Brent Barry In The Finals

[timvp]

Where does he fit? I'm not sure you can even put him on the court. He'd get abused by Prince in the low blocks and can't chase Rip around screens. I don't see how he's going to get playing time without giving up a lot on the defensive end.

Am I missing something?

[Mr. Body]

He'll be fine. He's an important part of the rotation and needs to get in there. He wasn't abused against Phoenix, was he?

[Kori Ellis]

Phoenix was perfect for him -- no perimeter D and a running game. It's completely the opposite going against Detroit. He'll have trouble finding a niche in this series.

[timvp]

I said he was going to have a monster Phoenix series. I just don't see it this series. Sure, the Spurs can try to match him up against Lindsey Hunter ... but even that isn't a great matchup for him.

[Mr. Body]

How's Devin Brown feeling?

[timvp]

Glenn Robinson might be a major factor in this series. I think he'd matchup with Prince well.

[Mr. Body]

I tentatively expect some fantastic things from Robinson in this series, too.

[mavsfan1000]

No Brent Barry and No Rasho Nesterovic

[Sense]

No Brent Barry and No Rasho Nesterovic


Both of them can help this team alot, just like they have the whole season... I think barry can get help defensively... I'll be the first to say that the pistons arent really of an offensive threat if we help barry.

[mavsfan1000]

Maybe Barry but if you put Nesterovic in there, Ben Wallace would be dominating the interior on defense because he isn't worried about Rasho being a scoring threat. If you put Horry in there he would either have to guard Duncan or Horry which is a tougher matchup for Ben Wallace.

[Kori Ellis]

Rasho will get playing time (but not as much as he would have against the Heat). He did a decent job in the last regular season game against the Pistons with Tim down he had 13 and 6. Ben had 8/9.

[mavsfan1000]

Rasho will get playing time (but not as much as he would have against the Heat). He did a decent job in the last regular season game against the Pistons with Tim down he had 13 and 6. Ben had 8/9.
I'm sure he would score more because B. Wallace will be wondering in the paint trying to block shots from Parker and Ginobili. B. Wallace is a much better team defender but if you put Horry in there Ben Wallace can't stay in the paint waiting to block shots.

[slayermin]

Detroit doesn't really double, from what I have seen. So I agree that Brent will be hard pressed to get open looks.

[DesiSpur_21]

IMO, Barry should see some good PT (definitely not as big as Suns series) esp. with Devin's non-availability. He is just coming off a good series and there is no reason to believe he is going to stink against Pistons. As for him defending Prince, I don't think Prince is going to shoot the lights out because Barry will be in when Timmy and Nazr are on the court - so Prince cannot get away with whatever he can.

A lineup of Manu,Barry,Beno,Timmy,Nazr could make sense.

Yeah , you have to respect the defending champions' great D, but that's not a reason to undermine our offensive execution with any lineup.

[Sense]

Maybe Barry but if you put Nesterovic in there, Ben Wallace would be dominating the interior on defense because he isn't worried about Rasho being a scoring threat. If you put Horry in there he would either have to guard Duncan or Horry which is a tougher matchup for Ben Wallace.



Ben wallace never dominated a game when Rasho was with him...


I don't think you should make remarks on games you never watched..

You have to remember you are a MAvs fan.

[timvp]

I'd be interested in knowing Whottt's stance on this.

[mavsfan1000]

I mean defense and rebounding. Horry would force him to not camp in the paint and actually have to come out. This opens driving lanes for Parker and Ginobili. He would have to respect Horry's shooting or guard Duncan which takes Rasheed off Duncan.

[whottt]

My stance is that Barry won't get much PT in this series...

Pop logic dicates that when you play a a low scoring defense oriented team, instead of trying to get more offense...you play down to the competition by acting like they are the 96 Bulls and play players and a style of ball that makes it even harder to score...

So...Barry will get fewer minutes, Pop will go half court O and throw the advantage to the Pistons, when he should be wanting to run even more than he did against Phoenix...

Barry'll go back into the mode of 1-3 in 18-19 minutes...and people will go back to saying he's got no sac and is a choker, when our starting and all D lineups choke due to shitty ball handling and stagnant O, and Barry doesn't see a meaningful minute in the 4th...


Against a great defensive team ball handling and offensive minded players should be at a premium...my hunch is that the Spurs will do just the opposite and try and grind it out against a team that is better at the grind it out game than they are...

