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  1. #2226
    Veteran Dejounte's Avatar
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    #youthmovement

  2. #2227
    Veteran rjv's Avatar
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    No. I think what you and a lot of other fans are doing is letting your emotions cloud your memory. This is what timvp said at the time:

    https://www.spurstalk.com/spurs-free...des-first-day/



    The idea that all of the sudden it's a two-year window with expiring vets is false. It was predictable that it would be this way.



    Yes, I can. I really think you're turtling at this point. They weren't going to sign guys to multi-year deals to win, because they basically don't have a path toward a le. They would just give up cap space for nothing. But the alternative to being a contender is not tearing it down and rebuilding.



    Yes. Last year, they were more willing to sign guys to two-year deals, since they had two years left to do it. That's what happened with Morris and Carroll. This year, they don't have the same flexibility to sign guys to one-year deals due to the cap staying flat, and even if they did, they weren't going to sign guys like Beli or Forbes when they have young players. It's really obvious that you're being biased when the same thing you think will make other teams better than the Spurs -- the development of their young players -- is just completely dismissed for SA to fit the argument. Memphis having guys like Ja and JJJ take the next step is inevitable and fine, and boy why can't the Spurs do that. But then the Spurs are hoping for the same thing and it's, "That's dumb, they shoulda signed Torrey Craig instead."

    Just no.



    Making the playoffs isn't more important than developing their players or even keeping a good amount of cap space open for next summer. "Winning" doesn't mean that they have to hit a certain seed or victory total. It means they are going out there with a mentality of using their best talent and letting their young players come up around the talent instead of moving that talent and having the players try to expand their games into roles they might not be comfortable with. Vassell solidifying himself as a three-and-D player is more helpful to his long-term development than him flailing around with the ball trying to be the lead guy on a team that has no better talent. Same thing with Johnson and Walker. They got way too excited with Murray and tried to short-cut his development by having him focus on off-dribble pull-ups. Murray's impact has degraded to the point where he's a questionable rotation player.

    They can't let that happen with Johnson or the others. That seems inconceivable to many Spurs fans. But as promising as he and some of the young guys are, they aren't more talented than the sea of players from perennially bad teams that get huge roles and flame out or at best become extremely flawed and unbalanced minor stars. Constantly churning out those players is how you become a permabad team, and it's why it doesn't make sense to assume some of those teams with "better futures" really will pass the Spurs. A sizeable number of those guys will bust out. Another bit will be okay and get overpaid. The rest will be good and earn their money but then ask out because they don't want to be in that cesspool anymore.
    couldn't agree more; too many ST posters take the point of view that this team somehow is positioned to win in the immediate future which just isn't possible. the best route for the spurs to take at this time is what you mention in regards to development and cap space. there are many different ways to define "winning".

  3. #2228
    Veteran Dejounte's Avatar
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    "We still have a good mix of experienced and young players," said Poeltl. "The younger players can learn from the veterans and I hope we can continue as seamlessly as possible."

    https://news4sanantonio.com/amp/spor...mpression=true

    What an odd concept from Poetl to say that he values having vets to learn from. Wow! That is so strange.

    Another reason to hate the fact that we signed him! He hopes they can continue as seamless as possible! Trade him!

  4. #2229
    Believe. jeebus's Avatar
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    Raptors playing chess while Spurs playing comic checkers per usual last few years.
    Pop(and a few ST members) is probably still pissed that Baynes was better than Jeff Ayres in every way.

  5. #2230
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    I don’t care what people say the only way we come close to winning another championship will not be through free agency but Will through our draft picks. We won all those Championships from drafting David Robinson and Tim Duncan and right now I am hoping that Keldon, White, Vassell, Walker can be at least in the same realm as Sean, Bowen, Manu, and Tony.

    As far as cap room well a lot of that will go into signing our young players hopefully our front office makes the right choice in keeping the right ones and trading and getting something back for the ones we think won’t be good fits. I am still optimistic that we can at least get a mid to late draft pick for one of our players getting traded this season - crossing fingers. I honestly think if we can get another top 10 draft pick and another first in the 17 to 26 range we could find our starting Center and SF.

  6. #2231
    Veteran RC_Drunkford's Avatar
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    Even in the 2021 free agency class, there aren't any players who will move the needle. Do you want to pay 30 million for Gobert or a 32-year old Paul George? I don't. Spurs need Lonnie to develop into a superstar, he's the only young guy who has the potential to become a real franchise player. The sooner the better. White can be a 3rd option, so can Vassell if everything pans out. Keldon might be able to be a legit 2nd option. The jury is still out on Dejounte. Internal improvement is the only way for this team to get back to contention. Maybe add a Jonathan Isaac or Markannen at PF, but next offseason won't be special either.

