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  1. #51
    Veteran RC_Drunkford's Avatar
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    In other words: We got a Flopovich problem and he got to go

  2. #52
    Veteran R. DeMurre's Avatar
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    Hard to say what the real root cause is, but if Kawhi has spoken off the record to multiple people and that word has spread, I could see it having a huge influence. One of the issues that I see is Pop doesn't seem to treat players equally at all anymore. The take on the Spurs before was that Pop would yell at Duncan or Parker just as easily as any bench player-- he was the quick-tempered drill sergeant, but at least he was consistent. Now there seems to be a much greater variance in treatment. The excuse for Lonnie Walker getting yanked a number of times this year has been defensive mistakes, but in those same games Forbes and DeRozan are getting lots of minutes with obvious glaring defensive shortcomings. Anyone watching and seeing Forbes get more minutes than White or Murray has to think, "hmmm, this doesn't seem to make sense." Also, trading Bertans-- who was an advanced stats standout-- seems odd and, again, Pop for some reason seemed to be very impatient with his defensive mistakes while overlooking those of other players. There are too many odd decisions to suss out at this point and I'm sure lots of players and agents are taking notice.

  3. #53
    You have no idea UZER's Avatar
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    Hard to say what the real root cause is, but if Kawhi has spoken off the record to multiple people and that word has spread, I could see it having a huge influence. One of the issues that I see is Pop doesn't seem to treat players equally at all anymore. The take on the Spurs before was that Pop would yell at Duncan or Parker just as easily as any bench player-- he was the quick-tempered drill sergeant, but at least he was consistent. Now there seems to be a much greater variance in treatment. The excuse for Lonnie Walker getting yanked a number of times this year has been defensive mistakes, but in those same games Forbes and DeRozan are getting lots of minutes with obvious glaring defensive shortcomings. Anyone watching and seeing Forbes get more minutes than White or Murray has to think, "hmmm, this doesn't seem to make sense." Also, trading Bertans-- who was an advanced stats standout-- seems odd and, again, Pop for some reason seemed to be very impatient with his defensive mistakes while overlooking those of other players. There are too many odd decisions to suss out at this point and I'm sure lots of players and agents are taking notice.
    Not treating players equally is one thing. But with Pop, I agree, so much of what he does doesn’t even make basketball sense. Nobody knows what the he is trying to do anymore. It sure as isnt putting the best team on the floor to try to win the most games. At least players could at least respect that. But with Pop, his coaching has literally become a joke.

    Everything is a chore and exhausting at this point. I mean, something as simple as having a 2nd in command on the bench turns into a big mess of no one in the entire organization, media, and arena knowing who the he’ll was in charge after he got kicked out. Then they pull the “committee” bs, then Pop comes out later and says it was Timmy. Really? Timmy? One month into his first coaching job? What a joke it’s all become.
    Last edited by UZER; 02-18-2020 at 01:52 AM.

  4. #54
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    Total BS post. So only winning teams have no image problem?

    Every team has former players that about the time they played their. Shaq likely ed about the time he played with the Lakers.

  5. #55
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    Yet they have no problem living in a bunch of other non glamour markets. If you think the stigma surrounding this one is because of the city, as opposed to the organization, you're delusional.
    Which ones?

    Let's see your list.

  6. #56
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    Which ones?

    Let's see your list.
    You're so predictable, I can literally see the responses coming multiple posts in advance.

    As I alluded to, the list was every other franchise because there is no other one with this stigma.

    Burying their proverbial head in the sand and pretending it doesn't exist isn't going to change it.

  7. #57
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    You're so predictable, I can literally see the responses coming multiple posts in advance.

    As I alluded to, the list was every other franchise because there is no other one with this stigma.

    Burying their proverbial head in the sand and pretending it doesn't exist isn't going to change it.
    every other franchise is a paradise for young black American free agents.

    OK.

  8. #58
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    every other franchise is a paradise for young black American free agents.

    OK.
    Right on cue, it's twisting words time.

    Find me another franchise with a laundry list of players, of similar background, who have this many complaints, slights, etc.

  9. #59
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    Right on cue, it's twisting words time.

    Find me another franchise with a laundry list of players, of similar background, who have this many complaints, slights, etc.
    now you're making demands. Right on cue.

    I'll just say every other team like you did and accuse you of having your head in the sand. There.

  10. #60
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    now you're making demands. Right on cue.

    I'll just say every other team like you did and accuse you of having your head in the sand. There.
    Ah, so it's a question when it comes from you, but a demand when it comes from me.

    The difference is, I named several players in the original post, while you haven't named a single team.

  11. #61
    Chopper Ed Helicopter Jones's Avatar
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    This topic is ground-breaking. I'm glad it has its own thread.

  12. #62
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    Ah, so it's a question when it comes from you, but a demand when it comes from me.
    OK, question. Now you can't whine about that anymore.

    The difference is, I named several players in the original post, while you haven't named a single team.
    You named Spurs.

    I asked about all the other paradise teams.

    Well?

  13. #63
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    Could Pop be bitter with the front office for trading away Bertans and therefore have been not playing Carroll out of spite? If you think about it, RC isn't technically the GM anymore. Or could Carroll have walked in not willing to adapt and Pop didn't want to deal with it? Either way, this team needs a youth infusion at coach and GM. Blow it up and start fresh with the roster as well. Free agents don't want to come to SA. The only selling point will be to draft some great players and build around that again. Right now, this team is just unwatchable and the organization is just bad. It's not Knicks bad just yet but it's becoming an embarrassment.