In short...we have more versatility than the Pistons but we won't use it...we'll try to beat them with our old grinding style of play...something we are no longer the best in the NBA at...something the Pistons are just about the best in the NBA at.

It seems to me that in a defensive struggle offense becomes the swing factor...but not in SA...we try to put out the fire with gas.


The Pistons one weakness is team speed...they are not a good running team and they got owned by just about every running team they played this season, no matter how big the game was...I will be very happy if the Spurs try to attack that weakness...but I don't believe Pop will do that.

[Mr. Body]

Pop has said the team will try to push the ball, so I expect them to try. If they gear up the running game, then Barry will get more burn... and I don't expect the Pistons to be able to match the point production. Whottt is correct, that Detroit's team speed doesn't match well and if they have to get into a shooting match to keep up with production, well, that's what words like 'avalanche' were made for.

The big obstacle is, though, that the Pistons have been handling the ball very well and not turning it over. But pushing it regardless will help, even just feints. It will force them to go away from offensive boards.

[polandprzem]

Pop was mentionning Glenn. If Barry can't handle the job I agree with POP.
But I do not see the stagnat offens because spurs will want that to do. The Pistons are heck of a defensive team. They would not allow spurs to get funky (or how U vcan call it)

[Sense]

My stance is that Barry won't get much PT in this series...

Pop logic dicates that when you play a a low scoring defense oriented team, instead of trying to get more offense...you play down to the competition by acting like they are the 96 Bulls and play players and a style of ball that makes it even harder to score...

So...Barry will get fewer minutes, Pop will go half court O and throw the advantage to the Pistons, when he should be wanting to run even more than he did against Phoenix...

Barry'll go back into the mode of 1-3 in 18-19 minutes...and people will go back to saying he's got no sac and is a choker, when our starting and all D lineups choke due to shitty ball handling and stagnant O, and Barry doesn't see a meaningful minute in the 4th...


Against a great defensive team ball handling and offensive minded players should be at a premium...my hunch is that the Spurs will do just the opposite and try and grind it out against a team that is better at the grind it out game than they are...

In short...we have more versatility than the Pistons but we won't use it...we'll try to beat them with our old grinding style of play...something we are no longer the best in the NBA at...something the Pistons are just about the best in the NBA at.

It seems to me that in a defensive struggle offense becomes the swing factor...but not in SA...we try to put out the fire with gas.


The Pistons one weakness is team speed...they are not a good running team and they got owned by just about every running team they played this season, no matter how big the game was...I will be very happy if the Spurs try to attack that weakness...but I don't believe Pop will do that.


You give good points, but you have to remember how good the Spurs have been against the Pistons... and logic sometimes won't see that..

Interesting...so you believe the Spurs will lose?

[whottt]

give a memo to pop whott


Pop knows where to look when he needs solutions...As long as he keeps doing like I say...we'll be ok...I just don't trust him to keep doing it.

I think when the pressure is on Pop is going to get conservative...and that's deadly against the Pistons...they play conservative better than we do...it wasn't always that way, but it is now. Get conversative and we can't exploit our edge in athleticism.

[whottt]

You give good points, but you have to remember how good the Spurs have been against the Pistons... and logic sometimes won't see that..

Interesting...so you believe the Spurs will lose?

On paper we should win, on paper they should end up with our foot stuck up their asses...the Pistons are so fucking over-rated it's not even funny. I just know Pop's tendencies...if Pop plays to his career long tendencies the Pistons will beat us.

TimVP made a good point when he said these Pistons were built to beat the Spurs...

They were built to beat the Spurs, the Duncan and aging Drob Spurs...not the Duncan, Manu and Parker Spurs...

These Pistons can't hang with the Duncan, Manu and Parker Spurs, they aren't built for it. It's going to be up to Pop to decide which team the Pistons will face...

And I know Drob isn't here anymore...which is why if that is the team the Pistons end up facing...we will lose. I hope Pop knows Drob isn't here anymore and doesn't play to the Pistons strengths...half court and grind it out. They are better at it than we are and they will destroy 4 down.

