Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 42
  1. #1
    Veteran
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Post Count
    13,827
    First off, had they done what many of the smart posters said 2 years ago, started White and Walker in the back court all season and had the former average around 30 mpg, given the way things broke around the league, they probably would have made the playoffs.

    White: Is playing with an aggressiveness and confidence I never thought I'd see. The percentages will inevitably regress some and I still think he'll probably ultimately reside in that nebulous zone between star and elite role player, but he's shown he can be a primary offensive option. I'd offer him 4/$70M. If it takes more, fair enough.

    Poeltl: Has been inconsistent. Predictably got bullied by brutes Valanciunas, Embiid, Jokic and would thrive amid better spacing, but more or less looks like the low end starting center it was obvious he's been for a few years. Hopefully they can retain him for 3-4/$24-32M. If it takes slightly more, fine. No more giving away assets.

    Murray: Looks completely lost and inept and the extension is quickly looking like a mistake. This team needs a go-to scorer and primary playmaker in his stead going forward. Should be shopped hard, along with the 11th pick and an asset from a DeRozan or Aldridge trade, to move up. Avdija, Hayes, Haliburton, should be targets.

    Walker: Has been erratic, but shown improved IQ. Due to passive mentality and relatively rudimentary ball skills, punchers chance at a star ship has probably sailed, with solid starter ceiling seeming more appropriate. Still, a 3 and D type with secondary creation is valuable.

    Johnson: Blurs the line between on ball type and 3 and D. Probably projects similar to Walker, but too soon to say definitively which direction he veers. Has that "dog" mentality this team desperately needs and will likely max out on his abilities because of it.

    Eubanks: Undersized and limited ability, but solid athlete that plays hard and within' himself. Has done enough to earn the third center job. Offer him a guaranteed 2 year minimum, with a 3rd year partial guarantee or team option.

    Weatherspoon: Basically the same thing as Eubanks. Can't find whether his 2-way expires or not. If so, his fate should be dependent on what happens to DeRozan, Murray, Forbes and the draft. If they need a depth guard, sign him. If not, sign him to the Austin Spurs.

    Metu: End of the line. Never really got a chance like Eubanks, but at the same time the latter has secured the job and carrying four centers on the 15 man would be a waste of a spot.

    Samanic: Needs to improve his shot, strength and give a level to become an NBA player, but has an intriguing combination of size, athleticism, ball skills.

  2. #2
    Lab Animal Capt Bringdown's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Post Count
    11,443
    The dream of Murray and Walker as foundational to Spursball going forward has been shattered by the bubble.

  3. #3
    Dejounte, White & THE IV Truth4sale$'s Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Post Count
    523
    Samanic has shown Nothing! Really dissapointed in both him and Metu, Samanic gets a pass but he should have bulked up some more during the shutdown. He had 3 months!! Metu cant get playing time on a team without height, he is done-sadly to say. Some guys just cant learn the basketball IQ part or it takes a while like Christian Wood in Detroit. Metu will likely bounce around and improve much better when he lands on his 3rd team.
    The Spurs have some interesting talent in the Gleague like Dedric Lawson to take Metu's place. Hopefully Lawson resigns with the team.

  4. #4
    Veteran R. DeMurre's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    Post Count
    3,580
    I'm pretty happy with the young guys. I think White can be the ultimate glue guy, adapt to any style of play, and be the 2nd or 3rd best player on a championship level team, playing PG, SG, or even SF. White, Walker, Johnson, and Murray are all shooting good-to-great 3pt%s, but only White is showing no hesitancy when it comes to shooting them. Trey Lyles is actually younger than White, and he's a good reasonably priced piece too. I was impressed today when Walker had a poor shooting game but still contributed with 6 rebounds, 6 assists, and defense. With these four plus Mills, I'd say the back court is set. Poeltl is a slightly better than average starting center, or an extremely good back up center. The key now is how to use the remaining pieces to get an impactful big, be that a forward or a center. I'm feeling good about the future.
    Last edited by R. DeMurre; 08-10-2020 at 05:05 AM.

  5. #5
    HTTR Ditty's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Post Count
    7,139
    White - Stud when healthy. Wish he was 24 instead of 26. Not a huge deal.

    Walker - Most upside out of all the young guys. Has the ability to be a playmaker with the ball in his hands. Once he figures out how to use his athleticism/get creative around the rim watch out.

