Lakers: Woj: Dan Hurley of UConn Targeted as new Head Coach

[Tyronn Lue]

Lakers friend zoned

[Tyronn Lue]

Knew enough to not reject the Celtics on & off the court, but to embrace them, humanized them and finally beat them. Those get together's by CBS with him and Bird were a riot. Magic would be all buddy-buddy and lovin' him some Bird and Bird would sit there with that pained smile on his face like he couldn't pass water. I don't know whether, truth be told he was conning the Celtics and Bird, or, being genuinely kind, but they were hard to watch. It'd get to Bird's turn to smootch ass and his heart wasn't in it. I'd go over to TCM real quick...I was uncomfortable. I was embarrassed for Bird, for getting conned into these things by Stern.

What's it like, living in the past?

[Tyronn Lue]

No, it's largely irrelevant period; at least in the way most easy to judge, which is X's and O's. The notion that certain ones know something that other ones don't or are going to utilize it in a way unforeseen or trick someone, is asinine.

The vast majority of people just base things off of results. They see the number 4 and that's enough for them. It was for me too pre Warriors, who (along with S bag) distorted results and I'm not rewarding them for it by mentioning them in the same breathe with the Celtics, Lakers, Bulls and Spurs, who earned the designation. That's not the same as saying I don't acknowledge the results; they just lack credibility.

Imagine plopping in Olajuwon on the Bulls in '92 or Bryant on the Spurs in '04, etc.

Steve didn't do much to "fix" the Warriors. Mark did a lot to them up though so all Steve needed to do was actually coach instead of preach and rap to them.

[Thread]

What's it like, living in the past?

It's who I am, Lue. I love it.

[ambchang]

No, because they were old, sometimes ego got in the way and other times the fit wasn't great.

All of their level of cowardice was unprecedented, those weasels just allowed Durant take the entirety of it (to be sure, he deserved the most since no one had a gun to his head) because they were too gutless to admit their role in it.

The dominance didn't happen organically though, so it's irrelevant. Just like it'd have with the examples I cited.

You again missed the point. It's not about "system", it's about you acting as if most of the players are clueless and need coaches to hold their hands when in comes to X's and O's, which is ridiculous.

Never said that. I said coaches matter. They absolutely do. Time after time coaching has changed a team. It’s more than X’s and O’s and if you refuse to admit it thenthere really is nothing to talk about. It really is like talking to the MAGA crowd.


As for the GSW, nothing you stated disqualified them from being a dynasty.

[TD 21]

Never said that. I said coaches matter. They absolutely do. Time after time coaching has changed a team. It’s more than X’s and O’s and if you refuse to admit it thenthere really is nothing to talk about. It really is like talking to the MAGA crowd.


As for the GSW, nothing you stated disqualified them from being a dynasty.

Nah, that's the narrative the media has fed the masses (of course, the young, mostly black players couldn't have figured anything out without the mostly middle aged - old white coaches) and like many, you've lapped it up.

Sure, if you're fine with starting on the two-yard line.

[Tyronn Lue]

It's who I am, Lue. I love it.

Are you sure you love it or will you need to reflect in 10 years to reassess?

[Tyronn Lue]

Nah, that's the narrative the media has fed the masses (of course, the young, mostly black players couldn't have figured anything out without the mostly middle aged - old white coaches) and like many, you've lapped it up.

Sure, if you're fine with starting on the two-yard line.

Steph and Klay (and at that time, Bogut) are either white or latte. Your crusade doesn't have any fact based foundation.

[Thread]

Are you sure you love it or will you need to reflect in 10 years to reassess?

No, I knew it as a young boy. I couldn't explain, nor reason it out, but I knew.

And that epitaph..."The past is prologue."

I don't believe I have 10 years left, Lue. I got a cancer streak both paternal and maternal that is 99% throughout the both trees.

[GAustex]

^
Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

Though wise men at their end know dark is right,
Because their words had forked no lightning they
Do not go gentle into that good night.

