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  1. #1
    Believe.
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    How did we miss on Nikola Jokic at 30th in 2014? I thought we had the edge in international scouting, a 3-tool player who can pass, shoot, and rebound.

    I personally had him up off my mock board at 18th to the Phoenix Suns.

    We could have ran it back in 2015 with him and Manu running the second unit.

  2. #2
    Europhile Play Boban's Avatar
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    Pop would’ve ruined him

  3. #3
    Machacarredes Chinook's Avatar
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    Jokic is basically Ryan Richards had Richards gotten way better instead of being content to waste his talent. Nikola didn't seem to care in Europe, but they Nuggets managed to talk sense into him during that stash season.

  4. #4
    5. timvp's Avatar
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    The scouting report on Jokic was that he was fat, addicted to soda, didn't really like basketball and said his goal was to work on his family's farm. Proof that it's best to sometimes ignore scouting reports, tbh.

  5. #5
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    Draft is a crapshoot.

  6. #6
    Shhhh... I'll be gentle. TheDoctor's Avatar
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    The scouting report on Jokic was that he was fat, addicted to soda, didn't really like basketball and said his goal was to work on his family's farm. Proof that it's best to sometimes ignore scouting reports, tbh.

  7. #7
    Veteran John B's Avatar
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    Denver has mini-beautiful game going on with Jokic/Murray reading and passing to better shot. They realistically have a shot against LeBron tbh

  8. #8
    You Are Not Worthy ZeusWillJudge's Avatar
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    The scouting report on Jokic was that he was fat, addicted to soda, didn't really like basketball and said his goal was to work on his family's farm. Proof that it's best to sometimes ignore scouting reports, tbh.

    Heh. I remember thinking that the Spurs were going to run him into the ground in the playoffs, and he would fade at the end of games. Bas never slowed down.

  9. #9
    Veteran John B's Avatar
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    Jokic has a lot of old man game, very smart player. To big men who think small ball, this is the ticket. He is how you play big man game. To be honest, I see a lot of Timmy in him reading the plays. Itís so beautiful to look at.

  10. #10
    D up! exstatic's Avatar
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    Misleading le. Should be ‘How did 30 teams miss on Jokic in 2014?’

  11. #11
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    The scouting report on Jokic was that he was fat, addicted to soda, didn't really like basketball and said his goal was to work on his family's farm. Proof that it's best to sometimes ignore scouting reports, tbh.

    What I preach constantly

  12. #12
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    The scouting report on Jokic was that he was fat, addicted to soda, didn't really like basketball and said his goal was to work on his family's farm. Proof that it's best to sometimes ignore scouting reports, tbh.
    I was actually reading Nikola's scouting reports not too long ago (to see how some European players scouting reports compared to Pokusevskis) and I was surprised to find this bit:

    Strengths: Very high basketball IQ, This is his greatest strength. Strong personality. A team player. Has a great work ethic … Tremendous length … Can really shoot the ball … Hard worker … He was first introduced to real professional training – strength and conditioning as well as basketball workouts in September of 2013 and has shown tremendous improvement in his body … Possesses a big wingpan … Considering the fact that he competes in the Adriatic league, where most players are older than he is, and also that he’s an average athlete, he uses his basketball IQ to succeed… Nikola understands the game really well. Furthermore he is able to follow and execute coach’s instructions. Shows a winning at ude, competes hard in games and practices … A self starter, doesn’t need to constantly be pushed to get the most of his abilties … Well liked by teammates, outgoing, strong character, doesn’t drink or smoke … Young player, born in February of 1995 …
    https://www.nbadraft.net/players/nikola-jokic/

    Of course there are also things like these:

    The big downside, though, is his athleticism. He doesn't get much lift off the floor at all, and he doesn't have the speed burst to drive past opponents or stay in front of them laterally.

    It's going to give him major problems on defense and limit him to being a role player on offense.
    A high IQ and great length might be enough to earn Jokic some minutes early in his career, but he won't provide enough defense or scoring firepower to gain a substantial role.

    It will take time for him to prove he can compensate for his underwhelming athleticism and compete with NBA bigs for long stretches.
    If Jokic can deliver accurate shooting and make the right plays when the ball is in his hands, he could be a poor-man's Diaw and a long-range threat like Antic. Jokic would probably be the fourth or fifth scoring option when he's in the game, but all that matters is whether he plays efficiently.