    Poeltl - I like him & hope we keep him. Wish he was a little more aggressive around the rim and was a little more offensively talented for being a top ten pick. Think he will continue to get better defensively.

    Murray - Proud that he learned how to shoot but doesn't seem as athletic or as quick since the injury imo. Going to give him another season to really judge him. Hopefully he continues to gain some muscle and possibly embraces being the 6th man of the team.

    Johnson - Wish he was 6'8. Not a big deal either. Kid is a basketball player. Seems like he loves the game. Coachable and likeable. Don't think he will be a star but I can see him putting up 15ppg as a career average for a long career in the NBA alternating with starting and playing off the bench.

    Ewwbanks :p - Has been impressive in the bubble. One of those guys who was too good for the G League but not talented enough for the NBA. Hopefully he keeps getting better and has a decent NBA career even if it isn't with us.

    Metu - Was hoping he would be what Eubanks is right now but the coaching staff isn't seeing it. I think he has a little something to him but not enough to be in a rotation unless we are tanking. Think his days as a Spur will be ending soon. He will get a shot with another team maybe in the summer league. Hopefully land somewhere in the G league or play somewhere overseas.

    Weatherspoon - Impressive in summer league last year. If Spurs move on from Forbes (hopefully), Marco (hopefully) and Derozan (depends) this summer. Would like to see what he brings off the bench for a season or two backing up Lonnie.

    Luka - Don't know what to think of him yet. I saw him up close in Vegas last year and you can definitely see why the Spurs drafted him as he is pretty intriguing. Haven't seen much of him this year outside of highlights in Austin which were mostly dunks. I think the kid will be fine. He moves great for a guy that size you can't coach that. He is going to get thrown into the fire next season at least off the bench and we will see how he responds.

  6. #6
    OH YOU LIKE IT!!! slick'81's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Post Count
    17,932
    I def think we keep poodle cheap . I agree with my boy cal and figure Dwhite gets something in the 60-70 range. Kj/lonnie and murray have upside and luka&spoon should continue to grow. Throw in a top 10 pick this year and the spurs got something cooking

  7. #7
    Believe.
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Post Count
    618
    Rudy gay trade value couldn’t be higher we need to package Aldridge and him and maybe dump Mills salary for young players and picks.

  8. #8
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Post Count
    30,991
    You don't overpay for Poeltl to keep from losing an asset. That's sunk cost. He's good enough to be on the team, and I'd be okay re-signing him. But his RFA status and overall meh-ness makes him one of the lowest priorities in the off-season for me.

    I think if White can develop more of a killer instinct, Walker can do. I think he' plays better when he's not the fourth option. He certainly has things to work on, but he should absolutely be the plan going forward pending the draft. Still, I do wonder if Walker's ceiling will be lowered by his demeanor.

    I'm not extending White. Learn from the mistake. The last thing you want is to lock Derrick into a deal during an artificially inflated cap and hope that he's going to stay healthy and aggressive. The whole point of having RFA status after that fourth year is so you don't have to extend guys to keep control over them. Even if White earns $100 Million, it's better to give that to him while maximizing flexibility and have seen him prove he can sustain his level of play for a season.

    It's no secret I agree about Murray, though I guess you can argue that he deserves and off-season to adjust his game. I just don't really trust that he'll do that. I don't think he's the future impact star the Spurs need, and there should still be teams that value him. It's a shame that he's not the one balling out rather than Gay. Oh well. I'm not down on the idea of packaging him with a pick to move up. Obviously, if there is a guy the Spurs really want, then it's not too big a price to pay to secure him. But I think the team needs a second first-rounder this year, and they'll only be able to get it from Murray, Aldridge or DeRozan. I think Murray by himself could get a late-lottery pick. If that's an option, I don't want to add that to 11 just to get up to five. Grab Toppin, use the next pick on a developmental front-court player and keep it going. Maybe Avdija is a future MVP candidate. If so, sure get him. But with the consensus seeming to be that the lottery is uniform outside Wiseman and the high number of front-court players available, having two bites of that apple is really hard to pass up.

