Why Does Sarah Palin Hate America...?

[Mr. Peabody]

Ok, the thread title is a little much.

Evidently, the Republican candidate for Vice-President believes that Alaska should vote on whether to secede from the U.S. ABC News has confirmed that Sarah Palin was a member of the Alaskan Independence Party in the 90's.


Members of 'Fringe' Alaskan Independence Party Say Palin Was a Member in 90s
Link (http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/09/members-of-frin.html)
September 01, 2008 6:52 PM

The campaign of Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., likes to herald the independence of its new running mate, Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin.

Officials of the Alaskan Independence Party say that Palin was once so independent, she was once a member of their party, which, since the 1970s, has been pushing for a legal vote for Alaskans to decide whether or not residents of the 49th state can secede from the United States.

And while McCain's motto -- as seen in a new TV ad -- is "Country First," the AIP's motto is the exact opposite -- "Alaska First -- Alaska Always."

Lynette Clark, the chairman of the AIP, tells ABC News that Palin and her husband Todd were members in 1994, even attending the 1994 statewide convention in Wasilla. Clark was AIP secretary at the time.

"We are a state's rights party," says Clark, a self-employed goldminer. The AIP has "a plank that challenges the legality of the Alaskan statehood vote as illegal and in violation of United Nations charter and international law."

She says it's not accurate to describe the party as secessionist -- they just want a vote, she says, adding that the members of the AIP hold different opinions on what Alaska should be.

"My own separate opinion as an individual is that we should be an independent nation," Clark says. Others in the AIP "believe that being a commonwealth would be a good avenue to follow." Some advocate statehood -- but a fuller statehood than exists now.

She doesn't know what Palin's position was.

The platform of the party is as follows -


Link (http://www.akip.org/)
The Alaskan Independence Party's goal is the vote we were entitled to in 1958, one choice from among the following four alternatives:

1) Remain a Territory.
2) Become a separate and Independent Nation.
3) Accept Commonwealth status.
4) Become a State.

The call for this vote is in furtherance of the dream of the Alaskan Independence Party's founding father, Joe Vogler, which was for Alaskans to achieve independence under a minimal government, fully responsive to the people, promoting a peaceful and lawful means of resolving differences.

Here is a clip of a discussion at the AIP State Convention. The Vice Chairman of the AIP, Dexter Clark, says this of Palin:

Our current governor, we mentioned at the last conference, the one we were hoping would get elected, Sarah Palin, did get elected. There’s a joke, she’s a pretty good looking gal, there’s a joke goes around we’re the coldest state with the hottest governor. And there was a lot of talk about her moving up. She was an AIP member before she got the job as a mayor of a small town – that was a non-partisan job. But you get along to go along – she eventually joined the Republican Party, where she had all kinds of problems with their ethics, and well, I won’t go into that. She also had about an 80% approval rating, and is pretty well sympathetic to her former membership.


Statement starts at 6:00
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In this clip Dexter Clark, the Vice Chairman from the AIP talks about the necessity of infiltrating the major national parties in order to further the goals of the AIP.

F9RDjKN8t4w

I don't know how much there is to this, but it is interesting that in this clip, when Palin is asked about the possibility of becoming VP, she responds "We wanna make sure that that VP slot would be a fruitful type of position, especially for Alaskans, and for the things we’re trying to accomplish up here for the rest of the US, before I can even start addressing that question." (statement at 3:50)

oro2Yh9HoEM

I guess Governor Palin only wants to be VP only if it's a good thing for Alaska.


The Alaskan Independence Party can be summed up in just two words:
ALASKA FIRST!

[jochhejaam]

was once a member of their party

End of Story.




Stay tuned as Peabody will next exhibit that he can link Sarah Palin to Kevin Bacon in 5 steps.

[Mr. Peabody]

so? i like texas more than any other state

I like Texas too, but I'm not advocating for us to be our own nation.:lol

This is like having one of the Republic of Texas guys running for Vice-President.:lmao

[whottt]

Thanks for proving she has more international experience than Obama...

[boutons_]

The EARLY diggings on Palin are unearthing a lot of stuff. There's probably lots more to come.

She wouldn't be the first VP pick to be forced to withdraw. Harriet Meiers II.

McSame has screwed up in the SAME way that dubya screwed up.

Again, picking her says a lot more about McFlummoxed's risky, unvetted, critical executive decisions than it does about her, who would as irelevant and ignored like most other VPs.

[whottt]

Palin: Trying to start her own country in 1992

Obama: President of the Harvard Review in 1992

No contest...

[Mr. Peabody]

Palin: Trying to start her own country in 1992

Obama: President of the Harvard Review in 1992

No contest...

Ha. Nice.:lol

[FromWayDowntown]

End of Story.




Stay tuned as Peabody will next exhibit that he can link Sarah Palin to Kevin Bacon in 5 steps.

So she's a flip-flopper?

:)

[jochhejaam]

So she's a flip-flopper?

:)
Apparently she is. I'm surprised it took this long for her to earn that title <and I had to play a part in it, ugh> :lol

[MannyIsGod]

lmao the political forum is so great today. The conservatives are scrambling and its quite entertaining to watch.

[Mr. Body]

Ladies and gentlemen, we're watching something historic. I don't know if this woman lasts the rest of the week. It's perfectly amazing.

[IceColdBrewski]

lmao the political forum is so great today. The conservatives are scrambling and its quite entertaining to watch.


Hell, I've seen it as just the opposite. The libs have absolutely blown a gasket over this woman, and are scouring the 4 corners of the earth to find something to attack her with. :lol

[Mr. Peabody]

Hell, I've seen it as just the opposite. The libs have absolutely blown a gasket over this woman, and are scouring the 4 corners of the earth to find something to attack her with. :lol

I guess they didn't have to go very far. It's only been 72 hours since the announcement.

