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  1. #1
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    CBO study notes an aspect of that raise would mean it could be passed by reconciliation, bypassing the fascist party objections in the Senate.

    CBO Report:
    https://www.cbo.gov/publication/56975

    NYT article:
    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/02/08/u...-wage-cbo.html

    Minimum Wage Hike Would Help Poverty but Cost Jobs, Budget Office Say

    WASHINGTON — Raising the federal minimum wage to $15 an hour — a proposal included in the package of relief measures being pushed by President Biden — would add $54 billion to the budget deficit over the next decade, the Congressional Budget Office concluded on Monday.

    Normally, a prediction of increased debt might harm the plan’s political chances. But proponents of the wage hike seized on the forecast as evidence that the hotly contested proposal could survive a procedural challenge under the Senate’s arcane rules.

    Democrats are trying to add the measure to a $1.9 trillion pandemic relief package that is advancing through a process called budget reconciliation, which requires a simple majority rather than the 60-vote margin to overcome a filibuster. But reconciliation is reserved for matters with a significant budgetary effect.

    Senator Bernie Sanders, the Vermont independent, said the forecast of an increased deficit showed that the measure passed the test. Raising the federal minimum wage to $15 “would have a direct and substantial impact on the federal budget,” he said in a statement. “What that means is we can clearly raise the minimum wage to $15 an hour under the rules.”

    -------------------------------------------------------

  2. #2
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    Lots of criticism about that CBO report for putting its thumb on the scale and highlighting negative reports while hiding the positive gains of raising the minimum wage

    If Trump repug people are running the CBO then it has absolutely no credibility

  3. #3
    my unders, my frgn whites pgardn's Avatar
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    I am not close to an economist, but some of the most vulnerable small businesses in places like South Texas or not going to be able to handle this.

    It has always been a problem legislating equality in wealth. I would think tax cuts for the richest are not the way to go, but beyond this and a few other things this is always been tough. This requires a cultural change beyond me myself and I imo.

    If you read many red team members responses under Trump then it’s pretty clear the culture is dogs eat dogs. How you change this, I have a not a clue. They truly believe this pseudo-Darwinian “I got to get mine first at the expense of others”

    * Foot note

    Many of these people claim to be Christians.

  4. #4
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    CBO study notes an aspect of that raise would mean it could be passed by reconciliation, bypassing the fascist party objections in the Senate.

    CBO Report:
    https://www.cbo.gov/publication/56975

    NYT article:
    https://www.nytimes.com/2021/02/08/u...-wage-cbo.html

    Minimum Wage Hike Would Help Poverty but Cost Jobs, Budget Office Say

    WASHINGTON — Raising the federal minimum wage to $15 an hour — a proposal included in the package of relief measures being pushed by President Biden — would add $54 billion to the budget deficit over the next decade, the Congressional Budget Office concluded on Monday.

    Normally, a prediction of increased debt might harm the plan’s political chances. But proponents of the wage hike seized on the forecast as evidence that the hotly contested proposal could survive a procedural challenge under the Senate’s arcane rules.

    Democrats are trying to add the measure to a $1.9 trillion pandemic relief package that is advancing through a process called budget reconciliation, which requires a simple majority rather than the 60-vote margin to overcome a filibuster. But reconciliation is reserved for matters with a significant budgetary effect.

    Senator Bernie Sanders, the Vermont independent, said the forecast of an increased deficit showed that the measure passed the test. Raising the federal minimum wage to $15 “would have a direct and substantial impact on the federal budget,” he said in a statement. “What that means is we can clearly raise the minimum wage to $15 an hour under the rules.”

    -------------------------------------------------------
    should have been 15 dollars 10 years ago.

    as others have pointed out, a one size fits all living wage is not going be a good fit in communities where the general standard of living is lower.

  5. #5
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    This country's CEOs have increased their own pay by 1000 percent in the last 40 years. Meanwhile our workers have the worst benefits of any wealthy nation. Right now those CEOs are out there saying that raising the minimum wage from a pitiful $7.25 an hour to a barely liveable $15/hour will cost jobs.
    But if we're barely compensating those workers in the first place, and raising pay for people will "cost jobs" *while these CEOs keep raising their own pay,* BY DEFINITION THAT OUTRAGEOUS CEO PAY IS THE THING THAT IS COSTING JOBS.

  6. #6
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    phased in too slowly to make a difference, tbh.

    should have been 15 dollars 10 years ago.
    Agree to some extent. Not ideal, but all for whatever can get passed. Better than nothing.

  7. #7
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    I am not close to an economist, but some of the most vulnerable small businesses in places like South Texas or not going to be able to handle this.

    It has always been a problem legislating equality in wealth. I would think tax cuts for the richest are not the way to go, but beyond this and a few other things this is always been tough. This requires a cultural change beyond me myself and I imo.

