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Next games starting lineup and minutes distribution.
I hope this win was a CIA pop move to show Mills and Derozan their time here is up after the season. Too many guards to play for the Spurs to sign them. Gay is an option purely because we need PFs on the team like him but his role should be different next year (probably has one or two years left tops.)
I’ll say it again best front court option right now is Dieng and Eubanks. Eubanks can defend the four Dieng can space for him on the offensive side.
Next games starting lineup and minutes distribution.
Ah, how beautiful stats are, and how blind some fans. Good thing about stats is that, when used and interpreted correctly, they're pretty unarguable as far as painting pictures and countering the "eye test" of people already prone to bias. Thanks, R.
I read a great thing the other day about how A&W restaurants tried to promote a 1/3rd lb burger as a superior & bigger alternative to the McDonald's Quarter Pounder, but after failing to be successful, market research showed that so many people thought the 1/4 lb burger was bigger than the 1/3 lb burger (4 bigger than 3, bro!). 'Merican math skills!
Lmao. Yeah, agree, these last couple of years on SpursTalk have been really eye-opening in terms of the "average American" ways of thinking, reasoning, and argumentating. Sad to think the true "American average" is even lower than the rhethorics spewed by some less-than-stellar posters on here.
As long as the Flopovich era isn’t over the Mills DeRozan era won’t be over either
I'd rather watch the young players struggle through a 20-30 win season next year than watch any more DeRozan-centered Spurs games.
As long as he's on the roster commanding the highest salary, he'll be the focal point of the offense. Two years of that has been two years too many.
They'll win more with the young guys than with these vets
I said this in the beginning of the year that running motion offense doesn’t mean when you have players like Patty and Gay. Demar can actually score but he isn’t one to play in a motion offense. Patty/Gay get the ball and they motion it to the basket.
Devin and luka getting dnp next game
You know it.
Mills still has a role in the 2nd unit, as he moves well without the ball as well as being an elite shooter, but you want Lonnie predominantly on the ball, not Mills. Ideally, Vassell starts which opens the floor up dramatically for White & Johnson. DeMar walks & Gay retires. Samanic has shown, particularly defensively, he's an NBA player. Two cold shooting nights after riding the pine for the season doesn't change that IMO.
That's the way I feel. I'm tired of Defrozen iso plays and Mills off of the screen bricking at the end of games.
That to me means White absolutely should be coming off the bench with Walker or Vassell starting. And Mills minutes should be halved and only when he is on, he gets to 20mins
Vassal should replace Murray
why? derrick white plays defense and shoots 3s to spread the floor. defrozan does none of that.
This feels pretty misleading. If you look at the USG% distribution for the season on the whole, the Spurs are basically spreading the load like the BG offense. In individual games, some players shoot more, but this necessarily means there are plenty of games where DMDR has a really low USG%, and finding out the Spurs' record in those would be interesting. Looking at NBA.com's tracking info, DeRozan two games ago handily outperformed White and Murray combined from last game. He was WAY more efficient as a scorer, passed more and passed with more success than either or both of the team's young guards. DeRozan gets a lot of , but he's a really, really, REALLY good offensive player. No one on the team has any realistic chance of being as good as him.
Also, no. A team with White controlling the tempo is only good if White himself is playing well. A lot of folks keep subs uting the young players playing their best for what we can immediately (or even eventually) expect from them. White, when things are going well, plays like a playoff-caliber offensive center piece and lead defender. But that's not who he is most of the time. Real Derrick White has had more than a quarter of his games where he's scored single-digit points and where he's had a neutral or negative assist-to-turnover ratio. DeRozan only has five of each despite playing in 50-percent more games. White does a lot of good things, but he hasn't improved to where you can count on him to play a high-usage role. Consistency and floor are a huge part of a player's foundational ability. With Good White, the Spurs might be a sixth seed. But with Real White, they'd be an easy lotto team.
