UFC 64: Unstoppable

[LEONARD]

I saw the Silva vs Franklin fight and was not that surprised. Pride fighters are much better than UFC fighters. UFC needs to put up more money to get the best fighters to come over.

Oh no!! You'll need to post some real proof of this for Mr Dio because he brings some serious facts in that argument...

[tlongII]

Oh no!! You'll need to post some real proof of this for Mr Dio because he brings some serious facts in that argument...

I've seen Mr Dio arguments before and I'm not worried.

[Mr Dio]

Oh no!! You'll need to post some real proof of this for Mr Dio because he brings some serious facts in that argument

LEONARD: " And in my opinion "

Leonard still thinks his opinion is the end all be all.
Wow, I could only hope to be in love with PRIDE so much & be the board MMA expert.

...

[Mr Dio]

I've seen Mr Dio arguments before and I'm not worried.


I guess if I were to say "I'd hit it" that'd be an amazing argument.
The board Beast Master wins all arguments.

[LEONARD]

I certainly don't think that my opinion is the "be all end all" and while I like Pride better than the UFC overall, there are plenty of fighters in the UFC that I'm a fan of and I order almost every UFC PPV...

I DO think that your opinions are severely flawed and you've provided no backing for them to show me otherwise...here's a few of my favorites...

I like UFC better.

Pride is more of a slugfest & from the dozen or so matches I've seen the action can tend to slow too much. Sure the ref says to fight but in UFC the ref will break-up the fighters & stand them up if it gets boring/slow.

UFC has much more skill on the ground. Not enough action on the ground in Pride. Rules are probably the reason, I dont know? Like I said, in UFC the ref will stand them up if neither fighter trys to advance their position.

I like both but I will take a UFC fight over Pride when the fighters in UFC/Pride are of belt quality.

This proved that you have VERY LITTLE knowledge of Pride since in Pride they yellow card (10% purse FINE) for stalling, which they don't do in the UFC. Nevermind the fact that you said you had seen a dozen matches, but you said that meant "events" which you called "90 min thingy's" .

You can download a ton of highlights from Pride/UFC/whatever from Limewire & UFC's always looks better.

Solid argument there...how could I argue with that??

Wanderlei Silva now moves up to top comp & joins the UFC.
Silva v Chuck in Nov.

You've never explained how the UFC LHW division would be "top comp" for Silva to "move up" to?? Considering Pride has Silva, Shogun, Arona, and Little Nog that could all give Chuck a fight. And the UFC has.... o?? Or maybe Forrest or Rashad will save the division?? Please explain to me how Silva fighting in the UFC is "moving up?" Chuck is the only guy in the UFC that would be worthy of a fight with Silva...yet there are at least 4 guys in Pride that are worthy of fighting Chuck (and that's AFTER Rampage left Pride for the WFA). Maybe there are some UFC LHW's that I don't know about? Please enlighten me...

All you do is rip me for my opinions which I've backed up with fight history, top 10 rankings, etc. I'm waiting for you to back your opinions with something other than cut-downs towards me...

[desflood]

Let's settle this somewhat more objectively

HEAVYWEIGHT DIVISION (over 205 pounds)

#1 Heavyweight Fighter in the World: Fedor Emelianenko
2. Mirko Cro Cop
3. Josh Barnett
4. Antonio Rodrigo Nogueira
5. Tim Sylvia
6. Andrei Arlovski
7. Aleksander Emelianenko
8. Fabricio Werdum
9. Mark Hunt
10. Sergei Kharitonov

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< <<<<<<<<<

LIGHT HEAVYWEIGHT DIVISION (205-pound limit)

#1 Light Heavyweight Fighter in the World: Chuck Liddell
2. Mauricio "Shogun" Rua
3. Wanderlei Silva
4. Ricardo Arona
5. Antonio Rogerio Nogueira
6. Renato "Babalu" Sobral
7. o Ortiz
8. Quinton Jackson
9. Alistair Overeem
10. Kazuhiro Nakamura

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< <<<<<<<<<

MIDDLEWEIGHT DIVISION (185-pound limit)

#1 Middleweight Fighter in the World: Matt Lindland
2. Anderson Silva
3. Rich Franklin
4. Paulo Filho
5. Dan Henderson
6. Denis Kang
7. Jeremy Horn
8. Kazuo Misaki
9. Nathan Marquardt
10. Amar Suloev

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< <<<<<<<<<

WELTERWEIGHT DIVISION (170-pound limit)

#1 Welterweight Fighter in the World: Matt Hughes
2. Georges St. Pierre
3. BJ Penn
4. Diego Sanchez
5. Karo Parisyan
6. Jake Shields
7. Jon Fitch
8. Akira Kikuchi
9. Nick Diaz
10. Joe Riggs

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< <<<<<<<<<

LIGHTWEIGHT DIVISION (160 pounds and lower)

#1 Lightweight Fighter in the World: Takanori Gomi
2. Hayato Sakurai
3. Tatsuya Kawajiri
4. Joachim Hansen
5. Norifumi "Kid" Yamamoto
6. Vitor "Shaolin" Ribeiro
7. Marcus Aurelio
8. Mitsuhiro Ishida
9. Sean Sherk
10. Gilbert Melendez

Judging by the majority of the rankings (the welterweight division being a notable exception), I would have to say that the Pride org. definitely tops the UFC as far as skill level, quality of matches, etc. That being said, I still prefer to watch the UFC.

