Top 30 Spurs Small Forward Free Agent Targets

[ace3g]

Rasual Butler and Matt Barnes are the only legit SF left on the market (and my wish list) after Childress signed a deal with the Suns using part of the Amare trade exception

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

None.

I'm sure Spurs are looking to sign a vet wing but there is a point where they should let it go. I rather see Spurs gambling on Hairston, Gee, Anderson and Temple that signing a crappy vet.

Jarvis Hayes is maybe the worst vet Spurs should consider.

I can see it going that way, and, really, I like the idea. Let's blood some youth.

Of those guys I mentioned, I wouldn't mind Hassell - he can't play offense for shit, but he sure plays tough on D (or at leats he did 2 years ago... he might be slowing down now).

Really hoping Butler might come here for the culture, minutes and a shot at a title, but that's wishful thinking given the money we can give him (LLE is about 1.8mil?). When Johan Petro is getting 3.3mil, Butler is a long shot for the LLE... :depressed

[analyzed]

If we don't end up with RJ, ( Clips can throw money away ) we might have to settle with head cases Howard or Tmac. Eveyone else is pretty much signed

[Muser]

If Howard could be had for the LLE then it's a steal, but that's a pipe dream.

[Spurs Brazil]

Celtics eye Howard?

The Boston Celtics and Chicago Bulls have shown “serious interest” in free-agent forward Josh Howard, a league source told Yahoo! Sports.

While the Bulls could have the salary-cap space to sign Howard, depending on what happens with their offer sheet to J.J. Redick, the Celtics would need a sign-and-trade to arrange a deal because they have already used their midlevel exception on Jermaine O’Neal.

Howard has yet to receive a contract offer. The Washington Wizards also have some interest in re-signing Howard.

– Marc J. Spears, 1:30 a.m. ET, July 12

http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/news;_ylt=AimqY4K3PgokdKbw7rDqzKW8vLYF?slug=ys-freeagentbuzz071110

[Bruno]

Update: In red, players that are gone:

1. Mike Miller
2. Josh Childress
3. Wesley Matthews
4. Kyle Korver
5. Anthony Morrow
6. Travis Outlaw
7. Linas Kleiza
8. Josh Howard
9. Ronnie Brewer
10. Ryan Gomes
11. Matt Barnes
12. Dorell Wright
13. Rasual Butler
14. Tony Allen
15. Pete Mickeal
16. Quentin Richardson
17. James Jones
18. Bobby Simmons
19. Tracy McGrady
20. Jarvis Hayes
21. Bostjan Nachbar
22. Rodney Carney
23. Stephen Graham
24. Alan Anderson
25. Devin Brown
26. Antoine Wright
27. Joey Graham
28. Dominic McGuire
29. Keith Bogans
30. Damien Wilkins

I like Howard, Brewer, Barnes, Butler, Jones, Simmons and Hayes. If Spurs can't get one of these players, they should gamble on their young guys..

[coyotes_geek]

Howard and Brewer will definitely get more than the LLE. Given the money flying around right now, I hate to say that it's a pretty safe bet that Butler might as well. Barnes might not, but that should be viewed more as a warning sign than anything.

[Bruno]

Howard and Brewer will definitely get more than the LLE. Given the money flying around right now, I hate to say that it's a pretty safe bet that Butler might as well. Barnes might not, but that should be viewed more as a warning sign than anything.

Agree. I put all the players I would like Spurs to get but some aren't realistic options.

[RiverwalkParade]

curious to see the money on the Tiago signing. wonder if any is left over to use with the LLE for a SF.

[Texas_Ranger]

Nachbar said he'll stay in Europe. But he's willing to listen to an opinion if an NBA team contacts him.

[Spurs Brazil]

Bruno, if Tiago deal is really three years and $10 million total how much do we have to offer to a SF

[Mark in Austin]

I have a hard time seeing McGrady back with NY - especially since now that they are capped out and it would have to be for the veteran's minimum and he's said he wants to sign with a contender.

If the Spurs want him, it might not be a bad move to contact him now - by all accounts he wants to keep his family in Houston, so playing in SA would make some sense, a la Robert Horry.

[coyotes_geek]

Agree. I put all the players I would like Spurs to get but some aren't realistic options.

If the rumored 3yrs/$10mil deal for Splitter is true, then that makes some of those options suddenly become a little more realistic.

[Spurs Brazil]

If the rumored 3yrs/$10mil deal for Splitter is true, then that makes some of those options suddenly become a little more realistic.


True, I'd go after Butler

[Bruno]

bruno, if tiago deal is really three years and $10 million total how much do we have to offer to a sf

$2.7m

[Bruno]

True, I'd go after Butler

I would go first after Howard and then after Butler.

[coyotes_geek]

True, I'd go after Butler

I'd at least lob a phonecall Josh Howard's direction just to give him the opportunity to say no. Starting at $2.7 the Spurs could offer 4yrs/$12 mil. I doubt that would be enough for Howard but it's at least enough to not get laughed off the phone.

After that though, Butler.

[pad300]

Personally, although Bruno hates it, I'd go for McGrady. If there is any hope of a championship for TD's retirement (next 2 years), given what's building in Miami, and has been built in LA, it's time to swing for the fences. Mcgrady has more boom potential than anybody left on the list.
He'd be a pretty good fit too, playing Brent Barry-ish minutes, filling in at the 2, the 3 and small ball 4.

[Marcus Bryant]

Howard + Bell. The Spurs need to be able to shut down offenses in the postseason.

[yavozerb]

Redick, even in reserve, has been a very popular player in Orlando, and ownership has said several times it expected to keep him. The Magic still are exploring various trade possibilities that include moving center Marcin Gortat, forward Mickael Pietrus and high-priced guard Vince Carter. Barnes is an unrestricted free agent who has been seeking more than the veteran's minimum of $1.6 million that the Magic would be willing to pay him. Richardson, according to sources, is expected to receive a two-year deal worth just over $4 million. The Magic have until Friday to decided whether to match the offer sheet to keep Redick. FanHouse.com

Peitrus would be a great option at SF for the spurs. REally do not see an option to trade for him though. It keeps looking like RJ will be our SF for years to come.

[tdunk21]

rest of mle and lle options

howard, bell - we get scoring sg/sf in howard, defender in bell
butler, barnes - both are good defenders
howard, barnes - we get scoring sg/sf in howard, defender in barnes
barnes, bell - both defenders

[Texas_Ranger]

I hope for Howard or Butler. Barnes would also be a good adition. Bell is just old.

[RiverwalkParade]

rest of mle and lle options

howard, bell - we get scoring sg/sf in howard, defender in bell
butler, barnes - both are good defenders
howard, barnes - we get scoring sg/sf in howard, defender in barnes
barnes, bell - both defenders

Howard/Barnes would be a locker room nightmare.

[tdunk21]

Howard/Barnes would be a locker room nightmare.

lol....true....i believe pop and timmy can change that

[Obstructed_View]

It's looking like Howard's going to go to the Celtics or staying with Washington. Anyone considered Morrison? He can shoot, and he'll probably be a bargain.

[ohmwrecker]

The best option of available FAs is Ronnie Brewer. If the Spurs can get him on board on the cheap for a year, that is the best possible scenario. I don't like Howard, but if he's healthy (mentally and physically) he is very talented. Outside of that, Barnes or Butler would probably fit the bill. The options go downhill pretty steeply after that.
Tracy McGrady is intriguing, but he is kind of a shithead, so I think he ends up in L.A. or Miami.

I know everybody here hates RJ, but signing him should be a top priority. He is the best available SF with starter ability and the S&T option is appealing if we can get back TE or talent.

If none of these options work out, the pickings get mighty slim and risky. Players like Joe Alexander, Jonathan Bender, Rodney Carney, Yakhouba Diawara, Stephen Graham and Jarvis Hayes are out there, but the Spurs would be taking a big gamble by taking a chance on them.

[tdunk21]

Lakers still have $1.8M left of their MLE and Raja is guy Kobe wants. The longtime rivals have already talked a lot by phone and text

http://twitter.com/STEIN_LINE_HQ

looks like kobe is recruiting raja bell.....so bell is likely going to the lakers....that leaves us howard(if celtics fall out of the race), barnes, butler, hayes, james jones....

[Austin_Toros]

Marcus Williams doesn't make the top 30 small forward free agents?
Should probably slot him in there.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Marcus Williams doesn't make the top 30 small forward free agents?
Should probably slot him in there.

Well his price tag is obviously too big to be put on that list. Other swingmen who deserve the max are not on it as well.

[Thomas82]

We should see if we can get Danny Green from Cleveland.

[SenorSpur]

It appears that Barnes is looking really hard for a job:

Read more: http://www.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/68108/20100713/barnes_isnt_likely_to_return_to_warriors/#ixzz0tZtXqWyj

Free-agent Matt Barnes has contacted the Warriors about a potential return to the team, but sources say an agreement is a longshot.

Barnes, who signed a contract with the Magic last offseason, played two seasons with Golden State from 2006 to 2008.

[mikeb2016]

The best option of available FAs is Ronnie Brewer. If the Spurs can get him on board on the cheap for a year, that is the best possible scenario. I don't like Howard, but if he's healthy (mentally and physically) he is very talented. Outside of that, Barnes or Butler would probably fit the bill. The options go downhill pretty steeply after that.
Tracy McGrady is intriguing, but he is kind of a shithead, so I think he ends up in L.A. or Miami.

I know everybody here hates RJ, but signing him should be a top priority. He is the best available SF with starter ability and the S&T option is appealing if we can get back TE or talent.

If none of these options work out, the pickings get mighty slim and risky. Players like Joe Alexander, Jonathan Bender, Rodney Carney, Yakhouba Diawara, Stephen Graham and Jarvis Hayes are out there, but the Spurs would be taking a big gamble by taking a chance on them.


I like the mention of Brewer...seems to me like he is a very viable (and previously not thought to be affordable) option at this point.

[Marcus Bryant]

I know everybody here hates RJ, but signing him should be a top priority. He is the best available SF with starter ability and the S&T option is appealing if we can get back TE or talent.

:tu

The primary problem with Jefferson was his contract. His production vis a vis his pay didn't make sense. That shouldn't be a problem with a new deal. And you're absolutely right, the dropoff between Jefferson and the next likely candidate for the starting 3 spot is significant. Plus he should show some improvement in his 2nd season with the Spurs.