[Gerryatrics]

I also think that Barry isn't going to get a lot of floor time against the Pistons. I don't think he'll get burned again like he did the last time he tried to defend Prince, especially with a mostly healthy team. But unless the Spurs run and move the basketball, Brent isn't going to get any touches on the offensive end, and unless he pulls a Seattle Game 1 & 2 like defensive performance, he'll probably be a defensive liability. The Suns series was his chance to step up and prove himself, and I think he did. But now I would think Pop is going to go back to the old Spurs style of basketball, and Brent Barry just doesn't fit in with that game plan.

[DesiSpur_21]

Going by the conventional wisdom of Spurs playing 48-minute half-court ball, what y'all are saying makes sense. But Pop has outgrown himself and allows some free-wheeling in the game. He has been like that all season as he has let Tony and Manu to run in a lot of games. Not underestimating Pistons' 'D', Spurs are much more capable in the running game against them.

My thinking is Pop is going to use this Running-game strength of the team and uses Barry. I am not sure how Detroit is defend this, but they definitely can't score at that pace against us.

You have to depend on your strengths rather than get bullied by what opponents do.

[xcoriate]

I think Brent can find a place in all this. Pistons aren't the most potent offensive team so any defensive liability he brings along hardly allows for it to be maximized.

If he is spacing the floor with well timed jumpers and even penetrating/dishing a little I think the pros far outweigh the cons. If he forces the defence to play him then there is no reason he can't outplay his man if it its one of the pistons bench players.

[spurster]

I think Brent on Prince will be fine. I would guess that the Spurs strategy will be to shut down Hamilton. Hold Hamilton to under 10, limit offensive rebounds, and let's see how much offense the rest of the Pistons can put up.

[orhe]

Grob Grob Grob Grob Grob Grob Grob Grob

[SPARKY]

Indeed. As much as people seem to think this series will be decided between the Spurs' O and the Pistons' D, I think the Pistons' O v. Spurs' D matchup will be what decides the series. I guess it's always assumed that Detroit is facing a team with a much weaker defense so their lackluster offense is not as much of an issue.

Not this time.

[spurs_fan_in_exile]

I think Brent will likely see less minutes than he did in Phoenix, but I doubt that it will be because Prince is torching him. Remember how Rashard Lewis was going to abuse him in the post? And Lewis was bigger and just as athletic as Prince. With that said, I don't think he's going to get a lot of open looks, and given how well Beno played both in the last series as well as against the Pistons in the regular season Barry's minutes are going to take a hit. And if Glen Robinson is going to get into the mix Brent is probably going to be the guy whose minutes suffer the most for it as well. Still it'll be nice to have him around for FT shooting if nothing else.

[GrandeDavid]

Where's Master Yoda to respond to this one when you need him!? LJ, let's just hope the force is with Barry and the Spurs' team D.

[SWC Bonfire]

This may be a physical series, possibly even w/ perimeter guys with foul issues. Brent is going to have to be a professional, dig deep find something to contribute to the team if that's the case. If he does get in the game, I would expect him to use some hustle if he's not shooting well, such as chasing down long rebounds.

[TDMVPDPOY]

We dont have to bring him in to gaurd billups or rip, when those 2 are bench we bring in barry and udrih to light them up

[SPARKY]

Detroit is capable of defending TD, Manu, and TP at the same time. The problem for Detroit is that the Spurs can put 4th and 5th guys on the court (GRob, Horry, Nazr) who can make them pay. Barry can be in that group if he nuts up...

[TwoHandJam]

I agree with Whottt on this one. Pop has been known to pucker up and crawl into his shell of grind-it-out offense when the chips are down. Our defense is generally as good as the Pistons but not as consistent. However, our offense and athleticism is far superior to the Pistons. If we defend moderately but really push the tempo on offense, I don't think the Pistons can hang with us.

It's up to Pop to make sure we don't fall into the trap of solely playing a grind-it-out halfcourt game against the Pistons and squandering our advantage. It's encouraging that he's been hinting at this in the press but I hope it's not just lip service and that he really does stick to it - even when the pressure is on.

[SPARKY]

The defenses are equal, if not with a slight edge to the Spurs. I think the Spurs' transition D is a tad bit better. Detroit is going to have a much tougher time scoring on the Spurs than the Spurs will have in scoring on them.

While both team's defensive strategies dictate their offensive pace, the Spurs can handle an uptempo game defensively much more proficiently than Detroit.

[ChumpDumper]

Pop's going to try to keep the pace up and play Barry his regular 26 minutes in the first game and see how it goes.