    If you read many red team members responses under Trump then it’s pretty clear the culture is dogs eat dogs. How you change this, I have a not a clue. They truly believe this pseudo-Darwinian “I got to get mine first at the expense of others”

    * Foot note

    Many of these people claim to be Christians.
    They will simply raise prices, and oddly, many of their customers will be able to afford that.

    Not the doom many think. THere will be anecdotes of businesses closing, and they will be endlessly parroted on fascist media outlets, but they will be offset by the millions of people who will benefit.

    There will be a net job loss, but it will be from people who now don't have to work 2 or 3 jobs to make ends meet.

  8. #8
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    Congressional Budget Office is 'putting its thumb on the scale' in its minimum wage predictions

    the CBO ignored the bulk of the economic research showing what has already happened as a result of minimum wage increases.

    The CBO agrees with the best available economic research that a lot of people will get raises as a result of a gradual increase to $15, and projects 900,000 will be lifted out of poverty.

    But the
    CBO projects a number of job losses—1.4 million—

    that is simply not supported by the cutting edge research into, again,
    what has already happened.

    https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2021/2/9/2014727/-Raising-the-minimum-wage-will-lift-hundreds-of-thousands-of-people-out-of-poverty

    Phillip Swagel is a Republican but has a bipartisan career.


    ===================

    McDonald's CEO: Chain will do 'just fine' with higher wages


    https://www.restaurantdive.com/news/...-wages/594182/

  9. #9
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    Congressional Budget Office is 'putting its thumb on the scale' in its minimum wage predictions

    the CBO ignored the bulk of the economic research showing what has already happened as a result of minimum wage increases.

    The CBO agrees with the best available economic research that a lot of people will get raises as a result of a gradual increase to $15, and projects 900,000 will be lifted out of poverty.

    But the
    CBO projects a number of job losses—1.4 million—

    that is simply not supported by the cutting edge research into, again,
    what has already happened.

    https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2021/2/9/2014727/-Raising-the-minimum-wage-will-lift-hundreds-of-thousands-of-people-out-of-poverty

    Phillip Swagel is a Republican but has a bipartisan career.


    ===================

    McDonald's CEO: Chain will do 'just fine' with higher wages


    https://www.restaurantdive.com/news/...-wages/594182/
    That was my thoughts as well, just haven't had time to delve back into the research. There will be a lot of "jobs" lost, but that will be offset by people not having to work "extra" jobs, i.e. withdrawing from the labor force.

    Net effect on overall employment will be pretty minor, since that is what has happened in places in the US where the wage was raised.

    There will be no shortage of anecdotes about harm. There is a cost to this.

    I am 100% sure that those anecdotes will be endlessly parroted by the fascist media outlets.

  10. #10
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    John Thune's childhood $6 wage—$24 adjusted for inflation—sure helps make the case for at least $15

    "I started working

    by bussing tables at the Star Family Restaurant for $1/hour and slowly moved up to cook—the big leagues for a kid like me—

    to earn $6/hour,"

    Thune, born in 1961, started earning $6 an hour, the seemingly modest wage he pulled in as a teenager

    would be equivalent to roughly $25 today.

    https://www.rawstory.com/john-thunes-childhood-6-wage-24-adjusted-for-inflation-sure-helps-make-the-case-for-at-least-15

    Maybe South Dakotans are THAT DUMB
    Last edited by boutons_deux; 02-25-2021 at 03:59 PM.

  11. #11
    my unders, my frgn whites pgardn's Avatar
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    They will simply raise prices, and oddly, many of their customers will be able to afford that.

    Not the doom many think. THere will be anecdotes of businesses closing, and they will be endlessly parroted on fascist media outlets, but they will be offset by the millions of people who will benefit.

    There will be a net job loss, but it will be from people who now don't have to work 2 or 3 jobs to make ends meet.
    $15 an hour is nowhere near enough for some areas, and I could live quite well in Aransas Pass for this much. there needs to be some cost-of-living adjustment and I have not the foggiest idea how to do it, that’s for the economists and other people who understand the different regions. seems like it would be a big mess though.

  12. #12
    bandwagoner fans suck ducks's Avatar
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    USA USA
    Raise alll prices will not matter
    Why to go donkeys

  13. #13
    Enemy of the System Millennial_Messiah's Avatar
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    $15 an hour is nowhere near enough for some areas, and I could live quite well in Aransas Pass for this much. there needs to be some cost-of-living adjustment and I have not the foggiest idea how to do it, that’s for the economists and other people who understand the different regions. seems like it would be a big mess though.
    It'd be downright stupid to make it $15 minimum at the FEDERAL level which would bankrupt the poor and rural communities, not to mention cause mass inflation there which is bad for everyone except the filthy rich jews.

    What should be done is give each individual jurisdiction / city limit the opportunity to raise local minimum wages UP TO $15 an hour... for example, a federal law requiring say, a $10+ minimum wage for all cities with 500K+ population, would be reasonable.

    But a one-size-fits-all more-than-doubled federal minimum wage for the entire USA, aka the most diverse nation in the history of the universe, is downright moronic, re ed, crippling, and ignorant.