  7. #2232
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    Even in the 2021 free agency class, there aren't any players who will move the needle. Do you want to pay 30 million for Gobert or a 32-year old Paul George? I don't. Spurs need Lonnie to develop into a superstar, he's the only young guy who has the potential to become a real franchise player. The sooner the better. White can be a 3rd option, so can Vassell if everything pans out. Keldon might be able to be a legit 2nd option. The jury is still out on Dejounte. Internal improvement is the only way for this team to get back to contention. Maybe add a Jonathan Isaac or Markannen at PF, but next offseason won't be special either.
    I believe Markannen is available...or at least will be..

  8. #2233
    Believe.
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    Spurs could keep 15th roster spot open to save money and maintain some trade flexibility. A two for one trade for any of their vets is not improbable between now and deadline.

  9. #2234
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    That's ing depressing. I'd take Baynes any day of the week over Poetl.
    I'd think twice about that.

    https://www.boxscoregeeks.com/player...89&season=2019

    Baynes takes the points category, but, Poetl is better on Rebounds, Blocks, Assists, Steals, Fouls and Turnovers. Scoring efficiency (by all measures) is strongly in Poetl's favor as well, although Baynes does shoot 3's (8.6 att/40, at 35.1%; Poetl 0 attempts).

  10. #2235
    The Dude minds DPG21920's Avatar
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    Spurs could keep 15th roster spot open to save money and maintain some trade flexibility. A two for one trade for any of their vets is not improbable between now and deadline.
    Depends. If we all agree they won’t pay tax? Then a 2 for 1 can only happen if the salaries Sa take back are virtually equal or less than what they send out.

    So now on top of trades already being difficult, they have to find a team that 1) wants our vets 2) is willing to give up enough value where Sa is ready to pull that trigger and 3) what they’re willing to give up is equal or less than salary we have going to them.

    You see how narrow that gets?

  11. #2236
    I want some NASTY! SpurPadre's Avatar
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    If what you’re saying is true then I’m even more convinced Poeltl was a mistake. Can’t have it both ways here imo. They weren’t willing to change the team at all because of some insanely strict 2 year plan but are willing to punt 9M in cap space for a back up Center?? That makes absolutely zero sense in the framework of what you’re pitching.

    Beyond that, not trading ANY of the vets for future capital makes no sense either. If payoffs aren’t really a goal as you mentioned you can absolutely trade at least one of the vets and still have functioned in the parameters you outlined.

    No matter how you slice it with what you’ve outlined it’s non sensical in both angles at best and a signal this front office is bottom tier with regard to doing anything creative/team building at worst.

    Poetl is overpaid and I still think he's playing in the wrong era but that's the market now and he's still young.

    Also, PATFO did try to get #2 pick for LMA but the Dubs weren't seriously taking any offers. They've been openly saying that alot the past few days. Sources in the Bay Area do say the Spurs were the only team that remotely made them think about it, though. The point is, PATFO were willing to deal LMA away but without the 2nd pick or any other picks this year, what's the point now? Wouldn't the best thing to do would be for him to showcase himself as a 35 year old still doing work this season and deal him by the deadline if we turn out to be a bad team?

  12. #2237
    Believe.
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    Depends. If we all agree they won’t pay tax? Then a 2 for 1 can only happen if the salaries Sa take back are virtually equal or less than what they send out.

    So now on top of trades already being difficult, they have to find a team that 1) wants our vets 2) is willing to give up enough value where Sa is ready to pull that trigger and 3) what they’re willing to give up is equal or less than salary we have going to them.

    You see how narrow that gets?
    It's been narrowing by the day, but the team still has options. I'm not concerned about the tax line because the team can buyout one of their vets at deadline to get under the line, if they find themselves within a couple million of relief. Plus there is the possibility that the Spurs would take back less money in a trade.

    I don't think any of this is likely to be super exciting, but I don't think there is reason to be too concerned about the tax line right now.

  13. #2238
    The Dude minds DPG21920's Avatar
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    It's been narrowing by the day, but the team still has options. I'm not concerned about the tax line because the team can buyout one of their vets at deadline to get under the line, if they find themselves within a couple million of relief. Plus there is the possibility that the Spurs would take back less money in a trade.

