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  1. #26
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    Well . I completely missed that. I’ll walk back my comment. Two firsts might not be enough for that contract.
    Yeah, itís not excellent. But hopefully Dougís money for next year gets moved is a separate deal too. I think two picks or a pick + young asset (Jovic?) is fair value.

  2. #27
    Veteran heyheymymy's Avatar
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    What years are these FRPs in such trade projections? Any chance you see these teams sending 2023 FRPs or are the picks in latter years beyond?

    I'm obsessed with adding even just 1 more 23 FRP after how well the 3x 2022 picks seem to have gone.

  3. #28
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    What years are these FRPs in such trade projections? Any chance you see these teams sending 2023 FRPs or are the picks in latter years beyond?

    I'm obsessed with adding even just 1 more 23 FRP after how well the 3x 2022 picks seem to have gone.
    The only one i see unprotected is the LAL pick involving Brick (but for 2027). I would expect all others to contain some level of protection and/or be from teams (Suns/Heat/GSW/BOS) that are expected to be playoff teams. My preference would be to push those out as far as possible.
    Last edited by CGD; 11-27-2022 at 03:23 PM.

  4. #29
    Veteran heyheymymy's Avatar
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    Very realistic pick thoughts CGD. I still would not mind just 1 more 2023 to swing with while the iron seems hot plus Spurs already have some hoarding in 2024 - 2028 with CHA ATL BOS FRPs etc so while I agree that I still want to stagger some draft capital especially since SA just got 3x new personnel already in the oven as we speak but we must balance that properly by not sliding too much down the timeline either. Tricky balance but I trust FO to keep making wise choices.

    Hard part is packing up a deal that everyone likes but Spurs have some decent trade pieces and time on their side as the deadline nears and desperation peaks I see something getting done that looks advantageous to SA.

  5. #30
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    I'm very high on the top 8-10 in this draft. Another thing I like about what CGD is proposing here is that ac ulating so much future draft capital lets us be very aggressive in this draft. I could see a couple teams that could end up in that 8-10 position that might rather have two or three future firsts to give them more future trade options chasing a star. Larger market teams like GS, NY, or Miami...

    If we struck gold on Wembanyama and could pick up a 2nd pick in that 8-10 range we might could get AT..or Smith...or Black...a large PG with high upside. That would be the homerun of all homeruns in my book...

  6. #31
    Veteran heyheymymy's Avatar
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    Exactly. Getting another 23 FRP is paramount this year because Spurs own 23 FRP looks like it will be quite tops itself. Imagine being able to double dip in the 23 lottery with how deep it seems. With a solid core already around and good money situation long term?

    the boys are back in town baby

  7. #32
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    Tank the fck outta this season!

  8. #33
    Veteran exstatic's Avatar
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    Exactly. Getting another 23 FRP is paramount this year because Spurs own 23 FRP looks like it will be quite tops itself. Imagine being able to double dip in the 23 lottery with how deep it seems. With a solid core already around and good money situation long term?

    the boys are back in town baby
    Iím not sure there are the resources to develop 5 players at one time. The 2022s will still be in development in year 2. I think their focus will be 70% on Wemby if we get him, and 30% on the 2023s, assuming we donít trade one or two to avoid having to pay 3 players at the same time.

  9. #34
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    Honestly had no interest in taking more than an additional year of salary. The Spurs need to be ready to move with their cap space if they're seeing improvement. Miami isn't going to pay multiple unprotected picks to get rid or Robinson. At this point, I'd be fine with no trades unless the team has already decided to dump Poeltl and passes up on a first-rounder playing chicken at the end of the year. If they still want to re-sign him, even a late-first isn't worth it

  10. #35
    Veteran heyheymymy's Avatar
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    I’m not sure there are the resources to develop 5 players at one time. The 2022s will still be in development in year 2. I think their focus will be 70% on Wemby if we get him, and 30% on the 2023s, assuming we don’t trade one or two to avoid having to pay 3 players at the same time.
    damn you make a great point and at what level does the coaching staff start bursting at the seams? I've got my mind on the fact we already have the 2022 3x in the oven cooking still, but 2023 looks so deep man I hate to miss out on a second FRP from that class. But you're right, there is a maximum capacity for development and roster slots and Spurs are not the types to waste much. If SA can lock up #1 or #2 though that might just be the cherry on top anyway, though.

