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  1. #18076
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
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    I figured you to be pretty intelligent and then you come out with this broken leg ? Doctors around the world have noted the decrease in cancer patients seen the last 3 months. Elective surgeries way down as well. Tons of people avoided going to hospitals for treatment for various diseases because they were scared to even go to a hospital.
    How does that work out with the fact that only certain regions are seeing a e in cases though? Wouldn't "doctors around the world" also mean " es around the world" too?

  2. #18077
    wrong about pizzagate TSA's Avatar
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    That actually makes sense, at this point most cases COVID are being spread by people who are asymptomatic. The deadly strands of the virus are obviously a lot tougher to spread.
    ???

  3. #18078
    wrong about pizzagate TSA's Avatar
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    How does that work out with the fact that only certain regions are seeing a e in cases though? Wouldn't "doctors around the world" also mean " es around the world" too?
    You’d have to look at each place’s severity of each outbreak to gauge reluctance to go to the hospital for non-Covid.

  4. #18079
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    If we were certain that this worked like smallpox and you could develop herd immunity Iíd be all for it - Iím worried that itís more like the flu where once you get it youíll have elevated antibodies for a few months but then you can get it again. Itís not clear if herd immunity is even feasible.
    If that's the case then there is no vaccine coming to save the day. His larger point would still stand though which is the other side of this pandemic looks the same for everyone, every where in the world. I think his quote was the other side isn't red or blue, it's all covid color.

    I do enjoy reading the debate over which party the virus likes/dislikes more though.

  5. #18080
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    How does that work out with the fact that only certain regions are seeing a e in cases though? Wouldn't "doctors around the world" also mean " es around the world" too?
    It depends on counting cases. It depends on who has opened hospitals for electives. It depends on if those hospitals test. It depends on the media. Too many variables. You dont even have e defined

  6. #18081
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
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    You’d have to look at each place’s severity of each outbreak to gauge reluctance to go to the hospital for non-Covid.
    Have you? Is that on the Blaze article?

  7. #18082
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    Have you? Is that on the Blaze article?
    You can also look at hospital census discharge and new hospitalization based on media craze

  8. #18083
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    Is there much reason to think the virus would spread in anything other than large waves without lockdowns? While the percentage of recovered + dead is low the growth in infected should be nearly exponential, shouldn't it? And there is little reason to believe a large percentage of the population say in San Antonio has been infected when NYC was only at 20-25% estimated infection rate a month ago after the virus had ripped through that city. Is there much reason to expect we're not all going to end up like New York or Detroit at some point this year? I'd be interested in seeing this interview you're talking about with Osterholm today. Where did you hear it?
    He was on Chris Wallace this morning.

    Past epidemics never had an strictly exponential infection rate. They shoot up and then level off or subside completely (or almost) only to return again. No one knows why, just various theories. This is a biology problem not a math problem.

    This is why I haven't been talking seriously on this topic anymore. The other side of this looks the same for Sweden and Denmark, New York and Texas. Only a vaccine can change that and it would be a miracle if we got one before 2022. Especially considering we've never been able to make a vaccine for the other 4 endemic HCoV's.

  9. #18084
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
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    He was on Chris Wallace this morning.

    Past epidemics never had an strictly exponential infection rate. They shoot up and then level off or subside completely (or almost) only to return again. No one knows why, just various theories. This is a biology problem not a math problem.

    This is why I haven't been talking seriously on this topic anymore. The other side of this looks the same for Sweden and Denmark, New York and Texas. Only a vaccine can change that and it would be a miracle if we got one before 2022. Especially considering we've never been able to make a vaccine for the other 4 endemic HCoV's.
    Osterholm is good, and he warned us about not taking this seriously, which we didn't to begin with.

    About vaccines, I was reading that the issue now is that with the virus both mutating and leveling out in most of the world, it gets difficult to find good samples of patients to test them on.

  10. #18085
    R.C. Drunkford TimDunkem's Avatar
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    He was on Chris Wallace this morning.

    Past epidemics never had an strictly exponential infection rate. They shoot up and then level off or subside completely (or almost) only to return again. No one knows why, just various theories. This is a biology problem not a math problem.

    This is why I haven't been talking seriously on this topic anymore. The other side of this looks the same for Sweden and Denmark, New York and Texas. Only a vaccine can change that and it would be a miracle if we got one before 2022. Especially considering we've never been able to make a vaccine for the other 4 endemic HCoV's.
    Basically how I've felt overall lately as well, tbh. This is a sandwich we're all going to have to take a bite out of at one point or another. Just have to deal with it the best we can.

  11. #18086
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    And this makes sense. As we open up and people become a bit less careful, we'll see infections upticks here and there, which hopefully we can control, now that we have tests more readily available.

    There's really no need for mental gymnastics (not talking about you) about elective surgeries or the like to come to that conclusion.
    That's not what he was talking about. Viruses have a life all their own, we don't know why.

    That's not to say we can't affect it by our actions but it will still have a life cycle of it's own regardless of what we do. Basically we all have the same destination locked in our gps, different places may take slightly different paths but in the end we all end up in the same place.

  12. #18087
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
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    That's not what he was talking about. Viruses have a life all their own, we don't know why.

    That's not to say we can't affect it by our actions but it will still have a life cycle of it's own regardless of what we do. Basically we all have the same destination locked in our gps, different places may take slightly different paths but in the end we all end up in the same place.
    What you quoted wasn't about Osterholm, but rationalizing why we will see es in infections without looking for obscure reasons. This is in the short term.

