Mason Wants Out?

[ElNono]

Maybe the problem is that there are too many prima donna bitches on the team who don't know what it takes to win a championship. Good luck in Clipperland or wherever, MaseMoneywhoever.

I agree with the characterization that we've turned into soft bitches...

[Kindergarten Cop]

Watch this thread get 10+ pages by tonight.

Didn't take long, did it? :lol

[dbestpro]

As a fan the thing that bugs me the most is that Pop will never take the responsibilty for when things go wrong. I mean never..... yeah sometimes its the players fault and sometimes Pop just makes bad decisions. Pop still points the finger at the players. When you are not winning like you are use to that has to wear on a player.

[EricB]

The point is Pop had done an excellent job in the past and now he sucks as much as anyone who is on the Spurs payroll this year. There came a time when Gervin could no longer deliver and had to move on. The same thing happens to coaches. It really looks like Pop has lost the ear of his players and that they just don't trust his decisions, anymore.

Hmmm, so now you know what the players are thinking.

Amazing...

[Marcus Bryant]

Fuck your non-committed ass. GTFO.

[timvp]

Maybe the problem is that there are too many prima donna bitches on the team who don't know what it takes to win a championship. Good luck in Clipperland or wherever, MaseMoneywhoever.

Good point. The chemistry hasn't been there this season. We may have stumbled upon one reason why.

[Libri]

Here is a Mason quote when he signed last season:

"I feel like my career is just starting," the 27-year-old Mason said. "This was my first year with consistent playing time in my career."

It's obvious that he wanted playing time. His final year with the Wizards, he averaged 21.4 min. Last year the Spurs gave him what he wanted and averaged 30.4. He is now down to 19.6 min.

[EricB]

Maybe the problem is that there are too many prima donna bitches on the team who don't know what it takes to win a championship. Good luck in Clipperland or wherever, MaseMoneywhoever.


Meh, I don't get the vibe that theres guys DYING for shots and discontent.

I know your partially kidding, but if Mason is pulling a Ron Mercer and being a bitch about shots, then honestly that suprises me.

[EricB]

As a fan the thing that bugs me the most is that Pop will never take the responsibilty for when things go wrong. I mean never..... yeah sometimes its the players fault and sometimes Pop just makes bad decisions. Pop still points the finger at the players. When you are not winning like you are use to that has to wear on a player.


:lol

Yeah so if they lose one night and pop says "Fuck ya know I was horrible, we lost cause of me"

Then your gonna feel better?


Please. get a grip...

[dbestpro]

Hmmm, so now you know what the players are thinking.

Amazing...

.....and you don't?

Amazing......

[EricB]

Good point. The chemistry hasn't been there this season. We may have stumbled upon one reason why.


I just find it hard to believe one guy grumbling about minutes would make a team underachieve this much...

[EricB]

.....and you don't?

Amazing......


:lol

I have ZERO clue what these players think.

I'm not egotistical nor that conceded to profess to KNOW what other players think...

[SpurNation]

It's not.

What do you think my response was to?

Just for grins...timvp said this


He probably is. However, Bonner is currently the second best defensive bigman on the team.

Although that probably says the more about the team than anything else . . .


To which I said



Ain't that the frickin' truth


It's Not?

[ducks]

I just find it hard to believe one guy grumbling about minutes would make a team underachieve this much...

I hope mason is the main reason and pop

and maybe when mason is out pop can find his brain

[EricB]

I agree with the characterization that we've turned into soft bitches...


Yeah to a point they are and I lay the blame on Pop on that one.

[ShoogarBear]

Yeah, I find it difficult to believe Roger Mason Jr, who's never had a word of controversy in his life, is suddenly this lockerroom malcontent bringing the team down.

Although given the Spurs' M.O., it wouldn't be surprising to suddenly have a bunch of stories floated in the media.

[dbestpro]

:lol

Yeah so if they lose one night and pop says "Fuck ya know I was horrible, we lost cause of me"

Then your gonna feel better?


Yeah, so I like it when a person takes responsibilty for their actions. I guess you prefer the later. You sure your not a Laker fan? I mean lack of character is kind of their main thing.

[SequSpur]

Good point. The chemistry hasn't been there this season. We may have stumbled upon one reason why.

:cry

[BOHOLANO#21]

no not at all
how he talks to the media
agree. freakin popovich coaching been slipping this year. i long for the day for once he will own up his failures this year. as a spurs fan it pains me to go to at&t center to watch our spurs struggle to get a win. i sometimes chose to stay home at times to ease some pain...:bang

[EricB]

What do you think my response was to?

Just for grins...timvp said this


To which I said



It's Not?


I'd say that Theo Ratliff is better defensively, but, I'm not gonna get into a drawn out disagreement or anything.

[EricB]

Yeah, so I like it when a person takes responsibilty for their actions. I guess you prefer the later. You sure your not a Laker fan? I mean lack of character is kind of their main thing.


I don't understand how Pop saying "I misjudged a lineup tonight" makes things all better.

[EricB]

Yeah, I find it difficult to believe Roger Mason Jr, who's never had a word of controversy in his life, is suddenly this lockerroom malcontent bringing the team down.

Although given the Spurs' M.O., it wouldn't be surprising to suddenly have a bunch of stories floated in the media.


Wouldn't shock me to read something this summer about Mase and late night flirtations at certain dance clubs either...

I'll leave that alone though.

[Go For Tree]

Later MASE!! We dont need you getting our hopes up hitting threes during the reg season only to be Chris Angel and disappear come the playoffs.

[alchemist]

Making matters worse, Mason is in a contract year. “I'd be lying if I said it's not tough,” Mason said. “I look at it as a challenge. There's not many guys in the league that can play well in those circumstances. I'm just looking to do what I can.”

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/spurs/Hill_Mason_boost_Parker-less_Spurs.html




“That's his job,” Popovich said. “Guys get paid a lot of money to go play. It doesn't matter when you play, or how many minutes. I expect them to give everything they have when they're called upon.”

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/spurs/Spurs_Mason_stays_cool_amid_trade_talk.html

:wow :lol

the writing was on the wall

[dbestpro]

I don't understand how Pop saying "I misjudged a lineup tonight" makes things all better.

OK, lets look at it this way. What do you think of a manager that always blames the employees when production fails?

Now, would you rather work for the guy above or the manager that takes the blame and protects his employees?

The players are human. You don't have to read a players mind to know that they will react to what is human nature.

[poop]

ive heard a bit about Mahinmi's nightlife from certain sources which makes me wonder if that has anything to do with why pop refuses to play him.

[SpurNation]

I'd say that Theo Ratliff is better defensively, but, I'm not gonna get into a drawn out disagreement or anything.

I would agree with you on that. Let's just say... out of the players actually being played...:toast

[poop]

id actually want to keep mason around, he is maybe the best pure shooters on the team and has shown he can do it in crunch time as well. he just needs to be in the right role

[EricB]

OK, lets look at it this way. What do you think of a manager that always blames the employees when production fails?

Now, would you rather work for the guy above or the manager that takes the blame and protects his employees?

The players are human. You don't have to read a players mind to know that they will react to what is human nature.


The same guy that took a huge PR bullet for the Spurs players back in 97 when he fired Bob HIll?

Yeah I can't see how Manu Parker and Duncan love the guy.

[EricB]

I would agree with you on that. Let's just say... out of the players actually being played...:toast

OUt of the players that play?

I don't know shit about basketball, but I think McDyess plays better D than Bonner, but, again, I thought Rasho Nesterovich was way too bagged on in his time in SA too..

[EricB]

ive heard a bit about Mahinmi's nightlife from certain sources which makes me wonder if that has anything to do with why pop refuses to play him.


Well when you come into practice the next day and let it affect you......


Not saying anymore...

[TD 21]

Or a Mason/Finley for Salmons

With Finley coming back in 30 days. (Pop's deal breaker)

I don't think Pop could live without Finley for 30 days.

In fact, this trade (assuming Salmons isn't in it, which I've assumed all along) will actually increase Finley's role. He'll be the 10th man in (at least for now) a 10 man rotation and will no longer have to battle Mason for the 10th man/spot up 3-point shooting wing off the bench role.

[dbestpro]

The same guy that took a huge PR bullet for the Spurs players back in 97 when he fired Bob HIll?

Yeah I can't see how Manu Parker and Duncan love the guy.

Uh,...... this is 2010.

[Go For Tree]

ive heard a bit about Mahinmi's nightlife from certain sources which makes me wonder if that has anything to do with why pop refuses to play him.

not sure if thats it, money mase is always at Posh, and has walked out on his tab more than once. He still gets minutes. He fires up too many Steve Nash fast break 3s. Hes not Steve Nash tho.....

[EricB]

Uh,...... this is 2010.

Good for you.

You figured out what year it is.

[duncan228]

Mason wants out? (http://blogs.mysanantonio.com/weblogs/courtside/2010/02/mason-wants-out.html)
By Jeff McDonald

In his final media interview before heading into the All-Star break, guard Roger Mason Jr. re-iterated his desire to remain a Spur.

"I want to be in San Antonio for my career," Mason told me after the Spurs' victory in Denver on Thursday. "I want to win a championship here. That would be the ultimate."

Now, according to his agent, Mason wants to be traded (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=ArDs7M94GcTHNEZDzZg5tNu8vLYF?slug=ys-masonspurs021510&prov=yhoo&type=lgns).

Strange days, indeed.

[EricB]

not sure if thats it, money mase is always at Posh, and has walked out on his tab more than once. He still gets minutes. He fires up too many Steve Nash fast break 3s. Hes not Steve Nash tho.....


Different Night clubs than Posh...

[all_heart]

Just curious, how many other players in the Pop era have asked for trades? I get the feeling not many. So on the outside looking in, Mason is pretty much an easy going player, what does this say about Pop. It's pretty obvious his choice of lineups and style the past couple of years stinks. Maybe this will knock some sense into Pop somehow. Really Finley?! Why does Pop feel obligated to turn the Spurs org into a retirement home despite the lack of production from these guys. I just hope we get a decent player out of the trade and he makes a positive impact for the team. Pop will probably bench the guy, since he "doesn't know the Spurs system", BS.

[Go For Tree]

Different Night clubs than Posh...

i believe you.

[Vic Petro]

To suggest that someone else would have definitely won 4 titles with Duncan's roster to me is crazy, given that like 7 guys in total have coached an NBA Championship team in the last 30 years.

The problem imo has not been Pop or his coaching. It has been Pop/RC and roster construction. Have not adjusted to new rules that limited their defense-first scheme, and consequentially have not surrounded Tim/Tony/Manu with the right players.

[dbestpro]

Good for you.

You figured out what year it is.

