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  1. #2326
    Veteran Sugus's Avatar
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    What FAs have we ever landed? Finley and LMA? One every ten years? Both nice at the time, but not a viable strategy.

    I think a better strategy is cap space to absorb contracts to get picks, but that doesnít seem to be happening. SO...letís hope for internal development. BUT overpaying Jakob is going to be something we regret. Should have let him walk is my thought if we couldnít trade LMA. We are a guard team and should have kept that money for other players or, again, cap space.
    I was away and studying while the whole Poeltl debacle was going down, so I might not have all the context, but how is he overpaid? I thought his signing was just a bit above market value. Or did posters believe we were going to retain him at what, 5M? Especially seeing all the deals being signed this off-season, and taking into account Poeltl's projection into starting C beginning next season most likely, why would you say he's overpaid?

    E: aside from that, agree with you. Building through the draft and internal growth will be the Spurs' best path to contention.

  2. #2327
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    Poeltl played in 66 games for the Spurs last season, including 18 starts, averaging 5.6 points, a career-high 5.7 rebounds, 1.8 assists and a career-best 1.44 blocks while shooting 62.4 percent from the field in 17.7 minutes. After the NBA restart in July, Poeltl contested the second-most shots in the league (114) while starting all eight contests and averaging 8.3 points, 8.1 rebounds and 1.38 blocks in 25.8 minutes. He had a block in 14 straight games from January to February, the longest streak by a Spur last season.

    https://www.nba.com/spurs/news/spurs-re-sign-jakob-poeltl

    Spurs trying to hype up Poetl. Impressive stat, though. He truly has potential to be a defensive anchor. If he can improve even more on the defensive end, he can take care of any wing or guard being funneled to him as designed by the defensive system.

  3. #2328
    Veteran Dejounte's Avatar
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    Good video of Poetl's impact on defense. Shows how Morant was less effective with Poetl in the paint than when Eubanks was in.

  4. #2329
    Veteran Sugus's Avatar
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    Good video of Poetl's impact on defense. Shows how Morant was less effective with Poetl in the paint than when Eubanks was in.
    Good video! Really backs up what I see in Poeltl's interior defensive presence. Oh, by the way, I watched that video on Vassell that you rec'd me the other day! Some pretty interesting stuff. I still don't buy into the hype of him being more than a high-end 3-and-D player in his prime, but I'd be glad to be wrong. Also, I'm working through those PM's... Time isn't abundant these days. Lol.

  5. #2330
    Veteran The Truth #6's Avatar
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    I actually like Jakob. And I think his skill set is what we need. But next year he will be a backup center and that’s more than we should pay for someone in that role. If LMA wasn’t around, then I think it makes more sense.

    As for market value, I would say that it’s a quantifiable term but not especially helpful. The FO has a reputation for being smart, and so that typically means not getting sucked into a frenzy of throwing money at non-star free agents like the market does. Yes, every other team does this, but most teams do regrettable things. And I don’t see how people here can brag about the FO being so smart if they do exactly what everyone else does, at least in this situation.

    Also, with the pandemic and the likelihood of plummeting income, this seemed like a time to be conservative and save that money for someone else. But maybe Caterpillars are selling like hot cakes?

    In summary: they didn’t trade LMA, they signed Eubanks, and then signed Jakob. Those are three decisions all made around the center position. We now have 3 centers! And now we’re combing the scrap heap for combo forwards, our greatest need.
    I appreciate the FO’s loyalty to our players in general, and I understand the exponential learning curve it takes to play here, which is a challenge for most new players, but the FO needs to take a direction. Or better, and this is something they never do and we consider to be normal, but they communicate nothing to the fans as far as what direction we are headed. And so we speculate.

  6. #2331
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    I actually like Jakob. And I think his skill set is what we need. But next year he will be a backup center and thatís more than we should pay for someone in that role. If LMA wasnít around, then I think it makes more sense.

    As for market value, I would say that itís a quantifiable term but not especially helpful. The FO has a reputation for being smart, and so that typically means not getting sucked into a frenzy of throwing money at non-star free agents like the market does. Yes, every other team does this, but most teams do regrettable things. And I donít see how people here can brag about the FO being so smart if they do exactly what everyone else does, at least in this situation.

    Also, with the pandemic and the likelihood of plummeting income, this seemed like a time to be conservative and save that money for someone else. But maybe Caterpillars are selling like hot cakes?

    In summary: they didnít trade LMA, they signed Eubanks, and then signed Jakob. Those are three decisions all made around the center position. We now have 3 centers! And now weíre combing the scrap heap for combo forwards, our greatest need.
    I appreciate the FOís loyalty to our players in general, and I understand the exponential learning curve it takes to play here, which is a challenge for most new players, but the FO needs to take a direction. Or better, and this is something they never do and we consider to be normal, but they communicate nothing to the fans as far as what direction we are headed. And so we speculate.
    But Aldridge is more than likely gone in a season, so what's the difference and what was the alternative? Most of the quality C's either went to good teams and/or teams where they'd be guaranteed significant minutes. Good luck getting anyone of quality to sign the inexpensive, one year contract, to play about a third of a game, on a mediocre team, that many seemingly had their hopes up for.