    Unfortunately, his defense will likely prevent him from ever playing 30-plus minutes or starting. However, there's no shame in being a respectable reserve on a winning team in the future.


    https://www.google.com/amp/s/syndica...-more.amp.html

  13. #13
    Veteran RD2191's Avatar
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    Because PATFO is overrated tbh

  14. #14
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    Jokic has a lot of old man game, very smart player. To big men who think small ball, this is the ticket. He is how you play big man game. To be honest, I see a lot of Timmy in him reading the plays. It’s so beautiful to look at.
    great take. And he ALSO runs the floor and his team, it is so clear to see with those side cameras in the bubble court how active he was organising, directing etc etc. Brilliant player

  15. #15
    Veteran R. DeMurre's Avatar
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    If Jokic can deliver accurate shooting and make the right plays when the ball is in his hands, he could be a poor-man's Diaw and a long-range threat like Antic. Jokic would probably be the fourth or fifth scoring option when he's in the game, but all that matters is whether he plays efficiently.


  16. #16
    Veteran ace3g's Avatar
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  17. #17
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    Jokic has a lot of old man game, very smart player. To big men who think small ball, this is the ticket. He is how you play big man game. To be honest, I see a lot of Timmy in him reading the plays. It’s so beautiful to look at.
    He's admitted in interviews that he's studied Tim Duncan's post game. He also said earlier this year that he wanted to be the Tim Duncan of Denver. A very likable player and my favorite Non-Spur.

  18. #18
    Got Woke? DMC's Avatar
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    If anything should be apparent to NBA fans its that physique doesn't equate to ability or talent. Look at how effective Diaw was, or Blair when he was effective, or Curry, or Doncic, or Dirk, or Klay, or Bird, or Magic. None of these guys had great physiques. Even Timmy didn't have a great physique. They were great players though. Marc Gasol was a dumpy kid.

  19. #19
    Veteran RD2191's Avatar
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    If anything should be apparent to NBA fans its that physique doesn't equate to ability or talent. Look at how effective Diaw was, or Blair when he was effective, or Curry, or Doncic, or Dirk, or Klay, or Bird, or Magic. None of these guys had great physiques. Even Timmy didn't have a great physique. They were great players though. Marc Gasol was a dumpy kid.
    Too bad that wasn't the case for you, fat sack of .

  20. #20
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    I was looking for these scouting reports to see how some of these aspects could translate to our guy, Pokusevski. I found the following bits interesting:

    These deficiencies will be most glaring on the defensive side, where he'll struggle to keep up with NBA-caliber speed. Whether he's guarding power forwards or centers, he'll have trouble staying in front of them or consistently protecting the rim.
    These are some of the concerns regarding Poku. He will struggle on defense keeping up laterally with "NBA-caliber speed". Jokic, without being even an average defender, is still far from a liability out there. Granted, Jokic is strictly a center and Poku will probably have to guard opposing PF's, but Poku is also infinitely more mobile than Jokic, and if a guy like Jokic isn't a liability on this league of constant pick and switch, then I see no reason why Pokusevski should be one (at least on the perimeter).

    He also won't be as effective on the boards as he is in the Adriatic League.
    This reminds me of R.C. saying Scola wouldn't be able to rebound at the NBA level. Rebounding always translates from Europe to the NBA, always. Don't ask me why but it just happens. Maybe because the spacier courts of the NBA allow for less contesting on rebounds, or maybe for another reason, but this is just a fact: if a Europe guy makes it on the NBA, he will see his rebounding numbers increase. Given the fact that Poku is already a pretty damn good rebounder in Europe, his potential is mouth watering on this aspect of the game.

    The slow-footed tendencies will also hurt his chances to create offense. Even on closeout drives, his slashing will get corralled pretty easily by help defenders, and he won't be able to elevate over upper-echelon defenders.
    Another aspect that people need to realize in the "Europe to NBA" transition: offense comes way easier in the NBA despite the glaring athletic difference in defenders. If a guy can break down a defense on Europe, he will be able to break down a defense on the NBA. The reasons for this are obvious: spacier courts and friendlier rules for offenses.

    As a second-tier prospect, he may not be expected to produce much, but you can't underestimate a player with good instincts and intelligence.
    This one stuck with me: "you can't underestimate a player with good instincts and intelligence". IQ >>> any other basketball trait (or thing in life). Can somebody name me an all-time great that was known for not being intelligent in a basketball court? What about any dumb great role players (the type that help you win championships)?

    Sure, there are plenty of examples of all-star (or even superstar) players that accomplished that status on skills and athletic ability alone, while displaying subpar IQs. Guys like Westbrook, Iverson, Rose, Carmelo, etc. What do they all have in common? At the end of the day, you are better off trading them away because you realize you can't never win with them no matter how talented they are.

    Sure, if you have the chance to select between a Russell Westbrook or a Robert Horry you have to go with the former, don't get me wrong.

