The D, well...it...sucks

[Dejounte]

Don't be surprised if they do extend DeMar because for all your so-called "flexibility" all we have to show for ever having cap space is LMA; no one wants to sign here. And it was up in the air if they would have ever won with him AND Kawhi. Also, with how bad PATFO ed up with DJ over Brogdon and last years draft, I am not expecting much with that 11th pick, but we'll see.

Yes, we will see.

[gambit1990]

How about OKC? Are they really in a better spot than us? Are they competing for a championship anytime soon? Especially after Paul breaks down?

lol, yeah, okc is really in a better spot than the spurs. they're in a fantastic spot tbh.

[gambit1990]

watched the first half of the last scrimmage... it's not just the defense that sucks.

even if the spurs had la... the play on the court is just so disjointed and they have no rhythm or chemistry. it's about as bad as it gets.

and pop's bad rotations don't help anything either.

[TD 21]

You're more concerned abt the offense? We aren't losing because we aren't scoring enough.

Now granted, we aren't efficient behind the 3pt line but the departure of DeMar alone being replaced with a more efficient 3pt shooter changes that with just one player swap. There are always vets on the open market to fill those kinds of voids too to bolster the team 3pt shooting.

And our offense ought to be behind our defense but it's not. We were in the top half of the league in offensive efficiency.

Long story short, I'm quite deflated about the future. Most of these guys have been in the system for a couple or three years. Pop and the Spurs system is known for their defensive systems and their player development, especially on the defensive side, first and foremost. So it all adds up to make me feel like the future is simply not bright on D.

In other words, I think we be ed.

They obviously need big wings in the worst way, but the offense is far more concerning going forward. I doubt all of the youth will remain intact for long, but most either already excel defensively or have the tools to at least not be liabilities. Offensively, there's no lead play maker and possibly scorer.

We have a 20 year old prototypical PF that should be able to score inside and outside for yrs to come as well as a SG (PG) in Walker and White that's showing an early ability to put up points.

And we have our highest draft pick in 21 years coming up this year. That should net us another young scorer because college players in the lottery tend to be better scorers than defenders.

I'm not worried about the offense much at all.

In fact the last several years have shown the trend line of increasing offensive efficiency compared to a decreasing defensive efficiency.

Samanic is a project who's ceiling as a scorer is more than likely of the ancillary variety and White doesn't have the mentality to be a go-to scorer. We'll see with Johnson, but at this writing Walker is the only one I could envision filling that role.

If they stick at 11, barring something unforeseen they're probably selecting an off ball wing of some sort.

The last several years are irrelevant because the primary personnel won't be in place going forward.

[ace3g]

Bam Adebayo is eligible for a contract extension this offseason as part of the 2017 draft class, but that is highly unlikely to happen due to the plans of the Miami Heat to preserve cap space for 2021. The Heat have interest in pursuing Giannis Antetokounmpo and Victor Oladipo

"He's not going to get a max contract in the offseason," said Brian Windhorst on his podcast. "Even though I think he should, because the Heat are going to save money for the 2021 summer. That's a storyline that I can almost guarantee for you: Bam Adebayo will not sign a contract extension this offseason.

"It will be, 'Bam, we'll take care of you later.'"

Adebayo's cap hold in 2021 will almost certainly be less than what he would receive as part of an extension.

[Dejounte]

Lol I would love to see Bam not get a max contract. Time will tell.

[KobesAchilles]

I hope y’all enjoyed the ride gentlemen bc we aren’t making the playoffs in a very long time. We are now the worst team in our own division.

Rockets will be better than us for as long as they have their dynamic duo.
Dallas has the future best player in the world in Luka.
As ty as the Grizzlies are run, even they had a better season. Ja is a stud. Surround him with shooters and that team will be scary... for a first round upset
Pelicans have youth and a franchise player in Zion, so long as they give him the Kawhi treatment.

We are the runt of the litter, boys.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

[Dejounte]

I hope y’all enjoyed the ride gentlemen bc we aren’t making the playoffs in a very long time. We are now the worst team in our own division.

Rockets will be better than us for as long as they have their dynamic duo.
Dallas has the future best player in the world in Luka.
As ty as the Grizzlies are run, even they had a better season. Ja is a stud. Surround him with shooters and that team will be scary... for a first round upset
Pelicans have youth and a franchise player in Zion, so long as they give him the Kawhi treatment.

We are the runt of the litter, boys.

