Luck or RG3?

[Spurtacus]

Who would you rather start your franchise with?

[DeadlyDynasty]

Luck

/thread.

[benefactor]

Luck

/thread.

[monosylab1k]

are they both white? no? then it's a pretty easy decision.

[Blake]

The question should be "is there anyone out there that would be stupid enough to draft RG3 over Luck"

[Greg Oden]

This poll should definitely be public.


And will refuse to root for a team that spends a #1 overall pick on an afro american qb.

[Trill Clinton]

Rgiii.

[monosylab1k]

Well so far in the voting, we've had 7 voters whose football IQ ranges anywhere from below average to genius, and we've had 4 black guys.

[JayTheClown]

Who would you rather start your franchise with?

Legitimate question on another forum, but a stupid question on SpursTalk. All you are doing is igniting the closet racists.:lol Its not racist to believe Andrew Luck is better QB because Luck played in a pro style offense in college, or has better mechanics etc....Believing RG3 will fail because he is black that is what makes you racist. Not that there is anything wrong with that. If your racist be racist, to each its own. :lol

But to answer to answer your question give me RG3

[DeadlyDynasty]

But to answer to answer your question give me RG3

Why

[monosylab1k]

Why

because he's not a racist

[monosylab1k]

Believing RG3 will fail because he is black that is what makes you racist.

When nearly all past history suggests something, how is it racist?

Female quarterbacks have only one less SB win than black quarterbacks do. So am I a sexist if I say that, based on women's past NFL success, Hilary Clinton would be a shitty franchise QB?

[monosylab1k]

For the record I think it's stupid to draft a white RB or WR, so it goes both ways.

[Pelicans78]

Also, a Pac-10 QB is usually better than a Big 12 spread offense system QB.

[Roddy Beaubois]

But to answer to answer your question give me RG3

Did you take a picture of yourself voting for obama and have it as your fb default?

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Legitimate question on another forum
:lol how is it a legitimate question? Andrew Luck is the consensus #1 overall pick. You'd be hard pressed to find a GM or coach who'd take Griffin over Luck. It's not a legitimate question at all.

[JayTheClown]

When nearly all past history suggests something, how is it racist?

Female quarterbacks have only one less SB win than black quarterbacks do. So am I a sexist if I say that, based on women's past NFL success, Hilary Clinton would be a shitty franchise QB?

Yeah man, I dont know you personally, but based on your posts on here I can conclude your a racist. You may not know you are one (which is the worst kind), but you are. You might as well embrace it.

To answer your question the black Qb is still to this day a relatively new concept. We had Randall Cunningham, Doug Williams, and Warren Moon in the past. Moon and Cunningham being the only 2 "franchise QBs" in their eras. Both QBs would have respectable careers. Warren having a HOF career.
Charlie Batch and Kordell Stewart came later, Charlie being the only true QB. Kordell always was this dual threat (Slash), never able to grasp the QB position. Charlie struggled as a starting QB for the struggling Lions but finally found his niche as a backup with the Steelers.
Then came the Steve McNair, Donavon McNab, Akili Smith, and Daunte Culpepper. Akili Smith was obviously a bust, playing for the awful Bengals, while Donavon and Daunte both would have respectable careers, tho neither would win a Superbowl, while McNair would lead his team to Superbowl only to fall short by 5 yards (or something like that).
Then came Mick Vick, Quincy Carer, and Byron Leftwich. Quincy was a dumb pick to begin with. Never should have been drafted in the 2nd round and never should have been given the reigns so quickly. Vick's career is not complete and Byron's injure riddled career has slowed down but who knows maybe he could pull a Tommy Maddux and come out of nowhere.

JaMarcus Russell was the probably one of the biggest busts in the history of the NFL draft, but you can easily make the case that the man should have never been drafted that high to begin with. He wasn't that good of a starting QB at LSU. He had like 3 good games I can remember. Dumb decision made by Al Davis and the Raiders scouts.

Today we have Freeman (Bucs), Vick (Eagles). I dont count Tavaris Jackson because I never thought of him as a "franchise QB".

Yes, out of all the "franchise QBs" I just named only 1 won a Superbowl. I named 13 black QBs (in the modern era) on the top of my head. I can easily name 13 white QBs who were far worse than any of the 13 black QBs I just named. Whats my point? My point is, only 13 black "franchise QBs" has gotten a chance to play in this league out how many white QBs? If you judge a race of QBs based on that small sample I just gave you than yeah your a racist.

Edit: I missed Jason Campbell and Cam Newton. Make that 15.

[DeadlyDynasty]

Maybe there's a reason we've only seen "13 Black Franchise QBs," ever think of that? There's been a shit-ton of them in college over the last 15 years, but the VAST majority can't hack it in the pros.

Is that racist, or just a fact?

Cam Newton shows promise, but let's see what he does now that teams have a year of game-film on him. Josh Freeman completely shit the bed after his one good year.

Michael Vick is an unreliable starting QB--he barely gets through 10 games a year b/c instead of staying in the pocket, the african in him takes over and starts running, resulting in injury.

Until Black QBs can win on a consistent basis--and win championships--then give me the white guy.

[JayTheClown]

Maybe there's a reason we've only seen "13 Black Franchise QBs," ever think of that? There's been a shit-ton of them in college over the last 15 years, but the VAST majority can't hack it in the pros.
hat
Is that racist, or just a fact?

Cam Newton shows promise, but let's see what he does now that teams have a year of game-film on him. Josh Freeman completely shit the bed after his one good year.

Michael Vick is an unreliable starting QB--he barely gets through 10 games a year b/c instead of staying in the pocket, the african in him takes over and starts running, resulting in injury.

Until Black QBs can win on a consistent basis--and win championships--then give me the white guy.

But there has been ateast a hundred white QBs that has failed miserably during that of the 16 (I forgot David Garrad) black QB span. Like I said the "Black QB" is still a relatively new phenomenon. In the past most black high schools didn't teach fundamentals to be agood college QB. Most black college QBs had to learn on the fly. Things are changing now that blacks are getting the opportunity to play the position. For years many people didn't believe the black man had the ability to play MLB. Ray Lewis and Patrick Willis has something to say about that now.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

:lol calling Doug Williams anything close to a "franchise QB", the fact he's the only black QB to ever win a superbowl is only a bigger indictment of the black quarterback

[JayTheClown]

:lol calling Doug Williams anything close to a "franchise QB", the fact he's the only black QB to ever win a superbowl is only a bigger indictment of the black quarterback

I didn't call Doug Williams a franchise QB.

[DeadlyDynasty]

But there has been ateast a hundred white QBs that has failed miserably during that of the 16 (I forgot David Garrad) black QB span. Like I said the "Black QB" is still a relatively new phenomenon. In the past most black high schools didn't teach fundamentals to be agood college QB. Most black college QBs had to learn on the fly. Things are changing now that blacks are getting the opportunity to play the position. For years many people didn't believe the black man had the ability to play MLB. Ray Lewis and Patrick Willis has something to say about that now.

Listen Sambo, I'm not one for grammatical correction, but you keep fucking up the tense of this word..."that HAVE failed miserably." Don't type it like you speak it, type it correctly.

On to your point...Being athletic at the LB position is more important in today's NFL--combine it with smarts and you have a beast (Lewis, Willis, etc)...unless of course you're legally retarded like Lavar Arrington.

You can't develop the mental capacity of a player---either thay have it or they don't. Either you can grasp 500+ plays, audibles, and can read a defense, or you can't.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Yes, out of all the "franchise QBs" I just named only 1 won a Superbowl.
Are you not indirectly calling Doug Williams a franchise QB here?

[Bill_Brasky]

Legitimate question on another forum, but a stupid question on SpursTalk. All you are doing is igniting the closet racists.:lol Its not racist to believe Andrew Luck is better QB because Luck played in a pro style offense in college, or has better mechanics etc....Believing RG3 will fail because he is black that is what makes you racist. Not that there is anything wrong with that. If your racist be racist, to each its own. :lol

But to answer to answer your question give me RG3

It's not racist, it's statistically proven.

[JayTheClown]

Are you not indirectly calling Doug Williams a franchise QB here?

Yeah you got me on that
But I did mention out the 3 first black QBs I included in my post only Cunningham and Moon were the only franchise QBs.

[DeadlyDynasty]

Oh yeah, you never answered you're reasoning for selecting RGIII over the best QB prospect in nearly 30 years--other than it being your racial obligation

[JayTheClown]

It's not racist, it's statistically proven.

Whats statistically proven?
Show me the stats

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Whats statistically proven?
Shoe me the stats
That black QBs don't even win superbowls 3% of the time.

[JayTheClown]

Oh yeah, you never answered you're reasoning for selecting RGIII over the best QB prospect in nearly 30 years--other than it being your racial obligation

Bullshit

RG3 is an accurate, poised QB with the ability to run, but doesn't like to.
Luck is a accurate, poised QB that is kinda mobile.

[JayTheClown]

That black QBs don't even win superbowls 3% of the time.

Again show me the stats. I gave you 16 black starting QBs. How many white QBs has there been in that span of the 16 black ones? At least 100 right?

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Again show me the stats. I gave you 16 black starting QBs. How many white QBs has there been in that span of the 16 black ones? At least 100 right?
46 superbowls, 1 black superbowl champion

1/46 = 2.17%

[DeadlyDynasty]

46 superbowls, 1 black superbowl champion

1/46 = 2.17%

That math is culturally biased, so let me help out.

Jay, say you have 46 homies, but only 1 of them doesn't have any priors. What percentage of your boys don't have a rapsheet?

[Trill Clinton]

Jay in here giving these ngger lovers a history lesson.

To keep it all the way 100 i picked rg3 not only because he's black, but he can do everything luck can do as far as passing, he's the better athlete and he's probably the smartest black qb, ever. Only thing luck has over him is experience in a pro style offense and size.

[JayTheClown]

46 superbowls, 1 black superbowl champion

1/46 = 2.17%

Good job Dok impressive.

Only 1 of 16 black QB have won a Superbowl in the Superbowl era

While 45 out 230ish (maybe?) have won a Superbowl. Keep in mind blacks weren't playing QB in the 60s and 70s. Whites got a head start there.

The white Superbowl list includes the likes of Trent Dilfer, Mark Rypien, Phil Simms average ass won 2, Jim Mcmahon got one.

[DeadlyDynasty]

Jay in here giving these ngger lovers a history lesson.

To keep it all the way 100 i picked rg3 not only because he's black, but he can do everything luck can do as far as passing, he's the better athlete and he's probably the smartest black qb, ever. Only thing luck has over him is experience in a pro style offense and size.

and this is impressive why......?