[Brazil]

:tu

The primary problem with Jefferson was his contract. His production vis a vis his pay didn't make sense. That shouldn't be a problem with a new deal. And you're absolutely right, the dropoff between Jefferson and the next likely candidate for the starting 3 spot is significant. Plus he should show some improvement in his 2nd season with the Spurs.

+1

RJ is our best candidate and yes he should be spurs main priority

[coyotes_geek]

Marcus Williams doesn't make the top 30 small forward free agents?
Should probably slot him in there.

Seeing as how the Spurs dumped Marcus Williams so that they could keep two other small forwards in Hairston and Gee, Marcus Williams making the top 30 available small forwards list would be a good sign that it's okay for the Spurs to stop looking for small forwards.

[Blackjack]

teamziller

RT @christomasson Ronnie Brewer an option to replace Wesley Matthews in Utah. At FanHouse: http://bit.ly/ccC5wn

[urunobili]

I can't believe y'all seriously welcome Josh Howard...

[HarlemHeat37]

:tu

The primary problem with Jefferson was his contract. His production vis a vis his pay didn't make sense. That shouldn't be a problem with a new deal. And you're absolutely right, the dropoff between Jefferson and the next likely candidate for the starting 3 spot is significant. Plus he should show some improvement in his 2nd season with the Spurs.

The primary problem with Jefferson wasn't his contract, I disagree..the only reason they were able to acquire him was because of his bad contract..his contract just put the Spurs over the tax, it didn't really affect them from making other moves..I would argue that his new contract is even worse, since it's going to be a multi-year deal..

The problem with Jefferson is that he doesn't fit as a starter here, and I doubt that will change TBH..he'll have to go back to his 40% 3-point shooting, which was more than likely an anomaly..

[AFBlue]

From David Aldridge twitter about an hour ago...


Knicks making a pitch to Josh Howard today; Howard still considering Wizards seriously, along w/Bulls, Cs. Story up soon on NBA.com.

Doesn't look like the Spurs are considering Howard at this point, which is a shame. He seems like a low-risk, high-reward type player. But maybe he's out of the Spurs' price range.

[yavozerb]

From David Aldridge twitter about an hour ago...



Doesn't look like the Spurs are considering Howard at this point, which is a shame. He seems like a low-risk, high-reward type player. But maybe he's out of the Spurs' price range.

I think thats exactly the case. Look at the 3 teams he's interested in, all can offer more $ than the spurs. Not going to lose any sleep over this guy though...

[AFBlue]

Barnes held a recent interview and didn't mention Spurs as possibility. Mentions Lakers, Dallas, etc. Here's the link and blip...

http://sportsradiointerviews.com/2010/07/14/matt-barnes-has-been-talking-to-four-teams-this-offseason/


On how many teams he has talked to this offseason:

“We’ve been talking to a few teams. Orlando, Miami, the Lakers, and Dallas and it’s always kinda been my thing where I have to wait around and see.

I suppose the fact that the Lakers are interested in him could be positive news...they might not like their chances of luring Bell, so they've tabbed Barnes as a backup.

[coyotes_geek]

From David Aldridge twitter about an hour ago...



Doesn't look like the Spurs are considering Howard at this point, which is a shame. He seems like a low-risk, high-reward type player. But maybe he's out of the Spurs' price range.

The problem with the Spurs going after Howard is that he's not going to be in any kind of a hurry to take LLE or the Spurs remaining MLE while other teams out there have cap space or full MLE's to work with. Sure would suck for the Spurs to lose out on Bell/Butler/Jones because they're waiting on Howard, only to then see Howard sign a deal for more money elsewhere.

The only approach with Howard the Spurs can take is to call him up and offer the remaining MLE, but unless Howard gives an immediate yes, they need to move on.

[coyotes_geek]

Barnes held a recent interview and didn't mention Spurs as possibility. Mentions Lakers, Dallas, etc. Here's the link and blip...

http://sportsradiointerviews.com/2010/07/14/matt-barnes-has-been-talking-to-four-teams-this-offseason/



I suppose the fact that the Lakers are interested in him could be positive news...they might not like their chances of luring Bell, so they've tabbed Barnes as a backup.

Are the lakers interested in Barnes, or is Barnes interested in the lakers? One has to wonder because there's a long list of teams who want nothing to do with the guy. It sure seems like all the buzz about Barnes is being generated directly from Barnes.

[timvp]

If the Spurs aren't going to sign RJ and need a starter out of free agency, the only two players to sign for the rest of the MLE are Matt Barnes and Rasual Butler.

The more I look at Barnes, the more he makes sense. He's a good defender, a great rebounder for a small forward, finishes well at the basket and has three-point range. His three-point percentage doesn't look good on paper but his splits tell an interesting story. When he starts he can really shoot from deep -- 35.8% in 2010, 38.2% in 2009 and 38.1% in 2008. His shooting struggles from three-point land are when he's coming off the bench -- 18.8% in 2008, 28.8% in 2009 and 28.7% in 2008.

From strictly a value point of view, the Spurs would get more bang for the buck signing Barnes for ~$2.5M and starting him at small forward than signing Richard Jefferson for ~$7M and starting him at power forward. Barnes would hold some risk because of his history of making everyone around him hate him by the end of the season, but the reward would be a small forward who could fit a valuable role for cheap.

Butler doesn't offer the upset you could get from Barnes but he's an extremely safe bet. He's a solid defender, a 36.3% three-point shooter and stays healthy. He could buy 20-25 minutes of decent play.

[xtremesteven33]

I would like a Butler signing....He doesnt have the highest bball IQ but I like his clutch 3 point shooting and tough defensive play

[HankChinaski]

Regardless if we bring back jefferson or not the spurs are going to sign one more wingman to the roster. Despite James Anderson's upside value being drafted for the spurs you still haven't seen him play one single minute with NBA talent. I don't see Pop and crew gambling on him to be able to play the wing effectively as a starter or 2nd wing off the bench without seeing him play consistently proving them he can.

I have to think the spurs are after someone who can effectively bring in some shooting apply average defense and some rebounding if possible. Thats why I see Barnes as good prospect to bring in.

And just like timvp said, the man may be a potential locker room cancer. I just have to believe that Pop could do a better job maintaining a locker room and a player like this better than the prettier Van Gundy.

And if he is providing results on the court I don't see how Duncan and the rest of the crew would give two shits about him in the locker room, they just want to win another NBA Finals if they can.

I don't mean to sound like a broken record if I beginning to sound like one. But Barnes is possible the best of the crop left to SIGN in free agency.

Jones, Butler wouldn't be bad pick ups, but you are not going to be jumping out of your seat in regards to what they bring to the spurs system. They'll just be a better addition than what we had taking minutes last season.

*edit*

And honestly, I really only see Anderson playing SG and sometimes defending the 3.

[ohmwrecker]

You had me until you said "prettier Van Gundy".

[HankChinaski]

Well, I still laugh when I think of a certain sports announcer referring to said Van Gundy being the prettier Van Gundy. I wish someone on TNT would make a bet with Jeff in game. The conversation would be something like this.

Jackson: I won the bet Jeff.
Van Gundy: I know.
Jackson: say it.
Van Gundy: I didn't specify when I had to say it on air.
Jackson: Just say the dang word Jeffrey.
Van Gundy: ....sigh GOLEM, Golem.
Jackson: You definitely are not the pretty Van Gundy.
Van Gundy: I hate you.

[ohmwrecker]

You are right. I forgot about that. I think it was Mark Jackson. Had to be. "Prettier" is just a weird way to say it.

[HankChinaski]

who is that in your avatar? I want to say it's a really young Tom Waits. Who is a bad ass musician.

[ElNono]

If the Spurs aren't going to sign RJ and need a starter out of free agency, the only two players to sign for the rest of the MLE are Matt Barnes and Rasual Butler.

The more I look at Barnes, the more he makes sense. He's a good defender, a great rebounder for a small forward, finishes well at the basket and has three-point range. His three-point percentage on paper doesn't look good on paper but his splits tell an interesting story. When he starts he can really shoot from deep -- 35.8% in 2010, 38.2% in 2009 and 38.1% in 2008. His shooting struggles from three-point land are when he's coming off the bench -- 18.8% in 2008, 28.8% in 2009 and 28.7% in 2008.

From strictly a value point of value, the Spurs would get more bang for the buck signing Barnes for ~$2.5M and starting him at small forward than signing Richard Jefferson for ~$7M and starting him at power forward. Barnes would hold some risk because of his history of making everyone around him hate him by the end of the season, but the reward would be a small forward who could fit a valuable role for cheap.

Butler doesn't offer the upset you could get from Barnes but he's an extremely safe bet. He's a solid defender, a 36.3% three-point shooter and stays healthy. He could buy 20-25 minutes of decent play.

I can tell you haven't been sleeping lately... :lol

[HarlemHeat37]

Timvp became an insomniac after hearing about the figures on Bonner's contract..

[timvp]

:lol Yeah, Bonner making ten times market value and Scola getting a $50 million deal has me staring at the ceiling at night . . .

[DAF86]

Sign the best shooter available.

[MI21]

Is Barnes a realistic option though?

I remember him saying he only wants to play in California, but obviously that changed with Orlando.

I'm pretty big on him as a player, he is an annoying prick, who thinks he is a bit better than he is. On a team like the Spurs, that sort of thing can either backfire heavily or end up being the bit of nastiness that can really help (Buckets, Elie, etc).

He shoots 3's well from the 45's and corners, which is a fit in the Spurs offense. He is a good cutter off the ball and gets a lot of layups that way. Pesky defender with the aforementioned nasty streak and a good passer. He just never really puts it all together consistently.

I really like him over James fucking Jones. Butler I would be alright with.

[Bruno]

July 16th: candidates to be Spurs starting SF: Alonzo Gee and Malik Hairston. :depressed

While I trust Spurs FO, it's preoccupying to have a that big hole on a team with championship aspirations that late in the summer. Spurs aren't in comfortable situation and it could get very ugly soon.

[EricB]

but but but Hairston would be all star level if given then chance!

[scottspurs]

Dang, I miss Bruce Bowen. :depressed

[tdunk21]

but but but Hairston would be all star level if given then chance!

is he really that good?

[Obstructed_View]

but but but Hairston would be all star level if given then chance!

You're an idiot.

[mikeb2016]

If the Spurs aren't going to sign RJ and need a starter out of free agency, the only two players to sign for the rest of the MLE are Matt Barnes and Rasual Butler.