Ill bookmark this thread and come back to it in 2-3 years. Some of yall are too shortsighted to actually think things dont change quick in the NBA. Been watching the NBA too long.

[ace3g]

Spurs Nation spurs_Nation
40m
Bryn Forbes’ future could be coming off the Spurs’ bench [and going to another team this offseason] ift.tt/2CW9euL #SpursNation #GoSpursGo

[TimDunkem]

Spurs Nation spurs_Nation
40m
Bryn Forbes’ future could be coming off the Spurs’ bench [and going to another team this offseason] ift.tt/2CW9euL #SpursNation #GoSpursGo

Doubt the former, but I'm praying for the latter.

[Chinook]

The Slurpers have convinced themselves that playing small means being small at every position because that's seemingly what PATFO thinks is going to work.

Not really. Pop would love to play big, but he finally realized LMA can't play with a center anymore and DeRozan needs to play four-out. Regardless, size isn't the team's problem. If they were in position all the time but just got shot over, that'd be one thing. But mentally, they aren't there, and that's Pop's fault.

We can't play big or small because multiple players with fatal flaws are playing positions that put them in position to fail.

This is true, though in terms of defense, I don't think their positions matter.

DJ should be playing PG but is best at SG because he has no PG instincts.

I mean Murray can play either guard spot from a physical standpoint. He's not undersized at the two. He was really skinny and needed to add weight when he came in the league. He's fine now. His limitations as a player are definitely there, though. He needs to become a gunner on offense so another player can takeover running the offense.

DDR playing SF because we have no true SF but he can't defend the position at the level needed to contend.

DeRozan can't defend any position at the level needed to contend. He's actually better as a forward defensively than as a guard. He's not a weak human by any means, but he is slow and doesn't rotate well. He should be on the weakest offensive player 1-4 as much as possible.

Rudy being a 4 at this point in his career but playing center because our options behind LMA in a best case scenario is no skill Yakob or Trey ing Lyles.

Poeltl is overrated by some here, but he's a fine player, especially for a backup. Rudy plays the five because he's theoretically the best player to play five-out without LMA. Plus, he can barely keep up with fours now. The team needed to invest in their bigs over the past couple of drafts. The Milutinov pick continues to affect the team.

KJ not being big enough to play the 3 full time.

Nah, he's fine. His issue is going to be that he'll need to score enough to make opposing SFs work. In the modern NBA, his height won't hold him back any more than it does to guys like Smart, Tucker, Green or Beverly. But if he can't score well enough to dictate the match-up on the other end, then the other team will just put in more guards to negate him.

Forbes playing at all. He doesn't have the skill to ever play PG or the size and athleticism to defend any position.

True.

Patty Mills when he plays the 2. Remember when Pop refused to adjust when he would switch on to KD?

The issue is that you can't just adjust that. Like that requires changing the whole gameplan. If you're going to switch (which you have to because it's the modern NBA), you're going to have mismatches when playing a smart offense. But the Spurs should have worked in different ways of helping and early bumps to where KD wouldn't get to his spots with shorter guys on him. They weren't physical enough.

DW not being athletic enough to defend the best 1s or big enough to handle the best 2s. He's an average role player at best. Reminds me of Delonte West without the crazy.

This is just weird. White's a perfectly competent defender 1-3. He's not elite against most guys, but he's strong enough to hold his position and savvy enough to stay in front of most guys. I'd certainly say that in a one-on-one sense he's quite a bit better than Murray.

Then again, you seemed to think poorly of guys like Green and Anderson too but didn't seem to make the connection that the defense sucks because those guys left.

This team doesn't know how to zig or zag.

Again true. They need to stop trying to dodge one way or another and look at their issues head on. They desperately need a defensive forward in the draft, and they simply can't keep re-signing bad defenders and giving them minutes. The age of a designated floor-spacer are long gone. If your best defenders can't shoot, teach them. If you can't teach them, get rid of them unless they are truly elite enough to still make up for it. A guy like Poeltl can work if he can play four-out. But with DMDR and Murray, that can't happen.

I don't think they should hesitate to trade their non-Walker players for an upgrade. I like every one of the young guys quite a bit outside Samanic and Metu. But they need to cycle in new young players (because you can't have a roster full of prospects). Trade someone like Murray or White, get another draft pick, and let the young guys grow more. Trade away the next set that don't seem like keepers and re-up those who do.