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

The white Superbowl list includes the likes of Trent Dilfer, Mark Rypien, Phil Simms average ass won 2, Jim Mcmahon got one.
All of these guys were better QBs than Doug Williams

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

:lmao claiming there have only been 16 black starting QBs in the modern NFL era

[monosylab1k]

:lol calling Doug Williams anything close to a "franchise QB", the fact he's the only black QB to ever win a superbowl is only a bigger indictment of the black quarterback

Hey you fucking racist! Black quarterbacks can win Super Bowls when their running back sets the record for rushing yards.

[monosylab1k]

:lmao claiming there have only been 16 black starting QBs in the modern NFL era

spergon wynn got taken ahead of tom brady. cleveland thought he was their franchise QB when they drafted him :lmao the list could go on and on tbh.

[JayTheClown]

:lmao claiming there have only been 16 black starting QBs in the modern NFL era

How many have there been? Have I missed any. Name the ones I missed? Lets see there were no black "franchise Qbs" in the 60s and 70s. Warren Moon and Randell Cunningham started in part of the 80s. Did I miss any from my original post?

[JayTheClown]

spergon wynn got taken ahead of tom brady. cleveland thought he was their franchise QB when they drafted him :lmao the list could go on and on tbh.

Bullshit

[monosylab1k]

While 45 out 230ish (maybe?)

hopefully your math skills are better when you're slangin rocks or you gonna be another statistic, brah.

[JayTheClown]

hopefully your math skills are better when you're slangin rocks or you gonna be another statistic, brah.

math skills?
I have no idea how many white franchise QBs there have been since 1960. Do you?

[monosylab1k]

math skills?
I gave no idea how many white franchise QBs there have been since 1960. Do you?

Yeah but I'm not about to pull a number out of my ass either. Please don't pull that shit when Stringer Bell asks why your numbers are down this week, or yo ass is dead as Wallace.

[JayTheClown]

Yeah but I'm not about to pull a number out of my ass either. Please don't pull that shit when Stringer Bell asks why your numbers are down this weeks, or yo ass is dead as Wallace.

Look redneck you give me your numbers

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

How many have there been? Have I missed any. Name the ones I missed? Lets see there were no black "franchise Qbs" in the 60s and 70s. Warren Moon and Randell Cunningham started in part of the 80s. Did I miss any from my original post?
Jamarcus Russell LSU 2007
Troy Smith Ohio State 2007
Tarvaris Jackson Alabama State 2006
Vince Young Texas 2006
Jason Campbell Auburn 2005
Seneca Wallace Iowa State 2005
Quinn Gray Florida A&M 2004
Cleo Lemon Arkansas State 2004
Byron Leftwich Marshall 2003
Henry Burris Temple 2002
Rohan Davey LSU 2002
David Garrard East Carolina 2002
Quincy Carter Georgia 2001
Jarious Jackson Notre Dame 2001
Tee Martin Tennessee 2001
Michael Vick Virginia Tech 2001
Aaron Brooks Virginia 2000
Michael Bishop Kansas State 2000
Dameyune Craig Auburn 2000
Anthony Wright South Carolina 2000
Spergon Wynn Southwest TX St.2000
Daunte Culpepper Central Florida 1999
Shaun King Tulane 1999
Donovan McNabb Syracuse 1999
Akili Smith Oregon 1999
Charlie Batch Eastern Michigan1998
Wally Richardson Penn State 1997
Tony Banks Michigan State 1996
Ray Lucas Rutgers 1996
Steve McNair Alcorn State 1995
Kordell Stewart Colorado 1995
Jeff Blake East Carolina 1992
Shawn Moore Virginia 1992
Andre Ware Houston 1990
Rodney Peete USC 1989
Mark Stevens Utah 1987
Walter Briggs Montclair State 1987
Larry Miller Northern Iowa 1987
Willie Gillus Norfolk State 1987
Bernard Quarles Hawaii 1987
Tony Robinson Tennessee 1987
Willie Totten Miss. Valley St.1987
Reggie Collier Southern Miss. 1986
Randall Cunningham Nevada-Las Vegas1985
Warren Moon Washington 1984
Doug Williams Grambling State 1978
Vince Evans USC 1977
Parnell Dickinson Miss. Valley St.1976
Dave Mays Texas Southern 1976
J.J. Jones Fisk 1975
Tony Adams Utah State 1975
Joe Gilliam Tennessee State 1972
James Harris Grambling State 1969
Marlin Briscoe Nebraska-Omaha 1968
Charlie Brackins Prairie View A&M1955
Willie Thrower Michigan State 1953
George Taliaferro Indiana 1950
Fritz Pollard Brown 1920

[JayTheClown]

Jamarcus Russell LSU 2007 Troy Smith Ohio State 2007 Tarvaris Jackson Alabama State 2006 Vince Young Texas 2006 Jason Campbell Auburn 2005 Seneca Wallace Iowa State 2005 Quinn Gray Florida A&M 2004 Cleo Lemon Arkansas State 2004 Byron Leftwich Marshall 2003 Henry Burris Temple 2002 Rohan Davey LSU 2002 David Garrard East Carolina 2002 Quincy Carter Georgia 2001 Jarious Jackson Notre Dame 2001 Tee Martin Tennessee 2001 Michael Vick Virginia Tech 2001 Aaron Brooks Virginia 2000 Michael Bishop Kansas State 2000 Dameyune Craig Auburn 2000 Anthony Wright South Carolina 2000 Spergon Wynn Southwest TX St.2000 Daunte Culpepper Central Florida 1999 Shaun King Tulane 1999 Donovan McNabb Syracuse 1999 Akili Smith Oregon 1999 Charlie Batch Eastern Michigan1998 Wally Richardson Penn State 1997 Tony Banks Michigan State 1996 Ray Lucas Rutgers 1996 Steve McNair Alcorn State 1995 Kordell Stewart Colorado 1995 Jeff Blake East Carolina 1992 Shawn Moore Virginia 1992 Andre Ware Houston 1990 Rodney Peete USC 1989 Mark Stevens Utah 1987 Walter Briggs Montclair State 1987 Larry Miller Northern Iowa 1987 Willie Gillus Norfolk State 1987 Bernard Quarles Hawaii 1987 Tony Robinson Tennessee 1987 Willie Totten Miss. Valley St.1987 Reggie Collier Southern Miss. 1986 Randall Cunningham Nevada-Las Vegas1985 Warren Moon Washington 1984 Doug Williams Grambling State 1978 Vince Evans USC 1977 Parnell Dickinson Miss. Valley St.1976 Dave Mays Texas Southern 1976 J.J. Jones Fisk 1975 Tony Adams Utah State 1975 Joe Gilliam Tennessee State 1972 James Harris Grambling State 1969 Marlin Briscoe Nebraska-Omaha 1968 Charlie Brackins Prairie View A&M1955 Willie Thrower Michigan State 1953 George Taliaferro Indiana 1950 Fritz Pollard Brown 1920

Franchise QBs
Not random black QBs

[monosylab1k]

Lets see there were no black "franchise Qbs" in the 60s and 70s.

Joe Gilliam says hi. His typical nlgger coke addiction which led him to being benched for Terry Bradshaw notwithstanding.

[JayTheClown]

Jamarcus Russell LSU 2007 Troy Smith Ohio State 2007 Tarvaris Jackson Alabama State 2006 Vince Young Texas 2006 Jason Campbell Auburn 2005 Seneca Wallace Iowa State 2005 Quinn Gray Florida A&M 2004 Cleo Lemon Arkansas State 2004 Byron Leftwich Marshall 2003 Henry Burris Temple 2002 Rohan Davey LSU 2002 David Garrard East Carolina 2002 Quincy Carter Georgia 2001 Jarious Jackson Notre Dame 2001 Tee Martin Tennessee 2001 Michael Vick Virginia Tech 2001 Aaron Brooks Virginia 2000 Michael Bishop Kansas State 2000 Dameyune Craig Auburn 2000 Anthony Wright South Carolina 2000 Spergon Wynn Southwest TX St.2000 Daunte Culpepper Central Florida 1999 Shaun King Tulane 1999 Donovan McNabb Syracuse 1999 Akili Smith Oregon 1999 Charlie Batch Eastern Michigan1998 Wally Richardson Penn State 1997 Tony Banks Michigan State 1996 Ray Lucas Rutgers 1996 Steve McNair Alcorn State 1995 Kordell Stewart Colorado 1995 Jeff Blake East Carolina 1992 Shawn Moore Virginia 1992 Andre Ware Houston 1990 Rodney Peete USC 1989 Mark Stevens Utah 1987 Walter Briggs Montclair State 1987 Larry Miller Northern Iowa 1987 Willie Gillus Norfolk State 1987 Bernard Quarles Hawaii 1987 Tony Robinson Tennessee 1987 Willie Totten Miss. Valley St.1987 Reggie Collier Southern Miss. 1986 Randall Cunningham Nevada-Las Vegas1985 Warren Moon Washington 1984 Doug Williams Grambling State 1978 Vince Evans USC 1977 Parnell Dickinson Miss. Valley St.1976 Dave Mays Texas Southern 1976 J.J. Jones Fisk 1975 Tony Adams Utah State 1975 Joe Gilliam Tennessee State 1972 James Harris Grambling State 1969 Marlin Briscoe Nebraska-Omaha 1968 Charlie Brackins Prairie View A&M1955 Willie Thrower Michigan State 1953 George Taliaferro Indiana 1950 Fritz Pollard Brown 1920

If you wanna go this route the list white QBs has to much larger this one right? How much longer do your think?

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Franchise QBs
Not random black QBs
:lmao so now only franchise QBs are part of the discussion after you already mentioned non-franchise QBs like Trent Dilfer to try to minimize the white man's achievements at QB.

It's also funny how you act like the lack of black franchise QBs is something that's out of the black community's control.

[monosylab1k]

Look redneck you give me your numbers

crofl not a redneck. i'm korean, which tbh means i hate black people way more than white ppl do.

[JayTheClown]

Joe Gilliam says hi. His typical nlgger coke addiction which led him to being benched for Terry Bradshaw notwithstanding.

Joe Gilliam was a gimmick in the beginning.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Franchise QBs
Not random black QBs
:lmao so now only franchise QBs are part of the discussion after you already mentioned non-franchise QBs like Trent Dilfer to try to minimize the white man's achievements at QB.

It's also funny how you act like the lack of black franchise QBs is something that doesn't speak to how limited the black man is at QB.

It'd be like me acting as if the lack of Jewish franchise power forwards in the NBA is something that has nothing to do with how Jews lack in ability to compete with 6'10" black men.