Good men, the last wave by, crying how bright
Their frail deeds might have danced in a green bay,
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

Wild men who caught and sang the sun in flight,
And learn, too late, they grieved it on its way,
Do not go gentle into that good night.

Grave men, near death, who see with blinding sight
Blind eyes could blaze like meteors and be gay,
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

And you, my father, there on the sad height,
Curse, bless, me now with your fierce tears, I pray.
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

[TD 21]

Steph and Klay (and at that time, Bogut) are either white or latte. Your crusade doesn't have any fact based foundation.

I wasn't talking about them specifically but the coaching-player dynamic in general and how the media (who is often in bed with those they incessantly slurp) portrays their supposed importance to the public.

[Thread]

^
Do not go gentle into that good night,
Old age should burn and rave at close of day;
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

Though wise men at their end know dark is right,
Because their words had forked no lightning they
Do not go gentle into that good night.

Good men, the last wave by, crying how bright
Their frail deeds might have danced in a green bay,
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

Wild men who caught and sang the sun in flight,
And learn, too late, they grieved it on its way,
Do not go gentle into that good night.

Grave men, near death, who see with blinding sight
Blind eyes could blaze like meteors and be gay,
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

And you, my father, there on the sad height,
Curse, bless, me now with your fierce tears, I pray.
Do not go gentle into that good night.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.

Gets the blood to boilin' for sure, GA.

Thank you.

[DeadlyDynasty]

Good for Hurley, proving he's not some starstruck sucker. No self-respecting coach is going to be held hostage to select Lebron's sprog

[Tyronn Lue]

I wasn't talking about them specifically but the coaching-player dynamic in general and how the media (who is often in bed with those they incessantly slurp) portrays their supposed importance to the public.

Do you think the media convinces ownership to pay tens of millions for coaches? Sure, the media skews the truth to sell clicks, no doubt. I think it's clear though that Jackson was a limiting factor with the Warriors just as Brad Stevens was a limiting factor in Boston and Mike D'Antoni was a limiting factor in Houston when he was there.

[TD 21]

Do you think the media convinces ownership to pay tens of millions for coaches? Sure, the media skews the truth to sell clicks, no doubt. I think it's clear though that Jackson was a limiting factor with the Warriors just as Brad Stevens was a limiting factor in Boston and Mike D'Antoni was a limiting factor in Houston when he was there.

Convinces would be an overstatement, but yeah some of these bigs wigs are in contact with certain owners, so when they're talking up some coach who feeds them information, be it directly or it's through TV, digital, podcasts, whatever, yeah they're influencing or at least attempting to do so.

Clear based on what? Results that occurred with better teams and more favorable breaks.

[Tyronn Lue]

Convinces would be an overstatement, but yeah some of these bigs wigs are in contact with certain owners, so when they're talking up some coach who feeds them information, be it directly or it's through TV, digital, podcasts, whatever, yeah they're influencing or at least attempting to do so.

Clear based on what? Results that occurred with better teams and more favorable breaks.

Funny people blame Pop for Spurs woes but then say coaches don't matter.

[ambchang]

Nah, that's the narrative the media has fed the masses (of course, the young, mostly black players couldn't have figured anything out without the mostly middle aged - old white coaches) and like many, you've lapped it up.

Sure, if you're fine with starting on the two-yard line.

I never said that. If your stance is that it’s either the coaches matter for 100% for the winning or none of it, then you are way stupider than I gave you credit for.

Hey, the supporting players matter too, I guess the media narrative is giving way too much credit to the superstar.

[TD 21]

Funny people blame Pop for Spurs woes but then say coaches don't matter.

I never said that. If your stance is that it’s either the coaches matter for 100% for the winning or none of it, then you are way stupider than I gave you credit for.

Hey, the supporting players matter too, I guess the media narrative is giving way too much credit to the superstar.

If you want to argue the whole "building relationships, getting buy-in" angle (though we're not privy to that), I'd be more amendable to that then the notion that one's "system" or X's and O's a en is some sort of difference maker.

