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  1. #176
    Body Of Work Mr. Body's Avatar
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    I like Jak and think he is solid. Having a bit of a down season but relative to last year but I think that is us missing what DJM brought. DJM made Jak’s life much easier.

    Still I don’t like paying him top dollar for a role playing center. If it’s a front-loaded contract as you have suggested it makes more sense but i’d rather just wish him luck at 20/yr. The good thing is that few teams will have outright cap to sign him so hopefully we can get something to help facilitate his next deal via S&T.
    Isn't the MLE projected to be like $15m next year?

  2. #177
    Formerly Spurs21 KingKev's Avatar
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    The NBA isn't like the stock market where player values go up and down according to each game.
    Nothing todo with his performance last night. I just donít believe the hype around his perceived value.

  3. #178
    Formerly Spurs21 KingKev's Avatar
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    Isn't the MLE projected to be like $15m next year?
    Nope.

  4. #179
    Veteran John B's Avatar
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    Zollins have been playing very well, averaging almost 11pts and 6 rebs per game in 21mins the last 10 games, about 15pts average the last 10 games. He could very well be Poeltl’s replacement as starting C. While Zollins needs to cut down on fouls, but only because he defends every-single-time, but he spreads the floor better. I think Zollins’ development is making it easier for the Spurs to part with Jak, and could make Spurs aggressively shop Jak around.

  5. #180
    クソ漏れそうだよ、助けてボゲ baseline bum's Avatar
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    Anyone scoffing a 4 year, $80 million deal on Poetl is nuts. That would be starting around $18 million next year, which is Marcus Morris or Derrick White money. $18 million out of a $134 million cap ain't bad at all for a quality starting center. If he tells the team he wants to be back and they believe him, then it would be re ed to sell low on him for something like one protected first.

  6. #181
    クソ漏れそうだよ、助けてボゲ baseline bum's Avatar
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    Isn't the MLE projected to be like $15m next year?
    About $11.5 million starting, for 4 years, $49 million factoring in 4.5% raises.

  7. #182
    Veteran Ariel's Avatar
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    I like Jak and think he is solid. Having a bit of a down season but relative to last year but I think that is us missing what DJM brought. DJM made Jak’s life much easier.

    Still I don’t like paying him top dollar for a role playing center. If it’s a front-loaded contract as you have suggested it makes more sense but i’d rather just wish him luck at 20/yr. The good thing is that few teams will have outright cap to sign him so hopefully we can get something to help facilitate his next deal via S&T.
    I agree with pretty much all of this, so I'd ask who is going to throw 20M at him? I don't see many teams able (i.e. under the cap) AND willing to do that, if any at all. Maybe Indiana if they trade/lose Myles Turner, and perhaps OKC? The rest would require a S&T, we have as strong a position as anyone, so if there's interest we'll get one pick at the very least, and if there isn't I don't see how he's going to get that 20M figure that's being talked about.

  8. #183
    Veteran Ariel's Avatar
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    Anyone scoffing a 4 year, $80 million deal on Poetl is nuts. That would be starting around $18 million next year, which is Marcus Morris or Derrick White money. $18 million out of a $134 million cap ain't bad at all for a quality starting center. If he tells the team he wants to be back and they believe him, then it would be re ed to sell low on him for something like one protected first.
    Which non star center is getting that kind of money? Not Robert Williams, not Mitc Robinson... maybe Clint Capella is the most overpaid. Myles Turner might get it due to his ability to shoot 3s at a high clip and space the floor, but really don't see any team losing sleep over Poeltl.

  9. #184
    Body Of Work Mr. Body's Avatar
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    About $11.5 million starting, for 4 years, $49 million factoring in 4.5% raises.
    Yeah, so what Poeltl is looking for is really cheap. I'm reminded at how Timvp and others freaked out at Poeltl's current deal thinking it was too much. Hilarious times.

  10. #185
    Body Of Work Mr. Body's Avatar
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    Which non star center is getting that kind of money? Not Robert Williams, not Mitc Robinson... maybe Clint Capella is the most overpaid. Myles Turner might get it due to his ability to shoot 3s at a high clip and space the floor, but really don't see any team losing sleep over Poeltl.
    Poeltl is straight up better than Robert Williams and Mitc Robinson. And that's when they're on the floor. In addition to being better, Poeltl also barely misses games.

