’t make this stuff up.
    Finding a real NBA player out of the scrap heap of undrafted free agents is no small feat. That in and of itself is worthy of praise.

    If you want to say Forbes is being used incorrectly, that's fair. It's also fair to say he should be traded in an effort to balance out the roster. But to criticize the Spurs for finding a quality UFA? Misguided.

  22. #72
    Veteran 8FOR!3's Avatar
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    Murray, White, DeRozan, Gay and Aldridge. Gay is the hardest call of the bunch but, IMO, if you have two isolation scorers in DeRozan and Aldridge, you might as well have a third in Gay instead of trying to space the court as has been done traditionally.
    How would you run the bench unit? Would you just start Murray/White together but essentially have one of them on the court at all times or would you do something different for backup PG?

  23. #73
    5. timvp's Avatar
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    How would you run the bench unit? Would you just start Murray/White together but essentially have one of them on the court at all times or would you do something different for backup PG?
    It'd be admittedly tough while Murray is on his minutes restriction ... but still doable.

    Play Murray the first 6 minutes of every quarter (as the doctors have prescribed).

    Play White the first 8 minutes of the 1st and 3rd quarters and the last 8 minutes of the 2nd and 4th.

    Play Mills behind Murray and Forbes behind White in the first half and then switch at halftime.

    Results would be...

    -Murray plays 24 minutes during his minutes restriction.
    -White plays 32 minutes.
    -Mills and Forbes play 20 minutes each.
    -Mills would only need to run point guard for the final four minutes of the 1st and 3rd quarters.

    It'd obviously become easier when there are no minutes restrictions to account for but I'll accept Mills playing 8 minutes a game at PG if the result is Murray and White playing 18 minutes together.

  24. #74
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    People agreeing with the OP but still giving him a hard time for being "too late"...

    When your simple mind only has two categories (either you're a "sniffer" or not), you'll find a way to make everything fit into those boxes.

  25. #75
    Spurs Sage Russ's Avatar
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    Not to derail the thread - but honest question timvp: How much stock do you put in leadership? I know talent and ability trumps all, but how many issues on this team are caused by lack of leadership and accountability by the best players (LMA and DeRozan)?
    Bingo. When your two best players are DeRozan and Aldridge leadership is always going to be the elephant in the room.

    That's why Murray could be so important going forward (and, yes, even Forbes because he is clutch).

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