[JayTheClown]

crofl not a redneck. i'm korean, which tbh means i hate black people way more than white ppl do.

True that :toast

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Joe Gilliam was a gimmick
there's a reason half the black QBs mentioned are "gimmicks", they can't win the way white QBs win, hence why they need to rely on "gimmicky" things.

[JayTheClown]

:lmao so now only franchise QBs are part of the discussion after you already mentioned non-franchise QBs like Trent Dilfer to try to minimize the white man's achievements at QB.

It's also funny how you act like the lack of black franchise QBs is something that doesn't speak to how limited the black man is at QB.

It'd be like me acting as if the lack of Jewish franchise power forwards in the NBA is something that has nothing to do with how Jews lack in ability to compete with 6'10" black men.

You are the one who mentioned Superbowl QBs

[monosylab1k]

True that :toast

get a fuckin job and quit robbin my people's liquor stores and maybe we can be cool one day.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

You are the one who mentioned Superbowl QBs
superbowl QB =/= franchise QB

[JayTheClown]

get a fuckin job and quit robbin my people's donut shops and maybe we can be cool one day.

Stop learning English and butchering the language and maybe we can be cool.

[Pelicans78]

If the JaytheClown knew his history, all he had to do was use the Couch-McNabb argument in 1999 and how the Browns made a mistake drafting Couch over a black McNabb.

But don't forget, Couch played in a bullshit spread run&shoot offense compared to what McNabb played in college.

Again, I think these Big 12 faggots played in these spread wide open offenses which doesn't compare to what Luck ran in college which will suit him better to the NFL. Its easy to be accurate when you have 5 WRs every play against shitty Big 12 defenses.

[JayTheClown]

superbowl QB =/= franchise QB

You brought up the stat remember?

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

You brought up the stat remember?
What the fuck? I brought up superbowl QB, you brought up franchise QB. They aren't the same thing.

[Pelicans78]

get a fuckin job and quit robbin my people's liquor stores and maybe we can be cool one day.

That's the fuckin truth.

[JayTheClown]

If the JaytheClown knew his history, all he had to do was use the Couch-McNabb argument in 1999 and how the Browns made a mistake drafting Couch over a black McNabb.

But don't forget, Couch played in a bullshit spread run&shoot offense compared to what McNabb played in college.

Again, I think these Big 12 faggots played in these spread wide open offenses which doesn't compare to what Luck ran in college which will suit him better to the NFL. Its easy to be accurate when you have 5 WRs every play against shitty Big 12 defenses.

This argument wouldn't prove my point. Why would I use it? There is alot of white busts at QB. While McNab didn't win a SB.

[Pelicans78]

This argument wouldn't prove my point. Why would I use it? There is alot of white busts at QB. While McNab didn't win a SB.

The argument didn't start out about winning a Super Bowl. Basically they were saying pick Luck over RG3 because he's white. All you had to do was use the Couch-McNabb argument.

[monosylab1k]

This argument wouldn't prove my point. Why would I use it? There is alot of white busts at QB. While McNab didn't win a SB.

Why didn't McNabb win a Super Bowl? "because he's black" is a given answer so think of something different.

[JayTheClown]

What the fuck? I brought up superbowl QB, you brought up franchise QB. They aren't the same thing.

I was talking about franchise QBs in the very beginning. You starting talking about superbowls. I thought our discussion shifted.

[monosylab1k]

The argument didn't start out about winning a Super Bowl. Basically they were saying pick Luck over RG3 because he's white. All you had to do was use the Couch-McNabb argument.

And then all that had to be said was "spergon wynn over tom brady". game over.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

The argument didn't start out about winning a Super Bowl. Basically they were saying pick Luck over RG3 because he's white. All you had to do was use the Couch-McNabb argument.
Tim Couch won the Browns as many superbowls as McNabb won the Eagles.

[monosylab1k]

Tim Couch won the Browns as many superbowls as McNabb won the Eagles.

and while he was busy not winning super bowls, he was out fucking playboy centerfolds and not dry-heaving on the field as the Patriots laughed at him.

again, even white QB's that suck are smarter than black QB's that don't.

[JayTheClown]

Why didn't McNabb win a Super Bowl? "because he's black" is a given answer so think of something different.

If your really Korean why are you even on a sports forum?

[monosylab1k]

If your really Korean why are you even on a sports forum?

Because we only need to win 1 super bowl as a QB to tie the nlggers.

[DeadlyDynasty]

Jay probably thinks Jordan Jefferson is a good NFL prospect

[monosylab1k]

Jay probably thinks Jordan Jefferson is a good NFL prospect

Not because he's black tho. It's because of his poise in the pocket and his accurate arm.

[Trill Clinton]

and this is impressive why......?

He has just as high a football iq as luck. There hasnt been many black qb's who had both the physical tools and the intelligence it takes to learn the qb position. Having an intelligent qb isn't important anymore?

[Pelicans78]

And then all that had to be said was "spergon wynn over tom brady". game over.

Or Michael Vick over Drew Brees.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

He has just as high a football iq as luck.
el oh el

[JayTheClown]

Jay probably thinks Jordan Jefferson is a good NFL prospect

No I actually dont.
didn't believe that the last black LSU QB draft prospect was a good one either.

[Pelicans78]

Is RG3 really as intelligent as Luck? I think Luck ran a more complicated offense and probably had way more freedom in his offense than RG3 who basically run a spread offense. Pass to the open guy or run.

[monosylab1k]

No I actually dont.
didn't believe that the last black LSU QB draft prospect was a good one either.

you fucking racist

[Pelicans78]

Not because he's black tho. It's because of his poise in the pocket and his accurate arm.

I like his pre-snap reads and change the play at the line of scrimmage especially when he runs the ball right away after the snap.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Is RG3 really as intelligent as Luck?
No, he's not. White or black, Baylor is one of the dumbest colleges in America.

:lol Waco
:lol David Koresh

[Pelicans78]

It was obvious at LSU how much smarter and better the team was when Flynn QB'd instead of Jamarcus the Hut.

[DeadlyDynasty]

He has just as high a football iq as luck. There hasnt been many black qb's who had both the physical tools and the intelligence it takes to learn the qb position. Having an intelligent qb isn't important anymore?

10-4, good buddy!:lmao

Of course having an intelligent QB is important, but you stated he was the most intelligent "black QB." What other intelligent black QBs can you name?

Warren Moon



I'm thinking.................................




































































???

[JayTheClown]

you fucking racist

Not like your people buddy
dont judge a man by his skin color.
There is a Korean guy who follows me around his food mart here in Queens every time I come in. I know you know each other. I'll PM you the address if you want.

[DeadlyDynasty]

I like his pre-snap reads and change the play at the line of scrimmage especially when he runs the ball right away after the snap.

:lol stupid n!gger couldn't even run the option correctly in that game--a play that was specifically designed for his species

[Trill Clinton]

U think rg3 has jamarcus russell's football iq? Either way id still pick him cuz he's black and has a ngger lover as a fiance.

[Pelicans78]

:lol stupid n!gger couldn't even run the option correctly in that game--a play that was specifically designed for his species

:lmao

[monosylab1k]

Not like your people buddy
dont judge a man by his skin color.
There is a Korean guy who follows me around his food mart here in Queens every time I come in. I know you know each other. I'll PM you the address if you want.

Korea wins a gold medal in archery like every fuckin olympics, so don't try pointin your piece sideways at my man, because I guarantee you his aim is better than yours.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

U think rg3 has jamarcus russell's football iq? Either way id still pick him cuz he's black and has a ngger lover as a fiance.
Even if RG3 was white there's no way of knowing how high his football IQ is in that gimmicky offense.

[JayTheClown]

Even if RG3 was white there's no way of knowing how high his football IQ is in that gimmicky offense.

gimmicky offense? It was a spread offense nothing more, nothing less. Houston Cougars and the New Orleans Saints run the same thing.

[Trill Clinton]

Even if RG3 was white there's no way of knowing how high his football IQ is in that gimmicky offense.

So is it that he's a ngger that doesn't put him near or above luck or is it the offensive system he played in?

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

gimmicky offense? It was a spread offense nothing more, nothing less. Houston Cougars and the New Orleans Saints run the same thing.
I wouldn't touch Case Keenum with a 10 foot pole in the draft.

[JayTheClown]

Korea wins a gold medal in archery like every fuckin olympics, so don't try pointin your piece sideways at my man, because I guarantee you his aim is better than yours.

You got me here. I have no aim, I spray random.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

So is it that he's a ngger that doesn't put him near or above luck or is it the offensive system he played in?
Both tbh. His blackness is definitely a cause for concern IMO but if he put up those numbers in a pro-style offense I'd consider him over Luck.

[DeadlyDynasty]

Both tbh. His blackness is definitely a cause for concern IMO but if he put up those numbers in a pro-style offense I'd consider him over Luck.

:rollin

[JayTheClown]

I wouldn't touch Case Keenum with a 10 foot pole in the draft.

I do agree, QBs who run spreads in college are harder to scout. Colt Brennen and comes to mind. Kevin Kolb ran a similar offense as well (he was drafted in the 2nd round I believe). Your in Arizona you know how that turned out.

[Pelicans78]

gimmicky offense? It was a spread offense nothing more, nothing less. Houston Cougars and the New Orleans Saints run the same thing.

The Saints routinely use TEs and a FB.

[JayTheClown]

The Saints routinely use TEs and a FB.

Yes,
In their spread offense

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

And btw this works both ways as already mentioned. I wouldn't take a black QB first overall, and I wouldn't take a Jewish power forward first overall in the NBA either.

[Trill Clinton]

Both tbh. His blackness is definitely a cause for concern IMO but if he put up those numbers in a pro-style offense I'd consider him over Luck.

Ah okay. I mean its close. I just don't think luck is leaps and bounds ahead of rg3. But im a loyal nicca, I gotta ride with my niccas. Im still a VY fan, b.

[Pelicans78]

Yes,
In their spread offense

The Saints use a Multiple Offense, not a spread. They use different formations to exploit mismatches and they run the football way more than a traditional spread offense.

[JayTheClown]

And btw this works both wys as already mentioned. I wouldn't take a black QB first overall, and I wouldn't take a Jewish power forward first overall in the NBA either.

It shouldn't
If Kevin Love or Dirk was Jewish I would take him number 1 in a heart beat. Who knows maybe Israel will develop the next Rubio. Sandy Koufax proved Jews could pitch. I bet not many people thought they could do that.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

If Kevin Love or Dirk was Jewish I would take him number 1 in a heart beat.
If Kevin Love or Dirk were Jewish they wouldn't be the athletes they are

[JayTheClown]

The Saints use a Multiple Offense, not a spread. They use different formations to exploit mismatches and they run the football way more than a traditional spread offense.