  14. #14
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    $15 an hour is nowhere near enough for some areas, and I could live quite well in Aransas Pass for this much. there needs to be some cost-of-living adjustment and I have not the foggiest idea how to do it, that’s for the economists and other people who understand the different regions. seems like it would be a big mess though.
    Cost of Living Indexes by city or region are very well developed, and available from many sources, for US and foreign cities.

    CoL indexes may be already used by govt relocations and certainly by companies. not at mysterious
    Last edited by boutons_deux; 02-25-2021 at 04:13 PM.

  15. #15
    Enemy of the System Millennial_Messiah's Avatar
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    Cost of Living Indexes by city or region are very well developed, and available from many sources, for US and foreign cities.

    CoL indexes may be already used by govt relocations and certainly by companies. not at mysterious
    When those Indian s guzzler recruiters tell me the salary for IT Job X is $125K in Texas, but if I relocate to Bay Area, California the salary is $132K because of "cost of living adjustment".

    I just hang up the phone, and laugh my a$$ off.

  16. #16
    dangerous floater Winehole23's Avatar
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    Costco just jumped on board.

  17. #17
    I am that guy RandomGuy's Avatar
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    It'd be downright stupid to make it $15 minimum at the FEDERAL level which would bankrupt the poor and rural communities, not to mention cause mass inflation there which is bad for everyone except the filthy rich jews.

    What should be done is give each individual jurisdiction / city limit the opportunity to raise local minimum wages UP TO $15 an hour... for example, a federal law requiring say, a $10+ minimum wage for all cities with 500K+ population, would be reasonable.

    But a one-size-fits-all more-than-doubled federal minimum wage for the entire USA, aka the most diverse nation in the history of the universe, is downright moronic, re ed, crippling, and ignorant.
    It won't cause mass inflation nationally, any more than it caused inflation in the states where it was implemented.

    Economics fail.

  18. #18
    bandwagoner fans suck ducks's Avatar
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  19. #19
    Believe. Dirks_Finale's Avatar
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    Yeah hard to imagine a $15 minimum wage in West Virginia. No wonder why Manchin won't sign off on this.

    What sucks about politicians is it has to be all or nothing. Why not negotiate a $12 minimum wage instead? (I think 10 is too low even for WV or Kentucky. )

    It'd be downright stupid to make it $15 minimum at the FEDERAL level which would bankrupt the poor and rural communities, not to mention cause mass inflation there which is bad for everyone except the filthy rich jews.

    What should be done is give each individual jurisdiction / city limit the opportunity to raise local minimum wages UP TO $15 an hour... for example, a federal law requiring say, a $10+ minimum wage for all cities with 500K+ population, would be reasonable.

    But a one-size-fits-all more-than-doubled federal minimum wage for the entire USA, aka the most diverse nation in the history of the universe, is downright moronic, re ed, crippling, and ignorant.

  20. #20
    Veteran DarrinS's Avatar
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    $15 an hour is nowhere near enough for some areas, and I could live quite well in Aransas Pass for this much. there needs to be some cost-of-living adjustment and I have not the foggiest idea how to do it, that’s for the economists and other people who understand the different regions. seems like it would be a big mess though.
    A minimum wage that doesn't factor cost of living doesn't make sense.

  21. #21
    The Timeless One Leetonidas's Avatar
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    I don't see what the big deal with raising minimum wage is, it's been stagnant long enough, and everything else has gone up. Min wage should go up with inflation. Just because Derp can live in his mom's basement off of 7.25 working at Olive Garden doesnt mean most people can

  22. #22
    Veteran DarrinS's Avatar
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    Current min wage by state

    https://www.minimum-wage.org/wage-by-state

  23. #23
    Veteran DarrinS's Avatar
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    It was a bit over $3 when I was a teenager.

  24. #24
    Take the fcking keys away baseline bum's Avatar
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    Yeah hard to imagine a $15 minimum wage in West Virginia. No wonder why Manchin won't sign off on this.

    What sucks about politicians is it has to be all or nothing. Why not negotiate a $12 minimum wage instead? (I think 10 is too low even for WV or Kentucky. )
    I think $12 is fair, it brings us back to where we were 50 years ago.

  25. #25
    coffee's for closers FrostKing's Avatar
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    I am not close to an economist, but some of the most vulnerable small businesses in places like South Texas or not going to be able to handle this.

    It has always been a problem legislating equality in wealth. I would think tax cuts for the richest are not the way to go, but beyond this and a few other things this is always been tough. This requires a cultural change beyond me myself and I imo.

    If you read many red team members responses under Trump then it’s pretty clear the culture is dogs eat dogs. How you change this, I have a not a clue. They truly believe this pseudo-Darwinian “I got to get mine first at the expense of others”

    * Foot note

    Many of these people claim to be Christians.
    Tens of millions of outsiders are being invited to the table so ya I should get mine first.

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