Individually, he's a better than average offensive player, but he has a decade long record that shows the vast majority of his teams in the regular season are better with him off the floor, and his numbers for the 6 seasons he has played in the playoffs are all dramatically in the negative, and among the worst you will ever find for a "star." Cherry picking his one relative strength while going out of your way to not even look at his obvious shortcomings... well, I don't get it. It's silly contrarianism at its best. Opposing teams target his defense because it's so universally agreed upon as a glaring weakness, and his iso ball/terror of the 3 ball approach lowers the effectiveness of his teammates on the offensive side.
Last edited by R. DeMurre; 04-18-2021 at 09:01 PM.
Do you think some of this has to do with White playing alongside a non-shooter in DD & 2 reluctant ones in Murray & Johnson?
Offense is half the game, not just "a part". I didn't say he was a good scorer. He's way better at offense in general than the other players. I didn't mention anything about his defense, and the post I was replying to wasn't talking about it. We aren't talking about whether the defense would be better without him; we're talking about whether having an even USG% distribution is good and whether White controlling the offense makes the team better.
It's completely wrong to thing White or Murray compare favorably to DeRozan on offense, and it's pretty much unfounded to claim that lowering DeMar's usage in favor of an even split would be better for the offense. It's not wrong to claim that the team can be better if they let DMDR go. It's just that to do so, they'll need to adequately replace him, and they will, in my opinion, struggle intensely if they try running Murray/White/Johnson as their perimeter trio. Sometimes that lineup would click and look good, but it'd be bad often enough to make for the worst iteration of the Spurs since 96.
Last edited by Chinook; 04-18-2021 at 09:10 PM.
I think it has to do with White being really inconsistent. Like I actually do think he'd play better without at least one of those guys. I just don't think he's been good enough consistently enough to where you can rely on him. Even with DMDR has been out, White hasn't played well enough to where you can say the team is in good hands. That's still true if you combine his play-making with Walker's scoring. DeMar's talent is just beyond them, and you have to replace that talent in order to have a chance to improve the team.
Why do you assume they won't improve next season?
-Murray has taken a big step this season.
-Johnson has hit the "rookie wall" this season. If the consensus is that the player development staff is one of the best in the NBA, why can't we see him improving next season?
-This could be White's ceiling. Still, in a regular season where games are more spaced out, he could be a better performer.
Just really odd to say things in advance like this.
I would understand it if they've tapered off for two consecutive seasons, but Murray has literally improved every season, and Keldon's shown to have an insane work ethic with the transformation of his body.
You're just arguing to hear yourself argue, and the only time you ever respond to anything I write is to disagree with it. If I said the sky was blue, you'd say no, it's aquamarine.
I didn't argue for an "even split." My point is and always has been--stated repeatedly-- that a team that has Derozan leading it in minutes and usage rate is not a team with a winning formula. I'm pretty sure you fundamentally agree with this, but much prefer to be pedantic and argue silly minutiae. Again, the issue is not White vs DeRozan one on one or Murray vs DeRozan battling it out on the playground, first guy to 15. It's a team concept that includes 50% of the time spent on defense and four other guys on the floor, and spacing, and opposing teams figuring how to defend, and not dribbling the air out of the ball in critical moments. I'm sorry my posts bug you so much, and that it's impossible for you to ever acknowledge agreeing with me on any solitary point, no matter how straight forward, but
It's not wrong to claim that the team can be better if they let DMDR go.
Yes, Chinook. I agree.
Last edited by R. DeMurre; 04-19-2021 at 01:28 AM.
Would you believe it if I said Dejounte is shooting (from 3) better than the following players:
*with the qualifier being a minimum of 161 3-point attempts (that's how many DJ has right now)
Dejounte is shooting equal to or better than:
Wesley Matthews
Deni Avdija
Tyler Herro
Eric Gordon
John Wall
Josh Hart
Victor Oladipo
Josh Richardson
Kelly Oubre Jr.
Anthony Edwards
Caris LaVert
Russell Westbrook
He's also progressively improving through the course of the season. He's been hitting high marks since March.
Keldon has a higher 3PT% than Murray and all of those guys but has shot at a lower volume (134 attempts total).
Last edited by Dejounte; 04-18-2021 at 09:44 PM.
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