[nkdlunch]

We'll need Rasho big time. Barry can be the waterboy.

[wildbill2u]

My stance is that Barry won't get much PT in this series...

So...Barry will get fewer minutes, Pop will go half court O and throw the advantage to the Pistons, when he should be wanting to run even more than he did against Phoenix...

Against a great defensive team ball handling and offensive minded players should be at a premium...my hunch is that the Spurs will do just the opposite and try and grind it out against a team that is better at the grind it out game than they are...

The Pistons one weakness is team speed...they are not a good running team and they got owned by just about every running team they played this season, no matter how big the game was...I will be very happy if the Spurs try to attack that weakness...but I don't believe Pop will do that.

You make some good points--but I read several items out of the Spurs practices this week that indicated Pop was preparing them to run more against the Pistons after seeing how well the team did in the West playoffs.

[wildbill2u]

The defenses are equal, if not with a slight edge to the Spurs. I think the Spurs' transition D is a tad bit better. Detroit is going to have a much tougher time scoring on the Spurs than the Spurs will have in scoring on them.

While both team's defensive strategies dictate their offensive pace, the Spurs can handle an uptempo game defensively much more proficiently than Detroit.

I think the Spurs defense if better if for no other reason than they play the majority of their games against tougher teams in the West all season. It's a little easier to play defense--and build your stats--against Atlanta than even the Clippers, no?

[Supergirl]

Phoenix was perfect for him -- no perimeter D and a running game. It's completely the opposite going against Detroit. He'll have trouble finding a niche in this series.

Yup.

[FromWayDowntown]

I'd argue that Brent would lose most if not all of his minutes in this series were Devin Brown healthy.

That said, I agree with whottt's take that Pop tends to shut off the offensive valves in situations like this unless/until he is forced to find some offensive skill (Steve Kerr, Game 6, 2003 WCF; Steve Kerr, Game 5, 2003 Finals, for examples). It's a dilemma, because points should be at a premium in this series and giving up points with defensive inadequacy will put you in a hole that you may never climb out of.

With that said, Barry was very effective, for example, in the last regular season game against Houston (the Rockets are kind of "Pistons Light" IMO) and perhaps Pop will reflect upon that and use Barry along with Manu as initiators if Tony turns passive.

[Manu'sMagicalLeftHand]

When practise finished last night, Pop talked to Brent to show him his designed spot in different plays.

http://images.lowes.com/general/d/doghouse.jpg

[mavsfan1000]

We'll need Rasho big time. Barry can be the waterboy.
This series doesn't suit Rasho well. He isn't needed on defense against Ben and he is not good on offense.

[1Parker1]

Call me crazy, but what about Barry seeing minutes at the point, when Billups is resting and/or Tony not having a good game? Barry makes pretty good decisions usually and hardly makes that many boneheaded plays anyways.

Actually, if Barry comes in and hits some 3's, that would force Detroit to respect him and put a defender out on the perimeter, making the lane easier for Manu and/or Tony.

Just a thought. Probably won't happen anyway.

[mavsfan1000]

Horry should get alot of minutes at PF and Duncan at center in this series.

[spur219]

Glenn Robinson better be in shape by now because he will get his number called more often in this series.

[ca®lo]

its time for barry to show up.

spurs didnt bring him in just to do well against the suns right? :)

[TNT21]

What if we run Barry at the point and have him post Billups up? I know Barry isn't a big post up kinda guy, but hey it might work!

[Flipmode Master]

I think Barry has the potential to be HUGE in this series. I feel like Pop should run soem plays for him(yes I said it), to free him up for the three. Barry hits those and it opens the lane even more.

[timvp]

It was even worse than I thought it was going to be. Barry can't play in this series except for the few times Pop can match him up with Lindsey Hunter. Going to Robinson and Brown was a smart thing to do.

[T Park]

Brown is waaaayyyy too rusty.


Robinson and thats it.


Brent Barry has officially become the most overpaid joke of a FA in this franchise's history.

[whottt]

:lol

[T Park]

Hes resorted to no stupid answers.

Just laughs.

[whottt]

I can't help it's that Barry is skinny.

[MaNuMaNiAc]

On paper we should win, on paper they should end up with our foot stuck up their asses...the Pistons are so fucking over-rated it's not even funny. I just know Pop's tendencies...if Pop plays to his career long tendencies the Pistons will beat us.

