Spurs Trade Rumor Thread (Spurs eyeing Collins, Osman? Fielding calls on Jak?)

[KingKev]

Wait, what? DDR was going to Chicago regardless. We worked a deal that got us a first round pick. Aminu and Thad only have salary for this year, a year where we are under the tax and can afford to take on one year of a salary. There was no downside. Now, if they can get something more for Young, great. But it looks like he isn't good enough to earn minutes on the floor and if that is the case, teams aren't trading much for him. No reason to trade him for trade's sake, but they shouldn't do something harmful to the roster, like trade for Saric just to "get something" for Young. If they get something, great. But don't trade him for a player with years on his contract and doesn't excite the Spurs about playing him.

Chicago was well over the cap so he wasn’t going there regardless. DDR still wanted to get paid, one of the reasons LA was not a suitable trade partner. There were few teams with the cap space to sign DDR outright. He always needed us.

[CGD]

He signed a 3 year deal, and I doubt his game falls off a cliff anytime soon. I think they’ve moved on by signing Biyambo.

He’ll be 39, we’ll see. I do think Biyambo not sucking ass has hurt us though.

[MannyIsGod]

you are also wrong. Just admit it for once.

Holy you can be annoying. Dude said he was wrong by saying Chinook is right. You've been here for like 2 days. Slow your roll.

[MannyIsGod]

I don't get why people are focusing on White. He put up 16/7/3 tonight and shot 6 for 10 from the field and 4 for 7 from three.

As I see it, here's the problem: the Spurs shot a better FG% and a better 3 pt% than the Warriors and still lost because the Warriors put up 13 more shots. The Spurs' two starting guards combined for 12 rebounds while their two starting forwards combined for 4. If McDermott & KJ combine for 10 total rebounds, the Spurs win this game. That's not a big ask.

White is mentioned in trade talks not because he sucks but because he's actually good enough to get a return. That's the point that is so often missed in talks about trades around here. You can't simply throw garbage into a trade and expect to get something that helps you get better. You have to have assets that other teams consider valuable and are interested in actually trading for. White fits this bill.

In addition to have value, White is also somewhat redundant on this team. Devin isn't as good defensively as white, but he's a better shooter and he's much younger. For me, I would rather keep Devin and try to improve other areas of need with white. Then you also have Primo who will need minutes eventually. And then I guess there's a chance we keep Lonnie. The Spurs need to move at least one of these players and White is probably the one you can flip for something else because of his contract and ability.

While I think White is close to his celling and I don't think anyone can argue he's the best player on the team, I think he's much better than the average NBA fan would give him credit for. I just wish he shot the ball better from 3.

[KingKev]

Holy you can be annoying. Dude said he was wrong by saying Chinook is right. You've been here for like 2 days. Slow your roll.

Under my moniker is my old handle just forgot the password as I did not post during the 15+ years between grad school and now. When I was in HS in like 2000 I was proving Ex wrong on Spurs Report. Regularly. Half smart guy just seldom admits he is wrong. All in good fun.

[Chinook]

Chicago was well over the cap so he wasn’t going there regardless. DDR still wanted to get paid, one of the reasons LA was not a suitable trade partner. There were few teams with the cap space to sign DDR outright. He always needed us.

I remember it being more complicated than that. Chicago basically paid SA and NOP to do their deals as S&Ts so they could stay over the cap and use their MLE on Caruso. Had they been forced to use cap space, they probably could have found a way to afford DeRozan outright. I assume he was the biggest of the three fish they secured, though they might have thought Ball and Caruso together would be a better catch. The Spurs had more leverage than Chicago, but they didn't have the Bulls over a barrel either.

[R. DeMurre]

White is mentioned in trade talks not because he sucks but because he's actually good enough to get a return. That's the point that is so often missed in talks about trades around here. You can't simply throw garbage into a trade and expect to get something that helps you get better. You have to have assets that other teams consider valuable and are interested in actually trading for. White fits this bill.

In addition to have value, White is also somewhat redundant on this team. Devin isn't as good defensively as white, but he's a better shooter and he's much younger. For me, I would rather keep Devin and try to improve other areas of need with white. Then you also have Primo who will need minutes eventually. And then I guess there's a chance we keep Lonnie. The Spurs need to move at least one of these players and White is probably the one you can flip for something else because of his contract and ability.

While I think White is close to his celling and I don't think anyone can argue he's the best player on the team, I think he's much better than the average NBA fan would give him credit for. I just wish he shot the ball better from 3.

I get that, but I think Keldon potentially has similar trade value as a young guy who just played in the olympics and is seen by many as having a break out type of year and potential going forward. To me, White has established that he can be a net positive player and glue guy. I'm not positive KJ will be that guy, plus an upgrade at PF seems to be the most glaring need at the moment. I think Vassell will be a SG/SF in the future, and Primo might too, so White being able to back up either guard spot makes him a solid 6th or 7th man going forward. White's effect on winning has been better than KJ's this year, even with KJ having an outstanding (and likely unsustainable) three point shooting year and White having a subpar 3 pt shooting year... If next season sees both players return to the mean, that difference in effectiveness could get even larger.