No team in football uses their base offense 100% of the time during a game except maybe Oregon. Majority of the time the Saints offense is at spread. Sometimes that means 3 WRs and Graham at the slot. Or that means 4 WR with Graham on the line, whatever. Saints majority of the time uses at least 3 WRs at a time.

[Pelicans78]

No team in football uses their base offense 100% of the time during a game except maybe Oregon. Majority of the time the Saints offense is at spread. Sometimes that means 3 WRs and Graham at the slot. Or that means 4 WR with Graham on the line, whatever. Saints majority of the time uses at least 3 WRs at a time.

Most teams use 3 WRs the majority of games, especially the pass heavy teams.

[monosylab1k]

Majority of the time the Saints offense is at spread. Sometimes that means 3 WRs and Graham at the slot. Or that means 4 WR with Graham on the line, whatever. Saints majority of the time uses at least 3 WRs at a time.

Using 3-4 WR's in a set isn't the same thing as a spread offense you dumbass.

[BUMP]

I think Luck ran a more complicated offense

No shit

His offense consisted more than make one read, if it's not there either chuck it to spook #2 downfield or take off with it.

And Baylor had some damn good receivers that bailed out RG3 a lot too tbh

[JayTheClown]

Using 3-4 WR's in a set isn't the same thing as a spread offense you dumbass.

Using 4 WRs in a set is a spread offense. I thought chinks were supposed to be smart. Using 3 WRs and putting a TE in the slot could be described as a spread dumb fuck.

[Huey Freeman]

Using 4 WRs in a set is a spread offense. I thought chinks were supposed to be smart. Using 3 WRs and putting a TE in the slot could be described as a spread dumb fuck.

The offense the Saints run is different than the ones Houston and Hawaii run.

[monosylab1k]

:lmao what a dumbfuck. You dont need 3 or 4 receivers. You dont need ANY receivers. You could have 3 fullbacks, 1 TE, and 2 QBs. The spread offense has nothing to do with who you have on the field, it's what you do to their defense.

[monosylab1k]

Comversely, you can have an empty backfield and 5 wrs and be running an offense not anywhere closely resembling a spread.

[jgome21]

Standford's Pro-Style Offense def gives Luck the upper hand here. RGIII has more big play making ability, but he was in a spread offense. Don't get me wrong, RGII has the talent to be better than Luck in the long-run, but right now I think Luck is more polished and NFL ready.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Hey, the Patriots use a slot receiver (3rd receiver) on virtually every play, I guess they also run a spread offense :lmao

[Blake]

has a RG ever lined up once under center?

I'd put the over/unders at 3 times for his entire football life.

[Blake]

Hey, the Patriots use a slot receiver (3rd receiver) on virtually every play, I guess they also run a spread offense :lmao

Two tight ends and a Welker.

Just like the Baylor offense runs!

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

Aaron Hernandez sometimes lines up in the slot


SPREAD OFFENSE!!!

[JayTheClown]

:lmao what a dumbfuck. You dont need 3 or 4 receivers. You dont need ANY receivers. You could have 3 fullbacks, 1 TE, and 2 QBs. The spread offense has nothing to do with who you have on the field, it's what you do to their defense.

LOL no shit dumb fuck, I wasn't fucking talking to you. I was having a conversation with another poster regarding the Saints offense. He says the Saints dont use a spread. I disagreed with him.

[JayTheClown]

Hey, the Patriots use a slot receiver (3rd receiver) on virtually every play, I guess they also run a spread offense :lmao

Spread offenses traditionally uses 4 or more WRs. When When I say WR I dont necessarily mean "wide receiver" I am referring to the players the lined up on the out side. My fault, I shouldn't have refered to them as "WR". So yes, When Hernandez lines up at slot and 3 wide receivers line up on the outside its a spread.

[monosylab1k]

No its not. You dont fucking get it. The word "spread" in spread offense doesnt refer to how the offense is lined up.

[Huey Freeman]

Spread offenses traditionally uses 4 or more WRs. When When I say WR I dont necessarily mean "wide receiver" I am referring to the players the lined up on the out side. My fault, I shouldn't have refered to them as "WR". So yes, When Hernandez lines up at slot and 3 wide receivers line up on the outside its a spread.

Jay I still wouldn't call the Saints offense a spread. When think of a spread I think of the Oregon Ducks, Houston Cougars, and SMU. Warren Moon's Oilers ran a spread tho.

[Huey Freeman]

No its not. You dont fucking get it. The word "spread" in spread offense doesnt refer to how the offense is lined up.

?
What does spread mean?
Shit I played the game. I guess I dont know as much as I thought I did.

[DeadlyDynasty]

?
What does spread mean?
Shit I played the game. I guess I dont know as much as I thought I did.

Seriously? It's in the name itself:lol

Spread offenses spread (imagine that!) the defense/field horizontally.

You can have 4/5 WR's and TE's, but if they're all running post routes then it's not a fucking spread...it really is a simple concept--especially since the name gives it away

[Huey Freeman]

Seriously? It's in the name itself:lol

Spread offenses spread (imagine that!) the defense/field horizontally.

You can have 4/5 WR's and TE's, but if they're all running post routes then it's not a fucking spread...it really is a simple concept--especially since the name gives it away

Ok, thank for that
No I know what I'm dealing with here.
Never again

[Huey Freeman]

Seriously? It's in the name itself:lol

Spread offenses spread (imagine that!) the defense/field horizontally.

You can have 4/5 WR's and TE's, but if they're all running post routes then it's not a fucking spread...it really is a simple concept--especially since the name gives it away

I cant leave this shit alone man.
If you have 4/5 WR and a TE or whatever lined up on the outside, your in a spread offense. It does not matter what the routes of the receivers are. They could be running vertically or horizontally. You could be running the ball (with the outside receivers blocking) and in would still be in a spread offense.

[Kirk Nowitzki]

The spread formation is all about getting the defense to "spread apart" against you. It has jack shit to do with offensive personnel. It gets whored out in the NCAA every year because it takes pressure off the QB making the right read and really relies more on your play caller adjusting to the defense. Denver was trying to run the "spread option" which is a spread variant and the Patriots easily shut it down by spying Tebow with a LB so he couldn't run on them. Most spread formations want to force you into going nickel or dime against them, and that's why you're probably thinking of 4-wide shotgun formations as spread formations.

[Huey Freeman]

The spread formation is all about getting the defense to "spread apart" against you. It has jack shit to do with offensive personnel. It gets whored out in the NCAA every year because it takes pressure off the QB making the right read and really relies more on your play caller adjusting to the defense. Denver was trying to run the "spread option" which is a spread variant and the Patriots easily shut it down by spying Tebow with a LB so he couldn't run on them. Most spread formations want to force you into going nickel or dime against them, and that's why you're probably thinking of 4-wide shotgun formations as spread formations.

True you can have 3 punters, a kicker, and offensive lineman lined up on the outside and it would still be considered a spread.

But a shotgun 4 wide formation is still a spread.

[Huey Freeman]

Here is a definition of teams who run spread offenses:



The spread offense is an offensive scheme in American (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_football) and Canadian football (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_football) that is used at every level of the game including professional (NFL (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Football_League), CFL (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Football_League)), college (NCAA (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NCAA), NAIA (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Association_of_Intercollegiate_Athletics) , CIS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIS_football)), and high school programs across America and Canada. The spread offense begins with the quarterback in the shotgun formation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shotgun_formation) most of the time, and often employs a no-huddle (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No-huddle_offense) approach. The fundamental nature of the spread offense involves spreading the field horizontally using 3, 4, and even 5-receiver sets. Some implementations of the spread also feature wide splits between the offensive linemen. The object of the spread offense is to open up multiple vertical seams for both the running and passing game to exploit, as the defense is forced to spread itself thin across the field (a "horizontal stretch") to cover everyone.

[Huey Freeman]

The "Spread Offense (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spread_offense)" is a generic term used to describe an offense that operates out of a formation with multiple wide receivers, usually out of the Shotgun, and can be run or pass oriented. One of the goals of the spread offense is to stretch the field both horizontally and vertically, and to take what are usually a teams' best defenders (linebackers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linebacker)) out of the game by utilizing three or more receivers.
Today variants of the spread are popular in high school and college football, with more modest versions appearing in the NFL. In college, especially, the offense often depends largely on option and misdirection runs, using all of the skill players on offense. The zone read is often a very popular play in this type of offense because of its flexibility, more so if a team has an athletic quarterback who can run the ball as well as pass. Linemen in the spread are often smaller and more agile so they can block effectively on screens, zones, options, and protect against aggressively blitzing defenses such as the 3-3-5 stack. As the defense, already spread out, begins to focus on stopping the run, the spread creates mismatches and single coverage on receivers, which creates opportunities in the passing game. Utilizing receiver motion along with jet sweeps is also an important part of creating confusion and running a balanced, yet successful, spread offense.

The success of the offense depends on creating mismatches (a linebacker covering a receiver), the ability for the quarterback and the receivers to find holes in the zone, and defensive breakdowns in the secondary (the receiver and quarterback both read that the safety (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safety_%28American_football_position%29) will not rotate over to help the cornerback (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cornerback), so the receiver breaks to the outside or up the sideline with single coverage). Few defenses are able to cope with a well-executed spread run-pass threat, which is one reason why football scores have been rising in recent years.
The spread offense can also be used to benefit the running game. By splitting out three, four or five receivers (thereby spreading out covering defenders) and employing a fast, athletic offensive line, the spread opens running lanes for the tailback, fullback and quarterback. Also, linebackers may be taken off the field to cover the additional receivers, possibly resulting in a diminished ability for the defense to effectively tackle the running back. The primary responsibility of receivers in this case is downfield blocking, rather than pass-catching, as they spring backs for long runs. Spread option offenses rely on a quarterback who can call plays at the line of scrimmage, read the intentions of the defensive end, and keep the ball or pitch it to a back. The offense also uses short passes like a running plays, executing "bubble screens" that begin with a short, nearly-lateral pass to a speedy wide receiver to get him into open space. No-huddle spread attacks are also popular.
One popular variant of the spread is the "Air Raid" offense (pioneered by Hal Mumme (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hal_Mumme)), in which the offense may pass on over 80% of its downs. The offense is seen as being complex, though receivers need to know relatively few routes. The complexity comes from the different formations the routes are run out of. The running back in the Air Raid offense serves a useful role as well by catching passes out of the backfield, on screens, and carrying the ball on draw plays.