TimVP made a good point when he said these Pistons were built to beat the Spurs...

They were built to beat the Spurs, the Duncan and aging Drob Spurs...not the Duncan, Manu and Parker Spurs...

These Pistons can't hang with the Duncan, Manu and Parker Spurs, they aren't built for it. It's going to be up to Pop to decide which team the Pistons will face...

And I know Drob isn't here anymore...which is why if that is the team the Pistons end up facing...we will lose. I hope Pop knows Drob isn't here anymore and doesn't play to the Pistons strengths...half court and grind it out. They are better at it than we are and they will destroy 4 down.
Way to stay on the fence and not pick a side! You're covered every which way! Pick a side Whottt!!

[milkyway21]

...
Brent Barry has officially become the most overpaid joke of a FA in this franchise's history.:cry

San Antonio fans are the BEST ? :huh

Truth? Some people here love Shaq, the Spurs' # 1 nemesis, Olojawon, the one who says "David that MVP trophy is mine", etc., but can't find love or just respect a member of their 2005 finals team,

it's so sad to learn that despite Barry's unassuming ways, 4-4 3s in one Denver game, doing some charitable work, respect & love for Tim Duncan, San Antonio team & the community, he's still an outsider, as if he doesn't belong.

or at least give some respect for Pops & R.C's choice of FA...so sad :depressed

come on.

[ShoogarBear]

Brent Barry was just adequate against a Phoenix team he was made to beat.

The only way he gets minutes against Detroit is if he shows he can be aggressive with his shot and provide some instant offense.

He did none of that last night.

[1Parker1]

Actually, according to Whott in the chatroom, "Barry having 4 fouls indicated that he's at least attempting to play some defense...he only had 1 really stupid foul." :lol


Sorry Whott, couldn't resist! Don't take it personally, I still love ya! :spin

[whottt]

:cry

San Antonio fans are the BEST ? :huh

Truth? Some people here love Shaq, the Spurs' # 1 nemesis, Olojawon, the one who says "David that MVP trophy is mine", etc., but can't find love or just respect a member of their 2005 finals team,

it's so sad to learn that despite Barry's unassuming ways, 4-4 3s in one Denver game, doing some charitable work, respect & love for Tim Duncan, San Antonio team & the community, he's still an outsider, as if he doesn't belong.

or at least give some respect for Pops & R.C's choice of FA...so sad :depressed

come on.


milkyway...don't separate from the hive mind.

Remember...1. Hate Barry. 2.We are incapable of winning a game without Devin Brown. Do not deviate from the hive. No matter good an idea it seems at the time, no matter if it seems to stupid to you to not say something...

Do not deviate from the hive. Just hate Barry unrelentingly, minimize his good contributions, magnify his bad games. Yes he doesn't deserve it....yes there is not a shred of statistical basis for doing it...

Yes even going scoreless he only scored 2 points less than anyone else on our bench and tied the starter who never is required to score a single point no matter how much court time he gets.

Just hate...he'll be gone this offseason if there is a god and the Barry haters and those that don't hate will be the happier for it. He'll get the ring he was a gutless pussy and signed with the leading title contender to try and get even though he's afraid...and everything will work out.



Just don't use independent thought...the board dictates hatred of Barry and I just reccomend you do it...it doesn't matter why....because it's not about having a legitimate reason to hate the dude...it's just about hating him.

Do what TPark would do...eat and hate. You'll be fine.

Don't make the same mistake I made and have an open mind about it...just hate. I give you this sound advice with my last shred of sanity. I don't want this to happen to another person. And please tell my wife and kids I loved them if you don't hear from me again.

[Solid D]

Pop will use Barry. There will be situations when the lane is collapsed and the Spurs need to score. If he's on...he'll get more PT. If not, he'll get less but he'll still get time because he does know how to move the ball, particularly when ball reversals are needed.

He played awful on Thursday, though.

[SilverPlayer]

You know even if we are discouraged by Barry's play it doesn't mean we don't root for him. My wife and I regularly try to cheer him on through the TV. Doesn't mean that I don't come back here and say he sucked in the last game though. I try not to bag on Barry too much but he certainly hasn't lived up to the most modest of expectations. I hope Glen Robinson replaces him next year in the rotation.

[myhc]

Do what TPark would do...eat and hate. You'll be fine.


:rollin

[milkyway21]

milkyway...don't separate from the hive mind.