[KingKev]

I remember it being more complicated than that. Chicago basically paid SA and NOP to do their deals as S&Ts so they could stay over the cap and use their MLE on Caruso. Had they been forced to use cap space, they probably could have found a way to afford DeRozan outright. I assume he was the biggest of the three fish they secured, though they might have thought Ball and Caruso together would be a better catch. The Spurs had more leverage than Chicago, but they didn't have the Bulls over a barrel either.

We held the chips. Even if they found a way to salary dump both Thad and Aminu and didn’t sign both Lonzo and Caruso their free cap would have been ~5-10mm. Not enough to pursue DDR. PATFO is the gift that keeps on giving. They did right by their guy. More goodwill.

[Chinook]

We held the chips. Even if they found a way to salary dump both Thad and Aminu and didn’t sign both Lonzo and Caruso their free cap would have been ~5-10mm. Not enough to pursue DDR. PATFO is the gift that keeps on giving. They did right by their guy. More goodwill.

Remember the Bulls were willing to pay a first and two seconds to get DeRozan. Sending picks to OKC to get them to take Young/Aminu and the stretch provision would have easily given them enough. A big reason why they were over the cap was Markkanen's hold. Renouncing him would have helped them out a lot as well.

Don't get me wrong, Chicago definitely needed the Spurs to help them get DeRozan while keeping together their depth. But if they had wanted DeRozan badly enough, they didn't need the Spurs to get him.

EDIT -- Sorry, I misread your post initially and didn't see that you do mention Young and Aminu being salary dumped. I don't think their team salary would have been as high as you're suggesting.

(Everything I'm saying is coming from looking at the Capulator salaries and trying to recreate the Bulls' 2021 off-season cap situation from that. It's not a fully fleshed out analysis.) If you remove Caruso and Jones from the Bulls' salary, they are almost at the cap. That's with Ball and DeRozan on the roster, in addition go buoyant salary for Brown, White and Williams. Not trading for Ball and stretching Satoransky would have given them $10 Million in cap space, after signing DeRozan. They definitely could have created around $40 Million in cap space if they were willing to move the picks and eat some dead money in future seasons. It's a much worse result than they got, but teams have definitely done those types of gymnastics before.

[MannyIsGod]

I get that, but I think Keldon potentially has similar trade value as a young guy who just played in the olympics and is seen by many as having a break out type of year and potential going forward. To me, White has established that he can be a net positive player and glue guy. I'm not positive KJ will be that guy, plus an upgrade at PF seems to be the most glaring need at the moment. I think Vassell will be a SG/SF in the future, and Primo might too, so White being able to back up either guard spot makes him a solid 6th or 7th man going forward. White's effect on winning has been better than KJ's this year, even with KJ having an outstanding (and likely unsustainable) three point shooting year and White having a subpar 3 pt shooting year... If next season sees both players return to the mean, that difference in effectiveness could get even larger.

I don't really think White is a good 6th man contender. I definitely think he has more value than KJ, especially because of White being on an extension rather than KJ's rookie deal.

Its almost impossible to trade KJ alone and get good value because he's still on the rookie scale of a late first round pick. Also, Atlanta - the most likely trade destination for White - have zero need for KJ.

[poopbox]

Yeah, no reason to make that trade with PHX unless they're giving up a first.

There has to be some other team out there that is eyeballing Thad...right? Right??

Why would anybody be eyeballing a player who has barely played this year? And what team is a thad young away from being so much better that they will give up something that the spurs want...

Me thinks that just like the spurs botched trading Pau and LMA...they have botched trading Thad.

[KingKev]

Remember the Bulls were willing to pay a first and two seconds to get DeRozan. Sending picks to OKC to get them to take Young/Aminu and the stretch provision would have easily given them enough. A big reason why they were over the cap was Markkanen's hold. Renouncing him would have helped them out a lot as well.

Don't get me wrong, Chicago definitely needed the Spurs to help them get DeRozan while keeping together their depth. But if they had wanted DeRozan badly enough, they didn't need the Spurs to get him.

The Spurs were going to do right by DDR almost regardless and had limited options for that cap space but I just don’t see trade as much of a win for Brian Wright. I’m not privy to the conversations that went down behind closed doors but I would have hoped for more. The cost to eat Aminu’s contract alone is an FRP. If Thad is turned into something it might change my view, but IMO a buyout is imminent as we have set a clear precedence.

[RC_Drunkford]

Why would anybody be eyeballing a player who has barely played this year? And what team is a thad young away from being so much better that they will give up something that the spurs want...

Me thinks that just like the spurs botched trading Pau and LMA...they have botched trading Thad.

simple, because playoff teams need a player who can defend Giannis and Thad has a history of doing that somewhat well. Everybody knows his game hasn't fallen off

[poopbox]

White is mentioned in trade talks not because he sucks but because he's actually good enough to get a return. That's the point that is so often missed in talks about trades around here. You can't simply throw garbage into a trade and expect to get something that helps you get better. You have to have assets that other teams consider valuable and are interested in actually trading for. White fits this bill.