The more I look at Barnes, the more he makes sense. He's a good defender, a great rebounder for a small forward, finishes well at the basket and has three-point range. His three-point percentage doesn't look good on paper but his splits tell an interesting story. When he starts he can really shoot from deep -- 35.8% in 2010, 38.2% in 2009 and 38.1% in 2008. His shooting struggles from three-point land are when he's coming off the bench -- 18.8% in 2008, 28.8% in 2009 and 28.7% in 2008.

From strictly a value point of view, the Spurs would get more bang for the buck signing Barnes for ~$2.5M and starting him at small forward than signing Richard Jefferson for ~$7M and starting him at power forward. Barnes would hold some risk because of his history of making everyone around him hate him by the end of the season, but the reward would be a small forward who could fit a valuable role for cheap.

Butler doesn't offer the upset you could get from Barnes but he's an extremely safe bet. He's a solid defender, a 36.3% three-point shooter and stays healthy. He could buy 20-25 minutes of decent play.

If we hear sometime this weekend that Ronnie Brewer is getting 4 mil/yr from the Bulls, then never mind this thought, but if he could be had on the cheap for what's left of the MLE, would you not think him a good pick up? I understand his outside shot leaves a lot to be desired, but he is one of the few players remaining with any potential to get better. I know your evaluation of him at the beginning of this thread is not terribly flattering (but spot on indeed), but do you really think that he wouldn't be better than Butler? Is there a chance with some good coaching and playing with a lot of talent around him, that Ronnie Brewer could turn into an excellent role player for the Spurs?

[SanAntonioSpurs23]

Dear god, Gee and Hairston as our SF rotation........... :lol that's just terrible.

Hairston starting is going to SUCK!!!!

[coyotes_geek]

If we hear sometime this weekend that Ronnie Brewer is getting 4 mil/yr from the Bulls, then never mind this thought, but if he could be had on the cheap for what's left of the MLE, would you not think him a good pick up? I understand his outside shot leaves a lot to be desired, but he is one of the few players remaining with any potential to get better. I know your evaluation of him at the beginning of this thread is not terribly flattering (but spot on indeed), but do you really think that he wouldn't be better than Butler? Is there a chance with some good coaching and playing with a lot of talent around him, that Ronnie Brewer could turn into an excellent role player for the Spurs?

I'd take Brewer in a heartbeat, but I don't see any way that he does not get an offer, or multiple offers, in excess of what the Spurs have left from their MLE.

[Obstructed_View]

I'd take Brewer in a heartbeat, but I don't see any way that he does not get an offer, or multiple offers, in excess of what the Spurs have left from their MLE.

I agree. Way too much to hope for.

[MaNu4Tres]

http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf/2010/07/cleveland_cavs_guard_delonte_w.html

Wing search on: In addition to looking for point guards via trade, league sources said the Cavs have been interested in several free agent wings. Ronnie Brewer, a defensive specialist who averaged 8.8 points and 3.3 assists for the Jazz and Grizzlies last season, is on the radar. Several teams have interest in him, including the Chicago Bulls.

Also on the Cavs' list is forward Rasual Butler, who averaged 11.9 points and 2.9 rebounds for the Los Angeles Clippers. Sources also indicate the Cavs have interest in Antoine Wright, a solid defender who averaged 6.5 points for the Raptors last season, and former Cav Flip Murray, a scoring specialist who averaged 9.9 points with the Bobcats and Bulls in 2009-10.



* FYI- Cavs can offer more than the 2.4 million salary the Spurs can offer for both Butler and Brewer*

[PDXSpursFan]

We can strike another name from the list. Barnes to make announcement today. Most likely Mavs, Lakers or Heat:

http://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/playerbreakingnews.asp?sport=NBA&id=892&line=137927&spln=1

[MaNu4Tres]

Well it's looking like Jefferson is the most realistic option after all...

Who would have thunk it?

[ElNono]

Well it's looking like is the most realistic option after all...

Who would have thunk it?

For 3 years/MLE money he is. More than that, pass...

[EricB]

For 3 years/MLE money he is. More than that, pass...


Look, get used to Jefferson being here. The Hairston unrealistic fan boys will have to temper it down. The team likes him as do I, but REALISTIC he is NOT a starting 3 in this league.

[AFBlue]

Based on what we've heard to this point, it looks an awful lot like RJ is coming back at some point. If the Spurs were showing genuine interest in potential starters like T-Mac or Howard, then I would say different...but I haven't seen it.

[Darkwaters]

is he really that good?

Yep. Absolutely that good.

PS: My money is on Ian Mahinmi winning the MVP next year in Dallas.

[jiggy_55]

Ronnie brewer is off the list too. Reportedly agrees 3 yr 12.5 million deal with Chicago.

[ace3g]

He turned down Boston

SpearsNBAYahoo

Ronnie Brewer tells Y! Sports he turned down Boston offer to sign 3-year, $12.5 million deal with Bulls. Big pro for CHI was chance to start

[ohmwrecker]

who is that in your avatar? I want to say it's a really young Tom Waits. Who is a bad ass musician.

Ding! Ding!

[Obstructed_View]

Look, get used to Jefferson being here. The Hairston unrealistic fan boys will have to temper it down. The team likes him as do I, but REALISTIC he is NOT a starting 3 in this league.

Even though he's better than Keith Bogans, who Pop had no problem starting for 50 games.

[ace3g]

and Barnes' "decision" will take a little longer than expected

Matt_Barnes22

Couple new teams just jumped n2 the game, so I'm sorry 2 say ima have 2 get back 2 you. Ill let yall know something with in the nxt few days

[jiggy_55]

Update: In red, players that are gone:

1. Mike Miller
2. Josh Childress
3. Wesley Matthews
4. Kyle Korver
5. Anthony Morrow
6. Travis Outlaw
7. Linas Kleiza
8. Josh Howard
9. Ronnie Brewer
10. Ryan Gomes
11. Matt Barnes
12. Dorell Wright
13. Rasual Butler
14. Tony Allen
15. Pete Mickeal
16. Quentin Richardson
17. James Jones
18. Bobby Simmons
19. Tracy McGrady
20. Jarvis Hayes
21. Bostjan Nachbar
22. Rodney Carney
23. Stephen Graham
24. Alan Anderson
25. Devin Brown
26. Antoine Wright
27. Joey Graham
28. Dominic McGuire
29. Keith Bogans
30. Damien Wilkins


Fixed.

[Nathan89]

I hate the heat.

[jiggy_55]

IraHeatBeat

Matt Barnes now backing off committing, say "couple new teams" have jumped in. Can't help Heat, which just has minimum and only backup job.

http://twitter.com/IraHeatBeat/status/18706815343

Hopefully one of those is the Spurs, cuz I'd like him here in SA. My top 3 choices are:

1. Matt Barnes
2. Josh Howard
3. Rasual Butler

[Obstructed_View]

Rodney Carney here we come!

[Bruno]

A player not on the list that Spurs should definitively target is Michael Finley who played with the Celtics last year. He is a great shooter with a lot of experience.

[HankChinaski]

Who's this Finley character?

He sounds like a steal to me.

[ElNono]

Look, get used to Jefferson being here. The Hairston unrealistic fan boys will have to temper it down. The team likes him as do I, but REALISTIC he is NOT a starting 3 in this league.

This is not about Hairston, at least not for me. This is about paying realistically for the production you're getting and preventing from hampering the rebuilding process on this team four or five years down the road.

TBH, I would take a gamble on a washed up T-Mac for 2 seasons/MLE money, if that's what it takes to avoid handing RJ a five year deal out of desperation.

[ElNono]

A player not on the list that Spurs should definitively target is Michael Finley who played with the Celtics last year. He is a great shooter with a lot of experience.

I wonder if Pop is already exchanging love letters... although the breakup was pretty hard on him.

[HankChinaski]

Nope, Pops dropped a deuce on a photo of the Findog and got sloshed up on his wine and went on with his life.

[Vic Petro]

The answer to our prayers is Ndudi Ebi.

[mazerrackham]

This is not about Hairston, at least not for me. This is about paying realistically for the production you're getting and preventing from hampering the rebuilding process on this team four or five years down the road.

TBH, I would take a gamble on a washed up T-Mac for 2 seasons/MLE money, if that's what it takes to avoid handing RJ a five year deal out of desperation.

This is how I feel. Jefferson is the best option we have, but I also feel it will limit us down the road to give a 4 year contract to a player who doesn't fit in the system we employ.

[AFBlue]

This is not about Hairston, at least not for me. This is about paying realistically for the production you're getting and preventing from hampering the rebuilding process on this team four or five years down the road.

TBH, I would take a gamble on a washed up T-Mac for 2 seasons/MLE money, if that's what it takes to avoid handing RJ a five year deal out of desperation.

Couldn't agree more. A contract for RJ that extends beyond Manu's current deal makes no sense at all.

[ace3g]

I hope he is wrong about Barnes

JMcDonald_SAEN

For those asking, hearing #spurs not one of the teams involved in talks with Matt Barnes.

[jiggy_55]

Spurs/Barnes news...

JMcDonald_SAEN

For those asking, hearing #spurs not one of the teams involved in talks with Matt Barnes.

http://twitter.com/JMcDonald_SAEN/status/18713730536

[jiggy_55]

McDonald actually replied to my tweet to him :).

JMcDonald_SAEN: For those asking, hearing #spurs not one of the teams involved in talks with Matt Barnes.

Me: @JMcDonald_SAEN So who ARE they talking to? They need an SF, whether or not they sign RJ. What are they doing?

JMcDonald_SAEN: Only outside guy I can confirm right now is James Jones. Maybe better off w/ in-house options RT @Amer_Mansour So who ARE they talking to?

[pad300]

A possible target to add to the list: Bill Walker
6'6", 220
Shot .431 from the 3 last season (50/116), TS% .649, very Athletic & a strong slasher (even after 2 knee surgeries...he appears to have recovered fully). Due to his atheletic gifts, he is not bad defensively; he tends to be very aggressive on his man.

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Bill-Walker-552/

He very likely would be available for the vet min...

[Bruno]

Bill Walker isn't a FA.

[Obstructed_View]

A player not on the list that Spurs should definitively target is Michael Finley who played with the Celtics last year. He is a great shooter with a lot of experience.

Finley made it pretty clear after he left the Spurs that he's not happy with Pop's micromanaging and questionable roster decisions. He didn't have a problem with it when he was benefitting from it, but that ship has long sailed.

[HarlemHeat37]

A possible target to add to the list: Bill Walker
6'6", 220
Shot .431 from the 3 last season (50/116), TS% .649, very Athletic & a strong slasher (even after 2 knee surgeries...he appears to have recovered fully). Due to his atheletic gifts, he is not bad defensively; he tends to be very aggressive on his man.

