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  1. #76
    Drive for Five! ambchang's Avatar
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    You do realize this exact same argument applies to Bird, right? Those Celtics teams were stacked.
    Compared to the compe ion? No. The lakers and arguably the 6ers were more stacked.

  2. #77
    Drive for Five! ambchang's Avatar
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    For the mental midgets:
    Stats metrics and rings only matter for Timmy D but in every other debate its MVP and romaticiized bull ...

    PER: Magic 24.11 (14th) vs 23.50 (19th) Close but Magic wins here
    Playoff PER: Magic 22.9 (19th) vs. Bird 21.41 (29th)

    Win shares: Magic 155.79 (21st) vs Bird 145.83 (24th)
    Playoffs Win shares: Magic 32.63 (5th ) vs. Bird (11th) (BTW Magic only trails Lebron, Jordan, Duncan and Kareem here ...just sayin')

    Win/48: Magic .2249 (9th) vs .2032 (22nd)
    Playoffs Win/48: Magic .2078 (5th) vs .1731 (31st)

    Offensive Rating Magic 120.79 (4th) vs Bird 114.53 (65th)
    Defensive Rating Magic (196) Bird (63rd) Bird destroys him here the one advanced metric that favors Bird clearly

    Rings: Magic 6 vs. Bird 3* (including of 3 of 4 head to head with that NCAA le game ass whuppin')

    MVPs: Bird 3 vs. Magic 3 (Bird got three straight props though MVP's dont mean as much to me but when Bird and to lessor degree Magic got them ... they meant more)

    Finals MVPs: Magic 3 Bird

    All NBA: Magic 10x Bird 10x

    You want more?

    SI all time: Magic 6th, Bird 7th
    ESPN NBA rank: Magic 4th Bird 6th

    But let me throw you a few bones if we go to TRADITional COUNTING STATS whuch have been discredited around here ....

    Career stats:

    career pts: Bird 34th Magic 81st
    Career Reb: Bird 54th Magic 138th
    career asts: Magic 5th Bird 42nd
    Career stls: Magic 21st Bird 36th

    Playoff Points: Bird 12th Magic 15th
    Playoff Rebounds: Bird 1tth Magic 18th
    Playoff Assists: Magic 1st Bird 6th
    Playoff Steals Magic 4th Bird 8th

    So In some career numbers including FT shooting and 3 pt shooting Bird is withput a doubt better than magic but rings, metrics (save defensive rating), experrts all point to Magic ... but hey lets not let facts get in the way of romantic fiction ...
    Bird dropped off like a rock after the injury. He was pummeling magic before it. As for playoffs stats, much easier to go through Denver Nuggets and Dallas mavericks than 76ers and Detroit Pistons. I’m not even counting the bulls and the cavs which are basically as good as any team magic faced in the west other than maybe the intact rockets and Dallas.

  3. #78
    Veteran Killakobe81's Avatar
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    Bird dropped off like a rock after the injury. He was pummeling magic before it. As for playoffs stats, much easier to go through Denver Nuggets and Dallas mavericks than 76ers and Detroit Pistons. Iím not even counting the bulls and the cavs which are basically as good as any team magic faced in the west other than maybe the intact rockets and Dallas.
    Injury excuses... You do realize a career does factor injuries? If your argument is that Bird at his peak was better than magic, fine I concede that peak Bird... like say, peak Hakeem or Shaq being better than Duncan, I agree.

    But all the same metrics that Say Duncan is better than Shaq, Dream or Achilles all point to Magic having a better career than Bird.
    Spur fan doesn't get to use metrics to rightfully support the claim that Timmy D is underrated, then ignore them, to prop Bird over Magic. The numbers are relatively close but Magic's advanced metrics clearly outrank Bird in those very metrics and I won't let the hypocrisy stand... It's Spur fan acting like the fanboy here, pointing to awards and leadership narrative and ignoring facts.

    Peak Bird was a top 5 player career Bird is probably not top 10 more like 15th if you just look at the metrics but I still have him in my top 10 as the second greatest SF..
    Last edited by Killakobe81; 12-29-2019 at 09:34 AM.

  4. #79
    ICE CREAM ???!!! lefty's Avatar
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    Harden is Better than Magic tbh

  5. #80
    Veteran Killakobe81's Avatar
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    Harden is Better than Magic tbh
    As a SG or pure scorer?
    Absolutely...