  14. #64
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    OK, question. Now you can't whine about that anymore.

    You named Spurs.

    I asked about all the other paradise teams.

    Well?


    I didn't say anything about paradise. I just said, no one else has a public laundry list of a similar type saying similar things.

  15. #65
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    I didn't say anything about paradise. I just said, no one else has a public laundry list of a similar type saying similar things.
    I'm sure you follow not other team on a granular level.

    Pop's going to be gone soon one way or another. Relax.

  16. #66
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    I'm sure you follow not other team on a granular level.

    Pop's going to be gone soon one way or another. Relax.
    Aka you concede. As if you'd know what I follow.

    He won't be the president of basketball operations/head coach for much longer, but he'll probably stay on as a senior advisor who has far more influence and say than any of them should because of his stature. If that's the case, it'll more or less be business as usual.

  17. #67
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    Aka you concede. As if you'd know what I follow.
    aka you concede. You can't say you follow any other team like this.

    He won't be the president of basketball operations/head coach for much longer, but he'll probably stay on as a senior advisor who has far more influence and say than any of them should because of his stature. If that's the case, it'll more or less be business as usual.
    Then he'll die. Be happy.

  18. #68
    Veteran J_Paco's Avatar
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    For the most part, those organizations don't have a certain types of players they seek/avoid and you don't hear the same types of things coming from former players of them, apologist.

    Until this organization is willing to be introspective and realize they need to change certain things about the way they operate, they're not going anywhere.
    Sure, just like the other 20+ teams that "aren't going anywhere" without elite talent or good coaching.

    You, like always, have to use the eventual down turn of the organization to whine about the team's culture, supposed "image problems, not sucking off major talent and Pop being a "senile old man."

  19. #69
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    Sure, just like the other 20+ teams that "aren't going anywhere" without elite talent or good coaching.

    You, like always, have to use the eventual down turn of the organization to whine about the team's culture, supposed "image problems, not sucking off major talent and Pop being a "senile old man."
    The other 20+ don't have the stigma this one has nor have they created the amount of self inflicted wounds this one has in recent years, apologist.

    They can either play the game within' the game and give themselves the best possible odds or they can decimate them by pretending they're smarter than everyone else because they lucked into the greatest franchise player/core of all-time, who allowed them to live a utopian existence for 19 years.

  20. #70
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    It's been starting them in the face for years and it's getting progressively worse. At first, the likes of Horry, Jackson, Blair, could be brushed off as malcontents who either wanted to extent their stay or play. Then it was whatever the happened with Dedmon, then it was some of Simmons' comments, then the Aldridge fiasco, the S bag saga, heck even subtle shots and/or frustration from the likes of Green, Anderson, Bertans, Murray, Walker and finally, the bizarre Carroll situation.

    Most of these players have a two very obvious things in common: They're black American and millennial. That encompasses the majority of the league, particularly the upper crust.

    They clearly perceive of this organization as being at best a dictatorship, replete with militaristic rigidity and a lack of freedom (many have referenced this) and at worst a plantation mentality.

    These are the people they need to repair their image with, especially being in a non glamour market. They need to create an environment conducive to them, which means loosening the reigns on court and off court, promoting the individual, both publicly and privately.
    I gad no idea Bertans was a black or an American, thanks for pointing it out.

  21. #71
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
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    The other 20+ don't have the stigma this one has nor have they created the amount of self inflicted wounds this one has in recent years, apologist.

    They can either play the game within' the game and give themselves the best possible odds or they can decimate them by pretending they're smarter than everyone else because they lucked into the greatest franchise player/core of all-time, who allowed them to live a utopian existence for 19 years.
    You say that like it was a bad thing.

    Do you just nurture your narratives every day like a bonsai plants or newborn calves?

  22. #72
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    Anybody remembers when Demarre Carroll left the Raptors? Same pattern. He didn't want to adapt and critized the Raptors.
    https://www.sbnation.com/2017/7/20/1...de-dwane-casey
    https://tipofthetower.com/2017/07/19...rust-comments/

    Spurs shouldn't have signed him.

  23. #73
    Lol Crews jjktkk's Avatar
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    The other 20+ don't have the stigma this one has nor have they created the amount of self inflicted wounds this one has in recent years, apologist.

    They can either play the game within' the game and give themselves the best possible odds or they can decimate them by pretending they're smarter than everyone else because they lucked into the greatest franchise player/core of all-time, who allowed them to live a utopian existence for 19 years.
    Still stupid after all these years.

  24. #74
    Veteran Maddog's Avatar
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    Anybody remembers when Demarre Carroll left the Raptors? Same pattern. He didn't want to adapt and critized the Raptors.
    https://www.sbnation.com/2017/7/20/1...de-dwane-casey
    https://tipofthetower.com/2017/07/19...rust-comments/

    Spurs shouldn't have signed him.
    Yeah
    But I also think he was signed for "insurance purposes" at the 3/4 slot
    In all honesty his contract even with the 3rd year added (only a small amount guaranteed) was not bad. With the emergence (yes that is an exaggeration) of Lyles he's not needed.

  25. #75
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    I gad no idea Bertans was a black or an American, thanks for pointing it out.

    Most of these players have a two very obvious things in common: They're black American and millennial. That encompasses the majority of the league, particularly the upper crust.





    You say that like it was a bad thing.

    Do you just nurture your narratives every day like a bonsai plants or newborn calves?

    The point is, those days are over, they're now in the real NBA and they are off to a lousy start.


    Still stupid after all these years.


    Stupid is your gods performance in recent years, apologist.

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