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Bill-Walker-552/

He very likely would be available for the vet min...

The Knicks didn't waive him by the deadline, he's still there..he has upside and is reportedly in great shape too, he's going to be good this season..it would have been really stupid for them to waive him..

[timvp]

I hope he is wrong about Barnes

JMcDonald_SAEN

For those asking, hearing #spurs not one of the teams involved in talks with Matt Barnes.

Alright, so that means the Spurs are interested.

[pad300]

Bill Walker isn't a FA.

My bad, I thought he was on a 1 year vet min with the Knicks last year... I guess he'd be a trade target.

[jiggy_55]

Alright, so that means the Spurs are interested.

LOL.

But really, looks like their not even looking at him. And with no other news than James Jones, looks like their not looking much into it. I guess they have RJ as #1 option right now and if they get him, they might just close the roster out with Gee/Hairston etc..

[in2deep]

A player not on the list that Spurs should definitively target is Michael Finley who played with the Celtics last year. He is a great shooter with a lot of experience.

he would fit like a glove!!!

http://ll-media.tmz.com/2007/09/28/0928_oj_glove_ap-1.jpg

[Obstructed_View]

Alright, so that means the Spurs are interested.

Yeah, McDonald ranks slightly above TPark and Kill_Bill_Oly on my list of reliable sources.

[ace3g]

Hopefully the Spurs are just throwing James Jones' name out there as a CIA move to protect their real target in Barnes

[Ginobili2Duncan]

Hopefully the Spurs are just throwing James Jones' name out there as a CIA move to protect their real target in Barnes



:tu

[AFBlue]

McGrady or Howard would be great. Butler would be good. Barnes or Jones would be acceptable.

[smrattler]

Finley made it pretty clear after he left the Spurs that he's not happy with Pop's micromanaging and questionable roster decisions. He didn't have a problem with it when he was benefitting from it, but that ship has long sailed.

Regardless of how "streaky" he was (another word for sucking ass) Pop pushed him out there, over and over and over... playoff games especially, believing in him. His vet with "great character" would shine for him because he believed in him. But when he sucked, Pop continued to give him the benefit of the doubt even as we pulled our hair out.

Then he goes out like that. How easily he forgot.

[mingus]

Dudley on the Suns is a guy i think the Spurs should try to target with S&T if they can. Phoenix is one of the teams RJ can actually produce on...Dudley works for us obviously. probably a pipe dream.

[ace3g]

MacDonald is really confused

JMcDonald_SAEN

Plan is to ink both RJ and Jones, I think. Don't see anyone else offering RJ what #spurs can, unless the Clippers get nutty. @VI_Massive

JMcDonald_SAEN

I don't know what any of those words mean. RT @aamcneill Indeed it is Common. Though Kanye did the beat.

[Spurs Brazil]

MacDonald is really confused

JMcDonald_SAEN

Plan is to ink both RJ and Jones, I think. Don't see anyone else offering RJ what #spurs can, unless the Clippers get nutty. @VI_Massive

JMcDonald_SAEN

I don't know what any of those words mean. RT @aamcneill Indeed it is Common. Though Kanye did the beat.

I think McDonald doesn't have any sources

[Marcus Bryant]

Plan is to ink both RJ and Jones


Most likely. If the Spurs are looking at Jones or whatever D-League scrub to start at the 3 they might as well start rebuilding.

[mikeb2016]

McGrady or Howard would be great. Butler would be good. Barnes or Jones would be acceptable.

This depends on what you are hoping for from them. If as a backup to RJ, Butler and Jones are your only two decent choices. The others' risk outweighs their benefit, especially McGrady's pouting by December and Barnes' tweeting in the 4th quarter of any random game because he isn't getting any burn. For the backup role, you need a quality personality like Butler, or a one-trick pony like Jones, to understand their standing on the team.

BUT, if you are looking for someone who can replace RJ, and potentially be a starting SF on a team with championship aspirations, then you need to gamble on Howard or Barnes, maaaaaaaybe Butler or McGrady. I believe that a career year from Barnes, or a return-to-form year for Howard, could indeed provide enough umph to make the Spurs at least competitive with the top-tier teams.

The other factor involved here is the reality that while RJ is the best player available at the SF position, there is a catch-22 dilemma involved in bringing him back. You either have to pay him enough to make him happy and thereby end up with a hideous contract that the team rues in two years, or you pay him market value that causes him to throw a contract-long tantrum where he constantly sulks and is more ineffective than he was last year. It is because of this no-win situation that I think the Spurs are better served as an organization to try and find a suitable starting replacement for RJ, rather than bringing him back.

Of course, if you add up all of the great decisions I have made for an NBA team, coupled with all of my years of experience working in a pro sports front office (NBA 2K excluded), you end up with the same number as the many millions that I am worth...so whadda I know.

[Spurs Brazil]

JMcDonald_SAEN
Depending on who you talk to, Spurs are waiting on RJ or RJ is waiting on Spurs. @VI_Massive

Piecing together various pieces of intel RT @ReigningBlack Is that a gut feel or have you heard anything more with regards to RJ and Jones?

[ace3g]

Out of the rest of the available SF FA (no specific order):

1. Josh Howard (Injury concern)
2. Matt Barnes
3. Rasual Butler
4. James Jones
5. Tracy McGrady (Injury concern)

I have a strange feeling the Spurs might try and sign Bostjan Nachbar

[smrattler]

Matt Barnes has to be gone from Orlando, right? We can't offer him much money, but we may not have to. I'm hopeful anyway.

[Spurs Brazil]

Cavs have been in contact with free agent forward Matt Barnes, sources say.
Tom Withers: Cavs have had talks with reps. for several free agents, including Flip Murray and Matt Barnes. Team is being patient.

[slick'81]

i just dont see barnes coming here dont know why really

i guess Jjones would be ok as long as rj is back jones could provide another shooter off the pine

[ceperez]

Out of the rest of the available SF FA (no specific order

I have a strange feeling the Spurs might try and sign Bostjan Nachbar

good possibility!

[Obstructed_View]

i just dont see barnes coming here dont know why really

Em oh en ee why.

[Spurs Brazil]

McDonald about RJ

Agree. And I think the Spurs want him back, so that's probably what will end up happening. @ReigningBlack

[Darkwaters]

My list of available Free Agent SF's

1) Rasual Butler
2) Matt Barnes
3) Josh Howard
4) James Jones

[Blackjack]

New Teams Enter Race For Barnes (http://basketball.realgm.com/src_wiretap_archives/68200/20100717/new_teams_enter_race_for_barnes/)

Matt Barnes expected to announce on Friday where he'd sign as a free agent, but the forward's agent says the decision has been delayed.

Aaron Goodwin says additional teams have become involved since it became clear that the Magic will not re-sign Barnes.

"Couple new teams just jumped n2 the game, so I'm sorry 2 say ima have 2 get back 2 you. Ill let yall know something with in the nxt few days," Barnes tweeted on Friday afternoon.

Via Orlando Sentinel

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

I'm really hoping the fact we haven't heard about Spurs' and Butler is that they are working a CIA Pop move. If not, I have no idea why they aren't going there with the rest of the MLE.

[MaNu4Tres]

If not, I have no idea why they aren't going there with the rest of the MLE.

Same reason why they didn't go after Brewer..He's most likely out of the 2.3 million salary range.

[RuffnReadyOzStyle]

Same reason why they didn't go after Brewer..He's most likely out of the 2.3 million salary range.

I agree that Brewer is, but I think Butler could be had for that. Butler is 31, Brewer has a lot more career to play out.

[MaNu4Tres]

I agree that Brewer is, but I think Butler could be had for that. Butler is 31, Brewer has a lot more career to play out.

I'm not saying Butler is worth 4 million like Brewer, but he certainly is worth more than 2.3 million IMO.

Bell's deal for 10 million over 3 years only helped his market value.

Also..

http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf/2010/07/cleveland_cavs_guard_delonte_w.html

"Also on the Cavs' list is forward Rasual Butler, who averaged 11.9 points and 2.9 rebounds for the Los Angeles Clippers. Sources also indicate the Cavs have interest in Antoine Wright, a solid defender who averaged 6.5 points for the Raptors last season, and former Cav Flip Murray, a scoring specialist who averaged 9.9 points with the Bobcats and Bulls in 2009-10."

As you can see Cleveland is reported to be interested in Butler and they have over 9 million in cap space to give him certainly more than 2.3 million.

Time will tell, but I'm willing to bet he nets more than 2.3 million with the Clippers or Cavaliers.

[Anonymous Cowherd]

however, he'd have to play for the Clippers or Cavaliers.

[quentin_compson]

If RJ isn't coming back, getting Barnes for decent money wouldn't be bad. I don't like him that much, though. I also think his D is overrated (still would be better than RJ's, of course).
I don't think he's really going to end up with the Spurs, anyway.

[Leonard Curse]

Dang, I miss Bruce Bowen. :depressed
:( me2

[will_spurs]

:( me2

Another clear indication for me why his jersey should be retired soon, when you see how hard it is to find anybody to step into his shoes.

[Spurs Brazil]

While Brewer and Korver help fill the void after the trade of Kirk Hinrich -- Brewer is an athletic player known for his defense, while Korver is one of the top three-point shooters in the league -- the Bulls might not be done acquiring shooting-guard candidates. They still have room under the salary cap, and NBA sources said the Bulls have had discussions with representatives for Josh Howard, Shannon Brown, Rasual Butler and even Tracy McGrady.

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/basketball/bulls/2505422,CST-SPT-bull17.article

[tdunk21]

While Brewer and Korver help fill the void after the trade of Kirk Hinrich -- Brewer is an athletic player known for his defense, while Korver is one of the top three-point shooters in the league -- the Bulls might not be done acquiring shooting-guard candidates. They still have room under the salary cap, and NBA sources said the Bulls have had discussions with representatives for Josh Howard, Shannon Brown, Rasual Butler and even Tracy McGrady.

http://www.suntimes.com/sports/basketball/bulls/2505422,CST-SPT-bull17.article

i thought shannon brown was close to re-signing with the fakers....

