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  1. #126
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    Yeah, I didn't say I'd automatically take every player who won an MVP over Ginobili.
    Why bring the "MVP caliber" argument then?

  2. #127
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    Why bring the "MVP caliber" argument then?
    Like I said, you were acting like it was absurd that I found Harden better than Ginobili (when any non homer would), despite his being that caliber of player.

    Whatever you think of him, let's not act like he's chopped liver.

  3. #128
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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    Like I said, you were acting like it was absurd that I found Harden better than Ginobili (when any non homer would), despite his being that caliber of player.

    Whatever you think of him, let's not act like he's chopped liver.
    Where did I do that?

  4. #129
    Still Sporting Ben Davis Allan Rowe vs Wade's Avatar
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    dude this is settled science


  5. #130
    2004-2005 NBA Champions Barfunk's Avatar
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    Sigh. Sometimes, there are things in life that just make you want to pull out your hair. Some people just don't get it.

  6. #131
    2004-2005 NBA Champions Barfunk's Avatar
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    Gino all day everyday and 4 times on Sunday.

  7. #132
    Body Of Work Mr. Body's Avatar
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    Arenas is a baller type. That he goes to one-on-ones just shows why he never won in the NBA.

    Jamal Crawford is a good dude with a great career. He'd be embarrassed by this take.

    There's not a single year Crawford didn't have a negative DBPM. Not a single one. He was straight up a poor defender. Manu wasn't. Manu at his peak was one of the best SGs in the league, Crawford never was. Crawford's playoff numbers dipped badly over his regular season production; Manu's generally didn't -- had bad series here or there, but very good ones, and probably deserved the 2005 Finals MVP.

    Playing 300 fewer games, Manu has a WS of 106.5 and a WS/48 of .190.
    Playing 300 more games, Crawford has a WS of 60.7 and a WS/48 of .075.

    If you look at total BPM or VORP there is simply no comparison.

    And given Crawford's poor defense, I'm not sure I'd take him over Ginobili in one-on-one.

  8. #133
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
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    Gilbert who?

  9. #134
    Chopper Ed Helicopter Jones's Avatar
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    HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA

  10. #135
    Drive for Five! ambchang's Avatar
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    I mean, it's not even close. From a purely statistical perspective (ignoring all the team accolades like les, or even playoff numbers), Ginobili is simply in every stat. The biggest issue about Ginobili and Crawford, or 6th man in general, are minutes. So let's take a look at minutes and per possession stats (to remove the issue with pace), in the format career/high season:


    pp36min pp100p rp36min rp100p ap36min ap100p sp36min sp100p bp36min bp100p
    Ginobili 18.8/22.6 27.5/33.9 5/6 7.2/9.1 5.4/7.1 7.8/10 1.9/2.4 2.7/3.6 0.4/0.5 0.6/0.8
    Crawford* 17.9/22.0 25.7/30.9 2.7/3.6 3.9/5.2 4.2/6.8 6/9 1.1/1.5 1.6/2.2 0.3/0.5 0.4/0.7

    * Crawford played a one game season with the Nets with insane per 36 and per 100 stats, so it won't count because it is a small sample size

    While I am not surprised that Ginobili was better in assists, rebounds, steals, I was surprised at how small a margin he had over Crawford in assists, and was more surprised that Ginobili was a better scorer. Crawford has the reputation of being an unstoppable offensive force and was brought in to score and not much else, Ginobili was STILL better.

    As for Ginobili vs. Harden is the classic case of why young ballers want to get theirs before "being a team player" and win some chips. Harden will most definitely be remembered as the better and even more accomplished player than Ginobili to most fans, he had better stats, he made way more money, he has his own shoes, he single-handedly fed villages worth of strippers, but he actively chose that route. He chose to go to a team that would give him free reign to have the ball in his hands as much as he did, and he took full advantage of it. I don't blame him, because who grew up aspiring to be a 6th man with zero MVPs and only two all-star appearances? Almost all kids, if not all kids, will choose getting an MVP, bunch of all-star games, making $40m a year, scoring and assist les, etc ... It's not even close.