Thought you would like to know seeing how you got lost in 97.

[EricB]

i believe you.


:lol

Its one of those "Im not sayin, I'm just sayin" things.

Im looking forward to after he's traded the articles that will come out, if they are allowed to be written...

[EricB]

Thought you would like to know seeing how you got lost in 97.


Im not lost there. Just giving an example of a coach that supposedly never takes the heat from his employees, times that he has...

[dbestpro]

Im not lost there. Just giving an example of a coach that supposedly never takes the heat from his employees, times that he has...

Once? In 97? :lol:lmao

[Spurtacus]

It's funny how people can make a trade with Fin,Mason,Bonner..... .If we don't want them how we are going to find a team to get good players for them.

Expiring contracts.

[EricB]

To suggest that someone else would have definitely won 4 titles with Duncan's roster to me is crazy, given that like 7 guys in total have coached an NBA Championship team in the last 30 years.

The problem imo has not been Pop or his coaching. It has been Pop/RC and roster construction. Have not adjusted to new rules that limited their defense-first scheme, and consequentially have not surrounded Tim/Tony/Manu with the right players.


Monday morning GMing is always easy, but again, did anyone EVEN YOU think Richard Jefferson and Antonio McDyess would've played this bad?

Those guys being dissapointing along with Parker being limited because of injuries.

That and Pop seemingly for some reason ignoring what worked in the past.

[EricB]

Once? In 97? :lol:lmao


He's done it more than once, but I'm not the master of the internets and would have no clue how to bring up quotes, but I remember times that he's said he's screwed up.

Again though, does that equal out the loss if he says "I fucked up"?

Seriously..

[skinsfan1]

Hate to see him leave but cant blame him

[EricB]

Expiring contracts.

Yup.

NBA Econ 101.

[SenorSpur]

Bonner/Mason/Mahinmi for Batum

Is it feasible or not?

Not if that punk-ass, Portland GM has anything to say about it - and he does.

[ducks]

mason for jr smith

[Agloco]

:wow :lol

the writing was on the wall

You changed the entire context of Pop's conversation by omitting the part in red......



Originally Posted by 02/13/2010

Mason's minutes have swung wildly this season, and he admits it's been difficult to find a groove. Popovich said he has been pleased with Mason's professionalism in amid a trying season.

“That's his job,” Popovich said. “Guys get paid a lot of money to go play. It doesn't matter when you play, or how many minutes. I expect them to give everything they have when they're called upon.”

http://www.mysanantonio.com/sports/s...rade_talk.html

[tmtcsc]

Ok, so he was out at da strip clubs in SA. How bad could it be ? What did you hear about him EricB? I always thought he kept his nose clean... --> Just an expression.

PM me if you don't want to write it out on the board.

[SpurNation]

OUt of the players that play?

I don't know shit about basketball, but I think McDyess plays better D than Bonner, but, again, I thought Rasho Nesterovich was way too bagged on in his time in SA too..

Again...maybe true. But when do we see a defensive lineup late in quarters with leads that have a chance to defend that lead?

That's not saying RMJ isn't doing what Pop wants. But there's bigger issues than RMJ with this team.

RMJ is out of his realm of comfort for what he does best. Other's simply don't get a chance to play and do what they do best.

Again...I can't blame RMJ if all this is true. Whipping Boy is not a thing I would take very long either if there happened to be other issues greater than my contributions or lack there of.

But who's to say RMJ has been the 'whipping boy' of Pop. It just appears that way.

How long would any of us put up with that if it were the case?

[ducks]

maybe pop wants out he said no title fire himself

[Agloco]

It's funny how people can make a trade with Fin,Mason,Bonner..... .If we don't want them how we are going to find a team to get good players for them.

Look up "expiring contracts".

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Yeah, I find it difficult to believe Roger Mason Jr, who's never had a word of controversy in his life, is suddenly this lockerroom malcontent bringing the team down.

Although given the Spurs' M.O., it wouldn't be surprising to suddenly have a bunch of stories floated in the media.

Yep. Whenever a player gets traded away that had a pulse, you always see stories about what a cancer they were after the fact. Typical Spurs media management...

[Mel_13]

Yep. Whenever a player gets traded away that had a pulse, you always see stories about what a cancer they were after the fact. Typical Spurs media management...

Outside of Beno, what traded Spur has received negative post-trade press in the last 6-7 years?

[Obstructed_View]

He was wrong or something? :lol

No, they pretty much had carte blanche from him to quit the moment Manu's injury was determined to be season-ending, didn't they?

Pop's holding a grudge against Mason for an uninspired performance in a series he himself had already given up on is just another block in his long running game of bad-decision Jenga.

[angelbelow]

ive heard a bit about Mahinmi's nightlife from certain sources which makes me wonder if that has anything to do with why pop refuses to play him.

Interesting.

[EricB]

Yep. Whenever a player gets traded away that had a pulse, you always see stories about what a cancer they were after the fact. Typical Spurs media management...



Yeah I was very fond of the stories about Kurt Thomas and Fabricio.

[Vic Petro]

Monday morning GMing is always easy, but again, did anyone EVEN YOU think Richard Jefferson and Antonio McDyess would've played this bad?

Those guys being dissapointing along with Parker being limited because of injuries.

That and Pop seemingly for some reason ignoring what worked in the past.

No of course, just like almost everyone else here I thought the RJ/McDyess moves were great. But it's not my job to be right. Even if every fan thought it was the best deal ever, the fact is the various roster permutations that Pop/RC have tried have failed. You have to hold them accountable for that, given it's their job to contruct a successful roster.

[objective]

Yep. Whenever a player gets traded away that had a pulse, you always see stories about what a cancer they were after the fact. Typical Spurs media management...

100% true.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Outside of Beno, what traded Spur has received negative post-trade press in the last 6-7 years?

Antonio Daniels.

Derek Anderson left, but got the post-Spur trashing in the press for being a prima donna.

Buckets (Stephen Jackson), same.

I know I'm missing some too.

[EricB]

Again...maybe true. But when do we see a defensive lineup late in quarters with leads that have a chance to defend that lead?

That's not saying RMJ isn't doing what Pop wants. But there's bigger issues than RMJ with this team.

RMJ is out of his realm of comfort for what he does best. Other's simply don't get a chance to play and do what they do best.

Again...I can't blame RMJ if all this is true. Whipping Boy is not a thing I would take very long either if there happened to be other issues greater than my contributions or lack there of.

But who's to say RMJ has been the 'whipping boy' of Pop. It just appears that way.

How long would any of us put up with that if it were the case?


I disagree he's been a whipping boy.

Has he gotten the raw end of PT?

At times yeah but there have been other times where he hasn't helped himself at all.

IMO both parties can share the blame equally which IMO, means a trade is best for both sides.

[objective]

Antonio Daniels.

Derek Anderson left, but got the post-Spur trashing in the press for being a prima donna.

Buckets (Stephen Jackson), same.

I know I'm missing some too.

I seem to remember some anti-Scola scuttlebutt in the media before and after the trade, at least that's my hazy memory.

The business of 'he wants to start/he can't play next to Tim with his game/he's demanding the full MLE' can't all have started on message boards.

[EricB]

No of course, just like almost everyone else here I thought the RJ/McDyess moves were great. But it's not my job to be right. Even if every fan thought it was the best deal ever, the fact is the various roster permutations that Pop/RC have tried have failed. You have to hold them accountable for that, given it's their job to contruct a successful roster.


Yeah I agree.

Wanting to run them all out of town? I would disagree with that.

[EricB]

Antonio Daniels.

Derek Anderson left, but got the post-Spur trashing in the press for being a prima donna.

Buckets (Stephen Jackson), same.

I know I'm missing some too.


Wasn't that true though?

[ElNono]

Antonio Daniels.

Derek Anderson left, but got the post-Spur trashing in the press for being a prima donna.

Buckets (Stephen Jackson), same.

I know I'm missing some too.

Anthony Carter?
Ime Udoka?

Scola?

[EricB]

I seem to remember some anti-Scola scuttlebutt in the media before and after the trade, at least that's my hazy memory.

The business of 'he wants to start/he can't play next to Tim with his game/he's demanding the full MLE' can't all have started on message boards.


Yeah it's called an agent.

[EricB]

Anthony Carter?
Ime Udoka?

Scola?

Well Scola did get painted with a bit of a bad picture I'll say that, but, most of that could be attributed to the agent.

RC critiquing his rebounding in an email to him (if thats true, I've never gotten confirmation on that) was bad form as well.

[ducks]

hill has nude pictures and he is still here

[ducks]

Well Scola did get painted with a bit of a bad picture I'll say that, but, most of that could be attributed to the agent.

RC critiquing his rebounding in an email to him (if thats true, I've never gotten confirmation on that) was bad form as well.

scola is the one that FUCKED UP
he could have had a ring by now

[objective]

Yeah it's called an agent.

I remember his agent saying that he needed a deal of 3 yrs 9-10 million. Not the full MLE.

[Vic Petro]

Yeah I agree.

Wanting to run them all out of town? I would disagree with that.

Totally agreed...my overall point was a defense of Pop. People wanting to run Pop/RC out of town are like the people living in a penthouse and complaining about no backyard. Some people don't know how good we have it. If these two are replaced you are almost assured of the new tandem being nowhere near as successful.

That said, for the past 3 years or so especially, they have made some serious errors in judgment.

[Obstructed_View]

Derek Anderson left, but got the post-Spur trashing in the press for being a prima donna.

Derek Anderson has been the victim of more revisionist history from the fans than any player the team's ever had. His injury in the playoffs absolutely cost the Spurs their second title, but because he complained publicly about his contract he's been relegated to a status somewhere between role-player and bench scrub.

Pretty much any big the Spurs have had since David Robinson has been minimized by the fanbase, as well as Scola. Lots of folks thought he wouldn't be able to defend or hit a jumpshot and that was why it was okay to let him go.

[EricB]

Derek Anderson has been the victim of more revisionist history from the fans than any player the team's ever had. His injury in the playoffs absolutely cost the Spurs their second title, but because he complained publicly about his contract he's been relegated to a status somewhere between role-player and bench scrub.

Pretty much any big the Spurs have had since David Robinson has been minimized by the fanbase, as well as Scola. Lots of folks thought he wouldn't be able to defend or hit a jumpshot and that was why it was okay to let him go.


I remember him choking and sucking ass against the Timberwolves...

[EricB]

Totally agreed...my overall point was a defense of Pop. People wanting to run Pop/RC out of town are like the people living in a penthouse and complaining about no backyard. Some people don't know how good we have it. If these two are replaced you are almost assured of the new tandem being nowhere near as successful.