[wildbill2u]

Re: Josh Howard. He was constantly a problem in Dallas because of his 'head' and attitude. Below are some of his negatives

He got his money and got lazy.
Watch him earlier in his career. Watch him the last couple. Night and day.
I know about his injuries. So I give him a pass on some of the dropoff.
But watch him loaf up and down the court. That isnt an injury.
Devin traded...he pouted
Smoking pot...personally dont care one way or another
Anthem...not good
Made of glass...yes
Mental midget...absolutely
Bday party during the season...really?
He quit playing D and quit driving to the rim
He played hard maybe once a week
After missing a month with his ankle he didnt play because of "stomach issues". When a source with the team was asked if he was really sick the source rolled his eyes
Cuban gave this dude NUMEROUS opportunities to get his head right. He couldn't/wouldn't do it.

[Spurs Brazil]

varner48MoH
Buford says Spurs are hopeful to bring Richard Jefferson back and the Spurs want to add at least one more shooter


JMcDonald_SAEN
The frightening prospect of Gee/Hairston/James Jones as your starting SF is one driving factor in Spurs' desire to bring back RJ, I think.

[Obstructed_View]

If nobody was frightened by having Bogans start so many games last year, why are they suddenly afraid of the guy that beat him out for the position?

[ElNono]

Not that starting RJ is any less of a frightening thought, especially on defense...

[Vic Petro]

At least we know they contacted him...

http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf/2010/07/how_close_were_the_cleveland_c.html

Q: Hey, Brian: Would the Cavs have any interest in Richard Jefferson for the upcoming season or two? --Mike Delaney, Mansfield

A: Hey, Mike: Jefferson certainly has interest in the Cavs, who have contacted him. However, after leaving $15 million on the table to get away from the Spurs for no good reason, he's looking for a long-term contact that the Cavs aren't interested in at the moment.

[lurker23]

With the seemingly league-wide lack of interest in giving RJ a long-term deal, one starts to wonder if the Spurs could manage to low-ball him on years too. RJ is probably looking for 4-5 years, but unless someone offers him full MLE for 4-5 years, the Spurs might be able to get him for 3 years, $20 million, which is a fairly absurd value considering his career.

For the sake of RJ's pride when signing this contract, they could even throw in a partial guarantee for a 4th year, or a team option, both of which would make his contract more tradeable in the future, or more of a bargain if he manages to turn his game back around.

[TD 21]

At least one more shooter? Interesting.

With news that Richards isn't coming over, I wonder if the Spurs (if Jones were to re-sign with the Heat) would pursue Novak? He's a knockdown three-point shooter (40.3% career), will come cheap, from what I know of him he seems like Spurs material character wise and he can play the role of a long three or a small four. On the donwside, he can't guard his own shadow and he'd be mostly redundant with Bonner on the roster.

[ducks]

At least we know they contacted him...

http://www.cleveland.com/cavs/index.ssf/2010/07/how_close_were_the_cleveland_c.html

Q: Hey, Brian: Would the Cavs have any interest in Richard Jefferson for the upcoming season or two? --Mike Delaney, Mansfield

A: Hey, Mike: Jefferson certainly has interest in the Cavs, who have contacted him. However, after leaving $15 million on the table to get away from the Spurs for no good reason, he's looking for a long-term contact that the Cavs aren't interested in at the moment.

spurs could just offer a one year deal or a 2 year deal
why lock in for 5 years

[024]

butler is still my first preference but his stock seems fairly high right now. i hope the spurs don't end up with adam morrison...

[Nathan89]

Re: Josh Howard. He was constantly a problem in Dallas because of his 'head' and attitude. Below are some of his negatives

Devin traded...he pouted


He pouted because they traded a young upcoming quick pg and got an old pg with one foot out the door in return. That was one terrible trade, so you can't knock him for recognizing that.

[Blackjack]

With the seemingly league-wide lack of interest in giving RJ a long-term deal, one starts to wonder if the Spurs could manage to low-ball him on years too. RJ is probably looking for 4-5 years, but unless someone offers him full MLE for 4-5 years, the Spurs might be able to get him for 3 years, $20 million, which is a fairly absurd value considering his career.

For the sake of RJ's pride when signing this contract, they could even throw in a partial guarantee for a 4th year, or a team option, both of which would make his contract more tradeable in the future, or more of a bargain if he manages to turn his game back around.

:tu

Had much the same thought.

In the end, I think the Spurs will give him a little more than they have to, but nevertheless wind up with a good value talent-wise. Hopefully they can get him on a McDyess-like contract with the partially guaranteed fourth or some such.

[timaios]

With the seemingly league-wide lack of interest in giving RJ a long-term deal, one starts to wonder if the Spurs could manage to low-ball him on years too. RJ is probably looking for 4-5 years, but unless someone offers him full MLE for 4-5 years, the Spurs might be able to get him for 3 years, $20 million, which is a fairly absurd value considering his career.

For the sake of RJ's pride when signing this contract, they could even throw in a partial guarantee for a 4th year, or a team option, both of which would make his contract more tradeable in the future, or more of a bargain if he manages to turn his game back around.

The problem i have with that strategy : we could have a totally unmotivated Jefferson for the upcoming season.

I think a fair deal would be his (original) 16.22 mil + 2 equivalent of the MLE for 3 years.
16.22 + 5.76 + 6.33 = 28.3 mil
28.3 mil for 3 years = 9.4 mil / season.
You can also give him a 4th year partially guaranteed.

The Spurs can do that because, with RJ opting out, Peter Holt saved a lot of money.

I think Jefferson will be better this year :
- with a good contract
- with a healthy Parker
- in his 2nd season with the Spurs
- because he has a lot to prove

[Obstructed_View]

The problem i have with that strategy : we could have a totally unmotivated Jefferson for the upcoming season.

Isn't that what we had last season?

[MaNu4Tres]

Resign Jefferson 4 years 30 million: partially guaranteed for the 4th year(team option). Worse case scenario: In 2 years(not 3) Jefferson's contract will be a hot trading commodity because its a reasonable expiring (roughly 7-8 million).

Sign James Jones to a two year deal around 4.5 million.

That leaves

Starters(by December)

Parker-Anderson-Jefferson-Duncan-Splitter

Bench

Hill-Ginobili-Jones-Blair-McDyess

Bonner-Hairston(or Temple)

Inactive: Hairston(or Temple), Gee, Gist (Diogu;another young big to stash in Austin; Or a veteran like Jason/Jarron Collins)

[Darkwaters]

The problem i have with that strategy : we could have a totally unmotivated Jefferson for the upcoming season.


Good point. When a player signs a big contract they always play better the next year. :rolleyes

[timaios]

Good point. When a player signs a big contract they always play better the next year. :rolleyes

It's not a big contact for Jefferson. It's a normal contract... again, he saved a lot of Holt's money by opting out.
And if you sign him for a pathetic contract, what will you expect from him this season ?
A fair deal for Jefferson is 8-9 mil / year for 3 or 4 seasons.

[wildbill2u]

Give Jefferson a short contract and he'll have the option of going for big money again--if he performs and his value goes up.

With his personal evaluation of his talent being so high (dropped a 15 million contract) he should be easy to convince.

Then both sides can take a deep breath and see what the future holds.

[Anonymous Cowherd]

The problem i have with that strategy : we could have a totally unmotivated Jefferson for the upcoming season.

I think a fair deal would be his (original) 16.22 mil + 2 equivalent of the MLE for 3 years.
16.22 + 5.76 + 6.33 = 28.3 mil
28.3 mil for 3 years = 9.4 mil / season.
You can also give him a 4th year partially guaranteed.

The Spurs can do that because, with RJ opting out, Peter Holt saved a lot of money.

I think Jefferson will be better this year :
- with a good contract
- with a healthy Parker
- in his 2nd season with the Spurs
- because he has a lot to prove

This contract would be very expensive, as it would put the Spurs into the luxury tax. Spreading the money more evenly over the years would avoid this.

[Bruno]

I think a fair deal would be his (original) 16.22 mil + 2 equivalent of the MLE for 3 years.
16.22 + 5.76 + 6.33 = 28.3 mil
28.3 mil for 3 years = 9.4 mil / season.
You can also give him a 4th year partially guaranteed.


RJ original salary was $15.2M but the main problem with your idea is that it isn't allowed by the CBA.
Raises and decreases are limited to 10.5% of the first year salary. Giving a decreeing salary to RJ is a good idea but it can't decrease as much as that.

[ElNono]

RJ original salary was $15.2M but the main problem with your idea is that it isn't allowed by the CBA.
Raises and decreases are limited to 10.5% of the first year salary. Giving a decreeing salary to RJ is a good idea but it can't decrease as much as that.

I don't think he meant to structure it like that. He was simply running the numbers of his proposal, which adds up to $28m... then splitting it over three seasons, which would be about $9m... that's what the Spurs would be offering RJ, a $9m per contract.

I think it's overpaying, and whoever is thinking he would be a hot trade commodity in 2 seasons please pass me what you're smoking.

[timaios]

I don't think he meant to structure it like that. He was simply running the numbers of his proposal, which adds up to $28m... then splitting it over three seasons, which would be about $9m... that's what the Spurs would be offering RJ, a $9m per contract.

I think it's overpaying, and whoever is thinking he would be a hot trade commodity in 2 seasons please pass me what you're smoking.

Yes, that's what I meant.
I agree that 9 mil per year is too much, but again, Holt saved a LOT of money with RJ opting out.
RJ looks like a fool right now, Spurs FO just need to put an acceptable offer on the table.
I believe it's between 8 & 9 mil per year for at least 3 years (+ a 4th year partially guaranteed).

[DPG21920]

I don't get the "reward a bad fit who made a dumb decision" with a good contract logic. If the Spurs want him back, they should give him not one penny more than the best offer he gets.

If he gets nothing, then you offer him nothing but pennies on the dollar short term.

[Blackjack]

I don't get the "reward a bad fit who made a dumb decision" with a good contract logic. If the Spurs want him back, they should give him not one penny more than the best offer he gets.

If he gets nothing, then you offer him nothing but pennies on the dollar short term.

I personally believe they will pay him a little more than what's needed because they'd want to have him back under the best possible conditions given the circumstance. They still need to have him perform to the best of his ability and showing him a little love after he got his ass humbled and beaten in FA could possibly be the best way to do that.

[HarlemHeat37]

Ya, I agree..

It would be a huge mistake to overpay, but I don't think they should give him his current "market value", since it would be too low..

Jefferson seems to be the moist type that would probably sulk all year due to the way everything has went so far, especially since the media will probably ridicule him all year for opting out and not getting a proper contract..

[MaNu4Tres]

I personally believe they will pay him a little more than what's needed because they'd want to have him back under the best possible conditions given the circumstance. They still need to have him perform to the best of his ability and showing him a little love after he got his ass humbled and beaten in FA could possibly be the best way to do that.