    Off the top of my head, only the Cavaliers, Rockets, Bucks, Knicks and Kings don't have three C's at the moment and obviously that can/will change. Meanwhile, most teams are "combing the scrap heap for combo forwards".

    Hopefully Johnson being bigger/stronger isn't just a figment of our collective imagination and he can credibly defend most big wings.

  7. #2332
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    I am confused for months on end I was getting bashed for wanting old school Centers ďIf they canít shoot they not staying in the league, If they donít have a 3 ball game they are DinosaursĒ So what changed?

    Either way I am OK with the signing with the understanding that Poodle is our backup Center for the next couple of years or at least until he can hit a wide open mid range or 3 ball shot

  8. #2333
    Veteran The Truth #6's Avatar
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    But Aldridge is more than likely gone in a season, so what's the difference and what was the alternative? Most of the quality C's either went to good teams and/or teams where they'd be guaranteed significant minutes. Good luck getting anyone of quality to sign the inexpensive, one year contract, to play about a third of a game, on a mediocre team, that many seemingly had their hopes up for.

    Off the top of my head, only the Cavaliers, Rockets, Bucks, Knicks and Kings don't have three C's at the moment and obviously that can/will change. Meanwhile, most teams are "combing the scrap heap for combo forwards".

    Hopefully Johnson being bigger/stronger isn't just a figment of our collective imagination and he can credibly defend most big wings.
    This is cool. I unwittingly baited you into an optimistic outlook. Nice.

    I’m ok with LMA and Eubanks next year given that LMA is still on the team. If the FO can finally trade LMA and DD off the team for a better future I’m ok with too. Jakob is a good fit but unproven for playing more than about 28 minutes a game.

  9. #2334
    Believe. PhantomDashCam's Avatar
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    I was away and studying while the whole Poeltl debacle was going down, so I might not have all the context, but how is he overpaid? I thought his signing was just a bit above market value. Or did posters believe we were going to retain him at what, 5M? Especially seeing all the deals being signed this off-season, and taking into account Poeltl's projection into starting C beginning next season most likely, why would you say he's overpaid?

    E: aside from that, agree with you. Building through the draft and internal growth will be the Spurs' best path to contention.
    Hope the studying going well mate, hard to concentrate on work at times with the draft/FA news coming fast through the week.

    I can't echo the sentiments of all posters, but the concern about Poeltl's contract is more to do with the current construction of the roster and the potential implications going forward.
    There are certain "squeezes" bound to occur at various positions that are magnified further when player's such as Gay, Mills, DDR, LA and Poeltl project as one dimensional/one true position pieces on the court.
    All these players, except perhaps for Mills, are expected to occupy the court for at least 20-24 of the 48 minutes of court time next season. LA and Poeltl can no longer play together it seems; and we have a good indication of all the other player's listed and their abilities as we have watched them for 2+ seasons together.

    Poeltl walking would have been devastating to the Spurs in the short term, especially next season; however if the Spurs are far from contending status, do the ramifications really impact the Spurs ability to contend (in say my earliest estimates), 3 years time?

    It would have forced the Spurs to be creative in obtaining an abled replacement, most likely at the expense of another veteran occupying one of the said position via trade;
    also with the potential to acquire future assets (perhaps even one of the mul ude of 2020 picks that were available), cap space and valuable data on some of the young player's games going forward.

    My biggest concern for this season: the Spurs finish as a top 3 seed in the West (very possible, I expect them to come out of the gates strong), yet are clearly not at a contender's level; miss out on a key lottery pick for next year, resign the veterans to one year deals (as they feel they are close to winning it all), decline further in 2022 - and some of the youngn's have walked as a result of mismanaged court responsibilities.
    That's very much a worse case scenario and TBF I actually like what the Spurs succession plan appears to be, but they have confounded me before.
    Marco, Brynn overplays - Dejounte/D.White not playing together 'til season was basically lost etc.

    I think this is where some of the trepidation of the best of both worlds (contend/rebuild) plan comes into focus for me.

  10. #2335
    Veteran ace3g's Avatar
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    Bobby Marks BobbyMarks42





    Oklahoma City will create a $19.5M trade exception with the Danilo Gallinari sign-and-trade to Atlanta. The Thunder also have a $27.5M trade exception from the Steven Adams trade to New Orleans.
    6:40pm ∑ 24 Nov 2020Twitter for iPhone

  11. #2336
    Erryday I'm Hustlin' Robz4000's Avatar
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    Bobby Marks BobbyMarks42





    Oklahoma City will create a $19.5M trade exception with the Danilo Gallinari sign-and-trade to Atlanta. The Thunder also have a $27.5M trade exception from the Steven Adams trade to New Orleans.
    6:40pm ∑ 24 Nov 2020Twitter for iPhone
    they're gonna get even more picks

  12. #2337
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    Yup. This means heís staying on the bucks. 2021 free agency looking not looking good for the spurs now. LBJ and AD are staying with LAL. Kawhitter and George are likely staying with LAC. The freak is staying with bucks. That leaves CP3, Holiday, Lowry, oladipo, gobert, DDR, LMA, Adams, Drummond, dinwiddie

    Spurs having a ton of cap space wonít help much
    maybe they will go after DeRozan and Aldridge in Free agency

  13. #2338
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    Patty rubbing off on DJ? Look at that good teammate. Who says vets aren't important? Who says building character isn't important? Need more of that good vibes we have here.

