Pick the best right now: Dirk vs KG

[z0sa]

lol still laughing at his own joke

i'm laughing at you, not my jokes about you. :lol:lol

[z0sa]

lol knowledgable isn't a word :lol:lol

[redzero]

lol stupid fat mexican

Tell us what you really think about him.

[Findog]

Who else on the team is there, beside Paul and West? Have you seen the players around Chris Paul? And when he's double and triple teamed by forwards along with guards, what do you think is going to happen? Are his teammates supposed to not suck anymore? Also, the lead became far larger when the bench was emptied out, which goes to show how horrible Paul's teammates are.


There is no excuse for the Memphis Grizzlies or LA Clippers losing by 58 points to another team at home. But keep trying to justify it because CP3 and West were so "tired." :lmao at you. If you want to make excuses for that, then you have to concede that the Mavericks have been a far tougher out than that. You can't call out a guy for missing a single free throw and then turn right around and say D West and CP3 were "tired." I'm pretty sure a college team that didn't quit and had a modicum of heart could stay within 58 points of the Nuggets with their home crowd behind them. I bet the Kansas Jayhawks could lose by less than 58 to the Nuggets at Allen Fieldhouse. :lmao at your excuses.

[urunobili]

So first you didn't want to argue about championships 'cause we're talking about individual players but you don't want to argue about individual awards either? You're a blind Dirk homer, know it.

:lmao at the "sabelo" translation :lmao

[redzero]

There is no excuse for the Memphis Grizzlies or LA Clippers losing by 58 points to another team at home. But keep trying to justify it because CP3 and West were so "tired."

1.) Chris Paul and David West are just two people.
2.) They weren't just worn down.
3.) Grizzlies & Clippers > Hornets without West and Paul.

[sonic21]

1.) Chris Paul and David West are just two people.
2.) They weren't just worn down.
3.) Grizzlies & Clippers > Hornets without West and Paul.

doesn't make sense, what's your point exactly?

[Findog]

1.) Chris Paul and David West are just two people.
2.) They weren't just worn down.
3.) Grizzlies & Clippers > Hornets without West and Paul.

:lmao
:lmao
:lmao

Your team quit and had no heart. And you have the balls to call out another team with a far greater record of success for quitting and having no heart, when they lost 3 games by a total of 6 points and every single one of those games came down to the final possession. Miami was better than Dallas in that series, but the Mavs did not quit.

:lmao

[Findog]

doesn't make sense, what's your point exactly?

His point is that CP3 and West had sore vaginas and were tired, and so we should excuse the Hornets losing by 58 points at home in a playoff game. Nevermind a D-League team playing at home should be able to be more competitive than that.

[23LeBronJames23]

This is a dumb thread...

[redzero]

:lmao
:lmao
:lmao

Your team quit and had no heart. And you have the balls to call out another team with a far greater record of success for quitting and having no heart, when they lost 3 games by a total of 6 points and every single one of those games came down to the final possession. Miami was better than Dallas in that series, but the Mavs did not quit.

:lmao

No, Dwyane Wade was better than Dallas, because Dwyane Wade carried the Heat to four consecutive wins. From a team perspective, the Dallas Mavericks were without question better, talent wise. Wade dropped 40 points on the Mavericks twice, with no opposition. I know that Mavs fans love to bring up the ref card, but the majority of Wade's points didn't come from free throws.

Also, your team doesn't have anything to show for all their 60+ win seasons. And you still fail to realize how garbage the Hornets are without Paul and West.

Sean Marks
Melvin Ely
Antonio Daniels
Ryan Bowen
Hilton Armstrong

These players wouldn't even get any play time on a the Kings, but those were the backups for the Hornets. I'll repeat myself: this isn't about quiting. There was a reason why Paul was being double and triple teamed by the Nuggets. The players listed above guard themselves.

I have the perfect example:

Chris Paul went down in at the end of the third quarter of a home game against the Portland Trail Blazers. The Hornets then managed to blow a 17 point lead and give up 40 points in one quarter. This had nothing to do with quitting at all. Garbage players will play like garbage.

[monoslyab1k]

Dirk!

[Findog]

Chris Paul and David West were tired. How can they be faulted for losing by 60 points at home when they were tired? Not quitters at all!

:lmao

[pauls931]

This is pointless, it's been proven that polls can be rigged just like in the real world...

[Double-Up]

Memphis is better than Cleveland without LeBron....really what you're point? :lol

[23LeBronJames23]

This is pointless, it's been proven that polls can be rigged just like in the real world...

dats wat i mean

[redzero]

If I ignore your post and repeat the same thin over again, that makes me right.


Chris Paul and David West weren't even playing in the last quarter. Paul's horrible teammates made the deficit balloon to 58 points.

I'll repeat myself: have you seen Chris Paul's teammates? Hell, they were outscored by 20 points in the fourth quarter by the Nuggets' backups. That's the gap in talent on each team. You keep bringing up D-League players as if you were trying to make a point. However, Sean Marks, Hilton Armstrong, Ryan Bowen, and Antonio Daniels are worse.

Your team, however, had the talent. They had the personnel. They had the two game lead. They were winning against a one-man team. Shit, they had chance to go up 3-0 against the Heat, but they somehow managed to blow a ten point lead and lose four games straight to Dwyane Wade. At least the Hornets lost to a clearly superior team, and that's with injuries. Your team became Dwyane Wade's doormat, making all of those 60+ win seasons irrelevant.

Shitty players will play like shit. This is nothing new.

[bdictjames]

As much as I hate KG, KG just brings the intangibles while being a beast on both sides of the floor as well. Individually its Dirk but its a team game.

[Findog]

You don't need to relate what my team's goals on either end are. I'm more than aware of what their gameplan is. Don't forget my team, and its coach, are title winners.

They turn into the Bad News Bears at the first sign of the blue and green.



Second, the fact Dirk sucked had much more to do with Matt Bonner than anyone will give credit. In fact, putting a mobile bigman on Dirk essentially guarantees you will inhibit the flow of the Mavs offense. The spurs have never possessed a big man who could do this, yet Bonner stepped in quite nicely.

:lmao. Okay. Yeah, Bonner locked Dirk down and the Spurs didn't constantly run double teams at him and trap him to force the ball out of his hands...leading to Barea, Bass and Josh having a field day. Okay. :lmao




Yeah, Dirk generally does shit on teams since they're forced to put a small forward on a center. KG doesn't have the same luxury ever.

KG can't create his own shot in crunchtime. Dirk can. I've seen Dirk score with ease against KG, Artest and Battier.





Fine. Though comparing the calls Tim got, deep in the post with a single move to the basket time after time, to Dirk's pussy flopping with no one touching him at the free throw line or high school 3 is a shame on basketball history. Dirk shooting all the FTs he did is a fucking travesty of epic, epic proportions. One of the worst occurrences in any sport. The refs truly denied Tim, an all-time great and deserving of 95% of those foul calls, a repeat/3peat.

"Wah Wah Wah! My pussy hurts!"




So you're saying you never, ever blamed the refs? Even during the series while it happened? If so, I'll just go ahead and not believe you. You are a mavfan, there are certain lows you have undoubtedly sank to.


The refs are not the reason Dallas lost that series to Miami. Wade got some bullshit calls, sure, but Miami deserves credit for winning that series. Pretty weak takes from you blaming the refs for San Antonio losing. What are you, 12?


Dirk has taken less talented teams further? As soon as KG got talent, he took them to the WCF/Title. Fail.

Dirk got within an inch of a title with Josh Howard and Jason Terry as his two main sidekicks. KG won a title with Paul Pierce and Ray Allen.

Pierce/Allen >>>>> Josh/Jet. KG has NEVER gotten out of the first round unless he's had two all stars by his side. Josh has a single All-Star selection as an injury replacement. :lmao at you.

[Hornets1]

I expect even more trolls on this one.

I wanted to see all of them come out. They would have in a Duncan vs. Dirk poll. I'm pretty split on this one, but I'm picking Dirk. He had a better season and Garnett was hurt at the end.

[Findog]

Chris Paul and David West weren't even playing in the last quarter. Paul's horrible teammates made the deficit balloon to 58 points.

Oh, and why weren't they playing in the last quarter? Because the game was a foregone conclusion with 12 minutes to play. Paul, West and the rest of the starters quit at home in a playoff game. They got outscored by 39 in 3 quarters at home. That's pathetic!!!!




I'll repeat myself: have you seen Chris Paul's teammates? Hell, they were outscored by 20 points in by the Nuggets' backups. That's the gap in talent on each team. You keep bringing up D-League players as if you were trying to make a point. However, Sean Marks, Hilton Armstrong, Ryan Bowen, and Antonio Daniels are worse.

:lmao 121-63. Those guys you listed are better than D-Leaguers. If they weren't, they wouldn't be in the League.


Your team, however, had the talent. They had the personnel. They had the two game lead. They were winning against a one-man team. Shit, they had chance to go up 3-0 against the Heat, but they somehow managed to blow a ten point lead and lose four games straight to Dwyane Wade.

They at least played hard and fought to the final buzzer in that series. Your team quit. What exactly are you criticizing the Mavs for? How can you criticize another team for not having heart and being losers for being outscored by 6 points over 144 minutes, when your team suffered a historically embarrassing loss at home?


Shitty players will play like shit. This is nothing new.

And your team will quit at home and you'll criticize another far more successful franchise for coming up an inch short. This is nothing new.

[Hornets1]

KG is no longer an "above average" offensive player, all he does is shoot mid range jumpers these days.

Yea, Garnett's fallen off a little, and Dirk really hasn't. However, KG's little turnaround jumper is still undefendable. Dirk does more with less around him. A bigman tandem of wallace and garnett is pretty damn scary though.

[LnGrrrR]

Don't worry he will. If this poll gets close Bump will do his thing.

:lol

That's how I'm judging the winners... I'm just looking at who BUMP picks.

[JustBlaze]

Even though I can't stand the Mavs, mainly Cuban, I gotta go with Dirk. The guy is a flat out beast Playoff performer. Anyone got the #'s? It's pretty insane.

[Findog]

Even though I can't stand the Mavs, mainly Cuban, I gotta go with Dirk. The guy is a flat out beast Playoff performer. Anyone got the #'s? It's pretty insane.

For a guy with such a poor playoff reputation, he's averaged 26 and 11 in the playoffs for his career.

[Findog]

Dirk regular season averages for his career: 23 and 9. Playoffs: 26 and 11. And a Finals appearance as a #1 guy on his resume. If I'm a GM, there's quite a few guys I'll take over Dirk because of age/contract differences. But to go to war and win a ballgame tomorrow, I would only take Kobe, LeBron, Wade and Duncan over Dirk.

[bigdog]

Duncan.

[redzero]

Oh, and why weren't they playing in the last quarter? Because the game was a foregone conclusion with 12 minutes to play. Paul, West and the rest of the starters quit at home in a playoff game. They got outscored by 39 in 3 quarters at home. That's pathetic!!!!

John Stockton's Jazz lost by 40 points to the Bulls in the Finals. Did they quit? Oh, and that team had far more talent than the Hornets had last season.



:lmao 121-63. Those guys you listed are better than D-Leaguers. If they weren't, they wouldn't be in the League. :lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol:lol

If you actually saw "those guys" play, you would reconsider. Antonio "Mr. Freeze" Daniels manages to blow every single lead the Hornets have with his point guard play (or lack thereof). Ryan Bowen doesn't do anything at all, except turn the ball over and foul. Hilton Armstrong is a useless fouling machine as well, and Sean Marks has practically been on every team in the league.


