Obama: My son would look like Treyvon

[ChumpDumper]

Would the ratio of blacks to whites in the prison system also be close to 17:3 by chance?Laughably distant tbh.

[Facts]

Here, Chump. You like reductionist arguments so much. Do you agree with me, or are you defending this brutal killer? Which one? No other answers are possible.

A false dichotomy is a type of logical fallacy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logical_fallacy) that involves a situation in which only two alternatives are considered, when in fact there is at least one additional option.

A straw man argument is an informal fallacy based on misrepresenting an opponent's position so as to more easily refute it.

Do you commit these fallacies all the time, or just this once?

[Facts]

Would the ratio of blacks to whites in the prison system also be close to 17:3 by chance?

No.

That is the incorrect question to ask based on the facts presented.

Do I know you? I don't think we have ever gotten acquainted.

[CosmicCowboy]

A false dichotomy is a type of logical fallacy (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Logical_fallacy) that involves a situation in which only two alternatives are considered, when in fact there is at least one additional option.

A straw man argument is an informal fallacy based on misrepresenting an opponent's position so as to more easily refute it.

Do you commit these fallacies all the time, or just this once?

Nice troll, Winehole.

[Facts]

This even looks kinda like your avatar, Chump-Puppet.

http://marionette.cz/images/T/Hansel.jpg

That is not a picture of a puppet. That is a picture of a marionnette.

[CosmicCowboy]

It's not like Obama held a press conference to make a statement on Treyvon. He was asked by a reporter and answered. Has a reporter specifically asked Barry about the white tourists that were murdered?

Are you aware that Obama has a well deserved reputation in the press pool of ignoring impromptu shouted questions? This is well documented.

[Wild Cobra]

No.

That is the incorrect question to ask based on the facts presented.
Why is it an incorrect question? Your figures when counting only white and black show that 85% of those exonerated by DNA are black. When looking at the Texas 2005 prison population between blacks and whites, blacks comprise of 82.6% of the prison population. Looks proportional to me.

One could say there is no significant difference in wrongly accused blacks vs whites when it comes to murder.

Uneven Justice:
State Rates of Incarceration By Race and Ethnicity (http://www.sentencingproject.org/doc/publications/rd_stateratesofincbyraceandethnicity.pdf)

[Th'Pusher]

Are you aware that Obama has a well deserved reputation in the press pool of ignoring impromptu shouted questions? This is well documented.

Has he ignored an impromptu shouted question about the murdered tourists?

[Facts]

wHY IS IT AN INCORRECT QUESTION?

The "caps lock" key is generally located beneath the "tab" key and above the left shift key.

[Winehole23]

Nice troll, Winehole.it's not me

[Wild Cobra]

The "caps lock" key is generally located beneath the "tab" key and above the left shift key.
LOL...

I hit several incorrect keys, including the shortcut to post before I was done.

[Facts]

Facts regrets coming to the political forum, and needs a shower.

Facts spends more time lurking in the Spurs forum and making fun of lakers fans.

[CosmicCowboy]

Has he ignored an impromptu shouted question about the murdered tourists?

Oh, I think several letters from the dead mans father trump even a shouted question...and don't pretend that those letters don't get read and NORMALLY answered by at least someone on the staff.

[Wild Cobra]

Oh, I think several letters from the dead mans father trump even a shouted question...and don't pretend that those letters don't get read and NORMALLY answered by at least someone on the staff.
I think this will end in a national tragedy for the family. It became a national, and probably world wide story. I think in the end, the family will be seen as nations fools.

Wouldn't want to be in their shoes.

[ChumpDumper]

When looking at the Texas 2005 prison population between blacks and whites, blacks comprise of 82.6% of the prison population.You read that completely wrong.

[Spurminator]

Oh, I think several letters from the dead mans father trump even a shouted question...and don't pretend that those letters don't get read and NORMALLY answered by at least someone on the staff.

How do you know they are?

You guys realize the major difference in the two stories, right? Shawn Tyson is serving a life sentence. There is no outstanding controversy here, except as a really desperate stretch to somehow find hypocrisy is a benign statement made by the President about a crime that HASN'T had a resolution.

Seriously, are you guys kidding with this bullshit? This is really pathetic.

[Wild Cobra]

You read that completely wrong.
Then please enlighten us.