[Mr Dio]

I certainly don't think that my opinion is the "be all end all" and while I like Pride better than the UFC overall, there are plenty of fighters in the UFC that I'm a fan of and I order almost every UFC PPV...

If it helps you sleep at night & you want to be known as the MMA expert ( ) then yeah, sure, uh huh….
No one can match your knowledge or opinion on MMA, you are indeed a legend in your own mind. Ooops, I meant legend in your own time.

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This proved that you have VERY LITTLE knowledge of Pride since in Pride they yellow card (10% purse FINE) for stalling, which they don't do in the UFC. Nevermind the fact that you said you had seen a dozen matches, but you said that meant "events" which you called "90 min thingy's" .

That shows how much respect I had/have for pride & it pissed you off. I mention Sherdog by the name SherPuppy or something like that & it pisses you off as well. That is obvious & only an idiot would deny it. Still pissed I see leo. Yeah, those pride thingys are the best!!!

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[Mr Dio]

Let's settle this somewhat more objectively
LIGHT HEAVYWEIGHT DIVISION (205-pound limit)

#1 Light Heavyweight Fighter in the World: Chuck Liddell
2. Mauricio "Shogun" Rua
3. Wanderlei Silva
4. Ricardo Arona
5. Antonio Rogerio Nogueira
6. Renato "Babalu" Sobral
7. o Ortiz
8. Quinton Jackson
9. Alistair Overeem
10. Kazuhiro Nakamura

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< <<<<<<<<<

Oh NO!!!
Don't put Chuck above Silva or Leo will prove will his opinion that you're wrong!

[desflood]

lol - but he's right about that. silva should definitely be above chuck.

[Mr Dio]

Let's settle this somewhat more objectively
LIGHT HEAVYWEIGHT DIVISION (205-pound limit)

#1 Light Heavyweight Fighter in the World: Chuck Liddell
2. Mauricio "Shogun" Rua
3. Wanderlei Silva
4. Ricardo Arona
5. Antonio Rogerio Nogueira
6. Renato "Babalu" Sobral
7. o Ortiz
8. Quinton Jackson
9. Alistair Overeem
10. Kazuhiro Nakamura

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< <<<<<<<<<

Easy way to get leo all upset is to downgrade Silva below o. Who is better leo, Silva or o. leo states that he puts fight history & fact , OK, Who won the o vs Silva fight?............Yeah, that what I thought.

[Mr Dio]

lol - but he's right about that. silva should definitely be above chuck.

Oh yes!
Without question!!

[Mr Dio]

I like watching all good fights.
I'd mention how boring some pride stuff thingys were & someone loses it.
Oh well, what do I care.
It's my opinion BUT, I can admit so.

[Mr Dio]

This is one of my fav "Legend in His own Mind" posts of all-time.

The consensus is that Pride is better overal...

WOW! Solid argument here again!
I guess you’ve polled everyone that watches MMA show you definitely know the consensus. Yeah, leo the great knows all!

===
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Pride's weight classes are a little different, so it's hard to make some of the comparisons fairly. But overall, most MMA fans agree that Pride is stronger overall...

So leo knows most MMA fans huh?
OMG, that is so hilarious for someone to even claim that!
It was so funny I almost sharted when I read it!

[desflood]

Honestly, I have seen more boring fights in Pride than UFC. But I think the skill level is so much higher it's worth having to watch a few more snoozefests to see it.

[Mr Dio]

Honestly, I have seen more boring fights in Pride than UFC. But I think the skill level is so much higher it's worth having to watch a few more snoozefests to see it.

pride does have some good fights.
I've seen good fights in a few organizations on some HD channels, online, PPV, etc.......
BUT, I can't show an obvious love affair for pride (or any org) & get pissed when someone else disagrees.
If someone doesn't like something that I do, so what????
I just don't give an org alot of cred when it still has freak fights to draw attention to itself.

[Mr Dio]

I still state the best way to determine the best fighter in a weight div/class/area is head-to-head.

[desflood]

ha ha ha ha ha - yes, let's talk Giant Silva for a second... that's not really about attention, though. it's more about putting on a show that the japanese fans will be entertained by.

[Mr Dio]

ha ha ha ha ha - yes, let's talk Giant Silva for a second... that's not really about attention, though. it's more about putting on a show that the japanese fans will be entertained by.

What about Verne Troyer vs "Insert pride guy here"??????????
I'd surely pay for that!!!

[tlongII]

IMO, UFC puts more emphasis on promoting their brand than Pride. I think they end up with better produced shows that often are more entertaining than the Pride shows. However, Pride offers larger purses to their fighters and therefore gets the top bad-asses from around the globe. UFC seems a little more focused on American fighters.

[LEONARD]

I knew that would get some replies...