They at least played hard and fought to the final buzzer in that series. Your team quit. What exactly are you criticizing the Mavs for? How can you criticize another team for not having heart and being losers for being outscored by 6 points over 144 minutes, when your team suffered a historically embarrassing loss at home?
I'm criticizing the Mavs for losing four times straight to an inferior team. Close losses still count as losses. A loss by 58 points and a loss by 1 point both count the same. And your team was better! That's the thing.

But I want to get this straight:

1.) Mavs fans think David West is overrated.
2.) Chris Paul is being double and triple teamed.
3.) Nobody outside of Paul and West can create their own shots, and the latter is playing on a bad back after logging the eighth most minutes in the league.

What the hell do you think is going to happen? You don't give the Nuggets enough credit; they dismantled the Hornets.


And your team will quit at home and you'll criticize another far more successful franchise for coming up an inch short. This is nothing new.If my team truly quit, how come they won a game? Game 3 was turning out just like Game 4, but the Hornets managed to win that one. Also, YOUR TEAM DIDN'T WIN SHIT. You can't put 60+ win seasons in a trophy case.

Neither franchise has a single one of these: :lobt2:.

[Findog]

John Stockton's Jazz lost by 40 points to the Bulls in the Finals. Did they quit? Oh, and that team had far more talent than the Hornets had last season.


You're missing the point entirely, but that's not a surprise. You don't get to call out another team or player for being "quitters," "lacking heart," and being "losers," when your team did this:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2608/3749845542_9581c5cf7a_o.jpg




If you actually saw "those guys" play, you would reconsider. Antonio "Mr. Freeze" Daniels manages to blow every single lead the Hornets have with his point guard play (or lack thereof). Ryan Bowen doesn't do anything at all, except turn the ball over and foul. Hilton Armstrong is a useless fouling machine as well, and Sean Marks has practically been on every team in the league.

Again you miss the point. Those guys are better than D-Leaguers. I trust Jeff Bowers player evaluation skills over yours. And even if they were D-Leaguers, I'm pretty sure the Arkansas Rim Rockers or Albany Patroons could stay within 58 of the Nuggets at home. You have the gall to call out Dirk and the Mavs for losing and not having heart after your team and leader put up an embarrassing quit job.





1.) Mavs fans think David West is overrated.
2.) Chris Paul is being double and triple teamed.
3.) Nobody outside of Paul and West can create their own shots, and the latter is playing on a bad back after logging the eighth most minutes in the league.

What the hell do you think is going to happen? You don't give the Nuggets enough credit; they dismantled the Hornets.

They could've played hard and not QUIT.

[Henke]

Dirk regular season averages for his career: 23 and 9. Playoffs: 26 and 11. And a Finals appearance as a #1 guy on his resume. If I'm a GM, there's quite a few guys I'll take over Dirk because of age/contract differences. But to go to war and win a ballgame tomorrow, I would only take Kobe, LeBron, Wade and Duncan over Dirk.

Well said dude.:tu

[redzero]

You're missing the point entirely, but that's not a surprise. You don't get to call out another team or player for being "quitters," "lacking heart," and being "losers," when your team did this:

No, you're missing the point. You completely dodged the question. John Stockton and Karl Malone were blown out by 40 points in the Finals. DID. THEY. QUIT?


Again you miss the point. Those guys are better than D-Leaguers. I trust Jeff Bowers player evaluation skills over yours. And even if they were D-Leaguers, I'm pretty sure the Arkansas Rim Rockers or Albany Patroons could stay within 58 of the Nuggets at home. You have the gall to call out Dirk and the Mavs for losing and not having heart after your team and leader put up an embarrassing quit job.:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao:lmao

And you keep saying this. You're making assumptions. I've watched these players play throughout the entire season, and they are garbage. I already told you, but you refuse to listen.



They could've played hard and not QUIT.How did you know that they weren't playing hard? I'll repeat myself again: Garbage players will play like garbage.

George Karl's plan was to throw defenders at Paul, and it worked. However, according to you, when the only person who can create shots for his teammates is being double and triple teamed, his shitty teammates are magically supposed to not be garbage--they are magically supposed to be able to create their own shot.

The Nuggets dismantled the Hornets, and you're not giving them enough credit. If Paul isn't creating plays for his incompetent--and incapable teammates--how are they supposed to score? And instead of answering that simple question, you will repeat the same thing again.

[Findog]

No, you're missing the point. You completely dodged the question. John Stockton and Karl Malone were blown out by 40 points in the Finals. DID. THEY. QUIT?

In that game yes they did. The Hornets went out meekly in Game 5.


And you keep saying this. You're making assumption. I've watched these players play throughout the entire season, and they are garbage. I already told you, but you refuse to listen.


They are NBA caliber players. You are some dipshit fan, not a GM like Jeff Bowers. They are not great players, but again, they are NBA caliber players. If there are guys better than them available, they would be on the Hornets roster. I think a D League team playing at home against Denver could've done better. The starters were outscored by 39 in 3 quarters, which projects out to 52 for the game. So the scrubs were only marginally worse than the starters. Your team tucked its tail between their legs and quit. You have no business giving any other team shit about lacking in competitive fire.





The Nuggets dismantled the Hornets, and you're not giving them enough credit. If Paul isn't creating plays for his incompetent--and incapable teammates--how are they supposed to score?

They're not supposed to lose by 58 points at home. Nowhere have I said the Hornets should've been expected to win that series. Showing a little heart and competitive spirit isn't asking too much.

[redzero]

And see: you keep repeating the same thing over and over again. I'll ask you one more time:

What was supposed to happen?

How were the Hornets going to score, when one or two people on the team are the only ones who could create a shot? You haven't answered that very simple question yet.

Hell, the Nuggets had a plan, and they executed it perfectly.

[Hornets1]

In that game yes they did. The Hornets went out meekly in Game 5.



They are NBA caliber players. You are some dipshit fan, not a GM like Jeff Bowers. They are not great players, but again, they are NBA caliber players. If there are guys better than them available, they would be on the Hornets roster. I think a D League team playing at home against Denver could've done better. The starters were outscored by 39 in 3 quarters, which projects out to 52 for the game. So the scrubs were only marginally worse than the starters. Your team tucked its tail between their legs and quit. You have no business giving any other team shit about lacking in competitive fire.






They're not supposed to lose by 58 points at home. Nowhere have I said the Hornets should've been expected to win that series. Showing a little heart and competitive spirit isn't asking too much.


I agree, they did give up. It was an embarressing loss. There was never a chance for us to win that series due to injuries and how well the nuggets were playing, but 58 points is unforgivable and inexcusable. This arguement is going absolutely nowhere and is off-topic, so why don't yall lay off and try to stay on topic. Our bench was absolutely pathetic, and our team was hurt, but it still never should have been that bad. BTW, there was no reason for West and Paul to be in the game in the 4th if your down by 39; just creates a pointless opportunity for injury when the game had already been decided.
I went to Game 3, b/c we have season tix behing the hornets bench, and it was the most hostile environment I've ever encountered(and I have been to rap "concerts"). I knew we weren't gunna win Game 4, so I sold my tix, and feel pretty bad for the people who bought them.:lol

[Findog]

What was supposed to happen?


I've answered your question again and again: NBA playoff teams are good enough that they can be expected to not lose by 58 points at home. I don't care if they're playing the Lakers or the freaking Detroit Pistons, that's unexcusable.



How were the Hornets going to score, when one or two people on the team are the only ones who could create a shot? You haven't answered that very simple question yet.


An NBA playoff team should be able to score more than 63 points in a playoff game at home. The fact that they didn't overwhelmingly suggests they quit. Deal with it.



Hell, the Nuggets had a plan, and they executed it perfectly.

Made all the easier by the fact that their opponents mailed it in and put up an embarrassing quit job.

[Findog]

I agree, they did give up. It was an embarressing loss. There was never a chance for us to win that series due to injuries and how well the nuggets were playing, but 58 points is unforgivable and inexcusable.

I agree with everything you said here. Too bad your fellow Hornets fan can't seem to understand. You don't call out other teams and players for quitting when your team has something like that on its resume.

[mavs>spurs2]

Celtics without KG = 2nd round exit team

Mavs without Dirk = lottery bound

This argument is pretty retarded seeing how Dirk owns KG head to head every time. Mavs get screwed out of a championship and all the sudden it becomes the trendy or cool thing to shit all over them and Dirk. Let's try to keep things in perspective, 3 years ago Dirk Nowitzki was the best player in basketball.

[FkLA]

Tim Duncan

[redzero]

Oh, look--you failed to answer the question yet again. I'll repeat myself: shitty players will play like shit. Paul was being double and triple teamed. Nobody else could create their own shots. Four out of five of the starting five were injured. The Nuggets were on a tear. It's no surprise that the Hornets were blown out. 58 points is an unexpected margin, but it was a blowout nonetheless.

[Findog]

Oh, look--you failed to answer the question yet again. I'll repeat myself: shitty players will play like shit. Paul was being double and triple teamed. Nobody else could create their own shots. Four out of five of the starting five were injured. The Nuggets were on a tear. It's no surprise that the Hornets were blown out. 58 points is an unexpected margin, but it was a blowout nonetheless.

I've answered your question repeatedly. The 7th seed in the West shouldn't lose by 58 at home in a playoff game. It's not my problem you don't like the answer, or you choose to shit on Dirk and the Mavs for sins that apply much more to your team.

[sonic21]

A Playoff Win for the Ages (http://www.nuggetshoops.com/articles/2009/04/29/a-playoff-win-for-the-ages/)



In looking back upon the Denver Nuggets first round, game four dominating 121-63 victory over the New Orleans Hornets, let’s take a look at the numbers:

Largest margin of victory on the road, in NBA playoff history (58 points)
Tied the largest margin of victory (Minneapolis Lakers – 1956) in NBA playoff history (58 points)
The Nuggets held the Hornets to the lowest score in a half in NBA playoff history (24 points)
The Nuggets held Chris Paul to one of the worst games of his career – 4 points, 6 assists, 6 turnovers.
It was the first time Chris Paul had scored less than 14 points in a playoff game
Using a swarming, active defense, the Nuggets forced New Orleans into 27 turnovers and capitalized on that with 41 points
The Nuggets shot nearly 57% from the field while holding New Orleans to less than 32%
The Nuggets previous largest margin of victory was 30 points in 1985
Not a single starter for either team played in the 4th quarter
Nuggets playoff opponent all-time low – total points (63)
Nuggets playoff opponent all-time low – assists (10)
Nuggets playoff opponent all-time low – field-goal percentage (31.5%)
The last time the Nuggets won a best-of-seven playoff series was 1985
http://www.nuggetshoops.com/articles/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/cp3-wearenotgood-300x129.jpg

[sook]

Dirk and its not even close. 05-06' dude was just unstoppable as the only all star on his team shocked everyone by taking the mavs to the finals.

KG couldn't even make the playoffs as the leader of his team.

[bostonguy]

KG>Dirk

KG is a proven clutch playoff performer and a great leader. The guy just has it all. Such an underrated player. Dirk on the other hand.............