[tim_duncan_fan]

The Slurpers have convinced themselves that playing small means being small at every position because that's seemingly what PATFO thinks is going to work. We can't play big or small because multiple players with fatal flaws are playing positions that put them in position to fail. Examples include:

DJ should be playing PG but is best at SG because he has no PG instincts.

DDR playing SF because we have no true SF but he can't defend the position at the level needed to contend.

Rudy being a 4 at this point in his career but playing center because our options behind LMA in a best case scenario is no skill Yakob or Trey ing Lyles.

KJ not being big enough to play the 3 full time.

Forbes playing at all. He doesn't have the skill to ever play PG or the size and athleticism to defend any position.

Patty Mills when he plays the 2. Remember when Pop refused to adjust when he would switch on to KD?

DW not being athletic enough to defend the best 1s or big enough to handle the best 2s. He's an average role player at best. Reminds me of Delonte West without the crazy.

This team doesn't know how to zig or zag.

Given the situation, maybe He Who Shall Not Be Named was right to leave. The future does not look to good right now.

I'd feel better if our tall forward, Luka, looked like a player.

[Robz4000]

how the does someone look at OKC's situation and not think they have a brighter future than the Spurs?

[TimDunkem]

Not really. Pop would love to play big, but he finally realized LMA can't play with a center anymore and DeRozan needs to play four-out. Regardless, size isn't the team's problem. If they were in position all the time but just got shot over, that'd be one thing. But mentally, they aren't there, and that's Pop's fault.



This is true, though in terms of defense, I don't think their positions matter.



I mean Murray can play either guard spot from a physical standpoint. He's not undersized at the two. He was really skinny and needed to add weight when he came in the league. He's fine now. His limitations as a player are definitely there, though. He needs to become a gunner on offense so another player can takeover running the offense.



DeRozan can't defend any position at the level needed to contend. He's actually better as a forward defensively than as a guard. He's not a weak human by any means, but he is slow and doesn't rotate well. He should be on the weakest offensive player 1-4 as much as possible.



Poeltl is overrated by some here, but he's a fine player, especially for a backup. Rudy plays the five because he's theoretically the best player to play five-out without LMA. Plus, he can barely keep up with fours now. The team needed to invest in their bigs over the past couple of drafts. The Milutinov pick continues to affect the team.



Nah, he's fine. His issue is going to be that he'll need to score enough to make opposing SFs work. In the modern NBA, his height won't hold him back any more than it does to guys like Smart, Tucker, Green or Beverly. But if he can't score well enough to dictate the match-up on the other end, then the other team will just put in more guards to negate him.



True.



The issue is that you can't just adjust that. Like that requires changing the whole gameplan. If you're going to switch (which you have to because it's the modern NBA), you're going to have mismatches when playing a smart offense. But the Spurs should have worked in different ways of helping and early bumps to where KD wouldn't get to his spots with shorter guys on him. They weren't physical enough.



This is just weird. White's a perfectly competent defender 1-3. He's not elite against most guys, but he's strong enough to hold his position and savvy enough to stay in front of most guys. I'd certainly say that in a one-on-one sense he's quite a bit better than Murray.

Then again, you seemed to think poorly of guys like Green and Anderson too but didn't seem to make the connection that the defense sucks because those guys left.



Again true. They need to stop trying to dodge one way or another and look at their issues head on. They desperately need a defensive forward in the draft, and they simply can't keep re-signing bad defenders and giving them minutes. The age of a designated floor-spacer are long gone. If your best defenders can't shoot, teach them. If you can't teach them, get rid of them unless they are truly elite enough to still make up for it. A guy like Poeltl can work if he can play four-out. But with DMDR and Murray, that can't happen.

I don't think they should hesitate to trade their non-Walker players for an upgrade. I like every one of the young guys quite a bit outside Samanic and Metu. But they need to cycle in new young players (because you can't have a roster full of prospects). Trade someone like Murray or White, get another draft pick, and let the young guys grow more. Trade away the next set that don't seem like keepers and re-up those who do.

I'm not going to quibble about where we disagree because I think we both ultimately reach the same conclusion: The team as it stands isn't going to cut it, and you have to adjust at some point; anyone who isn't Walker should be on the table.

[Chinook]

I'm not going to quibble about where we disagree because I think we both ultimately reach the same conclusion: The team as it stands isn't going to cut it, and you have to adjust at some point; anyone who isn't Walker should be on the table.