[Kirk Nowitzki]

The problem a lot of people here are having with understanding this is they're thinking of the spread like it's an entire offensive philosophy when it's just one mother fucking formation that works as a means to two different ends: You're either going to (1) get a high-percentage pass completion because the formation puts you in favorable one-on-one matchups against the defense if they go nickel or dime on you, or (2) basically makes your QB an extra player if he's able to quickly see that he has no read and can actually run the ball (think Colt McCoy, dude was the leading rusher in games from the QB spot all the time at Texas).

[Kirk Nowitzki]

Gold star to Huey Freeman for showing the world how to use Wikipedia. Thanks bro, I could have never figured it out by myself.

[Huey Freeman]

The problem a lot of people here are having with understanding this is they're thinking of the spread like it's an entire offensive philosophy when it's just one mother fucking formation that works as a means to two different ends: You're either going to (1) get a high-percentage pass completion because the formation puts you in favorable one-on-one matchups against the defense if they go nickel or dime on you, or (2) basically makes your QB an extra player if he's able to quickly see that he has no read and can actually run the ball (think Colt McCoy, dude was the leading rusher in games from the QB spot all the time at Texas).

It does not matter if its a teams offensive philosophy or just a single play a team runs in a game. The definition is still the same. Shit is not complex.

[Huey Freeman]

Gold star to Huey Freeman for showing the world how to use Wikipedia. Thanks bro, I could have never figured it out by myself.

You need to start

[Huey Freeman]

Gold star to Huey Freeman for showing the world how to use Wikipedia. Thanks bro, I could have never figured it out by myself.

Its a good tool to prove a point.

[Kirk Nowitzki]

Its a good tool to prove a point.

It's a good tool to prove you don't know what you're talking about so you went to fucking Wiki and tried to pass it off like you won the discussion when in reality we'll keep talking and you'll just be the idiot that Wikis shit when he gets into it with people on Spurstalk.

Like I said, gold star bro. Gold star.

[Huey Freeman]

It's a good tool to prove you don't know what you're talking about so you went to fucking Wiki and tried to pass it off like you won the discussion when in reality we'll keep talking and you'll just be the idiot that Wikis shit when he gets into it with people on Spurstalk.

Like I said, gold star bro. Gold star.

First off, I knew what a spread was long before I looked on Wiki. Just needed to show the definition.
Second, its better than just talking bullshit like were doing.

[Huey Freeman]

It's a good tool to prove you don't know what you're talking about so you went to fucking Wiki and tried to pass it off like you won the discussion when in reality we'll keep talking and you'll just be the idiot that Wikis shit when he gets into it with people on Spurstalk.

Like I said, gold star bro. Gold star.

Next time you enter a conversation know what the fuck you talking about. The shit you were saying may have been true to a point, but in way you were added nothing to to the conversation. You were just talking bullshit.

[monosylab1k]

If you have 4/5 WR and a TE or whatever lined up on the outside, your in a spread offense.

:lmao no you're fucking not.

[Huey Freeman]

:lmao no you're fucking not.

Yeah you are

[monosylab1k]

Warren Moon's Oilers ran a spread tho.

No they didn't, they ran the Run N Shoot which, while employing 4 receivers in their formations, is philosophically completely different than the spread. Goddamn you're a fucking retard.

[Huey Freeman]

:lmao no you're fucking not.

The object of a spread is to spread the field. It doesn't matter what the receivers are doing. They could be running vertically, horizontally, they can standing around scratching their asses. If you have 4/5 "receivers" (aboard term) you are in a spread.

[monosylab1k]

You're focused way too much on who lines up where and not nearly enough on what happens after the snap.

[monosylab1k]

The object of a spread is to spread the field. It doesn't matter what the receivers are doing.

And you just proved you have no clue what a spread offense is. maybe if you read the fucking wikipedia article you posted, you'd know.

[Huey Freeman]

No they didn't, they ran the Run N Shoot which, while employing 4 receivers in their formations, is philosophically completely different than the spread. Goddamn you're a fucking retard.

The run n shoot is a spread. When I say "spread" I am not referring to the offensive philosophy of Oregon or Mike Leach. A spread is a spread.

[Huey Freeman]

And you just proved you have no clue what a spread offense is. maybe if you read the fucking wikipedia article you posted, you'd know.

You can fucking be running the ball and you can still be in a spread formation.

[Huey Freeman]

You're focused way too much on who lines up where and not nearly enough on what happens after the snap.

It doesn't matter what happens after the snap. A spread formation is a spread formation. Your spreading the field.

[monosylab1k]

The run n shoot is a spread. When I say "spread" I am not referring to the offensive philosophy of Oregon or Mike Leach. A spread is a spread.

WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT?????????

There's no such thing as a "spread formation"

Since you're so good at using Wikipedia I'd like you to find the "spread formation" here in a list of football formations. Have fun.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formation_(American_football)

[Huey Freeman]

WHAT THE FUCK ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT?????????

There's no such thing as a "spread formation"

Since you're so good at using Wikipedia I'd like you to find the "spread formation" here in a list of football formations. Have fun.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formation_(American_football) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Formation_%28American_football%29)

LOL then what is a "spread"?

[monosylab1k]

there's a single set back formation or an empty backfield formation. If you want to call it a "spread formation" then fine, but all that means is you're a dipshit who had no fucking clue what anyone else was talking about.

[monosylab1k]

When I say "spread" I am not referring to the offensive philosophy of Oregon or Mike Leach.

Which is why you posted this article, right? Because you weren't talking about the philosophy, right?


Here is a definition of teams who run spread offenses:



The spread offense is an offensive scheme in American (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_football) and Canadian football (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_football) that is used at every level of the game including professional (NFL (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Football_League), CFL (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Football_League)), college (NCAA (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NCAA), NAIA (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Association_of_Intercollegiate_Athletics) , CIS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIS_football)), and high school programs across America and Canada. The spread offense begins with the quarterback in the shotgun formation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shotgun_formation) most of the time, and often employs a no-huddle (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No-huddle_offense) approach. The fundamental nature of the spread offense involves spreading the field horizontally using 3, 4, and even 5-receiver sets. Some implementations of the spread also feature wide splits between the offensive linemen. The object of the spread offense is to open up multiple vertical seams for both the running and passing game to exploit, as the defense is forced to spread itself thin across the field (a "horizontal stretch") to cover everyone.


The "Spread Offense (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spread_offense)" is a generic term used to describe an offense that operates out of a formation with multiple wide receivers, usually out of the Shotgun, and can be run or pass oriented. One of the goals of the spread offense is to stretch the field both horizontally and vertically, and to take what are usually a teams' best defenders (linebackers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linebacker)) out of the game by utilizing three or more receivers.
Today variants of the spread are popular in high school and college football, with more modest versions appearing in the NFL. In college, especially, the offense often depends largely on option and misdirection runs, using all of the skill players on offense. The zone read is often a very popular play in this type of offense because of its flexibility, more so if a team has an athletic quarterback who can run the ball as well as pass. Linemen in the spread are often smaller and more agile so they can block effectively on screens, zones, options, and protect against aggressively blitzing defenses such as the 3-3-5 stack. As the defense, already spread out, begins to focus on stopping the run, the spread creates mismatches and single coverage on receivers, which creates opportunities in the passing game. Utilizing receiver motion along with jet sweeps is also an important part of creating confusion and running a balanced, yet successful, spread offense.

The success of the offense depends on creating mismatches (a linebacker covering a receiver), the ability for the quarterback and the receivers to find holes in the zone, and defensive breakdowns in the secondary (the receiver and quarterback both read that the safety (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safety_%28American_football_position%29) will not rotate over to help the cornerback (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cornerback), so the receiver breaks to the outside or up the sideline with single coverage). Few defenses are able to cope with a well-executed spread run-pass threat, which is one reason why football scores have been rising in recent years.
The spread offense can also be used to benefit the running game. By splitting out three, four or five receivers (thereby spreading out covering defenders) and employing a fast, athletic offensive line, the spread opens running lanes for the tailback, fullback and quarterback. Also, linebackers may be taken off the field to cover the additional receivers, possibly resulting in a diminished ability for the defense to effectively tackle the running back. The primary responsibility of receivers in this case is downfield blocking, rather than pass-catching, as they spring backs for long runs. Spread option offenses rely on a quarterback who can call plays at the line of scrimmage, read the intentions of the defensive end, and keep the ball or pitch it to a back. The offense also uses short passes like a running plays, executing "bubble screens" that begin with a short, nearly-lateral pass to a speedy wide receiver to get him into open space. No-huddle spread attacks are also popular.
One popular variant of the spread is the "Air Raid" offense (pioneered by Hal Mumme (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hal_Mumme)), in which the offense may pass on over 80% of its downs. The offense is seen as being complex, though receivers need to know relatively few routes. The complexity comes from the different formations the routes are run out of. The running back in the Air Raid offense serves a useful role as well by catching passes out of the backfield, on screens, and carrying the ball on draw plays.

[Huey Freeman]

there's a single set back formation or an empty backfield formation. If you want to call it a "spread formation" then fine, but all that means is you're a dipshit who had no fucking clue what anyone else was talking about.

If you have never heard it referred to "spread formation" before only confirms to me you have never played football in your life. Madden can only take you so far, man.

[monosylab1k]

If you have never heard it referred to spread formation before only confirms to me you have never played football in your life. Madden can only take you so far, man.

:lmao We all did HS football, doucher. You act like you're special because you were the backup corner on the JV squad. How cute.

[Huey Freeman]

:lmao We all did HS football, doucher. You act like you're special because you were the backup corner on the JV squad. How cute.

Played a little junior college ball to, but that's not the point. The fact that you seem to have never heard the term "spread formation" is ludicrous. How can you sit there and argue something you seem to know nothing about.

[monosylab1k]

Played a little junior college ball

:wowHOLY SHIT! You're practically a fucking pro!


How can you sit there and argue something you seem to know nothing about.

:lmao pot meet kettle.

But I did like your "No I wasn't ever talking about the spread offense, I was talking about the formation!" defense.

[monosylab1k]

Here is a definition of teams who run spread offenses:



The spread offense is an offensive scheme in American (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_football) and Canadian football (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_football) that is used at every level of the game including professional (NFL (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Football_League), CFL (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Football_League)), college (NCAA (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NCAA), NAIA (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Association_of_Intercollegiate_Athletics) , CIS (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIS_football)), and high school programs across America and Canada. The spread offense begins with the quarterback in the shotgun formation (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shotgun_formation) most of the time, and often employs a no-huddle (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No-huddle_offense) approach. The fundamental nature of the spread offense involves spreading the field horizontally using 3, 4, and even 5-receiver sets. Some implementations of the spread also feature wide splits between the offensive linemen. The object of the spread offense is to open up multiple vertical seams for both the running and passing game to exploit, as the defense is forced to spread itself thin across the field (a "horizontal stretch") to cover everyone.