[Brazil]

no brainer here: Dirk

[Hornets1]

A Playoff Win for the Ages (http://www.nuggetshoops.com/articles/2009/04/29/a-playoff-win-for-the-ages/)




In looking back upon the Denver Nuggets first round, game four dominating 121-63 victory over the New Orleans Hornets, let’s take a look at the numbers:

Largest margin of victory on the road, in NBA playoff history (58 points)
Tied the largest margin of victory (Minneapolis Lakers – 1956) in NBA playoff history (58 points)
The Nuggets held the Hornets to the lowest score in a half in NBA playoff history (24 points)
The Nuggets held Chris Paul to one of the worst games of his career – 4 points, 6 assists, 6 turnovers.
It was the first time Chris Paul had scored less than 14 points in a playoff game
Using a swarming, active defense, the Nuggets forced New Orleans into 27 turnovers and capitalized on that with 41 points
The Nuggets shot nearly 57% from the field while holding New Orleans to less than 32%
The Nuggets previous largest margin of victory was 30 points in 1985
Not a single starter for either team played in the 4th quarter
Nuggets playoff opponent all-time low – total points (63)
Nuggets playoff opponent all-time low – assists (10)
Nuggets playoff opponent all-time low – field-goal percentage (31.5%)
The last time the Nuggets won a best-of-seven playoff series was 1985
http://www.nuggetshoops.com/articles/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/cp3-wearenotgood-300x129.jpg

Here you go Findog. Doesn't matter if Hornets' fans do admit the embarressment of that loss. Cheap shots comming from everywhere. THE LOSS WAS EMBARRESSING!! VERY! But this is a Dirk vs. KG thread believe it or not.
One thing I try to keep in perspective is that we are the smallest market in the league by far, and we are just lucky to have a team. In actuality, we are lucky to still have a city. I just think it's in very poor taste that people on this board make fun of Katrina's effect on Nola more than sympathize. A lot of people I know in Nola lost absolutely everything they had, and the Hornets and Saints gave us something to finally cheer for. New orleans fans are known for being very protective of their teams. But those teams simply playing games back in Nola was our 1st step back towards normalcy, and gave us something to be proud of and to cheer for, which was something everyone really needed at that time. Many of us feel like we owe it to them even in bad times, b/c they helped us in the worst of times. Might be a some-what corny post, but I'm just trying to give you a little perspective into New orleans and it's fans.

[turiaf for president]

i can see the argument for dirk even tho i disagree, but geez theres gotta be some texas homerism here. how can it be this lopsided? we are talking about kevin freakin garnett people. a douche, yes but quite possibly the best 2 way player in the game today!

[Findog]

KG>Dirk

KG is a proven clutch playoff performer and a great leader. The guy just has it all. Such an underrated player. Dirk on the other hand.............

:lmao

you forgot \sarcasm

[Findog]

Here you go Findog. Doesn't matter if Hornets' fans do admit the embarressment of that loss. Cheap shots comming from everywhere. THE LOSS WAS EMBARRESSING!! VERY! But this is a Dirk vs. KG thread believe it or not.
One thing I try to keep in perspective is that we are the smallest market in the league by far, and we are just lucky to have a team. In actuality, we are lucky to still have a city. I just think it's in very poor taste that people on this board make fun of Katrina's effect on Nola more than sympathize. A lot of people I know in Nola lost absolutely everything they had, and the Hornets and Saints gave us something to finally cheer for. New orleans fans are known for being very protective of their teams. But those teams simply playing games back in Nola was our 1st step back towards normalcy, and gave us something to be proud of and to cheer for, which was something everyone really needed at that time. Many of us feel like we owe it to them even in bad times, b/c they helped us in the worst of times. Might be a some-what corny post, but I'm just trying to give you a little perspective into New orleans and it's fans.

That's fine, and I understand where you're coming from. I think Katrina jokes are in extremely bad taste.

[bostonguy]

:lmao

you forgot \sarcasm

Im glad you detected that.:lol

In all honesty, I wouldnt trade KG for Dirk simply because of the Celts D getting worse. Dirk is a better player than KG in all areas except the D. It isnt a knock on the big German. The guy is a great player and a hall of famer no doubt and he isnt a horrible defender. KG is a sidekick but he is our defensive anchor. We have Pierce to be the man in the 4th while KG watches as his nuts shrivel.

[Findog]

Im glad you detected that.:lol

In all honesty, I wouldnt trade KG for Dirk simply because of the Celts D getting worse. Dirk is a better player than KG in all areas except the D. It isnt a knock on the big German. The guy is a great player and a hall of famer no doubt and he isnt a horrible defender. KG is a sidekick but he is our defensive anchor. We have Pierce to be the man in the 4th while KG watches as his nuts shrivel.

Yeah, I mean it's close. You can make an argument for either guy.

[Ghazi]

i can see the argument for dirk even tho i disagree, but geez theres gotta be some texas homerism here. how can it be this lopsided? we are talking about kevin freakin garnett people. a douche, yes but quite possibly the best 2 way player in the game today!

I think the lopsidedness is justified because its best RIGHT now. KG saw some steep declines in his #'s last year and that was BEFORE the injury. Come playoffs 2010, KG will be 34 years old, Dirk will be 31 years old. You could say KG may have exited his prime last year, while Dirk has 1-2 prime years left.

It's tough to say though, cause who knows how KG will bounce back next year?


Just my take.

FWIW I think Dirk's been better than KG for the past 5 years :)

[LnGrrrR]

Here you go Findog. Doesn't matter if Hornets' fans do admit the embarressment of that loss. Cheap shots comming from everywhere. THE LOSS WAS EMBARRESSING!! VERY! But this is a Dirk vs. KG thread believe it or not.
One thing I try to keep in perspective is that we are the smallest market in the league by far, and we are just lucky to have a team. In actuality, we are lucky to still have a city. I just think it's in very poor taste that people on this board make fun of Katrina's effect on Nola more than sympathize. A lot of people I know in Nola lost absolutely everything they had, and the Hornets and Saints gave us something to finally cheer for. New orleans fans are known for being very protective of their teams. But those teams simply playing games back in Nola was our 1st step back towards normalcy, and gave us something to be proud of and to cheer for, which was something everyone really needed at that time. Many of us feel like we owe it to them even in bad times, b/c they helped us in the worst of times. Might be a some-what corny post, but I'm just trying to give you a little perspective into New orleans and it's fans.

Damn straight. I'm not from New Orleans, but I got rocked by Katrina here in Biloxi, and thank goodness New Orleans French Quarter and Bourbon Street came back when it did. It felt weird cruising down those streets seeing everything boarded up, and no one playing music or dancing on the canal entrance to Bourbon. Bad times.

[mavs>spurs2]

Look at KG's fuckin supporting cast. He goes out for the playoffs with an injury and they still make it to the second round. Didn't miss too much of a beat when he was out, they finished the last 10 games 8-2 without him. Now had Dirk missed a sizable portion of the regular season? That team wouldn't have even made the playoffs. We're talking about an 8 man rotation where JJ Barea,Antoine Wright, and Erik Dampier are key parts. Dirk carried those sorry fucks to the playoffs, past the Spurs, and who knows what could have happened if the refs knew how to blow a whistle and didnt change the entire dynamics and momentum of the Denver series. Anyone who says KG > Dirk is retarded and has never seen the two go at it head to head. Anyone who's calling Dirk a poor defender doesn't follow basketball and is basing their perception off of what everyone else was saying 8 or 9 years ago. Dirk plays solid above average defense and is a smart defender always in good position much like Duncan minus the shotblocking presence. I'm willing to bet that 90% of the KG votes are by black posters because it's a pretty ridiculous claim.

[La Peace]

Here you go Findog. Doesn't matter if Hornets' fans do admit the embarressment of that loss. Cheap shots comming from everywhere. THE LOSS WAS EMBARRESSING!! VERY! But this is a Dirk vs. KG thread believe it or not.
One thing I try to keep in perspective is that we are the smallest market in the league by far, and we are just lucky to have a team. In actuality, we are lucky to still have a city. I just think it's in very poor taste that people on this board make fun of Katrina's effect on Nola more than sympathize. A lot of people I know in Nola lost absolutely everything they had, and the Hornets and Saints gave us something to finally cheer for. New orleans fans are known for being very protective of their teams. But those teams simply playing games back in Nola was our 1st step back towards normalcy, and gave us something to be proud of and to cheer for, which was something everyone really needed at that time. Many of us feel like we owe it to them even in bad times, b/c they helped us in the worst of times. Might be a some-what corny post, but I'm just trying to give you a little perspective into New orleans and it's fans.
You just raised a level in my book.

You are now on level one.

[z0sa]

They turn into the Bad News Bears at the first sign of the blue and green.

Last I checked, that 06 series went to OT in game 7. And excuse me for pulling the whole Manu/Tim injury cards. Shit happens, we weren't up to par without those two healthy.


:lmao. Okay. Yeah, Bonner locked Dirk down and the Spurs didn't constantly run double teams at him and trap him to force the ball out of his hands...leading to Barea, Bass and Josh having a field day. Okay. :lmao

Talk about exaggeration.






KG can't create his own shot in crunchtime. Dirk can. I've seen Dirk score with ease against KG, Artest and Battier.

KG is more of a traditional big man. That's honestly like saying Tim can't create his own shot in crunchtime, which is why they let parker or Ginobili handle the ball down the stretch. You want the ball in a perimeter players hands for multiple reasons. Regardless of what the e-tards are saying, an open shot from midrange is way better than a toughly contested 3 footer, which is what a traditional bigman will be getting. Dirk's fadeaways are like an open shot from midrange due to his height and the fact he's generally guarded by smaller players.



Wah Wah Wah! My pussy hurts!


i'm sorry to hear that.


The refs are not the reason Dallas lost that series to Miami. Wade got some bullshit calls, sure, but Miami deserves credit for winning that series. Pretty weak takes from you blaming the refs for San Antonio losing. What are you, 12?

my profile relates my age. As to blaming the refs, the blame actually goes against Manu. If you had any clue about spurfan, you'd already know this. However, there'd have been no Manu foul to give if the refs had called it fair.


Dirk got within an inch of a title with Josh Howard and Jason Terry as his two main sidekicks.

An inch? They only won 2 games out of the required 4. They didn't force a game 7. The Mavericks got pwned. The fuck you talking this "inch" business. More convincing yourself day after day your Mavs didn't lose as pathetically as you remembered.


KG won a title with Paul Pierce and Ray Allen.

In his first season with them. And they won 60something games. And KG came through for them pretty damn well. That monstrous Game 6 of the Finals comes to mind.


Pierce/Allen >>>>> Josh/Jet. KG has NEVER gotten out of the first round unless he's had two all stars by his side.

Guess you're just ignoring the fact Dirk had Nash and Finley for a good while as well. Don't forget you had an all-time great coach, too. Couldn't win shit back then, either. WHOOOSH the sound of your argument losing air.


:lmao at you.

:flag:

[Findog]

Tim Duncan's Spurs already won something. Your team let Dwyane Wade beat them four times straight. You can bring up your 121-63, but at least my Hornets lost to the better team. Your team had it's foot on the Heat's throat, and they let go.

I like how this dipshit keeps throwing Wade in our faces...as if we let Jannero Pargo go for 37 points a game in the Finals. It's Dwyane Fucking Wade. When healthy, he is one of the top 3 players in the League. If he's not equal with Kobe or LeBron, he's only a hair behind them. Avery doubled Shaq constantly in that series and for the most part played Wade straight up. The Heat will probably be remembered as one of the weaker title teams, but they earned their championship by getting hot at the exact right time.

