official offseason thread

[ZeusWillJudge]

Well the distributed combine is starting. Devin Vassell has elected not to come. I think that's a bad move, unless he and his agent are pretty confident that it would only hurt him. Between those videos of the changes in his shooting stroke, and staying out of the combine, he's going to drop. The question is how far.

[Dejounte]

Well the distributed combine is starting. Devin Vassell has elected not to come. I think that's a bad move, unless he and his agent are pretty confident that it would only hurt him. Between those videos of the changes in his shooting stroke, and staying out of the combine, he's going to drop. The question is how far.

Let him drop past 11th. He deserves to be undrafted.

[ace3g]

NBA free agents 2020: Predicting starting salaries for the best available players


Shooting guards

Player	Team	Age	FA Type	Starting Salary
DeMar DeRozan (player)	SAS	30	All-Star	$22-24M
Bryn Forbes	SAS	26	Rotation A	$4-6M

Centers

Player	Team	Age	FA Type	Starting Salary
Jakob Poeltl (restricted)	SAS	24	Starter	$8-10M

http://insider.espn.com/nba/insider/...ilable-players

[ZeusWillJudge]

Let him drop past 11th. He deserves to be undrafted.

I never liked him at 11. The only reason I could see for drafting him was that he knocked down 3's and he would be an improvement over Forbes at a much cheaper price. But if he's damaged his 3P shooting ability, I can't see him anywhere in the first round. I guess the question I was asking was whether he would be a value at 41, but I understand you not liking him even there, after those videos came out. Without an outstanding 3P%, I don't think he would have gotten much attention.

I'm still eager to see what they do and don't do in this modified combine. I've really wanted to see Desmon Bane's results. They were all over the place, and I still think there had to be some mistakes.

[Sugus]

there is no risk, NO ONE really relevant wants to play for Pop and play in San Antonio, this trade (# 2 + Wiggins for Aldridge) would be an easy YES, without discussion.

I tend to agree - cap space in particular is overvalued as a commodity, it's mostly "valuable" to teams who are FA destinations, or teams that are willing to eat up salary from other teams in exchange for picks - neither of which the Spurs have been known to be. I'd rather have #2 and be paying Wiggins' salary in '21, than to have LMA, DD leave for nothing and have to wait for a "big FA signing" that isn't happening.

[Thomas82]

That's been my line of thinking as well. Wiggins is an albatross - no way around it. But the Spurs in particular are probably one of the teams that would value open cap space the least, since chances of landing a FA are slim-to-none, especially while we're rebuilding - which also allows us to "splurge" in to Wiggins' deal without having to compromise the integrity of the team (if I'm not mistaken, the only contracts we'd have to sign while he was here would be Lonnie's once his fourth year is up, since Keldon would still be on his rookie deal two years from now, and we'll have to re-sign White/Jak either way this summer).

So getting a decade+ of solid frontcourt play, with All-Star upside in Wiseman, all while retaining all of our picks and the possibility to tank if necessary, is extremely enticing. I can see why other posters are risk-averse on Wiggins, but in the NBA and being a small market team, you gotta throw the big stones if you want to make ripples, tbh...

Man, the more I think about this, the more I want it to happen.

[JuneJive]

Off topic, but a quick question.

How do you guys define a contender?

[cd021]

I agree that if the Spurs take on Wiggins, then they are very very high on a rookie. And if that is the case, I would be excited. But here in Spurstalk, people here have this weird perception that we are not going anywhere, therefore just get a high pick at the cost of our best player and at the cost of getting one of the worst contracts. It's the wrong mentality.


Wiggins contract is a net negative. It is untradable for 2 seasons without giving up an asset in return. His value becomes somewhat even only on his expiring season.


You have to assume that rookie at number 2 is going to be worth 40mil in cap space gone. That is over a third of your cap.


Usually, when you give up by the far the best player in the trade, you want two of these three things.


1) A promising prospect.
2) Cap Space
3) Draft pick.


Spurs would be getting a promising prospect. No further future 1st that would be worthwhile. And no cap space flexibility for 3 seasons.

-Wiggins is a negative value contract for next season and the season after, that is true, and the obvious downside of the deal. Agreed, that his contract becomes somewhat even in year 3. Spurs could use that expiring to take on more bad salary in exchange for additional first round picks. That's if they are still in rebuilding mode and don't value cap space.

-The number 2 pick has a bigger rookie scale deal; true, though that's not really that big of a deal if the Spurs hit on that pick. Hitting on a top 3 pick, makes that an immediate value contract, not an negative.

-Aldridge is on an expiring and will be 36 by the end of next season, using him as a key part of a trade to get the number 2 pick is fantastic return tbh.

-In regards to cap space; if the Spurs were to make the Aldridge, Gay, and 11 for Wiggins, Looney, and 2, then the Spurs would likely embrace the rebuild. That means DeRozan and Mills will likely play out season before moving on from them. I wouldn't anticipate the Spurs being cap space players in the near future, in that scenario.

[Joseph Kony]

Off topic, but a quick question.