That said, for the past 3 years or so especially, they have made some serious errors in judgment.


The errors in judgement were moves that looked good on paper but just didn't work out would be my contention.

[EricB]

I remember his agent saying that he needed a deal of 3 yrs 9-10 million. Not the full MLE.


To the media sure.

[SenorSpur]

If no larger trade can be worked out, I bet the Spurs trade RMJ + Mahinmi to Golden State for Raja Bell and cash.

Surely, they couldn't be foolish enough to trade away one of their trade chips to make such a useless trade.

Acquiring Bell would address nothing. He's is getting on in age, has been recently injured, and not quite as accomplished a defender as he once was.

The last thing this team needs is another player on the north side of 30 years old.

God help us all if they do this.

[TDMVPDPOY]

there be no money for him next season anyway if he continues to stay with the spurs,

spurs going to spend on resigning gino and tryin to bring over splitter at any costs

[EricB]

Surely, they couldn't be foolish enough to trade away one of their trade chips to make such a useless trade.

Acquiring Bell would address nothing. He's is getting on in age, has been recently injured, and not quite as accomplished a defender as he once was.

The last thing this team needs is another player on the north side of 30 years old.

God help us all if they do this.


So if this is the only trade offered, you keep both players?

:lol

[Obstructed_View]

I remember him choking and sucking ass against the Timberwolves...

The Spurs played the Timberwolves 4 times when DA was a Spur. He scored 12 points in one of them, which was an overtime loss. In the other three he scored 21, 29 and 30 points. In the 30 point game, he also had 8 rebounds, 3 assists and 2 blocks.

So if that's the best you can come up with, I rest my case.

[EricB]

there be no money for him next season anyway if he continues to stay with the spurs,

spurs going to spend on resigning gino and tryin to bring over splitter at any costs


I agree.

I never saw mason staying beyond this season even if he DID have a great year or even worse year than he's having.

The MLE is going to Splitter no question.

[Sean Cagney]

Derek Anderson has been the victim of more revisionist history from the fans than any player the team's ever had. His injury in the playoffs absolutely cost the Spurs their second title, but because he complained publicly about his contract he's been relegated to a status somewhere between role-player and bench scrub.

Pretty much any big the Spurs have had since David Robinson has been minimized by the fanbase, as well as Scola. Lots of folks thought he wouldn't be able to defend or hit a jumpshot and that was why it was okay to let him go.He got hurt badly in those playoffs didn't he? Came back game 3against LA and by that time we were already DONE and DEAD (We were not going to win a title that year obviously). If he was healthy in the playoffs thats a different story, but he missed alot of games and by the time he came back it was over (Complaining or not).

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

I seem to remember some anti-Scola scuttlebutt in the media before and after the trade, at least that's my hazy memory.

The business of 'he wants to start/he can't play next to Tim with his game/he's demanding the full MLE' can't all have started on message boards.

Damn, how could I forget Scola? He was painted as a greedy bastard by the E-N and Spurs team brass, then went and signed with Houston for like half of what he was supposedly demanding from SA...


Yeah it's called an agent.

LOL, yeah the same agent who negotiated a lesser deal than the supposedly 'outrageous' deal he was demanding from SA...

[Blackjack]

I remember his agent saying that he needed a deal of 3 yrs 9-10 million. Not the full MLE.

The only thing I really remember the agent saying, was that Scola was some kind of "prisoner" of the Spurs -- they were the only reason Luis wasn't in the NBA.

The crazy buyout, while maybe a hindrance in the beginning, seems like something the Spurs pushed to mythical proportions (as to win the PR battle in the print) in order to allow them to pass on a guy they didn't believe fit their need -- the perceived poor rebounding and fit with Tim being the "rationale".

To this day (just a couple of games ago, as a matter of fact) people like Sean and Bill will tell you that Scola's buyout was the only reason he's not a Spur (never mind the fact that he signed for $3M per) . . .

[EricB]

The Spurs played the Timberwolves 4 times when DA was a Spur. He scored 12 points in one of them, which was an overtime loss. In the other three he scored 21, 29 and 30 points. In the 30 point game, he also had 8 rebounds, 3 assists and 2 blocks.

So if that's the best you can come up with, I rest my case.


I apologize, i didn't remember the other games.

[lennyalderette]

You have?

:lol

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

I remember him choking and sucking ass against the Timberwolves...

Methinks you remember wrong.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

BTW, I can't blame Mason. He knows he's not going to get much PT behind Duncan and 'Dice at power forward :lol

[EricB]

Methinks you remember wrong.


I did.

I own up to it.

I still don't think Anderson makes them better than the steamroller that was LA in 2001 however.

To each his own however.

[toki9]

hill has nude pictures and he is still here

Maybe Pop likes those pictures...which may explain the "favorite" player bit...

[Obstructed_View]

I apologize, i didn't remember the other games.

Yeah, we all have a tendency to be so angry from the way he forced the trade that we don't remember what a perfect fit he was with the system. The Spurs needed a slasher and a creator and he was exactly that. I will never forgive Juwan Howard, and I'm still a little annoyed at David for making the Spurs back-burner DA's contract talks.

[timvp]

I believe EricB was thinking about DA in the playoffs against the T'Wolves when he average 11 points for the series on 31.9% shooting. That certainly was a Mason-esque first playoff series as a Spur.

[EricB]

Yeah, we all have a tendency to be so angry from the way he forced the trade that we don't remember what a perfect fit he was with the system. The Spurs needed a slasher and a creator and he was exactly that. I will never forgive Juwan Howard, and I'm still a little annoyed at David for making the Spurs back-burner DA's contract talks.


Yeah he fit in well and played the perfect teammate all year and never seemed to be a "Pay me bitch" kinda guy.

Getting him for a milion dollars in August like that was unreal.

Juwan getting nailed with the beer at the end of the game made the whole atmosphere tense to say the least :lol

[Mel_13]

Antonio Daniels.

Derek Anderson left, but got the post-Spur trashing in the press for being a prima donna.

Buckets (Stephen Jackson), same.

I know I'm missing some too.

So all 2003 or earlier.

Just curious. Did anything come out about any of those players that was not true?

[EricB]

I believe EricB was thinking about DA in the playoffs against the T'Wolves when he average 11 points for the series on 31.9% shooting. That certainly was a Mason-esque first playoff series as a Spur.


Shit who's right?!

:lol

I mean I don't doubt OV's numbers they could've been right, but I could've sworm he laid a pretty good goose egg in that series.

Again, that was 9 years ago and I most likely am wrong.

[objective]

Damn, how could I forget Scola? He was painted as a greedy bastard by the E-N and Spurs team brass, then went and signed with Houston for like half of what he was supposedly demanding from SA...



LOL, yeah the same agent who negotiated a lesser deal than the supposedly 'outrageous' deal he was demanding from SA...

Exactly.

His agent tells the media he needs a 3 year deal worth 9-10 . . . he signs a 3 year deal for 10.

Besides, the 3-9/10 was so well known as his necessary for his signing that a lot of people argued strenuosly and with a straight face that the Spurs shouldn't even give him that kind of deal . . . because it would make him the highest paid 2nd rounder in history.

Seriously. That really happened. That's how polluted the groundwater was from the Spurs. To this day people still believe all the anti-Scola stories.

[lennyalderette]

quit making excuses

spurs are starting to look like they need a new coach


I really hate to agree, but wait! i cant agree just yet but i definitely think its getting there, his recent decisions have been insane, one right after the other, and he's morphing into don nelson and its unacceptable with tim duncan on your team, if your not serious get the hell out.

Enough of the bull shit dog house treatment, strict discipline on the young and naturally talented and the untalented olds get the green light to play whatever position they want and suck at defense!! i mean this isnt the god dang military just because a guy doesnt curl his tail when you walk into the room doesnt mean you ship him out!!!

[scottspurs]

Your either with us or against us.

If he wants out trade him. If a player that wants to "win a championship" as Mason said he does and then he complains about playing time he obviously doesn't know what it takes so let him have his contract year playing for the Nets or whoever while the Spurs do whatever they can to win a championship.

A trade needs to happen. I wouldn't even be mad if nothing of value comes in return, although I believe the FO is smarter than that. If a trade happens everyone wins.

Mason gets his $$$ by showing off his skills for the remainder of the season and the Spurs get a TEAM that wants to win a championship regardless of outcome.

[Obstructed_View]

Shit who's right?!

:lol

I mean I don't doubt OV's numbers they could've been right, but I could've sworm he laid a pretty good goose egg in that series.

Again, that was 9 years ago and I most likely am wrong.

I just dumped the info into the calculator at basketball-reference and that's what it gave me back. Maybe it skipped playoffs or something. Looking it up a second time.

[E-RockWill]

Brewer sucks.

It's starting to look like you suck. :wow

[EricB]

hill has nude pictures and he is still here


Those pictures came out last year in February and he was damn near shipped to the Clippers...

[objective]

Those pictures came out last year in February and he was damn near shipped to the Clippers...

+ benched

[Obstructed_View]

I just dumped the info into the calculator at basketball-reference and that's what it gave me back. Maybe it skipped playoffs or something. Looking it up a second time.

Yeah they had a first round series against Minnesota which they won 3-1. DA scored 16, 16, 12 and 4 points in those games. The 4 point game was the closeout game which they won by 13. He only had 4 shot attempts and was basically invisible offensively.

[lennyalderette]

aj is avaible
right now he would be better then pop and I am not an aj fan

i think either PJ or mike budenholzer will do fine

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

So all 2003 or earlier.

Just curious. Did anything come out about any of those players that was not true?

Scola? (2007)

I don't think any of those stories were either confirmed or denied, no one has the balls in SA to challenge the Spurs on it. Nationally, the press just didn't care.

[EricB]

2000–01 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2000%E2%80%9301_NBA_season) San Antonio (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Antonio_Spurs) 7 7 27.7 .262 .273 .762 2.7 2.4 .4 .0 7.7


Thats Derek Anderson's playoff numbers from 2001....

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

I did.

I own up to it.

I still don't think Anderson makes them better than the steamroller that was LA in 2001 however.

To each his own however.

Where did I ever say he would have made the difference versus LA?

[timvp]

Shit who's right?!

:lol

I mean I don't doubt OV's numbers they could've been right, but I could've sworm he laid a pretty good goose egg in that series.

Again, that was 9 years ago and I most likely am wrong.

I believe he quoted DA's regular season numbers against the T'Wolves. In the playoffs, DA was a massive disappointment in that first round series. By the final game, DA was worthless and Antonio Daniels was the team's shooting guard.

DA was pretty damn good in that 2001 regular season. He helped the Spurs put up some of their best regular season stats in history. Come playoff time though, he was a real disappointment and the main reason why DA wasn't re-signed, IMO.