[ChumpDumper]

Then please enlighten us.
The statistics provided are from the Fiscal Year 2010 Statistical Report of the Texas Department of Criminal Justice. (Fiscal Year 2010 is the most recent year for which statistics were available on TDCJ’s website on November 4, 2011.) The statistics provided here represent only the inmates in the Institutional Division of TDCJ; state jails and substance abuse felony treatment centers are not included.

Total number of inmates incarcerated in Texas prisons on August 31, 2010: 139,316....

Race
Black: 50,811
White: 42,190
Hispanic: 45,607
Other Racial Background: 708

http://insidetexasprisons.blogspot.com/2011/12/demographics-of-texas-prison-system.html

That's 36.5%.

Not 82.6%.

You were completely wrong.

[Wild Cobra]

The statistics provided are from the Fiscal Year 2010 Statistical Report of the Texas Department of Criminal Justice. (Fiscal Year 2010 is the most recent year for which statistics were available on TDCJ’s website on November 4, 2011.) The statistics provided here represent only the inmates in the Institutional Division of TDCJ; state jails and substance abuse felony treatment centers are not included.

Total number of inmates incarcerated in Texas prisons on August 31, 2010: 139,316....

Race
Black: 50,811
White: 42,190
Hispanic: 45,607
Other Racial Background: 708

http://insidetexasprisons.blogspot.com/2011/12/demographics-of-texas-prison-system.html

That's 36.5%.

Not 82.6%.

You were completely wrong.
Do you have anything better than a blog, written by an inmate?

[cheguevara]

The statistics provided are from the Fiscal Year 2010 Statistical Report of the Texas Department of Criminal Justice. (Fiscal Year 2010 is the most recent year for which statistics were available on TDCJ’s website on November 4, 2011.) The statistics provided here represent only the inmates in the Institutional Division of TDCJ; state jails and substance abuse felony treatment centers are not included.

Total number of inmates incarcerated in Texas prisons on August 31, 2010: 139,316....

Race
Black: 50,811
White: 42,190
Hispanic: 45,607
Other Racial Background: 708

http://insidetexasprisons.blogspot.com/2011/12/demographics-of-texas-prison-system.html

That's 36.5%.

Not 82.6%.

You were completely wrong.

sadly those numbers would mean .25% of texas whites are in jail vs. 2.5% of texas blacks :(

I blame mostly on the racist drug war

[ChumpDumper]

Do you have anything better than a blog, written by an inmate?They plainly stated where they got the stats.

Are you so stupid that you can't understand where they got them?

Do you need your hand held to start a google search?

Let me know, I'm here to help.

[ChumpDumper]

I found the source in three seconds.

Let's see if Wild Cobra can find it!

[Wild Cobra]

I found the source in three seconds.

Let's see if Wild Cobra can find it!
LOL...

Like I said before Chump...

You're losing it.

All you had to do was point out that in my linked material, I used the wrong stats. The stats I used were the 667/100,000 whites vs. the 3,162/100,000 blacks. I took the numbers to be total population, when it too was by race.

You are the one who stings people for using blogs... I repaid you.

Now I will admittedly move the goal post.

What are these statistics when only Murder apply?

My gut feeling tells me they will be close to that 17:3 ratio.

[ChumpDumper]

LOL...

Like I said before Chump...

You're losing it.

All you had to do was point out that in my linked material, I used the wrong stats. The stats I used were the 667/100,000 whites vs. the 3,162/100,000 blacks. I took the numbers to be total population, when it too was by race.

You are the one who stings people for using blogs... I repaid you.

Now I will admittedly move the goal post.

What are these statistics when only Murder apply?

My gut feeling tells me they will be close to that 17:3 ratio.Thanks for admitting you were completely wrong.

Found the source yet?

[Wild Cobra]

The statistics provided are from the Fiscal Year 2010 Statistical Report of the Texas Department of Criminal Justice. (Fiscal Year 2010 is the most recent year for which statistics were available on TDCJ’s website on November 4, 2011.) The statistics provided here represent only the inmates in the Institutional Division of TDCJ; state jails and substance abuse felony treatment centers are not included.

Total number of inmates incarcerated in Texas prisons on August 31, 2010: 139,316....

Race
Black: 50,811
White: 42,190
Hispanic: 45,607
Other Racial Background: 708

http://insidetexasprisons.blogspot.com/2011/12/demographics-of-texas-prison-system.html

That's 36.5%.

Not 82.6%.

You were completely wrong.
When only looking at the black and white numbers, blacks are 54.6%. The 17:3 is 85%. Now is there a different incarceration rate for murder? Is there (and I'll bet there is) a different number of violent crimes committed by blacks?