    But as a GM, it's likely wise to choose the player who helps you win and there is no doubt in my mind Ginobili is the player you want more than Harden if you want to win les.

  11. #136
    ಥ﹏ಥ DAF86's Avatar
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  12. #137
    TheDrewShow is salty lefty's Avatar
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    Duncan and Manu making Parker look good tbh

  13. #138
    Chunky Brazil's Avatar
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    Duncan and Manu making Parker look good tbh
    and you are the one talking about Spurs fans obsessed with former players... Tony is retired and you still spend your time dissing him in majority of your post in the spurs forum.. speaking of obsessed, he ed your wife or something ?

  14. #139
    Chunky Brazil's Avatar
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    also Crawford Kobe


    also amazing graph... and anyone who does not put Duncan in a top 10 list of all time

  15. #140
    TheDrewShow is salty lefty's Avatar
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    and you are the one talking about Spurs fans obsessed with former players... Tony is retired and you still spend your time dissing him in majority of your post in the spurs forum.. speaking of obsessed, he ed your wife or something ?
    Nah I'm not obsessed with former players, just making an observation about that graphic
    There is a difference

    You Parker fans are sensitive and come to his rescue fast

  16. #141
    Chunky Brazil's Avatar
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    Nah I'm not obsessed with former players, just making an observation about that graphic
    There is a difference

    You Parker fans are sensitive and come to his rescue fast
    All posters talking about former players Kawhi, Dejounte etc... are just making observation and you are calling them out on the regular... you are using dat double standard.

    don't talk about former players only if it is to diss Tony who I hate for whatever reason

  17. #142
    Veteran exstatic's Avatar
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    Look across the top row at those three shining lights. Only ONE of them made the 75th anniversary team. What a ing joke THAT was...

  18. #143
    TheDrewShow is salty lefty's Avatar
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    All posters talking about former players Kawhi, Dejounte etc... are just making observation and you are calling them out on the regular... you are using dat double standard.

    don't talk about former players only if it is to diss Tony who I hate for whatever reason
    They are just making observations?

    I guess you were too busy licking Parker's balls to notice there are multiple, multi-page threads about Kawhi and DJM

    Double standards right?

  19. #144
    Every game is game 1 Seventyniner's Avatar
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    Number Two could join the Big Three above that 70% line, but he has somehow only played 576 games in his career so far and is already 31. If he keeps only playing 60 games per year he might never make it to 1,000 total.

  20. #145
    Chunky Brazil's Avatar
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    They are just making observations?

    I guess you were too busy licking Parker's balls to notice there are multiple, multi-page threads about Kawhi and DJM

    Double standards right?
    yes they are they post less about former players than you about Parker .. the thing is you are the only one obsessed with Parker... you have nary room to talk .

    I would go a bit further... probably two thirds of your posts spurs related are about Parker..

  21. #146
    TheDrewShow is salty lefty's Avatar
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    y
    I would go a bit further... probably two thirds of your posts spurs related are about Parker..
    The better than Porker posts?

    Nah it's just (lame) trolling tbh

  22. #147
    Chunky Brazil's Avatar
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    The better than Porker posts?

    Nah it's just (lame) trolling tbh
    just asking to not jinx FNT for the WC bro

  23. #148
    TheDrewShow is salty lefty's Avatar
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    just asking to not jinx FNT for the WC bro
    So you didn't notice the team logo change I made a few weeks ago?

  24. #149
    Chunky Brazil's Avatar
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    So you didn't notice the team logo change I made a few weeks ago?
    yeah that's why I'm getting worried

  25. #150
    TheDrewShow is salty lefty's Avatar
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    yeah that's why I'm getting worried
    No don't worry
    Barring major injuries, France will win
    The 2018 team with more experience and motivation from the early Euro exit + Benzema?
    Shiiiiiiiiiiiiiit

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