  11. #36
    Veteran heyheymymy's Avatar
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    losing Primo does open up 1 dev slot imho

  12. #37
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    SAS: Westbrook, LAL 2026 SRP, LAL 2027 FRP unprotected
    LAL: Richardson, McDermott

    SAS: Fournier, NYK (DAL) 2023 FRP top-10 protected, NYK (MIA) 2024 SRP top-55 protected, NYK (MIL) 2025 FRP top-4 protected
    NYK: Poeltl, Langford

    Lakers trade: The FRP is for the space rent on WB's contract. LAL is -46mm, so this deal nearly halves the amount; 47mm going out and 25mm coming in. The SRP is for the inherent value of JR/MCD and should be another FRP but LAL is being difficult.

    Knicks trade: Spurs responsible for whatever remainder of Fournier's 2023 18mm, his full 2024 18mm, but then Spurs use his team option to decline Fournier's 19mm due in 2025. He is renting space for little more than 1 season for the reward of 2 FRPs and 1 SRP. That's 2 FRPs since Spurs wanted 2 for Poeltl so it's 1 FRP for Poeltl, 1 FRP for the Fournier contract bailout, and the SRP for Langford ballast value acknowledgments.

    Both deals work in Trade Machine.

  13. #38
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    Honestly had no interest in taking more than an additional year of salary. The Spurs need to be ready to move with their cap space if they're seeing improvement. Miami isn't going to pay multiple unprotected picks to get rid or Robinson. At this point, I'd be fine with no trades unless the team has already decided to dump Poeltl and passes up on a first-rounder playing chicken at the end of the year. If they still want to re-sign him, even a late-first isn't worth it
    Iím of the view that having huge capspace is overstated small cap teams more often than notó at least if the goal is signing a key free agent. How many times have we see it flame out and/or a small market team having to give out a massive overpay to a mediocre player (the 2016 FA class comes to mind)?

    I support having capspace as a means to acquire draft capital though, which is my preferred strategy for a sustainable rebuild. Its the thought with eating that Robinson salary, and/or salary an over the tax team like PHX might send our way (Saric, Shatmat etc).

    As an aside, I do think the risk of inaction for the spurs become real the closer we get to the deadline. I bet that when itís reported that Miami is ďkeeping an eyeĒ on Richardson, itís because they think heíll be a prime buyout candidate after the deadline.

  14. #39
    Veteran exstatic's Avatar
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    losing Primo does open up 1 dev slot imho
    I think it just relieved the pressure on developing the 22s. I’d actually be fine with another 23 pick if we send out one of the 22s in the deal, probably Branham.

  15. #40
    Forum Official Personal Life Coach BacktoBasics's Avatar
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    I think it just relieved the pressure on developing the 22s. I’d actually be fine with another 23 pick if we send out one of the 22s in the deal, probably Branham.
    I don’t see the logic in moving prospects to acquire picks of the unknown that would fall in the late teens to 20’s before even scratching the surface of our current ones.

    One could even argue that returning a mid 1st carries more risk than developing good character guys like Branham who we’d already have half a season invested in.

    Unless they’re sour on him. Too many unknowns.

  16. #41
    Body Of Work Mr. Body's Avatar
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    We already canning Branham?

  17. #42
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    We already canning Branham?
    Well... he's already 19, and he's had all of 2 months to put it together. Clearly he's a bust.

  18. #43
    Veteran heyheymymy's Avatar
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    I don't know about dumping Bran so soon but I agree with ex that development capacity is probably more critical than the avg fan thinks.

    Don't want more horses than you have stables for and look ahead, Spurs have a trove of picks coming 2024 - 2028. I wouldn't be surprised if they pull the plug quickly on someone new just depending on how the player is tracking and how the team future appears to be looking/shaping up.