    Long term, I agree we're going to be dealing with this thing as it comes.

  13. #18088
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    Osterholm is good, and he warned us about not taking this seriously, which we didn't to begin with.

    About vaccines, I was reading that the issue now is that with the virus both mutating and leveling out in most of the world, it gets difficult to find good samples of patients to test them on.
    I think you still don't get it. This is the 5th endemic human coronavirus, in other words the 5th time in human history a coronavirus has successfully mutated to us. So if you strip away trying to blame someone for that you'll see that was a brief period of time in China where maybe, maybe, this virus could have been stopped but once it was out of the bag it was just out and that's that.

    Who knows maybe Hillary would have shut down all borders in December but then what. It's just prolonging the inevitable. The virus will burn through the population globally. Slow, fast, matters not. The other side is the same for everyone.

  14. #18089
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
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    He was on Chris Wallace this morning.

    Past epidemics never had an strictly exponential infection rate. They shoot up and then level off or subside completely (or almost) only to return again. No one knows why, just various theories. This is a biology problem not a math problem.
    I just meant exponential early on when infection rates are low, like how Italy and NYC had near perfect exponential death counts in March before the time delay from lockdowns really kicked in for the death rates. That even an absolute best case scenario of a vaccine distributed to the most at risk of our general population by the end of the year would be unlikely to save us from massive death counts.

    This is why I haven't been talking seriously on this topic anymore. The other side of this looks the same for Sweden and Denmark, New York and Texas. Only a vaccine can change that and it would be a miracle if we got one before 2022. Especially considering we've never been able to make a vaccine for the other 4 endemic HCoV's.
    I had to stop watching the national news because I got sick of the bull hope they keep feeding viewers about vaccines and cures. I guess saying sucks isn't good for ratings.

  15. #18090
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    Basically how I've felt overall lately as well, tbh. This is a sandwich we're all going to have to take a bite out of at one point or another. Just have to deal with it the best we can.
    That's basically it. We'll probably make it as bad as possible because it seems we are either so scared we shut down in a completely unsustainable way or we are just saying it.

  16. #18091
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    I've never had hopes for a vaccine, tbh.

    Be a shame if common vitamins and simple dietary changes reduced bad outcomes. That's not being communicated.

  17. #18092
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
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    I've never had hopes for a vaccine, tbh.

    Be a shame if common vitamins and simple dietary changes reduced bad outcomes. That's not being communicated.
    We're so ing addicted to sugar in the US that I don't think the communication would matter tbh.

  18. #18093
    Veteran DarrinS's Avatar
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    We're so ing addicted to sugar in the US that I don't think the communication would matter tbh.
    I got my mom to start taking vitamin D, in mass quan ies. The evidence is overwhelming at this point.


    Your point about sugar is spot on. Especially, if it's high fructose corn syrup. If you want to die, eat that.

  19. #18094
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
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    I think you still don't get it. This is the 5th endemic human coronavirus, in other words the 5th time in human history a coronavirus has successfully mutated to us. So if you strip away trying to blame someone for that you'll see that was a brief period of time in China where maybe, maybe, this virus could have been stopped but once it was out of the bag it was just out and that's that.

    Who knows maybe Hillary would have shut down all borders in December but then what. It's just prolonging the inevitable. The virus will burn through the population globally. Slow, fast, matters not. The other side is the same for everyone.
    This is ridiculous. It *is* the 5th endemic, it's not the 1st or 2nd. We had experts like him telling us what we needed to do to contain it. He never said we were going to stop it, but things we could do to make the situation manageable.

    Frankly, it's baffling how you have to come up with excuses for this at this point. Nobody is blaming anybody for not having a cure, or stopping the virus in it's track, it's never been about that.

  20. #18095
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    I've never had hopes for a vaccine, tbh.

    Be a shame if common vitamins and simple dietary changes reduced bad outcomes. That's not being communicated.
    I doubt that. It's all genetics imo. It's ust the way mother nature is. You get the wrong genetic card you get the axe. She's a cruel who thinks mercy is overrated.

  21. #18096
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    I doubt that. It's all genetics imo. It's ust the way mother nature is. You get the wrong genetic card you get the axe. She's a cruel who thinks mercy is overrated.
    Lol no.

  22. #18097
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
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    I got my mom to start taking vitamin D, in mass quan ies. The evidence is overwhelming at this point.


    Your point about sugar is spot on. Especially, if it's high fructose corn syrup. If you want to die, eat that.
    I hope you're not talking about the way Thread gives his mother the Vitamin D tbh.

  23. #18098
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    This is ridiculous. It *is* the 5th endemic, it's not the 1st or 2nd.
    I said it was the 5th so idk wtf your talking about

    We had experts like him telling us what we needed to do to contain it.
    I think it was on a Joe Rogan interview very early on where he said flat out we have never been able to stop these types of respiratory viruses. So be more specific, "experts like him"????

    Frankly, it's baffling how you have to come up with excuses for this at this point. Nobody is blaming anybody for not having a cure, or stopping the virus in it's track, it's never been about that.
    Just more vague nonsense that's been going on for 100's of pages.
    Last edited by SnakeBoy; 06-14-2020 at 11:24 PM.

  24. #18099
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    Well take your flintstones multivitamin then. You'll be alright.

  25. #18100
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    Hindsight expert will be a career description by the end of this pandemic
    Called it

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