[PixelPusher]

I guess they didn't have to go very far. It's only been 72 hours since the announcement.

And about 71 more hours than the McCain campaign bothered to put into researching their potential VP pick.

[CubanSucks]

Bringing up a politician's past=Obama's worst nightmare
http://playahata.com/hatablog/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/obama.jpg
If you're an Obama supporter then I suggest you stay away from all the candidate's pasts.

[Mr. Body]

It's been coming out like a geyser. It's so fast I'm not sure anyone knows what to do with it.

The RNC and hurricanes may cover it up, but damn.

[PixelPusher]

Bringing up a politician's past=Obama's worst nightmare
http://playahata.com/hatablog/wp-content/uploads/2008/04/obama.jpg
If you're an Obama supporter then I suggest you stay away from all the candidate's pasts.

was a member of his church.

End of Story.

- signed, jochhejaam

[jochhejaam]

Ladies and gentlemen, we're watching something historic. I don't know if this woman lasts the rest of the week. It's perfectly amazing.

Other than the Daily Kos lie, there have been no surprises sprung on Palin. She's been in politics for a bit, so I would assume that she was prepared for the attacks she and her family would be subjected to <although for the life of me I don't understand why anyone would willingly put themselves in that position>


Nothing historic here.

[IceColdBrewski]

I guess they didn't have to go very far. It's only been 72 hours since the announcement.

Please let me know if you come up with anything important.


"Oh noes! Palin was a former member of the Alaskan Independence Party! Oh noes!"

:lol

[Biernutz]

William Airs, Professor Kalidi, Toni Resko, Reverend Wright, the mysterious birth certificate, Frank Marshall Davis being an identified member of the Communist Party USA and being a close mentor of Obama in Hawaii.

I would guess all the candidates have had associations they now regret.

[efrem1]

So liberals encourage francophones to have Quebec separate from Canada, encourage East Timor to separate from Indonesia, Biden wanting to partition Iraq into three separate countries, but it is wrong for Palin to once believe in Alaska independence. What hypocrisy!

[boutons_]

Lying now about The Bridge To Nowhere

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/uselection2008/johnmccain/2656914/John-McCain-running-mate-Sarah-Palin-misled-Republican-supporters.html

[Biernutz]

Sara is somewhat inexperienced, but check out this voting record in congress. This guy wont take a stand on anything.

http://projects.washingtonpost.com/congress/members/o000167/votes/

[Mr. Peabody]

William Airs, Professor Kalidi, Toni Resko, Reverend Wright, the mysterious birth certificate, Frank Marshall Davis being an identified member of the Communist Party USA and being a close mentor of Obama in Hawaii.

I would guess all the candidates have had associations they now regret.


Is William Airs related to my Nike Airs? Or my Obama Airs?

http://images.quickblogcast.com/95248-87970/n7711050_36214504_5456.jpg

[GuerillaBlack]

i want those shoes.

[Mr. Body]

Her lies on the stump already take her almost to the point of dismissal - but McCain can just say they got wires crossed. But this Alaskan separatist movement is astonishing. That would get most people shitcanned.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Her selection might just swing this election for McCain, I hope the liberal assholes can smear her enough to make her want to quit

fify, jackass.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Her lies on the stump already take her almost to the point of dismissal - but McCain can just say they got wires crossed. But this Alaskan separatist movement is astonishing. That would get most people shitcanned.

Yeah, it's almost as bad as associating with a domestic terrorist whose only stated regret is that he didn't blow up the entire Pentagon, not that anyone like that is running for president or anything like that...

[Wild Cobra]

I can understand wanting to leave the USA and become an independent nation. You libtards are screwing this place up. If I lived in a constitutional conservative state, I would want to succeed from the union!

[boutons_]

Aggie can't respond to my own words, so he invents words for me:

"Originally Posted by boutons_ http://spurstalk.com/forums/images/Style_Templates/DefaultStyle/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://spurstalk.com/forums/showthread.php?p=2746626#post2746626)
Her selection might just swing this election for McCain, I hope the liberal assholes can smear her enough to make her want to quit"

You lie like Palin. Can't you or Whott or T_pork bring any shit that's worth reading?

The facts on Palin, not yet fully exposed, are bad enough. No need for the anti-Repugs to slander and slime with lies like the Repug attack machine has been doing for decades.

[efrem1]

Her lies on the stump already take her almost to the point of dismissal - but McCain can just say they got wires crossed. But this Alaskan separatist movement is astonishing. That would get most people shitcanned.

Yeah, just like Ted Kennedy's association with Sinn Fein and the IRA. He get's a free pass while Palin gets pummelled. :ihit

[Mr. Peabody]

Please let me know if you come up with anything important.

"Oh noes! Palin was a former member of the Alaskan Independence Party! Oh noes!"

:lol

It's the top headline on the ABC News front page.:lmao

Oh noes!:lmao

[whottt]

You don't want facts boutons...you want propaganda, and you want propaganda that is as slanted as you are.


I'll give you a fact...


The more you guys attack her, the more popular she is going to become, the more she talks the more popular she is going to become.


So by all means...keep attacking


Get er boy! Attack! Smear! Propagandize! Whore! :lol


What a whore :lol

[TheProfessor]

Huge problem for the McCain campaign. The choice of VP is a direct reflection of his executive decision-making. Palin's myriad of issues, a direct result of her not being vetted properly, makes Obama's argument for him with regards to McCain's executive competence. She'll soon become a Harriet Miers-esque joke for late night talk shows. I think they're best to let her "take care her family" and risk everything on someone else who can motivate evangelicals, but it may be too late.

[T Park]

So liberals encourage francophones to have Quebec separate from Canada, encourage East Timor to separate from Indonesia, Biden wanting to partition Iraq into three separate countries, but it is wrong for Palin to once believe in Alaska independence. What hypocrisy!