[Findog]

Last I checked, that 06 series went to OT in game 7. And excuse me for pulling the whole Manu/Tim injury cards. Shit happens, we weren't up to par without those two healthy.


Excuses, Excuses. When my team loses, I give credit to the other team for outplaying the Mavs.








KG is more of a traditional big man. That's honestly like saying Tim can't create his own shot in crunchtime, which is why they let parker or Ginobili handle the ball down the stretch.

If you think Tim Duncan is no better at creating his own shot in crunchtime than KG, I honestly don't know what to say. The Spurs have the luxury of having 3 guys, 4 now with RJ, that can create their own shot in crunchtime. Duncan is one of them. You're a Spurs fan? Have you ever watched the Spurs or Duncan play?


You want the ball in a perimeter players hands for multiple reasons. Regardless of what the e-tards are saying, an open shot from midrange is way better than a toughly contested 3 footer, which is what a traditional bigman will be getting. Dirk's fadeaways are like an open shot from midrange due to his height and the fact he's generally guarded by smaller players.

So it would be folly to throw it down in the low block to Shaq (in his prime) or Duncan in the clutch? Umm...okay. Why am I arguing with you again?










my profile relates my age. As to blaming the refs, the blame actually goes against Manu. If you had any clue about spurfan, you'd already know this. However, there'd have been no Manu foul to give if the refs had called it fair.

Sounds like blaming the refs to me.




An inch? They only won 2 games out of the required 4. They didn't force a game 7. The Mavericks got pwned. The fuck you talking this "inch" business. More convincing yourself day after day your Mavs didn't lose as pathetically as you remembered.

They were an inch within going up 3-0. Had that happened, Miami would've rolled over. Each team had a blowout win (Dallas G2, Miami G4). The other three Miami wins were by a grand total of 6 points. Six points over 144 minutes. Every single one of those games coming down to the final possession. So yeah, they were blown the fuck out. :rolleyes Dallas also lost to Golden State in 6 games, but they were never in that series.




In his first season with them. And they won 60something games. And KG came through for them pretty damn well. That monstrous Game 6 of the Finals comes to mind.

Paul Pierce/Ray Allen >>>>>> Josh Howard/Jason Terry. You're welcome.



Guess you're just ignoring the fact Dirk had Nash and Finley for a good while as well.

Those teams played no defense and would never have beaten Shaq/Kobe in a playoff series.


Don't forget you had an all-time great coach, too.

You mean this functioning alcoholic?

http://bettorsedge.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/don-nelson.jpg




Couldn't win shit back then, either. WHOOOSH the sound of your argument losing air.

I wouldn't brag about "winning" an argument when you say Tim Duncan is no better a crunchtime scorer than KG, blame the refs when your team loses, and state that it's better to take jump shots than throw it down low to a dominant big in the clutch. :lmao

[Findog]

I love Woody Paige....the ST poster, not the assbag who writes for the Denver Post.

[baseline bum]

with a below average supporting cast, KG's teams were in the lottery.

with a below average supporting cast, Dirk's teams are still winning 50 games.

Howard, Terry, Kidd, and Dampier isn't a below average supporting cast. :lmao

[Findog]

Howard, Terry, Kidd, and Dampier isn't a below average supporting cast. :lmao

Paul Pierce/Ray Allen or Josh Howard/Jason Terry? Who do you want? Because one of the central tenets in the KG > Dirk argument is the ring KG has. I'm sorry, they're both great players, and you can make an argument for one or the other being better, but I don't think you can point to KG's ring as proof that KG is better. That Celtics supporting cast is decisively better than Dirk's 06 supporting cast.

[Findog]

In that case then neither is Sprewell, Cassell, Sczerbiak, & Olowokandi, but the Wolves were still a lottery team with that group and KG.

I guarantee you the 08/09 Mavs do not advance to the second round if you swap out a healthy KG for Dirk.

[baseline bum]

Paul Pierce/Ray Allen or Josh Howard/Jason Terry? Who do you want? Because one of the central tenets in the KG > Dirk argument is the ring KG has. I'm sorry, they're both great players, and you can make an argument for one or the other being better, but I don't think you can point to KG's ring as proof that KG is better. That Celtics supporting cast is decisively better than Dirk's 06 supporting cast.

Where have I argued that? If you look at my vote, I chose Dirk.

[Ghazi]

Dirk's supporting cast isn't / wasn't that bad, just very poorly structured IMO. Mediocre outside shooting (25th in league), inability to generate free throw attempts (I think bottom 5 in league), and a lack of paint scoring (30th in league). Just not anywhere close to championship caliber, and I think it's fair to say that they were below average in the Nuggets series, considering Dirk played with out of this world efficiency and the Mavs only mustered 1 win.

[ffadicted]

Dirk is the best PF at the moment period.

[baseline bum]

In that case then neither is Sprewell, Cassell, Sczerbiak, & Olowokandi, but the Wolves were still a lottery team with that group and KG.

2009 Terry is clearly better than 2005 Sprewell; it's not even close
2009 Howard is at worst equal to 2005 Szczerbiak
2009 Kidd is a lot better than 2005 Cassell at everything but scoring
2009 Dampier in limited minutes is still a lot better than soft-ass 2005 Olowokandi

[z0sa]

Excuses, Excuses. When my team loses, I give credit to the other team for outplaying the Mavs.

Your team outplayed my team. There.



If you think Tim Duncan is no better at creating his own shot in crunchtime than KG, I honestly don't know what to say. The Spurs have the luxury of having 3 guys, 4 now with RJ, that can create their own shot in crunchtime. Duncan is one of them. You're a Spurs fan? Have you ever watched the Spurs or Duncan play?

You'd be better off just saying, "I have no response," than changing the subject. Because, indeed, it was you who said KG cannot create his own shot in crunchtime, not I. I simply LOL'd at you and said that'd be like saying Timmy D can't create his shot in crunchtime. My point, whether or not you understood it, stands.



So it would be folly to throw it down in the low block to Shaq (in his prime) or Duncan in the clutch? Umm...okay. Why am I arguing with you again?

But it is you who wouldn't give it to Shaq or Tim in the clutch, bro. That's what you just said - that KG can't create his own shot in the clutch, but Dirk can. That's the same as saying any of the great players can't create their own shot in the clutch. Last I checked, the coach calls the plays. Like I related earlier, KG hit multiple game winners in isolation plays his last season with Minny. You can doublecheck that if you want.

You're agreeing with me and you don't even know it is the problem. I'm not comparing timmy and KG's skill levels, I'm just saying either one can get his shot at any time, any place. Dirk can too. So can Shaq, etc It's not hard to understand.

Whether or not you want to argue one or the other is "clutch," that is a different story.




They were an inch within going up 3-0. Had that happened, Miami would've rolled over. Each team had a blowout win (Dallas G2, Miami G4). The other three Miami wins were by a grand total of 6 points. Six points over 144 minutes. Every single one of those games coming down to the final possession. So yeah, they were blown the fuck out. :rolleyes Dallas also lost to Golden State in 6 games, but they were never in that series.

More exaggeration. You use that a lot against others in your arguments, don't you? To put them on the defensive? To make yourself look better? Nice try. Look, I never said Dallas wasn't in the series. it was pretty close at one point. Within an inch? Nope. They weren't ever within an inch at any point. Being up by 10 with a quarter to go doesn't mean jack shit, just ask the 2000 Blazers - and its ridiculous you'd sink that low. Oh well, Mavfan for you.



Paul Pierce/Ray Allen >>>>>> Josh Howard/Jason Terry. You're welcome.

you can keep ignoring my posts, too, since you obviously have no answer.



Those teams played no defense and would never have beaten Shaq/Kobe in a playoff series.

No excuses, remember? Dirk just wasn't good enough on both ends. Accept it. Learn to live with it.



You mean this functioning alcoholic?

http://bettorsedge.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/don-nelson.jpg

Absolutely. Unless you'd fare to make an argument that he somehow held Dirk down.




I wouldn't brag about "winning" an argument when you say Tim Duncan is no better a crunchtime scorer than KG

That's what you would be saying is what I said, sort of. I didn't compare the two players oncesoever.


blame the refs when your team loses,

The calls weren't fair. Just because your team was on the receiving end and therefore you cast a blind eye, doesn't mean they didn't alter the course of history.


and state that it's better to take jump shots than throw it down low to a dominant big in the clutch. :lmao

I responded to you saying that, dude. :huh are you drunk? You stated KG can't get his own shot in the clutch, but Dirk can. You're full of shit and we both know it, so I responded with the Timmy comment. Great players can get their shot anytime they wish, but you will rarely see a play down the stretch from Boston or SA that doesn't involve Parker/Manu or Pierce/Allen with the ball. Do you hit Timmy or KG at an open wing, or down low for a bodied up, contested layup? At this stage of their career, with this NBA's calls, you want an open jumpshot or a lane to the basket. Which ties in with the rest of my argument.

[dickface]

Dirk played with out of this world efficiency and the Mavs only mustered 1 win.

Obviously Dirk still choked. That's the only explanation. He told Antoine Wright to give a weak ass foul and then back off like he didn't want to.

It's amazing how far some Spurs fans will go to discredit Dirk just because he kicked your team's ass a couple times. And it's no wonder they love KG, he bent over and let Tim Duncan rape him constantly.

[Ghazi]

:lol

Mavs/Lakers beat Spurs every year Spurs don't win a title, and so their fans are douchebags

Pistons lose to Spurs in Finals because of Sheed's clusterfuck, and so their fans are classy and get their own message board :lol

Although Lakers fans can be pretty douchey IMO, sme at least.

[dickface]

Don't forget you had an all-time great coach, too.

Oh, the guy who's never won an NBA title and doesn't give a shit about defense? After more than a dozen pages of douchey ass "Defense wins titles, and titles mean everything, take it from me, I'm a Spurs fan I know this!" posts from you, and now you're going to claim that a coach who NEVER WON A TITLE AND DOESN'T COACH DEFENSE IS AN ALL-TIME GREAT????????????????????????????????????!?!?!?!?! ?

just stop now, we know you're full of shit and will say whatever you can to win an argument without even so much as a glance at your own failed logic. You lose, good day sir.

[dickface]

:lol

Mavs/Lakers beat Spurs every year Spurs don't win a title, and so their fans are douchebags

Pistons lose to Spurs in Finals because of Sheed's clusterfuck, and so their fans are classy and get their own message board :lol

Although Lakers fans can be pretty douchey IMO, sme at least.

:tu Ghazi has had some rare quality posts in this thread

[z0sa]

Oh, the guy who's never won an NBA title and doesn't give a shit about defense? After more than a dozen pages of douchey ass "Defense wins titles, and titles mean everything, take it from me, I'm a Spurs fan I know this!" posts from you, and now you're going to claim that a coach who NEVER WON A TITLE AND DOESN'T COACH DEFENSE IS AN ALL-TIME GREAT????????????????????????????????????!?!?!?!?! ?

just stop now, we know you're full of shit and will say whatever you can to win an argument without even so much as a glance at your own failed logic. You lose, good day sir.

I consider him an all-time great. Just because he doesn't believe in defense doesn't mean he's not one of the more brilliant basketball minds ever. he's got quite a few wins, as well. Just because he couldn't lead the Mavs (or anyone else) to the heartland doesn't mean he's another d'antoni. There's plenty of great minds without a title; sorry that means everything to you.