In addition to have value, White is also somewhat redundant on this team. Devin isn't as good defensively as white, but he's a better shooter and he's much younger. For me, I would rather keep Devin and try to improve other areas of need with white. Then you also have Primo who will need minutes eventually. And then I guess there's a chance we keep Lonnie. The Spurs need to move at least one of these players and White is probably the one you can flip for something else because of his contract and ability.

While I think White is close to his celling and I don't think anyone can argue he's the best player on the team, I think he's much better than the average NBA fan would give him credit for. I just wish he shot the ball better from 3.

Derrick doesn't really impact winning and we got 2 players in the pipeline, Primo and Vassel...who are in the same mold of the type of player Derrick is. It just makes logical sense to trade him for something you need, like a young power forward or center, when you have some plug in play options off the bench behind Derrick AND you are not winning anyway.

[poopbox]

simple, because playoff teams need a player who can defend Giannis and Thad has a history of doing that somewhat well. Everybody knows his game hasn't fallen off

I am very confident that if a game is coming down to how Thad defends Giannis then the bucks are winning 9 out of 10 of those games .

This seems like a Demarre Carrol situation all over again where we are like "why is this guy not playing" and then we see him play and we are like "oh thats why this guy is not playing".

[RC_Drunkford]

I am very confident that if a game is coming down to how Thad defends Giannis then the bucks are winning 9 out of 10 of those games .

This seems like a Demarre Carrol situation all over again where we are like "why is this guy not playing" and then we see him play and we are like "oh thats why this guy is not playing".

we've seen Thad play and he didn't look like Demarre Carrol. Completely different situation

[Leetonidas]

I am very confident that if a game is coming down to how Thad defends Giannis then the bucks are winning 9 out of 10 of those games .

This seems like a Demarre Carrol situation all over again where we are like "why is this guy not playing" and then we see him play and we are like "oh thats why this guy is not playing".

Say what? He's looked fine whenever he gets minutes. He is by far the best big we have besides Poeltl. Carroll was straight washed looking every time he stepped on the court. Not the same as Thad at all

[cd98]

Chicago was well over the cap so he wasn’t going there regardless. DDR still wanted to get paid, one of the reasons LA was not a suitable trade partner. There were few teams with the cap space to sign DDR outright. He always needed us.

Ok, but all that being true doesn't change the fact that the Spurs got a first round pick in the deal to essentially take salary for a year when they were tanking anyway. If DDR had gone elsewhere, they would not have gotten anything. So I guess I don't see your point.

[scott]

Is this thread about potential trades at the deadline or whether the normal dip s were able to make better trades for DDR in 2k? Jesus this place has been the same for 20 years.

[Robz4000]

Is this thread about potential trades at the deadline or whether the normal dip s were able to make better trades for DDR in 2k? Jesus this place has been the same for 20 years.

We love you too.

[R. DeMurre]

Derrick doesn't really impact winning and we got 2 players in the pipeline, Primo and Vassel...who are in the same mold of the type of player Derrick is. It just makes logical sense to trade him for something you need, like a young power forward or center, when you have some plug in play options off the bench behind Derrick AND you are not winning anyway.

Not sure how you reached this opinion, but every imaginable stat shows that White does impact winning-- Win Shares, BPM, +/- per 100 possessions, WAR, RAPTOR, etc...

https://www.basketball-reference.com.../SAS/2022.html
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com...layer-ratings/

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Not sure how you reached this opinion, but every imaginable stat shows that White does impact winning-- Win Shares, BPM, +/- per 100 possessions, WAR, RAPTOR, etc...

https://www.basketball-reference.com.../SAS/2022.html
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com...layer-ratings/

I agree, he does impact games positively, even when not shooting an amazing % from 3. He's a glue guy who does a lot of the little things for a team. It's true he's not having his best season but this is precisely why I wouldn't trade him now unless there's a great offer. I believe his value would increase and his contract is long enough so there shouldn't be any pressure to move him now.

[tbdog]

If I could trade White for another White at PF. I would do it without a thought. The spurs really do have a log jam at the guard spot and desperate for PF.

[KingKev]

If I could trade White for another White at PF. I would do it without a thought. The spurs really do have a log jam at the guard spot and desperate for PF.

If we don’t come away with a starting caliber PF in the draft I think this is very likely.

[poopbox]

Not sure how you reached this opinion, but every imaginable stat shows that White does impact winning-- Win Shares, BPM, +/- per 100 possessions, WAR, RAPTOR, etc...

https://www.basketball-reference.com.../SAS/2022.html
https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com...layer-ratings/

If he impacted winning that much, we wouldn't be 14 games under .500. Of course that is not all on him, but when you impact winning then you usually aren't one of the 5 worst teams in the nba