Page 3 of 5 FirstFirst 12345 LastLast
Results 51 to 75 of 122
  1. #51
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
    My Team
    Boston Celtics
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Post Count
    22,310
    Trump got a $21 million tax break for a conservation easement he granted on a property he only paid $7.5 million for

    My tl;dr read on this whole thing is yes, the Trump defenders are technically right that everyone does this. You'd be hard pressed to find a real estate investor who doesn't push for the conservative appraisal method when dealing with a tax assessor while simultaneously trying to use the most aggressive appraisal method to get a bigger loan.

    The catch though is that Trump seems like he's taken it to an extreme level with obvious fraudulent intent; furnishing bull information to appraisers, overtly misstating square footages, etc...there's limits to how much you can do this and Trump clearly went way overboard.

  2. #52
    Mr. John Wayne CosmicCowboy's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Post Count
    43,734
    That's not true. The conservation easement tax break is a federal program (that Trump has utilized a lot in the last decade) and the size of the tax break you get is tied to the value of the property you're granting the conservation easement on. That obviously involves reporting the value of the property to the IRS.

    Here's an article with more detail about how Trump abused it:
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...a62_story.html
    That makes sense. Since he is supposedly audited almost every year it's surprising they didn't catch it.

  3. #53
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
    My Team
    Boston Celtics
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Post Count
    22,310
    I'm not defending Trump at all, but price to sales ratios of 30-1 are not at all unusual in the stock market, I don't know what a normal PS ratio for a private golf club is but Mar-A-Lago Lago as an ongoing business supposedly reports 25 million revenue per year. At the 75 million valuation claimed by Leticia James that would only be a 3-1 ratio which seems unreasonably low. 30-1 (which seems high to me) puts it at 750 million. Values on property are always ambiguous until they are actually sold and the price determined by the market.
    Cash flowing golf courses typically sell for around ~8x EBITDA (or a 12.5% cap rate in real estate terms).

    Using a 30:1 price to sales ratio for a golf course (or any other type of real estate investment for that matter) is ing absurd. The only way that would ever happen is if it was a highly distressed property that's mostly vacant (and thus has almost no sales) in which case it's not being valued on a price to sale basis but rather on a replacement cost basis.

    https://www.cbre.com/-/media/project...eview-2021.pdf


  4. #54
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
    My Team
    Boston Celtics
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Post Count
    22,310
    That makes sense. Since he is supposedly audited almost every year it's surprising they didn't catch it.
    Could be mistaken but I think the environmental easements he's gotten on the Westchester properties is a focal point of the IRS audit that's been going for years.

  5. #55
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Post Count
    144,595
    That makes sense. Since he is supposedly audited almost every year it's surprising they didn't catch it.
    Audited according to whom? I'm not even sure a single audit has occurred.

  6. #56
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
    My Team
    Boston Celtics
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Post Count
    22,310
    It's going to be years before there's ever a real fact finding that Trump did something illegal in this case, but I've gotta think the legal pressure is starting to weigh on Trump.

    The 11th circuit panel he drew in Florida had an Obama appointee + probably the 2 most hackish right wing judges on that entire circuit, and the ruling against him there was unanimous, and he's not going to get any lucky federalist society judge breaks in NY.

    No normal person would be able to run for president with so much litigation going on in the background.

  7. #57
    Savvy Veteran spurraider21's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Post Count
    96,023
    It's going to be years before there's ever a real fact finding that Trump did something illegal in this case, but I've gotta think the legal pressure is starting to weigh on Trump.

    The 11th circuit panel he drew in Florida had an Obama appointee + probably the 2 most hackish right wing judges on that entire circuit, and the ruling against him there was unanimous, and he's not going to get any lucky federalist society judge breaks in NY.

    No normal person would be able to run for president with so much litigation going on in the background.
    who's gonna tell him?

  8. #58
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
    My Team
    Boston Celtics
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Post Count
    22,310
    who's gonna tell him?
    What I mean is that no one would be able to do it without an insane amount of for ude and stamina that Trump just doesn't have.

  9. #59
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Post Count
    144,595
    It's going to be years before there's ever a real fact finding that Trump did something illegal in this case, but I've gotta think the legal pressure is starting to weigh on Trump.

    The 11th circuit panel he drew in Florida had an Obama appointee + probably the 2 most hackish right wing judges on that entire circuit, and the ruling against him there was unanimous, and he's not going to get any lucky federalist society judge breaks in NY.

    No normal person would be able to run for president with so much litigation going on in the background.
    That's absolutely why he's going to run again. He sees winning again as a get out of jail free card, and he's probably not wrong.

  10. #60
    4-25-20 Will Hunting's Avatar
    My Team
    Boston Celtics
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Post Count
    22,310
    That's absolutely why he's going to run again. He sees winning again as a get out of jail free card, and he's probably not wrong.
    That saves him from the criminal probe in Florida, but it does jack to save him from the civil suit in NY.

    I fully expect him to run again, I just think the amount of background noise is going to affect his ability to campaign and even pretend to be normal.