[ffadicted]

lol @ all the Spurs fans in denial

[dickface]

I consider him an all-time great. Just because he doesn't believe in defense doesn't mean he's not one of the more brilliant basketball minds ever. he's got quite a few wins, as well. Just because he couldn't lead the Mavs to the heartland doesn't mean he's another d'antoni.

So you'd love for him to coach the Spurs, right? You'd love for Parker & Duncan to start jacking up 3's all night and nobody to play defense, right?

[z0sa]

So you'd love for him to coach the Spurs, right? You'd love for Duncan to start jacking up 3's all night and nobody to play defense, right?

Timmy can shoot 3's. :wakeup

[dickface]

Timmy can shoot 3's. :wakeup

Yeah that career 18.8% is incredible.

[Unforgivable]

Timmy can shoot 3's. :wakeup


So that's a yes or no?

[dickface]

There's plenty of great minds without a title; sorry that means everything to you.

Oh, so titles don't mean anything now?

In that case, Dirk >KG now.

[z0sa]

Oh, so titles don't mean anything now?

In that case, Dirk >KG now.

You have an opinion. Feel free to exercise it more often, should you wish.

[dickface]

So that's a yes or no?

An all-time great coach with a brilliant basketball mind? Surely he wants Nellie coaching the Spurs when Popovich calls it quits.

[z0sa]

Yeah that career 18.8% is incredible.

he makes 'em when they count. :wgaf:

[dickface]

You have an opinion. Feel free to exercise it more often, should you wish.

Would you be happy with Don Nelson coaching the Spurs, yes or no?

[BRHornet45]

LMAO sons Ghazi's troll votes are back!!!

[sonic21]

lol @ all the Spurs fans in denial

the majority of spurs fans chose Dirk

[z0sa]

An all-time great coach with a brilliant basketball mind? Surely he wan'ts Nellie coaching the Spurs when Popovich calls it quits.

it'd be better than AJ's sorry ass.

[Ghazi]

How do you view who has voted for what?

[Findog]

You'd be better off just saying, "I have no response," than changing the subject. Because, indeed, it was you who said KG cannot create his own shot in crunchtime, not I. I simply LOL'd at you and said that'd be like saying Timmy D can't create his shot in crunchtime. My point, whether or not you understood it, stands.

KG is not a great crunch-time scorer. It's no surprise his job with Boston was to anchor the defense and have the Celtics run their offense through Pierce. Dirk is a much more dynamic and efficient scorer, they are both excellent rebounders, while KG is a much better interior defender. To claim KG is a guy you can run your offense through in crunchtime is folly.





But it is you who wouldn't give it to Shaq or Tim in the clutch, bro. That's what you just said - that KG can't create his own shot in the clutch, but Dirk can. That's the same as saying any of the great players can't create their own shot in the clutch. Last I checked, the coach calls the plays. Like I related earlier, KG hit multiple game winners in isolation plays his last season with Minny. You can doublecheck that if you want.

You know who else has hit multiple game-winning shots? Steve Kerr. Who the fuck would run their offense through him the final 5 minutes of a playoff game?








More exaggeration. You use that a lot against others in your arguments, don't you? To put them on the defensive? To make yourself look better? Nice try. Look, I never said Dallas wasn't in the series. it was pretty close at one point. Within an inch? Nope. They weren't ever within an inch at any point. Being up by 10 with a quarter to go doesn't mean jack shit, just ask the 2000 Blazers - and its ridiculous you'd sink that low. Oh well, Mavfan for you.

The Mavs came as close as you possibly can in that series to winning a championship without actually doing it. You're talking literally two different bounces of the ball and the Mavs are 06 champs. It went the same length as the GS series, but the Mavs were never within striking distance of the Warriors. If you had watched the 06 Finals, maybe you could grasp this.





you can keep ignoring my posts, too, since you obviously have no answer.

What am I ignoring? I've replied to your idiocy.





No excuses, remember? Dirk just wasn't good enough on both ends. Accept it. Learn to live with it.

The 99-04 Mavs <<< 99-04 Lakers. I can more than live with that.




Absolutely. Unless you'd fare to make an argument that he somehow held Dirk down.

Well, being a Spurs fan and all, I would think you would prize defense instead of some guy that is a fan of creating offensive "mismatches."










The calls weren't fair. Just because your team was on the receiving end and therefore you cast a blind eye, doesn't mean they didn't alter the course of history.


Translation: "The Mavs didn't beat the Spurs, the refs did."



I responded to you saying that, dude. :huh are you drunk? You stated KG can't get his own shot in the clutch, but Dirk can.

Dirk is a much better option for running your offense through during the final five minutes of a game than KG. That's a fact. KG is a much better interior defender. That's also a fact.


You're full of shit and we both know it, so I responded with the Timmy comment.

Refs beat San Antonio, not Dallas....KG is just as clutch and efficient a crunch-time scorer as Dirk...a jumpshot is a much better option than throwing it down on the low block to a franchise center who can easily draw a foul. Okay, I'm full of shit and you're not. Whatever you say. :lmao

[z0sa]

Would you be happy with Don Nelson coaching the Spurs, yes or no?

why not? Would I fire popovich and change the entire system that we've won 4 championshipswith, just for him? No.

[sonic21]

How do you view who has voted for what?

click on the numbers in the poll

[dickface]

why not? Would I fire popovich and change the entire system that we've won 4 championshipswith, just for him? No.

But he's an all-time great coach and a brilliant basketball mind!

[dickface]

Theoretically, Popovich never coaches the Spurs. Instead, Nellie is coaching the Spurs. Same teams, same personnel, but it's Nellie's basketball philosophy instead of Pop's.

How many titles do the Spurs win? Answer truthfully, and there is a right answer and a wrong answer.

[dickface]

hint: right answer is "zero" and wrong answer is "anything that isn't zero"

[Findog]

theoretically, popovich never coaches the spurs. Instead, nellie is coaching the spurs. Same teams, same personnel, but it's nellie's basketball philosophy instead of pop's.

How many titles do the spurs win? Answer truthfully, and there is a right answer and a wrong answer.

0

[Ghazi]

Looks relatively troll free to me, although a few trolls voted for KG (21_Blessings, BRHornet45) :lol :lol

[Gino]

Stupid poll. The results are even worse. As if anyone would really have Dirk over Kevin Garnett.

No doubt people who voted for Dirk include:

1) The KFC crew
2) Lakers fans pissed that the Celtics curb-stomped the Lakers last year and will probably do it again with KG back :hat

[James David Manning]

Stupid poll. The results are even worse. As if anyone would really have Dirk over Kevin Garnett.

No doubt people who voted for Dirk include:

1) The KFC crew
2) Lakers fans pissed that the Celtics curb-stomped the Lakers last year and will probably do it again with KG back :hat


Which one of those two categories does Bostonguy fall under since he voted for Dirk?

[z0sa]

KG is not a great crunch-time scorer. It's no surprise his job with Boston was to anchor the defense and have the Celtics run their offense through Pierce. Dirk is a much more dynamic and efficient scorer, they are both excellent rebounders, while KG is a much better interior defender. To claim KG is a guy you can run your offense through in crunchtime is folly.

The story changes. First, its KG can't create his shot in crunchtime. Now its you can't run your offense through him. Those are two very different things.

If you would have been more specific, I wouldn't have been as quick to defend KG. Everyone, including me, has gotten on him for not exerting his influence more during the final stretches of a game. I do believe he has improved in stepping up the plate when his team needs him, especially offensively.

But this isn't who would you want taking the last shot for you. This is who is better overall. In the last 5 minutes, you can't say KG is a bad option.



You know who else has hit multiple game-winning shots? Steve Kerr. Who the fuck would run their offense through him the final 5 minutes of a playoff game?

You've been purposely obtuse.



The Mavs came as close as you possibly can in that series to winning a championship without actually doing it.

Disagree. Guess you can't handle that.


You're talking literally two different bounces of the ball and the Mavs are 06 champs.


I watched the series, every game and intently. I never said they weren't close. I did say the Heat pwned them, which is what the final result is. Coming down from 0-2 against a superior team? Thats pwnage in my book. that's something worthy of a champion. You calling this "1 inch" BS is a disgrace if you really believe the better team won without help from the refs.


It went the same length as the GS series, but the Mavs were never within striking distance of the Warriors.

I watched every game of this series, as well. I don't give Dirk a whole lot of shit for this series, though it was a choke; he was injured. See? I'm not as bad as you think.


If you had watched the 06 Finals, maybe you could grasp this.

I did and I can.


The 99-04 Mavs <<< 99-04 Lakers. I can more than live with that.

Okay then.


Well, being a Spurs fan and all, I would think you would prize defense instead of some guy that is a fan of creating offensive "mismatches."

Doesn't mean I can't respect and like the guy for what he DID bring to the game. I enjoy watching the Phoenixes and Golden States of the world even though I'm a spurs fan.


Translation: "The Mavs didn't beat the Spurs, the refs did."

Oops. Translator seems broken.




Dirk is a much better option for running your offense through during the final five minutes of a game than KG. That's a fact. KG is a much better interior defender. That's also a fact.

I wouldn't say much better. I wouldn't say his abilities on offense even supercede KG's; he's just a walking mismatch. A coach's entire offense revolves around mismatches and getting players into comfortable positions to score.


Refs beat San Antonio, not Dallas....KG is just a clutch and efficient a crunch-time scorer as Dirk...a jumpshot is a much better option than throwing it down on the low block to a franchise center who can easily draw a foul. Okay, I'm full of shit and you're not. Whatever you say. :lmao

Every marquee has a perimeter player handle the ball during crunchtime, all I said.

[Hornets1]

Stupid poll. The results are even worse. As if anyone would really have Dirk over Kevin Garnett.

No doubt people who voted for Dirk include:

1) The KFC crew
2) Lakers fans pissed that the Celtics curb-stomped the Lakers last year and will probably do it again with KG back :hat

Click on the # next to the player and it shows you who voted for who. Most Lakers fans, as I can see, voted for Garnett. Lots of Spurs fans went w/ Dirk as well

[Henke]

Stupid poll. The results are even worse. As if anyone would really have Dirk over Kevin Garnett.

No doubt people who voted for Dirk include:

1) The KFC crew
2) Lakers fans pissed that the Celtics curb-stomped the Lakers last year and will probably do it again with KG back :hat

Epic fail.

Dirk's 65 votes:

35 from Spurs fans(props to them)
9 from Mavs fans
2 from Pistons fans
1 from Celtics fan
1 from Cavs fan
1 from Hawks fan
5 from Rockets fans
3 from Hornets fans
2 from Nuggets fans
1 from Suns fan
4 from Lakers fans
1 from Blazers fan

Just deal with the results and:stfu

[Gino]

Epic fail.

Dirk's 65 votes:

35 from Spurs fans(props to them)
9 from Mavs fans
2 from Pistons fans
1 from Celtics fan
1 from Cavs fan
1 from Hawks fan
5 from Rockets fans
3 from Hornets fans
2 from Nuggets fans
1 from Suns fan
4 from Lakers fans
1 from Blazers fan

Just deal with the results and:stfu

I dont know whats worse:

1) The fact that you took the time to count out and separate each vote by team affiliation.
2) The fact that you go it wrong. A quick look shows at least 3 Celtics fans voted.

I dont know why most Spurs fans would vote for Dirk. Maybe its cuz Dirk plays in Texas or maybe they hate that Duncan vs. KG talk(who is better). But I dont believe for one second Spurs fans wouldnt rather have KG on their team rather than Dirk freaking Nowitski.