That's nonsense. These guys are all well versed in that stuff (it's mostly the same things anyway, just different vernacular) or they wouldn't sniff the NBA.

[ambchang]

If you want to argue the whole "building relationships, getting buy-in" angle (though we're not privy to that), I'd be more amendable to that then the notion that one's "system" or X's and O's a en is some sort of difference maker.

That's nonsense. These guys are all well versed in that stuff (it's mostly the same things anyway, just different vernacular) or they wouldn't sniff the NBA.

And yet time and again, through being a GM, coach or even an analyst, have shown that ex-players are often average to terrible basketball minds. Mark Jackson being a perfect example. It's like saying some random move generator with a whole bunch of queens will beat an expert chess player every time. it took years to generate big blue and have it beat a chess master, and it is with deliberate learning over the years to do so.

Many times, it's not even the knowledge level, it's about specialization. A player would spend all day every day training to improve his game, he doesn't have the time to look at another team's strengths and weakneses, then come up with a game plan, nor does he have time to evaluate himself and his teammates to see what is the best way to proceed. A coach, often a player in his younger days who couldn't make it to the top due to limited physical abilities, would focus on learning the intricacies of the game and think through things.

Other than throwing race-baiting garbage out there, you have yet to show anything related to that. You have also failed to demonstrate any knowledge of the history of basketball, when it actually started with a bunch of white guys shooting around, then slowly developed into changes in strategy with a coach. Why would there be a white coach to march the white kids around back then? Why was it even necessary? Was the media involved back then? Why would overseas league require coaches? Your entire myopic race-baiting views falls apart once you look outside of what is immediate right now happening in the US. You look anywhere else and the entire argument falters.

[TD 21]

And yet time and again, through being a GM, coach or even an analyst, have shown that ex-players are often average to terrible basketball minds. Mark Jackson being a perfect example. It's like saying some random move generator with a whole bunch of queens will beat an expert chess player every time. it took years to generate big blue and have it beat a chess master, and it is with deliberate learning over the years to do so.

Many times, it's not even the knowledge level, it's about specialization. A player would spend all day every day training to improve his game, he doesn't have the time to look at another team's strengths and weakneses, then come up with a game plan, nor does he have time to evaluate himself and his teammates to see what is the best way to proceed. A coach, often a player in his younger days who couldn't make it to the top due to limited physical abilities, would focus on learning the intricacies of the game and think through things.

Other than throwing race-baiting garbage out there, you have yet to show anything related to that. You have also failed to demonstrate any knowledge of the history of basketball, when it actually started with a bunch of white guys shooting around, then slowly developed into changes in strategy with a coach. Why would there be a white coach to march the white kids around back then? Why was it even necessary? Was the media involved back then? Why would overseas league require coaches? Your entire myopic race-baiting views falls apart once you look outside of what is immediate right now happening in the US. You look anywhere else and the entire argument falters.

This is cliched, stereotypical nonsense. There's 9-10 rotation players per team; these guys all know the NBA game and each other's tendencies after they've been around for a while. Once you know that, combined with your own strength and weaknesses on your team, cultivating a "system" and "game plan" becomes relatively easy.

But my point wasn't so much that or in terms of developing players from a grassroots level as it is, the notion that at the professional level certain coaches are geniuses and others are idiots.

I don't do race-baiting, I do truth telling. Unfortunately many people (usually white and white adjacent) squirm at the mere mention of it, when most of the time I'm not accusing them of anything but racial bias and how certain ideologies are drilled into people's minds until it becomes the gospel.

[Tyronn Lue]

This is cliched, stereotypical nonsense. There's 9-10 rotation players per team; these guys all know the NBA game and each other's tendencies after they've been around for a while. Once you know that, combined with your own strength and weaknesses on your team, cultivating a "system" and "game plan" becomes relatively easy.

But my point wasn't so much that or in terms of developing players from a grassroots level as it is, the notion that at the professional level certain coaches are geniuses and others are idiots.