Remember...1. Hate Barry. 2.We are incapable of winning a game without Devin Brown. Do not deviate from the hive. No matter good an idea it seems at the time, no matter if it seems to stupid to you to not say something...

Do not deviate from the hive. Just hate Barry unrelentingly, minimize his good contributions, magnify his bad games. Yes he doesn't deserve it....yes there is not a shred of statistical basis for doing it...

Yes even going scoreless he only scored 2 points less than anyone else on our bench and tied the starter who never is required to score a single point no matter how much court time he gets.

Just hate...he'll be gone this offseason if there is a god and the Barry haters and those that don't hate will be the happier for it. He'll get the ring he was a gutless pussy and signed with the leading title contender to try and get even though he's afraid...and everything will work out.



Just don't use independent thought...the board dictates hatred of Barry and I just reccomend you do it...it doesn't matter why....because it's not about having a legitimate reason to hate the dude...it's just about hating him.

Do what TPark would do...eat and hate. You'll be fine.

Don't make the same mistake I made and have an open mind about it...just hate. I give you this sound advice with my last shred of sanity. I don't want this to happen to another person. And please tell my wife and kids I loved them if you don't hear from me again.sorry Whott, i can't do that.

i don't really care if he'll be traded this summer or stay a Spur after a non-memorable performance this season. But i respect ALL the Spurs players (though i only have one favorite player in Tim Duncan).

I just can't understand WHY we can't stop from mocking Brent Barry. Or are we just making a joke out of it?

We ARE in the finals, aren't we? Then, at least enjoy and show some love

:makeout

[T Park]

Hate = Truth

according to Mrs. Barry.

[milkyway21]

Hate = Truth

according to Mrs. Barry.so, it's confirmed. you hate Brent Barry. :oops

at least you could explain WHY?

[whottt]

Pop will use Barry. There will be situations when the lane is collapsed and the Spurs need to score. If he's on...he'll get more PT. If not, he'll get less but he'll still get time because he does know how to move the ball, particularly when ball reversals are needed.

He played awful on Thursday, though.

Yeah he played bad...

But no one on our bench had a good night shooting...he got in foul trouble but most of it was because he was trying to play D because he knew he wasn't gonna stay on the court if he didn't...

The simple fact of the matter if that none of our Spurs heroes have ever shot as well in their first year here as Brent Barry is shooting now...

And the only guy that scored signifigantly more PPG was Manu.

That's the reality of it...

And it's sickening because when the dude actually does step up...every one discounts it, they subtract it...as if the others scored the exact PPG during their playoffs runs...or they say it was the timing...

None of that stuff holds water...

I flat out lose respect for anyone that thinks Barry is performing worse in his shooting than guys like Jaren Jackson, Mario Elie, Steve Kerr...ect, did in their first year here...he's shooting far and away better than any of those guys did...it's not even close.

[Brodels]

I flat out lose respect for anyone that thinks Barry is performing worse in his shooting than guys like Jaren Jackson, Mario Elie, Steve Kerr...ect, did in their first year here...he's shooting far and away better than any of those guys did...it's not even close.

Did you even bother to look?

Jaren Jackson was a pretty sucky shooter throughout his career. But he shot better in his first year as a Spur than his career average. Sure, Barry shot the ball better, but Barry's a better shooter. The fact is that being on the Spurs allowed Jaren to shoot better than his career average.

And Elie shot over 47% his first year on the Spurs. That's right on par with his career average and better than Barry shot this season. Elie's three point percentage was 37.4%, which was also is better than Brent shot from downtown this season. You'll have to clarify on this: how did Brent shoot "far and away" better than Elie?

And you're right about Kerr. He didn't shoot very well in his first year with the team, but he didn't play very much either. He played meager minutes in 44 games.

So Jaren actually did better than his career averages during his first year on the team. Elie shot about the same from the field and raised his three point shooting. And again, you look like a fool.

[whottt]

Did you even bother to look?

I meant in the playoffs...you know the context that you and other haters have chosen to focus on all fucking seasonb and only now when your own weak ass argument got stuck up your ass have you lost your enthusiasm for focusing on.

Playoffs..figure it the fuck out...You aren't in some elite club that realizes Barry had a substandard, for him, regular season...There have only been about 6.3 billion posts discussing it...I don't think I all of a sudden forgot about it.