[dirk4mvp]

I have 4chan bookmarked so I can easily access child pornography with ease.

[redzero]

4chan doesn't do child pornography.

[dirk4mvp]

I would expect you to know the ins and outs of 4chan.

[James David Manning]

I would expect you to know the ins and outs of 4chan.


:lmao

[redzero]

I would expect you to know the ins and outs of 4chan.

A simple glance at the boards will show anyone who isn't blind that 4chan doesn't do child pornography. Those who do post it are banned.

[Gino]

4chan doesn't do child pornography.

It doesnt matter. Mavs fans' response to every argument is to claim that someone is a pedophile.

Oh...and DUNCANOwnKobe too. They take turns getting owned and resorting to "pedo-smack" in every fucking thread.

Thats when theyre not watching their favorite KFC joke on youtube by the guy who did the voice for "Ratatoiulle".

Mavs fan is a joke.

[sonic21]

I dont know why most Spurs fans would vote for Dirk. Maybe its cuz Dirk play in Texas or maybe they hate that Duncan vs. KG (who is better talk). But I dont believe for one second Spurs fans wouldnt rather have KG on their team rather than Dirk freaking Nowitski.

we hate the mavs but no question Dirk is better.

[Henke]

I dont know whats worse:

1) The fact that you took the time to count out and separate each vote by team affiliation.
2) The fact that you go it wrong. A quick look shows at least 3 Celtics fans voted.

I dont know why most Spurs fans would vote for Dirk. Maybe its cuz Dirk plays in Texas or maybe they hate that Duncan vs. KG talk(who is better). But I dont believe for one second Spurs fans wouldnt rather have KG on their team rather than Dirk freaking Nowitski.

1)Only 5-10 minutes so it's not a big deal.
2)When I counted the votes were 65 and it was only Bostonguy's vote from Celtics fans.I don't know who voted after.

For your final statement,Sonic21 gave you the answer.

Dirk is fucking GREAT,a real monster on the floor and better than KG.Deal with it and stop bitching about him.

[Findog]

1)Only 5-10 minutes so it's not a big deal.
2)When I counted the votes were 65 and it was only Bostonguy's vote from Celtics fans.I don't know who voted after.

For your final statement,Sonic21 gave you the answer.

Dirk is fucking GREAT,a real monster on the floor and better than KG.Deal with it and stop bitching about him.

You don't understand the history with this poster. During the whole Josh Howard/national anthem imbroglio, I made a comment to the effect that I didn't care to stand for the pledge at sporting events because it felt like enforced patriotism. He went nuts...Somebody can probably dredge up the link. Ever since then, he's had a grudge against the Mavs and their fans.

[LnGrrrR]

Well, since KG has obviously lost this round, I hope the picture of KG losing will be as good as C. Paul last time.

[timvp]

I'll take Dirk's forthcoming super seed over both. That kid is going to be born with street cred.

[duncan228]

I'll take Dirk's forthcoming super seed over both. That kid is going to be born with street cred.

Which one is going to be better...Dirk's kid or Duncan's son? :stirpot:

[timvp]

Which one is going to be better...Dirk's kid or Duncan's son? :stirpot:
I gotta go with Dirk's kid. He'll be the perfect combination of Dirk's skillset, Stackhouse's athleticism and KG's tough guy act ... but Dirk, Jr. will actually have street cred and not be fake like KG.

[Kori Ellis]

I know a lot of Spurs fans hate KG, but I didn't think this poll would be lopsided in Dirk's favor. Anyway "right now" (as the poll says) I'd take Dirk.

Over the course of their careers, it's tough. Obviously they are both very, very good but KG couldn't get Minny out of the first round (and don't whine about his "bad" supporting cast). Dirk's Mavs gave the Heat a title. Dirk's Mavs suffered the worst playoff upset in the history of sports. Hmm... I'd probably still take Dirk (barely).

[DAF86]

I know a lot of Spurs fans hate KG, but I didn't think this poll would be lopsided in Dirk's favor. Anyway "right now" (as the poll says) I'd take Dirk.

Over the course of their careers, it's tough. Obviously they are both very, very good but KG couldn't get Minny out of the first round (and don't whine about his "bad" supporting cast). Dirk's Mavs gave the Heat a title. Dirk's Mavs suffered the worst playoff upset in the history of sports. Hmm... I'd probably still take Dirk (barely).

Didn't he get to the WCF once? same that Dirk with Dallas.

[Kori Ellis]

Didn't he get to the WCF once? same that Dirk with Dallas.

KG couldn't get out of the first round for what? 6 years in a row? 7?

That's what I meant.

[DAF86]

KG couldn't get out of the first round for what? 6 years in a row? 7?

That's what I meant.

KG=NBA ring-reg. season MVP-DPOY-lots of all-nba teams-lots of all-defensive teams.
Dirk=reg. season MVP-lots of all-nba teams-...

IMO career wise: KG > Dirk easily.

[Findog]

They met once in the playoffs and KG got his teeth kicked in.

[Findog]

Wow, that doesn't explain Dirk to a T or anything.

Dirk is arguably the most efficient offensive player in the League. Kobe takes more bad shots, although of course Kobe is better. Dirk never turns the ball over and he shoots 47-50% from the floor. A Dirk fadeaway is about as efficient as it gets.

[DAF86]

Dirk is arguably the most efficient offensive player in the League. Kobe takes more bad shots, although of course Kobe is better. Dirk never turns the ball over and he shoots 47-50% from the floor. A Dirk fadeaway is about as efficient as it gets.

Lebron is the most efficient offensive player in the league.

[redzero]

Dirk definitely is the best mid-range shooter in the league. Kobe takes horrible shots all the time.

[Findog]

I doubt that. The reason those guys won the 'ship in '08 was because of their defense, and according to them the reason for that defensive improvment was KG's prescence. He set the tone for everyone.

Dirk and KG are both 1.5 players. Kobe, Bron, Duncan and Wade are the only 1.0 Franchise Guys. Dirk and KG are clearly above Robin 2.0 level, but not quite at the 1.0 level. Manu, Pau Gasol, Joe Johnson are 2's. Scottie Pippen was a 1.5 in his prime. Actually, to take that back, I think Duncan is a 1.5 now, but an obvious 1 in his prime.

[Findog]

Lebron is the most efficient offensive player in the league.

Arguably.

[Findog]

except that's not what i did moron. I said when your offense consists of wide open mid range jumpers someone else creates for you, you're not an "above average" offensive player. Dirk creates virtually every shot he takes.

+1

[Findog]

Maybe he is, but it isn't as sure as Manu's lock.

Oh man, what a fuckin' homer take. And you have the gall to act as if you're impartial. They'll probably both end up in the Hall, but Dirk will get in before Manu.

[TDMVPDPOY]

your comparing a guy coming back from injury to a guy who has never had a career ending injury....

KG doesnt need to do much since joining the celtics, his role has became facilitator instead of the dominator....

[leemajors]

Oh man, what a fuckin' homer take. And you have the gall to act as if you're impartial. They'll probably both end up in the Hall, but Dirk will get in before Manu.

I think Manu gets in before Dirk, considering his Olympic and World Championship titles. It's the Basketball HOF, not strictly an NBA one. That, and that Dirk will probably play a bit longer than Manu.

[redzero]

LeBron and Wade are the most efficient scorers in the league. Obviously, Dirk is a better shooter than both of them, but they can get to rim and the line at will.

[Findog]

Dirk owns the Spurs. I am sorry, I am a Spurs fan but the Spurs can never find an answer for Dirk. Elson Bonner Udoka Bowen, nothing. Dirk is one of the best offensive players in the league. Bonner didnt ever make Dirk look like a bitch. If anything, its the double teams and scheming by Pop.

Thank you. A good Spur fan take. Popovich schemed to get the ball out of Dirk and Terry's hands. In theory, you would rather take your chance on JJ Barea and Brandon Bass beating you instead of Dirk. It's not a coincidence that Dirk was kind of quiet in that series while the role players stepped up and made the Spurs pay. Anybody who watched that series saw that Dirk made the right plays and didn't force anything. He took what the defense gave him, played the facillitator role very well and made San Antonio pay for it.

[Findog]

I think Manu gets in before Dirk, considering his Olympic and World Championship titles. It's the Basketball HOF, not strictly an NBA one.

Fair enough, but no way Manu gets in and Dirk doesn't.

[leemajors]

Fair enough, but no way Manu gets in and Dirk doesn't.

Agreed. I got an edit in there too.

[DAF86]

Arguably.

-Lebron 1.4 pts per FG attempt-(210 more pts. than Dirk in 3 less FG attempts than Dirk)

-Dirk 1.2 pts per FG attempt

-Lebron 2.0 TO/Assts. ratio

-Dirk 1.3 TO/Assts ratio

[Findog]

-Lebron 1.4 pts per FG attempt-(210 more pts. than Dirk in 3 less FG attempts than Dirk)

-Dirk 1.2 pts per FG attempt

-Lebron 2.0 TO/Assts. ratio

-Dirk 1.3 TO/Assts ratio

Agreed. Off the top of my head without looking it up, I thought Dirk was more efficient. Dirk is up at the top of the league though.

[DAF86]

Oh man, what a fuckin' homer take. And you have the gall to act as if you're impartial. They'll probably both end up in the Hall, but Dirk will get in before Manu.

If I were a homer I'd have put Manu on the top 16 list. Manu is already a first ballot HoF, Dirk isn't right now. Tell me how's that beign a homer.

[Findog]

If I were a homer I'd have put Manu on the top 16 list. Manu is already a first ballot HoF, Dirk isn't right now. Tell me how's that beign a homer.

There's no way the greatest foreign NBA player of all time has less of a case than Manu. I know it's the basketball hall of fame and things other than the NBA matter, but Dirk is a better bet than Manu. Dirk is already first-ballot HOF. It's not even up for debate. For the record, I think Manu gets in too, but it's ludicrous to say Manu is a lock and Dirk isn't.

[DAF86]

There's no way the greatest foreign NBA player of all time has less of a case than Manu. I know it's the basketball hall of fame and things other than the NBA matter, but Dirk is a better bet than Manu. Dirk is already first-ballot HOF. It's not even up for debate. For the record, I think Manu gets in too, but it's ludicrous to say Manu is a lock and Dirk isn't.

I agree that Dirk is a HoF, but if the people that vote to get players into the HoF would have to pick only one between Manu and Dirk. Manu'd get the nod.

Manu is the only player in the history to win the Eurolegue (MVP), Olympics (MVP) and NBA (one vote short of the MVP).

I know that you don't give a fuck about the Euroleague but the people that have a say in who gets into the Hall do.

[Findog]

I agree that Dirk is a HoF, but if the people that vote to get people into the HoF would have to pick only one between Manu and Dirk. Manu'd get the nod.

You're crazy.


Manu is the only player in the history to win the Eurolegue (MVP), Olympics (MVP)

Fixed it for you.

[DAF86]

You're crazy.



Fixed it for you.

So he didn't win the NBA

[Findog]

Manu also played on stacked Argentinian teams while Dirk took a bunch of scrubs to an Olympic birth. Manu's gold medal and Olympics MVP is impressive; it is not awe-inspiring.