  9. #9
    #POPOUT
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Post Count
    894
    It's no secret I agree about Murray, though I guess you can argue that he deserves and off-season to adjust his game. I just don't really trust that he'll do that. I don't think he's the future impact star the Spurs need, and there should still be teams that value him. It's a shame that he's not the one balling out rather than Gay. Oh well. I'm not down on the idea of packaging him with a pick to move up. Obviously, if there is a guy the Spurs really want, then it's not too big a price to pay to secure him. But I think the team needs a second first-rounder this year, and they'll only be able to get it from Murray, Aldridge or DeRozan. I think Murray by himself could get a late-lottery pick. If that's an option, I don't want to add that to 11 just to get up to five. Grab Toppin, use the next pick on a developmental front-court player and keep it going. Maybe Avdija is a future MVP candidate. If so, sure get him. But with the consensus seeming to be that the lottery is uniform outside Wiseman and the high number of front-court players available, having two bites of that apple is really hard to pass up.
    im a huge fan of gettin a second 1st rnd pick but im not convinced that murray could get us a late lottery pick. Maybe we could get the blazers pick for a package around LMA without our pick.

  10. #10
    Believe.
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Post Count
    618
    It’s amazing to me people are so quick to get rid of Murray

  11. #11
    Veteran
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Post Count
    7,878
    It’s time to start consolidating some pieces.

  12. #12
    #POPOUT
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Jul 2019
    Post Count
    894
    It’s amazing to me people are so quick to get rid of Murray
    its amazing how ppl before pandemic put the 24 yrs old guy who cant dribble, pass and shoot into a future all star consideration.

  13. #13
    Believe.
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Post Count
    636
    its amazing how ppl before pandemic put the 24 yrs old guy who cant dribble, pass and shoot into a future all star consideration.
    I don't think Murray is god but you think Josh Jackson and Lonzo are good so your player evaluation is .

  14. #14
    Veteran exstatic's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Post Count
    40,486
    The dream of Murray and Walker as foundational to Spursball going forward has been shattered by the bubble.
    They would both be a LOT better if they could finish thru contact.

    Walker misses a lot of shots because he actively avoids contact. His speed going to the rim works against him, because his shot almost always comes off the glass too hard, hits the rim, and bounces straight away in whatever direction the side of the rim that the shot hit. Absorbing contact is the finishing version of using the backboard to deaden your shot for a kind bounce. The impact slows your speed from what you used to blow past your defender to a manageable speed to execute a layup with the ball caromming wildly off the rim.

  15. #15
    Veteran
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Post Count
    13,827
    You don't overpay for Poeltl to keep from losing an asset. That's sunk cost. He's good enough to be on the team, and I'd be okay re-signing him. But his RFA status and overall meh-ness makes him one of the lowest priorities in the off-season for me.

    I think if White can develop more of a killer instinct, Walker can do. I think he' plays better when he's not the fourth option. He certainly has things to work on, but he should absolutely be the plan going forward pending the draft. Still, I do wonder if Walker's ceiling will be lowered by his demeanor.

    I'm not extending White. Learn from the mistake. The last thing you want is to lock Derrick into a deal during an artificially inflated cap and hope that he's going to stay healthy and aggressive. The whole point of having RFA status after that fourth year is so you don't have to extend guys to keep control over them. Even if White earns $100 Million, it's better to give that to him while maximizing flexibility and have seen him prove he can sustain his level of play for a season.

    It's no secret I agree about Murray, though I guess you can argue that he deserves and off-season to adjust his game. I just don't really trust that he'll do that. I don't think he's the future impact star the Spurs need, and there should still be teams that value him. It's a shame that he's not the one balling out rather than Gay. Oh well. I'm not down on the idea of packaging him with a pick to move up. Obviously, if there is a guy the Spurs really want, then it's not too big a price to pay to secure him. But I think the team needs a second first-rounder this year, and they'll only be able to get it from Murray, Aldridge or DeRozan. I think Murray by himself could get a late-lottery pick. If that's an option, I don't want to add that to 11 just to get up to five. Grab Toppin, use the next pick on a developmental front-court player and keep it going. Maybe Avdija is a future MVP candidate. If so, sure get him. But with the consensus seeming to be that the lottery is uniform outside Wiseman and the high number of front-court players available, having two bites of that apple is really hard to pass up.
    I meant slightly and of course you do. Like, if they ideally want to pay him in the $7 million range and he get's an offer sheet in the $9 million range, you don't lose him over that. He's a quality player/asset, at a position of need. If someone goes nuts and offers $12 million, that's a different discussion.