Jaren Jackson was a pretty sucky shooter throughout his career. But he shot better in his first year as a Spur than his career average. Sure, Barry shot the ball better, but Barry's a better shooter. The fact is that being on the Spurs allowed Jaren to shoot better than his career average.

This is even stupider than your last anti-Barry argument...Nazr is shooting better from 3 than his career average as well...I guess that means we should be using him from 3.




And Elie shot over 47% his first year on the Spurs. That's right on par with his career average and better than Barry shot this season. Elie's three point percentage was 37.4%, which was also is better than Brent shot from downtown this season. You'll have to clarify on this: how did Brent shoot "far and away" better than Elie?

Look at what he did in the playoffs...maybe then you'll see the blatant double standard you used to label Barry a choker.


And you're right about Kerr. He didn't shoot very well in his first year with the team, but he didn't play very much either. He played meager minutes in 44 games.


So Jaren actually did better than his career averages during his first year on the team. Elie shot about the same from the field and raised his three point shooting. And again, you look like a fool.

No...you look like you can't read...when and where did I say they shot better or worse than their career averages?

I said they didn't shoot as well as Barry has...and obviously, since it's well documented he shot poorly by his own standard during the regular season, and everyone said he would be judged by what he did in the playoffs, I was talking the playoffs...you know, the here and now, when he is shooting well...

Fool.


Good look it up...then go ahead and dismiss it...

And your point is still fucking stupid...if Joe Blow is a career 10% shooter and he shoots 11% that doesn't mean he's good all of a sudden, or better than another guy who shot 35% in a down year.

Dumbass.

[Gerryatrics]

Game 1 means nothing. Barry was plagued with foul trouble, only played 10 minutes and didn't get any touches. Let's wait until he actually gets to play in the series before we start labeling him a choker or the worst player in NBA history... again.

[Jimcs50]

TPark, at least Whottt's lover actually plays some mins, unlike yours.

[Useruser666]

I think that at this point, Barry only sees spot minutes. Times when Hunter is on the floor, foul trouble, or in short offensive sequences at ends of quarters. Pop can sub him in again if Manu is having a tough game early. If he shows something, he can stay on the floor for a while. Maybe he can get a rythem, but even with steady stretches of minutes, he hasn't shown anything. Let's see if he can be a spark rather than a flame.

[TheAfricanFan]

I would like to see him in the mid of the 3rd quarter when players start to get tired. We could let Duncan draw attention and dish the ball for the 3. I think that Barry did a nice job when he was on court in game one

[wildbill2u]

Barry was getting some fouls called because he was trying to play defense, just like Pop wants. Nothing wrong with that as long as: we have some fouls to give, need to rest our starters, and can put someone in with fresh energy to wear the Pistons down.

[whottt]

Mario Elie's first Spurs playoffs(and he was starting):

PPG: 7.9
FG%: 384
3PT%: 267

Jaren Jackson

First year(for the fucking tools agmongst us)

PPG: 10.2
FG%: 34%
3PT%: 305%

Title year:

PPG:8.2
FG%:382%
3PT%:360%


Stephen Jackson(a starter)

First year: NA

Title year:

PPG: 12.8
FG%: 414
3PT%: 336


Steve Kerr

PPG: NA
FG%:391
3PT%:313

Manu(bench player, now an All Star and universally touted as a fantastic player):

PPG:9.4
FG%:386
3PT%:384


Barry:

PPG: 6.4
FG%: 46
3PT%: 43

Bonus: EFG% of over 60% to lead the entire team.

Now I realize his PPG totals aren't as high...

But do you guys realize we are averaging over 100 PPG, and have 3 dominant scorers, unlike any of those other years? It's almost like you guys want a 20% shooters to chuck up shots when we've got 3 All Star Caliber offensive players on the team.

Now either you guys are fucking stupid...or you are biased. I'll leave it up to you decide which you are.






Personally I think you guys need to stop calling me Mrs.Barry and go buy the ring for when you marry Devin( I can shoot the ball against a 3-1 disadvantage in game 1 of the finals, something an junior high kid wouldn't be stupid enough to do, against the best defensive team in the NBA, and still have 99% of SpursTalk lining up to suck my dick after the game. I am 27 years old and this is my third season with this team and I get the rookie excuse more than Beno Udrih does) Brown.


or whoever it is you insecure about.