[Findog]

So he didn't win the NBA

What is "winning the NBA?" You wrote "one short of MVP." What does that mean? Manu does not have a regular-season MVP award. He has never won a Finals MVP. "Almost" winning either doesn't count. An NBA regular-season MVP is more important than a Euroleague MVP award. I didn't say the Euroleague isn't a high quality of play, but an NBA MVP award is more impressive. The Basketball HOF does not value a Euroleague MVP award over an NBA regular-season one.

NBA = Major Leagues
EuroLeague = Triple A

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

OK, if I was the 12th man on the US Olympic team this year instead of Michael Redd, I'd have an Olympic gold medal and wouldn't have to do shit. Is that some sort of achievement?

[Findog]

Manu has the same # of titles as a #1 guy as Dirk: 0. Dirk has 1 more Finals appearance as a #1 guy than Manu. Dirk would have 3 rings too if he had been a Spur since 2003. Actually, he'd probably have more, because Dirk/TD >>> Manu/TD.

[dickface]

I'd love to see the vote tally where Manu was one vote short of winning NBA MVP. I'd love to see it mostly because it doesn't exist.

[dickface]

Why the hell is it taking so long for Christian Laettner to get into the Hall of Fame? He's a fucking Gold Medal winner, dammit!

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

NBA (one vote short of the MVP).


:lmao

[Findog]

Why the hell is it taking so long for Christian Laettner to get into the Hall of Fame? He's a fucking Gold Medal winner, dammit!

AC Green has RINGS! He's a lock for the HOF!

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

AC Green has RINGS! He's a lock for the HOF!


Sean Marks > Charles Barkley

[dickface]

Trajan Langdon kicks fucking ASS in Euroleague! Put him in the HOF the day he retires!!!!!

[Findog]

Trajan Langdon kicks fucking ASS in Euroleague! Put him in the HOF the day he retires!!!!!

Euroleague fa life!

[DAF86]

Manu also played on stacked Argentinian teams while Dirk took a bunch of scrubs to an Olympic birth. Manu's gold medal and Olympics MVP is impressive; it is not awe-inspiring.

Problem with Manu is that NBA fans don't realize how big Manu trully is in the rest of the basketball world. Go ask any FIBA fan and you'll see that he's one of the greats. Manu had the bad luck (not really) of landing on the Spurs at the age of 24. Put Manu at the age of 20 or 21 on the Grizzlies and he'll have a career average of 20+ pts per game, lots of all-star games, individual awards, etc.

Naming Manu to FIBA fans is like naming Magic, Bird, etc. to NBA fans.

[dickface]

Put Manu at the age of 20 or 21 on the Grizzlies and he'll have a career average of 20+ pts per game, lots of all-star games, individual awards, etc.

Yeah, and if Dirk was drafted by the Lakers, the Shaq/Kobe/Dirk Lakers would have about 7 rings right now.

Hypothetical Dirk > Hypothetical Manu

[DAF86]

Trajan Langdon kicks fucking ASS in Euroleague! Put him in the HOF the day he retires!!!!!

If he wins it and wins the MVP he would probably get into the HoF. There's life outside the NBA you know.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Fabricio Oberto olympic gold medalist and NBA champion!!! Make the sure HoF committee has their ballots ready!

[dickface]

There's life outside the NBA you know.

Mediocre life, for sure.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

wins the NBA


How do you win the NBA? Is there some sort of raffle?

[Findog]

Problem with Manu is that NBA fans don't realize how big Manu trully is in the rest of the basketball world. Go ask any FIBA fan and you'll see that he's one of the greats. Manu had the bad luck (not really) of landing on the Spurs at the age of 24. Put Manu at the age of 20 or 21 on the Grizzlies and he'll have a career average of 20+ pts per game, lots of all-star games, individual awards, etc.

Naming Manu to FIBA fans is like naming Magic, Bird, etc. to NBA fans.

Dirk is a better player than Manu. At the end of the day, that's what matters, and it's why Dirk has a better HOF case than Manu.

[Findog]

If he wins it and wins the MVP he would probably get into the HoF. There's life outside the NBA you know.

I gotta put this in my sig.

[dickface]

Naming Manu to FIBA fans is like naming Magic, Bird, etc. to NBA fans.

and naming Magic, Bird, etc to FIBA fans is like naming Magic, Bird, etc to NBA fans.

Meanwhile, naming Manu to NBA fans is like naming a pretty good 2nd or 3rd scoring option on a multiple title team.

[BUMP]

Yeah, and if Dirk was drafted by the Lakers, the Shaq/Kobe/Dirk Lakers would have about 7 rings right now.

Hypothetical Dirk > Hypothetical Manu

What are you talking about?

Dirk is not better than Horry, he played some defense. Dirk doesn't Lakers don't win with Dirk. End of story MavFan.

Horry>Dirk, Horry has rings, Dirk doesn't

[dickface]

I still want to find the vote tallies where Manu was one vote away from being NBA league MVP.

[Findog]

Fabricio Oberto olympic gold medalist and NBA champion!!! Make the sure HoF committee has their ballots ready!

Oberto, Langdon, Laettner: The Mount Rushmore of professional basketball.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Oh fuck he changed it to "wins the MVP" :depressed

[DAF86]

I don't want to turn KBP on you guys but you're beign really obnosious with the whole "everything outside the NBA sucks" thing. Go check the HoF list and you'll see that there lots of people that never came close to playing on the NBA.

[dickface]

Horry>Dirk, Horry has rings, Dirk doesn't

When Horry does something in the Euroleague, we'll talk. Until then, JR Holden > Horry.

[Findog]

What are you talking about?

Dirk is not better than Horry, he played some defense. Dirk doesn't Lakers don't win with Dirk. End of story MavFan.

Horry>Dirk, Horry has rings, Dirk doesn't

Horry has rings and is a better defender. Case closed, I agree.

[dickface]

I don't want to turn KBP on you guys

You acheived that status with "Manu is a hall of famer, Dirk isn't" bullshit. Saying Trajan Langdon has a shot at the HOF made it worse.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Oberto, Langdon, Laettner: The Mount Rushmore of professional basketball.


For sure. Ian Mahinmi might be an addition once he becomes the 3rd wheel of Robinson and Duncan.

[Findog]

I don't want to turn KBP on you guys but you're beign really obnosious with the whole "everything outside the NBA sucks" thing. Go check the HoF list and you'll see that there lots of people that never came close to playing on the NBA.

Your stance is that Manu has a better HOF case than Dirk. I agree that Sabonis could get in if he had never played a minute in the NBA, but Trajan Langdon??? Really?

[DAF86]

I still want to find the vote tallies where Manu was one vote away from being NBA league MVP.

NBA finals MVP, and he should have won it.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Loren Woods (double double Euroleague player) > Karl Malone (ringless pussy)

[BUMP]

At the same time, i'm not sure if we can put Dirk ahead of Mark Madsen or Rick Fox yet because as soon as they left the Lakers, they stopped winning championships. Same goes with Brian Scalabrine, looks like Dirk will have to take a backseat to him too

[duncan228]

Just for the record: Manu was one vote shy of being Co-MVP of the '05 Finals. The vote was 6-4 Duncan.

[DAF86]

You acheived that status with "Manu is a hall of famer, Dirk isn't" bullshit. Saying Trajan Langdon has a shot at the HOF made it worse.

When did I say that? if you're going to argue at least pay attention to the discussion.

[Findog]

NBA finals MVP, and he should have won it.

But he didn't.

[dickface]

Bob McAdoo - Euroleague MVP and NBA Champion

he might be the greatest player ever. Move aside, Jordan.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

At the same time, i'm not sure if we can put Dirk ahead of Mark Madsen or Rick Fox yet because as soon as they left the Lakers, they stopped winning championships. Same goes with Brian Scalabrine, looks like Dirk will have to take a backseat to him too


Luc Longley > Patrick Ewing as well. His team used to smoke Ewing's team, and he has 3 rings, faggot.

[Findog]

At the same time, i'm not sure if we can put Dirk ahead of Mark Madsen or Rick Fox yet because as soon as they left the Lakers, they stopped winning championships. Same goes with Brian Scalabrine, looks like Dirk will have to take a backseat to him too

If you project Scal's #'s out to 36 minutes, it's no contest.

[DAF86]

Your stance is that Manu has a better HOF case than Dirk. I agree that Sabonis could get in if he had never played a minute in the NBA, but Trajan Langdon??? Really?

Yes and if you weren't an ignorant NBA fan you should know that it isn't even arguable.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Bob McAdoo - Euroleague MVP and NBA Champion


:wow

[dickface]

Yes but Manu would be KG (two locks for the HoF), and Dirk Terry (two that aren't, even though I think Dirk will eventualy get there).

oh, eventually. He'll "eventually" get there. Fuck off.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Yes and if you weren't an ignorant NBA fan


Yeah Findog, brush up on your B-list and C-list basketball league knowledge.

[DAF86]

Bob McAdoo - Euroleague MVP and NBA Champion

he might be the greatest player ever. Move aside, Jordan.

No but he has a strong case to make the HoF.

[Findog]

Yes and if you weren't an ignorant NBA fan you should know that it isn't even arguable.

Sorry, but you're dead wrong. Dirk has a better HOF resume than Manu. NBA Regular season MVP, Finals appearance as a #1 guy, greatest foreign NBA player of all time, took a bunch of German scrubs to an Olympic birth easily trumps a euroleague mvp, olympics mvp with a stacked Argentinian team, and 3 titles as a #2 in the NBA.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

No but he has a strong case to make the HoF.


No, MJ couldn't hold his jock. The day MJ wins an MVP against some B-list competition, then he can talk to McAdoo.

[DAF86]

oh, eventually. He'll "eventually" get there. Fuck off.



I agree that Dirk is a HoF, but if the people that vote to get players into the HoF would have to pick only one between Manu and Dirk. Manu'd get the nod.

Manu is the only player in the history to win the Eurolegue (MVP), Olympics (MVP) and NBA (one vote short of the MVP).

I know that you don't give a fuck about the Euroleague but the people that have a say in who gets into the Hall do.

Please shut the fuck up.

[dickface]

DAF86, if you weren't such an ignorant fuck, you'd know that while playing for DJK Würzburg, Dirk Nowitzki was voted "German Basketballer of the Year" by the German BASKET magazine. That shit is prestigious.

Dirk now has Euro cred. Dirk > Manu.

[dickface]

No but he has a strong case to make the HoF.

He's already in there you fucking dipshit. for his NBA career.

[dickface]

Please shut the fuck up.

I'm glad you realized what a dumbass you sounded like, and changed your opinion. Baby steps!

[DAF86]

I know that it hurts to realize that not everything is how you thought it was but you don't need to be such little bitches about it.

[redzero]

I would definitely take Dirk over Manu for the Hall of Fame. He is the best foreign NBA player in history, even though he has no rings.

[dickface]

Luc Longley > Patrick Ewing as well. His team used to smoke Ewing's team, and he has 3 rings, faggot.

Plus wasn't he some kind of Australian League badass? What does DAF86 know about Aussie Hoops?

Luc Longley = GOAT

[Findog]

Manu's Olympic teams were like the 96 Bulls of the Olympics, whereas Dirk's German teams were like the mid-eighties Bulls teams.

[DAF86]

He's already in there you fucking dipshit. for his NBA career.

Well, see: eroleague MVP-NBA ring=HoF.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

He is the best foreign NBA player in history, even though he has no rings.


Nonsense!!! All players with rings are automatically better than all players w/o rings.