  11. #186
    Formerly Spurs21 KingKev's Avatar
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    Yeah, so what Poeltl is looking for is really cheap. I'm reminded at how Timvp and others freaked out at Poeltl's current deal thinking it was too much. Hilarious times.
    It is all downside risk. The only argument for paying him that is that we have to allocate capital somewhere. We really need to use one of our many incoming draft pics on a replacement big. Zollins can fill the void while we rebuild.

  12. #187
    クソ漏れそうだよ、助けてボゲ baseline bum's Avatar
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    Which non star center is getting that kind of money? Not Robert Williams, not Mitc Robinson... maybe Clint Capella is the most overpaid. Myles Turner might get it due to his ability to shoot 3s at a high clip and space the floor, but really don't see any team losing sleep over Poeltl.
    You forgot Nurkic, Vucevic, and Allen who make similar money for similar production, and then guys like Ayton, Porzingis, and Gobert who make way more. Spurs aren't in a position to just be giving good players like Poetl away, especially with how ty Keldon has been this year.

  13. #188
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    It is all downside risk. The only argument for paying him that is that we have to allocate capital somewhere. We really need to use one of our many incoming draft pics on a replacement big. Zollins can fill the void while we rebuild.
    The argument for paying him is he's probably the second most talented player on the team and even if you land Wembanyama you can't throw Sochan plus ten bags of crap around him and expect to get anywhere.

  14. #189
    Veteran Ariel's Avatar
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    Poeltl is straight up better than Robert Williams and Mitc Robinson. And that's when they're on the floor. In addition to being better, Poeltl also barely misses games.
    More reliable than Robert Williams, sure. But to pretend Poeltl is a tier above Robert Williams when healthy is laughable, that's Spurs' bias speaking. He's better than Mitc Robinson at this point in time, but he's also 3 years older. Poeltl is a good starting caliber center (above average), but can't shoot FTs, let alone 3s. He'd have a hard time closing games in a playoff series, for instance. That's not the most sought after center archetype these days, to the point where teams will allocate a big chunk of their salary cap to him. Maybe someone overpays, sure, it happens all the time. But it's not guaranteed, and certainly not advisable.

  15. #190
    Formerly Spurs21 KingKev's Avatar
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    The argument for paying him is he's probably the second most talented player on the team and even if you land Wembanyama you can't throw Sochan plus ten bags of crap around him and expect to get anywhere.
    Second most talented player on the least talented team in the NBA.

    I actually do expect to throw a horrible roster around our next few lottery picks. Those writings are already on the wall and it probably is the best strategy so we can secure 3-5 years worth of high lottery picks to stand a chance. Even Wemby won’t move the needle his first few years with this roster.

  16. #191
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    Zollins have been playing very well, averaging almost 11pts and 6 rebs per game in 21mins the last 10 games, about 15pts average the last 10 games. He could very well be Poeltl’s replacement as starting C. While Zollins needs to cut down on fouls, but only because he defends every-single-time, but he spreads the floor better. I think Zollins’ development is making it easier for the Spurs to part with Jak, and could make Spurs aggressively shop Jak around.
    See Collins has a great three point shot for a center, but he doesn't have the mobility like Poeltl on defense. I still like Collins for the price tag, though.

  17. #192
    Remember Cherokee Parks The Truth #6's Avatar
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    FiveThirtyEight Raptor WAR , 646 minutes minumum (their default)

    Bottom Six
    #245 -1.5 Will Barton, Shaedon Sharpe, Jabari Smith Jr.
    #248 -1.6 Jaden Ivey
    #249 -1.8 Malaki Branham, P.J. Washington
    Heís right there with some top ten draft picks. Nice!

