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  1. #76
    Bosshog in the cut djohn2oo8's Avatar
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    In Houston's case, none of that matters at all. Of course allegations should be thoroughly checked out and guilty parties penalized accordingly. But none of that changes anything for Houston. It certainly doesn't absolve them from anything. Their guilt doesn't change with an increased number of violators.

    How many people speed on the freeway? Only a fraction get pulled over and ticketed. If you get pulled over for speeding, cry that the officer should only give you a speeding ticket if he pulls over every other car that was speeding and tickets them too. See how that works out.

    You just want your misery shared. That has nothing to do with the idea that a line must be and has been drawn.
    What I want to see, is since the precedent has been set, if anyone else is caught besides Houston and Boston, are the penalties the same across the board as in long suspensions? And what does MLB do then if it’s widespread

  2. #77
    Bosshog in the cut djohn2oo8's Avatar
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    And No it’s not about sharing misery. Had Manfred never said in front the cameras that he wasn’t worried about any other teams, before completing an investigation, then okay. Right after he says it Boston pops up. It makes it look like it’s a rabbit hole he doesn’t want to big go down to do a true investigation. Even if there’s nothing to be found, you can’t make that comment so early in the game.

  3. #78
    faggy opinion + certainty Mark Celibate's Avatar
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    The entire 2000 Yankees team was juiced. Should they give theirs back as well?
    The difference is that everybody juiced then, so they didn't really gain a compe ive advantage. I'll concede that you can make an argument the Astros keep their le if it's found out that many more teams did this. I'm just picking apart your "you can't quantify it, so you can't disqualify them" argument which is full of and doesn't hold up in situations where somebody is caught cheating.

  4. #79
    Believe.
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    Not gonna bull -

    Been an Astros fan forever - my dad (RIP) and my brother and I followed them all our lives and my dad went to his grave NEVER seeing the Astros win the world series. Doing the yardwork with the astros on the radio and then having some chilled watermelon (me and my bro- and my dad a cold brew) in a texas summer scorching night under the stars -
    are still special memories-

    When the Astros finally did get a le- I was ecstatic and felt my dad's presence when they won it -


    This just s on everything - and well -

    even though I am an Astros fan forever-

    them - this is . The le is meaningless - and I wont pretend or defend or whatever -


    THEY GOT CAUGHT. They are ing disgraceful and should be banned forever - it -

    they should actually lose the entire franchise - move them to ing Encino - I don't give a .

  5. #80
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    Not gonna bull -

    Been an Astros fan forever - my dad (RIP) and my brother and I followed them all our lives and my dad went to his grave NEVER seeing the Astros win the world series. Doing the yardwork with the astros on the radio and then having some chilled watermelon (me and my bro- and my dad a cold brew) in a texas summer scorching night under the stars -
    are still special memories-

    When the Astros finally did get a le- I was ecstatic and felt my dad's presence when they won it -


    This just s on everything - and well -

    even though I am an Astros fan forever-

    them - this is . The le is meaningless - and I wont pretend or defend or whatever -


    THEY GOT CAUGHT. They are ing disgraceful and should be banned forever - it -

    they should actually lose the entire franchise - move them to ing Encino - I don't give a .
    That's extreme.

  6. #81
    Bosshog in the cut djohn2oo8's Avatar
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    That's extreme.
    Way extreme

  7. #82
    Bosshog in the cut djohn2oo8's Avatar
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    Alex Cora fired

  8. #83
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    Good move. The only move really.

  9. #84
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    Looks like it was mutual. Respect


  10. #85
    Believe.
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    That's extreme.

    Disagree.

    Gotta call it like it is. They disgraced the game - they need to be dismantled and removed from the city of Houston forever - that would be the proper and fair and just thing to do.

    Or strip the entire organization - force the owner to sell/resign ownership - at the VERY LEAST.

    Start new with a brand new expansion club if they want to stay in Houston.

  11. #86
    I'll tumble for ya Chris Fall's Avatar
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    I agree with Crane losing ownership. It’s been pretty much agreed from the investigation that both Hinch and Luhnow were NOT active participants in the cheating, but were suspended and ultimately fired for passively allowing it to happen and not doing more to stop it. Then should it not follow that the owner SHOULD have also known and also be punished for not taking action or for not being more actively involved in his team’s operations so he would have known so he could have stopped it?

    Billionaire Boys Club mentality. Manfred protecting one of his bosses, making sure he publicly absolved Crane of any wrongdoing or blame. Crane gets a $5 million slap on the wrist, which to a billionaire is like a dinner and bar tab for a weekend. He gets to throw Hinch and Luhnow under the bus. And he still gets to enjoy the World Series win with no wrinkles on his clothes as he watches from his ivory tower.

    If not forced to sell, something more tangible of a reprimand should have been placed on Crane, like the one year suspension from the team that Hinch and Luhnow originally got.

  12. #87
    Veteran weebo's Avatar
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    Btw, Baseball doesn’t exactly have a clean history either considering a whole decade called the steroid era. The 2000 Yankees were juiced to high . MLB looked left on that for a long time until they couldn’t. That was literally an era where everyone was doing it. now, many players wear gloves in the field that are outside the legal dimensions. Baseball looks left on that. Everyone looks for an advantage and that’s not debatable. How far they go with it is a different story.