[dickface]

It hurts to realize that not everything is how I thought it was but I don't need to be such a little bitch about it.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Plus wasn't he some kind of Australian League badass? What does DAF86 know about Aussie Hoops?

Luc Longley = GOAT


I'm not sure, but I know Bogut was an Aussie b-ballin' king. Future HoF.

[dickface]

I'm not so sure about Tim Duncan's HOF credentials. Dude better get some Euroleague time in before he retires. He doesn't have a gold medal or anything!

[Rogue]

No one would know shit about someone named Manu Ginobili hadn't dude joined NBA in 02, it was NBA league that made this second round draftee a superstar.

[Findog]

Ricky Rubio is a HOF before ever putting on an ugly-ass blue and green jersey.

[sook]

Dirk noooooowheetzki

[dickface]

Ricky Rubio is a HOF before ever putting on an ugly-ass blue and green jersey.

If he's one vote away from being named Co-MVP of next year's Summer League, he's a first ballot!

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

I'm not so sure about Tim Duncan's HOF credentials. Dude better get some Euroleague time in before he retires. He doesn't have a gold medal or anything!


True, David Robinson must have paid off some voters if he got in without any Euroleague experience.

[duncan228]

I'm not so sure about Tim Duncan's HOF credentials. Dude better get some Euroleague time in before he retires. He doesn't have a gold medal or anything!

:lol


:depressed A Gold Medal would have been sweet on his resume. That, and a DPOY.

[Rogue]

I'm not so sure about Tim Duncan's HOF credentials. Dude better get some Euroleague time in before he retires. He doesn't have a gold medal or anything!
exactly, that's why there once blew some rumors that Kobe and Lebron both were considering playing in Europe after 2010.

[dickface]

Fellas, Dirk isn't even the biggest HOF candidate on the Mavericks!

No, I'm not talking about Jason Kidd. I'm talking about 2004-05 NBA D-League MVP Matt Carroll!

Does Manu have a D-League MVP trophy? I think not.

[redzero]

:lol


:depressed A Gold Medal would have been sweet on his resume. That, and a DPOY.

Timmy is too unpatriotic to win a gold medal for Mother America, which is too bad--he could put all the foreign players asleep with his play.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

I'm talking about 2004-05 NBA D-League MVP Matt Carroll!

Does Manu have a D-League MVP trophy? I think not.


Carroll > Jordan (no D-league experience whatsoever).

[KidCongo]

:lol


:depressed A Gold Medal would have been sweet on his resume. That, and a DPOY.

In short he wanted to be an olympic swimmer and win gold. Then due to circumstances he turned to basketball, wins almost every award imaginable, goes to the olympics but doesn't win gold.

Sorta funny how things work out.

[Rogue]

Fellas, Dirk isn't even the biggest HOF candidate on the Mavericks!

No, I'm not talking about Jason Kidd. I'm talking about 2004-05 NBA D-League MVP Matt Carroll!

Does Manu have a D-League MVP trophy? I think not.
Even Dick Breath has more leverage to run for HOF than Dirk does, since dude has got 3 rings with the Lakers while Dirk has none. Too bad we traded him away earlier this summer, because the ringless Marion is definitely not as valuable as DickBreath.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Even Dick Breath has more leverage to run for HOF than Dirk does, since dude has got 3 rings with the Lakers while Dirk has none. Too bad we traded him away earlier this summer, because the ringless Marion is definitely not as valuable as DickBreath.

Son players with three rings don't come along very often, why on erf did you guys get rid of him?

[BUMP]

:lol even Rogue getting into the action

[Rogue]

Son players with three rings don't come along very often, why on erf did you guys get rid of him?
I have never appreciated the Marion trade, it's was just a typical unsuccessful deal made by Donnie Nelson who is an idiot.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

I have never appreciated the Marion trade, it's was just a typical unsuccessful deal made by Donnie Nelson who is an idiot.


You guys should be trying to sign Fabricio Oberto since he has a ring.

[Findog]

:lol even Rogue getting into the action

It's a merciless pile-on now. I love that he calls him Dickbreath. Surely the Raptors must now be included in the same conversation as Cleveland, Orlando and Boston since D George and his Bird Rights are now rocking it in the T-Dot.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Finley w/ Dallas = No rings
Finley w/ SA = 1 ring, therefore:

Finley w/ SA > Finley w/ Dallas

[redzero]

Hey, I'll trade Antonio Daniels and Sean Marks for Dirk. They both have rings, so the Hornets would be doing the Mavericks a favor.

[Durant82]

I'll take Durant over either of them. But I like Dirk more than KG right now.

[Findog]

Finley w/ Dallas = No rings
Finley w/ SA = 1 ring, therefore:

Finley w/ SA > Finley w/ Dallas

Mitch Richmond with the Lakers >>>>> Mitch Richmond with the Kings.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Hey, I'll trade Antonio Daniels and Sean Marks for Dirk. They both have rings, so the Hornets would be doing the Mavericks a favor.


I didn't think NO's GM was that stupid.

[DAF86]

I see that folks in here have to resort to bad Luc Longley jokes 'cause they don't have any arguments to continue with the discussion.

P/S: I didn't even say that Manu is a better player than Dirk, I'm saying that he had a better career therefore a stronger case for the HoF.

[Rogue]

You guys should be trying to sign Fabricio Oberto since he has a ring.
Yup, players with rings are precious fortunes for the team they play on, and it's precisely the reason why Suns purchased Shaq in 08, though it's been proven a failure.

[Findog]

I see that folks in here have to resort to bad Luc Longley jokes 'cause they don't have any arguments to continue with the discussion.

P/S: I didn't even say that Manu is a better player than Dirk, I'm saying that he had a better career therefore a stronger case for the HoF.

You can't have a better career if you're not a better player. Manu has the same # of rings as a #1 guy as Dirk: 0. He's got one less Finals appearance as a #1 guy than Dirk.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Mitch Richmond with the Lakers >>>>> Mitch Richmond with the Kings.


Robert Parish in 1987 <<<<<< Robert Parish in 1997

[redzero]

Manu also cost the Spurs another Championship with a pointless foul.

[Ghazi]

His accolades are purely circumstantial. Right place, right time. I wouldn't say his career is better.

Fuck Bennett Salvatore etc.

[DAF86]

You can't have a better career if you're not a better player. Manu has the same # of rings as a #1 guy as Dirk: 0. He's got one less Finals appearance as a #1 guy than Dirk.

He has lots of more championships than Dirk as a #1 guy, including the Olympics.

[redzero]

He has lots of more championships than Dirk as a #1 guy, including the Olympics.

Who cares about the Olympics? If that Argentinian team actually faced a real NBA team, they wouldn't have won a single gold medal.

[Findog]

He has lots of more championships than Dirk as a #1 guy, including the Olympics.

Sorry to break it to you, but the Olympics aren't as important as the NBA.

[DAF86]

His accolades are purely circumstantial. Right place, right time. I wouldn't say his career is better.

Fuck Bennett Salvatore etc.

Manu won in every place he played. I bet he must be the luckiest man on earth.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Sorry to break it to you, but the Olympics aren't as important as the NBA.


I guess in the HoF they are......neither being as important as the Euroleague.

[redzero]

Your wife has a pretty little whore mouth.

Hey, Tyson, when are you going to stop having fucked up feet/ankles?

[Findog]

Also, when it comes to FIBA, Argentina is like the 96 Bulls. Manu had a great supporting cast. Germany was like the mid-eighties Bulls teams. Just like in the NBA, Manu is on a better team.

[DAF86]

Sorry to break it to you, but the Olympics aren't as important as the NBA.

See, that's what I'm talking about. For the rest of the world, YES. yes they are. Get your head out of your ass.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Manu won in every place he played. I bet he must be the luckiest man on earth.


Replace Manu with Dirk from 2003-2009 and they might actually win every title during that period.

[BUMP]

See, that's what I'm talking about. For the rest of the world, YES. yes they are. Get your head out of your ass.

Who fucking cares?

Replace Ginobli with Dirk in any situation on any team and Dirk duplicates the success and more.

Therefore Dirk>Manu

[Findog]

See, that's what I'm talking about. For the rest of the world, YES. yes they are. Get your head out of your ass.

Nobody in their right mind thinks the Olympics are a higher level of play than the NBA. The NBA probably has 75-80% of the best players in the world. Get real. Manu played on stacked teams anyways. What he did is just as impressive as Dirk leading Germany to an Olympic berth.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

See, that's what I'm talking about. For the rest of the world, YES. yes they are. Get your head out of your ass.

Have you conducted a poll? You seem like you know this as fact.

[Rogue]

I see that folks in here have to resort to bad Luc Longley jokes 'cause they don't have any arguments to continue with the discussion.

P/S: I didn't even say that Manu is a better player than Dirk, I'm saying that he had a better career therefore a stronger case for the HoF.
Manu played important roles on the Spurs 03, 05 and 07 champion teams as the sixth man, just like DickBreath's role on the Lakers team through 00-02 champion streak. Therefore Manu is equally as great as Dickbreath, and both of them have received 3 rings respectively for their careers. Then Manu and DickBreath are both ahead of Dirk to be nominated for HOF.

[redzero]

An NBA team with Manu as its number one option wouldn't get further than one with VC as its number one option.

[DAF86]

Who fucking cares?

Replace Ginobli with Dirk in any situation on any team and Dirk duplicates the success and more.

Therefore Dirk>Manu

Argentina wouldn't have won the gold with Dirk instead of Manu.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

Argentina wouldn't have won the gold with Dirk instead of Manu.


:lmao

[dickface]

Argentina wouldn't have won the gold with Dirk instead of Manu.

Yeah, that much is obvious. I'm pretty sure a German citizen can't play for Team Argentina without breaking some sort of rule.

[Findog]

Argentina wouldn't have won the gold with Dirk instead of Manu.

Germany would not have qualified for the Olympics with Manu instead of Dirk.

[Findog]

Argentina wouldn't have won the gold with Dirk instead of Manu.

So you're saying Manu > Dirk. Umm...okay.

[dirk4mvp]

I guess you have to cling onto Manu if you're from Argentina, as he's the only non-flopball athlete from that shit stain on mother earth.

[Findog]

Yeah, that much is obvious. I'm pretty sure a German citizen can't play for Team Argentina without breaking some sort of rule.

I don't know about that. There's a rich heritage of Germans going to South America.

[dickface]

I guess you have to cling onto Manu if you're from Argentina, as he's the only non-flopball athlete from that shit stain.

At least they're Nazi sympathizers. They have that going for them.

[DUNCANownsKOBE2]

I guess you have to cling onto Manu if you're from Argentina, as he's the only non-flopball athlete from that shit stain on mother earth.


And even the U.S. is advancing further than them in flopball these days :lmao

[Ghazi]

Yoooo that Indian chick from Slumdog millionaire is pretty hot.


Just saw the movie :)


It was alright.

[dirk4mvp]

At least they're Nazi sympathizers. They have that going for them.

Running water is fucking cool.

[Rogue]

Nobody in their right mind thinks the Olympics are a higher level of play than the NBA. The NBA probably has 75-80% of the best players in the world. Get real. Manu played on stacked teams anyways. What he did is just as impressive as Dirk leading Germany to an Olympic berth.
The 7'6 piece of **** and his national team didn't play any qualification game to get the berth of Olympics last summer, then his team is superior to German basketball team and the 7'6 piece of **** is greater than the leader of our boys in blue.