Well played.

[T Park]

It's the top headline on the ABC News front page.:lmao

Oh noes!:lmao

What a shocker.

The liberal media puts it front and center.

[Mr. Peabody]

So liberals encourage francophones to have Quebec separate from Canada, encourage East Timor to separate from Indonesia, Biden wanting to partition Iraq into three separate countries, but it is wrong for Palin to once believe in Alaska independence. What hypocrisy!

I guess if I ever run for for #2 in command of Canada, Indonesia, or Iraq, you can call me out on this issue.:toast

[2centsworth]

for all this "bad news" the polling has this a dead heat. Tells me the libs will lose again come Nov.

[boutons_]

Whott, nobody's attacking your little bimbo cutie, but just exposing the facts of her stinky short sojourn through public life.

[IceColdBrewski]

for all this "bad news" the polling has this a dead heat.

Don't forget that all the "bad news" has raised over 10 million for the McCain campaign. Yeah, I'm sure Ol' McCain is really kicking himself over the Palin decision.

[Mr. Peabody]

for all this "bad news" the polling has this a dead heat.

It's close, but not a dead heat.

Polling Data
Poll Obama (D) McCain (R) Spread
RCP Average 48.8 44.3 Obama +4.5
CBS News 48 40 Obama +8
CNN 49 48 Obama +1
Gallup 49 43 Obama +6
Rasmussen 49 46 Obama +3

[whottt]

Those numbers are horrible for Obama coming out of the DNC....and it was a good DNC. It'd be one thing if the DNC sucked, but it didn't.

[2centsworth]

It's close, but not a dead heat.

Polling Data
Poll Obama (D) McCain (R) Spread
RCP Average 48.8 44.3 Obama +4.5
CBS News 48 40 Obama +8
CNN 49 48 Obama +1
Gallup 49 43 Obama +6
Rasmussen 49 46 Obama +3

+1 and +3 are statistical dead heats, and this is just after the democratic convention and all this "bad news" for the republicans.

[romad_20]

Those numbers are horrible for Obama coming out of the DNC....and it was a good DNC. It'd be one thing if the DNC sucked, but it didn't.


I would agree if McCain ever took a surge but he hasn't. Also it doesn't reflect the electoral college.

[TheProfessor]

for all this "bad news" the polling has this a dead heat. Tells me the libs will lose again come Nov.
Uh...first off, CNN or Zogby might have it there, but other national polls have Obama up 6 - 9 points and still maintaining a bounce from the convention. Check out pollster - his lead is smaller there, but his favorables have improved since the convention, and the number of undecideds has declined by half since a week ago. Not to mention the fallout from Palin would actually be seen in polls a few days from now.

With the McCain campaign going the "rally evangelicals" route, this comes down to groundwork and get-out-the-vote campaigns in battleground states, where Obama will have a sizable advantage. His campaign has been preparing for that since the beginning, and even though I expect national polls to tighten following the Republican convention, those polls won't reflect newly recruited Dem voters. This will be an interesting political experiment, though - evangelical turnout v. new Dem fervor.

[2centsworth]

Uh...first off, CNN or Zogby might have it there, but other national polls have Obama up 6 - 9 points and still maintaining a bounce from the convention. Check out pollster - his lead is smaller there, but his favorables have improved since the convention, and the number of undecideds has declined by half since a week ago. Not to mention the fallout from Palin would actually be seen in polls a few days from now.

reads very Kerry like. You'll agree Obama's "lead" has shrunk considerably.




With the McCain campaign going the "rally evangelicals" route, this comes down to groundwork and get-out-the-vote campaigns in battleground states, where Obama will have a sizable advantage.

are you dreaming?


His campaign has been preparing for that since the beginning, and even though I expect national polls to tighten following the Republican convention, those polls won't reflect newly recruited Dem voters. This will be an interesting political experiment, though - evangelical turnout v. new Dem fervor.

the newly recruited, I forgot them:lol

[Mr. Peabody]

reads very Kerry like. You'll agree Obama's "lead" has shrunk considerably.

are you dreaming?

the newly recruited, I forgot them:lol

On these issues of the polls and ground game, we'll see how those shake out. Obama has a great ground game in place (I experienced it first hand), but we'll see if he can turn voters out like he did in the primary.

On the issue of Palin, you can try and put a happy face on it, but I guarantee you that the McCain campaign would rather not be going through these issues right now.

[2centsworth]

On these issues of the polls and ground game, we'll see how those shake out. Obama has a great ground game in place (I experienced it first hand), but we'll see if he can turn voters out like he did in the primary.

he'll turn them out against him that's for sure.



On the issue of Palin, you can try and put a happy face on it, but I guarantee you that the McCain campaign would rather not be going through these issues right now.

I don't see the big deal, but the libs are wetting themselves for some reason.

[PixelPusher]

I can understand wanting to leave the USA and become an independent nation. You libtards are screwing this place up. If I lived in a constitutional conservative state, I would want to succeed from the union!

Not very PATRIOTIC of you...

http://i270.photobucket.com/albums/jj89/desertbandit06/LOVEITLEAVEIT.png

...it's funny, conservatives are supposedly the more loyal, patriotic of Americans, but they're the ones always bitching about seceding from the union.

[Mr. Peabody]

My question is whether Hannity will question Palin's patriotism. He railed against Obama for not wearing a flag pin on his lapel or putting his hand over his heart during the Pledge. He skewered Michelle Obama for saying this election was the first time in her adult life that she was proud of her country. Palin was part of a political group that literally wanted to leave the US and start a separate nation. Will anyone question her patriotism? Is this less serious than Michelle's statement or Barack's lack of a flag pin? What will Hannity say?

[PixelPusher]

Palin was a member of a secession party which stated "Alaska First, Alaska Always". By putting Alaska ahead of America, she is a traitor.


...yeah I blued that text, but in reality the logic follows the diatribe spewed forth by Republicans for the past 6 years non-stop, day in and day out, without end. So all the resident Republicans get your fucking asses in here and explain to me why the above statement is wrong.

[Wild Cobra]

+1 and +3 are statistical dead heats, and this is just after the democratic convention and all this "bad news" for the republicans.

Besides, are those numbers among all voters, or of likely voters? The likely voter results have less liberals weighing in!

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Palin was a member of a secession party which stated "Alaska First, Alaska Always". By putting Alaska ahead of America, she is a traitor.


...yeah I blued that text, but in reality the logic follows the diatribe spewed forth by Republicans for the past 6 years non-stop, day in and day out, without end. So all the resident Republicans get your fucking asses in here and explain to me why the above statement is wrong.

I guess the obvious comment would be if you have no problem with states rights, you have no problem with this.

If you're some nanny stater who thinks the federal government could and should take care of everything from giving you a home and a 42" plasma to wiping your ass in the morning while you read the comics, you probably have a problem with it.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Whott, nobody's attacking your little bimbo cutie, but just exposing the facts of her stinky short sojourn through public life.

:lmao boutons getting desperate. Bimbo cutie? :lol How is she a bimbo? Obama's mom is the one who had a kid at 18.

[Mr. Peabody]

I guess the obvious comment would be if you have no problem with states rights, you have no problem with this.

If you're some nanny stater who thinks the federal government could and should take care of everything from giving you a home and a 42" plasma to wiping your ass in the morning while you read the comics, you probably have a problem with it.

So only "nanny staters" would have a problem with states wanting to secede from the U.S.? I guess real Americans are in favor of secession.:lmao Does that even make sense?:lol

[Wild Cobra]

So only "nanny staters" would have a problem with states wanting to secede from the U.S.? I guess real Americans are in favor of secession.:lmao Does that even make sense?:lol

Real Americans are against communists like Obama.

[PixelPusher]

I guess the obvious comment would be if you have no problem with states rights, you have no problem with this.


"States Rights" is about the Constitutional balance of powers between the States and the Federal Government within this Nation.

If you break yourself off from this nation, you are no longer part of this nation. "States", "Rights" and "Constitution" are then rendered meaningless.

So I'll ask again, how is secession not an act of treason?

[PixelPusher]

So only "nanny staters" would have a problem with states wanting to secede from the U.S.? I guess real Americans are in favor of secession.:lmao Does that even make sense?:lol

Lincoln was a liberal who played video games in his mom's basement all day. Jefferson Davis was the real patriotic American.

[romad_20]

+1 and +3 are statistical dead heats, and this is just after the democratic convention and all this "bad news" for the republicans.


http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-09-01-poll-monday_N.htm?loc=interstitialskip

Damn you, liberal USA Today

[Mr. Peabody]

Real Americans are against communists like Obama.

Real Americans also don't go to Black surgeons, so we know how valid their opinions are....

[Wild Cobra]

"States Rights" is about the balance of powers between the States and the Federal Government with this Nation.

If you break yourself off from this nation, you are no longer part of this nation. "States" and "Rights" are then rendered meaningless.

So I'll ask again, how is succession not an act of treason?

Read how treason is defined in the constitution:


Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort.

It is the demonrats who commited treason by "giving aid and comfort" to our enemies.

You cannot even infer that from the wiki definition of treason (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treason).

[whottt]

Palin was a member of a secession party which stated "Alaska First, Alaska Always". By putting Alaska ahead of America, she is a traitor.


...yeah I blued that text, but in reality the logic follows the diatribe spewed forth by Republicans for the past 6 years non-stop, day in and day out, without end. So all the resident Republicans get your fucking asses in here and explain to me why the above statement is wrong.

Her son is in Iraq...

Seriously idiot...are you really so stupid you needed someone to explain that to you?

[PixelPusher]

It is the demonrats who commited treason by "giving aid and comfort" to our enemies.

You cannot even infer that from the wiki definition of treason (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treason).

Considering "aid and comfort to the enemy" has been dumbed down by Republicans to "anything that would make al-Qaeda smile", the definition of treason still would hold because al-Qaeda would jump for joy seeing America broken apart by seceding States.

[Wild Cobra]

http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-09-01-poll-monday_N.htm?loc=interstitialskip

Damn you, liberal USA Today
Unless things changed, USA Today is probably the most neutral paper in print with a large circulation.

Note that the poll was among registered voters. Not likely voters! It makes a different as liberals are less reliable getting to the polls. In fact, they are less reliable period!

[PixelPusher]

Her son is in Iraq...

Seriously idiot...are you really so stupid you needed someone to explain that to you?

I don't think Sarah Palin is a traitor (which is why I blued the text...see how that works?). I just enjoy shoving old talking points back down their throats.

[Wild Cobra]

Considering "aid and comfort to the enemy" has been dumbed down by Republicans to "anything that would make al-Qaeda smile", the definition of treason still would hold because al-Qaeda would jump for joy seeing America broken apart by seceding States.
Now that's really a stretch.

The way demonrats gave aid and comfort was through saying we were losing, and other words that effectively increased the enemies moral. It was completely uncalled for. Our news reports inspired by democrat political figures focused so much on leaving because of the deaths we incurred that they would step up the violence. Unknown extra soldiers have died because of the anti-American rhetoric spewed by demonrats.

[whottt]

Considering "aid and comfort to the enemy" has been dumbed down by Republicans to "anything that would make al-Qaeda smile", the definition of treason still would hold because al-Qaeda would jump for joy seeing America broken apart by seceding States.

Obama does drugs....daily.

[Mr. Peabody]

Unknown extra soldiers have died because of the anti-American rhetoric spewed by demonrats.

I wonder how many died because of Republican rhetoric....:bang

[PixelPusher]

Now that's really a stretch.

The way demonrats gave aid and comfort was through saying we were losing, and other words that effectively increased the enemies moral. It was completely uncalled for. Our news reports inspired by democrat political figures focused so much on leaving because of the deaths we incurred that they would step up the violence. Unknown extra soldiers have died because of the anti-American rhetoric spewed by demonrats.

More bullshit.

By your shitty logic seceeding from the union would "inspire" al-Qaeda to step up the violence because "The Great Satan is weakening from within! We must strike while the iron is hot!"

Has it ever occured to you that al-Qaeda and other terrorist groups might, just might, have their own independent agenda?

[whottt]

I don't think Sarah Palin is a traitor (which is why I blued the text...see how that works?). I just enjoy shoving old talking points back down their throats.


But you didn't shove any old talking points down anyones throats...you contrived some lame ass scenario out of two different time periods.


Seriously...why don't you guys wait until she actually opens her mouth before becoming experts on her...


Does she really scare ya'll that bad?



Look at it this way...she's a hell of a lot eaiser on the eyes than Cheney is.

[Mr. Peabody]

Does she really scare ya'll that bad?

Look at it this way...she's a hell of a lot eaiser on the eyes than Cheney is.

That's not a very high threshold. I'm not saying Biden meets it (he's got some bad plugs), but it's not a high threshold.

[JohnnyMarzetti]

I can understand wanting to leave the USA and become an independent nation. You libtards are screwing this place up. If I lived in a constitutional conservative state, I would want to succeed from the union!

So then you are against us? Get the fuck out then you unpatriotic a-hole!!

[JohnnyMarzetti]

Yeah, it's almost as bad as associating with a domestic terrorist whose only stated regret is that he didn't blow up the entire Pentagon, not that anyone like that is running for president or anything like that...

I heard that during Christmas while McCain was a POW he associated and prayed with one of his commie vietnamese captors. What was up with that!?!?

[ChumpDumper]

Unknown extra soldiers have died because of the anti-American rhetoric spewed by demonrats.Not as many that have died for being sent to an unnecessary war in the first place.

[efrem1]

Not as many that have died for being sent to an unnecessary war in the first place.

Not that I defend the incursion into Iraq, but Clinton's incursions into Somalia and Bosnia were unnecessary either. We can also question LBJ's incursion into Vietnam or Woodrow Wilson's questionable entrance into WWI. The Democrats will always holler about Bush, but they will do the same thing down the road.

[ChumpDumper]

Not that I defend the incursion into IraqYou don't? This is news.

[CubanSucks]

If you're a woman over 40 and you're hating on Palin then that only means you're jealous cause she's had like 40 kids and is still smokin. JUST LAY OFF THE MILF!

[Mr. Body]

Not that I defend the incursion into Iraq, but Clinton's incursions into Somalia and Bosnia were unnecessary either. We can also question LBJ's incursion into Vietnam or Woodrow Wilson's questionable entrance into WWI. The Democrats will always holler about Bush, but they will do the same thing down the road.

George W. Bush went into Somalia. Clinton had to deal with it.

Vietnam started before LBJ, dumbass. Our involvement started with Eisenhower. Several presidents were wrong to escalate it, including JFK and LBJ. Nixon claimed to have a plan to get us out but instead he doubled down hard and wound up having to helicopter people out of the embassy.

[jochhejaam]

It's close, but not a dead heat.

Polling Data
Poll Obama (D) McCain (R) Spread
RCP Average 48.8 44.3 Obama +4.5
CBS News 48 40 Obama +8
CNN 49 48 Obama +1
Gallup 49 43 Obama +6
Rasmussen 49 46 Obama +3

You left out Zogby - McCain/Palin 47 Obama/Biden 45 - McCain +2
I'm sure it wasn't intentional on your part.

[jochhejaam]

Don't forget that all the "bad news" has raised over 10 million for the McCain campaign. Yeah, I'm sure Ol' McCain is really kicking himself over the Palin decision.


Palin was a fine choice. There would have been a shark frenzy regardless of his pick, that's the nature of the beast <politics>.

[Mr. Peabody]

You left out Zogby - McCain/Palin 47 Obama/Biden 45 - McCain +2
I'm sure it wasn't intentional on your part.

I got the polls results from Real Clear Politics because they have a poll of polls. That's where those results are from.

I also didn't include USA Today which has Obama +8.:lol:rolleyes:lol

You know, I didn't include it. Because it's not in the polls of polls that I used.:rolleyes:lol:rolleyes

[Mr. Body]

As a red-blooded American, this secession crap doesn't sit well with me. Alaska gets almost $1.87 back from the federal government for every tax dollar they pay. They are stealing from the rest of us (like most Red States). But we are okay with that in general, up until the point they whine about it. A bunch of freaking whiners. I'd like to see them try to get along without all the money we send them.

[Mr. Peabody]

You left out Zogby - McCain/Palin 47 Obama/Biden 45 - McCain +2
I'm sure it wasn't intentional on your part.

Here. This is the today's Real Clear politics poll of polls.


General Election: McCain vs. Obama
Poll Date Sample Obama (D) McCain (R) Spread
RCP Average 08/29 - 08/31 -- 48.6 43.2 Obama +5.4
Hotline/FD 08/29 - 08/31 RV 48 39 Obama +9
CBS News 08/29 - 08/31 781 RV 48 40 Obama +8
CNN 08/29 - 08/31 927 RV 49 48 Obama +1
Gallup 08/29 - 08/31 2733 RV 49 43 Obama +6
Rasmussen 08/29 - 08/31 3000 LV 49 46 Obama +3

Do you want to bitch about these results as well?:rolleyes

[Anti.Hero]

Why shouldn't they. All the envirolosers handcuff Alaska.

Texas and Alaska should team up.

[romad_20]

Unless things changed, USA Today is probably the most neutral paper in print with a large circulation.

Note that the poll was among registered voters. Not likely voters! It makes a different as liberals are less reliable getting to the polls. In fact, they are less reliable period!


I'm not sure I get your point. Obama is up by 8 among registered voters and has gained since the convention in every sub category. The liberal USA Today was obviously sarcasim. I'm just proving a point that everyone, FoxNews included, still has him up by quite a bit and the electoral map has him up by a lot.

[Mr. Body]

It comes down to a few states. National polls don't mean much.

Obama will take the Kerry states. He needs a handful of others. These are the important ones: Colorado, New Mexico, Nevada, Virginia, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, New Hampshire, and Florida.

Kerry got 251 electoral votes. None of those votes look to be threatened.

Obama has Iowa wrapped up. That makes it 258 EVs.

He needs 12 more and he wins.

[clambake]

Nixon claimed to have a plan to get us out but instead he doubled down hard and wound up having to helicopter people out of the embassy.

actually, it was ford who helicoptered people out of the embassy after nixon ended up being helicoptered from the white house.

[JoeChalupa]

Go USA!!!!

[Mr. Peabody]

It comes down to a few states. National polls don't mean much.

Obama will take the Kerry states. He needs a handful of others. These are the important ones: Colorado, New Mexico, Nevada, Virginia, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, New Hampshire, and Florida.

Kerry got 251 electoral votes. None of those votes look to be threatened.

Obama has Iowa wrapped up. That makes it 258 EVs.

He needs 12 more and he wins.

According to Mark Halperin, this was the reason for the Palin pick. Halperin was saying that the McCain internals showed him losing the election in almost any scenario and that a conventional running mate wasn't going to change that.

[Mr. Body]

Obama wins either Ohio or Virginia, it's over. Florida is unlikely.

If he wins Colorado and New Mexico, it's over. Or Colorado and Nevada, it's over.

BUT... He needs to make sure to get Michigan (17 votes); he can lose New Hampshire (4 votes), but needs to make those up somewhere.

Virginia looks like a tie. The others are leaning one way or the other.

[JoeChalupa]

It is going to be a close election either way and as much as many like to consider McCain the underdog, Obama has a much higher mountain to climb.

[efrem1]

George W. Bush went into Somalia. Clinton had to deal with it.

Vietnam started before LBJ, dumbass. Our involvement started with Eisenhower. Several presidents were wrong to escalate it, including JFK and LBJ. Nixon claimed to have a plan to get us out but instead he doubled down hard and wound up having to helicopter people out of the embassy.

Can you say Gulf of Tonkin Resolution? I think that was 1964. Nixon help to negoitate the Paris Peace Accords and we had to evacuate people from the embassy under Gerald Ford because congress refused to provide money to South Vietnam when Vietminh forces attacked in violation of those agreements. Go mix in a history book once in a while.

[efrem1]

As a red-blooded American, this secession crap doesn't sit well with me. Alaska gets almost $1.87 back from the federal government for every tax dollar they pay. They are stealing from the rest of us (like most Red States). But we are okay with that in general, up until the point they whine about it. A bunch of freaking whiners. I'd like to see them try to get along without all the money we send them.

Maybe if the federal government frees up more land in Alsaka that they might be more self-suffcient. Almost 90 percent of the land is federally owned.

[clambake]

Can you say Gulf of Tonkin Resolution? I think that was 1964. Nixon help to negoitate the Paris Peace Accords and we had to evacuate people from the embassy under Gerald Ford because congress refused to provide money to South Vietnam when Vietminh forces attacked in violation of those agreements. Go mix in a history book once in a while.

just so you know, it was ford who refused, not congress.

[Mr. Body]

Can you say Gulf of Tonkin Resolution? I think that was 1964. Nixon help to negoitate the Paris Peace Accords and we had to evacuate people from the embassy under Gerald Ford because congress refused to provide money to South Vietnam when Vietminh forces attacked in violation of those agreements. Go mix in a history book once in a while.

No, it was after Dien Bien Phu we started sending advisors there. This was in the '50s. Go check out a range of books from Hell in a Very Small Place to A Bright Shining Lie, for a full cross-section of years.

[ChumpDumper]

Maybe if the federal government frees up more land in Alsaka that they might be more self-suffcient. Almost 90 percent of the land is federally owned.The state cuts checks for every citizen every year for oil royalties.

Every citizen got $1654 last year.

So that's $992,400,000 of self sufficiency on top of the federal welfare they receive.

And they need more :rolleyes

[rascal]

What a shocker.

The liberal media puts it front and center.

The media is not liberal. Stop listening to conservative talk radio which drums this into your brain, afterall they are also part of media.

[Wild Cobra]

I'm not sure I get your point. Obama is up by 8 among registered voters and has gained since the convention in every sub category. The liberal USA Today was obviously sarcasim. I'm just proving a point that everyone, FoxNews included, still has him up by quite a bit and the electoral map has him up by a lot.
I don't remember the numbers exactly, but the differences within the same polls when they are pointed out is something like 5% to 10%. If a poll had Obama up by 5% among registered voters, change that to likely voters and he could be down by 2%, in the same poll!

Some polls have both numbers within them. It's already a known factor for those of us listening. Don't ask me to look it up, not worth my time. Just watch and listen more.

[101A]

Politically, Palin may or may not be a good pick
As for governing, I'd have a very hard time arguing that Palin should be next in line for the presidency

LMAO.

I've been voting for President since '88; I'd have trouble arguing ANY Of the candidates I've had to select from SHOULD be the next president of the United States. The people that SHOULD be, don't run.

What the hell have Barrack, McCain or Biden done that uniquely qualifies them?

NONE have executive experience!!! Trust me, GE doesn't put somebody in charge that hasn't had the buck stop with them SOMWHERE pretty big before being given the reigns.

Generals, CEO's, Governors and Mayors; they are the ones that have actually walked the walk. Senators, though, yes, in Washington, are each just 1% of the voice of the body; NO MATTER what they do, they are minor cog in the wheel; and not held personally accountable for much of what the body does (Biden's vote on the war being a case in point - had he been president, he would be being held accountable as GW is being held; as it is, he's " changed his mind", and that's good enough). Barrack? Gave a SPEACH opposing the war; didn't even have to cast a vote on record - and that is considered enough!

Palin? Some scum bag wife beating cop gets fired, and SHE is having to answer for it. She accountable, she has NO ONE to pass the buck to, or hide behind. HUGE difference.

This is going to be the first President elected since Kennedy that the person's most recent employment wasn't executive. Before that, don't know, but I'm gonna half to bone up on the resume's of early 20th centurly Republican presidents to figure it out.

[101A]

It comes down to a few states. National polls don't mean much.

Obama will take the Kerry states. He needs a handful of others. These are the important ones: Colorado, New Mexico, Nevada, Virginia, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, New Hampshire, and Florida.

Kerry got 251 electoral votes. None of those votes look to be threatened.

Obama has Iowa wrapped up. That makes it 258 EVs.

He needs 12 more and he wins.

Pennsylvania and Michigan went for Kerry - they also went for Hillary in the primaries.

If either falls to McCain; game over.

[Mr. Body]

Pennsylvania and Michigan went for Kerry - they also went for Hillary in the primaries.

If either falls to McCain; game over.

Trouble is, both states have large sections of those "working class, rural whites" that Obama has trouble capturing. Michigan should be okay, Pennsylvania may be harder.

If Obama gets both, it's not over for McCain, but it does make it harder. But McCain can lose both and still win.

[Bartleby]

.

[Mr. Peabody]

The hits just keep on coming....


Todd Palin Was Registered Member of Alaska Independence Party Until 2002
By Kate Klonick - September 2, 2008, 3:25PM

The McCain camp today disputed rumors that presumptive vice presidential nominee Sarah Palin was ever registered with the secessionist Alaska Independence Party by releasing years of voter registration history . . . but it looks like that doesn't apply to her husband.

This afternoon, the director of Division of Elections in Alaska, Gail Fenumiai, told TPMmuckraker that Todd Palin registered in October 1995 to the Alaska Independence Party, a radical group that advocates for Alaskan secession from the United States.

Besides a short period of a few months in 2000 when he changed his registration to undeclared, Todd Palin remained a registered member of AIP until July 2002 when he registered again as an undeclared voter.

[Wild Cobra]

Originally Posted by talkingpointsmemo.com

Todd Palin Was Registered Member of Alaska Independence Party Until 2002
By Kate Klonick - September 2, 2008, 3:25PM

The McCain camp today disputed rumors that presumptive vice presidential nominee Sarah Palin was ever registered with the secessionist Alaska Independence Party by releasing years of voter registration history . . . but it looks like that doesn't apply to her husband.

This afternoon, the director of Division of Elections in Alaska, Gail Fenumiai, told TPMmuckraker that Todd Palin registered in October 1995 to the Alaska Independence Party, a radical group that advocates for Alaskan secession from the United States.

Besides a short period of a few months in 2000 when he changed his registration to undeclared, Todd Palin remained a registered member of AIP until July 2002 when he registered again as an undeclared voter. The hits just keep on coming....
Who cares?

Why does it matter?

[Holt's Cat]

Wow. Left wing blog after left wing blog posting garbage. I'm thoroughly convinced.

It's obvious Palin's selection has the left in panic mode, and this thread is pure proof of that.

[Wild Cobra]

Wow. Left wing blog after left wing blog posting garbage. I'm thoroughly convinced.

It's obvious Palin's selection has the left in panic mode, and this thread is pure proof of that.
I know. All I can do is laugh at the libtards because they have nothing of substance.

[xrayzebra]

Wow. Left wing blog after left wing blog posting garbage. I'm thoroughly convinced.

It's obvious Palin's selection has the left in panic mode, and this thread is pure proof of that.

McCain obviously make a great choice, I think so anyhow, otherwise the lefties wouldn't be in such a panic mode.:toast

[dav4463]

At least she wasn't a member of a church for twenty years where the pastor wants God to "damn America".

[dav4463]

The media is not liberal. Stop listening to conservative talk radio which drums this into your brain, afterall they are also part of media.


Conservative talk radio is their OPINION. It is a talk show, not regular media. Liberals have talk radio on Air America, but nobody listens.

Regular media is skewed toward the liberals. CNBC puts a breaking news story asking how many houses Palin adds to the Republican ticket. That's real objective isn't it?

Obama could kill a man and get a free pass from the media. According to the media, it's like Obama has descended from heaven to become our president. He can do no wrong in their eyes.

[Mr. Peabody]

Obama could kill a man and get a free pass from the media. According to the media, it's like Obama has descended from heaven to become our president. He can do no wrong in their eyes.

It's a good thing we have Fox News on the case....

ouKJixL--ms

[Extra Stout]

The AIP since 1992 or so has basically been the Alaska wing of the Constitution Party, as opposed to being singularly devoted to Alaskan secession.

Similarly, by the time Cruz Bustamante became associated with MEChA, the group was a general Chicano-interest organization, as opposed to one committed to forcibly reconstituting the Southwest back into Mexico.

That said, the Constitution Party is way, way, way to the right. Nominating a former member to the GOP ticket is not much different from nominating a former Green Party member to the Democrat one.

[Nbadan]

This could be the deal breaker, if only the 'liberal news' gave it as much coverage as they've given the Obama Pastor story...


The founder of the Alaska Independence Party -- a group that has been courted over the years by Sarah Palin, and one her husband was a member of for roughly seven years -- once professed his "hatred for the American government" and cursed the American flag as a "damn flag."

The AIP founder, Joe Vogler, made the comments in 1991, in an interview that's now housed at the Oral History Program in the Rasmuson Library at the University of Alaska, Fairbanks.

"The fires of hell are frozen glaciers compared to my hatred for the American government," Vogler said in the interview, in which he talked extensively about his desire for Alaskan secession, the key goal of the AIP.

"And I won't be buried under their damn flag," Vogler continued in the interview, which also touched on his disappointment with the American judicial system. "I'll be buried in Dawson. And when Alaska is an independent nation they can bring my bones home."

At another point, Volger advocated renouncing allegiance to the United States. In the course of denouncing Federal regulation over land, he said:

"And then you get mad. And you say, the hell with them. And you renounce allegiance, and you pledge your efforts, your effects, your honor, your life to Alaska."

You can listen to audio of the relevant section of the Volger interview here. Bill Schneider, curator of oral history at the library, verified the authenticity of the interview and the quote to me a few moments ago.

Palin has courted the group over the years.

Talking Point Memo (http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/09/aip_founder_professed_hatred_f.php)

[whottt]

Hey dan....I have some information on Palin that makes a pretty convincing argument that the govenor of Alaska has both more foreign and military experience than any other Govenor's office in the US.


I'm not going to tell you what it is though.

[jack sommerset]

Every politician is a crook. Every last one of them.

[Nbadan]

The campaign of Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., likes to herald the independence of its new running mate, Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin.

Officials of the Alaskan Independence Party say that Palin was once so independent, she was once a member of their party, which, since the 1970s, has been pushing for a legal vote for Alaskans to decide whether or not residents of the 49th state can secede from the United States.

And while McCain's motto -- as seen in a new TV ad -- is "Country First," the AIP's motto is the exact opposite -- "Alaska First -- Alaska Always."


She doesn't know what Palin's position was.

"It never came up in conversation," Clark recalls. "But when she joined the party, our platform was right under her nose"

ABC News (http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/09/members-of-frin.html)

[whottt]

This could be the deal breaker, if only the 'liberal news' gave it as much coverage as they've given the Obama Pastor story...



Talking Point Memo (http://tpmelectioncentral.talkingpointsmemo.com/2008/09/aip_founder_professed_hatred_f.php)


Cool...even Democrats might vote for her now.

[clambake]

yeah dan. i happen to know that palin does all her governing from a secret bunker under the pentagon.

[whottt]

My question...does anyone really give a shit if Alaska wants to secede?


Edit: Does anyone actually give a shit if it actually does secede?


First liberal that brings up Oil is a neo-con.

[boutons_]

My conservative friends tell there's 200 years of oil in Alaska.

Here's the plan: Alaska secedes.

The US invades, using only Blackwater and othr MIC mercernaries charging 5 times more than the US military, to establish democracy and peace which that spontaneously overflow into Russia. This will take some decades. In the meantime, US oilcos wrap royalty-free contracts privatize all the oil and gas fields under oilco control.

That's as rational and sure-fire as dubya's Iraq invasion for oil.

[whottt]

Hey boutons....I have some information on Palin that makes a pretty convincing argument that the govenor of Alaska has both more foreign and military experience than any other Govenor's office in the US.


I'm not going to tell you what it is though.

[Holt's Cat]

So much for wishful thinking. (http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/09/02/alaska-party-official-says-palin-was-not-a-member/)

Poor bastards.

[Wild Cobra]

So much for wishful thinking. (http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2008/09/02/alaska-party-official-says-palin-was-not-a-member/)

Poor bastards.

Wow...

I'm starting to feel sorry for the democrats.

They just cannot find any dirt on the 'Teflon Barracuda."

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

She was a member.

And it's a non-issue to me right now.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Wow...

I'm starting to feel sorry for the democrats.

They just cannot find any dirt on the 'Teflon Barracuda."

That's alright, this correction will be printed on page 20, while the story about her being a part of it will be on page 1 :rolleyes

[Wild Cobra]

Well, let's not start sucking each other's dicks quite yet.
You have wierd fantasies.

[Wild Cobra]

That's alright, this correction will be printed on page 20, while the story about her being a part of it will be on page 1 :rolleyes

True. Just proves it as a liberal media.

[DisgruntledLionFan#54,927]

You have wierd fantasies.

Who said anything about fantasies besides you? :lol

It's a quote.

[efrem1]

just so you know, it was ford who refused, not congress.

Give this man a dunce cap. :bang


http://www.nytimes.com/learning/general/specials/saigon/senateaid.html

December 13, 1974 - North Vietnam violates the Paris peace treaty and tests President Ford's resolve by attacking Phuoc Long Province in South Vietnam. President Ford responds with diplomatic protests but no military force in compliance with the Congressional ban on all U.S. military activity in Southeast Asia.

[Wild Cobra]

Give this man a dunce cap. :bang


http://www.nytimes.com/learning/general/specials/saigon/senateaid.html

Yep. The democrats love to lose wars.

[rascal]

Conservative talk radio is their OPINION. It is a talk show, not regular media. Liberals have talk radio on Air America, but nobody listens.

Regular media is skewed toward the liberals. CNBC puts a breaking news story asking how many houses Palin adds to the Republican ticket. That's real objective isn't it?

Obama could kill a man and get a free pass from the media. According to the media, it's like Obama has descended from heaven to become our president. He can do no wrong in their eyes.


Its amazing how you don't consider conservative talk radio a part of mainstream media. They are the most blatent form of propaganda in the media. They even tell you how to vote.