Draymond didn't do any of those things and the Warriors didn't suffer in anyway from '14-'19.
Draymond was averaging a triple double around the time, so he was certainly scoring, tbh... I've called him an overrated player plenty of times, and I still think he is a product of Curry, and if you look now, that they don't have KD, Curry and Klay to score the ball, he sucks and his team sucks.
My response was to your shot towards Dennis Rodman. If a scrub like Draymond could succeed in this era I have hard time believing a guy like Rodman would struggle.
I get where you're going, I'm just saying Draymond is a bench talent at best. He simply struck lightning in a bottle having Curry around who needed 3 people to guard him, and then having guys like Klay or KD hitting from everywhere.
I don't hate Rodman or anybody else from the 90s, but those guys couldn't even make a pass to save their lives. The difference is back then you wouldn't need 3 guys on Curry, you would put one of those thugs to elbow and trip him all night and do nothing else. That just wasn't basketball, IMVHO.
It's actually kinda hilarious to still hear antiquated stuff like "the Spurs need an enforcer"... what for, foul out in 3 mins? The Spurs need solid shooters and people that can put the ball in the basket. Unfortunately, we've opted for the mid range jumper, an awful shot in modern basketball, and our 3 point specialists are average at best in a good day.
Draymond really never approached averaging a triple double. Only in 16 was that a remote possibility.
2013–14 Golden State 82 12 21.9 .407 .333 .667 5.0 1.9 1.2 .9 6.2 2014–15† Golden State 79 79 31.5 .443 .337 .660 8.2 3.7 1.6 1.3 11.7 2015–16 Golden State 81 81 34.7 .490 .388 .696 9.5 7.4 1.5 1.4 14.0 2016–17† Golden State 76 76 32.5 .418 .308 .709 7.9 7.0 2.0* 1.4 10.2 2017–18† Golden State 70 70 32.7 .454 .301 .775 7.6 7.3 1.4 1.3 11.0 2018–19 Golden State 66 66 31.3 .445 .285 .692 7.3 6.9 1.4 1.1 7.4
He had 3 good months, Bill. Let's leave it there. I had to argue with assholes here on my Raymond thread for like a week because he fluked into that .
That said, and as much as I hate to say this, he's a much more complete player than Rodman ever was. This guy even attempts to shoot 3s, even if he's not very good at it. Rodman might've been a rebounding machine (wasn't, but let's pretend he was), but couldn't hit the side of a barn.
I will say few things. Assists in today's league are very overrated. Stat guys easily give them out versus back in the day. For example I didn't see Draymond dissing out amazing passes for the most part. They were just simple hand offs to Klay,Curry,Durant and he easily got to 7 a game. They were normal passes that anybody could throw. Out of the current bigs in the league I would say only Jokic,Simmons,Gasol,Griffin, and other euro bigs are great passers. When I mean by great passers they can actually set up and run a play to get guys a bucket.
As for 90's ball being nothing but dirty goon defense I would say that's not 100 percent true. You had dirty teams during that era in the Knicks,Pacers,Heat,Jazz. All 4 of those teams contained thugs that were out just to hurt you. Don't remember seeing any other teams out of those top 4 that played dirty basketball. The rest of the league was doing hand checking but it wasn't dirty and you had bumping but not to the extreme mugging every game like you are saying.
The defense really picked up after '95. From '95-'07 you had strong defenses but weak offense. I can't really say all of that was dirty. For example the '99 Spurs were a defensive juggernaut but they weren't a dirty team. Guys like Jerome Kersey,Ellie,Perdue were physical players but not goons. The second 3 peat bulls outside of Rodman were not dirty but were a great defensive team. Only championship team during that stretch I felt was dirty was the Kobe-Shaq Lakers. Kobe,Fisher,Horry,Fox,Shaq all committed cheap shots and dirty fouls during their le run.
Curry to a large degree even in this era is overrated. He didn't become a superstar player until Klay Thompson became an all-star player. Once Klay reach that level then it became hard to guard Curry due to the spacing. Notice how Curry is reluctant to comeback from a minor hand injury. The reason for it is because he knows he will get exposed out there. He was in the 4 games he played this year averaging 20 points on overall 40 percent shooting and 24 percent 3 point shooting.
I don't miss the dirty flagrant WWE fouling from that era but at the same time whats going on in the league with Harden and company isn't basketball either. It's gotten to the extreme where the offensive player has too much leeway where if you even graze them slightly it's a foul. That's not fun to watch. I still play basketball a few times a week and I will say this nobody would loves to play by NBA rules out on the streets. Everybody hates it when guys call touch fouls.
I, too, wish DeRozan played in the 90s. That way, he wouldn't be on the Spurs right now ...
Imagine Boban in the 80s
I mostly agree, but there were more teams than those, tbh... ie: the Bad Boys Pistons in the early 90s was another team. Malone in the Jazz. The damning part is that they were all mostly successful teams.
Some fans even complained when hand checking rules were added, when in reality, it rewarded talent over thuggery.
I was kid during the 90's but don't really remember any dirty teams outside of Pacers/Knicks/Jazz/Heat/Lakers. I didn't start watching until '92 so I missed out on the dirty bad boys Pistons. Anyways the bad boy Pistons and Shaq-Kobe Lakers were the only teams that won les by playing dirty thug basketball but those other teams that attempted it failed in the playoffs.
I will say this in '04 I felt the Lakers got away with thuggery after the Spurs went up 2-0 on them. I will never forget the media screaming that the Lakers needed to lay the wood on Tony and Manu. Malone-Shaq-Payton-Kobe ratcheted up the level of dirtiness by 10x the next 4 games. Didn't respect what they did and how the refs allowed them to get away with murder. If that series was reffed by today's rules then the Spurs would have beaten them in 5. So your argument about thuggery over talent definitely works in that scenario.
We all wish wed wake up in the 90's and atleast have championships to look forward to
Me too Demar, me too
He would average 35 ppg in the 90s
No zone
Mid Range
Demar has had the better career by a big margin.
Stackhouse put up 29ppg that one season on 24fga. In 40mpg. Shooting 40% from the field. Yikes.
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