I don't do race-baiting, I do truth telling. Unfortunately many people (usually white and white adjacent) squirm at the mere mention of it, when most of the time I'm not accusing them of anything but racial bias and how certain ideologies are drilled into people's minds until it becomes the gospel.

Idiots, no, bull headed assholes? Sure. Some coaches get in their own way.

[ambchang]

No, Jackson was largely irrelevant, just like Kerr (he just inherited them when they were further along) and all the others. If his magical system had so much impact, then why were they at the bottom of the league when injuries finally struck? Criticize Jackson all you want, but they were terrible defensively for eons and became a solid defensive team under him and without great personnel. But who needs facts?

Wrong, it is my point and I get to contextualize and determine my standard the same way you do. They were too gutless to attempt to earn it (even if you want to set aside the non Durant ones, that leaves 2 which is obviously not a dynasty), so they don't get to have their cake and eat it too.

This is cliched, stereotypical nonsense. There's 9-10 rotation players per team; these guys all know the NBA game and each other's tendencies after they've been around for a while. Once you know that, combined with your own strength and weaknesses on your team, cultivating a "system" and "game plan" becomes relatively easy.

But my point wasn't so much that or in terms of developing players from a grassroots level as it is, the notion that at the professional level certain coaches are geniuses and others are idiots.

I don't do race-baiting, I do truth telling. Unfortunately many people (usually white and white adjacent) squirm at the mere mention of it, when most of the time I'm not accusing them of anything but racial bias and how certain ideologies are drilled into people's minds until it becomes the gospel.

Unfortunately that’s not what you said. I wouldn’t call saying some of the most celebrated coaches in the history of the league irrelevant is the same as saying some are geniuses and others are idiots. Once again, you have reduced the entire issue as extremes, which nobody is doing other than you.

Hanging your entire argument on the media selling white coach good black player dumb is exhibit a of race baiting. Jack Ramsay and red auebach played teams with dozens of white players. What’s their excuse of being heralded as some of the best basketball minds? Coach K who coached teams of largely white players. What’s your excuse? Owners spending millions year over year on a useless position because the media told them to? Who came up with this bull argument? Did you even read through what your wrote? It is no different than those racist hillbillies who insisted black folks are inferior despite mountains of data arguing otherwise. Ultimately, your way of thinking is the same as those you portray to hate.


I’m on the side of saying there aren’t too many great black coaches due to racial bias (not getting the introductory jobs, not being promoted despite good performance, getting to bad teams with no chance of winning when they actually make pro) but to say coaches are useless and a figment of the racist media is just stupid.

[Thread]

Idiots, no, bull headed assholes? Sure. Some coaches get in their own way.

Hey Lue, this is as good as it's gonna get, and it'll never get this good again.

You remember that, daddy-O.

[TD 21]

Once again, you have reduced the entire issue as extremes

Hanging your entire argument on the media selling white coach good black player dumb. Owners spending millions year over year on a useless position because the media told them to? Ultimately, your way of thinking is the same as you portray to hate.


I’m on the side of saying there aren’t too many great black coaches due to racial bias (not getting the introductory jobs, not being promoted despite good performance, getting to bad teams with no chance of winning when they actually make pro) but to say coaches are useless and a figment of the racist media is just stupid.

No, you have because you're too dense to understand basic things and too fixated on one specific comment that you predictably took the wrong way and have blown out of proportion.

I've listed a combination of reasons that I'm not going to bother doing again.

Oh, so you can that and it's not "race baiting", but if I bring up anything have to do with the word, it is? I'm done here.

[ambchang]

No, you have because you're too dense to understand basic things and too fixated on one specific comment that you predictably took the wrong way and have blown out of proportion.

I've listed a combination of reasons that I'm not going to bother doing again.

Oh, so you can that and it's not "race baiting", but if I bring up anything have to do with the word, it is? I'm done here.

As in backtracking from coaches being irrelevant to now being a distinction? List it out. Quote your own posts in this thread. Your entire argument is around biased media putting white coaches ahead of black players which somehow would force billionaire owners who are smart people to spend tens of millions of dollars on something useless.