The "Spread Offense (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spread_offense)" is a generic term used to describe an offense that operates out of a formation with multiple wide receivers, usually out of the Shotgun, and can be run or pass oriented. One of the goals of the spread offense is to stretch the field both horizontally and vertically, and to take what are usually a teams' best defenders (linebackers (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Linebacker)) out of the game by utilizing three or more receivers.
Today variants of the spread are popular in high school and college football, with more modest versions appearing in the NFL. In college, especially, the offense often depends largely on option and misdirection runs, using all of the skill players on offense. The zone read is often a very popular play in this type of offense because of its flexibility, more so if a team has an athletic quarterback who can run the ball as well as pass. Linemen in the spread are often smaller and more agile so they can block effectively on screens, zones, options, and protect against aggressively blitzing defenses such as the 3-3-5 stack. As the defense, already spread out, begins to focus on stopping the run, the spread creates mismatches and single coverage on receivers, which creates opportunities in the passing game. Utilizing receiver motion along with jet sweeps is also an important part of creating confusion and running a balanced, yet successful, spread offense.

The success of the offense depends on creating mismatches (a linebacker covering a receiver), the ability for the quarterback and the receivers to find holes in the zone, and defensive breakdowns in the secondary (the receiver and quarterback both read that the safety (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Safety_%28American_football_position%29) will not rotate over to help the cornerback (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cornerback), so the receiver breaks to the outside or up the sideline with single coverage). Few defenses are able to cope with a well-executed spread run-pass threat, which is one reason why football scores have been rising in recent years.
The spread offense can also be used to benefit the running game. By splitting out three, four or five receivers (thereby spreading out covering defenders) and employing a fast, athletic offensive line, the spread opens running lanes for the tailback, fullback and quarterback. Also, linebackers may be taken off the field to cover the additional receivers, possibly resulting in a diminished ability for the defense to effectively tackle the running back. The primary responsibility of receivers in this case is downfield blocking, rather than pass-catching, as they spring backs for long runs. Spread option offenses rely on a quarterback who can call plays at the line of scrimmage, read the intentions of the defensive end, and keep the ball or pitch it to a back. The offense also uses short passes like a running plays, executing "bubble screens" that begin with a short, nearly-lateral pass to a speedy wide receiver to get him into open space. No-huddle spread attacks are also popular.
One popular variant of the spread is the "Air Raid" offense (pioneered by Hal Mumme (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hal_Mumme)), in which the offense may pass on over 80% of its downs. The offense is seen as being complex, though receivers need to know relatively few routes. The complexity comes from the different formations the routes are run out of. The running back in the Air Raid offense serves a useful role as well by catching passes out of the backfield, on screens, and carrying the ball on draw plays.

:cry but you were only talking about the formation.

[DeadlyDynasty]

If you have never heard it referred to "spread formation" before only confirms to me you have never played football in your life. Madden can only take you so far, man.

Sorry, never heard of it either...it's not a formation, it's how you attack the defense.

and lol at evoking your high school football days to back up your point. HS offenses are always simple, and involve simple formations like the Wing T or the Wishbone. You basically just outed yourself

[Huey Freeman]

:wowHOLY SHIT! You're practically a fucking pro!



:lmao pot meet kettle.

But I did like your "No I wasn't ever talking about the spread offense, I was talking about the formation!" defense.

Not claiming it was anything special. Just pointing out I played more than JV football.

I'm not going to have this troll ass argument with you regarding something that's foreign to you.

[Huey Freeman]

Sorry, never heard of it either...it's not a formation, it's how you attack the defense.

and lol at evoking your high school football days to back up your point. HS offenses are always simple, and involve simple formations like the Wing T or the Wishbone. You basically just outed yourself

Dude, I already learned your knowledge of the game through your first reply to me.

[monosylab1k]

Not claiming it was anything special. Just pointing out I played more than JV football.

And that makes you very special. It really does.


I'm not going to have this troll ass argument with you regarding something that's foreign to you.

:lmao

but you were only talking about the formation this whole time, not the offense :cry

[Huey Freeman]

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/spread%20formation

[monosylab1k]

Dude, I already learned your knowledge of the game through your first reply to me.

That he didn't play junior college ball like you? And that he clearly knows more about the spread offense than you do?

[Huey Freeman]

And that makes you very special. It really does.



:lmao

but you were only talking about the formation this whole time, not the offense :cry

A spread offense runs spread formations. You do know that right?

[DeadlyDynasty]

Dude, I already learned your knowledge of the game through your first reply to me.

Please, enlighten me about this mysterious "spread formation" that only YOU know about.:lol

Feel free to draw upon your JuCo days

[monosylab1k]

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/spread%20formation

:lol wikipedia couldn't help you out so you just kept digging till you struck oil!

yeah we get that you're talking about the "spread formation" which in normal football language is known as a "single set back" or "empty backfield" formation, which still doesn't explain why you posted a wikipedia article about the SPREAD OFFENSE.

[monosylab1k]

A spread offense runs spread formations. You do know that right?

not necessarily.

[Huey Freeman]

:lol wikipedia couldn't help you out so you just kept digging till you struck oil!

yeah we get that you're talking about the "spread formation" which in normal football language is known as a "single set back" or "empty backfield" formation, which still doesn't explain why you posted a wikipedia article about the SPREAD OFFENSE.

Yeah, my first wiki article was about the spread offense, but the second was about the formation your right.

[Huey Freeman]

not necessarily.

Please give me an example

[Huey Freeman]

not necessarily.

Please dont tell me sometimes they use special teams formations, and goal-line formations etc...

[monosylab1k]

Please give me an example

xfh0RUM6vq8

2 receiver set

[monosylab1k]

an offensive football formation in which the pass receivers are spread out across the field

:lmao this definition is so retarded. so basically any offensive set with receivers out wide is a spread formation :lol

West Coast Offense - Spread!

[Huey Freeman]

xfh0RUM6vq8

2 receiver set

Thats what I thought, you are still talking about offenses you use the "spread offense" philosophy. OK that's fine, they kick field goals to captain obvious. That's not a spread right?

[Huey Freeman]

:lmao this definition is so retarded. so basically any offensive set with receivers out wide is a spread formation :lol

West Coast Offense - Spread!

Question are you a Cowboys fan? Has there ever been an instance were Romo is in shotgun and he has two Wrs on each side of him?

[monosylab1k]

Thats what I thought, you are still talking about offenses you use the "spread offense" philosophy. OK that's fine, they kick field goals to captain obvious. That's not a spread right?

Holy shit. You're a moron.

YOU SAID:


A spread offense runs spread formations. You do know that right?

I SAID:


not necessarily.

YOU SAID:


Please give me an example

And I provided an example of a spread offense that wasn't in your wanton definition of the "spread formation".

WE WERE TALKING ABOUT THE SPREAD OFFENSE THE WHOLE FUCKING TIME.

Unless you plan on proving that Oregon under Chip Kelly in fact does not run the spread offense, then I just provided a time when a spread offense wasn't in your so-called "spread formation".

Doesn't that make sense to you, or is your brain that dumb that you can't even get that?

[Huey Freeman]

Holy shit. You're a moron.

YOU SAID:



I SAID:



YOU SAID:



And I provided an example of a spread offense that wasn't in your wanton definition of the "spread formation".

WE WERE TALKING ABOUT THE SPREAD OFFENSE THE WHOLE FUCKING TIME.

Unless you plan on proving that Oregon under Chip Kelly in fact does not run the spread offense, then I just provided a time when a spread offense wasn't in your so-called "spread formation".

Doesn't that make sense to you, or is your brain that dumb that you can't even get that?

Yes and this is obvious

[monosylab1k]

Yes and this this obvious

so what's your goddamn point?

[Huey Freeman]

so what's your goddamn point?

Question are you a Cowboys fan? Has there ever been an instance were Romo is in shotgun and he has two Wrs on each side of him?

[Creepn]

If you wanna go this route the list white QBs has to much larger this one right? How much longer do your think?

It's in the thousands.

Don't worry about it. All this black quarterback stuff is just the white man's fear of the black man dominating every position of the sport that they once dominated. It's been like that since the beginnings of this country and with sports. It's just the usual outcry to save the last coveted spot but all it's doing is propelling black inspired quarterbacks to become even better at it as history shows.

Racist koreans like mono are of course bitter because they suck at sports and their noodle bones are fragile. They are at the bottom of the athlete scale. They also hate the fact that the only people that goes into their shitty ass stores are the black guys because no other race has the balls to do so. They owe their livelihoods to the black people and they know it.

[monosylab1k]

Question are you a Cowboys fan? Has there ever been an instance were Romo is in shotgun and he has two Wrs on each side of him?

Not a Cowboys fan. And the Cowboys don't run the spread offense.

[monosylab1k]

They are at the bottom of the athlete scale.

South Korea is always in the top 10 for medal count at the Olympics and curbstomps any spearchucker country in Africa.

[Huey Freeman]

Not a Cowboys fan. And the Cowboys don't run the spread offense.

Look on post #138
Where you said that if a team has 4/5 WRs on the field the team is not in a spread offense. Do you remember that?

[Creepn]

South Korea is always in the top 10 for medal count at the Olympics and curbstomps any spearchucker country in Africa.

you can keep your shitty ass figure skating medals lol.

[DeadlyDynasty]

Look on post #138
Where you said that if a team has 4/5 WRs they are not in a spread offense. Do you remember that?

It doesn't necessarily mean they're in a spread offense. You're backpedalling and now trying to argue semantics. Just shut the fuck up already. The Cowboys do not run the spread, and they won't be this year either with Callahan as OC.

Go back and study your JuCo playbook a little harder

[monosylab1k]

Where you said that if a team has 4/5 WRs on the field are not in a spread offense. Do you remember that?

Yeah exactly. They aren't running a spread offense. The offensive philosophy of Jason Garrett and the Cowboys is not the spread offense. They could use 4/5 receiver sets and not be running the spread offense, the run n shoot, or the west coast offense.

So your point is that I'm still right?

[monosylab1k]

It doesn't necessarily mean they're in a spread offense.

no no no, but they're in the spread formation! the formation! not the offense! nevermind that he said "spread offense" just remember he's talking about the formation :cry

[Huey Freeman]

It doesn't necessarily mean they're in a spread offense. You're backpedalling and now trying to argue semantics. Just shut the fuck up already. The Cowboys do not run the spread, and they won't be this year either with Callahan as OC.