[objective]

did they get Charles Smith back for DA as well as Steve Smith?

[EricB]

I believe he quoted DA's regular season numbers against the T'Wolves. In the playoffs, DA was a massive disappointment in that first round series. By the final game, DA was worthless and Antonio Daniels was the team's shooting guard.

DA was pretty damn good in that 2001 regular season. He helped the Spurs put up some of their best regular season stats in history. Come playoff time though, he was a real disappointment and the main reason why DA wasn't re-signed, IMO.


Yeah just posted his playoff numbers above.

He made Cliff Robinson look like John Paxson.

[EricB]

Where did I ever say he would have made the difference versus LA?


No where, and that was my opinion.

[EricB]

did they get Charles Smith back for DA as well as Steve Smith?


Yeah the "Secret weapon" :lmao

[itzsoweezee]

if only playoff performance really dictated playing time . . . boner would be permanently glued to the bench.

i think any non-homer knows that popovich doesn't award playing time based on ability or past performance.

[Marcus Bryant]

MaseMoney
MoneyMase (http://twitter.com/MoneyMase)

Fitting name.

GTFO.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

BTW on the coaching talk... I don't think Pop needs to go. But he's been decidedly Don Nelson/Larry Brownesque since P.J. left the bench for other opportunities. I don't know for sure but there seems to be a strong correlation between Pop's stupidity in strategy and rotations with PJ leaving (i.e., no sanity check for Pop's coaching decisions).

[objective]

I thought he was 'Spider-Man'?

[Bartleby]

Mason's number are down across the board this season and he didn't do himself any favors in the playoffs last year when he shot only 0.375% from the field and 0.368% from 3pt. range (and only three free throws).

[EricB]

if only playoff performance really dictated playing time . . . boner would be permanently glued to the bench.

i think any non-homer knows that popovich doesn't award playing time based on ability or past performance.

Bonner plays now because he plays well in the regular season.

Totally different example.

[duncan228]

Mason's agent: 'It's not a trade demand' (http://blogs.mysanantonio.com/weblogs/courtside/2010/02/masons-agent-it.html)
By Jeff McDonald

Mark Bartelstein, the agent for Spurs guard Roger Mason Jr., has clarified comments about Mason's desire to be traded (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=ArDs7M94GcTHNEZDzZg5tNu8vLYF?slug=ys-masonspurs021510&prov=yhoo&type=lgns) to a team that could offer more playing time.

"It's not a trade demand," Bartelstein told the Express-News on Monday night. "It's simply, if there's an answer to the problem of not enough minutes, and everybody can come out good, they should look at that. That's all that's going on."

Bartelstein said Mason was "happy playing for (Gregg Popovich) and San Antonio has been good to him."

"It's just that players like to play," Bartelstein said.

Bartelstein insisted Mason would be comfortable finishing the season with the Spurs, should a suitable trading partner not be found.

"One of the things I really enjoy about working with the Spurs is you can have conversations like this, where you can find something that is good for everyone," Bartelstein said. "They really try to do the right thing by players."

[timvp]

As long as we are talking about the past, the Spurs not giving DA a contract turned out to be one of the best moves this FO ever did. 2001 was his absolute peak and he was pretty damn horrible the rest of his career. The Spurs had to suffer through 2002 but not having DA's bloated contract on the books was a big help ... not to mention it allowed room for Manu to step in and play right away.

At the time I thought letting DA go and getting so little in return was a mistake. But the FO turned out to be 100% right.

[SenorSpur]

I figured Mason was in some trouble after that Sacramento game, where he got stripped by Evans in the waning minutes of the 4th. Pop benched him immediately, a la Beno. I could be wrong, but I don't recall him getting any time the next game versus Portland.

On one hand, I can understand Mason wanting more playing time. After all, he's in a contract year. Even though he was a newcomer to the team, his performances last year certainly warranted it. It's unfortunate that Pop tried, unsuccessfully, to utilize him in ways that his talent wasn't suited for (i.e. backup PG).

On the other hand, RMJ it's not like he doesn't have flaws. He's still a horrible defender, can't get to the rim, and his effectiveness waned when opposing teams defending him against the 3 pt line.

Mason, like a lot of players, probably has an overly-inflated opinion of his own value. Based on how this team is going to look next year, I'd say he would've been valuable to keep, but not at an inflated price and certainly not if Pop isn't going to play him consistent minutes. Still, there's no way that Mason should be behind Finley in the rotation, but in Pop's world grudges are often held.

All that said, this certainly means a trade is eminent, which, if the right move is made, will be a good thing for all. I hope the Spurs smartly pounce on the Thomas/Salmons trade and use the expiring contracts of Bonner/FinleyMason's expiring contracts to get it done.

Good Luck Mase. We hardly knew ya.

[SenorSpur]

Mason's agent: 'It's not a trade demand' (http://blogs.mysanantonio.com/weblogs/courtside/2010/02/masons-agent-it.html)
By Jeff McDonald

Mark Bartelstein, the agent for Spurs guard Roger Mason Jr., has clarified comments about Mason's desire to be traded (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=ArDs7M94GcTHNEZDzZg5tNu8vLYF?slug=ys-masonspurs021510&prov=yhoo&type=lgns) to a team that could offer more playing time.

"It's not a trade demand," Bartelstein told the Express-News on Monday night. "It's simply, if there's an answer to the problem of not enough minutes, and everybody can come out good, they should look at that. That's all that's going on."

Bartelstein said Mason was "happy playing for (Gregg Popovich) and San Antonio has been good to him."

"It's just that players like to play," Bartelstein said.

Bartelstein insisted Mason would be comfortable finishing the season with the Spurs, should a suitable trading partner not be found.

"One of the things I really enjoy about working with the Spurs is you can have conversations like this, where you can find something that is good for everyone," Bartelstein said. "They really try to do the right thing by players."

Too late to clean it up now. The die has been cast.

[itzsoweezee]

Bonner plays now because he plays well in the regular season.

Totally different example.

oh, so bonner's not going to get playing time in the playoffs? that is genius coaching. play guys that aren't going to play when it counts. yeah right. we both know bonner is going to get major minutes when the playoffs come around. popovich is just full of shit.

[Ice009]

LOL is this thread a waste of time after reading that?

Marcus Bryant really piling it on.

[EricB]

I thought he was 'Spider-Man'?


People from the board here in 2001 2002 will remember that...

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Mason's number are down across the board this season and he didn't do himself any favors in the playoffs last year when he shot only 0.375% from the field and 0.368% from 3pt. range (and only three free throws).

Mason played great for us last year until Pop channeled Larry Brown and benched Hill for being a rookie and tried to turn a solid SG in Mason into his backup PG for the stretch run and post-season.

Roger has never been the same since. I blame his deteriorating play last year solely on Pop for being a dumbass with how he handled the Hill/Mason situation.

[EricB]

As long as we are talking about the past, the Spurs not giving DA a contract turned out to be one of the best moves this FO ever did. 2001 was his absolute peak and he was pretty damn horrible the rest of his career. The Spurs had to suffer through 2002 but not having DA's bloated contract on the books was a big help ... not to mention it allowed room for Manu to step in and play right away.

At the time I thought letting DA go and getting so little in return was a mistake. But the FO turned out to be 100% right.

Then trading AD to make room for Manu ended up being a winner too...

[Mel_13]

Scola? (2007)

I don't think any of those stories were either confirmed or denied, no one has the balls in SA to challenge the Spurs on it. Nationally, the press just didn't care.

OK.

When I read these comments about how the Spurs treated this or that player poorly, I always come back to the same question.

Where are stories/interviews from former players complaining about their time with the team or their interactions with management? There have been plenty of public expressions from disgruntled athletes in all professional sports, but the only former Spur I can recall making such complaints after the fact is Beno.

It's entirely possible there have been others, but I don't recall any. It seems to me that if a player was the subject of false accusations or rumors, they would comment publicly on that.

[scottspurs]

Mason's agent: 'It's not a trade demand' (http://blogs.mysanantonio.com/weblogs/courtside/2010/02/masons-agent-it.html)
By Jeff McDonald

Mark Bartelstein, the agent for Spurs guard Roger Mason Jr., has clarified comments about Mason's desire to be traded (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=ArDs7M94GcTHNEZDzZg5tNu8vLYF?slug=ys-masonspurs021510&prov=yhoo&type=lgns) to a team that could offer more playing time.

"It's not a trade demand," Bartelstein told the Express-News on Monday night. "It's simply, if there's an answer to the problem of not enough minutes, and everybody can come out good, they should look at that. That's all that's going on."

Bartelstein said Mason was "happy playing for (Gregg Popovich) and San Antonio has been good to him."

"It's just that players like to play," Bartelstein said.

Bartelstein insisted Mason would be comfortable finishing the season with the Spurs, should a suitable trading partner not be found.

"One of the things I really enjoy about working with the Spurs is you can have conversations like this, where you can find something that is good for everyone," Bartelstein said. "They really try to do the right thing by players."

The bottom line is he is whining and he was brought in to be role player and serve his role as a shooter. This team, playing as they are right now, doesn't have room for crying.

Mason must be traded.

[EricB]

Mason played great for us last year until Pop channeled Larry Brown and benched Hill for being a rookie and tried to turn a solid SG in Mason into his backup PG for the stretch run and post-season.

Roger has never been the same since. I blame his deteriorating play last year solely on Pop for being a dumbass with how he handled the Hill/Mason situation.

Mason holds zero blame in his bad play?

Wow thats amazing..

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

I don't mind the decision made on DA, though one thinks the Spurs should have at least been able to get a draft pick or some cash out of the situation.

Anderson was held up more as example of the post-Spur, Spurs organization led media crucifixion of players leaving the organization via trade or free agency.

[EricB]

I don't mind the decision made on DA, though one thinks the Spurs should have at least been able to get a draft pick or some cash out of the situation.

Anderson was held up more as example of the post-Spur, Spurs organization led media crucifixion of players leaving the organization via trade or free agency.


Yeah the whole thing about him being greedy and all that was totally unfounded.
Yeah.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

OK.

When I read these comments about how the Spurs treated this or that player poorly, I always come back to the same question.

Where are stories/interviews from former players complaining about their time with the team or their interactions with management? There have been plenty of public expressions from disgruntled athletes in all professional sports, but the only former Spur I can recall making such complaints after the fact is Beno.

It's entirely possible there have been others, but I don't recall any. It seems to me that if a player was the subject of false accusations or rumors, they would comment publicly on that.

With the exception of Scola, the majority of players who got the treatment either got a ring out of the situation, or got a ring and a fat deal somewhere else and were trashed after signing said fat deal.