Couldn't have said it any better... :tu

[Blackjack]

Ya, I agree..

It would be a huge mistake to overpay, but I don't think they should give him his current "market value", since it would be too low..

Jefferson seems to be the moist type that would probably sulk all year due to the way everything has went so far, especially since the media will probably ridicule him all year for opting out and not getting a proper contract..

Still haven't gotten used to that avatar. The thought of having an intelligent discussion with ducks . . . :lol

[DPG21920]

So if you sulk, teams should pay you more :lol....This is a great new strategy for NBA players.

IMO he would be sulking regardless.

[Whisky Dog]

Jefferson is washed up and sucks in our system. All the motivation in the world won't change that.

[Cant_Be_Faded]

Pragmatically it makes zero sense for the Spurs to overpay Jefferson one red cent. We pay him the least amount we can get away with.

[Blackjack]

So if you sulk, teams should pay you more :lol....This is a great new strategy for NBA players.

IMO he would be sulking regardless.

It is what it is.

Unfortunately for basketball front offices, players are human. And if you need them to perform at a certain level, there's a certain amount of catering to one's needs and feelings that has to be taken into consideration in a circumstance like this.

He won't be happy but it's hard to be a Jake when a team gives you an unnecessarily kind offer; even if that offer doesn't make up for all of the butthurt.

[Obstructed_View]

So if you sulk, teams should pay you more :lol....This is a great new strategy for NBA players.

IMO he would be sulking regardless.

I'm unsure where this idea that RJ's going to stop giving any effort if he doesn't get paid a lot of money came from. I don't think there's any evidence of his doing that at any time in his career. Furthermore, as you mention, I don't think you can throw more money at a guy to keep him from quitting on you.

[HarlemHeat37]

Usually, I would say no, but he's pretty much the only option the Spurs have right now..I don't think he's going to be any better this year, as you already know DPG(since I was on your side against most people that are desperate to keep him here), so I'm saying the Spurs should give him a reasonable contract to keep him happy..

It's not about "stop giving effort"..it's about Jefferson being extremely mentally weak, as we've already seen..

So while he's going to suck either way, and he should be a bench player, it's better to keep him happy and have a good relationship with the team IMO, especially since he's probably going to be here for years(sadly)..

I would rather the Spurs not re-sign Jefferson instead of giving him more than 2 years, but they obviously will IMO..

[Blackjack]

Basically my sentiments, both as it pertains to my affection for RJ and the Spurs' need for him. Sometimes the best option is a necessary evil.

[Blackjack]

JMcDonald_SAEN

Heard three, heard five with fifth year partial guarantee RT @Amer_Mansour if RJ were to re-sign, how many years/$?

[timvp]

I'd rather the Spurs overpay RJ over three years than give him five years. Three years and $27 million and let's end this charade.

[Blackjack]

My thoughts exactly. :tu

[ElNono]

I'd rather the Spurs overpay RJ over three years than give him five years. Three years and $27 million and let's end this charade.

Why pay $27m if you can pay $20m? I think that's where the Spurs are at this point.

[Blackjack]

I'd shoot between 21 and 24M for 3 years but if tacking on a few extra mil mitigates not giving him another year ... get 'er done.

[Mark in Austin]

My default response would be structure the contract to be as easy to move as possible if the right trade opportunity comes up... but the lockout / CBA makes a lot of this so speculative.

But one thing that is predictable - existing contracts won't be voided, so there will be a lot of teams that will be way over the cap is the new CBA drops it. Even if things don't change significantly, there will be teams looking for relief like now, so I would say do the three year contract - but add a fourth fully or mostly unguaranteed year that gives the Spurs an attracative trade chip.

[Spurs Brazil]

JMcDonald_SAEN

It is. @Stang_08 I thought u said signing Jefferson was pretty much a lock.

[ElNono]

lol trolling McDonald on Twitter...

[Obstructed_View]

It's not about "stop giving effort"..it's about Jefferson being extremely mentally weak, as we've already seen..

So while he's going to suck either way, and he should be a bench player, it's better to keep him happy and have a good relationship with the team IMO, especially since he's probably going to be here for years(sadly)..

I would rather the Spurs not re-sign Jefferson instead of giving him more than 2 years, but they obviously will IMO..

Again, I haven't seen a lot of evidence that he's mentally weak. I think too many Spurs fans are taking it personally that he didn't mesh as well as they thought and that he didn't score the same number of points as he did with the Bucks with only 40 percent of the shots he got with the Bucks. If he's really as useless as many of you say, then I don't quite understand why you wouldn't want Hairston or Gee or free agent x starting in his place.

[Obstructed_View]

I'd rather the Spurs overpay RJ over three years than give him five years. Three years and $27 million and let's end this charade.

What's the hurry? Opting out was a gamble. If it doesn't pay off then the Spurs should get him for market value. He's not an asset that warrants overpaying to lock up.

[TD 21]

I'd shoot between 21 and 24M for 3 years but if tacking on a few extra mil mitigates not giving him another year ... get 'er done.

Same here. I think in the end, he ends up with something like that, but with a partially guaranteed 4th year tacked on. That would give the Spurs the option of using him as an asset in trades going into that 4th year.

[Bruno]

Update: In red, players that are gone:

1. Mike Miller
2. Josh Childress
3. Wesley Matthews
4. Kyle Korver
5. Anthony Morrow
6. Travis Outlaw
7. Linas Kleiza
8. Josh Howard
9. Ronnie Brewer
10. Ryan Gomes
11. Matt Barnes
12. Dorell Wright
13. Rasual Butler
14. Tony Allen
15. Pete Mickeal
16. Quentin Richardson
17. James Jones
18. Bobby Simmons
19. Tracy McGrady
20. Jarvis Hayes
21. Bostjan Nachbar
22. Rodney Carney
23. Stephen Graham
24. Alan Anderson
25. Devin Brown
26. Antoine Wright
27. Joey Graham
28. Dominic McGuire
29. Keith Bogans
30. Damien Wilkins

[DPG21920]

Gross list.

[Blackjack]

How has Nachbar looked in his time away; the guy looked to have a breakthrough and be a real solid player his final year with the Nets.

[slick'81]

yes #29.keith bogans can still be had

butler
barnes
howard
mcgrady
simmons
nachbar

pretty much only decent options get it done sa

[Blackjack]

Definitely a shooter first and foremost in the NBA, but does contribute in other ways, and plays to his strengths very well. Also has a reputation for being an extremely high character guy. Seems likely to return to the NBA this summer, at a reduced price.































And that would be in reference to Bostjan 'Boki' Nachbar.

[Mel_13]

#Cavs had further talks with F Matt Barnes. Interest is mutual. Cavs like his toughness, Barnes looking for PT. Talks likely to continue

http://twitter.com/pdcavsinsider

[Cane]

yes #29.keith bogans can still be had

butler
barnes
howard
mcgrady
simmons
nachbar

pretty much only decent options get it done sa


Seems like its Butler at this point. I don't see the Spurs going after or having a realistic shot at Howard, McGrady, and Barnes.

[HarlemHeat37]

I'm gonna say that they re-sign Jefferson and end it there..that was my preference from the beginning, but I didn't think they would do it..it looks like that's what might happen now..

With Hairston, Temple, Anderson, Gee, and maybe even Neal, I'm sure a few of them will show something good and earn a bench role..compared to the $ difference between those guys and the potential SF signing, I'd rather stick with them..a bench role isn't worth the potential difference in salary/ability IMO..

[MaNu4Tres]

If Spurs want to bring in another wing via Free Agency, Bostjan Nachbar has my vote.

[DPG21920]

He can't defend.

[MaNu4Tres]

He can't defend.

You can't be picky with whats left, he's a 6'9" 38% career 3 point shooter. That is enough for me.

[DPG21920]

I would rather just give the young guys burn.

[Blackjack]

No, but neither can James Jones really, and everyone was all over him.

If the Spurs are going to bring someone in for shooting, I'd go with him; but I've also made it known I don't believe they need to bring anyone else in at this point.

[MaNu4Tres]

I would rather just give the young guys burn.

I agree..

I'm just saying if Spurs still intend on bringing someone in, Nachbar would be my guy.

[Bruno]

RC said that Spurs were looking at shooters and they have made offers to Bell and Jones 2 great shooters. I guess we can deduce that Spurs will go after a shooter.

Rasual Butler, Bobby Simmons, Jarvis Hayes and Bostjan Nachbar are the better shooters of the bunch. Nachbar is a little exotic choice and Butler should be too expensive for Spurs. Simmons and Hayes are my front runner to be signed by Spurs and, quite frankly, it's a little depressing. :depressed

[Blackjack]

If the Spurs are going to bring someone in, I'm guessing they can choose between Nachbar, Simmons and Hayes.

Given the choice, I'd go with Boki, but I'd much rather they play the hell out of their young guys early and let Anderson see what he can do; they've essentially got the same shooters they had last year, only they've substituted Mason for Anderson. That should be fine for the first couple of months of the season (at a minimum).

[elemento]

i don't see the point for another shooter ..why did we draft James Anderson then? Didn't the Spurs bring Bonner back mainly because he is suposed to be a good 3-point shooter?

Our main priority should be a decent SF that can defend ! And it's not RJ.

The best option i see for the money we have is Barnes. SA is not his main option, but the Spurs would be the only option for him if he wants to be a starter.

[Texas_Ranger]

Nachbar is a pretty good defender, he's a good shooter, and can play SF position and even PF position. But he also likes money, he went back to Europe just cause he got a really good deal with Dynamo Moscow. he was on of the most payed players in Europe 2 years ago. Nachbar left Dynamo and said that the team didn't pay him what they said they will, and he was paid just about 30% of what they promised him. He also said last week that he will stay with his team Efes Pilsen, but he is willing to hear an opinion from an NBA team. So if it comes to Simmons, Hayes, Butler and Nachbar, I'd first pick Butler and Boki second.

[ace3g]

if the Spurs signed Nachbar and he plays decently, he could create some match up problems

[slick'81]

nachbar doesnt do much but shoot but i guess thats what the spurs need

[HarlemHeat37]

I only know Nachbar from his time in NJ, since I used to follow them closely when Carter played there..

He was an average defender at best, but he was surprisingly athletic, and he was good for a big game every once in a while..he was one of those extremely frustrating players that made you wonder why he couldn't show his ability more often, since he always "seemed" like he should be better than he was on a consistent basis..

He's more than just a shooter though..he has good ability to get to the rim and draw fouls, and he's a pretty good rebounder too..