    I don't think any of this is likely to be super exciting, but I don't think there is reason to be too concerned about the tax line right now.
    True. We don’t know for sure what SA is willing to do. I’m just making my best guess. Trade can absolutely still be done; just appears more difficult every day. But there are a couple teams like Ny&Det with cap space that may actually work well as trade partners.

    They have not secured any notable fa with their space and can absorb a lot of salary

  14. #2239
    The Dude minds DPG21920's Avatar
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    Poetl is overpaid and I still think he's playing in the wrong era but that's the market now and he's still young.

    Also, PATFO did try to get #2 pick for LMA but the Dubs weren't seriously taking any offers. They've been openly saying that alot the past few days. Sources in the Bay Area do say the Spurs were the only team that remotely made them think about it, though. The point is, PATFO were willing to deal LMA away but without the 2nd pick or any other picks this year, what's the point now? Wouldn't the best thing to do would be for him to showcase himself as a 35 year old still doing work this season and deal him by the deadline if we turn out to be a bad team?
    The point kind of is regardless of being a “bad” team or not. Let’s say SA is not a terrible team but are within 3-6 games of 8th at deadline?

    To me, if you aren’t taking winning at least somewhat seriously you should absolutely be prioritizing your future more. The concern is that LMA value only decreases the longer Sa waits. I don’t see many paths to his value rising.

  15. #2240
    Believe.
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    True. We don’t know for sure what SA is willing to do. I’m just making my best guess. Trade can absolutely still be done; just appears more difficult every day. But there are a couple teams like Ny&Det with cap space that may actually work well as trade partners.

    They have not secured any notable fa with their space and can absorb a lot of salary
    We'll know more by Thanksgiving. If Atlanta misses on Bogdan (doubtful), then there might be a before-the-holiday-desperately-seeking-to-use-space-market that could benefit the Spurs. I wouldn't bet on it, but Atlanta, Houston, Orlando, NY, and Detroit all teams to watch, particularly for DeRozan, imo. Maybe Sacramento.

  16. #2241
    Veteran Dejounte's Avatar
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    I kinda think if you weren't a regular in the Austin Spurs Thread last year and before the Covid this year.... you really aren't a spurs fan your either a fan of the Benefactor a posters who post to , or both. Than Venn Diagram set has lots of cross over
    Sorry to disappoint you. What are you disagreeing with? We can discuss.

  17. #2242
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    True. We don’t know for sure what SA is willing to do. I’m just making my best guess. Trade can absolutely still be done; just appears more difficult every day. But there are a couple teams like Ny&Det with cap space that may actually work well as trade partners.

    They have not secured any notable fa with their space and can absorb a lot of salary
    Isn’t he a chris paul the same age? LMA resting & rehabilitating, so he may show better than you think����

  18. #2243
    Believe. PhantomDashCam's Avatar
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  19. #2244
    Veteran ace3g's Avatar
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    Shams Charania ShamsCharania





    Cousins is signing a new deal with the Rockets, sources said.



    Shams Charania
    ShamsCharania



    Free agent DeMarcus Cousins and the Houston Rockets are nearing a deal, sources tell @TheAthleticNBA @Stadium.


    4:46pm · 23 Nov 2020 · TweetDeck

  20. #2245
    what uganda do about it? Joseph Kony's Avatar
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    Cousins to Houston is interesting. I wonder what they plan on doing with Harden considering he said he wants out, and no one wants Westbrook Spurs should offer LMA/DeRozan/White/1st for Harden and Tucker imo. benefits both teams, even though i despise harden

  21. #2246
    Veteran tbdog's Avatar
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    Cousins to Houston is interesting. I wonder what they plan on doing with Harden considering he said he wants out, and no one wants Westbrook Spurs should offer LMA/DeRozan/White/1st for Harden and Tucker imo. benefits both teams, even though i despise harden
    That would be a gutsy call.

  22. #2247
    The Dude minds DPG21920's Avatar
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    Vegas has Spurs wins at 31. More or less ST and surprised at total or no?

  23. #2248
    Believe. Kurik's Avatar
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    Vegas has Spurs wins at 31. More or less ST and surprised at total or no?
    If the team stays pat, I think it's pretty realistic maybe plus or minus 5 games.

  24. #2249
    The Timeless One Leetonidas's Avatar
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    31 sounds about right. 34 max

  25. #2250
    Erryday I'm Hustlin' Robz4000's Avatar
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    I say the Sours finish 32-50 tbh, but it should be a much more enjoyable season than last. Hopefully they move the vets by the trade deadline for something.

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