At that point, why bitch? Like I said - the only place the player was trashed was in the SA media and the national press could have given a damn.

Just typical Spurs organization/SA Excuse for News hometown media propaganda for jettisoning one of the favorite sons of the fans.

Scola did speak up, but his actions, the deal he signed with Htown, and his subsequent play as a Rocket have said more than any press soundbite ever could.

[objective]

All I remember about DA was Greg Matsun camped outside his house, sitting on a 3-foot high stone wall waiting to get an interview at the Anderson estate.

[Bartleby]

All I remember about DA was Greg Matsun camped outside his house, sitting on a 3-foot high stone waiting to get an interview at the Anderson estate.

I remember DA making a stink about how the Spurs weren't respecting him.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Mason holds zero blame in his bad play?

Wow thats amazing..

Um, if you were paying attention last year, he was a different player from the day he was forced to play PG and told it would be his primary position the rest of the season.

Some guys just aren't wired where they can play one position for 15-20 years of their lives and then change gears the last two months of the season/playoffs for a championship contender. Mase is one of them.

If you can't comprehend that, I don't know what to say. Maybe if you'd have played sports, you'd understand. It takes time to adjust. I mean damn - guys like you have no problems defending new players on the team due to the complexities of the team's playbook and giving them a free pass for an entire season.

Mason came on, got 'it' at the shooting guard position, but then was thrown to the PG wolves with little time to adapt. Gimme a f'in break...

[silverblk mystix]

I think this thread is about Mason...
Mason never struck me as an unintelligent player, in fact he seems like a very smart guy.
When he arrived...everyone here loved him...tried to find him a nickname,praised his character,etc...

I always thought he was ---Spur material---

this latest development got me to thinking....

what IS going on behind closed doors...what happened with Bowen last season?...

what exactly is going on with team chemistry...

where DOES pop stand with his team---as far as RESPECT?

are the players losing faith?...

if I worked my ass off and Finley started over me to start the season...how would I feel?

Maybe Mason saw the writing on the wall and decided---what's the point? Pop is in control of this ship and pop would rather have the whole ship sink than actually give up control.

Maybe Pop would rather see the whole franchise go down the drain before admitting that maybe HE is the problem.

I once thought Pop was the BEST coach in the league...but he has really sucked this season---and last season.

Maybe Mason knows firsthand just how bad things have become.

[Mel_13]

Mason played great for us last year until Pop channeled Larry Brown and benched Hill for being a rookie and tried to turn a solid SG in Mason into his backup PG for the stretch run and post-season.

Roger has never been the same since. I blame his deteriorating play last year solely on Pop for being a dumbass with how he handled the Hill/Mason situation.

Mason's numbers had declined and hit bottom before he picked up the backup PG duties. Look up his month-by-month splits.

[clubalien]

Pop screwed the guy up. Mason has never been anything more than a shooter. That's obvious. But it wasn't obvious to Pop, who tried to make him a point guard, and in so doing, messed up his rhythm and consequently, his shot.

Mason's agent must be extremely angry if he went to the press with this. He has to know this "announcement" makes a deal that much more difficult to do, but he did it anyway - probably to spite Popovich.

I think this situation is indicative of a far greater problem the Spurs have - very few NBA guys like playing for Pop. Tim is very unusual. Tim is also very disciplined, no nonsense, and extremely good. He also is a great defender. But if you are like 95% of the NBA and you are not all of those things, you're going to have a hard time playing for Pop.

Add Mason to the list of guys Pop has ruined.
pop is clearly the problem with the spurs. he should have been fired a long time ago. Spurs won in spite of pop not because. take phil away from lakers and make him spurs coach and the spurs would beat the lakers during the lakers vs spurs era.

We see what losing pop's assistant coaches causes.

[EricB]

Um, if you were paying attention last year, he was a different player from the day he was forced to play PG and told it would be his primary position the rest of the season.

Some guys just aren't wired where they can play one position for 15-20 years of their lives and then change gears the last two months of the season/playoffs for a championship contender. Mase is one of them.

If you can't comprehend that, I don't know what to say. Maybe if you'd have played sports, you'd understand. It takes time to adjust. I mean damn - guys like you have no problems defending new players on the team due to the complexities of the team's playbook and giving them a free pass for an entire season.

Mason came on, got 'it' at the shooting guard position, but then was thrown to the PG wolves with little time to adapt. Gimme a f'in break...



So that time he played PG in Washington doesn't count as a position he's never played in his entire life?

Just curious.

[objective]

I remember DA making a stink about how the Spurs weren't respecting him.

I think the catchphrase with DA was 'loyalty'

[EricB]

I think the catchphrase with DA was 'loyalty'


Even made a clothing line named after it...

[ElNono]

Mason's agent: 'It's not a trade demand' (http://blogs.mysanantonio.com/weblogs/courtside/2010/02/masons-agent-it.html)
By Jeff McDonald

Mark Bartelstein, the agent for Spurs guard Roger Mason Jr., has clarified comments about Mason's desire to be traded (http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=ArDs7M94GcTHNEZDzZg5tNu8vLYF?slug=ys-masonspurs021510&prov=yhoo&type=lgns) to a team that could offer more playing time.

"It's not a trade demand," Bartelstein told the Express-News on Monday night. "It's simply, if there's an answer to the problem of not enough minutes, and everybody can come out good, they should look at that. That's all that's going on."

Bartelstein said Mason was "happy playing for (Gregg Popovich) and San Antonio has been good to him."

"It's just that players like to play," Bartelstein said.

Bartelstein insisted Mason would be comfortable finishing the season with the Spurs, should a suitable trading partner not be found.

"One of the things I really enjoy about working with the Spurs is you can have conversations like this, where you can find something that is good for everyone," Bartelstein said. "They really try to do the right thing by players."

IOW... "Roger wants to play more minutes. Spurs are cool and all, but I need to showcase my client more"...

[objective]

So that time he played PG in Washington doesn't count as a position he's never played in his entire life?

Just curious.

My memory is that he played some point in Washington as well

[EricB]

Mason's numbers had declined and hit bottom before he picked up the backup PG duties. Look up his month-by-month splits.


Maybe Pop started having heart to heart talks with him at that time, who knows.

[EricB]

My memory is that he played some point in Washington as well


Him playing point for an injured Arenas and pretty much getting thrown into the fire was what got him that amount of minutes that season in Washington.

[EricB]

IOW... "Roger wants to play more minutes. Spurs are cool and all, but I need to showcase my client more"...

To me it reads, Were not demanding a trade we love the Spurs, please don't say that were demanding a trade even though we are.

Saving face statements IMO.

[ElNono]

To me it reads, Were not demanding a trade we love the Spurs, please don't say that were demanding a trade even though we are.

Saving face statements IMO.

Exactly. The whole 'if there's an answer to the problem of not enough minutes' is like :lol

[scottspurs]

I think this thread is about Mason...
Mason never struck me as an unintelligent player, in fact he seems like a very smart guy.
When he arrived...everyone here loved him...tried to find him a nickname,praised his character,etc...

I always thought he was ---Spur material---

this latest development got me to thinking....

what IS going on behind closed doors...what happened with Bowen last season?...

what exactly is going on with team chemistry...

where DOES pop stand with his team---as far as RESPECT?

are the players losing faith?...

if I worked my ass off and Finley started over me to start the season...how would I feel?

Maybe Mason saw the writing on the wall and decided---what's the point? Pop is in control of this ship and pop would rather have the whole ship sink than actually give up control.

Maybe Pop would rather see the whole franchise go down the drain before admitting that maybe HE is the problem.

I once thought Pop was the BEST coach in the league...but he has really sucked this season---and last season.

Maybe Mason knows firsthand just how bad things have become.

I think we all wonder what happened with Bruce, but the truth probably is he had nothing left and Pop knew that while Bruce (deservingly so) refused to believe that.

As far as Mason goes we must trade him. Bruce would never of pulled a stunt like this.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

So all 2003 or earlier.

Just curious. Did anything come out about any of those players that was not true?

Oh yeah, and I forgot the biggest one of all - Bowen. He basically had a falling out with Pop at the end of last year over Finley getting all the run and Bowen being benched.

Pop trashed him within the last two weeks to the press, as well.

You think Bruce is a bad person too?

[EricB]

Exactly. The whole 'if there's an answer to the problem of not enough minutes' is like :lol


Yeah were not getting many minutes with said team thats had said player on the block since last February, lets demand a trade!

Agents are geniuses.

[EricB]

Oh yeah, and I forgot the biggest one of all - Bowen. He basically had a falling out with Pop at the end of last year over Finley getting all the run and Bowen being benched.

Pop trashed him within the last two weeks to the press, as well.

You think Bruce is a bad person too?



Go there, please....

[slayermin]

Mason is the second best clutch shooter on the Spurs. It would be a loss. But I still think our need is at backup point guard. Without Mason, that pretty much gives Hill all the minutes he wants at the two. We need a playmaking point guard who can shoot. Someone who doesn't turn the ball over but is able to create for slashers.

I still don't think we need Thomas. I would like to see Ian or even Theo get some minutes rather than trade for Thomas.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

So that time he played PG in Washington doesn't count as a position he's never played in his entire life?

Just curious.

He stepped into Gilbert's spot in the starting lineup. Washington used Butler as a "point" forward and had Mason run as a shooting guard.

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Go there, please....

Where do you want me to go? It was documented ad nauseum in the 'Pop: Bowen isn't the answer' discussion at some point in the last two weeks.

[itzsoweezee]

I think we all wonder what happened with Bruce, but the truth probably is he had nothing left and Pop knew that while Bruce (deservingly so) refused to believe that.



What a completely asinine comment. You watched the Spurs last season and honestly believe Finley had more to offer than Bowen? Just admit that Popovich does a lot of stupid petty shit that makes no sense. You guys bend over backwards to provide logic to his completely nonsensical moves.

[ShoogarBear]

So that time he played PG in Washington doesn't count as a position he's never played in his entire life?

Just curious.

When Mason was in DC and Arenas was injured, Antonio Daniels was the point guard, and Caron Butler ran point forward. Mason never ran the offense for any significant of time.

[EricB]

Mason is the second best clutch shooter on the Spurs. It would be a loss. But I still think our need is at backup point guard. Without Mason, that pretty much gives Hill all the minutes he wants at the two. We need a playmaking point guard who can shoot. Someone who doesn't turn the ball over but is able to create for slashers.

I still don't think we need Thomas. I would like to see Ian or even Theo get some minutes rather than trade for Thomas.

Yeah those are LITERALLY very hard to find.

If they could get the Tyrus Thomas from the playoffs against the Celtics, I'd be hard pressed to pass.