  18. #193
    Veteran Ariel's Avatar
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    You forgot Nurkic, Vucevic, and Allen who make similar money for similar production, and then guys like Ayton, Porzingis, and Gobert who make way more. Spurs aren't in a position to just be giving good players like Poetl away, especially with how ty Keldon has been this year.
    I didn't forget any of those, I purposefully left them out because they're not comparable.
    Gobert is a perennial DPOY and multiple times all NBA and all Star.
    Vucevic was a multiple times all star who averaged close to 20 & 10 for half a decade (he's just washed now).
    Ayton lives off of his promise and former no. 1 status, the Suns reluctantly matched because they couldn't afford to lose him as an asset.
    Allen is better, younger, and even made an all star team.
    Porzingis is an entirely different player, he's not a traditional center at all, so his name makes no sense in this list.
    Nurkic is the only one you mentioned who I'd take Poeltl over, but his contract is a burden and I certainly wouldn't advocate giving an average center a big contract using him as an example.
    At the end of the day, Poeltl is a good player (better than average starting center) but I'd be careful to give him a huge contract simply because we're just horrible. At 16M/17M per year he's probably worth, much more than that and he might turn into a burden in a couple of years.

  19. #194
    Remember Cherokee Parks The Truth #6's Avatar
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    Nothing todo with his performance last night. I just donít believe the hype around his perceived value.
    I think itís Boston or Toronto or basically nobody in my opinion. He needs to go to a team where they donít need a star and they are at least in their eyes somewhat close to competing. But if itís like most teams where thereís a typical star player, thereís no way theyíre gonna push for yak to be on the team. Itís not like theyíre going to peruse through advanced metrics and come to that conclusion. My gut feeling is most typical NBA stars donít think much at all of yak. Iím not saying this to say that he is a bad player but I donít think most players or teams are going to appreciate his, how should we say, nuance?

  20. #195
    Body Of Work Mr. Body's Avatar
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    More reliable than Robert Williams, sure. But to pretend Poeltl is a tier above Robert Williams when healthy is laughable, that's Spurs' bias speaking. He's better than Mitc Robinson at this point in time, but he's also 3 years older. Poeltl is a good starting caliber center (above average), but can't shoot FTs, let alone 3s. He'd have a hard time closing games in a playoff series, for instance. That's not the most sought after center archetype these days, to the point where teams will allocate a big chunk of their salary cap to him. Maybe someone overpays, sure, it happens all the time. But it's not guaranteed, and certainly not advisable.
    Poeltl is without a doubt better than Robert Williams.

  21. #196
    Veteran Ariel's Avatar
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    Poeltl is without a doubt better than Robert Williams.
    OK, you convinced me.

  22. #197
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    We're not really comparing Poetl with Gobert, are we?

    And not only have I no problem having a Wemby/Sochan FC, but that's what I would do, if you consider Jeremy have to start and you're not gonna give Poetl 80/4 to be a back up.

  23. #198
    Remember Cherokee Parks The Truth #6's Avatar
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    I think the Spurs consider victor a power forward and not a center, at least, according to TimVPs article that one time.

  24. #199
    クソ漏れそうだよ、助けてボゲ baseline bum's Avatar
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    More reliable than Robert Williams, sure. But to pretend Poeltl is a tier above Robert Williams when healthy is laughable, that's Spurs' bias speaking. He's better than Mitc Robinson at this point in time, but he's also 3 years older. Poeltl is a good starting caliber center (above average), but can't shoot FTs, let alone 3s. He'd have a hard time closing games in a playoff series, for instance. That's not the most sought after center archetype these days, to the point where teams will allocate a big chunk of their salary cap to him. Maybe someone overpays, sure, it happens all the time. But it's not guaranteed, and certainly not advisable.
    $18 million is not a big chunk of a $134 million salary cap. You're acting like I'm saying bring him back at $30 million.

  25. #200
    Veteran scott's Avatar
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    More reliable than Robert Williams, sure. But to pretend Poeltl is a tier above Robert Williams when healthy is laughable, that's Spurs' bias speaking. He's better than Mitc Robinson at this point in time, but he's also 3 years older. Poeltl is a good starting caliber center (above average), but can't shoot FTs, let alone 3s. He'd have a hard time closing games in a playoff series, for instance. That's not the most sought after center archetype these days, to the point where teams will allocate a big chunk of their salary cap to him. Maybe someone overpays, sure, it happens all the time. But it's not guaranteed, and certainly not advisable.
    This is why I could see some teams more interested in Collins over Jak, not to mention that Collins is under contract next season (team option). If a team is looking for a contributing (20 min/game) backup C, Collins is the better buy.

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