  19. #44
    Veteran heyheymymy's Avatar
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    That said, trades and contracts could open up new unforeseen slots. If you trade JR, MCD and/or Doug and say Poeltl walks, Spurs will be graduating up the newer potential whether they are ready or not. Now that doesn't necessarily magically create additional dev coaches/resources but you could free up a lot of roster slots regardless pretty quickly depending on how many trades and how many ending contracts don't return.

    Roby, KBD and Dieng all look like they fall off the books this upcoming offseason too in addition to the expirings with trade value (JR, Doug, Poeltl)

  20. #45
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    I don't know about dumping Bran so soon but I agree with ex that development capacity is probably more critical than the avg fan thinks.

    Don't want more horses than you have stables for and look ahead, Spurs have a trove of picks coming 2024 - 2028. I wouldn't be surprised if they pull the plug quickly on someone new just depending on how the player is tracking and how the team future appears to be looking/shaping up.
    Yeah, letís say we donít get the first or second pick we could then end up with the best SG or SF in the draft who definitely would impact playing time for Branham - Not saying I want to but I could see it happening a lot depends on who we draft as they going to impact one of the starters for sure

  21. #46
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    Yeah, letís say we donít get the first or second pick we could then end up with the best SG or SF in the draft who definitely would impact playing time for Branham - Not saying I want to but I could see it happening a lot depends on who we draft as they going to impact one of the starters for sure
    I'm not worried about it at this point. The reality is that we will cycle through at least half our current guys before we get another compe ive team (including Keldon). Grab as many lotto tickets as possible and hope the timelines match up reasonably well.

  22. #47
    Veteran exstatic's Avatar
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    I don't know about dumping Bran so soon but I agree with ex that development capacity is probably more critical than the avg fan thinks.

    Don't want more horses than you have stables for and look ahead, Spurs have a trove of picks coming 2024 - 2028. I wouldn't be surprised if they pull the plug quickly on someone new just depending on how the player is tracking and how the team future appears to be looking/shaping up.
    You don’t trade him during the season, but on draft night if a team has been calling about him, you call them when they’re on the clock if there’s a player you really like.

    I like Malaki, but of the three 22s, he’s probably got the lowest ceiling, like good bench scorer. He’s the epitome of the trope that it’s easier to teach a defender to score than a scorer to defend.

  23. #48
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    I'm not advocating for a Keldon Johnson trade, but I do wonder what kind of market he has. He is an easy on court fit for several teams (Kings, Knicks, Suns, Blazers) who are an impact player away from contention or getting into the playoffs.

    My guess is KJ could command two FRPs, one lightly protected or unprotected. The Knicks could offer that for the upcoming draft. Something like Cam Reddish, Obi Toppin, their own '23 unprotected, and Washington's pick, which is protected and may not convey this year.

    I wonder if the Spurs see KJ as their best trade asset or a piece of their future core?

  24. #49
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    On the frequently suggested Poeltl to the Warriors...

    I propose Poeltl and Richardson (and one of Bates-Diop or Roby) for Kuminga, Moody, and '26 FRP unprotected. Wiseman would have to be included to make the salaries match. Wiseman's gleague plus/minus suggests he shouldn't be on a gleague court. His trade value is very, very low. The Warriors will frame him as the former number 2 pick, but every team they try to push him onto will respond by saying in his third NBA season Wiseman is -35 in the gleague. Lacob is too proud to admit it, but Wiseman is not worth much more than salary filler atm.

  25. #50
    Veteran exstatic's Avatar
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    I'm not advocating for a Keldon Johnson trade, but I do wonder what kind of market he has. He is an easy on court fit for several teams (Kings, Knicks, Suns, Blazers) who are an impact player away from contention or getting into the playoffs.

    My guess is KJ could command two FRPs, one lightly protected or unprotected. The Knicks could offer that for the upcoming draft. Something like Cam Reddish, Obi Toppin, their own '23 unprotected, and Washington's pick, which is protected and may not convey this year.

    I wonder if the Spurs see KJ as their best trade asset or a piece of their future core?
    Trading Keldon is weird until July. He been extended, but he’s not IN his extension yet, but you can’t match his current salary and call it a day. Their are weird rules about salary we can accept in return, and what he would count for in a trade.

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