  14. #2339
    Veteran r0drig0lac's Avatar
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    Bobby Marks BobbyMarks42





    Oklahoma City will create a $19.5M trade exception with the Danilo Gallinari sign-and-trade to Atlanta. The Thunder also have a $27.5M trade exception from the Steven Adams trade to New Orleans.
    6:40pm ∑ 24 Nov 2020Twitter for iPhone
    wow

  15. #2340
    Wolf Ruvinskis tonight...you's Avatar
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    Patty rubbing off on DJ? Look at that good teammate. Who says vets aren't important? Who says building character isn't important? Need more of that good vibes we have here.
    A team that cares: Cares for each other and how they go about business can elevate talent to a degree.
    Talent is the true trump card, but giving a about each other and the team is what elevates everything.
    From the singular to the totality.
    2014 is the proof.

  16. #2341
    Veteran The Truth #6's Avatar
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    I like it!

  17. #2342
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  18. #2343
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
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    I was one of those people who couldn't believe the Spurs took White over Bell. I came around pretty early compared to some STers, but it just seemed like the obvious need at the time. They did a good job there, though I think Bell has a career in the league still.

  19. #2344
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    Marc Stein @TheSteinLine
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    The Hawks and Bogdan Bogdanovic have been notified that the Kings will not be matching Atlanta's four-year, $72 million offer to the restricted free agent, league sources say Danilo Gallinari, Rajon Rondo, Kris Dunn and Bogdanovic to the Hawks in an eventful offseason

  20. #2345
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
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    I don't love the Hawks' off-season. They signed a bunch of JAGs to long-term deals.

  21. #2346
    Veteran Sugus's Avatar
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    Hope the studying going well mate, hard to concentrate on work at times with the draft/FA news coming fast through the week.

    I can't echo the sentiments of all posters, but the concern about Poeltl's contract is more to do with the current construction of the roster and the potential implications going forward.

    (...)
    Thanks for the well wishes. Interesting post. Yeah, I see the logic behind most of the criticism regarding Jak's contract - I just fundamentally disagree that the price he's being paid is so much above his market rate as to call him "overpaid". Especially when we know for a fact that he had at least 2 other teams making offers at him, besides the Spurs. I think a lot of posters don't really see what Poeltl brings to the table, nor how important he is to the rest of our young core. While losing him would definitely force the FO into more unconventional and "creative" ways, I don't think it would be a positive, nor his production easily replaced.

    I also don't agree that the sentences "worse case scenario" and "Spurs finish top 3 seed in the West" can be strung together... Any scenario where the Spurs make the playoffs, let alone get a top seed, is an overachievement considering our current roster, and would probably only be possible by huge leaps from one or more of our young players. That's more of a best case scenario to me... But I doubt it happens. I'm also rooting for a timely tank next season - contending teams are mostly lead by versatile wings, and that's exactly what we're lacking - and what the top of the '21 draft is apparently made of. But I don't trust the Spurs to full-out tank, so we better hope DD and LMA show some game at the beginning of the season, and some underachieving teams get desperate, tbh.

  22. #2347
    Wolf Ruvinskis tonight...you's Avatar
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    I don't love the Hawks' off-season. They signed a bunch of JAGs to long-term deals.
    You're quite right, but they are certainly going to be an interesting team to pay attention to.

  23. #2348
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    Not only are they getting more picks but they can also absorb some bad contracts out there.... Chips aren't the only indicator of a Good GM. This guy is the Dumbledore of Nba Trades and manipulating the cap.... ing Presti... There wasn't some dude working for Sam that the Spurs could have courted..... a Presti Protege.... we ended up with Urkle from Detroit.......
    He has to be related to BOOOBFORD.....by marraige by adoption... sumthin...
    My ignorance may be showing, but... what is a "Dumbledore"?

    Edit: Oh! Harry Potter. Makes sense. I've never watched the movies, or read the novels.
    Right on.

  24. #2349
    Believe.
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    Not only are they getting more picks but they can also absorb some bad contracts out there.... Chips aren't the only indicator of a Good GM. This guy is the Dumbledore of Nba Trades and manipulating the cap.... ing Presti... There wasn't some dude working for Sam that the Spurs could have courted..... a Presti Protege.... we ended up with Urkle from Detroit.......
    He has to be related to BOOOBFORD.....by marraige by adoption... sumthin...
    Troy Weaver Sam Presti's protege is the GM of Detroit now, he drafted 3 unathletic players and gave 20 million to Jerami Grant and 9 million to Mason Plumlee and 4 mil of dead money for 5 years. LOL

  25. #2350
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    Adams is horrible. If he was even average the thunder would have won against the rockets. He literally did nothing except jog up and down the court.
    he struggled because he wasnít used to a swarming, small ball defense.

    and TBH, the refs werenít used to it either. lotta missed calls.

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