Go back and study your JuCo playbook a little harder

Dammit I'm not saying the Cowboys do run a spread offense. I'm say there are instance where they run spread formations. Fuck foget the term "spread offense". Its obvious the Cowboys aren't running the same offense as Baylor or Houston.

[DeadlyDynasty]

It's in the thousands.

Don't worry about it. All this black quarterback stuff is just the white man's fear of the black man dominating every position of the sport that they once dominated. It's been like that since the beginnings of this country and with sports. It's just the usual outcry to save the last coveted spot but all it's doing is propelling black inspired quarterbacks to become even better at it as history shows.

Oh yeah? Doug Williams won it in 1987. Warren Moon didn't but was a great B around that time also.

I haven't seen progress since then, have you?

[monosylab1k]

Dammit I'm not saying the Cowboys do run a spread offense.

Well thankfully your JuCo experience taught you that.


Fuck foget the term "spread offense".

Then stop fucking saying it.

[Huey Freeman]

Yeah exactly. They aren't running a spread offense. The offensive philosophy of Jason Garrett and the Cowboys is not the spread offense. They could use 4/5 receiver sets and not be running the spread offense, the run n shoot, or the west coast offense.

So your point is that I'm still right?

They are running a spread formation. There are in a spread offense. Fuck the damn philosophy term.

[monosylab1k]

If you have 4/5 WR and a TE or whatever lined up on the outside, your in a spread offense.


Fuck foget the term "spread offense".

:lmao

[Huey Freeman]

h
Well thankfully your JuCo experience taught you that.

ou have n

Then stop fucking saying it. t

Damn, how is it you have never heard anyone refer to a team who is using 4 WR on the field as a spread offense. Teams can run spread offenses without using the damn philosophy.

[DeadlyDynasty]

Dammit I'm not saying the Cowboys do run a spread offense. I'm say there are instance where they run spread formations. Fuck foget the term "spread offense". Its obvious the Cowboys aren't running the same offense as Baylor or Houston.

How far are you reaching?:lol You're looking for a blanket term that'll support your argument.

"Hey! Tony Romo's in the shotgun with Dez and Robinson on the outside, Miles in the slot, and Witten at TE....that must mean it's a spread formation!"

Seriously, where the fuck are you going with this?

[monosylab1k]

They are running a spread formation. There are in a spread offense. Fuck the damn philosophy term.

The philosophy term is the only term.

The Patriots run the Wildcat! And by Wildcat I mean 2 TE sets with a slot receiver. That's what I mean by Wildcat! Fuck the real definition, use my definition!

[Huey Freeman]

:lmao

Yes they are in a spread offense
What do you call the damn offense?
When a team lines up 4 WRS on the field, what is it doing to the defense?
They are spreading the defense out. Any team can do that. Not just the ones who do it majority of the time like an Oregon or Houston.

[Huey Freeman]

How far are you reaching?:lol You're looking for a blanket term that'll support your argument.

"Hey! Tony Romo's in the shotgun with Dez and Robinson on the outside, Miles in the slot, and Witten at TE....that must mean it's a spread formation!"

Seriously, where the fuck are you going with this?

So everytime Tony Romo's in the shotgun

He is in a spread formation. Whats the formation to you?

[monosylab1k]

Damn, how is it you have never heard anyone refer to a team who is using 4 WR on the field as a spread offense.

I've heard people refer to the Mavs as a Run n Gun team, but I'm not going to go along with their retardedness just to appease them.

simply having 4 WR's on the field does not mean you're running the spread offense. End of story.

[monosylab1k]

When a team lines up 4 WRS on the field, what is it doing to the defense?
They are spreading the defense out.

Except when the defense is in a zone and doesn't give a shit where the receivers line up.

[Huey Freeman]

Ok lets agree to disagree, I'm done arguing with you about this.
I'm not going to persuade you otherwise and you not going to persuade me IMO. Any team in the world can go in a spread formation (spread offense or whatever). I have hared that term before used that way. Why you haven't is beyond me.

[DeadlyDynasty]

He is in a spread formation. Whats the formation to you?

Well, since I feel like being a smart-ass...shotgun formation:lol

[DeadlyDynasty]

Why you haven't is beyond me.

I guess I just wasn't cut out for the JuCo gridiron

[monosylab1k]

Any team in the world can go in a spread formation (spread offense or whatever).

No, not "spread offense or whatever". the spread offensive is a very specific thing that you very clearly don't understand. Or you're just being willfully ignorant. Running a "spread formation or whatever" as you define it, and running the spread offense, are two very different things.

We'll agree that you're fucking retarded and don't understand the spread offense. Thanks.

[monosylab1k]

Except when the defense is in a zone and doesn't give a shit where the receivers line up.

:lmao I guess this is where he realized he couldn't win. Trying to explain how a 4 WR set could spread a zone defense would only prove that running the "spread offense or whatever" entailed at least a little bit more than having 4/5 receivers.

[DeadlyDynasty]

yew jess kent dew teengks lyke det!

[Huey Freeman]

OK, Mono I concede to your notion. I asked around and you were correct. Using the terms spread formation and spread offense interchangeably is wrong. You win that argument. I apologize if I offended you in anyway.

[Huey Freeman]

DeadlyDynasty, I apologize to you as well. I questioned your intelligence in one post and you were right. Obviously my intelligence should have been questioned on this matter.

[Huey Freeman]

To cover all bases, I would like to also apologize to Kirk Nowitzki. Obliviously you were not talking bullshit.

[Creepn]

Oh yeah? Doug Williams won it in 1987. Warren Moon didn't but was a great B around that time also.

I haven't seen progress since then, have you?

I'm saying that racism and stereotypes towards black athletes existed with every single position they tried to fill by people like you saying the same exact shit they spewed decades ago. It only gives them more resolve to push harder to get better to prove all this shit wrong. More opportunities opened up for this to happen than the years of Warren Moon to make it happen now.

Quarterbacking is next. Watch.

[DeadlyDynasty]

I'm saying that racism and stereotypes towards black athletes existed with every single position they tried to fill by people like you saying the same exact shit they spewed decades ago. It only gives them more resolve to push harder to get better to prove all this shit wrong. More opportunities opened up for this to happen than the years of Warren Moon to make it happen now.

Quarterbacking is next. Watch.

Sorry, I'm just not buying it. Black players from all positions other than QB have evolved (no pun) through the stereotypes and become dominant players.

Like I said, the college ranks are full of black QBs too--including many of the top teams. Even black head coaches are more prevalent--and they've won superbowls.


What's taking the QB position so long? Has there been a better black QB since Moon and Cunningham?

[Creepn]

What's taking the QB position so long? Has there been a better black QB since Moon and Cunningham?

They aren't given an equal chance to develop as white quarterbacks do. You make a mistake and your black ass is gone. No history making for you!

You think if Tim Tebow was black, he still would've have the same opportunities he was afforded this year?

[DeadlyDynasty]

They aren't given an equal chance to develop as white quarterbacks do. You make a mistake and your black ass is gone. No history making for you!

You think if Tim Tebow was black, he still would've have the same opportunities he was afforded this year?

http://ll-media.tmz.com/2011/03/03/0303-jamaracus-ex-getty-02.jpg

Next excuse.

[Creepn]

http://ll-media.tmz.com/2011/03/03/0303-jamaracus-ex-getty-02.jpg

Next excuse.

We'll see how long Tebow plays as a starter playing the way he plays.

[DeadlyDynasty]

We'll see how long Tebow plays as a starter playing the way he plays.

<not a Tebow-hugger, but that still has nothing to do with you being wrong:


They aren't given an equal chance to develop as white quarterbacks do. You make a mistake and your black ass is gone. No history making for you!

You think if Tim Tebow was black, he still would've have the same opportunities he was afforded this year?

Jamarcus Russell was given 2+ years, so there goes your Black Tebow argument

[BRHornet45]

have some of you not learned anything from football history? college or pro?

Luck all the way. no doubt about it.

[Creepn]

<not a Tebow-hugger, but that still has nothing to do with you being wrong:



Jamarcus Russell was given 2+ years, so there goes your Black Tebow argument

2+? Bullshit. He got 1 year and a few games then benched. I'll let you win this argument ONLY because I said Tebow when I should've used the NUMEROUS other white quarterbacks that were way worse than Jamarcus and got repeat chances to play.

You won by a technicality.

[DeadlyDynasty]

2+? Bullshit. He got 1 year and a few games then benched. I'll let you win this argument ONLY because I said Tebow when I should've used the NUMEROUS other white quarterbacks that were way worse than Jamarcus and got repeat chances to play.

You won by a technicality.

So you don't think Jamarcus got a fair shake? Do tell.

[DeadlyDynasty]

Also, what other Black QBs were not given enough 2nd chances?

[Creepn]

Compared to the others no but fuck you for making me defend Jamarcus. The dude wasn't even able to be picked as a back up or a stringer.

[Creepn]

Also, what other Black QBs were not given enough 2nd chances?

I think a more productive thing to do is compare white and black crappy quarterbacks and their tenure in the nfl.

[DeadlyDynasty]

I think a more productive thing to do is compare white and black crappy quarterbacks and their tenure in the nfl.

Actually, I think it'd be more productive if we addressed this:


You make a mistake and your black ass is gone. No history making for you!

Who didn't get to make history cause The Man kept him down? I want names.

[BRHornet45]

son Les Miles did everything he could to push Jordan Jefferson when he knew that he had two white boys sitting on the bench who are both head and shoulders better than Jefferson. Miles even chose to throw away an opportunity at winning another National Championship because he wanted Jefferson to succeed so badly.

[Obstructed_View]

Jeff George. Dude was super white.

[DeadlyDynasty]

son Les Miles did everything he could to push Jordan Jefferson when he knew that he had two white boys sitting on the bench who are both head and shoulders better than Jefferson. Miles even chose to throw away an opportunity at winning another National Championship because he wanted Jefferson to succeed so badly.

BR w/ the TRUTHBOMB.

When Brent fucking Musberger is questioning why Jordan Jefferson's still in the game, you know you have problems.

[AFBlue]

Rg3

[Ryan Fitzpatrick]

Rg3

says Baylor fan

[Blake]

have some of you not learned anything from football history? college or pro?

Luck all the way. no doubt about it.

College is much different.

Give me a list of some white qbs and there's a good chance I take tommie frazier or college Vince over them.

[BRHornet45]

College is much different.

Give me a list of some white qbs and there's a good chance I take tommie frazier or college Vince over them.

as soon as you give me a list of some black QB's who have won in the NFL.