[CosmicCowboy]

I'm curious where y'all are going with this conversation...what is the point?

[Wild Cobra]

Thanks for admitting you were completely wrong.

Found the source yet?
Not looking for it.

I'm multitasking. Switching to here every few minutes while I'm doing other things. I could care less, as like I said, all you had to do was point out my mistake... but I found it... Why should I continue to look?

[ChumpDumper]

When only looking at the black and white numbers, blacks are 54.6%. The 17:3 is 85%.:lmao
Now is there a different incarceration rate for murder? Is there (and I'll bet there is) a different number of violent crimes committed by blacks?:rollin

[Wild Cobra]

I'm curious where y'all are going with this conversation...what is the point?
Who knows with Chump...

Our friendly troll Facts brought up the 17:3 blacks:whites exonerated by DNA. Every time I see something like this, it seems there is an agenda to show unfairness between races. However, blacks do commit more crimes, and especially more violent crimes than whites. just simple facts, but you always have someone wanting to say it's racism.

[RandomGuy]

Why is it an incorrect question? Your figures when counting only white and black show that 85% of those exonerated by DNA are black. When looking at the Texas 2005 prison population between blacks and whites, blacks comprise of 82.6% of the prison population. Looks proportional to me.

One could say there is no significant difference in wrongly accused blacks vs whites when it comes to murder.

Uneven Justice:
State Rates of Incarceration By Race and Ethnicity (http://www.sentencingproject.org/doc/publications/rd_stateratesofincbyraceandethnicity.pdf)

Um, that isn't what your pdf says, goober.

This is soooo illustrative of your inability to meaningfully interpret what you read.

The RATE of incarceration is roughly that much compared to whites.

What you missed in your bit here is that blacks only comprise 10% of the population.

[Wild Cobra]

Um, that isn't what your pdf says, goober.

This is soooo illustrative of your inability to meaningfully interpret what you read.

The RATE of incarceration is roughly that much compared to whites.

What you missed in your bit here is that blacks only comprise 10% of the population.
What you missed is I already corrected myself. Besides, I thought it was more like 12%?

[RandomGuy]

Oh, I think several letters from the dead mans father trump even a shouted question...and don't pretend that those letters don't get read and NORMALLY answered by at least someone on the staff.

Does the president need to opine on all of the three million letters? or just some of them?

How much delay do you allow for?

When where the letters written?

What other letters from murder victims also have gotten buried in there?

Honestly, it seems a bit of a stretch to expect them to get to millions of letters on a timely basis.

Since the dude who did it got locked away for a LONG sentence, I don't see how that is an injustice.

[RandomGuy]

LOL...

Like I said before Chump...

You're losing it.

All you had to do was point out that in my linked material, I used the wrong stats. The stats I used were the 667/100,000 whites vs. the 3,162/100,000 blacks. I took the numbers to be total population, when it too was by race.

You are the one who stings people for using blogs... I repaid you.

Now I will admittedly move the goal post.

What are these statistics when only Murder apply?

My gut feeling tells me they will be close to that 17:3 ratio.

Hmm....

The ratios are roughly 4:1 for overall incarceration.
The exoneration ratio was roughly 5:1

While 20 people from one county aren't exactly a meaningful statistical sample, it does indicate a possibility for blacks accused of murders to be found guilty at a rate higher than the incarceration rates for the general population.

There is a whole field of study on this.

Blacks are far more likely to be both arrested and convicted of crimes than whites, after controlling for just about every other factor, based on what I remember of reading.

[Wild Cobra]

Blacks are far more likely to be both arrested and convicted of crimes than whites, after controlling for just about every other factor, based on what I remember of reading.
Yes, but were they actually guilty or not?

I know there is a sentiment that blacks are unfairly arrested an convicted. If you go only by statistics, then it is a fair assumption at first look. However, with more poverty , gang affiliation, etc. among blacks than whites, maybe the statistics are a proper reflection of the crimes actually committed.

Really hard to know for certain, wouldn't you agree?

[CosmicCowboy]

And don't forget genetics...:lol

[RandomGuy]

Yes, but were they actually guilty or not?

I know there is a sentiment that blacks are unfairly arrested an convicted. If you go only by statistics, then it is a fair assumption at first look. However, with more poverty , gang affiliation, etc. among blacks than whites, maybe the statistics are a proper reflection of the crimes actually committed.

Really hard to know for certain, wouldn't you agree?