    Maybe Walker can too, but he also lacks a degree of toughness that White possesses. With White, it seemed more so to be not wanting to step on proven veterans toes. With Walker, it seems more of a confidence issue.

    White isn't Murray and though I don't think he can maintain his current pace, I'm confident he's turned a corner. If not, at worst he's a high end role player, with the malleability to double a quality trade asset. Plus, everything isn't about opportunity cost. This is a relationship business too and not extending guys who are worthy of it can have an adverse affect on the relationship (sometimes, it's strike one to it's ultimate demise). Also, this is an organization that value certain ethos that he clearly possesses and they desperately need a PR win.

    Murray and 11 isn't getting them to 5. They'd have to pick up a third asset for Aldridge or DeRozan and add it to the package.

  16. #16
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Post Count
    30,991
    I meant slightly and of course you do. Like, if they ideally want to pay him in the $7 million range and he get's an offer sheet in the $9 million range, you don't lose him over that. He's a quality player/asset, at a position of need. If someone goes nuts and offers $12 million, that's a different discussion.
    I'm okay with the idea that you should pay to keep a good player. I'm not okay with the idea that him being an "asset" matters. Good teams create assets -- they don't fight to maintain them. You draft and develop players before moving those players to get a better starting chip. If Poeltl is the plan at center, keep him if the money's right. But if the goal is to trade him later, let him walk. He'll be nothing more than filler on an inflated contract during a deflated cap.

    Maybe Walker can too, but he also lacks a degree of toughness that White possesses. With White, it seemed more so to be not wanting to step on proven veterans toes. With Walker, it seems more of a confidence issue.
    Yeah, it reminds me of Anderson that way. Lonnie seems like a good guy but not a lead dog. I think he'd be a good second option if the team can find a first option, though. I still have his ceiling as better than a role-player.

    White isn't Murray and though I don't think he can maintain his current pace, I'm confident he's turned a corner. If not, at worst he's a high end role player, with the malleability to double a quality trade asset. Plus, everything isn't about opportunity cost. This is a relationship business too and not extending guys who are worthy of it can have an adverse affect on the relationship (sometimes, it's strike one to it's ultimate demise). Also, this is an organization that value certain ethos that he clearly possesses and they desperately need a PR win.
    Murray's extension was the PR move. Right now, the team needs to think about actually getting better, and that should come from using cap space in 2021. If they extend White, it's likely to come with them extending DeRozan or trading him for long-term money. I agree that if White is getting loud about a deal that it could be a dicey situation, but I'm also not opposed to trading White if the value's right. Spurs can't let non-stars hold them hostage.

    Murray and 11 isn't getting them to 5. They'd have to pick up a third asset for Aldridge or DeRozan and add it to the package
    I think it gets five easily. This is a depressed draft, and I'm pretty confident that Murray has good value. The thing with this draft is that the lottery is considered to be pretty flat. I could see some trades where teams jump up five or six picks barely having to give up anything. Murray's certainly enough to get a protected future first, and that's all it took to get the Mavericks from five to three in a good draft. It really wouldn't surprise me to see a team like Phoenix offer 10 for Murray, especially given their recent play.

  17. #17
    Veteran
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    Post Count
    13,827
    I'm okay with the idea that you should pay to keep a good player. I'm not okay with the idea that him being an "asset" matters. Good teams create assets -- they don't fight to maintain them. You draft and develop players before moving those players to get a better starting chip. If Poeltl is the plan at center, keep him if the money's right. But if the goal is to trade him later, let him walk. He'll be nothing more than filler on an inflated contract during a deflated cap.



    Yeah, it reminds me of Anderson that way. Lonnie seems like a good guy but not a lead dog. I think he'd be a good second option if the team can find a first option, though. I still have his ceiling as better than a role-player.



    Murray's extension was the PR move. Right now, the team needs to think about actually getting better, and that should come from using cap space in 2021. If they extend White, it's likely to come with them extending DeRozan or trading him for long-term money. I agree that if White is getting loud about a deal that it could be a dicey situation, but I'm also not opposed to trading White if the value's right. Spurs can't let non-stars hold them hostage.