  6. #81
    ICE CREAM ???!!! lefty's Avatar
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    As a SG or pure scorer?
    Absolutely...
    As a player tbh

  7. #82
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
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    Lou Williams is better than Larry Bird and Magic combined, tbh

  8. #83
    Drive for Five! ambchang's Avatar
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    Injury excuses... You do realize a career does factor injuries? If your argument is that Bird at his peak was better than magic, fine I concede that peak Bird... like say, peak Hakeem or Shaq being better than Duncan, I agree.

    But all the same metrics that Say Duncan is better than Shaq, Dream or Achilles all point to Magic having a better career than Bird.
    Spur fan doesn't get to use metrics to rightfully support the claim that Timmy D is underrated, then ignore them, to prop Bird over Magic. The numbers are relatively close but Magic's advanced metrics clearly outrank Bird in those very metrics and I won't let the hypocrisy stand... It's Spur fan acting like the fanboy here, pointing to awards and leadership narrative and ignoring facts.

    Peak Bird was a top 5 player career Bird is probably not top 10 more like 15th if you just look at the metrics but I still have him in my top 10 as the second greatest SF..
    Peak duncan was better than peak Hakeem. Those two years were over exaggerated. Peak shaq was like two three years max. Peak Duncan was close to ten years. Whereas peak bird was six years and peak magic was about the same. Just that magic had a longer career because the western conference was so weak.

    Peak bird was as good as peak Jordan shaq and Lebron. But both Jordan and Lebron had way longer careers.

  9. #84
    Veteran Killakobe81's Avatar
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    Peak duncan was better than peak Hakeem. Those two years were over exaggerated. Peak shaq was like two three years max. Peak Duncan was close to ten years. Whereas peak bird was six years and peak magic was about the same. Just that magic had a longer career because the western conference was so weak.

    Peak bird was as good as peak Jordan shaq and Lebron. But both Jordan and Lebron had way longer careers.
    Longer peak doesn't mean greater peak, just greater career, like magic over Bird
    Last edited by Killakobe81; 12-30-2019 at 04:35 AM.

  10. #85
    Veteran Killakobe81's Avatar
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    Damn, my boy nay stepson Luka took a hard fall...
    Last edited by Killakobe81; 12-29-2019 at 10:53 PM.

  11. #86
    Best Believe. Ball Buster's Avatar
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    This might sound callous, why did Luka not even try to protect his head as he was falling down on that play? Even if there was contact with Dwight. He did this the last time Dallas played the Lakers. The guys always smacking his head against the floor. Protect your noggin dude.

  12. #87
    Veteran Killakobe81's Avatar
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    Not his best game but Luka still a balla...
    My stepson gonna take out on next team they play...
    Oh special soutout to my nephew Caruso I'm adopting all the good (Caruso) to great (Luka) on whiteboys on my all mistress team the squad is Steph Russ Giannis Luka Ingram with Ingles and Kleber off the bench.
    Those only non Lakers I root for...

  13. #88
    Veteran LkrFan's Avatar
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    As a player tbh

  14. #89
    Veteran LkrFan's Avatar
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    Peak duncan was better than peak Hakeem. Those two years were over exaggerated. Peak shaq was like two three years max. Peak Duncan was close to ten years. Whereas peak bird was six years and peak magic was about the same. Just that magic had a longer career because the western conference was so weak.

    Peak bird was as good as peak Jordan shaq and Lebron. But both Jordan and Lebron had way longer careers.
    The difference between Duncan and Dream is Gregory Popovich. Give Dream Pop for 20 years and I guarantee you he wins more than 4.61 rangs.

    Dream >>

  15. #90
    Believe.
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    I feel like Luka going to be hated in the NBA if he continues his flopping. Second straight game where he hooked his arm on the defender creating contact.

  16. #91
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    Compared to the compe ion? No. The lakers and arguably the 6ers were more stacked.
    Again, your bias is showing.

    What years were the 76ers more stacked than the Lakers or Celts during the 80s? NEVER.