[Mel_13]

Oh yeah, and I forgot the biggest one of all - Bowen. He basically had a falling out with Pop at the end of last year over Finley getting all the run and Bowen being benched.

Pop trashed him within the last two weeks to the press, as well.

You think Bruce is a bad person too?

I think Bruce is a great Spur and a fine person. I didn't take Pop's recent comments as bashing Bruce.

[EricB]

When Mason was in DC and Arenas was injured, Antonio Daniels was the point guard, and Caron Butler ran point forward. Mason never ran the offense for any significant of time.


The Washington Post article after he signed in SA was wrong then...

[EricB]

I think Bruce is a great Spur and a fine person. I didn't take Pop's recent comments as bashing Bruce.


Him saying "Bruce Bowen isn't the answer to our defensive woes" is of course bashing him.

Come on.

[ShoogarBear]

The Washington Post article after he signed in SA was wrong then...

Somebody had to bring the ball up when AD sat. That didn't make him a point guard. He averaged 1.7 assists in 21 minutes.

I guess in a world where people consider George Hill a point guard, maybe he could be called one, too.

[objective]

Him saying "Bruce Bowen isn't the answer to our defensive woes" is of course bashing him.

Come on.

I think what he might be talking about was Pop's assertion that if Bruce could still play someone would have signed him. It seemed to completely reject the idea that Bruce could have retired of his own free will.

[Mel_13]

Him saying "Bruce Bowen isn't the answer to our defensive woes" is of course bashing him.

Come on.

We disagree.

Even if the Spurs were able to somehow re-acquire a 2005 version of Bowen, Popovich said, it would make only a small dent in this team's defensive woes.

“Bruce was a great defender, but it's not just one guy that makes it,” Popovich said. “There's something called team defense, where five guys have to react appropriately. We just haven't reacted well.”

I don't read that as bashing Bruce in any way. I read that as an indictment of the current team, not a criticism of Bruce. If you hold a different view, that's fine. I certainly don't care to debate the issue.

[EricB]

Somebody had to bring the ball up when AD sat. That didn't make him a point guard. He averaged 1.7 assists in 21 minutes.

I guess in a world where people consider George Hill a point guard, maybe he could be called one, too.

The writer referred to him IIRC i probably don't, that he ran the point outside of AD when GA when down.

[EricB]

We disagree.

Even if the Spurs were able to somehow re-acquire a 2005 version of Bowen, Popovich said, it would make only a small dent in this team's defensive woes.

“Bruce was a great defender, but it's not just one guy that makes it,” Popovich said. “There's something called team defense, where five guys have to react appropriately. We just haven't reacted well.”

I don't read that as bashing Bruce in any way. I read that as an indictment of the current team, not a criticism of Bruce. If you hold a different view, that's fine. I certainly don't care to debate the issue.


I apologize, I meant that in complete sarcasm.

I agree 100% with you.

[ElNono]

I think what he might be talking about was Pop's assertion that if Bruce could still play someone would have signed him. It seemed to completely reject the idea that Bruce could have retired of his own free will.

This.

Plus Pop couldn't possibly say that with a straight face when he trots out Finley's skeleton on a nightly basis.

[Mel_13]

I apologize, I meant that in complete sarcasm.

I agree 100% with you.

Not the first time my sarcasm detector failed.

[EricB]

I think what he might be talking about was Pop's assertion that if Bruce could still play someone would have signed him. It seemed to completely reject the idea that Bruce could have retired of his own free will.

possibly.

[slayermin]

Yeah those are LITERALLY very hard to find.

If they could get the Tyrus Thomas from the playoffs against the Celtics, I'd be hard pressed to pass.

I'm thinking someone like Luke Ridnour, Kirk Hinrich type. I know Hinrich makes a ton of money and the Bucks probably wouldn't trade Ridnour. But there is a void at backup point. I love Hill and I hope he proves me wrong.

If RC and Pop trade for Thomas, cool. I'm with this team to the bitter end.

[EricB]

Not the first time my sarcasm detector failed.


No quite OK, I didn't do a good job conveying sarcasm :lol

[EricB]

I'm thinking someone like Luke Ridnour, Kirk Hinrich type. I know Hinrich makes a ton of money and the Bucks probably wouldn't trade Ridnour. But there is a void at backup point. I love Hill and I hope he proves me wrong.

If RC and Pop trade for Thomas, cool. I'm with this team to the bitter end.

Damn Luke Ridnour would be great as a backup PG.

He'd just be a horrible defender.

HEY He fits right in! :lol

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Him saying "Bruce Bowen isn't the answer to our defensive woes" is of course bashing him.

Come on.


Um, as was discussed in the other thread, it wasn't that. It was Pop's comment that if he could still play someone would have signed him.

Yep, nothing insulting about that. Nevermind the fact that other teams were on record as wanting him, but Bruce instead chose to retire.

And I guess you ignored the part of that thread where LJ shed some light on the Pop-Bowen relationship.

But care on with the defense of Pop, it's what you do best on this site.

[Mark in Austin]

I don't think Mason's failure against the Mavs was a choke -- as in he couldn't handle the pressure mentally.

Roger just happened to be a very limited player playing on a beat up team, which in turn allowed their opponent to completely neutralize his one real strength by forcing him into a role he was incapable of playing -- namely taking him off the three-point line and making him create off the dribble offensively (rendering him baffled and ineffective).

If you've got a dominant, healthy Tim and Manu that series, I'm sure Mason would have acquitted himself much better . . .

I have no problem with the Spurs letting him go or Roger and his agent even advocating for a trade -- it's in both parties best interest, imo. The Spurs need a more well-rounded player than Mason and Roger deserves the opportunity to play for his next contract -- it clearly won't be with the Spurs.

well said.

[EricB]

Um, as was discussed in the other thread, it wasn't that. It was Pop's comment that if he could still play someone would have signed him.

Yep, nothing insulting about that. Nevermind the fact that other teams were on record as wanting him, but Bruce instead chose to retire.

And I guess you ignored the part of that thread where LJ shed some light on the Pop-Bowen relationship.

But care on with the defense of Pop, it's what you do best on this site.


Keep on with the Pop bashing its what your laughed at when your not around and what you do best.

[SenorSpur]

Don't see why so many are trying to defend Pop on this. It's not as if he's above being an asshole at times.

[Obstructed_View]

As long as we are talking about the past, the Spurs not giving DA a contract turned out to be one of the best moves this FO ever did. 2001 was his absolute peak and he was pretty damn horrible the rest of his career. The Spurs had to suffer through 2002 but not having DA's bloated contract on the books was a big help ... not to mention it allowed room for Manu to step in and play right away.

At the time I thought letting DA go and getting so little in return was a mistake. But the FO turned out to be 100% right.

We're talking about the past, not about hindsight. If you fall out of a moving car before it happens to be hit by a meteor, it doesn't suddenly make you smart, it just makes you lucky.

[Blackjack]

And fuckin' awesome.

[Mel_13]

We're talking about the past, not about hindsight. If you fall out of a moving car before it happens to be hit by a meteor, it doesn't suddenly make you smart, it just makes you lucky.

Much as having RJ turn into a terrible disappointment doesn't make the FO stupid for making the trade, just unlucky.

[EricB]

And fuckin' awesome.

:lmao

[Obstructed_View]

Him playing point for an injured Arenas and pretty much getting thrown into the fire was what got him that amount of minutes that season in Washington.

Mason did a really good job IIRC (and no telling with my memory), but I really have a hard time agreeing that stepping in for Gilbert Arenas somehow constitutes running the point. Mason's shown that his strength is shooting off his own dribble. Getting Arenas' minutes fits his game like a glove. Getting Tony Parker's minutes and being expected to penetrate, draw fouls and get the ball to Parker and Manu is not remotely the same thing.

[Amuseddaysleeper]

And fuckin' awesome.

:lol

[Chieflion]

Much as having RJ turn into a terrible disappointment doesn't make the FO stupid for making the trade, just unlucky.
No. It is just the Spurs getting the ultimate ass-kicking by the Bucks again.

[Obstructed_View]

Much as having RJ turn into a terrible disappointment doesn't make the FO stupid for making the trade, just unlucky.

Very true. Although a point could be made that expecting him to turn into a defender that could take Bowen's assignments was at very least unrealistic. It's still not too late for RJ, and there's not anybody on this team that couldn't benefit from some urgency. I'm still hoping that the Denver game was a springboard.

[EricB]

Very true. Although a point could be made that expecting him to turn into a defender that could take Bowen's assignments was at very least unrealistic. It's still not too late for RJ, and there's not anybody on this team that couldn't benefit from some urgency. I'm still hoping that the Denver game was a springboard.


Unrealistic, but, with his athleticism, you thought it could be done.

[EricB]

No. It is just the Spurs getting the ultimate ass-kicking by the Bucks again.


??

Trading away a 14 point a game guy for Kurt Thomas was a good trade?

Yeah ok.

[Obstructed_View]

Unrealistic, but, with his athleticism, you thought it could be done.

Losing a defender like Bowen, the options were pretty sparse. One had to hope that his better offense would help offset the defense. Again, it's still not too late for him to turn it around, so in that sense, I still think it could be done.

[timvp]

We're talking about the past, not about hindsight. If you fall out of a moving car before it happens to be hit by a meteor, it doesn't suddenly make you smart, it just makes you lucky.

At the time, the Spurs questioned DA's durability and his work ethic. Turned out they were right.

More than blind luck.

[Chieflion]

??

Trading away a 14 point a game guy for Kurt Thomas was a good trade?

Yeah ok.
It was sarcasm. The Spurs did the right thing at that time. The Bucks got what they want and they do not regret it. And a little play on the Bucks somehow beating the Spurs in regular season games.

[EricB]

Losing a defender like Bowen, the options were pretty sparse. One had to hope that his better offense would help offset the defense. Again, it's still not too late for him to turn it around, so in that sense, I still think it could be done.


Yeah while Bowen played IIURC the threads about the "Bowen replacement" were infinite with guys that were barely NBA level and everyone from you me TIMVP Kori and everyone tried to explain, when Bruce retires, it will be a HUGE hole to fill.

Its like everyone is stating that now and were doing one big no fucking duh.

[Mel_13]

Losing a defender like Bowen, the options were pretty sparse. One had to hope that his better offense would help offset the defense. Again, it's still not too late for him to turn it around, so in that sense, I still think it could be done.

This sums it up well.

Even if the defense was average, the reasonable expectation was that he would be a reliable 3rd/4th option on the offense. Since we may never be able to trade him, let's hope for steady improvement during his tenure with the team. This may not be the team we want, but it is the team we have.