    Rob Manfred said this was only relegated to the Astros, until it wasn’t. He wasn’t expecting Boston to be implicated. Now you have rumors involving the Yankees, Dodgers and Diamondbacks all doing the same thing. It’s a league wide issue. It doesn’t stop with those 5 teams.
    Bro, everyone cheats and probably in the same way...only reason it became news was because the Stros are a top 5 team with talent and you had a player in Fiers with an axe to grind...people are naive if they think cheating isn't rampant in professional sports...its a multimillon dollar industry and winners get paid...this sign stealing didn't start with the Stros...Cora and Beltran must have learned some of this while on other teams...funny how you never heard from other organizations about any of this before if it was so scandalous...maybe because they have their own skeletons?

  13. #88
    Bosshog in the cut djohn2oo8's Avatar
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    I agree with Crane losing ownership. It’s been pretty much agreed from the investigation that both Hinch and Luhnow were NOT active participants in the cheating, but were suspended and ultimately fired for passively allowing it to happen and not doing more to stop it. Then should it not follow that the owner SHOULD have also known and also be punished for not taking action or for not being more actively involved in his team’s operations so he would have known so he could have stopped it?

    Billionaire Boys Club mentality. Manfred protecting one of his bosses, making sure he publicly absolved Crane of any wrongdoing or blame. Crane gets a $5 million slap on the wrist, which to a billionaire is like a dinner and bar tab for a weekend. He gets to throw Hinch and Luhnow under the bus. And he still gets to enjoy the World Series win with no wrinkles on his clothes as he watches from his ivory tower.

    If not forced to sell, something more tangible of a reprimand should have been placed on Crane, like the one year suspension from the team that Hinch and Luhnow originally got.
    Yet the article and report said he didn’t know. Can’t punish someone for what they allegedly didn’t know

  14. #89
    Veteran weebo's Avatar
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    Also Mono, I’m you don’t remember back in the day about the Rumors of Arlington stadium
    https://www.espn.com/mlb/news/story?id=2147225
    1993 rangers roster was roided out ...from canseco, palmer, palmero to ryan ...bottom line all teams cheat in one way or another

  15. #90
    adolis is altuve’s father monosylab1k's Avatar
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    Boiled down, it’s:: Astros got caught, Rangers didn’t.

    Rangers > Cheatstros

  16. #91
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    Boiled down, it’s:: Astros got caught, Rangers didn’t.

    Rangers > Cheatstros
    If not for the trash banging, they would have gotten away with it.

    That's what launched this whole mess.

  17. #92
    Bosshog in the cut djohn2oo8's Avatar
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    Boiled down, it’s:: Astros got caught, Rangers didn’t.

    Rangers > Cheatstros
    Not with 400 less wins. But you can kiss the ring though.

    Oh and Rangers did get popped for PED use. Couldn’t cheat their way to though
    Last edited by djohn2oo8; 01-15-2020 at 11:59 AM.

  18. #93
    Bosshog in the cut djohn2oo8's Avatar
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    If not for the trash banging, they would have gotten away with it.

    That's what launched this whole mess.
    Naw it was Fiers salty that he was cut.

  19. #94
    adolis is altuve’s father monosylab1k's Avatar
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    Not with 400 less wins. But you can kiss the ring though.

    Oh and Rangers did get popped for PED use. Couldn’t cheat their way to though
    Ken Caminiti, Jeff Bagwell, etc, the glass houses thing.

    Also equating PED’s to the biggest baseball scandal since the Black Sox

  20. #95
    Bosshog in the cut djohn2oo8's Avatar
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    Ken Caminiti, Jeff Bagwell, etc, the glass houses thing.

    Also equating PED’s to the biggest baseball scandal since the Black Sox
    Rodriguez, both of them, Hamilton, caught. Not Bagwell.


    Astros > Rangers

  21. #96
    Bosshog in the cut djohn2oo8's Avatar
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    Lest we forget. Your own city celebrated our . In your own Backyard. In the Rangers backyard.

    So know your place and remember it.

  22. #97
    adolis is altuve’s father monosylab1k's Avatar
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    Rodriguez, both of them, Hamilton, caught. Not Bagwell.


    Astros > Rangers
    Deflecting from your team being the biggest cheaters in the history of the sport

    Rangers > Cheatstros

  23. #98
    adolis is altuve’s father monosylab1k's Avatar
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  24. #99
    Bosshog in the cut djohn2oo8's Avatar
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    Around the league, everyone noticed the twitch in Pearce Chiles’ leg. It was odd enough that Chiles, the third-base coach for the Philadelphia Phillies, convulsed only at the team’s home park, Baker Bowl, where he stood in the same spot, atop a puddle in the coach’s box that was there even when it didn’t rain. On Sept. 17, 1900, in the first game of a doubleheader, Cincinnati Redsshortstop Tommy Corcoran tired of the tic and decided to do something about it.
    Corcoran scurried toward Chiles and started kicking at the ground, harder and harder, enough that the livid Phillies’ groundskeeper told him to stop. Corcoran didn’t, and eventually he hit paydirt: a wooden box. He pulled the top off it and found a mess of wires. His su ions were dead-on: Someone in the stadium was stealing opponents’ signals and feeding them to Chiles through electrical pulses into the box. One buzz for a fastball, two jolts for a curveball, three twitches for a changeup. Chiles then verbally fed the pitch to the batter.

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/sports....053859138.html

  25. #100
    Bosshog in the cut djohn2oo8's Avatar
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    Sign stealing using electronics has been around since the 1900s. Cry more.

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