    But if your choice comes down to same level of talent, you are better off going with the guy that shows a higher IQ. You are better off with a Dwayne Wade than a Carmelo Anthony, or with a Derrick White than a Dejounte Murray, or, in this case, an Aleksej Pokusevski than a Precious Achiuwa.
    Last edited by DAF86; 6 Days Ago at 12:44 AM.

  21. #21
    Veteran R. DeMurre's Avatar
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    If anything should be apparent to NBA fans its that physique doesn't equate to ability or talent. Look at how effective Diaw was, or Blair when he was effective, or Curry, or Doncic, or Dirk, or Klay, or Bird, or Magic. None of these guys had great physiques. Even Timmy didn't have a great physique. They were great players though. Marc Gasol was a dumpy kid.
    Also why I think advanced stats are so important, especially when they contradict the "eye test." A season's worth of objective stats don't have the flash of slam dunk posterizations or crossover broken ankles, but they usually tell a more accurate story regarding a player's effectiveness and contributions to winning.

  22. #22
    You Are Not Worthy ZeusWillJudge's Avatar
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    I was looking for these scouting reports to see how some of these aspects could translate to our guy, Pokusevski.

    Brah... Jokic was big and strong as . Pokusevski is built like Jack Skellington.

    To be fair, I think Jokic juiced to build muscle and lose baby fat. Maybe if Pokusevski did a chemical summer, he could put on enough weight.



  23. #23
    R.C. Drunkford TimDunkem's Avatar
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    Fathead was just a talent too good to pass up.

  24. #24
    R.C. Drunkford TimDunkem's Avatar
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    Seriously

    the one time they passed on a Euro

    PATFO

  25. #25
    Veteran R. DeMurre's Avatar
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    I was looking for these scouting reports to see how some of these aspects could translate to our guy, Pokusevski. I found the following bits interesting:



    These are some of the concerns regarding Poku. He will struggle on defense keeping up laterally with "NBA-caliber speed". Jokic, without being even an average defender, is still far from a liability out there. Granted, Jokic is strictly a center and Poku will probably have to guard opposing PF's, but Poku is also infinitely more mobile than Jokic, and if a guy like Jokic isn't a liability on this league of constant pick and switch, then I see no reason why Pokusevski should be one (at least on the perimeter).



    This reminds me of R.C. saying Scola wouldn't be able to rebound at the NBA level. Rebounding always translates from Europe to the NBA, always. Don't ask me why but it just happens. Maybe because the spacier courts of the NBA allow for less contesting on rebounds, or maybe for another reason, but this is just a fact: if a Europe guy makes it to the NBA, he will see his rebounding numbers increase. Given the fact that Poku is already a pretty damn good rebounder in Europe, his potential is mouth watering on this aspect of the game.



    Another aspect that people need to realize in the "Europe to NBA" transition: offense comes way easier in the NBA despite the glaring athletic difference in defenders. If a guy can break down a defense on Europe, he will be able to break down a defense on the NBA. The reasons for this are obvious: spacier courts and friendlier rules for offenses.



    This one stuck with me: "you can't underestimate a player with good instincts and intelligence". IQ >>> any other basketball trait (or thing in life). Can somebody name me an all-time great that was known for not being intelligent in a basketball court? What about any dumb great role players (the type that help you win championships)?

    Sure, there are plenty of examples of all-star (or even superstar) players that accomplished that status on skills and athletic ability alone, while displaying subpar IQs. Guys like Westbrook, Iverson, Rose, Carmelo, etc. What do they all have in common? At the end of the day, you are better off trading them away because you realize you can't never win with them no matter how talented they are.

    Sure, if you have the chance to select between a Russell Westbrook or a Robert Horry you have to go with the former, don't get me wrong.

    But if your choice comes down to same level of talent, you are better off going with the guy that shows a higher IQ. You are better off with a Dwayne Wade than a Carmelo Anthony, or with a Derrick White than a Dejounte Murray, or, in this case, an Aleksej Pokusevski than a Precious Achiuwa.


    Yeah, watching Jokic & the Nuggets tonight had me wondering how many GMs, scouts, and coaches were also watching and thinking about another 7' Serb with great passing skills and a sky high BB IQ... Jokic was the best player on the floor while shooting 5-13-- that looks a lot like Pokusevski's stat lines during a 10-1 run while playing for Olympiacos B, who were 6-3 when he didn't play. Jokic was too fat, and Pokusevski is too skinny. They might be the Laurel and Hardy of Serbian draft surprises.
    Last edited by R. DeMurre; 6 Days Ago at 12:55 AM.

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