[objective]

At the time, the Spurs questioned DA's durability and his work ethic. Turned out they were right.

More than blind luck.

I think they also questioned his loyalty. :lol

[Russ]

No. It is just the Spurs getting the ultimate ass-kicking by the Bucks again.

Ever since the Paul Pressey trade . . .

[EricB]

Ever since the Paul Pressey trade . . .


DAMNT!

Don't remind me of trading Brickowski for that stiff....

[Mr. Body]

Pop screwed things up with Mason. He's the extra scorer we needed, but got in the doghouse.

[Blackjack]

Frank Brickowski ... I loved that dude. :lol

I was watching the Legends Brunch the other day and I couldn't help but be reminded of some of our stellar big men from back in the day (Charles Smith was there -- I'm still pissed how the media lead me to believe they were acquiring Oakley).

[EricB]

Frank Brickowski ... I loved that dude. :lol

I was watching the Legends Brunch the other day and I couldn't help but be reminded of some of our stellar big men from back in the day (Charles Smith was there -- I'm still pissed how the media lead me to believe they were acquiring Oakley).


Yeah but still, they got him for JR Reid and Brad freaking Lohaus....

Although Charles Smith getting pissed at Bob Hill and turning over the gatorade Table though cause his knees wouldn't let him play anymore is funny to think about kinda...

[Blackjack]

The dude's held up well. He could pass for his mid-thirties.

I was just absolutely jacked for Oakley, especially given the makeup of the team, and to end up with Smith was a huge disappointment -- to say nothing of the contract and injuries.

[objective]

Yeah but still, they got him for JR Reid and Brad freaking Lohaus....

Although Charles Smith getting pissed at Bob Hill and turning over the gatorade Table though cause his knees wouldn't let him play anymore is funny to think about kinda...

+ a first rounder iirc

[EricB]

The dude's held up well. He could pass for his mid-thirties.

I was just absolutely jacked for Oakley, especially given the makeup of the team, and to end up with Smith was a huge disappointment -- to say nothing of the contract and injuries.

Yeah Charles Oakley.

Not gonna go there.

Another Message Board legend story :lol

[Aggie Hoopsfan]

Keep on with the Pop bashing its what your laughed at when your not around and what you do best.

Cute comeback. Who is laughing at me when I'm not around? Besides you and all of CrustyGarza's nutriders who are like 15 and don't know shit about basketball?

I mean, really, is that all you got? I guess I shouldn't have to ask that. All you've ever been good at on this site is petty, third grade comebacks because you can never talk x's and o's or personnel, unless it's you quoting Pop or some stupid shit like that.

[hsxvvd]

I posted this in the trade speculation thread, but worth discussing here also...
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yj5mug8

[EricB]

Cute comeback. Who is laughing at me when I'm not around? Besides you and all of CrustyGarza's nutriders who are like 15 and don't know shit about basketball?

I mean, really, is that all you got? I guess I shouldn't have to ask that. All you've ever been good at on this site is petty, third grade comebacks because you can never talk x's and o's or personnel, unless it's you quoting Pop or some stupid shit like that.


What no "stupid carny" insult or anything?


Just like 2005.

Predictable :lol

Who laughs at you? Dude, seriously, you should hang around more...

[pad300]

Yeah while Bowen played IIURC the threads about the "Bowen replacement" were infinite with guys that were barely NBA level and everyone from you me TIMVP Kori and everyone tried to explain, when Bruce retires, it will be a HUGE hole to fill.

Its like everyone is stating that now and were doing one big no fucking duh.

Yeah, while the trade itself wasn't bad, signing Bogans instead of re-signing Bruce was just dumb-ass stupidity.

[koriwhat]

Cute comeback. Who is laughing at me when I'm not around? Besides you and all of CrustyGarza's nutriders who are like 15 and don't know shit about basketball?

I mean, really, is that all you got? I guess I shouldn't have to ask that. All you've ever been good at on this site is petty, third grade comebacks because you can never talk x's and o's or personnel, unless it's you quoting Pop or some stupid shit like that.

:toast

[EricB]

Yeah, while the trade itself wasn't bad, signing Bogans instead of re-signing Bruce was just dumb-ass stupidity.

In hindsight it sure was.

[jjktkk]

Yeah, while the trade itself wasn't bad, signing Bogans instead of re-signing Bruce was just dumb-ass stupidity.

Bruce Bowen is thru as not just a Spur, but as a NBA player. Hes lost a step and cannot compete athletically, due to age. Why do you think hes not playing and working as a ESPN basketball analyst? You need to move on like Bruce did.

[Booharv]

Some of these guys overvalue themselves. Roger Mason is nothing more than an erratic three pointer shooter with shoddy defense. He's had a couple of good games here and there but nothing that would warrant him getting big minutes. The coming of age for GHill as the 2 guard really pushed Mason farther into Pop's dog house. So long 'Money Mase'.

:tu

Hopefully they trade him to a team where he can fulfill his potential and win the 3 point shootout at All-Star weekend. That's really the only real preventing him from being Craig Hodges at this point.

[Obstructed_View]

Yeah while Bowen played IIURC the threads about the "Bowen replacement" were infinite with guys that were barely NBA level and everyone from you me TIMVP Kori and everyone tried to explain, when Bruce retires, it will be a HUGE hole to fill.

Its like everyone is stating that now and were doing one big no fucking duh.

I've been in a number of discussions with people defending the FO's attempts to get a Bowen replacement in here, and people have a hard time realizing just how few of those exist. Jefferson was at the top of a short list of guys who, in the right situation, MIGHT be able to help.

I'm still on record saying that a combination of Hill, Hairston and Mahinmi would be the best way to make up for the loss of Bowen. You can't just recover his versatility, so you make up for it with numbers of good defenders, preferably guys with long arms who can guard multiple positions.

[Obstructed_View]

At the time, the Spurs questioned DA's durability and his work ethic. Turned out they were right.

More than blind luck.

DA was badly injured in a really hard foul as a Spur and had played in every game up to that point, IINM. He was then traded to probably the most out of control waste of talent franchise in the history of the NBA in the Jailblazers. He was neither injury-prone nor lazy when he was a Spur, and getting a payday to play alongside Bonzi Wells, Damon Stoudamire and Rasheed Wallace at their chronic smoking peak was nearly a polar opposite from the situation he left. By the way he played 76 and 70 games the next two seasons, four more games than David Robinson appeared in.

Suggesting that things would have gone the same way in San Antonio that they ended up going is once again a way of making yourself feel better, much like the people who say that the Spurs played smallball in 2006 because they'd have been swept by the Mavs otherwise.

[Blackjack]

There's a pretty versatile, intelligent and tough defender in Washington that could be had, but he's a bit of a project offensively: Dominic McGuire

[timvp]

Suggesting that things would have gone the same way in San Antonio that they ended up going is once again a way of making yourself feel better

:lol Okay.

So you would have wanted the $55 million, six-year contract on the books that DA wanted? Would he have lived up to that deal, IYO?

[Obstructed_View]

:lol Okay.

So you would have wanted the $55 million, six-year contract on the books that DA wanted? Would he have lived up to that deal, IYO?

Wow, is that how much the offer sheet from Portland was for? As I remember it he took somewhere around MLE money because he was so mad at San Antonio for not even answering his phone calls while they were in Hawaii soothing David Robinson's ego.

[newacc]

I just read 7 pages of this and the title should be changed to "EricB" is Very Condescending and BTW Mason Wants Out.

Now that I got that jab out of the way, if the Spurs got Raja Bell I'd be floored. That would be one hell of an acquisition if he's anywhere close to how good he was in Phoenix.

As for Roger Mason, I never liked him anyway. Yeah he made some game winners in the regular season, but where's the filler? Sometimes he gets on a good shooting streak during games, but that's about the extent of what he brings to the table. He's not the kind of roll player that will put you over the top (as opposed to a Bowen).

Inconsistent shooter with no rebounds, no defense, no slashing, no passing and he's demanding a trade? He should be happy Peter Holt's checks are still going through. We'll see how good he is when he takes his I can only go right show somewhere else.

One last thing, I keep reading Pop ruined RM. I don't like Pop anymore and playing RM at PG was stupid, but RM not being able to comeback from Pop's stupid move is his own fault. He was asked to do more and failed. That shouldn't taint you for the rest of your career as a 2 guard.

[jesterbobman]

I posted this in the trade speculation thread, but worth discussing here also...
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yj5mug8

Why wouldn't Houston take on Lee instead of Harrington if that's on the table, or put Lee in instead of Jordan Hill. I doubt the Knicks are moving Lee for the DJ Augustin that's showed up this year.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yj8hhta

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yjryf6x

[objective]

Wow, is that how much the offer sheet from Portland was for? As I remember it he took somewhere around MLE money because he was so mad at San Antonio for not even answering his phone calls while they were in Hawaii soothing David Robinson's ego.

I think you're confusing the two . . . it was Robinson who was flirting with taking the MLE from New York iirc.

But according to Basketball-reference's earnings estimates . . . I don't think it includes the buyouts . . . looks like with 10% increases it's about 6 years, 49?

[Mel_13]

I think you're confusing the two . . . it was Robinson who was flirting with taking the MLE from New York iirc.

But according to Basketball-reference's earnings estimates . . . I don't think it includes the buyouts . . . looks like with 10% increases it's about 6 years, 49?

The final deal was a sign and trade, 6yrs/48M, DA and Kerr for Steve Smith. DA played 4yrs for Portland and then was waived under the Allan Houston rule and received the remainder of his money from Portland while he played in Houston, Miami, and Charlotte.

[mountainballer]

There's a pretty versatile, intelligent and tough defender in Washington that could be had, but he's a bit of a project offensively: Dominic McGuire

but but...this would mean no James Jones for the Spurs!!

hey, you are right to bring back the Wizards option.
(didn't read the whole 18 pages, maybe someone talked about it)
Wizards wouldn't mind to get him back. ok, after the big trade the Wizards will be below the cap this summer, so Mason's early bird rights are worthless for them. still, they might want to re sign him, mainly to get a high character guy and bringing him back home isn't the worst way to start a new relationship.
Wizards still have some interesting players. Mike Miller is one of them and we know that the Spurs wanted him last year.
yes, he isn't the one to fill our urgent needs, TT plus Salmons would make so much more sense, but let's say plan A and B failed, wouldn't Miller be a nice plan C? (in such a trade we could also snap McGuire to make Blackjack happy!)
would be Mason, Bonner, Fin for Miller and McGuire.
as I said, doesn't solve the problems, but I would still think it makes the Spurs a slightly better team and Spurs get the option to re sign Miller with the Bird rights.
a wing rotation of Manu, Miller and RJ looks as good (slightly better offensively) as Manu, Salmons, RJ.