[stretch]

Doug Williams ftw

[manufan10]

2+? Bullshit. He got 1 year and a few games then benched. I'll let you win this argument ONLY because I said Tebow when I should've used the NUMEROUS other white quarterbacks that were way worse than Jamarcus and got repeat chances to play.

You won by a technicality.

I bet if a white QB got fat, was lazy, and had a piss poor work ethic, that they wouldn't be picked up by any team either.

[AFBlue]

says Baylor fan

Ahem...that's Baylor Alum.

And I don't see why it's such a stretch. They're both intelligent, accurate, and strong throwers. They're both great leaders and winners. I know Luck has the edge on "readiness" because he operated out of a more pro-style offense, but Griffin definitely has the edge on mobility and escapability.

RG3 just needs a year or two in a set offense and he's the better all-around player.

[Halberto]

Rg3

[DeadlyDynasty]

Wow...judging by the poll you can already deduce that there's 10 people who know jackshit about the NFL:lol

[AFBlue]

Wow...judging by the poll you can already deduce that there's 10 people who know jackshit about the NFL:lol

Do explain.

[JoeTait75]

Even if a GM wanted to pick RGIII, he wouldn't. There's too much downside. Too much disaster potential.

It's one thing to pick Ryan Leaf. It's another to pick Ryan Leaf when Peyton Manning is still on the board.

[Bill_Brasky]

Ahem...that's Baylor Alum.

And I don't see why it's such a stretch. They're both intelligent, accurate, and strong throwers. They're both great leaders and winners. I know Luck has the edge on "readiness" because he operated out of a more pro-style offense, but Griffin definitely has the edge on mobility and escapability.

RG3 just needs a year or two in a set offense and he's the better all-around player.


Griffin = guy whos operated out of a gimmick college offense, has faltered against teams that are worth a shit, undersized, and already has had a major knee injury.

Luck = guy whos operated out of a real offense, can read a defense, has size, went to Stanford, and won a BCS bowl(woulda been 2 if his shitty freshman kicker hadn't choked).

Seems like a no brainer for me tbh.

[DeadlyDynasty]

Even if a GM wanted to pick RGIII, he wouldn't. There's too much downside. Too much disaster potential.

It's one thing to pick Ryan Leaf. It's another to pick Ryan Leaf when Peyton Manning is still on the board.


Griffin = guy whos operated out of a gimmick college offense, has faltered against teams that are worth a shit, undersized, and already has had a major knee injury.

Luck = guy whos operated out of a real offense, can read a defense, has size, went to Stanford, and won a BCS bowl(woulda been 2 if his shitty freshman kicker hadn't choked).

Seems like a no brainer for me tbh.

+100000000000000000000

The only people who've voted RG3 are either alums, fans, and/or minorities (mostly black, but I see one be@ner just gave his stamp of approval).

Andrew Luck is a sure thing and has everything you could ever want in a QB. JoeTait said it right...you don't wanna be the guy who drafts Leaf ahead of Manning. Bill Polian would've been fired in 1998 instead of 2012 had he passed up on the sure thing.

Black QB's don't win superbowls
Big 12 QB's haven't made good Pros in years--gimmicky offenses.

Look at the 4 Big12 QB's currently starting:

Blaine Gabbert - Unquestionably the WORST rookie QB this year. Newton, Dalton, Yates, and Ponder all showed improvement throughout the season. Gabbert didn't.

Bradford - Injured (like college) and regressed
McCoy - regressed
Freeman - ABSOLUTE DOGSHIT this year

Add in a prior knee injury (as BB said) and the fact that he's pretty much shotgun-only his entire career and yeah...I'll take the stud from Stanford.

It's an easy decision unless you're:

A. affiliated with Baylor
B. a minority
C. mentally retarded

[JoeTait75]

It's no shame for RGIII to go after Luck. He'll get an opportunity somewhere.

I'll take him in Cleveland at #4 to replace Colt McCoy's broke ass.

[Bill_Brasky]

+100000000000000000000

The only people who've voted RG3 are either alums, fans, and/or minorities (mostly black, but I see one be@ner just gave his stamp of approval).

Andrew Luck is a sure thing and has everything you could ever want in a QB. JoeTait said it right...you don't wanna be the guy who drafts Leaf ahead of Manning. Bill Polian would've been fired in 1998 instead of 2012 had he passed up on the sure thing.

Black QB's don't win superbowls
Big 12 QB's haven't made good Pros in years--gimmicky offenses.

Look at the 4 Big12 QB's currently starting:

Blaine Gabbert - Unquestionably the WORST rookie QB this year. Newton, Dalton, Yates, and Ponder all showed improvement throughout the season. Gabbert didn't.

Bradford - Injured (like college) and regressed
McCoy - regressed
Freeman - ABSOLUTE DOGSHIT this year

Add in a prior knee injury (as BB said) and the fact that he's pretty much shotgun-only his entire career and yeah...I'll take the stud from Stanford.

It's an easy decision unless you're:

A. affiliated with Baylor
B. a minority
C. mentally retarded

Agree on all points, and add that it's no shame to be drafted top ten no matter what happens. Yeah, he put up big numbers and won a Heisman. Does not make him close to the prospect that Luck is. Hope he comes out and has a solid career, but in no way would I ever consider him over Luck.

[DUNCANownsKOBE]

:lmao defending JaMarcus Russell is a new low for the black man

[AFBlue]

Griffin = guy whos operated out of a gimmick college offense, has faltered against teams that are worth a shit, undersized, and already has had a major knee injury.

Luck = guy whos operated out of a real offense, can read a defense, has size, went to Stanford, and won a BCS bowl(woulda been 2 if his shitty freshman kicker hadn't choked).

Seems like a no brainer for me tbh.

You've labeled him as a guy that has faltered against teams that are worth a shot before, but it doesn't bare out. He's not undersized, standing a legit 6'2 and weighing over 200lbs. I'll give you the injury as a concern.

As for his lack of experience in a pro-style offense, it didn't hurt Cam Newton. Having said that, I don't expect him to start right away or be as good right away. I still think the upside is with him though.

[DeadlyDynasty]

You've labeled him as a guy that has faltered against teams that are worth a shot before, but it doesn't bare out. He's not undersized, standing a legit 6'2 and weighing over 200lbs. I'll give you the injury as a concern.

As for his lack of experience in a pro-style offense, it didn't hurt Cam Newton. Having said that, I don't expect him to start right away or be as good right away. I still think the upside is with him though.

It remains to be seen whether Cam and Carolina takes the next step in 2012. Teams have a year of game-film on him now and he's in a division where 2 teams are clearly better than them.

Luck is ready NOW (actually, he was ready last year), and being in a pro-system means all he has to adjust to is the speed of the game--which takes good QBs a year or less. Griffin has to adapt not only to the speed of the game--but how a pro-offense is run.

It all comes down to what JT said earlier: Griffin may very well be a good QB someday, but you DO NOT take him over the sure thing who is NFL ready and has superstar written all over him.

Try to look at this from a non-Baylor fan/black man's POV and you'll see that this is clear as day.

[Blake]

He's not undersized, standing a legit 6'2 and weighing over 200lbs.



.....The NFL Draft is next month and Cam Newton is expected to be the first quarterback chosen. Among the many NFL quarterback-like qualities that Newton possesses, the most important might be size.

At 6-6 and 250 pounds, Newton is a big boy. And he will fit right in with the NFL's new breed of quarterback.

Of the 32 quarterbacks who started at least eight games in 2010, 13 were at least 6-5, and 11 were at least 230 pounds.

In 2010, the average starting quarterback was more than 6-3 and 225 pounds.

Read more: http://articles.businessinsider.com/2011-03-02/sports/30012299_1_cam-newton-josh-freeman-big-quarterbacks#ixzz1k9CmTsdm

He's undersized.

[AFBlue]

It remains to be seen whether Cam and Carolina takes the next step in 2012. Teams have a year of game-film on him now and he's in a division where 2 teams are clearly better than them.

Luck is ready NOW (actually, he was ready last year), and being in a pro-system means all he has to adjust to is the speed of the game--which takes good QBs a year or less. Griffin has to adapt not only to the speed of the game--but how a pro-offense is run.

It all comes down to what JT said earlier: Griffin may very well be a good QB someday, but you DO NOT take him over the sure thing who is NFL ready and has superstar written all over him.

Try to look at this from a non-Baylor fan/black man's POV and you'll see that this is clear as day.

The question was who you start your franchise with...the implication being who is the better long-term prospect. This is obviously my opinion, but I think RG3 has higher upside and would risk taking him over Luck if he were to be the centerpiece of my franchise. I realize I'm in the minority...pun intended.

[AFBlue]

He's undersized.

Fair enough, though I think it has little impact on his projected success.

[Blake]

Fair enough, though I think it has little impact on his projected success.

If he was purely a pocket passer, I might agree.

[AFBlue]

He's undersized.

FYI, RG3 came in at 6'2 3/8 and 223lbs.

He also confirmed he is an athletic freak...4.4 in the 40 and a 39in vert.

There were also reports that he interviewed very well...no surprise there.

[Ryan Fitzpatrick]

Two most important questions on the QB-interview questionnaire:

1. Race?
2. Conference?

Double whammy

[Goran Dragic]

Tbh I can't wait to compare the wonderlic scores of Luck and RG3. According to all the spooks and Branch Dividians in this thread they should be the same since "RG3 is as smart as Luck"

[Ryan Fitzpatrick]

tbh I'd love RG3 to go to the Browns, just to see all his supporters eat their words about him. "He's not a tuck and run QB like all the rest!:cry"

:lolYeah, we'll see what happens when Ray Lewis, Ngata, Suggs, Harrison, Woodley, and Polamalu are rushing him. You can best believe those animal instincts will take over at that point.

[Goran Dragic]

It's funny that the black man claims :cryhe's not a rushing QB like all the other monkeys who have tried to play QB:cry in one argument then in the next argument use RG3's rushing ability as the reason why he's a better overall player than Luck.

A QB with rushing ability is a negative. A QB is at his best if he doesn't trust his rushing ability and only uses it as a very last resort.

[Ryan Fitzpatrick]

A QB with rushing ability is a negative. A QB is at his best if he doesn't trust his rushing ability and only uses it as a very last resort.

Exactly, Steve Young became a great QB later on when he wasn't just rushing at the first sign of trouble--but to be fair he was on a bad Bucs team in those early days.

Michael Vick improved greatly in 2010 by becoming more of a pocket passer, but the african in him eventually got the best of him and he rushed himself to injury again.

Warren Moon was a BOSS. Black QBs should try to emulate him and not Cunningham.

[Spursfan092120]

I hate mother fucking racist ass bigots...


just sayin.