How do you guys define a contender?

a team that has a legitimate shot to win a ring, or at least win a conference le

[Joseph Kony]

i was reading that NBA told teams cap won't go below 109M for next season, so hopefully they'll announce the actual number soon so they can move forward with free agency or at least trades

[PhantomDashCam]

Well the distributed combine is starting. Devin Vassell has elected not to come. I think that's a bad move, unless he and his agent are pretty confident that it would only hurt him. Between those videos of the changes in his shooting stroke, and staying out of the combine, he's going to drop. The question is how far.

Let him drop past 11th. He deserves to be undrafted.

I still think he goes top 20. Recent article suggests he was goofing around at training.

https://sny.tv/articles/florida-stat...crystal-clear-

So I asked Young about the video. At first, he chuckled. Then, he said, unequivocally, that Vassell hasn’t altered his shooting.“He has not changed his shot at all,” Young says.
Here’s what happened: Young said Vassell was messing around at the end of a workout, shooting from about five steps behind the 3-point line. He was hitting most of his attempts, so someone at the workout started to film the shooting session.
That person put the video on social media without the context mentioned above (Vassell is messing around at the end of a workout shooting from well beyond the 3-point line).
So people assumed that Vassell had altered his shot. Not the case, Young says.
“Because he’s shooting from so far back, he’s sling-shotting it from over his head. Because it’s way deep. It was a (mess around) half-court shot,” Young says. “He always had kind of a high release but he hasn’t changed his shot. He doesn’t bring it back that far. He has not changed his shot at all.”

Still silly that someone posts that video considering how tenuous draft positioning can be and $ it may have cost him on a rookie contract.

[ZeusWillJudge]

I still think he goes top 20. Recent article suggests he was goofing around at training.

Still silly that someone posts that video considering how tenuous draft positioning can be and $ it may have cost him on a rookie contract.

Well for his sake I hope that's true. I hate to see a young guy get crushed right before the draft. And this year there is so much less information than ever before. I know I'm not an NBA scout, but I still think that skipping the combine could be a really bad move for him. I can understand some of those guys who are definitely going in the top 6-7 slots skipping it. But the difference between being drafted 12 and being drafted 20 is over $1M a year, for the first three years of rookie scale.

Pretty high stakes poker for a kid that young.

[tbdog]

I wonder if we could somehow get Sabonis. Pacers have no draft pick.

[exstatic]

I wonder if we could somehow get Sabonis. Pacers have no draft pick.

No. He’s not available for anything we have. They are extremely high on him.

[Em-City]

I wonder if we could somehow get Sabonis. Pacers have no draft pick.

They'd be shopping Turner before Sabonis.

[exstatic]

They'd be shopping Turner before Sabonis.

They actually are, Oladipo, too, according to reports.

[The Truth #6]

Think the 2 safest players in this draft are Halliburton and Tyler Bey. They will both contribute right away. Halliburton can lead a franchise but Bey won’t be franchise player but should be a solid starter. Nesmith and Toppin could be good on the right teams but they are complementary players and not franchise players.

I really want Tyler Bey on the team, but I think his role will be limited to defense/glue guy. But I would love to be wrong.

[EasyMoney]

They actually are, Oladipo, too, according to reports.

According to *rumors

[exstatic]

According to *rumors

Po tay to. Po tah to. Everything is a rumor until it happens. You’ll never have Kevin Pritchard come out and be quoted as saying he’s shopping specific players.

[Prime BEEF]

I tend to agree - cap space in particular is overvalued as a commodity, it's mostly "valuable" to teams who are FA destinations, or teams that are willing to eat up salary from other teams in exchange for picks - neither of which the Spurs have been known to be. I'd rather have #2 and be paying Wiggins' salary in '21, than to have LMA, DD leave for nothing and have to wait for a "big FA signing" that isn't happening.

Totally agree. Doubt any big FA is signing with SA. Only way to improve is through trades and the draft...period.

[Prime BEEF]

If the spurs do make the GSW trade, who should be the pick at #2? It’s obviously all a guessing game but I’m not so sure that wiseman will be better than Toppin or Halliburton.

[spurspl]

If the spurs do make the GSW trade, who should be the pick at #2? It’s obviously all a guessing game but I’m not so sure that wiseman will be better than Toppin or Halliburton.

imo still with #2 - wiseman. But id also love to draft hali so why not to try and offer DET: ddr + murray + #41 for #7 + whoever if they want to. They have lots of money this offseason but theyr not a fav FAs destination, casey and ddr reunion, they were looking for a guard per rumors (murray) etc. imagine drafting wiseman, hali and smith. sweet dreams. i doubt spurs trade murray.

[Leetonidas]

Looks like NBA is targeting free agency to begin on Nov 21st. saw earlier they were reporting some teams expect to have the cap info from the league by the end of this week. hopefully that means we'll see some movement soon

[poopbox]

Contracts don't match but if we kid swap Turner for Lamarsha straight up that would be great

[Dverde]

Contracts don't match but if we kid swap Turner for Lamarsha straight up that would be great

Pacers got some trash contracts to make up the rest. I can’t see them trading LMA to a bad situation like Indy.