[Obstructed_View]

The final deal was a sign and trade, 6yrs/48M, DA and Kerr for Steve Smith. DA played 4yrs for Portland and then was waived under the Allan Houston rule and received the remainder of his money from Portland while he played in Houston, Miami, and Charlotte.

Yeah, and if I recall the Spurs were actually offering DA more money for fewer years, which was also a sore point for his agent.

[mountainballer]

btw. Wizards.
is it a potential plan D to bring in Blatche, if the TT trade fails?
Wizards might be willing to add some nice teasers, if we take him off their hands. (their 2010 2nd rounder for example. likely #34). would give the Spurs some security if they use their 1st rounder in another deal.
again, this is a plan D or E proposal and I just bring it on the table to get some opinions.

[jesterbobman]

Blatche is certainly in the same sort of mould as Ty, though a little longer and bulkier and less athletic.(Also, JaVale McGee is probably in their long term plans at Centre, despite being lacking in basketball intelligence. Could be an option if we could grab him as our Athletic Centre prospect) Mason for Blatche as the Principles works, though I think they'd want to get under the tax this year aswell, and that would mean they'd have to clear even more salary, So a Three team deal such as

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yf8w7oe

Might make more sense(Clears 2.8 million off, They need to clear 2.6 to get under), They downgrade talent(Foye-> Mason, Blatche-> Arthur) But still get 1 young piece, and Memphis may want more scoring on it's bench to help a playoff run.

Thomas is certainly a better player(and prospect), but if we could squeeze an early 2nd(From Wash) or late 1st from Memphis(Own Theirs, Denvers, Lakers) it's not a bad Fallback option.

Foye may be worth keeping though, and they may just flick off Jamison and get under that way.

[hsxvvd]

Why wouldn't Houston take on Lee instead of Harrington if that's on the table, or put Lee in instead of Jordan Hill. I doubt the Knicks are moving Lee for the DJ Augustin that's showed up this year.

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yj8hhta

http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yjryf6x

Because that has nothing to do with Mason. :rolleyes

[Chomag]

I'm one of those that believe the rumors there was a friction between Bowen and Pop because Finley was in front of him on the rotation. This would be the second time Pop pulled the same shit. Obviously, this is mere opinion based on a rumor, so take it with a grain of salt.

First thing I thought of when reading this as well. :lol

I don't hate Finley but he needs to be separated from Pop.

Finley in the last two season's has prevented developing players such as Hairston, most likely caused friction with one of our greats Bowen, and now keeping Mason out of the line up.

Mason and Fin are similar players, but at this stage of Finley's career Mason is the better player.

Finely is even now taking up minutes at PF that could go to Blair or even some to Ian but thats not happening as long as Pop has the call.

Finely... well the Finley Pop relationship is quietly killing this team.

[TJastal]

First thing I thought of when reading this as well. :lol

I don't hate Finley but he needs to be separated from Pop.

Finley in the last two season's has prevented developing players such as Hairston, most likely caused friction with one of our greats Bowen, and now keeping Mason out of the line up.

Mason and Fin are similar players, but at this stage of Finley's career Mason is the better player.

Finely is even now taking up minutes at PF that could go to Blair or even some to Ian but thats not happening as long as Pop has the call.

Finely... well the Finley Pop relationship is quietly killing this team.

Yup when Finley returned to the lineup even though it was short minutes it was enough to disrupt the team's chemistry, and esp Mason Jr/Bogans. Now that his minutes have steadily increased it's gotten even worse.

With Hill being moved to the starting lineup Pop had his pick of Roger or Keith depending on the situation and I think that arrangement could have worked out ok (even though both would have their minutes reduced somewhat).

But Finley getting a slice of those minutes now too? Unacceptable situation for a coach to expect that many guys to share roles. And like a previous poster mentioned, he's using Finley in a power forward role almost like adding a cherry to his total mind/rotation fuck.

[hater]

motherfuckin Money Mase!

[DaBears]

See yah Mas nice to know yah.. Dont let the locker room door hit you wear the good lord split yah...... Oh an get your parking pass stamped on the way out...

[Spurs Brazil]

GTFO Mason

I don't want to see your crap play in the playoffs again

[DaBears]

All though in a way i cant really blame Mason much, i mean sure his defense sucked ass but so does most of the team.... Mason was playing extremely well till POP fucked everything up, starting way back when he was brining back Bonner whom is a shadow of his former self....

Hopefully if this trade or any trade goes down, SPURS get an young Big man that plays D... Cause appearantly offense is not the prob here.. Or Mason would be playing more...

[pad300]

In hindsight it sure was.

In hindsight? Some of us said so at the time, quite loudly...


Bruce Bowen is thru as not just a Spur, but as a NBA player. Hes lost a step and cannot compete athletically, due to age. Why do you think hes not playing and working as a ESPN basketball analyst? You need to move on like Bruce did.

Do you remember our last playoff series vs Dallas? Who was the only wing player on the floor for us who was worth paying? Oh Yeah, that Bruce guy. There's a reason his minutes went to an average of 26 mpg for that series, when on the season he averaged 18.9; he was doing his job, and doing it fairly well. Bruce moved on because Pop didn't want him back; the decisions this season has made me willing to consider the possibility Pop was wrong.

[Mel_13]

Bruce moved on because Pop didn't want him back; the decisions this season has made me willing to consider the possibility Pop was wrong.

I don't think we'll ever know for sure because I don't think Bruce or Pop will ever provide us with full details.The Spurs signed Bogans to the vet min to play a limited role. If that offer was not made first to Bruce, then Pop was wrong, plain and simple.

There has been speculation that Bruce was not interested in returning to play a limited role. It appears fairly certain that he turned down an offer from Boston, and perhaps one from Cleveland, for reasons which he has not completely discussed. If the Spurs offered him a limited role and Bruce turned it down, I can't say that I find fault on either side.

[pressurez]

Mason for a second round pick to Minny.

Would that really surprise you?

[Mel_13]

Mason for a second round pick to Minny.

Would that really surprise you?

Since that trade is not allowed under the CBA, I would be shocked.

[TimDunkem]

Since that trade is not allowed under the CBA, I would be shocked.
:lol

[pad300]

I don't think we'll ever know for sure because I don't think Bruce or Pop will ever provide us with full details.The Spurs signed Bogans to the vet min to play a limited role. If that offer was not made first to Bruce, then Pop was wrong, plain and simple.

There has been speculation that Bruce was not interested in returning to play a limited role. It appears fairly certain that he turned down an offer from Boston, and perhaps one from Cleveland, for reasons which he has not completely discussed. If the Spurs offered him a limited role and Bruce turned it down, I can't say that I find fault on either side.

You can't, I can. Fuck limited roles. I would happily have signed him for a year, and started him at the 2. He'd only get 24 mpg max, and he'd be our 3ed best wing, assuming RJ panned out. Given how RJ's been playing this year, he'd be our 2nd best wing...

Manu > RJ >= Bowen > Mason >= Bogans > Finley

PS. I count Hill as back up PG, not a wing. Still, he and Bowen would be pretty close to tied.

[5in10]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=Anyp3wm5VJ8r2RJcn_xcw5y8vLYF?slug=ys-masonspurs021510&prov=yhoo&type=lgns

"The Miami Heat and Memphis Grizzlies are being considered as possible destinations for Mason."

[I. Hustle]

The Grizz want Mase. I say give them Mase and get Marc Gasol. Bam problem solved lol.

[Mel_13]

You can't, I can. Fuck limited roles. I would happily have signed him for a year, and started him at the 2. He'd only get 24 mpg max, and he'd be our 3ed best wing, assuming RJ panned out. Given how RJ's been playing this year, he'd be our 2nd best wing...

Manu > RJ >= Bowen > Mason >= Bogans > Finley

PS. I count Hill as back up PG, not a wing. Still, he and Bowen would be pretty close to tied.

I'm not sure where we disagree, unless you think Pop should have assured a starting role. You say he would get 24 mpg max. 19 mpg was not apparently enough for him last year.

Whatever, I loved Bruce as a Spur and wanted him back. If he needed an assured role as a starter or a specified number of minutes to sign a contract, I don't have a problem with Pop not giving such assurance.

[5in10]

Maybe the spurs are trying to reunite sam young and dejuan blair

[pad300]

I'm not sure where we disagree, unless you think Pop should have assured a starting role. You say he would get 24 mpg max. 19 mpg was not apparently enough for him last year.

Whatever, I loved Bruce as a Spur and wanted him back. If he needed an assured role as a starter or a specified number of minutes to sign a contract, I don't have a problem with Pop not giving such assurance.

I think he wanted an assurance from Pop that he wouldn't be sitting while worse players kept their time. ie. what happened last season with Finley and Mason; he was better than either when he got to play. There's no doubt Bowen's a competitor and wants to play (and win). I imagine he got pretty peeved at Pop over that fiasco. That kind of assurance, I have trouble with Pop NOT giving. Cause it appears he's given the other kind of assurance to certain players (Finley, Bonner)...

[Mel_13]

I think he wanted an assurance from Pop that he wouldn't be sitting while worse players kept their time. ie. what happened last season with Finley and Mason; he was better than either when he got to play. There's no doubt Bowen's a competitor and wants to play (and win). I imagine he got pretty peeved at Pop over that fiasco. That kind of assurance, I have trouble with Pop NOT giving. Cause it appears he's given the other kind of assurance to certain players (Finley, Bonner)...

Well, then we do disagree. Opposing views make this board work. Some can't be bridged. :toast

Back to the Mason discussion.

[ABrooks111]

Absolutely fine with dealing Mason. I like the guy, but I doubt losing him takes much away from the team and expiring contracts are a hot commodity right now.

[doobs]

http://twitter.com/MoneyMase/status/9193486616

He's acting like nothing's changed . . .

[benefactor]

http://twitter.com/MoneyMase/status/9193486616

He's acting like nothing's changed . . .
He's doing what he is supposed to do.

[Mel_13]

http://twitter.com/MoneyMase/status/9193486616

He's acting like nothing's changed . . .

Four years ago, the Spurs told Brent Barry not to go to the airport because he had been traded. The trade fell through, he made the flight and stayed around another 2+ years.

Like we hear them say all the time, "it's just business".

[CGD]

Maybe the spurs are trying to reunite sam young and dejuan blair

I'd take Sam Young's Big East pedigree any day.

[ducks]

http://twitter.com/MoneyMase/status/9193486616

He's acting like nothing's changed . . .

until it is offical he does not want to mess it up

[Ditty]

I'd take Sam Young's Big East pedigree any day.

yah if spurs trade to memphis hope its for this guy because the spurs wanted him