I don't know if he has improved or not, but I would pass on him..

[AFBlue]

If the Spurs are going to bring someone in, I'm guessing they can choose between Nachbar, Simmons and Hayes.

Given the choice, I'd go with Boki, but I'd much rather they play the hell out of their young guys early and let Anderson see what he can do; they've essentially got the same shooters they had last year, only they've substituted Mason for Anderson. That should be fine for the first couple of months of the season (at a minimum).

Of this group, I like Bobby Simmons.

Here's what the ESPN scouting report says on him...


Scouting report: A tough, physical wingman, Simmons has the size and shooting ability to occasionally line up as a smallball power forward, providing some added versatility. However, he's not terribly quick and isn't very deft with the dribble -- when he drives it's usually just one dribble for a pull-up. Again, where he excels is on catch-and-shoots from the corners, especially from the left. He has a quick release over his head and can make it with a hand in his face

It goes on to say that he's a physical, tough defender but his lack of athleticism hurts his ability to guard quick 3s.

Still, a corner 3pt shooter who is tough defensively sounds like the best of those options listed above.

[Mr Bones]

I think if someone had suggested signing Bobby Simmons two weeks ago, he would've been run outta spurstalk immediately by 50 searing sarcastic comments. How humble everyone has become late in the free agency season!

[HarlemHeat37]

I'm still in the group of the "50 searing sarcastic comments" regarding Simmons..I can't think of anything clever to say right now though..

[Obstructed_View]

Simmons has unbelievably long arms. Like a shorter version of Larry Sanders long arms. If people want size and corner shooting, he's probably someone to consider.

[Mr Bones]

I'm still in the group of the "50 searing sarcastic comments" regarding Simmons..I can't think of anything clever to say right now though..

:lol Me too. Probably something along the lines of not being able to get minutes on one of the worst teams in history... or something like that.

[ace3g]

Nachbar will be playing in the World Championships, so the Spurs and us can get a better look at him (if he is signed prior to the WC or if we haven't signed anyone and his name comes up in rumors)

http://twitter.com/boki_camp

He is currently doing a blog of his training for the WC

[AFBlue]

What's wrong with Bobby Simmons for the vet min? I'm not advocating for him to be a starter, but as a tough-nosed defender and decent spot-up shooter, the Spurs could do worse.

Or they could sign no one...I don't honestly care. Spurs are likely to re-sign RJ because they clearly haven't been interested in any other starting-calibur SFs on the market, so whether the Spurs stand pat (Hairston, Gee) or sign one of these vet-min types, it really isn't going to make or break a title.

[Obstructed_View]

:lol Me too. Probably something along the lines of not being able to get minutes on one of the worst teams in history... or something like that.

He was fifth in the league in three point percentage, and he's scored 16 ppg in the league before, I think the year he won most improved. If you're looking for a bargain vet who has the skillset the Spurs want and some upside if he gets motivated, this could be your guy. Odds are that he fits better than RJ with the Spurs and that he's going to command quite a bit less money.

[timvp]

Simmons has unbelievably long arms. Like a shorter version of Larry Sanders long arms. If people want size and corner shooting, he's probably someone to consider.

Yeah, he measured 6'7.5 with a wingspan of 7'0.25 wingspan. It pains me that it has even come to this but Bobby Simmons would be a good get right about now. Good three-point shooter, especially from the corners. Decent defender against slower players. Could be used as a stretch four, which would be helpful if Bonner falters.

I'd take Butler first but Simmons wouldn't be much of a drop off from Jones. Top ten active three-point percentage shooter who is only 30. Meh, not bad.

[ElNono]

Yeah, he measured 6'7.5 with a wingspan of 7'0.25 wingspan. It pains me that it has even come to this but Bobby Simmons would be a good get right about now. Good three-point shooter, especially from the corners. Decent defender against slower players. Could be used as a stretch four, which would be helpful if Bonner falters.

I'd take Butler first but Simmons wouldn't be much of a drop off from Jones. Top ten active three-point percentage shooter who is only 30. Meh, not bad.

What are the odds he takes less money to go play for the Clippers? :lol

[Obstructed_View]

What are the odds he takes less money to go play for the Clippers? :lol

He had some good numbers with the Clippers. They might be willing to pay him more than the Spurs can afford.

[ElNono]

He had some good numbers with the Clippers. They might be willing to pay him more than the Spurs can afford.

I forgot he played for the Clips. It was meant to be a joke...

:depressed

[ace3g]

What's wrong with Bobby Simmons for the vet min? I'm not advocating for him to be a starter, but as a tough-nosed defender and decent spot-up shooter, the Spurs could do worse.

Or they could sign no one...I don't honestly care. Spurs are likely to re-sign RJ because they clearly haven't been interested in any other starting-calibur SFs on the market, so whether the Spurs stand pat (Hairston, Gee) or sign one of these vet-min types, it really isn't going to make or break a title.

This was the problem when RJ decided to opt out, before that the Spurs really only needed to sign 1 more SF to have a backup SF (something they did not have last season).

Now the Spurs have 2 scenarios to focus on (which is essentially 3 SF FA):
1. RJ and back up SF
2. starting SF and back up SF from what is left with the available SF FA

[Obstructed_View]

I forgot he played for the Clips. It was meant to be a joke...

:depressed

Unfortunately with this team, you make too many jokes and suddenly wonder why the Spurs are announcing Steve Novak's new contract.

[ElNono]

Wait, Novak played for the Clippers too... :depressed

:lol

[ceperez]

Let me see, we already got Gee at 6'6", so I think Simmons may be redundant. We already have too many 6'6" players that another one isn't going improve our chances.

I'll go with Nachbar at 6'9", I seem to recall a gutsy performance by Nachbar once during the playoffs.

[TD 21]

Yeah, he measured 6'7.5 with a wingspan of 7'0.25 wingspan. It pains me that it has even come to this but Bobby Simmons would be a good get right about now. Good three-point shooter, especially from the corners. Decent defender against slower players. Could be used as a stretch four, which would be helpful if Bonner falters.

I'd take Butler first but Simmons wouldn't be much of a drop off from Jones. Top ten active three-point percentage shooter who is only 30. Meh, not bad.

I feel the same way.

I've talked myself into him. "He's a 40.1% career three point shooter, particularly accurate from the corners. He was a solid player and hard worker before he became badly overpaid, lost motivation and got injured. He's probably thinking this could be his last chance in the NBA and he'll likely be on a one-year deal at or close to the minimum, so he's got to be motivated again."

Butler I just can't imagine being in the Spurs price range. At this point, of course I'd gladly take him over the remaining options, but I don't think he's a realistic option.

[Obstructed_View]

Let me see, we already got Gee at 6'6", so I think Simmons may be redundant. We already have too many 6'6" players that another one isn't going improve our chances.

I'll go with Nachbar at 6'9", I seem to recall a gutsy performance by Nachbar once during the playoffs.

Well they could just trade Blair. After all, both guys are 6'6" so they're the same right? Gee could play Blair's position and then the Spurs could get someone tall.

[dbestpro]

Yeah, he measured 6'7.5 with a wingspan of 7'0.25 wingspan..

NBA.com lists Simmons at 6'6.

[HarlemHeat37]

I don't think Simmons has anything left in the tank, which is why I don't want him..he looked absolutely done last season, he's only going to get worse IMO..

[Blackjack]

I personally really liked Simmons as he was making a name for himself with the Clippers years ago and actually had him targeted for the Spurs in the past -- was a damn good midrange shooter.

But after the move to Milwaukee, the injuries and whatever the hell else happened to him to have him fall off the map, I lost touch. I knew he was pretty good from the corners, but I had no idea how good he had gotten as a 3-point shooter until I saw timvp's chart.

We're talking about a backup here and if the Spurs are to pick up on of these guys, Boki or Simmons would be fine. They both have nice size for the position -- Boki's probably the more pure shooter while Simmons is a little more capable defensively if right and in the right mindset -- and they could work out as backups.

Personally, I'd much rather call Anderson a small forward and go with he and Malik to start the season.

[Mr Bones]

Simmons went the first 95% of this thread completely unmentioned, and now he suddenly has these interesting positive attributes... I think people are just trying to psyche themselves up and looking for a miracle. It's understandable, but I have serious doubts.

[Nathan89]

Let me see, we already got Gee at 6'6", so I think Simmons may be redundant. We already have too many 6'6" players that another one isn't going improve our chances.

I'll go with Nachbar at 6'9", I seem to recall a gutsy performance by Nachbar once during the playoffs.

Simmons weighs 230 plus pounds. Does Gee? Gee we do not need because we have Anderson. Simmons can match up against Artest, Dudley and Turkoglue.

[Blackjack]

I don't think Simmons has anything left in the tank, which is why I don't want him..he looked absolutely done last season, he's only going to get worse IMO..

That bad, huh?

Like I said, I can't remember the last time I really saw him play after the injuries -- Boki might actually be both the better pure shooter and a more capable defender (which would be saying something, none of it good for Simmons).

[Mr Bones]

Simmons cannot match up with Artest, not for one second.

[Obstructed_View]

Simmons went the first 95% of this thread completely unmentioned, and now he suddenly has these interesting positive attributes... I think people are just trying to psyche themselves up and looking for a miracle. It's understandable, but I have serious doubts.

The Spurs don't need a miracle, they need a veteran 3 that can shoot a little bit and maybe defend.

[smrattler]

Supposedly the Spurs wanted JJ. If that's true, they are usually pretty specific about these things. They won't sign guys for the sake of front office activity. I wonder how active they will be the rest of the summer. I wouldn't be surprised if they wait it out now till things dry up for free agents and they can get a real bargain with potentialy big return.

[ElNono]

Simmons cannot match up with Artest, not for one second.

Not even RJ can. That's why Pop ended up putting Bonner on him so he would have to deal with size, and for a while there it seemed to work.

[Blackjack]

If we're worried about Artest offensively we might as well just throw in the towel . . .

[ElNono]

The scary part with the obsession of signing up a shooter is that RMJ might start looking more and more attractive to the FO. I can already hear TPark's trying to rationalize it: "Well, he knows the system already plus he was hurt for half a season..."

Scary thought.

[HarlemHeat37]

Artest is horrible offensively, he's not a worry..

If the Spurs want to bring in Simmons for the minimum and have him compete with the young guys, go for it..I just don't want to see him come here and have the usual veteran spot on the team..

I could be wrong anyways, I just believe he's done from what I watched last season..he could obviously bounce back, I just don't think he will..