THey controlled for all the socio-economic factors you mention.

Even allowing for poverty and even geographic area.

The levels of false convictions raises some serious doubts as to whether people with more pigment in their skins get a fair shake in our system.

The uncomfortable truth is that there are some fair grounds for black people to complain about unfairness in our justice system.

[RandomGuy]

Don't take my word for it though. Do some digging.

[Wild Cobra]

THey controlled for all the socio-economic factors you mention.

Even allowing for poverty and even geographic area.

The levels of false convictions raises some serious doubts as to whether people with more pigment in their skins get a fair shake in our system.

The uncomfortable truth is that there are some fair grounds for black people to complain about unfairness in our justice system.
What about the whites improperly convicted?

[Winehole23]

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/.a/6a00d8341c630a53ef015436c0f549970c-600wi

[Jacob1983]

Are you honestly going to tell me that there aren't double standards when it comes to racism and prejudice?

If you're a rich white male, you're extremely powerful. If not, then you fucked.

And people love it when a white person kills or beats up a black person because they love to just hash out at each other on this shit. People love drama. And people love to judge and throw stones at someone that has done something wrong.

[RandomGuy]

What about the whites improperly convicted?

What about them?

It sucks if anybody gets wrongly convicted.
It really sucks that, all other things equal, you are more likely to be both convicted, and, it seems, wrongly convicted, if you are black.

What do you want me to say here?

[RandomGuy]

Are you honestly going to tell me that there aren't double standards when it comes to racism and prejudice?

If you're a rich white male, you're extremely powerful. If not, then you fucked.

And people love it when a white person kills or beats up a black person because they love to just hash out at each other on this shit. People love drama. And people love to judge and throw stones at someone that has done something wrong.

Oddly enough, I would agree. People love the sensational.

I think that black racists get something of a free pass when they say stupid shit.

But then again, one has to keep in mind the historical context of white on black violence.

http://www.americanlynching.com/images/pic2.gif
Jesse Washington
Spectacle lynching--Burned Alive Waco Texas 1916
Souvenir Postcard sold for ten cents.

http://www.americanlynching.com/images/pic6.gif
Double lynching of Abram Smith 19, and Thomas Shipp 18 --Lynched to death in Marion, Indiana August 7, 1930.

(edit, waaay too large on screen, and quite too graphic, although I am of the opinion that you need to see this kind of stuff to let the horrific nature of what is being discussed sink in a little)
Three men lynched in
Duluth, Minnesota, circa 1920.



http://www.americanlynching.com/images/pic7.gif
Minneapolis 1882
Dragged from his jail cell by an angry mob, accused rapist McManus was hanged from a leafless tree.

YOU can't tell me that if this had been done to your grandfather, you would not be a bit sensitive when the subject comes up.

[RandomGuy]

It is not pretty.

Gloss over anything you want. I spared you from some of the more nasty stuff.

http://www.americanlynching.com/photos-old.htm

Kind of hard to have an honest conversation about racial violence without talking about the elephant in the room.

[Jacob1983]

Speaking of historical context, wasn't it rich white males that owned slaves in America?

[Goran Dragic]

If you're a rich white male, you're extremely powerful. If not, then you fucked.

Listen guy, with that shitty retail job you have, you wouldn't be any more powerful if you were black :lmao

[Jacob1983]

Okay.

[Wild Cobra]

What about them?

It sucks if anybody gets wrongly convicted.
It really sucks that, all other things equal, you are more likely to be both convicted, and, it seems, wrongly convicted, if you are black.

What do you want me to say here?
I just don't buy that the wrongly convicted has a preference for race. Sure, 30 years ago and more, but not today. the police and prosecution will set their sights on whites if they think they have a case also. They just want the conviction, to put the public at ease.

[RandomGuy]

I just don't buy that the wrongly convicted has a preference for race. Sure, 30 years ago and more, but not today. the police and prosecution will set their sights on whites if they think they have a case also. They just want the conviction, to put the public at ease.

Sure you don't buy it. It doesn't fit in with your worldview.

You think less than a hundred years after the pictures above, everything has magically gotten better?

You think that the immunity from prosecution enjoyed by the KKK enjoyed as few as 50 years ago has entirely faded?

You have a lot more faith in people than I do.

I can only tell you what I have read. I don't have the time to spoon feed it to you. Get off yer butt and look. Even with your rather strong reality filtering system, the information is there. It is pretty extensively studied and documented, from what I saw.

(edit)

Man can I kill a thread or what?