    The Fo, Fi, Fo 6ers were the best of the lot, and had a past-prime Doc and Moses Malone. There are a lot of familiar names like your Doug Collins and Darryl Dawkins and Mo Cheeks, but they were just really good pieces. Lakers and Celts boasted 3+ HOFers basically every year of the 80's. Most in their primes. Magic, Worthy, Kareem. Bird, McHale, Chief. Their benches had better pieces throughout the decade than those early-mid 80s 76er teams. The Celts had HoFers on the bench like Tiny Archibald and Dennis Johnson and the Lakers had the best bench/role players for the majority of the decade. AC Green, Byron Scott, Michael Cooper, Bob McAdo (HOF), Norm Nixon, Kurt Rambis, Mychal Thompson...it's ing hard to find a team that surrounded their stars with better castmates than the Lakers did in the 80s.

    You're wrong, Chang.

  17. #92
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    The difference between Duncan and Dream is Gregory Popovich. Give Dream Pop for 20 years and I guarantee you he wins more than 4.61 rangs.

    Dream >>
    Little Juanito, unsure of how long you're home pinche squid, but put that plastic bottle tequila down, son.

    If Dream had Pop, they'd only have the two rings, but the Magic would have won 2 games against them and Barkley would have had to admit that Steve Francis and Cuttino Mobley were better than him in front of the whole team his retirement season.

  18. #93
    Veteran LkrFan's Avatar
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    Little Juanito, unsure of how long you're home pinche squid, but put that plastic bottle tequila down, son.

    If Dream had Pop, they'd only have the two rings, but the Magic would have won 2 games against them and Barkley would have had to admit that Steve Francis and Cuttino Mobley were better than him in front of the whole team his retirement season.

  19. #94
    Veteran LkrFan's Avatar
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    I feel like Luka going to be hated in the NBA if he continues his flopping. Second straight game where he hooked his arm on the defender creating contact.
    Saw it live. That was Hardenesque. I hope he gets fined.

    Also, he was flopping when he was fouled by Dwert. Probably concussed? I know his back will be sore in the morning along with a headache.

  20. #95
    Veteran LkrFan's Avatar
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    Luka is the Real Deal Holyfield tho. The Lakers scouted him well. He didn't play nearly as well as he did the last time. He shot 5/14, 0-6 3ptrs, 7 dimes and 6 turnovers.

    Avery Bradley sucks offensively but he was a big reason Luka shot poorly. If not for 9-9 freebies (via superstar calls), Luka might have single digits tonight.

    uva defensive effort by the Lakers tonight

  21. #96
    5X ST MVP Spurtacular's Avatar
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    SI all time: Magic 6th, Bird 7th
    ESPN NBA rank: Magic 4th Bird 6th
    All the corporations pull this . That way they don't have to deal with the obvious reality that Bird was better than Jordan because they've created a false narrative roadblock.

    As it is, nobody thinks to say Magic is better than Jordan. That should be your first clue that it's bull , bro.

  22. #97
    Veteran Killakobe81's Avatar
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    Because even Bird/Magic knows that MJ was better...

  23. #98
    Drive for Five! ambchang's Avatar
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    Longer peak doesn't mean greater peak, just greater career, like magic over Bird
    Agreee but birds peak was just as long as magics. He just dropped off dramatically because of his back.

  24. #99
    Drive for Five! ambchang's Avatar
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    The difference between Duncan and Dream is Gregory Popovich. Give Dream Pop for 20 years and I guarantee you he wins more than 4.61 rangs.

    Dream >>

    Rudy t changed how the league used the three ball.

  25. #100
    Drive for Five! ambchang's Avatar
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    Again, your bias is showing.

    What years were the 76ers more stacked than the Lakers or Celts during the 80s? NEVER.

    The Fo, Fi, Fo 6ers were the best of the lot, and had a past-prime Doc and Moses Malone. There are a lot of familiar names like your Doug Collins and Darryl Dawkins and Mo Cheeks, but they were just really good pieces. Lakers and Celts boasted 3+ HOFers basically every year of the 80's. Most in their primes. Magic, Worthy, Kareem. Bird, McHale, Chief. Their benches had better pieces throughout the decade than those early-mid 80s 76er teams. The Celts had HoFers on the bench like Tiny Archibald and Dennis Johnson and the Lakers had the best bench/role players for the majority of the decade. AC Green, Byron Scott, Michael Cooper, Bob McAdo (HOF), Norm Nixon, Kurt Rambis, Mychal Thompson...it's ing hard to find a team that surrounded their stars with better castmates than the Lakers did in the 80s.

    You're wrong, Chang.
    Not the lakers but comparable to the Celtics. Moses, dr J, cheeks, jones, toney. I’d say is comparable to bird, mchale parish Johnson

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