    I think it gets five easily. This is a depressed draft, and I'm pretty confident that Murray has good value. The thing with this draft is that the lottery is considered to be pretty flat. I could see some trades where teams jump up five or six picks barely having to give up anything. Murray's certainly enough to get a protected future first, and that's all it took to get the Mavericks from five to three in a good draft. It really wouldn't surprise me to see a team like Phoenix offer 10 for Murray, especially given their recent play.
    Most teams, barring a completely insane offer that could cripple them in some way, refuse to let teams poach them. Now, if you're saying they should get out ahead of that in certain cases, I agree. That's why I'm generally a fan of extending or trading before the ELC expires. In his case, too late. Keep him for now and if they ultimately land a better center in the draft or via trade at some point, consider cashing him in then.

    There's numerous role players who play a star type role or put up star type counting stats. I could see that being more plausible than his being a genuine star.

    Murray's was in the sense that they were doing right by a player, White would be in the sense of they're locking in a core player. Cap space on what? They won't strip it down entirely, so forget about renting it out as a dumping ground for dead money to acquire pick(s). Though an ideal fit with DeRozan, White's fate shouldn't be tied to his. His trade value is likely high, but probably not high enough to get an almost certainly better younger piece.

    I don't think he does. Saturated position, torn ACL, 4 years since drafted, nearing 24, still can't dribble, shoot, pass or think and doesn't seem ready to humble himself and focus on becoming a 3 and D type.

  18. #18
    Veteran gambit1990's Avatar
    My Team
    Toronto Raptors
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Post Count
    9,576
    Rudy gay trade value couldn’t be higher
    agree.
    we need to package Aldridge and him
    i'm not against moving la but not retaining demar has to come first.

  19. #19
    Believe.
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Sep 2018
    Post Count
    618
    I know much of st can’t stand DeMar but without him we don’t win any of these games same can be said about white . I’m totally fine with dumping Mills salary and packaging la and gay while extending dd and white

  20. #20
    Believe. Down Under's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Jul 2015
    Post Count
    1,069
    There is no way in the world they would've made the playoffs starting White & Walker. Lonnie, despite being most likely to become a star, is still fairly clueless on team defense - he gets backdoored regularly as well as missing basic rotations. Additionally, his shot selection for most of the year has been woeful - passes up too many wide open 3s & instead drives into the teeth of the defense where he often becomes out of control. He will get there, but it will take a number of season IMO.

  21. #21
    fuk yo team clown Dingle Barry's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    May 2005
    Post Count
    1,907
    I think it's a mistake if they give up on Metu. He improved a load this year.

  22. #22
    Believe.
    My Team
    Anybody but Spurs
    Join Date
    Oct 2018
    Post Count
    1,987
    agree.

    i'm not against moving la but not retaining demar has to come first.
    Yup. These bubble games have shown that healthy White is much more impactful and cheaper than Demar. Worst thing the Spurs can do is extend him.

  23. #23
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Post Count
    30,991
    I think it's a mistake if they give up on Metu. He improved a load this year.
    For what it's worth, I think the Spurs will keep him around. I don't know what the off-season is going to look like, I could totally see some type of summer league for the fall or winter. I don't think Pop likes Metu, but the Spurs gave him way more guaranteed money than they needed to, and they were ultra secretive about his scouting process. That suggests they believed in him. He's just the worst player on the team and an abject misery to watch on the court. Maybe that changes. But if the Spurs don't draft a big this year, I think they give it one more season.

  24. #24
    Veteran Dejounte's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Post Count
    13,619
    Maybe theyll turn Metu into an assistant coach once his "NBA career" ends. He did take up a mentorship role to Keldon according to reports this year. Metu's problem is he doesn't love basketball based off from what I've seen him constantly post on his social media. It's all about soccer. Never about basketball. Probably didnt have a great work ethic because of this. That doesnt fly under Pop.

  25. #25
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Post Count
    30,991
    Maybe theyll turn Metu into an assistant coach once his "NBA career" ends. He did take up a mentorship role to Keldon according to reports this year. Metu's problem is he doesn't love basketball based off from what I've seen him constantly post on his social media. It's all about soccer. Never about basketball. Probably didnt have a great work ethic because of this. That doesnt fly under Pop.
    Saw a video that says his dream is to be a lawyer.

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •