Mother kills son with a bullet to back of head at Florida shooting range

[JoeChalupa]

Another one who doesn't understand what he's defending.

Another one who thinks he's Mr.Knowitall.

[JoeChalupa]

I still don't get how we got into this debate on religion...we can all assume what we want about this crazy bitch's motives, but it's impossible for us to know. She was clearly a crazy bitch with serious problems and whatever came to her mind wouldn't make sense to us anyway.

It was B2B. Post #2

[Dr. Gonzo]

I find it funny that so many athiests know so much about God and Jesus when they don't believe in them.

[Dr. Gonzo]

You are confusing the teachings, or philosophy, of Jesus (Yeshua) with the doctrine of christianity.

There isn't a single christian religion that follows the true meaning of the teachings of Jesus.

Did you find that on Wikipedia? The basis of all your arguments.

lol

[JoeChalupa]

I find it funny that so many athiests know so much about God and Jesus when they don't believe in them.

And yet they understand religion better than anyone.

[ALVAREZ6]

I find it funny that so many athiests know so much about God and Jesus when they don't believe in them.
Maybe it's a product of knowing too much....rather than not enough.


I find it funny that so many "religious" people go to church and pray and believe in God when they don't know too much about him.

[BacktoBasics]

It was B2B. Post #210 pages later I consider it a success. I've filled two days at work with this thread.

[peewee's lovechild]

However, in most instances that I have read about early civilizations and the advancement ofcivilization, societies have derived their societies laws based on the predominant religon in the area that society lives in. I would have to do some research to find a society that did not, because I couldn't come up with one off the top of my head.

Fair enough.

However, there are some who used the predominant religion as a set up for laws that had nothing to do with said religion.

The Code of Hammurabi is one example.

[whottt]

I find it funny that so many athiests know so much about God and Jesus when they don't believe in them.

This group of atheists fall right in line with people who think they're smart because they realize wrestling is fake.


They laugh at silly stupid wrestling fans...all the way to the movie theater.

[E20]

Fair enough.

However, there are some who used the predominant religion as a set up for laws that had nothing to do with said religion.

The Code of Hammurabi is one example.


Hammurabi (ruled ca. 1796 BC – 1750 BC) believed that he was chosen by the gods to deliver the law to his people. In the preface to the law code, he states, "Anu and Bel called by name me, Hammurabi, the exalted prince, who feared God, to bring about the rule of righteousness in the land."[5]

[5]Edited by Richard Hooker; Translated by L.W. King (1910) (1996). "Mesopotamia: The Code of Hammurabi". Washington State University. http://www.wsu.edu/~dee/MESO/CODE.HTM. Retrieved on September 14 2007.

[peewee's lovechild]

Another one who thinks he's Mr.Knowitall.

It's not at all that I'm being Mr. Knowitall. Far from it.

I rebuted Steven's post about how christianity just wants you to live a good and moral life. You agreed with him.

And, that's far from the truth.

In christianity, the focus point is on god and glorifying his as the one and only. The focus is not on the individual, unlike Taoism, Buddhism, and Confucianism.

You obviously didn't know this because you agreed with Steven, just like that estatic guy did.

If you don't know this basic tennant, then you don't know anything about your religion.

Don't get all ass hurt because I pointed that out to you.

[ididnotnothat]

Maybe it's a product of knowing too much....rather than not enough.


I find it funny that so many "religious" people go to church and pray and believe in God when they don't know too much about him.

And atheist do?

[peewee's lovechild]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Code_of_Hammurabi#Hammurabi

Read the actual code.

Check if it refers to a god, then get back to me.

[whottt]

:lmao it was worth the wait.

This fucking bitch killed her son because she said he was going to a better place.

So why'd she kill herself?

To go to a worse place?

I don't know if you realize this or not but you can still go to heaven even after commiting murder according to most christian sects.





There's a chance in all her nutjobbery that she might not have done that had she not believed he would have in fact been going to a better place. I know its too much for you to ponder. I know you so desperately want religion removed from the story but its the reason she gave and no other. Sometimes you can put your fingers in your ears and hum to magically make things go away.


Well obviously she felt hell and enternal damnatation was a better alternative to sticking around here...so she obviously didn't have a real high opinion of life....what makes you think that changed where her son was concerned?




:sleep borrrrrring. How do those guys move the chess peices anyway. Sounds like work.

I'm not talking about the ones that play chess...I'm talking about the ones that lay around in their own piss and shit all day long getting infected be sores and waiting for someone to come along and clean it up...someone who hopefully won't take advantage of their helplessness.


You'll know exactly what I am talking about someday...unless you're one of the lucky ones that gets obvlivion first.


Not a deterrent...at least when compared to eternal damnation.

[peewee's lovechild]

Did you find that on Wikipedia? The basis of all your arguments.

lol

It's called the bible.

That book you've never cracked open in your life.

[peewee's lovechild]

And yet they understand religion better than anyone.

I obviously understand your religion much better than you do.

[ALVAREZ6]

Early civilizations establishing their codes and laws based of the predominant religion makes sense, they did their best with what they had. All of these civilizations started quite some time ago, modern science is relatively new. In the relevant time line, it's actually very new. We cannot sit here and blame or fault the people of those earlier civilizations...after all, they were people...just like us. They were trying to do the best with what they knew.

At least the founding fathers of this country understood well that we were not to become a christian nation, yet many believe we are. They all knew that religion had no place in politics and law.

[peewee's lovechild]

Maybe it's a product of knowing too much....rather than not enough.


I find it funny that so many "religious" people go to church and pray and believe in God when they don't know too much about him.

Or anything at all about thier own doctrines.

[Dr. Gonzo]

It's not at all that I'm being Mr. Knowitall. Far from it.

I rebuted Steven's post about how christianity just wants you to live a good and moral life. You agreed with him.

And, that's far from the truth.

In christianity, the focus point is on god and glorifying his as the one and only. The focus is not on the individual, unlike Taoism, Buddhism, and Confucianism.

You obviously didn't know this because you agreed with Steven, just like that estatic guy did.

If you don't know this basic tennant, then you don't know anything about your religion.

Don't get all ass hurt because I pointed that out to you.

It's not my religion. I'm not Christian.

[Dr. Gonzo]

It's called the bible.

That book you've never cracked open in your life.

No I haven't. I don't believe in the Bible.

[E20]

Read the actual code.

Check if it refers to a god, then get back to me.

According to the person who translated it, L.W King, Hammurabi thought he was chosen by the Gods, as posted in the translation in my previous post, to prescribe these laws. Nonetheless, it was religon that being used to base the law of the land, whether it had validity towards the religon or not, just by the context in which the laws were being ordained had connection to God by the ruler or the people who were making the laws.

[JoeChalupa]

It's not at all that I'm being Mr. Knowitall. Far from it.

I rebuted Steven's post about how christianity just wants you to live a good and moral life. You agreed with him.

And, that's far from the truth.

In christianity, the focus point is on god and glorifying his as the one and only. The focus is not on the individual, unlike Taoism, Buddhism, and Confucianism.

You obviously didn't know this because you agreed with Steven, just like that estatic guy did.

If you don't know this basic tennant, then you don't know anything about your religion.

Don't get all ass hurt because I pointed that out to you.
WTF is ass hurt? There you go again thinking you know it all. You've spent too much time locked up in that library. I know plenty about my religion. You are just pissed because I don't agree with you. Get over yourself.

[exstatic]

It's not at all that I'm being Mr. Knowitall. Far from it.

I rebuted Steven's post about how christianity just wants you to live a good and moral life. You agreed with him.

And, that's far from the truth.

In christianity, the focus point is on god and glorifying his as the one and only. The focus is not on the individual, unlike Taoism, Buddhism, and Confucianism.

You obviously didn't know this because you agreed with Steven, just like that estatic guy did.

If you don't know this basic tennant, then you don't know anything about your religion.

Don't get all ass hurt because I pointed that out to you.
WTF? I busted his ass about the Crusades. How is that "agreeing with him"?

[peewee's lovechild]

It's not my religion. I'm not Christian.

That was posted to Joe Chalupa, not Steven.

[ALVAREZ6]

And atheist do?
Not necessarily, no.

I'm not going to generalize, everyone is their own case, we're all individuals. You have people that know and don't know very much in both groups.

[whottt]

My guess is this woman suffered from psychotic depression...learn to look beyond skin color, b2b, and you'll see this is a human condition, not a religious one.

[peewee's lovechild]

According to the person who translated it, L.W King, Hammurabi thought he was chosen by the Gods, as posted in the translation in my previous post, to prescribe these laws. Nonetheless, it was religon that being used to base the law of the land, whether it had validity towards the religon or not, just by the context in which the laws were being ordained had connection to God by the ruler or the people who were making the laws.

Do anyone of the 282 laws mention "god" or "gods"?

[JoeChalupa]

I obviously understand your religion much better than you do.

Wrong again but keep on believing that. You obviously need it.

[Dr. Gonzo]

When I was in high school I masturbated in an HEB bathroom during my lunch break.

[JoeChalupa]

That was posted to Joe Chalupa, not Steven.

That's right.

[BacktoBasics]

This group of atheists fall right in line with people who think they're smart because they realize wrestling is fake.


They laugh at silly stupid wrestling fans...all the way to the movie theater.
Its real ok. People die in the ring.

[peewee's lovechild]

WTF is ass hurt? There you go again thinking you know it all. You've spent too much time locked up in that library. I know plenty about my religion. You are just pissed because I don't agree with you. Get over yourself.

Okay, I'll play your game, since you're avoiding the original posts.

True or False:

The main purpose of Christianity is to ensure that people live good and moral lives.



Go ahead.

I'll wait.

[Dr. Gonzo]

Wrong again but keep on believing that. You obviously need it.

Peewee understands everything. He is an intellectual that belongs in New York City because there are intellectual circles there that you simply can't find here.

[E20]

Early civilizations establishing their codes and laws based of the predominant religion makes sense, they did their best with what they had. All of these civilizations started quite some time ago, modern science is relatively new. In the relevant time line, it's actually very new. We cannot sit here and blame or fault the people of those earlier civilizations...after all, they were people...just like us. They were trying to do the best with what they knew.

At least the founding fathers of this country understood well that we were not to become a christian nation, yet many believe we are. They all knew that religion had no place in politics and law.

That is true, however, even in our own Declaration of Independence it started out with the line: "In these truths we hold self evident, that every man was created equal before God." So the colonial Americans who fled Great Britian for the major reason of religous persecution had religon on their minds.

Furthermore we can still see laws that root from Christian ideals to this day, such as gay marriage and abortion. If the government held no allegiance to Christian ideals, why would they have to amend the law to allow abortion or allow gay marriage, where did those notions and laws that were set of gay marriage and abortion being wrong come from?

[BacktoBasics]

My guess is this woman suffered from psychotic depression...learn to look beyond skin color, b2b, and you'll see this is a human condition, not a religious one.
So no matter what we should just ignore what she said.

What exactly did her skin color have to do with this?

[peewee's lovechild]

WTF? I busted his ass about the Crusades. How is that "agreeing with him"?

My bad.

You're right.

[JoeChalupa]

I"m Catholic and I'm sticking with it. God Bless.

[Dr. Gonzo]

So no matter what we should just ignore what she said.

Sure. Why not? She was crazy.

[E20]

Do anyone of the 282 laws mention "god" or "gods"?
I don't know, but my main point is that the reason those laws were even made were due to God ordaining a mediator, in this case Hammurabi, to prescribe them.

[whottt]

So no matter what we should just ignore the color of the rapists skin?

Pretty much.



What exactly did his religion have to do with this?

:rolleyes

[peewee's lovechild]

That is true, however, even in our own Declaration of Independence it started out with the line: "In these truths we hold self evident, that every man was created equal before God." So the colonial Americans who fled Great Britian for the major reason of religous persecution had religon on their minds.

Furthermore we can still see laws that root from Christian ideals to this day, such as gay marriage and abortion. If the government held no allegiance to Christian ideals, why would they have to amend the law to allow abortion or allow gay marriage, where did those notions and laws that were set of gay marriage and abortion being wrong come from?

Did you know that Ben Franklin was an athiest? Did you know that Thomas Jefferson didn't consider himself a christian? Did you know that George Washington was never confirmed?

The Declaration of Independence was not written with any kind of christian purose to it. Religion was not in their mind. That is ridiculous.

What was on thier mind was not paying taxes to a monarch. What was on thier mind was starting a representative government. What was on thier mind independence itself, not religion.

Not even close.

[peewee's lovechild]

I"m Catholic and I'm sticking with it. God Bless.

Thanks for answering the question.

You should be a priest.

God bless.

[JoeChalupa]

Did you know that Ben Franklin was an athiest? Did you know that Thomas Jefferson didn't consider himself a christian? Did you know that George Washington was never confirmed?

The Declaration of Independence was not written with any kind of christian purose to it. Religion was not in their mind. That is ridiculous.

What was on thier mind was not paying taxes to a monarch. What was on thier mind was starting a representative government. What was on thier mind independence itself, not religion.

Not even close.

I concur.

[JoeChalupa]

Thanks for answering the question.

You should be a priest.

God bless.

But you don't believe in God.

[marini martini]

My guess is this woman suffered from psychotic depression...learn to look beyond skin color, b2b, and you'll see this is a human condition, not a religious one.

BINGO!!!:toast

Can we say "voices in her head"??????????

[peewee's lovechild]

I don't know, but my main point is that the reason those laws were even made were due to God ordaining a mediator, in this case Hammurabi, to prescribe them.

And, my point was that some used it as a pretext to set up actual laws that had nothing to do with said religion.

Go back to my post, it says it all there.

[peewee's lovechild]

But you don't believe in God.

Still avoiding the question?

[ALVAREZ6]

That is true, however, even in our own Declaration of Independence it started out with the line: "In these truths we hold self evident, that every man was created equal before God." So the colonial Americans who fled Great Britian for the major reason of religous persecution had religon on their minds.

Furthermore we can still see laws that root from Christian ideals to this day, such as gay marriage and abortion. If the government held no allegiance to Christian ideals, why would they have to amend the law to allow abortion or allow gay marriage, where did those notions and laws that were set of gay marriage and abortion being wrong come from?
Some of the founding fathers were religious, I never said they weren't, but they knew it had no place in politics. They state the created equal part because that's the only explanation they had at the time. The Declaration was written before Darwin's work and any real theory of evolution. Again, as I said, modern science is very new.

We had to amend these laws to get away from stupid religious beliefs. But the Constitution says nothing about gays or abortion.

[E20]

Did you know that Ben Franklin was an athiest? Did you know that Thomas Jefferson didn't consider himself a christian? Did you know that George Washington was never confirmed?

The Declaration of Independence was not written with any kind of christian purose to it. Religion was not in their mind. That is ridiculous.

What was on thier mind was not paying taxes to a monarch. What was on thier mind was starting a representative government. What was on thier mind independence itself, not religion.

Not even close.

Yes, I know but that is 3 people out of 56 delegates, no one knew what the majority of people were thinking back then in regards to religon or independence. We know what a select few were thinking (the major players, Jefferson, Franklin etc.) But not all of them. And to say that this government or nation does not have Christian roots embedded in it is just wrong.

[E20]

And, my point was that some used it as a pretext to set up actual laws that had nothing to do with said religion.

Go back to my post, it says it all there.
What religon did Hammurabi's people follow?

[peewee's lovechild]

Yes, I know but that is 3 people out of 56 delegates, no one knew what the majority of people were thinking back then in regards to religon or independence. We know what a select few were thinking (the major players, Jefferson, Franklin etc.) But not all of them. And to say that this government or nation does not have Christian roots embedded in it is just wrong.

Who wrote The Declaration of Independence?

And, once you find out who it was, did this person consider himself a christian?


Take your time.

[peewee's lovechild]

What religon did Hammurabi's people follow?

Fuck if I know.

What bearing does this have on the conversation?

[JoeChalupa]

Okay, I'll play your game, since you're avoiding the original posts.

True or False:

The main purpose of Christianity is to ensure that people live good and moral lives.



Go ahead.

I'll wait.

Okay, I was wrong. But it is a major part that through the teachings of Jesus Christ I can live a better and moral life. Have I fallen off the path? More times than I can remember but my faith if very important to me and while some may ridicule me it doesn't change a thing.
I always tell myself to stay out of these "debates" I always find myself going back and forth with someone who thinks he knows all the answers such as yourself or B2B.
I admit that I don't know all the answers but I do know that I DO believe in n Jesus Christ as the Son of God, that there are three persons and one God: the Creator, the Redeemer and the Holy Spirit who is the Sanctifier.
I may not be the intellectual that you are or have access to all the books that you do. But I do know what I believe in.
That is all.

[E20]

Some of the founding fathers were religious, I never said they weren't, but they knew it had no place in politics. They state the created equal part because that's the only explanation they had at the time. The Declaration was written before Darwin's work and any real theory of evolution. Again, as I said, modern science is very new.

We had to amend these laws to get away from stupid religious beliefs. But the Constitution says nothing about gays or abortion.

The Consitution does not, but laws being made or amended to allow a certain act whether or not it is in the Constitution still proves that just until recently the modern American government had religous ideals in some of there laws, which goes back to my point that even this nation was brought up with religous notions in there laws.

[JoeChalupa]

Are you happy know that I've answered your question?

[JoeChalupa]

Stop avoiding me damnit!! :cuss

[Jesus Christ]

It's not at all that I'm being Mr. Knowitall. Far from it.

I rebuted Steven's post about how christianity just wants you to live a good and moral life. You agreed with him.

And, that's far from the truth.

In christianity, the focus point is on god and glorifying his as the one and only. The focus is not on the individual, unlike Taoism, Buddhism, and Confucianism.

You obviously didn't know this because you agreed with Steven, just like that estatic guy did.

If you don't know this basic tennant, then you don't know anything about your religion.

Don't get all ass hurt because I pointed that out to you.

You know nothing of my teachings.

[ALVAREZ6]

We know what a select few were thinking (the major players, Jefferson, Franklin etc.) But not all of them.
And how great and smart men were those we remember...

And to say that this government or nation does not have Christian roots embedded in it is just wrong.
Sure, it does, which is contrary to what the founding fathers wanted. It's a product of ignorance and misconception. We are predominantly culturally christian. But we are humans, and we have flaws, which include bringing religion into politics.

John McCain has publicly stated "we are a christian nation"....when we are not. We are just a nation. Leave the religions at home and church, don't bring it to Congress.

[E20]

Who wrote The Declaration of Independence?

And, once you find out who it was, did this person consider himself a christian?


Take your time.

Thomas Jefferson. But the Declartion of Independence is not the main point that I'm talking about here. It is that the American government from early on up until even now still has had religous roots in some of there laws. Simple as that.

[Dr. Gonzo]

Okay, I was wrong. But it is a major part that through the teachings of Jesus Christ I can live a better and moral life. Have I fallen off the path? More times than I can remember but my faith if very important to me and while some may ridicule me it doesn't change a thing.
I always tell myself to stay out of these "debates" I always find myself going back and forth with someone who thinks he knows all the answers such as yourself or B2B.
I admit that I don't know all the answers but I do know that I DO believe in n Jesus Christ as the Son of God, that there are three persons and one God: the Creator, the Redeemer and the Holy Spirit who is the Sanctifier.
I may not be the intellectual that you are or have access to all the books that you do. But I do know what I believe in.
That is all.

:lmao

He is far from an intellectual.

[ALVAREZ6]

The Consitution does not, but laws being made or amended to allow a certain act whether or not it is in the Constitution still proves that just until recently the modern American government had religous ideals in some of there laws, which goes back to my point that even this nation was brought up with religous notions in there laws.
No...state laws do, but the constitution has nothing to do with religion. Look it up. Check all the articles. All it says is we have freedom of religion.

[peewee's lovechild]

Okay, I was wrong.


Thank you.

[peewee's lovechild]

Are you happy know that I've answered your question?

Yea, quite.

[JoeChalupa]

Answer me now peewee!!!

[E20]

And how great and smart men were those we remember...

Sure, it does, which is contrary to what the founding fathers wanted. It's a product of ignorance and misconception. We are predominantly culturally christian. But we are humans, and we have flaws, which include bringing religion into politics.

John McCain has publicly stated "we are a christian nation"....when we are not. We are just a nation. Leave the religions at home and church, don't bring it to Congress.

Then how do you explain laws being set up for Gay marriage and abortion to be illegal? From religous ideals. Who makes the laws? The State and Federal Governemnt? Where did the government get the idea or law from? Religon.

Which leads to Religon transpiring or influencing laws in the government of this society.

[JoeChalupa]

Yea, quite.

Alright then. :toast

[JoeChalupa]

Thank you.

I hate it when that happens...but it does.

[mavs>spurs2]

Hi guys just stopping by to say while the rest of you are just babbling about stupid shit, Blake still somehow manages to stick out like a sore thumb as the dumbest motherfucker in this thread. Bye

PS- One ring, faggot!

[peewee's lovechild]

Answer me now peewee!!!

I already did.

Thanks for saying I was right.

[E20]

No...state laws do, but the constitution has nothing to do with religion. Look it up. Check all the articles. All it says is we have freedom of religion.

You cannot just take into account the Constiution. The Consitution is the supreme law of the land, but other laws and acts are passed and revised both locally and federally. It has been a national (federal) issue regarding two topics that root from religon. Otherwise we would not be hearing about it in Congress.

[peewee's lovechild]

Thomas Jefferson. But the Declartion of Independence is not the main point that I'm talking about here. It is that the American government from early on up until even now still has had religous roots in some of there laws. Simple as that.

If you're not talking about the Declaration, why did you bring it up?

Were you talking about The Constitution?

If you were, it also has nothing to do with religion.

[E20]

Do anyone of the 282 laws mention "god" or "gods"?

There is a picture of their God on top of the stele that it was carved on.

[ALVAREZ6]

Okay, I was wrong. But it is a major part that through the teachings of Jesus Christ I can live a better and moral life. Have I fallen off the path? More times than I can remember but my faith if very important to me and while some may ridicule me it doesn't change a thing.
I always tell myself to stay out of these "debates" I always find myself going back and forth with someone who thinks he knows all the answers such as yourself or B2B.
I admit that I don't know all the answers but I do know that I DO believe in n Jesus Christ as the Son of God, that there are three persons and one God: the Creator, the Redeemer and the Holy Spirit who is the Sanctifier.
I may not be the intellectual that you are or have access to all the books that you do. But I do know what I believe in.
That is all.
And this is perfectly fine, to each his own. No one has the answers, otherwise none of these discussions would take place.

For you, like many others, religion and faith has been important in keeping you on the right path in terms of living a moral life. But what I can't urge enough is that not everyone needs faith to act and live morally. We don't all need religion to justify our actions. And, in the end, isn't this the goal? To have every member of our society, religious and non-religious, to comply and live and act morally as a community? As long as we all do, it doesn't matter if we are religious or not and how we justify it. Like Bill Maher likes to say, he considers not having faith a privilege. Please don't criticize or attack me for mention Maher, I know he's an asshole, but in the end, we don't all need religious justification or advice to act morally and as complying member of a community.

[BacktoBasics]

Hi guys just stopping by to say while the rest of you are just babbling about stupid shit, Blake still somehow manages to stick out like a sore thumb as the dumbest motherfucker in this thread. Bye

PS- One ring, faggot!
The first part of this post delivered.

[peewee's lovechild]

You cannot just take into account the Constiution. The Consitution is the supreme law of the land, but other laws and acts are passed and revised both locally and federally. It has been a national (federal) issue regarding two topics that root from religon. Otherwise we would not be hearing about it in Congress.

Wait, wait, wait . . .

First you talk about the founding fathers and how they had relgion on their mind. Then, when it's explained to you that they didn't, you go on to talk about other laws and acts???

Make up your mind.

[E20]

If you're not talking about the Declaration, why did you bring it up?

Were you talking about The Constitution?

If you were, it also has nothing to do with religion.

I was using the DOI because it referred to God and the Creator. I am not talking about the Constituion. I am talking about how currently the Government is debating Gay marriage and abortion, two acts which are a sin in Christianity, and imposing laws on these two issues.

[BacktoBasics]

I don't know it all. My latest calculations have me at 92.3% dating back to 1989.

[ALVAREZ6]

Then how do you explain laws being set up for Gay marriage and abortion to be illegal? From religous ideals. Who makes the laws? The State and Federal Governemnt? Where did the government get the idea or law from? Religon.

Which leads to Religon transpiring or influencing laws in the government of this society.
Well yeah, states do have laws on these issues.


But what I've been trying to point out is that the founding fathers didn't want this!!!! They didn't want religion to justify any of our laws. If ideals from both sides coincide, so be it, but they didn't want to look to religion to create laws. The fact that many politicians use their religion for influence on their stances is a human flaw!!! So, the short answer is, many politicians are stupid.

[peewee's lovechild]

There is a picture of their God on top of the stele that it was carved on.

Nice.

You still didn't understand the post.

But, oh well.

[peewee's lovechild]

well yeah, states do have laws on these issues.


But what i've been trying to point out is that the founding fathers didn't want this!!!! They didn't want religion to justify any of our laws. If ideals from both sides coincide, so be it, but they didn't want to look to religion to create laws. The fact that many politicians use their religion for influence on their stances is a human flaw!!! So, the short answer is, many politicians are stupid.

+1

[E20]

Wait, wait, wait . . .

First you talk about the founding fathers and how they had relgion on their mind. Then, when it's explained to you that they didn't, you go on to talk about other laws and acts???

Make up your mind.
My ORIGNIAL POINT was referring to Gay marriage and abortion in this modern day and age. I alluded to the DOI because it referred to God, which is funny because the founding fathers didn't have God on their mind. I never meant to go in depth about the DOI or consitution or the founding fathers. The main point was that this nation debates passing and amending laws that deal with religous conotations.

[desflood]

I don't know it all. My latest calculations have me at 92.3% dating back to 1989.
Wow. You must have been the smartest 12-year-old who ever lived.

[ALVAREZ6]

I was using the DOI because it referred to God and the Creator. I am not talking about the Constituion. I am talking about how currently the Government is debating Gay marriage and abortion, two acts which are a sin in Christianity, and imposing laws on these two issues.
Well, we currently have politicians that have flaws in their logic and reasoning, what do you want me to tell you?

The founding fathers didn't want this nonsense.

[Dr. Gonzo]

Peewee's vast intelligence of all things is amazing.

[E20]

Nice.

You still didn't understand the post.

But, oh well.

I don't get what you are trying to say? That the religon of Hammurabi had nothing to do with there laws? Religon was given to the people by Priests and rulers in Babylon. Hammurabi introduced the laws given to him by God. Whether you want to accept it or not, God was the main fact Hammurabi passed these laws, priests accepted, people accepted it.

[E20]

Well, we currently have politicians that have flaws in their logic and reasoning, what do you want me to tell you?

The founding fathers didn't want this nonsense.

I don't care about the founding fathers. My main point is that civilizations have often derived there laws from religon and I was just pointing out an example.

[ALVAREZ6]

E20, here's a clip for you:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fliFcvGAKk&feature=PlayList&p=2F514D7E559D7196&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=46

Sure, religion plays a huge influential role for many of our politicians...in fact, WAY TOO MANY. It's sad. And again....our founding fathers didn't want this shit. I couldn't find the entire clip, which I find more useful and interesting, but at least you get the point.

[JoeChalupa]

And this is perfectly fine, to each his own. No one has the answers, otherwise none of these discussions would take place.

For you, like many others, religion and faith has been important in keeping you on the right path in terms of living a moral life. But what I can't urge enough is that not everyone needs faith to act and live morally. We don't all need religion to justify our actions. And, in the end, isn't this the goal? To have every member of our society, religious and non-religious, to comply and live and act morally as a community? As long as we all do, it doesn't matter if we are religious or not and how we justify it. Like Bill Maher likes to say, he considers not having faith a privilege. Please don't criticize or attack me for mention Maher, I know he's an asshole, but in the end, we don't all need religious justification or advice to act morally and as complying member of a community.

Oh no. I never push my religion on anyone and I'm not so closed minded that I think one MUST have religion in their lives to live good moral lives. If religion doesn't work for you that is fine with me. That is why I'm not the perfect Catholic. While I am pro-life and believe life begins at conception I will not push my faith on others. But that is a different discussion that I've gone round and round with others. And it isn't hard to understand how others ridicule religion like Bill Maher.

[ALVAREZ6]

I don't care about the founding fathers. My main point is that civilizations have often derived there laws from religon and I was just pointing out an example.
I know..and I pointed out finally how the founding fathers of this great nation decided it was best to leave religion out of it.


And also, then why were you mentioning current times?

[BacktoBasics]

http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj23/kumarudm/Funny%20Shit/fshs.jpg

[BacktoBasics]

http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj23/kumarudm/Funny%20Shit/chk.jpg

[JoeChalupa]

I know..and I pointed out finally how the founding fathers of this great nation decided it was best to leave religion out of it.


And also, then why were you mentioning current times?

Not to make this political but then I assume you don't have an issue with President Obama saying the US is NOT a Christian country?

[BacktoBasics]

http://i268.photobucket.com/albums/jj23/kumarudm/Funny%20Shit/sfbhf.jpg

[JoeChalupa]

Brahahahahaha!!!! :lmao

[BacktoBasics]

http://i324.photobucket.com/albums/k324/sanaqua/Religion%20lolz/Armorofgod.jpg

[E20]

I know..and I pointed out finally how the founding fathers of this great nation decided it was best to leave religion out of it.


And also, then why were you mentioning current times?

Because in current times abortion and gay marriage laws are being created and the fact that these laws are being amended, rejected, passed is because it was wrong due to religous ideals.

[ALVAREZ6]

Not to make this political but then I assume you don't have an issue with President Obama saying the US is NOT a Christian country?
Why would I have an issue with it?


I don't believe we as a country should have any affiliation with a religion, I think religion should be kept private and out of politics.

[BacktoBasics]

http://i601.photobucket.com/albums/tt92/Jashinist_101/poster763849.jpg

[BacktoBasics]

http://i12.photobucket.com/albums/a201/XLente/Religion.jpg

[JoeChalupa]

Why would I have an issue with it?


I don't believe we as a country should have any affiliation with a religion, I think religion should be kept private and out of politics.

+1 I concur.

[BacktoBasics]

http://i524.photobucket.com/albums/cc328/AxelordFTW/Religion.jpg

[ALVAREZ6]

Because in current times abortion and gay marriage laws are being created and the fact that these laws are being amended, rejected, passed is because it was wrong due to religous ideals.
Ok...but what does this tell us? Religion should not dictate our laws, and that is that, if you don't agree with that then get out of this country, because none of the founding fathers wanted that and they knew why. So, any politician who tries using religion to justify their own personal hatred (towards gays for example) should just resign and do something else where they aren't affecting the lives of millions over their stupid beliefs.

[E20]

Do anyone of the 282 laws mention "god" or "gods"?

106. If the agent accept money from the merchant, but have a quarrel with the merchant (denying the receipt), then shall the merchant swear before God and witnesses that he has given this money to the agent, and the agent shall pay him three times the sum.

110. If a sister of a God open a tavern, or enter a tavern to drink, then shall this woman be burned to death.

120. If any one store corn for safe keeping in another person's house, and any harm happen to the corn in storage, or if the owner of the house open the granary and take some of the corn, or if especially he deny that the corn was stored in his house: then the owner of the corn shall claim his corn before God (on oath), and the owner of the house shall pay its owner for all of the corn that he took.

126. If any one who has not lost his goods state that they have been lost, and make false claims: if he claim his goods and amount of injury before God, even though he has not lost them, he shall be fully compensated for all his loss claimed. (I.e., the oath is all that is needed.)

Yes they do a lot of them do actually.

[BacktoBasics]

http://i191.photobucket.com/albums/z23/Gooey_GUI/religion.jpg

[ALVAREZ6]

b2b, dude, please stop trolling.

[BacktoBasics]

http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii294/benno0091/religion.jpg

[E20]

Ok...but what does this tell us? Religion should not dictate our laws, and that is that, if you don't agree with that then get out of this country, because none of the founding fathers wanted that and they knew why. So, any politician who tries using religion to justify their own personal hatred (towards gays for example) should just resign and do something else where they aren't affecting the lives of millions over their stupid beliefs.

I don't care about the anaylsis of how religon is good or bad for laws in a country. My point is that even today you can see religon having an influence on laws and that's that.

[BacktoBasics]

b2b, dude, please stop trolling.I'm laughing

http://i310.photobucket.com/albums/kk402/mag-ledon/Religion.jpg

[BacktoBasics]

http://i283.photobucket.com/albums/kk284/Gibsonist36/Religion.jpg

[Dr. Gonzo]

b2b, dude, please stop trolling.

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/midgetonadonkey/alvarezbw4.jpg

[BacktoBasics]

http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e151/drdraxx/religion.jpg

alright maybe some more later.

[JoeChalupa]

b2b, dude, please stop trolling.

Doesn't he always? :lol

[BacktoBasics]

http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h290/midgetonadonkey/alvarezbw4.jpg:lmao its never not funny

[ALVAREZ6]

Where did E20 go? I was hoping for a reaction from the clip I posted...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fliFcvGAKk&feature=PlayList&p=2F514D7E559D7196&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=46

[BacktoBasics]

Where did E20 go? I was hoping for a reaction from the clip I posted...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fliFcvGAKk&feature=PlayList&p=2F514D7E559D7196&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=46Its over ok. Nothing you can say or do will ever undo that picture. It will haunt for all eternity.

[peewee's lovechild]

106. If the agent accept money from the merchant, but have a quarrel with the merchant (denying the receipt), then shall the merchant swear before God and witnesses that he has given this money to the agent, and the agent shall pay him three times the sum.

110. If a sister of a God open a tavern, or enter a tavern to drink, then shall this woman be burned to death.

120. If any one store corn for safe keeping in another person's house, and any harm happen to the corn in storage, or if the owner of the house open the granary and take some of the corn, or if especially he deny that the corn was stored in his house: then the owner of the corn shall claim his corn before God (on oath), and the owner of the house shall pay its owner for all of the corn that he took.

126. If any one who has not lost his goods state that they have been lost, and make false claims: if he claim his goods and amount of injury before God, even though he has not lost them, he shall be fully compensated for all his loss claimed. (I.e., the oath is all that is needed.)

Yes they do a lot of them do actually.

Are they edicts from god?

That is the question I should've posed.

They mention "god" as a reference post. None of the laws say that "god" says you should do this or that.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

just wondering here........

many people say this nation wasn't started based on christianity yada yada, or whatever......

explain to me why what is written on the East peak of the Washington Monument is written there.

just wondering.

[peewee's lovechild]

http://i283.photobucket.com/albums/kk284/Gibsonist36/Religion.jpg


Ha.

Good one.

[E20]

Are they edicts from god?

That is the question I should've posed.

They mention "god" as a reference post. None of the laws say that "god" says you should do this or that.

Hammurabi and the priests said themselves that God told them to give these laws out. The 10 commandments do not mention God telling people to do stuff either. What's your point?

[Blake]

Hi guys just stopping by to say while the rest of you are just babbling about stupid shit, Blake still somehow manages to stick out like a sore thumb as the dumbest motherfucker in this thread. Bye

PS- One ring, faggot!

Hi. Anyone named mavs>spurs is the dumbest motherfuker on the board by default.

4>0

spurs>mavs

Bye

[peewee's lovechild]

Hammurabi and the priests said themselves that God told them to give these laws out. The 10 commandments do not mention God telling people to do stuff either. What's your point?

The 10 C's mention that you are to have no other god than the one true god. They also mention false idols. And so on, and so on.

Hammurabi's Code has no mention of this. All of the laws he passed were laws to ensure that people lived moral lives.

That's the point.

[E20]

Where did E20 go? I was hoping for a reaction from the clip I posted...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7fliFcvGAKk&feature=PlayList&p=2F514D7E559D7196&playnext=1&playnext_from=PL&index=46

Yeah my bad.

Yeah the guy being interviewd by Maher is an idiot. Nothing more to say. He can't justify his belief or defend them. Looks like he is being talked out of his beliefs by Maher himself.

[E20]

The 10 C's mention that you are to have no other god than the one true god. They also mention false idols. And so on, and so on.

Hammurabi's Code has no mention of this. All of the laws he passed were laws to ensure that people lived moral lives.

That's the point.
But is God ordering those laws or Moses?

In Hammurabi's case:
Is God ordering those laws or Hammurabi?

Also, if we are talking about morality, Hammurabi's codes are immoral compared to todays' standards, so if morality is the case, then you can exclude Hammurabi and his laws from this.

If we can accept that Moses said that the 10 C's were ordained by God and those laws have a religous background to them, then we can say the same for Hammurabi.

[ALVAREZ6]

Its over ok. Nothing you can say or do will ever undo that picture. It will haunt for all eternity.
lol, it doesn't haunt me...I know it's a gay ass picture what can I do.

[E20]

.

[BacktoBasics]

lol, it doesn't haunt me...I know it's a gay ass picture what can I do.acting like its no big deal won't make it go away.

[ALVAREZ6]

Yeah my bad.

Yeah the guy being interviewd by Maher is an idiot. Nothing more to say. He can't justify his belief or defend them. Looks like he is being talked out of his beliefs by Maher himself.
Yeah, well the truth is we have plenty of idiots like those in our politics that try to tie religion and faith to politics. I mean, this guy is currently a fucking senator, and that is just pathetic. I'm sure there's plenty of other retarded senators like him. What's interesting is this guy is actual a democrat, even though he's a religious senator from alabama.

[ALVAREZ6]

acting like its no big deal won't make it go away.
well quite frankly, and I'm sorry to say but, it's not a big deal...I look like a big douche in a picture of when I was 13...it doesn't bother me.

[E20]

I'm done here. I have to get ready for Friday prayers. :lol

[BacktoBasics]

well quite frankly, and I'm sorry to say but, it's not a big deal...I look like a big douche in a picture of when I was 13...it doesn't bother me.how about the donkey picture? Does that bother you?

[ALVAREZ6]

how about the donkey picture? Does that bother you?
no...that's not even me lol.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

http://i283.photobucket.com/albums/kk284/Gibsonist36/Religion.jpg

A least most Christians can spell "Christians".

[DarkReign]

I find it funny that so many athiests know so much about God and Jesus when they don't believe in them.

Know thy enemy?

[ClintSquint]

What a sad story.

[mavs>spurs2]

how about the donkey picture? Does that bother you?

You're thinking of Norcal :lmao Same guy who posts pictures of himself posing in the mirror

[desflood]

Wasn't Norcal on a yak?

[ClintSquint]

Wasn't Norcal on a yak?

That could be true. He's always on GIG's nuts.

[ClintSquint]

You're thinking of Norcal :lmao Same guy who posts pictures of himself posing in the mirror

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y29/clintsquint/PIC-0027.jpg

[CosmicCowboy]

:lmao

He has his computer in the closet?

[BacktoBasics]

You're thinking of Norcal :lmao Same guy who posts pictures of himself posing in the mirror


Wasn't Norcal on a yak?


That could be true. He's always on GIG's nuts.


http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y29/clintsquint/PIC-0027.jpg:lmao I can't keep my douche bags in order.

[monosylab1k]

Just wanna say that whottt regulated in this thread :tu

[exstatic]

http://i283.photobucket.com/albums/kk284/Gibsonist36/Religion.jpg

See...this is my argument against the existence of a God. Why would said God give us a marvelous brain like we have, and then expect us to shut it off completely, not use it, worship completely etherial imaginary beings, and blindly follow a book written by an ignorant Middle Eastern herding culture 4000 years ago?

[monosylab1k]

rofl "Athiests"

i thought you guys possessed superhuman intelligence & intuition?

[monosylab1k]

See...this is my argument against the existence of a God. Why would said God give us a marvelous brain like we have, and then expect us to shut it off completely, not use it, worship completely etherial imaginary beings, and blindly follow a book written by an ignorant Middle Eastern herding culture 4000 years ago?

yeah it's much more logical to believe that nothingness & oblivion queefed out an entire universe.

[exstatic]

yeah it's much more logical to believe that nothingness & oblivion queefed out an entire universe.

Would that be the 5000 year old universe, with fossils seeming to be millions of years old planted in it just to trick us into not believing?

[JoeChalupa]

See...this is my argument against the existence of a God. Why would said God give us a marvelous brain like we have, and then expect us to shut it off completely, not use it, worship completely etherial imaginary beings, and blindly follow a book written by an ignorant Middle Eastern herding culture 4000 years ago?

I don't think God is expecting us to shut off our brains or minds at all if he did we wouldn't even be having this discussion.

[ALVAREZ6]

Would that be the 5000 year old universe, with fossils seeming to be millions of years old planted in it just to trick us into not believing?
:lol


Oh, and there's a ton of evidence from astronomy that once you learn, it's kind of hard to accept that the world began only 4,000-5,000 years ago...and the bullshit lies continue everywhere as you look further into Christianity...and also every other religion for that matter.

[ALVAREZ6]

I don't think God is expecting us to shut off our brains or minds at all if he did we wouldn't even be having this discussion.
Well he clearly didn't want us to advance as far as we have in technology and other areas...that's IF he exists...that's right, it's not a certainty. But if he didn't want us to be as knowledgeable of our world, maybe he would have done something about it. Or is this another one of his things he's keeping around "for a reason" ...

[JoeChalupa]

:lol


Oh, and there's a ton of evidence from astronomy that once you learn, it's kind of hard to accept that the world began only 4,000-5,000 years ago...and the bullshit lies continue everywhere as you look further into Christianity...and also every other religion for that matter.

I don't believe the world began only 4 or 5 thousand years ago and I love astronomy and science and the Hubble telescope and DNA and watching the Dinosaur and Giant Mammoth shows on NatGeo and the Discovery Channel and watching the "Truth about the Bible" shows on A&E and The History Channel for I'm not a closed minded person I just happen to have a faith. Is that so bad?

[ALVAREZ6]

I don't believe the world began only 4 or 5 thousand years ago and I love astronomy and science and the Hubble telescope and DNA and watching the Dinosaur and Giant Mammoth shows on NatGeo and the Discovery Channel and watching the "Truth about the Bible" shows on A&E and The History Channel for I'm not a closed minded person I just happen to have a faith. Is that so bad?
No. I'm glad you're not a fundamentalist clown. Congrats.

[JoeChalupa]

Well he clearly didn't want us to advance as far as we have in technology and other areas...that's IF he exists...that's right, it's not a certainty. But if he didn't want us to be as knowledgeable of our world, maybe he would have done something about it. Or is this another one of his things he's keeping around "for a reason" ...

How the hell do I know? I'm no God. How in the world can you clearly know that God doesn't want us to go as far in technology and other areas? How can you prove that? Because man hasn't learned to travel to Mars in a day or something else? Look how much we are already messing with humanity by cloning and gene selection. That is pretty damn advanced technology if you ask me.
I feel that man will destroy itself through its own advances in techonolgy. We already have the capacity to blow ourselves up and you don't think that is advanced technology?

[ALVAREZ6]

How the hell do I know? I'm no God. How in the world can you clearly know that God doesn't want us to go as far in technology and other areas? How can you prove that? Because man hasn't learned to travel to Mars in a day or something else? Look how much we are already messing with humanity by cloning and gene selection. That is pretty damn advanced technology if you ask me.
I feel that man will destroy itself through its own advances in techonolgy. We already have the capacity to blow ourselves up and you don't think that is advanced technology?
I don't disagree that all technology is used for good, I'm very well aware we may end our own race through human stupidity.

I'm not saying I know God's motives...I don't even believe in the guy lol.

This just brings me to another aspect I hate and it's the "I'm not God"/"His ways are higher than us" cop out. Whenever we can't explain something, at least those of us that are religious, use the god cop out.

[ALVAREZ6]

How the hell do I know? I'm no God. How in the world can you clearly know that God doesn't want us to go as far in technology and other areas? How can you prove that?
It's just an assumption because the christian religion is based on human ignorance and acceptance of bullshit stories. God wants everyone to believe in him and make sure we don't believe in other gods, to devote our lives to him. But to do such a thing based on very little evidence or at least a lot of uncertainty is being blind and accepting...

[JoeChalupa]

I don't disagree that all technology is used for good, I'm very well aware we may end our own race through human stupidity.

I'm not saying I know God's motives...I don't even believe in the guy lol.

This just brings me to another aspect I hate and it's the "I'm not God"/"His ways are higher than us" cop out. Whenever we can't explain something, at least those of us that are religious, use the god cop out.

I don't see it as a cop out. Not knowing the future is not a cop out because you yourself stated you don't know God's, err..whomever you don't believe in's motives. So how can I answer something that there is no correct answer to? You can't prove God doesn't want us to advance or can you? Don't cop out on me.

[JoeChalupa]

It's just an assumption because the christian religion is based on human ignorance and acceptance of bullshit stories. God wants everyone to believe in him and make sure we don't believe in other gods, to devote our lives to him. But to do such a thing based on very little evidence or at least a lot of uncertainty is being blind and accepting...

And that my friend........is why they call it faith. Blind and accepting as it may seem to you....it is faith still the same.

[ALVAREZ6]

So you admit that it's not a certainty? You admit you could be wrong, just how I can be? If this is the case, then there's no need for further discussion, I can actually respect that. The main thing that causes me to argue sometimes with Christians is most I encounter talk about their beliefs as "truth". They literally refer to what they believe in as truth and for that reason they have to believe it. That's my main problem with many religious people's beliefs...having faith and everything is fine, I can respect someone like you as long as you acknowledge and admit that you could be wrong because it's not a certainty.

[JoeChalupa]

So you admit that it's not a certainty? You admit you could be wrong, just how I can be? If this is the case, then there's no need for further discussion, I can actually respect that. The main thing that causes me to argue sometimes with Christians is most I encounter talk about their beliefs as "truth". They literally refer to what they believe in as truth and for that reason they have to believe it. That's my main problem with many religious people's beliefs...having faith and everything is fine, I can respect someone like you as long as you acknowledge and admit that you could be wrong because it's not a certainty.

No, I'm certain there is a God, otherwise why would I have faith? But can I prove it? No, I can not. But there are many things that cannot be seen that are what I consider a reality and a certainty that while not being able to be proven does not mean they do not exist. It very well could be a generational thing if you can understand that. I am a product of my upbringing and that is something I am content with.

In the words of the Boss....
God have mercy on the man, who doubts what he's sure of.

[Leetonidas]

yeah it's much more logical to believe that nothingness & oblivion queefed out an entire universe.

:lmao

So that's your logic for believing? That's pretty pathetic. Just because it's too complex of a process for human minds to grasp doesn't mean illogical. What's illogical is coming to this point and then assuming an imaginary being you've never seen did it, just to ease your mind. Well what created God, because he couldn't have just been queefed from nothingness and oblivion, right? :rolleyes

[Trainwreck2100]

:lmao

So that's your logic for believing? That's pretty pathetic. Just because it's too complex of a process for human minds to grasp doesn't mean illogical. What's illogical is coming to this point and then assuming an imaginary being you've never seen did it, just to ease your mind. Well what created God, because he couldn't have just been queefed from nothingness and oblivion, right? :rolleyes

complex? How do you know its complex if you don't know what it is?

[JoeChalupa]

Faith is something that some just simply cannot grasp. At least in God that is. The unproven simply cannot be believed in for without proof it simply does not exist.

[Trainwreck2100]

Faith is something that some just simply cannot grasp. At least in God that is. The unproven simply cannot be believed in for without proof it simply does not exist.

Asking some to believe in faith, is like asking you to not.

[Leetonidas]

Faith is something that some just simply cannot grasp. At least in God that is. The unproven simply cannot be believed in for without proof it simply does not exist.

I got no problem with people who have faith or are religious at all brah, but I can't stand dipshits who think with retarded ass logic as seen above.

[ALVAREZ6]

Faith is something that some just simply cannot grasp. At least in God that is. The unproven simply cannot be believed in for without proof it simply does not exist.
No...I don't hold that idea.

The unproven can be believed in, of course. Anything can be believed in, I understand the concept of faith. The fact that it cannot be proven only tells us that it may or may not exist, not that it does not exist, and for that reason, sure, it can be believed in.

[ALVAREZ6]

No, I'm certain there is a God, otherwise why would I have faith? But can I prove it? No, I can not.
Ahh, nevermind. You are a moron.

In my opinion, you can have faith without being certain there is a God.

[ALVAREZ6]

Just to clarify, I am NOT certain that God does not exist. As Maher has said in multiple interviews, I don't even consider myself an atheist because it mirrors the same certainty that many Christians have. The common ground I find is that neither scenario can be proven, and for that reason I find it unreasonable to say that either is a certainty. I never say there definitely is not a god, if I did, I would be the same idiot as someone saying there definitely is a god. And when I talk of god, I'm not even speaking of the christian god, because if there is some sort of higher power, I definitely don't think it's the god that Christians worship, and the Jews, Muslims and all other religions for that matter.

[JoeChalupa]

Just to clarify, I am NOT certain that God does not exist. As Maher has said in multiple interviews, I don't even consider myself an atheist because it mirrors the same certainty that many Christians have. The common ground I find is that neither scenario can be proven, and for that reason I find it unreasonable to say that either is a certainty. I never say there definitely is not a god, if I did, I would be the same idiot as someone saying there definitely is a god. And when I talk of god, I'm not even speaking of the christian god, because if there is some sort of higher power, I definitely don't think it's the god that Christians worship, and the Jews, Muslims and all other religions for that matter.

I can live with that. And yes, as a sinner, I've had my doubts but it always, at least for me, goes back to faith. Each and every time.

[Trainwreck2100]

I can live with that. And yes, as a sinner, I've had my doubts but it always, at least for me, goes back to faith. Each and every time.

Why should he care what you think after all you're a "moron"

[ALVAREZ6]

Why should he care what you think after all you're a "moron"
lol, I'm sorry, but anyone who tells me there DEFINITELY is a heaven or hell, without ever experiencing any of these things (obviously), is a moron.

It's the same for saying there DEFINITELY is a god.


Call me an asshole, I find it completely rational to acknowledge that these things are unprovable, and for that reason it's just stupid to say they definitely exist. Again, having faith without saying there definitely is a god is completely different.

[JoeChalupa]

lol, I'm sorry, but anyone who tells me there DEFINITELY is a heaven or hell, without ever experiencing any of these things (obviously), is a moron.

It's the same for saying there DEFINITELY is a god.


Call me an asshole, I find it completely rational to acknowledge that these things are unprovable, and for that reason it's just stupid to say they definitely exist. Again, having faith without saying there definitely is a god is completely different.

Saying there DEFINTELY is s heaven or hell is based on faith. And since you have none, thus, you cannot comprehend and therefore..God does not exist.

[baseline bum]

Just to clarify, I am NOT certain that God does not exist. As Maher has said in multiple interviews, I don't even consider myself an atheist because it mirrors the same certainty that many Christians have. The common ground I find is that neither scenario can be proven, and for that reason I find it unreasonable to say that either is a certainty. I never say there definitely is not a god, if I did, I would be the same idiot as someone saying there definitely is a god. And when I talk of god, I'm not even speaking of the christian god, because if there is some sort of higher power, I definitely don't think it's the god that Christians worship, and the Jews, Muslims and all other religions for that matter.

Most atheists don't believe there is no god with the same certainty that Christians believe there is one. We think it's highly unlikely there is one who would never leave his footprint in the world. What is the probability you'd put on God's existence? 50/50? 30/70? 20/80?

[monosylab1k]

:lmao

So that's your logic for believing? That's pretty pathetic. Just because it's too complex of a process for human minds to grasp doesn't mean illogical. What's illogical is coming to this point and then assuming an imaginary being you've never seen did it, just to ease your mind. Well what created God, because he couldn't have just been queefed from nothingness and oblivion, right? :rolleyes

Who said it was my logic for believing? If atheists want to reduce religion to such stupidly simplistic terms, then I'll do the same for them. You should stick to talking about things you have a grasp on, like weed and...........well, weed.

Atheists believe in the "Incredible Universe-Queefing Nothingness"....good for them.

[Pablo Escobar]

somebody post the uncut video that shit is messed up but still would like to see it

[Leetonidas]

Who said it was my logic for believing? If atheists want to reduce religion to such stupidly simplistic terms, then I'll do the same for them. You should stick to talking about things you have a grasp on, like weed and...........well, weed.

Atheists believe in the "Incredible Universe-Queefing Nothingness"....good for them.

Just because you're too much of a simple-minded troll to understand the complexity of super-condensed particle matter exploding upon massive amounts of pressure isn't my fault. Perhaps you should stick to talking about things you have a grasp on like failing and making yourself look stupid. :tu

[Leetonidas]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang

Boy, that's so much more simplistic than "God did it."

[marini martini]

So..............any one want to play Tx. holdem??????

[ALVAREZ6]

Most atheists don't believe there is no god with the same certainty that Christians believe there is one. We think it's highly unlikely there is one who would never leave his footprint in the world. What is the probability you'd put on God's existence? 50/50? 30/70? 20/80?
Well that's why I don't label myself as an atheist...as I have explained, I don't mirror that same certainty that Christians have. Not even close. And putting probabilities is stupid because it's just throwing subjective numbers out without any real method, it's just a guess, but if you want ball park, I'd say 10%...but what does that even mean? I just think it's silly to get caught up in probabilities on this subject.

But you should also clarify what god...I mean, asking me for what probability I would assign to the christian god's existence, or the existence of an unidentified higher power, are different things.

[BacktoBasics]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang

Boy, that's so much more simplistic than "God did it."The point isn't simplicity the point is that they've recreated every moment of the big bang to support its theory with the exception of the first moment. That moment or particle is refered to as the Higgs Boson particle or "god particle" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Higgs_particle

The Large Hadron Collider is expected to shed light on that very particle if they can get it going sometime late this year or next year. If successful in identifying the particle this would be in my opinion the greatest scientific breakthru of all time.

[ploto]

Being intolerant of other people's intolerance and judging people for being judgmental.

[dimsah]

Well, it's happened. Some atheists have become just as annoying and pretentious as their religious counterparts.

The phrase "non-religious zealot" should be coined here. The antithesis of the religious zealot. Both groups angrily stating their case about the beliefs they espouse.

[Expresso]

http://labaguette-co.com/images/expresso.jpg

[baseline bum]

Well that's why I don't label myself as an atheist...as I have explained, I don't mirror that same certainty that Christians have. Not even close. And putting probabilities is stupid because it's just throwing subjective numbers out without any real method, it's just a guess, but if you want ball park, I'd say 10%...but what does that even mean? I just think it's silly to get caught up in probabilities on this subject.

But you should also clarify what god...I mean, asking me for what probability I would assign to the christian god's existence, or the existence of an unidentified higher power, are different things.

If you think it's silly to get caught up in probabilities, then why would you say 10% even? Being an atheist is about rejecting the idea of something existing that leaves no proof as being highly improbable. Look up Russell's Teapot; Bertrand Russell said we can never prove there isn't a teapot, too small to be seen with our most powerful telescopes, in orbit between the Earth and Mars, but almost everyone would agree that the probability there is one is virtually 0. Your argument would indicate it would be meaningless to assign probabilities to Russell's ridiculous hypothesis too, since it can't be shown one way or the other. I guess by God I would mean the active god who creates a universe, watches every person, knows what everyone is thinking, etc.

[baseline bum]

Well, it's happened. Some atheists have become just as annoying and pretentious as their religious counterparts.

The phrase "non-religious zealot" should be coined here. The antithesis of the religious zealot. Both groups angrily stating their case about the beliefs they espouse.

Atheism is lack of belief in god. It's not on par with belief. It's absolutely not on us to prove a negative. See the above post about the teapot. Fuck this whole notion that atheists should tiptoe around religion and treat it with kiddie gloves. Religion is often a political institution; I can't imagine anyone ever trying to seriously argue that you can't criticize the Republicans or the Democrats, and that they're so fragile we must treat them with reverence when we disagree with them.

[monosylab1k]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_Bang

Boy, that's so much more simplistic than "God did it."

That's a big long article to say "the universe was queefed out of nothing"

[ALVAREZ6]

If you think it's silly to get caught up in probabilities, then why would you say 10% even? Being an atheist is about rejecting the idea of something existing that leaves no proof as being highly improbable. Look up Russell's Teapot; Bertrand Russell said we can never prove there isn't a teapot, too small to be seen with our most powerful telescopes, in orbit between the Earth and Mars, but almost everyone would agree that the probability there is one is virtually 0. Your argument would indicate it would be meaningless to assign probabilities to Russell's ridiculous hypothesis too, since it can't be shown one way or the other. I guess by God I would mean the active god who creates a universe, watches every person, knows what everyone is thinking, etc.
I assigned it a probability for the hell of it because you asked. If you had asked for the Christian God, I would assign no greater than 1%.

[CosmicCowboy]

:lmao

This thread is still going on religion?

:lol

And people wonder why we can't have peace in the middle east. When religion and anti-religion or religion vs. religion gets going it just never stops.

[Viva Las Espuelas]

just wondering here........

many people say this nation wasn't started based on christianity yada yada, or whatever......

explain to me why what is written on the East peak of the Washington Monument is written there.

just wondering.

:wakeup