I agree there. I just think where we disagree is WHY the team is bad defensively. Even with their size, they'd be an okay defensive team if everyone went out there and gave a . That's why I think Pop needs to go. He just doesn't seem to get what it takes to make a team without a superstar successful. Forget contending. There's just not excuse for a non-tanking team to get blown out as often as this team does. That lack of focus and fundamentals is totally Pop's fault.

[paperboy77]

I'm going to be optimistic here and say it's just pre-season. I'm hoping they don't just roll over and actually compete for the 8 seed. The draft sux anyway. Go ing Spurs Go!f and the Lakers!

[KobesAchilles]

Ill bookmark this thread and come back to it in 2-3 years. Some of yall are too shortsighted to actually think things dont change quick in the NBA. Been watching the NBA too long.

So what a long time to you? Bc we aren’t making the playoffs this year and if you have to wait 3 more ing years to bring back my comment then that’s 4 years of not making the playoffs. Then if we did make the playoffs that’s 5 seasons

[TimDunkem]

I agree there. I just think where we disagree is WHY the team is bad defensively. Even with their size, they'd be an okay defensive team if everyone went out there and gave a . That's why I think Pop needs to go. He just doesn't seem to get what it takes to make a team without a superstar successful. Forget contending. There's just not excuse for a non-tanking team to get blown out as often as this team does. That lack of focus and fundamentals is totally Pop's fault.

Amen on the Pop angle. I've been a Pop troofer for a while, but the evidence is clear now that he's lost without a star keeping the train on the tracks.

[Killakobe81]

how the does someone look at OKC's situation and not think they have a brighter future than the Spurs?

Not gonna pile on ...because i respect PATFO despite the recent issues.
But yes OKC is im better shape despite having CP3 on a bloated contract. Paul has reestablished his value and even if he stays he is developing SGS. Speaking of SGA he is like having a mixture of White and Murray in onecpkayer withvmore updide than Lonnie. And though i would take healthy Aldridge over Adams his physicality and toughness is superior. OKC also has a ton of picks.
To bad for OKC their state is crapola compared to Texas ...

[TimDunkem]

Not gonna pile on ...because i respect PATFO despite the recent issues.
But yes OKC is im better shape despite having CP3 on a bloated contract. Paul has reestablished his value and even if he stays he is developing SGS. Speaking of SGA he is like having a mixture of White and Murray in onecpkayer withvmore updide than Lonnie. And though i would take healthy Aldridge over Adams his physicality and toughness is superior. OKC also has a ton of picks.
To bad for OKC their state is crapola compared to Texas ...

Totally forgot about the picks. They can form a whole team with the amount they have. We'll see how that turns out, but how could one argue SA is in a better position?

[KobesAchilles]

Not gonna pile on ...because i respect PATFO despite the recent issues.
But yes OKC is im better shape despite having CP3 on a bloated contract. Paul has reestablished his value and even if he stays he is developing SGS. Speaking of SGA he is like having a mixture of White and Murray in onecpkayer withvmore updide than Lonnie. And though i would take healthy Aldridge over Adams his physicality and toughness is superior. OKC also has a ton of picks.
To bad for OKC their state is crapola compared to Texas ...

Spurs are about to come crashing down hard. Pop gone. RC gone. No real subs utes for either one. Franchise being owned/run by spoiled rich kids. The only way they can make a comeback is if they have everything upstairs in place. But with no proven GM, no proven coach, and no proven star... that’s a lot to ask of a franchise

[Dejounte]

So what a long time to you? Bc we aren’t making the playoffs this year and if you have to wait 3 more ing years to bring back my comment then that’s 4 years of not making the playoffs. Then if we did make the playoffs that’s 5 seasons

Its not just about the Spurs but the other teams you mentioned. You act like these other teams will become dynasties. All Im saying is things change so quick. Im not even saying just the Spurs. This is an example of people like you not seeing past the short term future when you make a remark of the Spurs making the playoffs. You set the bar so low.

[Dejounte]

Totally forgot about the picks. They can form a whole team with the amount they have. We'll see how that turns out, but how could one argue SA is in a better position?

So wait, you on the Spurs for the bad picks theyve made the past two years but think OKC is great with drafting? Wtf lmfao

[Dejounte]

For the past decade, the number of players OKC has drafted in the first round who went on to have NBA careers: THREE. And one of those three is already out of the league now.

Yall are laughable, man.