But the hate...or the stupidity...is obvious and I am sick of folks acting like I am th one with bias. ...And BTW Barry can suck as badly as he did in game 1 a few more times and still shoot about as well as Jack, Bowen and Manu did in the finals in 03.

I am the only the one that's unbiased, or, unstupid in this debate.

[whottt]

Barry was getting some fouls called because he was trying to play defense, just like Pop wants. Nothing wrong with that as long as: we have some fouls to give, need to rest our starters, and can put someone in with fresh energy to wear the Pistons down.


Word...every player on the team admitted they were nervous and rusty...

Manu scored 4 points in the first half...what if he didn't get back on the court?

Bowen was in foul trouble too...

Every played on the bench sucked on offense...I think the Pistons D had a lot to do with it.

But Barry doesn't get that kind of slack.

On top of that, WTF was up with putting him on Rip Hamilton anyway?

What was funny was Duncan passing it to Barry when he could have touched the rim just by raising his hand...if Barry did that you'd never hear the end of it lol. But Barry did commit a stupid foul on that play.

[Cant_Be_Faded]

When it comes down to it, we paid brent barry that contract so he could make those threes in game 1 of the phoenix series.

thats all he's done thats impressed me the entire season

[Brodels]

I meant in the playoffs...you know the context that you and other haters have chosen to focus on all fucking seasonb and only now when your own weak ass argument got stuck up your ass have you lost your enthusiasm for focusing on.

You didn't specify. If seemed to me that you were talking about the regular season. It helps to explain what you're talking about.


Playoffs..figure it the fuck out...You aren't in some elite club that realizes Barry had a substandard, for him, regular season...There have only been about 6.3 billion posts discussing it...I don't think I all of a sudden forgot about it.

I never claimed to be in any 'elite club?' Why are you so bitter?


This is even stupider than your last anti-Barry argument...Nazr is shooting better from 3 than his career average as well...I guess that means we should be using him from 3.

One of your excuses for Barry (along with 'Pop doesn't know how to use him' and 'he's always played on sucky teams in the playoffs) was that many perimeter guys struggle in their first year on the Spurs. My argument simply demonstrated that the very players you cited didn't struggle in their first year on the team.

The point is that those players, for the most part, lived up to expectations. They matched the kinds of numbers that they had been putting up throughout their careers. The exception is Kerr, although he really didn't get much playing time. He played in far fewer games that season than Barry played in this season.


Look at what he did in the playoffs...maybe then you'll see the blatant double standard you used to label Barry a choker.

He's averaging 6 points per game on 46.8% shooting. When he was signed in the offseason, more was expected of him. I can't call him a choker by comparing his regular season and playoff numbers because he had such a shitty regular season. He contributed more during the regular season as far as points are concerned. I give him props for having a good Phoenix series. He was one of the reasons why the Spurs won. I've given him props for that over and over again. What else do you want?

I'm not going to give him props for playing well in the playoffs, because he's played well in exactly one (1) series. Playing well in one series doesn't erase memories of a poor regular season and over two poor playoff series, nor does it reverse his reputation of a playoff choker that he took years to build.

He played well during the Phoenix series. I was happy. I hope he can find a way to contribute against the Pistons. I'm not a Barry hater, I just want to see him do what he was brought in to do.


No...you look like you can't read...when and where did I say they shot better or worse than their career averages?

You didn't. Read above for explanation.


I said they didn't shoot as well as Barry has...and obviously, since it's well documented he shot poorly by his own standard during the regular season, and everyone said he would be judged by what he did in the playoffs, I was talking the playoffs...you know, the here and now, when he is shooting well...

After shooting around 50% for three of the four seasons before coming to the Spurs and averaging between 11-ish points per game, his 6 points on 46% shooting doesn't get me very excited.

Here's my judgement on his playoff performances: he's played one good series and over two crappy series.


And your point is still fucking stupid...if Joe Blow is a career 10% shooter and he shoots 11% that doesn't mean he's good all of a sudden, or better than another guy who shot 35% in a down year.

No, it means that he's consistent. It means that he can perform in the Spurs' system. And if he's been consistent throughout his career, it could mean that he's not a choker.


Dumbass.

Ah, resorting the the TPark strategy of namecalling when you don't have an argument. Classic.

[orhe]

barry should shoot more :(
he doesn't like to shoot
:(
man that's what we got him for to shoot...
jack up a bad three or two...