Let's settle this somewhat more objectively

Judging by the majority of the rankings (the welterweight division being a notable exception), I would have to say that the Pride org. definitely tops the UFC as far as skill level, quality of matches, etc. That being said, I still prefer to watch the UFC.

Pride doesn't have a WW division...

Oh NO!!!
Don't put Chuck above Silva or Leo will prove will his opinion that you're wrong!

I have no problem with most of the rankings having Chuck ahead of the Pride guys. That's why I wanted the Silva-Liddell fight to happen!!! The point I made above is that the Pride LHW division is MUCH better overall than the UFC's. You said that Silva would be "moving up" when there is only one guy to fight in that org. You didn't counter that point with anything though, as expected...

Last week they had Franklin #1 and you saw what a 2nd tier Pride MW did to him...

Same thing would happen to Tim Sylvia (take your pick from about 5 or 6 HW's in Pride)...

Gomi (among others) would destroy Sherk...he couldn't even finish Kenny F'n Florian in 25 min's!!! WTF??

and in MY OPINION, Wand Silva would beat Chuck. I'm not alone in that OPINION...

Easy way to get leo all upset is to downgrade Silva below o. Who is better leo, Silva or o. leo states that he puts fight history & fact, OK, Who won the o vs Silva fight?............Yeah, that what I thought

I said fight history, not MMA math. o beat Silva 6 years ago! Silva has gotten much better since then. What has o done? Lost to Couture and Chuck, and beaten Shamrock 3 times He's fought 12 times to Silva's 25. And the level of compe ion that Silva has fought since then is so much higher (surely you can agree on that?!)...HW's like Crocop (twice - draw and a loss), Hunt (lost split decision), & Fujita...he split 2 fights with Arona...crushed Rampage twice...beat Dan Henderson...and beat Sakuraba 3 times (who you said was one of the few exciting fighters in Pride).

Anybody that would consider o above Silva is clueless...

pride does have some good fights.
I've seen good fights in a few organizations on some HD channels, online, PPV, etc.......
BUT, I can't show an obvious love affair for pride (or any org) & get pissed when someone else disagrees.
If someone doesn't like something that I do, so what????
I just don't give an org alot of cred when it still has freak fights to draw attention to itself.

I'm not pissed that you don't agree...just baffled at the things you say and the reasoning you give for your opinions.

Pride has SOME good fights? Like I said...you just haven't watched much Pride. If Pride has "some" then the UFC has "none"...

LMAO...Pride certainly doesn't need "freak fights" to draw attention to itself. The fact that they have many more top 10 fighters in the world than any other org does that. Who gives a flying f about the occasional freak fight?? Are they filling 50k+ seat stadiums because of a freak fight a few times a year? Don't think so...

I still state the best way to determine the best fighter in a weight div/class/area is head-to-head.

Captain Obvious to the rescue...do ya think so??

The problem is that the UFC is a business. Does Dana White want to risk having all of his posterboys get smashed by guys that don't speak English and who most of the current fanbase doesn't know? Anderson Silva cost him millions...he probably won't be too motivated to bring over more Pride fighters, or ex-Pride fighters. There isn't a WW division in Pride so Hughes is safe from that unless a guy moves up or down (go GSP go!). Except for Sylvia...I don't think Dana likes him. He'd probably like to see him get smashed in order to have a respectable HW division...

[LEONARD]

IMO, UFC puts more emphasis on promoting their brand than Pride. I think they end up with better produced shows that often are more entertaining than the Pride shows. However, Pride offers larger purses to their fighters and therefore gets the top bad-asses from around the globe. UFC seems a little more focused on American fighters.

The UFC is definitely more focused on American fighters, but according to Dana White they're going international (UK, Mexico, etc).

What about the UFC shows is better produced or more entertaining? I've always found the Pride intros to be extremely well done, not that I care much about the intros. I'll see for myself this weekend in Vegas though...

[Mr Dio]

Anybody that would consider o above Silva is clueless...

I knew that would get a reply ASAP!
Another Leonism?
If someone disagrees with leo they're "clueless" because The Legend in His Own Mind says so!

[LEONARD]

I knew that would get a reply ASAP!
Another Leonism? If someone disagrees with leo they're "clueless" because The Legend in His Own Mind says so!

LMAO...here's a thought. Tell me why my statement is wrong in your OPINION?? Maybe even try backing it with some facts like I did... (referring to o over Silva)

[tlongII]

The UFC is definitely more focused on American fighters, but according to Dana White they're going international (UK, Mexico, etc).

What about the UFC shows is better produced or more entertaining? I've always found the Pride intros to be extremely well done, not that I care much about the intros. I'll see for myself this weekend in Vegas though...

I don't care about intros. I like the cage better than a ring. I also think you get excellent camera shots with UFC since they have to get high over the top of the cage. Just my opinion.

[LEONARD]

I don't care about intros. I like the cage better than a ring. I also think you get excellent camera shots with UFC since they have to get high over the top of the cage. Just my opinion.

That's cool...that's all I was asking for

I think it's easier to see into the ring, but prefer the cage to prevent re-setting and guys using the ring (ie, leaving it) to buy time. Not a huge deal for me either way. I like Pride's rules a little better...especially the 10 min 1st round...