I really wouldn't be surprised if Centerpiece returned, TBH..

[MaNu4Tres]

Not even RJ can. That's why Pop ended up putting Bonner on him so he would have to deal with size, and for a while there it seemed to work.

Pop put Bonner on Artest and Jefferson on Odom because Odom is more effective and more of a threat off the dribble. Jefferson had the athleticism necessary to be effective against Odom.

It wasn't because R.J can't guard Artest. Artest was more of a spot up shooter anyway in the Lakers offense (never having the ball to create; which is why Spurs could get away with Bonner guarding him).

[dbestpro]

I would rather give McGrady a shot over Simmons. More likely to catch lightning in a bottle.

[HarlemHeat37]

I would rather give McGrady a shot over Simmons. More likely to catch lightning in a bottle.

I think McGrady is done too, but he has more of a chance to contribute as a point-forward IMO, allowing Manu to move to the starting unit, if the Spurs want that..I definitely agree that T-Mac would have more potential to find some of his talent back..

McGrady would definitely cost more though..

[ceperez]

Assuming we sign RJ, it appears the Spurs have no opening for another SF in the lineup.

PG - Parker, Hill, Temple
SG - Ginobili, Anderson, Hairston
SF - RJ, Gee
PF - Duncan, Bonner, Blair
C - Splitter, McDyess

That is 13 players, one player too many for the daily rotation. Either there's going to be a 2 for 1 trade in the near future or an unguaranteed contract (i.e. Temple, Hairston, Gee) will be waived.

There are 2 players missing but this likely be filled by more d-league players.

[dbestpro]

Hairston and Gee are most likely competing for the same spot.

[ElNono]

Pop put Bonner on Artest and Jefferson on Odom because Odom is more effective and more of a threat off the dribble. Jefferson had the athleticism necessary to be effective against Odom.

It wasn't because R.J can't guard Artest. Artest was more of a spot up shooter anyway in the Lakers offense (never having the ball to create; which is why Spurs could get away with Bonner guarding him).

I was actually watching the games against the Lakers from last season. What Phil did with Artest against us was to have him backdoor cut to the middle right under the basket. Against RJ he just muscled his way for a couple of and1, easy layups or automatic fouls. RJ actually lost him entirely on a couple of occasions. In the last game Pop put Bonner on him and it worked pretty well, because of the added size, Artest was basically hesitant to bring the ball up. So he stayed on the perimeter and tried to post up Odom, who I guess thought had a mismatch with RJ on him. Now, don't forget that Bynum was missing from this game, so Odom was actually playing the post quite a bit. That said, Odom simply doesn't have a post game, and I rather have him taking fadeaway jumpers than what he was doing the two games prior: driving right around and over Dice or Bonner and scoring at will.

[TD 21]

Artest is horrible offensively, he's not a worry..

If the Spurs want to bring in Simmons for the minimum and have him compete with the young guys, go for it..I just don't want to see him come here and have the usual veteran spot on the team..

I could be wrong anyways, I just believe he's done from what I watched last season..he could obviously bounce back, I just don't think he will..

I really wouldn't be surprised if Centerpiece returned, TBH..

In Simmons defense, he only played in 23 games and 395 minutes last season. He was injured to start the season, the Nets were historically bad and had two young players capable of playing his position and he was a veteran in the last year of his deal, so it made sense to play them and not play him.

I don't know whether he's done or not, but at 30 and as a career 40.1% three-point shooter, I think he's worthy of another shot somewhere for the minimum.

As recently as two seasons ago, he was still an NBA player. Not necessarily a good one, or a starting caliber one and clearly an overpaid one, but an NBA player nonetheless. I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt.

I'd be very surprised if Centerpiece returned. The Spurs have clearly prioritized three-point shooting and he doesn't fit the bill. Besides, the Spurs have a younger, more athletic version of him already.

[ceperez]

Hairston and Gee are most likely competing for the same spot.

Even if it is the same spot, that still makes 12 roster spots occupied.

No sense signing a free-agent without a roster spot open for that player.

[Nathan89]

Assuming we sign RJ, it appears the Spurs have no opening for another SF in the lineup.

PG - Parker, Hill, Temple
SG - Ginobili, Anderson, Hairston
SF - RJ, Gee
PF - Duncan, Bonner, Blair
C - Splitter, McDyess

That is 13 players, one player too many for the daily rotation. Either there's going to be a 2 for 1 trade in the near future or an unguaranteed contract (i.e. Temple, Hairston, Gee) will be waived.

There are 2 players missing but this likely be filled by more d-league players.

Temple will not suit up because all the pg minutes will be taken up between ghill and parker. So he is not one of the 12. Only one out of hairston and gee will suit up. That is 11 out of 12 spots filled. We still need one more FA signing.

[ceperez]

Temple will not suit up because all the pg minutes will be taken up between ghill and parker. So he is not one of the 12. Only one out of hairston and gee will suit up. That is 11 out of 12 spots filled. We still need one more FA signing.

Disagree, despite the effectiveness of Hill and Parker, I thing you'll need at least 3 point guards in the rotation during the regular season.

[Nathan89]

Disagree, despite the effectiveness of Hill and Parker, I thing you'll need at least 3 point guards in the rotation during the regular season.

He will not see the court as the third string pg. I think we need 5 sg/sf, just like we have 5 pf/c on the 12 roster. It will help us if they get in foul trouble. Also if one guy is not shooting well we can just put in another guy. It also helps with match-ups. We just do not need a third string pg because pg is one of are strengths. We will not have match issues or bad games from the pg position. If there is foul trouble at pg we can then just play manu at the pg spot.

[MaNu4Tres]

It's July 19th and Jefferson is the most realistic/most viable option...

Who would have thunk it???

[Darkwaters]

I doubt Gee suits up. He likely spends the entire year in Austin with just a few call-ups to get his feet wet like we did with Hairston a few years ago. He looks very intriguing, but hes got a long way to go.

I'm really not sold on Hairston. I think those two compete for a spot and only one of them gets it. But it probably makes more sense to keep Gee as he can to to Austin for one more year like Hairston cannot.

[barbacoataco]

The Spurs need Hairston, or someone, at the SF position who can play some defense. As much as he was hated on this board, Bogans had that role last year and someone has to fill it this year.

[Interrohater]

The Spurs need Hairston, or someone, at the SF position who can play some defense. As much as he was hated on this board, Bogans had that role last year and someone has to fill it this year.

Right, a lot of people are disregarding Hairston and his play, mainly because we've just seen the Summer League and the big topic has been Alonzo Gee. Hairston is a better player than Gee, I highly doubt that it's a tossup between them.

[Obstructed_View]

Right, a lot of people are disregarding Hairston and his play, mainly because we've just seen the Summer League and the big topic has been Alonzo Gee. Hairston is a better player than Gee, I highly doubt that it's a tossup between them.

But Gee is fresh in everyone's mind. He MUST be better.

[TJastal]

It's July 19th and Jefferson is the most realistic/most viable option...

Who would have thunk it???

Ahh, yah... can't wait to bring back that dynamite Parker/Jefferson starting combo.. just can't wait.

[yavozerb]

Ahh, yah... can't wait to bring back that dynamite Parker/Jefferson starting combo.. just can't wait.

Just like you couldn't wait for Splitter to stay in europe? :lol

[TJastal]

Wait, is Matt Barnes available at a fraction of the cost of Jefferson? And he's never been accused of being soft?

Who would have thunk it?

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Wait, is Matt Barnes available at a fraction of the cost of Jefferson? And he's never been accused of being soft?

Who would have thunk it?

There's a reason why he's never been in the same team for two consecutive seasons, apart from GS, but they couldn't wait to kick him out. He's a douche, he's also a much worse basketball player compared to RJ.

Also, Pop doesn't coach assholes.

[ElNono]

I don't think Barnes is the kind of player RC talks about when he says players for this team need to have certain character fiber. Sure, we have had some misfits before, like Glenn Robinson, but they were already on their way out of the league pretty much.

I just don't see Pop putting up with his attitude.

[TJastal]

There's a reason why he's never been in the same team for two consecutive seasons, apart from GS, but they couldn't wait to kick him out. He's a douche, he's also a much worse basketball player compared to RJ.

Also, Pop doesn't coach assholes.

Wow, you really hate Matt Barnes, almost sounds personal.

IIRC there used to be a somebody on the spurs with a little nasty in his game. A little dirty. Bruce Bowen ring a bell? I guess you forgot about ol' nasty Bruce. The spurs could use a guy like that, huh?

As far as being a worse basketball player than RJ that's debatable. I'd take Barnes, myself, at a fraction of the cost. He's a better defensive player and he would bring a toughness and an edge to the team. He's a better shooter than RJ, IMO.

Remember the spurs are supposedly looking for defense first and 3pt shooting second out of that position.. so who cares if RJ is more talented, when he doesn't fit in the starting lineup.. IMO it's as much to do with being a "fit" to the team and last year proved RJ and Parker are not good fits. Barnes would fit the mold of defense first, 3pt shooter second.

Sure he's a journeyman player that's been bouncing around, but so was Bogans last year. Barnes however actually brings something to the table the spurs need at the 3, which is size... the guy is a full 6'8" and has equivalent length of a 6'10" player. Combine that with decent lateral quickness and you have a fairly decent defensive stopper.

C'mon BG_Spurs_Fan what ya got against Matt? Hell, we could have two Matt's on the team, wouldn't that be cool? :rollin

[TJastal]

I don't think Barnes is the kind of player RC talks about when he says players for this team need to have certain character fiber. Sure, we have had some misfits before, like Glenn Robinson, but they were already on their way out of the league pretty much.

I just don't see Pop putting up with his attitude.

What "attitude" do you speak of? He's no different than Bruce Bowen, except Bowen was more subtle in the way he went about his business, where Barnes is in your face.

Fickleness has got us where exactly the last two years? Oh, right. 1st round exit and 2nd round sweep. But at least we got a team of choir boys.

[ohmwrecker]

I think what they mean by saying Barnes has an "attitude" is that he is a dumbass. Bowen was a smart player. RJ is a much better player than Barnes, and it's not really debatable.

[TJastal]

I think what they mean by saying Barnes has an "attitude" is that he is a dumbass. Bowen was a smart player. RJ is a much better player than Barnes, and it's not really debatable.

In about 7 less minutes a game Matt Barnes outrebounded Jefferson, shot a better % from the field (and from the 3pt line), almost out-assisted him, and this doesn't even mention defense (which is Barnes strong suit). And your saying it's not even debatable?

:lmao