  11. #61
    The Timeless One Leetonidas's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Apr 2005
    Post Count
    28,313
    What I mean is that no one would be able to do it without an insane amount of for ude and stamina that Trump just doesn't have.
    He's pretty overweight and clearly has dementia, wonder how long before he pops a vein and keels over

  12. #62
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Post Count
    144,595
    That saves him from the criminal probe in Florida, but it does jack to save him from the civil suit in NY.
    The consequences there are much less dire even if the suit continued into another Trump presidency.

    I fully expect him to run again, I just think the amount of background noise is going to affect his ability to campaign and even pretend to be normal.
    I could be pretty bad in a debate, but Trump has and will be protected in a right wing media cocoon that will still give him all the airtime he needs. The new CNN will go soft on him as well. I think you'll be surprised at how normalized it's all going to get.

  13. #63
    Believe. daboom1's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Post Count
    8,022
    The new CNN will go soft on him as well.

  14. #64
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Post Count
    144,595
    Explain how you think the new CNN will go harder on Trump now, Qhris.

    Or just fold immediately as always.

  15. #65
    Believe. daboom1's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Post Count
    8,022
    More Firings Coming At CNN With New Management, Report

    Don Lemon, Jim Acosta, and some others may be next on the CNN chopping block as the network has begun to make cuts.

    Jim Nicosia, the president of News Cycle Media and former managing editor of Mediaite, made the predictions on Twitter and he has a history of being correct on these matters more often than he is not.

    “Source: Once the coming shakeup at CNN is done, don’t expect John Berman, Alisyn Camerota, Jim Acosta, Brianna Keilar, Jake Tapper, John King, and Don Lemon to still be at the network OR have their current show assignments,” he said.

    https://conservativebrief.com/jake-c...&utm_medium=SG
    this is really important to you
    ST Trump s caring about CNN so hard

    The new CNN will go soft on him as well. I think you'll be surprised at how normalized it's all going to get.

  16. #66
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Post Count
    144,595
    Qhris folds immediately.

  17. #67
    Believe. daboom1's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2019
    Post Count
    8,022
    Qhris folds immediately.
    Oh you got a post in the 2 minutes it took me to post again

    That's not even what I was laughing about

    Why do you care so much about CNN, Beepbumper?

  18. #68
    Alleged Michigander ChumpDumper's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Post Count
    144,595
    Oh you got a post in the 2 minutes it took me to post again

    That's not even what I was laughing about

    Why do you care so much about CNN, Beepbumper?
    It's media exposure to old people who vote.

    I don't watch it nor do I care about who is hosting what on the network.

  19. #69
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Post Count
    152,607
    Nope. I can't speak directly to Trumps details but property value when it isn't actually put up for sale to let the market determine the price is extremely ambiguous. I own several properties and protest the tax valuations every year when they come out. I hire professionals to do it. I don't get to set the values, a valuation board decides what the taxable value is. I am confident the real values of the properties are at least twice what the tax appraisals are and probably more. It is not fraud to put the estimated real value of the properties on your financial statement.
    It is when you're putting them for collateral. You can't claim it to be $300 million for a loan, then turn around and tell the IRS it's really $100 million. That's fraud plain and simple.

  20. #70
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Post Count
    152,607
    Property valuations have nothing to do with the IRS until they are sold.
    They do have to do with State property taxes if the State charges a percentage of the property value.

    EDIT: I also see Will's note on that

  21. #71
    Believe.
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Post Count
    9,877
    I'm not defending Trump at all, but price to sales ratios of 30-1 are not at all unusual in the stock market, I don't know what a normal PS ratio for a private golf club is but Mar-A-Lago Lago as an ongoing business supposedly reports 25 million revenue per year. At the 75 million valuation claimed by Leticia James that would only be a 3-1 ratio which seems unreasonably low. 30-1 (which seems high to me) puts it at 750 million. Values on property are always ambiguous until they are actually sold and the price determined by the market.
    What if Obama did all the same things trump has done?

  22. #72
    Mr. John Wayne CosmicCowboy's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Post Count
    43,734
    It is when you're putting them for collateral. You can't claim it to be $300 million for a loan, then turn around and tell the IRS it's really $100 million. That's fraud plain and simple.
    I borrow using property for collateral all the time. The bank usually wants a financial statement but they always do their own appraisal of the collateral..

  23. #73
    Mr. John Wayne CosmicCowboy's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Mar 2003
    Post Count
    43,734
    What if Obama did all the same things trump has done?
    If he did it I would say he sucks too. Obama is a better man than Trump.

  24. #74
    🏆🏆🏆🏆🏆 ElNono's Avatar
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    Post Count
    152,607
    I borrow using property for collateral all the time. The bank usually wants a financial statement but they always do their own appraisal of the collateral..
    That's because you're small fish. When the bank comes back with the appraisal, you say yes, and sign the dotted line. You're not a recalcitrant fraudster.

    This is exactly what the civil suit alleges, and goes beyond loans, but also tax and insurance advantages, which would include tax and insurance fraud.

  25. #75
    Believe.
    My Team
    San Antonio Spurs
    Join Date
    Aug 2018
    Post Count
    9,877
    If he did it I would say he sucks too. Obama is a better man than Trump.

    He would have been lynched the minute he said, "russia- if you are listening"

Thread Information

Users Browsing this Thread

There are currently 1 users browsing this thread. (0 members and 1 guests)

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •